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+
+ - OVERSIGHT HEARING ON CLIMATE CHANGE: THE IMPACTS AND THE NEED TO ACT
+
+[House Hearing, 116 Congress]
+[From the U.S. Government Publishing Office]
+
+
+ CLIMATE CHANGE: THE IMPACTS AND THE NEED TO ACT
+
+=======================================================================
+
+ OVERSIGHT HEARING
+
+ BEFORE THE
+
+ COMMITTEE ON NATURAL RESOURCES
+ U.S. HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES
+
+ ONE HUNDRED SIXTEENTH CONGRESS
+
+ FIRST SESSION
+
+ __________
+
+ Wednesday, February 6, 2019
+
+ __________
+
+ Serial No. 116-1
+
+ __________
+
+ Printed for the use of the Committee on Natural Resources
+
+[GRAPHIC NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]
+
+
+ Available via the World Wide Web: http://www.govinfo.gov
+ or
+ Committee address: http://naturalresources.house.gov
+
+
+ __________
+
+
+ U.S. GOVERNMENT PUBLISHING OFFICE
+34-954 PDF WASHINGTON : 2019
+
+-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
+For sale by the Superintendent of Documents, U.S. Government Publishing Office,
+http://bookstore.gpo.gov. For more information, contact the GPO Customer Contact Center,
+U.S. Government Publishing Office. Phone 202-512-1800, or 866-512-1800 (toll-free).E-mail,
+[email protected].
+
+
+
+ COMMITTEE ON NATURAL RESOURCES
+
+ RAUL M. GRIJALVA, AZ, Chair
+ DEBRA A. HAALAND, NM, Vice Chair
+ GREGORIO KILILI CAMACHO SABLAN, CNMI, Vice Chair, Insular Affairs
+ ROB BISHOP, UT, Ranking Republican Member
+
+Grace F. Napolitano, CA Don Young, AK
+Jim Costa, CA Louie Gohmert, TX
+Gregorio Kilili Camacho Sablan, Doug Lamborn, CO
+ CNMI Robert J. Wittman, VA
+Jared Huffman, CA Tom McClintock, CA
+Alan S. Lowenthal, CA Paul A. Gosar, AZ
+Ruben Gallego, AZ Paul Cook, CA
+TJ Cox, CA Bruce Westerman, AR
+Joe Neguse, CO Garret Graves, LA
+Mike Levin, CA Jody B. Hice, GA
+Debra A. Haaland, NM Aumua Amata Coleman Radewagen, AS
+Jefferson Van Drew, NJ Daniel Webster, FL
+Joe Cunningham, SC Liz Cheney, WY
+Nydia M. Velazquez, NY Mike Johnson, LA
+Diana DeGette, CO Jenniffer Gonzalez-Colon, PR
+Wm. Lacy Clay, MO John R. Curtis, UT
+Debbie Dingell, MI Kevin Hern, OK
+Anthony G. Brown, MD Russ Fulcher, ID
+A. Donald McEachin, VA
+Darren Soto, FL
+Ed Case, HI
+Steven Horsford, NV
+Michael F. Q. San Nicolas, GU
+Vacancy
+Vacancy
+Vacancy
+
+ David Watkins, Chief of Staff
+ Sarah Lim, Chief Counsel
+ Parish Braden, Republican Staff Director
+ http://naturalresources.house.gov
+
+
+ ------
+
+ CONTENTS
+
+ ----------
+ Page
+
+Hearing held on Wednesday, February 6, 2019...................... 1
+
+Statement of Members:
+
+ Bishop, Hon. Rob, a Representative in Congress from the State
+ of Utah.................................................... 4
+
+ Dingell, Hon. Debbie, a Representative in Congress from the
+ State of Michigan, prepared statement of................... 114
+
+ Grijalva, Hon. Raul M., a Representative in Congress from the
+ State of Arizona........................................... 1
+ Prepared statement of.................................... 3
+
+ Hice, Hon. Jody B., a Representative in Congress from the
+ State of Georgia, prepared statement of.................... 115
+
+Statement of Witnesses:
+
+ Baker, Hon. Charlie, Governor, State of Massachusetts,
+ Boston, Massachusetts...................................... 17
+ Prepared statement of.................................... 19
+ Questions submitted for the record....................... 27
+
+ Cobb, Kim, Director, Global Change Program; Advance
+ Professor, Earth & Atmospheric Sciences, Georgia Institute
+ of Technology, Atlanta, Georgia............................ 64
+ Prepared statement of.................................... 66
+ Questions submitted for the record....................... 70
+
+ Cooper, Hon. Roy, Governor, State of North Carolina, Raleigh,
+ North Carolina............................................. 7
+ Prepared statement of.................................... 9
+ Questions submitted for the record....................... 10
+
+ Curry, Judith A., President, Climate Forecast Applications
+ Network, Reno, Nevada...................................... 83
+ Prepared statement of.................................... 85
+ Questions submitted for the record....................... 93
+
+ DiPerna, Paula, Special Advisor, CDP North America, New York,
+ New York................................................... 71
+ Prepared statement of.................................... 73
+
+ Hollie, Derrick, President, Reaching America, Bennsville,
+ Maryland................................................... 80
+ Prepared statement of.................................... 81
+ Questions submitted for the record....................... 82
+
+ Nazar, Nadia, Co-Founder, Co-Executive Director, and Art
+ Director, Zero Hour Movement; Co-Organizer of the Youth
+ Climate March, Perry Hall, Maryland........................ 54
+ Prepared statement of.................................... 56
+
+ Yeampierre, Elizabeth, Executive Director, UPROSE, Co-Chair
+ of the Climate Justice Alliance, Brooklyn, New York........ 59
+ Prepared statement of.................................... 61
+ Questions submitted for the record....................... 64
+
+ Yearwood, Lennox, Jr., President and CEO, Hip Hop Caucus,
+ Washington, DC............................................. 77
+ Prepared statement of.................................... 79
+
+
+Additional Materials Submitted for the Record:
+
+ Facebook, Letter dated February 8, 2019, Submitted for the
+ Record..................................................... 115
+
+ List of documents submitted for the record retained in the
+ Committee's official files................................. 116
+
+ Submissions for the Record by Rep. Graves
+
+ Letter addressed to the President from Senators Cantwell,
+ Schumer, Menendez, and Markey on oil production dated
+ May 23, 2018........................................... 43
+ Average Electricity Prices for each State, chart......... 45
+
+ Submission for the Record by Rep. Grijalva
+
+ Highlights from the NOAA Report, U.S. and Global Climate
+ for 2018............................................... 46
+
+ Submission for the Record by Rep. Westerman
+
+ Dilbert Cartoon.......................................... 49
+
+
+
+
+ OVERSIGHT HEARING ON CLIMATE CHANGE: THE IMPACTS AND THE NEED TO ACT
+
+ ----------
+
+
+ Wednesday, February 6, 2019
+
+ U.S. House of Representatives
+
+ Committee on Natural Resources
+
+ Washington, DC
+
+ ----------
+
+ The Committee met, pursuant to notice, at 10:07 a.m., in
+room 1324, Longworth House Office Building, Hon. Raul M.
+Grijalva [Chairman of the Committee] presiding.
+ Present: Representatives Grijalva, Napolitano, Costa,
+Sablan, Huffman, Lowenthal, Cox, Neguse, Levin, Haaland, Van
+Drew, Cunningham, Velazquez, Clay, McEachin, Case, Horsford,
+Bishop, Gohmert, Lamborn, McClintock, Gosar, Westerman, Graves,
+Webster, Hern, and Fulcher.
+
+ The Chairman. Let me call the Committee on Natural
+Resources to order.
+ The Committee today is meeting to hear testimony on the
+impacts of climate change and the need for Congress and the
+Administration to act.
+ Under Committee Rule 4(f), any oral opening statements at
+hearings are limited to the Chairman and the Ranking Minority
+Member. Therefore, I ask unanimous consent that all other
+Members' opening statements be made part of the hearing record
+if they are submitted to the Clerk by 5 p.m. today.
+ Hearing no objection, so ordered.
+ Welcome, everyone, to the first hearing of the 116th
+Congress for the Natural Resources Committee, and thank you to
+our witnesses for appearing before us, as we begin to tackle
+one of the most urgent and pressing challenges of our time.
+
+ THE HON. RAUL M. GRIJALVA, A REPRESENTATIVE IN CONGRESS FROM
+ THE STATE OF ARIZONA
+
+ The Chairman. The majority of Americans consider meaningful
+action on climate change to be a moral and economic imperative.
+They are absolutely right. And they have friends on this
+Committee, including myself and other colleagues who are here
+to work on solutions.
+ Climate change is real. The emissions we produce from
+burning fossil fuels are making it worse. It is a threat to our
+public health, national security, infrastructure, and natural
+resources. We are seeing the impacts now, and they will grow
+stronger unless we change course.
+ Our communities are paying the price for years of inaction
+on this issue. The massive and unprecedented storms, heat
+waves, fires, and droughts we are experiencing are not normal.
+They are being made worse by climate change, and if we don't
+take action now, we are only at the beginning of this process.
+ The last 4 years have been the 4 hottest years ever
+recorded. Ice sheets are melting far faster than previously
+thought. The coast of Alaska is literally disappearing into the
+ocean. Indigenous villages are already having to relocate.
+ We will see more climate refugees as time goes on. Parts of
+our planet where people currently live may very well become
+uninhabitable.
+ Every day that we fail to act increases the costs of
+addressing this crisis for future generations. Putting our
+heads in the sand puts people's lives at risk and our Nation's
+safety in jeopardy.
+ Today, we turn the page on this Committee from climate
+change denial to climate action. The Democratic Majority is
+here to listen to people, to work for people, to hear from
+Americans across the country from all walks of life whose
+experiences emphasize the need to address this crisis.
+ The rest of the world understands the urgent need to take
+action on climate change. The Trump administration chooses to
+mock science and mislead the public about what our country will
+look like if we do nothing.
+ As President Trump seeks to expand fossil fuel production
+on public lands, roll back the protections for clean air and
+clean water, suppress the role of science, and turn his back on
+international agreements, we have situations.
+ That is why states, local community leaders, businesses,
+and many others are stepping up. They can't wait for action
+from an Administration that appears not to care about their own
+well-being and of their constituents.
+ This is a great opportunity for American entrepreneurs to
+lead the way in creating and deploying new energy technologies
+the world will need. But with people's lives in imminent
+danger, we know that we need more than innovation; we need good
+policies.
+ Climate change is a matter of social justice. Communities
+of color and tribes are disproportionately impacted by climate
+change, and will continue to struggle unless we take action.
+ Along with testimony from our witnesses today, I invite the
+public to provide their climate crisis stories at
+www.naturalresources.house.gov. I would like to briefly share
+just one of the many stories we have already heard from the
+public. This is from a woman named Katie Davis, from Goleta,
+California.
+ ``Last July on a freakishly hot night that broke records
+across Southern California, a fire suddenly broke out in our
+neighborhood due to hot winds, the likes of which I've never
+felt before, that pushed flames toward us rapidly. It was one
+of the most terrifying moments of my life. We ran out of the
+house with nothing, no time to prepare, and fled. Our house
+survived with minor damage, but on that anguishing night most
+of the houses on our street burned down. I look at the
+foundations of five burned down houses as I write this.''
+ These are the stories we need to hear in this Committee and
+in this Congress. The best policies are informed by a
+combination of sound science and informed public input. These
+are the guideposts for this Committee, both in our hearing
+today and everything we do in the next 2 years. Climate change
+is an urgent problem. It demands urgent action and a sense of
+purpose from Congress. This Committee will offer both.
+ And I want to thank you again to the witnesses. I look
+forward to your testimony.
+
+ [The prepared statement of Mr. Grijalva follows:]
+ Prepared Statement of the Hon. Raul M. Grijalva, Chair, Committee on
+ Natural Resources
+ The Committee on Natural Resources will now come to order.
+
+ The Committee is meeting today to hear testimony on the impacts of
+climate change and the need for Congress and the Administration to act.
+ Under Committee Rule 4(f), any oral opening statements at hearings
+are limited to the Chairman and the Ranking Minority Member.
+ Welcome everyone to the first hearing of the 116th Congress for the
+Natural Resources Committee and thank you to our witnesses for
+appearing before us as we begin to tackle one of the most urgent and
+pressing challenges of our time.
+ The majority of Americans consider meaningful action on climate
+change a moral imperative. They're absolutely right. And they have
+friends on this Committee, including the Chairman, who are here to work
+on solutions.
+ Climate change is real. The emissions we produce from burning
+fossil fuels are making it worse. It's a threat to our public health,
+national security, infrastructure, and natural resources. We are seeing
+its impacts now, and they will only grow stronger unless we change
+course.
+ Our communities are paying the price for years of inaction on this
+issue. The massive and unprecedented storms, heat waves, fires, and
+droughts we are experiencing are not normal. They are being made worse
+by climate change, and if we don't take action now, we're only at the
+beginning.
+ The last 4 years have been the 4 hottest years ever recorded. Ice
+sheets are melting far faster than previously thought. The coast of
+Alaska is literally disappearing into the ocean. Indigenous villages
+are already having to relocate.
+ We will see more climate refugees as time goes on. Parts of our
+planet where people currently live may very well become uninhabitable.
+ Every day we fail to act increases the costs of addressing this
+crisis for future generations. Putting our heads in the sand puts
+peoples' lives at risk and our Nation's safety in jeopardy.
+ Today, we turn the page on this Committee from climate denial to
+climate action. The Democratic Majority is here to listen to the
+people. To work for the people. To hear from Americans across the
+country, from all walks of life, whose experiences emphasize the need
+to address this crisis.
+ The rest of the world understands the urgent need to take action on
+climate change. The Trump administration chooses to mock science and
+mislead the public about what our country will look like if we do
+nothing.
+ President Trump seeks to expand fossil fuel production on public
+lands, roll back protections for clean air and clean water, suppress
+the role of science, and turn his back on international agreements.
+ That's why states, local community leaders, businesses and many
+others are stepping up. They can't wait for action from an
+Administration that doesn't care about their well-being.
+ There is a great opportunity for American entrepreneurs to lead the
+way in creating and deploying new energy technologies the world will
+need. But with people's lives in imminent danger, we know that we need
+more than innovation. We need good policies.
+ Climate change is a matter of social justice. Communities of color
+and tribes are disproportionately impacted by climate change and will
+continue to struggle unless we take action.
+ Along with testimony from our witnesses today, I invite the public
+to provide their climate crisis stories an naturalresources.house.gov.
+I'd like to briefly share just one of the many stories we've already
+heard from the public. This is from a woman named Katie Davis who wrote
+to us from Goleta, California: ``Last July on a freakishly hot night
+that broke records across Southern California, a fire suddenly broke
+out in our neighborhood due to hot winds, the likes of which I've never
+felt before, that pushed flames toward us rapidly. It was one of the
+most terrifying moments of my life. We ran out of the house with
+nothing, and no time to prepare, and fled. Our house survived with
+minor damage, but that anguishing night most of the houses on our
+street burned down. I look out at the foundations of five burned out
+houses as I write this.''
+ These are the stories we need to hear in this Committee and in this
+Congress. The best policies are informed by a combination of sound
+science and informed public input. Those are the guideposts for this
+Committee, both in our hearing today and in everything we do for the
+next 2 years. Climate change is an urgent problem. It demands urgent
+action and a sense of purpose from Congress. This Committee will offer
+both.
+
+ Thank you again to the witnesses. I look forward to your testimony.
+
+ I now recognize Ranking Member Bishop for his opening statement.
+
+ ______
+
+
+ The Chairman. I now recognize the Ranking Member, Mr.
+Bishop, for his opening statement.
+
+STATEMENT OF THE HON. ROB BISHOP, A REPRESENTATIVE IN CONGRESS
+ FROM THE STATE OF UTAH
+
+ Mr. Bishop. Congratulations, Mr. Grijalva, on your first
+Full Committee chairing. I know you had a Ranking Member
+chairmanship at the time, but that was a long, long time ago. I
+am happy to have you here, happy to be here for this particular
+discussion.
+ I know you have made February as Climate Change Month. I
+appreciate the fact that you picked the shortest month of the
+year to do that.
+ Also, it happens to be, of course, Black History Month,
+which I wish we could deal with some other things. Because in
+the last couple of years, this Committee has done some
+significant issues in the area of Federal lands and projects. I
+mean we have expanded the Martin Luther King home, historic
+site, as well as the Central High School in Little Rock,
+Arkansas, which I had the opportunity of going to this summer,
+and was amazed at how actually great that was, as a narrative
+history of what is going on here.
+ We will have, in the last package the Senate is pushing
+over, the establishment of the Medgar Evers National Monument,
+Camp Nelson National Monument. We also did the Kennedy-King
+Historic Area in Indiana this particular year, as well as the
+African-American Civil Rights Network, and re-authorizing
+historically black colleges and university preservation grant
+programs.
+ All of those are within the purview of this Committee. That
+is our jurisdiction, talking about those kinds of things would
+be very positive. In the ones I have just listed to you also
+there is a $41 million maintenance backlog, just on the
+programs I just enunciated. Talking about that is in the
+jurisdiction of this Committee.
+ The Chairman has been very good in helping us come up with
+ways of funding that maintenance backlog creatively in the
+past. I hope that we can actually get to those kind of
+activities, which would be extremely important.
+ All right. Now, focusing to the topic of this particular
+meeting, it is my hope that what we do is coming up with ways
+we can actually help people.
+ Utah, for example, has had terrible air. It is part of the
+topography, especially in the winter time. But it is much
+better than the air that Representative Curtis and I grew up in
+in Utah, simply because of the actions of the state of Utah.
+EPA and other Federal agencies over the last 15 years haven't
+done squat, but the state has made major changes. And I hope
+that we can look at how we can do those types of changes.
+ I appreciate the fact that we have two governors here with
+us today. Thank you for being here. Once again, it would have
+been nice to have known some of the topics of this hearing,
+even though Rule 4(c) requires that to be in there, and
+transparency requires it. We did not have time to invite
+another governor. I would have loved to have a governor from
+the West come here and join you two, simply because they are,
+unfortunately, in the middle of our legislative sessions, or
+the beginning of their legislative sessions, and could not make
+it in such short notice. But they actually have Federal lands
+over which we have jurisdiction that would be an input.
+ But I hope that you guys can enlighten us, even though you
+are only governors. You are one of those peons that work in the
+outer hinterlands of America that really aren't as important as
+we here in the Federal Government.
+ [Laughter.]
+ Mr. Bishop. So, we appreciate your groveling before us,
+because all of us and the agencies breathe the rarified air and
+drink the leaded water of Washington. Therefore, we know
+exactly what is right to do. And for you to actually come here
+on hands and knees, I appreciate that.
+ I hope, though, in the process, you can give us some ideas
+of what you all are trying to do in your states, how maybe
+permitting process--we can work with you easier to actually
+allow states to become partners with us, instead of being
+dominated by us, to find real solutions for real people. That,
+I hope, is the ultimate goal of what we are attempting to do.
+ As I said, Utah has amazingly bad air in the winter. It is
+part of the topography. When it is snowing on the ground, the
+mountains prohibit any kind of wind gust from cleaning out the
+atmosphere. We never have bad air in the summer, except for
+this year, which meant that as every forest burned in
+California, a week later we were breathing the air of the
+burned California. And that was unique.
+ And it is going to happen again, unless we actually can do
+something about that, which is why the frustration I had with
+the Senate using the filibuster to gut most of the forest fire
+reforms that we passed. That is one of the things that is in
+the jurisdiction of this Committee, and I wish we were talking
+about that.
+ If we actually were able to control forest fires by
+different managing systems that are experts, like Mr.
+Westerman, who has a doctorate in this area, that the experts
+from the Forest Service in both the Obama and Trump
+administrations told us they needed to do to manage the lands,
+we could actually help with the environment.
+ There is another one, too. Even though a lot of the people
+who are--well, carbon sequestration. If we actually want to get
+carbon out of the air, there are enough new studies that are
+being done, specifically in Portugal and Australia, and here in
+the United States, as well, that talk about the way of using
+carbon sequestration--to use plant life, which needs carbon, to
+suck it out of the air and put it into the ground where it
+could be useful for plant life, and then also help clean the
+air. That is the jurisdiction of this Committee. And those are
+the kinds of things I hope we can do to talk about specific
+issues.
+ So, I have to mention I am at kind of a loss. I do not know
+where this hearing is going, or the other six hearings you
+planned, because you simply haven't told us where the goal is.
+At some point we may be asking, ``Where are we going?''
+ What is the real legislation to help people that is
+supposed to come out of these hearings--to understand whether
+these hearings are simply for those of us around the horseshoe
+who are going to make legislation.
+ Or are these hearings designed for that group that is
+sitting at a table in the corner so they can write cute
+stories?
+ Once again, we have not been given the detail of where
+these hearings are going. We would like to know that in the
+future.
+ With that, we are ready to get started on this wonderful
+new adventure in a month that has only 28 days. But I would
+like Rule 4(c) to be instituted so that we actually can have
+greater understanding and preparation so we can participate
+fully with you in these hearings.
+ And governors, thank you for joining us. Thank you for
+groveling before us. I am looking forward to your testimony.
+ I yield back.
+
+ The Chairman. Thank you, Mr. Bishop. And I can assure you
+that, in terms of all the areas of jurisdiction, and on this
+particular topic that I think has significance and consequences
+over all our jurisdictions that this Committee is under, that
+we will aptly be able to--and adroitly, as well--chew gum and
+walk. We can do all these things.
+ Mr. Bishop. Are you saying that because I am chewing gum?
+ The Chairman. Yes.
+ Mr. Bishop. OK, fine.
+ The Chairman. Thank you. I would like to introduce our
+first panel, our distinguished panel, which consists of the
+governor of North Carolina, the Honorable Roy Cooper, and the
+governor of Massachusetts, the Honorable Charles Baker. I
+appreciate them being here, taking the time--in particular,
+bringing an insight.
+ I don't know if it is so much a question of groveling, but
+setting an example where, across party lines, people confront
+the issue of climate change, the effect on their constituents,
+and begin to take action. I think that is an important example
+that we need to remind ourselves, that we are not impotent to
+do nothing about this. We can, and we should. And the point is
+that we have elected executives here, governors, who can speak
+to those issues today, and I welcome them.
+ I want to particularly thank Governor Baker for scheduling
+the Patriots' victory parade yesterday so that he could be
+here, and it wouldn't conflict with this hearing. I very much
+appreciate it.
+ Under our Committee Rules, oral statements are limited to 5
+minutes, but your entire statements will appear in the hearing
+record.
+ The lights in front of you will turn yellow when there is 1
+minute left in the presentation, and red when time is up.
+ After the governors have testified, Members will be given
+the opportunity to ask them questions.
+ I would like to inform the members of the Committee that,
+due to commitments, the governors can only be here--we have a
+hard stop of 11:30 a.m. So, depending on how many Members are
+here, we may need to shorten the time each Member has to ask
+questions.
+ With that, the Chair now recognizes Governor Cooper of
+North Carolina for his testimony.
+ Welcome, sir. The floor is yours.
+
+ STATEMENT OF THE HON. ROY COOPER, GOVERNOR, STATE OF NORTH
+ CAROLINA, RALEIGH, NORTH CAROLINA
+
+ Governor Cooper. Thank you, Chairman Grijalva, for your
+hospitality. Thank you, Ranking Member Bishop, for your
+expression of humility through humor. Thanks to all of the
+other members of the Committee. We are grateful to be here
+today.
+ As a lifelong resident and now it is governor, I know that
+North Carolina is a fantastic place to live, grow a family, and
+have a business. Between our majestic mountains, miles of coast
+land, and scenic tourist venues, a visit to North Carolina is
+bound to be the time of your life.
+ But just like many places in our country and across the
+globe, we are beginning to feel the harsh effects of climate
+change on our communities and on our economy. Scientists have
+found that climate change makes weather more erratic. It makes
+storms larger and more powerful. And it intensifies heavy
+rainfalls and drought.
+ North Carolinians, unfortunately, know about this the hard
+way. We have weathered two so-called 500-year floods within 2
+years, and three of them within 20 years.
+ In the western North Carolina mountains, erratic weather
+has caused mudslides, damaged infrastructure, cost apple
+growers valuable crops, and forced ski areas to close mid-
+season, hurting local businesses and putting jobs in jeopardy.
+ In central North Carolina, soaring summer temperatures have
+killed poultry and crops, costing farmers critical income. Fort
+Bragg and military ocean terminal Sunny Point, two of the most
+important military installations in our country that are
+located in North Carolina, are listed at current and future
+risk for wildfires and recurrent flooding, respectively, in the
+U.S. Department of Defense report on the effects of our
+changing climate.
+ And the worst damage has been in eastern North Carolina,
+where we now are more vulnerable than ever to devastating
+storms and floods.
+ In September, just 2 years after our state was deluged by
+Hurricane Matthew, Hurricane Florence slammed into North
+Carolina. Its powerful winds and storm surge decimated coastal
+communities and crushed coastal tourism and fisheries. The
+storm stayed for days, dropping trillions of gallons of rain,
+inundating communities, drowning crops, and bringing rivers to
+historic flood levels. Hurricane Florence caused at least $17
+billion in damage, and tragically took 43 lives.
+ Then, a month later, Tropical Storm Michael took additional
+lives and caused millions more in damage. But for the survivors
+of these storms, the true cost is incalculable.
+ I have traveled to hard-hit communities and listened to
+North Carolinians whose lives are changed forever; tireless
+first responders who kept showing up to work, even though their
+own homes were destroyed; children who went weeks without
+schools; families whose livelihoods were washed away.
+ I spoke with an elderly woman who was pulled from flood
+waters by a first responder, bringing with her only a few
+possessions that she could carry. When I saw her in the shelter
+I told her how sorry I was, and she looked at me and said, ``I
+thank God I am alive. I thank God for that firefighter who
+pulled me to safety. And I thank God for these volunteers here
+in this shelter. Many of them have had their own homes flooded.
+I am going to make it.''
+ Well, as governor of North Carolina, I have a
+responsibility to help her make it. I have a responsibility to
+keep all of our people safe. I told them we have to do
+everything we can to rebuild our state smarter and stronger,
+and we are pursuing unprecedented recovery and resiliency plans
+to help North Carolinians get back on their feet.
+ We are also making a difference together. I am pleased that
+members of our congressional delegation and Federal agencies
+are helping provide meaningful relief to North Carolinians hit
+hard by the storm, and I look forward to continuing to work
+together with you on the Federal appropriations process.
+ But when storms are becoming more fierce, it is not enough
+just to pick up the pieces. We must take action to prevent this
+kind of devastation in the future. I urge Congress and all of
+our Federal partners to match the level of determination
+brought to recovery efforts in our fight to reduce the effects
+of climate change.
+ We in North Carolina are doing our part to address those
+effects. I have signed an executive order that sets a goal for
+our state to achieve a 40 percent reduction in greenhouse gases
+by 2025. North Carolina is second in the country in solar
+energy, and my order directs more use of renewable energy.
+ It also orders state agencies to begin using more zero
+emission vehicles in our motor fleet. It orders a clean energy
+plan and better state building efficiency. It also directs our
+state department of commerce to grow our strong clean energy
+economy by supporting the expansion of clean energy business,
+service providers, and companies with commitments to using
+clean energy.
+ In 2017, I ordered that North Carolina join the U.S.
+Climate Alliance, a bipartisan group of states focused on
+reducing our pollution and protecting our environment.
+ And while local and state action is critical, Federal
+partners must join us in taking action to protect our people
+from the growing harm of climate change. We need Federal
+legislation and regulations that promote emission reductions,
+preservation of forests, marshes, barrier islands, and other
+national infrastructure. We need Federal leadership to work
+with global partners to fulfill and strengthen our
+international agreements. We need consistent Federal action
+that meets the urgency of our global climate problem. Our
+communities, our economy, and our future depend on it.
+ Thank you very much.
+
+ [The prepared statement of Governor Cooper follows:]
+ Prepared Statement of the Honorable Roy Cooper, Governor of North
+ Carolina
+ Chairman Grijalva, Ranking Member Bishop and members of the
+Committee:
+
+ As a lifelong resident and now its governor, I know North Carolina
+is a fantastic place to live, grow a business and raise a family.
+Between our majestic mountains, miles of coastline and scenic tourist
+areas, a visit to North Carolina is bound to be the time of your life.
+But just like many places in our country and across the globe, we're
+beginning to feel the harsh effects of climate change on our
+communities and our economy.
+ Scientists have found that climate change makes weather more
+erratic. It makes storms larger and more powerful and intensifies heavy
+rainfalls and droughts. North Carolinians unfortunately know this the
+hard way. We've weathered two so-called 500-year floods in 2 years and
+three in fewer than 20 years. In the Western North Carolina mountains,
+volatile weather has caused mudslides, damaged infrastructure, cost
+apple growers valuable crops and forced ski areas to close mid-season,
+hurting local businesses and putting jobs in jeopardy. In central North
+Carolina, soaring summer temperatures have killed poultry and crops,
+costing farmers critical income. Fort Bragg and Military Ocean Terminal
+Sunny Point, two of the many important military installations we're
+proud to have located in our state, were recently listed at current and
+future risk for wildfires and recurrent flooding, respectively, in a
+U.S. Department of Defense report \1\ on effects of our changing
+climate. And the worst damage has been in eastern North Carolina, which
+is now more vulnerable than ever to devastating storms and floods.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ \1\ https://www.americansecurityproject.org/wp-content/uploads/
+2019/01/DoD-Effects-of-a-Changing-Climate-to-the-Department-of-
+Defense.pdf.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ In September, just 2 years after our state was deluged by Hurricane
+Matthew, Hurricane Florence slammed into North Carolina. Its powerful
+winds and storm surge decimated coastal communities and crushed coastal
+tourism and fisheries. The storm stayed for days, dropping trillions of
+gallons of rain, inundating communities, drowning crops and bringing
+rivers to historic flood levels. Hurricane Florence caused at least $17
+billion in damage and tragically took 43 lives. One month later,
+another tropical storm, Michael, took additional lives and caused
+millions more in damage.
+ For survivors of a storm like Florence or Hurricane Matthew before
+it, the true cost is incalculable. I've traveled to hard-hit
+communities and listened to North Carolinians whose lives are forever
+changed: Tireless first responders who kept showing up to work even
+though their own homes were destroyed; children who went weeks without
+school; families whose livelihoods were washed away. I spoke with an
+elderly woman who was pulled from floodwaters by a first responder,
+bringing with her only the few possessions she could carry. When I saw
+her in a shelter, I told her how sorry I was. She said, ``I thank God
+I'm alive, I thank God for that firefighter who rescued me and I thank
+God for all of these volunteers helping in this shelter. Many of them
+had their own homes flooded. I'm going to make it.''
+ As governor of North Carolina, I have a responsibility to help her
+make it. I have a responsibility to help keep all our people safe. I've
+told them we have to do everything we can to rebuild our state smarter
+and stronger and we're pursuing unprecedented efforts to help North
+Carolinians get back on their feet.
+ Weeks after Florence, I announced the new North Carolina Office of
+Recovery and Resiliency (NCORR), which is administering U.S. Department
+of Housing and Urban Development-funded Community Development Block
+Grants for Disaster Recovery for Hurricane Matthew recovery efforts.
+NCORR is also planning for additional Federal funding for residents
+hurt by Florence and will develop and implement strategies to protect
+North Carolina from future storms. We've continued to invest in the
+North Carolina Flood Inundation Mapping and Alert Network (FIMAN), a
+state-of-the-art flood mapping technology that helps indicate where to
+direct first responders and which communities remain most at risk
+during disasters, as well as the safest locations to rebuild. I've
+worked together with members of the North Carolina General Assembly to
+appropriate state relief, including $65 million to help our state draw
+down Federal disaster recovery dollars and $200 million to fund the
+North Carolina Farmer Recovery Reinvestment Program.
+ We're also making a difference together. I'm pleased that members
+of our congressional delegation and Federal agencies are helping
+provide meaningful relief to North Carolinians hit hard by the storm.
+We've approved over $1 billion in State and Federal recovery resources,
+including over $100 million in individual housing assistance from FEMA,
+over $550 million in estimated claims paid through the National Flood
+Insurance Program and more than $380 million in low-interest loans for
+homeowners, renters and business owners from the U.S. Small
+Administration.
+ While we've come a long way, we have much more work to do. I'm
+submitting two documents for the record: The first is a damage and
+needs assessment related to Hurricane Florence produced by the North
+Carolina Office of State Budget and Management \2\; the other is North
+Carolina's request to Congress for assistance in the aftermath of
+Hurricane Florence,\3\ which I shared with the North Carolina
+delegation and Federal appropriators in November. I look forward to
+continuing to work with Members of Congress throughout the Federal
+appropriations process.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ \2\ https://files.nc.gov/ncosbm/documents/files/
+Florence_Report_Full_rev20181016v10.pdf.
+ \3\ https://files.nc.gov/governor/documents/files/
+Hurricane%20Florence%20Appropriation%20and
+%20Leadership%20Request%2011-28-18.pdf.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ But when storms are becoming more destructive, it's not enough to
+pick up the pieces. We must take action to prevent this kind of
+devastation in the future. I urge this Congress and all our Federal
+partners to match the same level of determination brought to disaster
+recovery in our fight to reduce the effects of climate change.
+ We in North Carolina are doing our part to address those effects.
+I've signed an executive order that sets a goal for our state to
+achieve a 40 percent reduction in greenhouse gas emissions by 2025,
+increase state building efficiency and get at least 80,000 zero-
+emission vehicles on the road in North Carolina. North Carolina is
+second in the country in installed solar capacity and my order directs
+the development of a state clean energy plan to ensure a continued
+transformation of the power sector away from fossil fuels and toward
+clean energy. My executive order also directs state agencies to begin
+using more zero-emission vehicles in our state motor fleet. Further, it
+directs our state Department of Commerce to grow our strong clean
+energy economy by supporting the expansion of clean energy business,
+service providers and companies with commitments to using clean energy.
+North Carolina is a national leader in clean energy and technology
+innovation and we're taking steps to promote the growth of energy
+efficiency, solar, land-based and offshore wind, storage and other
+clean energy resources.
+ In 2017, I ordered that North Carolina join the U.S. Climate
+Alliance, a bipartisan group of 20 governors committed to uphold the
+goals of the Paris Agreement on climate change, including by
+collectively achieving our share of the U.S. emission reduction target.
+The Alliance represents 47 percent of the U.S. population, over half of
+the national GDP and 1.5 million clean energy jobs. Alliance states are
+tackling climate change and growing our economies at the same time.
+We're working across party lines to share best practices and defend our
+Nation's most important environmental, energy and climate policies.
+ I've also worked with coastal community leaders and business owners
+to fight seismic testing and offshore drilling, two activities that
+endanger the health and economic success of our coast.
+ While local and state action is critical, Federal partners must
+join us in taking action to protect our people from the growing harm of
+climate change. State and local governments, researchers and the public
+rely on Federal data, research and analysis to inform policy decisions.
+Federal funding fuels critical scientific research and drives
+innovation that can help solve our climate crisis.
+ We need Federal legislation and regulations that promote emission
+reductions and the preservation of forests, marshes, barrier islands
+and other natural infrastructure that protect communities from the
+worsening effects of storms. We need Federal leadership to work with
+global partners to fulfill and strengthen international agreements. We
+need consistent Federal action that meets the urgency of our global
+climate problem. Our communities, our economy and our future depend on
+it.
+
+ ______
+
+
+ Questions Submitted for the Record to the Honorable Roy Cooper,
+ Governor of North Carolina
+ Questions Submitted by Rep. Cunningham
+ Question 1. Do you support my beforementioned bill, H.R. 291, the
+Coastal Economies Protection Act?
+
+ 1a. If yes, why?
+
+ 1b. If no, how could we work together to change that?
+
+ Answer. I support amending the Outer Continental Shelf Lands Act to
+place a 10-year moratorium on oil and gas preleasing, leasing, and
+related activities. I would recommend adding language to specifically
+state that the moratorium applies to oil and gas seismic air gun
+testing.
+
+ Question 2. Governor Cooper, last year the Republican Mayor of Nags
+Head, Ben Cahoon, testified before the Committee and spoke in
+opposition to offshore oil and gas development. Why is opposition to
+offshore oil and gas drilling a bipartisan issue in your state?
+
+ Answer. North Carolinians, regardless of party affiliation, love
+and depend on the natural beauty and resources of our state. Offshore
+drilling and damaging seismic testing threaten North Carolina's coastal
+economy and environment yet offer little economic benefit to our state.
+These oil and gas activities present an unacceptable and unnecessary
+risk to our coast, which depends upon vibrant tourism and fishing
+industries.
+
+ My comment letter, dated March 9, 2018, in response to BOEM's Draft
+Proposed Program (see attached) lists in detail the economic and
+natural resources that could be impacted by drilling off North
+Carolina's coast:
+
+ Coastal tourism, which generates $3.4 billion annually and
+ supports 35,000 jobs in the region.
+
+ Commercial and recreational fishing, which contribute
+ nearly $2 billion to the state's economy.
+
+ Approximately 300 miles of ocean beaches, 614,000 acres of
+ submerged lands and waters within the state's 3nm
+ Territorial Sea, 22 barrier islands, 2.5 million acres of
+ estuarine waters, and more than 10,000 miles of estuarine
+ shoreline.
+
+ Department of Defense mission capability which, as the
+ state's second largest economic sector, contributes $66
+ billion in gross state product, and $34 billion in personal
+ income.
+
+ 12 Division of Parks and Recreation units and recreational
+ areas located adjacent to ocean waters or the sounds, which
+ welcome 5.2 million visitors annually.
+
+ The items listed above provide jobs, recreational opportunities,
+and homes for North Carolinians and people who travel here from around
+the world. Protecting these resources is a bipartisan issue.
+
+ Question 3. Aside from the risks of an offshore oil spill, what
+other harmful impacts might result--either onshore or offshore--from
+opening the Atlantic Outer Continental Shelf to oil and gas
+development?
+
+ Answer. Here are potential risks broken down by issue.
+Geological
+
+ One location in North Carolina's coverage area in the
+ National Outer Continental Shelf Oil and Gas Leasing
+ Program has overlapping geologic plays located directly off
+ Cape Hatteras. Known geologic hazards could induce failure
+ in safety measures, as was determined when Mobil evaluated
+ the Manteo block in 1987 or induce submarine landslides.
+
+ The known underwater landslides offshore of North Carolina
+ could impact underwater wellheads and trigger disastrous
+ results in each of the six geological plays off our coast.
+
+ The U.S. Geological Survey (USGS) identified three major
+ slides: the Currituck Slide that extends from the northern
+ border of the state; the Cape Lookout Slide that extends
+ from the Outer Banks; and the Cape Fear Slide that extends
+ from the southern border of the state.
+
+ If oil- and gas-related activities destabilize these
+ slides, a tsunami could result.
+
+ A slide destabilization could also undermine the wellhead
+ where blowout preventers are located.
+
+ The unique physical oceanographic area off Cape Hatteras
+ at the confluence of the two major surface currents of the
+ western Atlantic Ocean--the Gulf Stream and the Labrador
+ Current--present significant complications for subsurface
+ resource development due to the instability of the marine
+ floor and severe surface weather.
+
+ According to the National Parks Service's Cape Hatteras
+ National Seashore, these natural elements, including
+ devastating hurricanes and Nor'easters ``form a
+ navigational nightmare that is feared as much as any in the
+ world.'' It is estimated that over 1,000 vessels have been
+ lost near Cape Hatteras.
+
+Marine Fisheries and Habitats
+
+ The South Atlantic Fishery Management Council, acting
+ through the National Marine Fisheries Service, designated
+ several areas offshore of North Carolina as Essential Fish
+ Habitat; a subset of these areas is designated as Habitat
+ Areas of Particular Concern. Habitat Areas of Particular
+ Concern are designated where they are considered
+ particularly important for managed species or species
+ complexes due to the importance of the ecological functions
+ they provide and where they are at risk due to their rarity
+ or sensitivity to human degradation. These designated areas
+ include The Point, Ten Fathom Ledge, Big Rock and the
+ shoals of Cape Hatteras, Cape Lookout and Cape Fear.
+
+ Essential Fish Habitat is important to migratory species
+ such as king and Spanish mackerel, dolphin, tuna, and
+ cobia, as well as the snapper grouper complex. Due to the
+ importance of these species to the state's economy, it is
+ vital that Essential Fish Habitats are protected from
+ direct, indirect, and cumulative impacts associated with
+ oil and gas drilling and development in the Outer
+ Continental Shelf waters off North Carolina.
+
+ Deep waters of the Blake Plateau in the Southeast harbor
+ some extremely unusual and valuable marine ecosystems. A
+ deep water coral wilderness stretches from North Carolina
+ to Florida, including ancient reefs--some documented as
+ more than a million years old--of slow-growing Lophelia
+ corals. An area encompassing 23,000 square miles of these
+ reefs has been designated as Habitat Areas of Particular
+ Concern under Federal essential fish habitat provisions by
+ the South Atlantic Fisheries Management Council. Deep water
+ methane seep communities are just now being discovered; the
+ one that is well documented on the Blake Ridge was also
+ protected in the same action by the South Atlantic
+ Fisheries Management Council (SAFMC).
+
+ The SAFMC Habitat and Environmental Protection Advisory
+ Panel also identified further unexplored areas where deep
+ water coral discoveries are likely to be made.
+
+Commercial and Recreational Fishing
+
+ The commercial fishing industry in 2016 supported an
+ estimated 7,410 jobs, $166 million in income, and a $388.32
+ million economic impact for the state. In the same year,
+ approximately 1.4 million recreational anglers embarked on
+ approximately 5.4 million trips in North Carolina's coastal
+ waters. Coastal recreational fishing activity supported an
+ estimated 15,069 jobs, $621 million in income, and $1.57
+ billion economic impact to the state economy. Combined,
+ commercial and recreational fishing activities support an
+ estimated 22,500 jobs, $787 million in income, and $1.96
+ billion in annual economic impact.
+
+ Oil and gas development off our shores, including oil
+ platforms, could severely limit the areas within which our
+ state's fishermen could fish for certain species.
+
+Historic Resources
+
+ North Carolina has earned the nickname ``Graveyard of the
+ Atlantic'' for the thousands of ships lost off the Outer
+ Banks, from Native American dugouts to colonial-era ships
+ to Civil War ironclads and WWII U-boats. Other submerged
+ historic resources include downed military aircraft. Many
+ of these sites have the potential to contain human remains
+ and may legally be considered graves subject to state,
+ Federal, and international law. While some of these
+ resources have known locations for avoidance and planning
+ purposes, other archaeologically sensitive locations are
+ unknown or unexpected.
+
+ Both pipeline excavation and dredging are likely to affect
+ submerged historic resources within both state and Federal
+ waters. Additionally, pipeline connections onto shore for
+ resource transportation by land and construction of
+ additional port infrastructure have the potential to affect
+ archaeologically sensitive areas or nearby historic
+ districts.
+
+Military
+
+ Military exercises conducted in North Carolina and from
+ North Carolina-based military installations are vital not
+ only to national defense and security, but also to the
+ economies of North Carolina and the Nation. Oil and gas
+ leasing and development off North Carolina's coast could
+ jeopardize both military readiness and the North Carolina
+ economy.
+
+ The normal operations of oil and gas development in the
+ region would be enough to hinder military training
+ exercises off the North Carolina coast.
+
+ The presence of multiple shipping and exploratory sea
+ vessels and oil derricks pose a risk of obstructing
+ visibility and encroaching on existing flight paths.
+
+ Because the military is the second largest sector of North
+ Carolina's economy, adverse impacts from oil and gas
+ development would be felt throughout the state economy.
+ North Carolina has the fourth-largest active and reserve
+ military population in the Nation. The military contributes
+ $66 billion in gross state product and $34 billion in
+ personal income. More than 575,000 individuals are either
+ directly employed by the military or work in the private
+ sector providing goods or services that support the
+ military's presence in North Carolina.
+
+Renewable Energy
+
+ Development of oil and gas resources off North Carolina's
+ coast would jeopardize renewable energy opportunities in
+ the same general area.
+
+ The Kitty Hawk Wind Energy Area is located in the same
+ offshore region that BOEM proposes for oil and gas drilling
+ and development in North Carolina's Outer Continental Shelf
+ waters.
+
+ Co-locating two separate incompatible large-scale energy
+ projects increases the potential for user conflicts and
+ environmental impacts.
+
+ The best way to mitigate these potential use conflicts is
+ to remove North Carolina's Outer Continental Shelf waters
+ from further consideration in the Federal oil and gas
+ leasing program.
+
+Commercial Shipping
+
+ Potential navigation and safety impacts to commercial
+ shipping along the East Coast.
+
+ Question 4. Governor Cooper and Governor Baker, while we're
+discussing the threats and impacts associated with climate change,
+there's an obvious connection to opening vast new areas of the Atlantic
+Ocean to oil and gas development. At a time when our country needs to
+confront the reality of climate change, what does the Trump
+administration's desire to open the Atlantic coast to unfettered fossil
+fuel development tell you about their priorities about environmental
+protection?
+
+ Answer. The most prudent actions the U.S. Department of the
+Interior could take on this topic are to exclude the Atlantic Coast
+from its forthcoming Proposed Plan for the National Outer Continental
+Shelf Oil and Gas Leasing Program for the years 2019-2024 and to deny
+permit applications for oil and gas seismic air gun surveying off North
+Carolina's coast. Offshore drilling and seismic testing unnecessarily
+threaten North Carolina's coastal environment and economy.
+
+ Question 5. Did either of you have conversations with former
+Secretary Ryan Zinke about his decision to unilaterally exempt Florida
+from offshore oil and gas development, but no other states that have
+equally as valuable and vibrant fishing and tourism industries?
+
+ 5a. Why do you think former Secretary Zinke tried to exempt
+Florida, but no other state?
+
+ Answer. In February 2018 a bipartisan group of local officials and
+I met with former Secretary Zinke in Raleigh. We asked Mr. Zinke to
+exempt North Carolina's coast from the offshore drilling plan, just as
+he had putatively exempted Florida. We emphasized that like in Florida,
+coastal tourism is important to North Carolina. And like Florida, North
+Carolina has bipartisan opposition to drilling, an ecologically fragile
+shoreline, and the potential for catastrophic accidents.
+
+ I don't know why Mr. Zinke purported to exempt Florida, but the
+Department of the Interior still has the ability to remove water off
+North Carolina's coast and the rest of the Atlantic Ocean from
+consideration for the 5-year offshore leasing plan.
+
+ 5b. Do you believe former Secretary Zinke potentially violated
+Federal laws when he made the snap decision to exempt a single state
+from his oil and gas leasing plan without going through the required
+public process?
+
+ Answer. I can't speak to whether or not Secretary Zinke violated
+the law in the Florida process, but I did tell him during the February
+2018 meeting that if the final 5-year offshore leasing plan includes
+coastal waters off North Carolina, he could expect to be involved in a
+lawsuit.
+
+ Question 6. Why do your administrations oppose offshore oil and gas
+development, and are your positions in line with your state's coastal
+communities and coastal businesses?
+
+ Answer. Simply put, offshore oil and gas development off North
+Carolina's coast is a bad deal for the state. Please refer my responses
+to Questions 2 and 3 above for an explanation of why North Carolina
+opposes seismic air gun testing and offshore drilling.
+ North Carolina's coastal communities and businesses strongly oppose
+seismic air gun testing and offshore drilling in the Atlantic. Nearly
+40 coastal governments have passed resolutions in opposition to oil and
+gas exploration and development activities off the coast. So too have
+North Carolina business interests passed resolutions in opposition to
+oil and gas exploration and development, including the tourism
+development authorities in Carteret, New Hanover, and Dare counties;
+the Carteret County, Outer Bank, and Wrightsville Beach chambers of
+commerce; the Outer Banks Home Builders Association; and the Outer
+Banks Association of Realtors.
+ In addition, other business and key stakeholders, including the NC
+Association of Resort Towns and Convention Cities, the NC Council of
+Churches, and NC Interfaith Power and Light, submitted comments in
+opposition to offshore oil and gas activities. These positions in
+opposition taken by communities and business organizations echo the
+message we've heard from our state's residents and the editors' desks
+of our major news organizations. In August 2017, following BOEM's
+renewed call for a new 5-year leasing plan, the NC Department of
+Environmental Quality hosted three public hearings on the coast and
+solicited feedback from the public on the Federal proposal. In total,
+465 people attended the hearings in Wilmington, Morehead City, and
+Manteo. Of the 104 people who made remarks at the hearings, 96 spoke
+against oil and gas exploration off North Carolina's coast.
+
+ Question 7. Do you support seismic air gun blasting that is a
+precursor to oil and gas development?
+
+ Answer. North Carolina is opposed to seismic air gun blasting.
+Research indicates that the proposed seismic surveys off of North
+Carolina's coast would harm marine mammals. Our state has a higher
+diversity of marine mammals than anywhere else along the East Coast or
+in the Gulf of Mexico. The disruption of North Carolina's critical
+marine resources by allowing seismic testing represents a critical
+threat to North Carolina's coastal communities and economy.
+ My administration has taken numerous steps to oppose seismic
+surveying. I have signed onto two letters that include multiple East
+Coast governors in opposition to oil and gas exploration and
+development in the Atlantic Ocean. The most recent letter--dated
+December 20, 2018, and submitted to the Secretaries of the Department
+of the Interior and Department of Commerce--was signed by a bipartisan
+group of 10 governors. On July 21, 2017, my administration submitted
+regulatory comments to the National Oceanic and Atmospheric
+Administration asking that it deny applications to incidentally harass
+marine mammals off the North Carolina coast.
+ Additionally, after new scientific studies regarding potential
+impacts of Geological and Geophysical (G&G) activities on marine
+resources were published, the N.C. DEQ's Division of Coastal Management
+sent letters to four companies on December 22, 2017, asking them to re-
+open the consistency determinations pursuant to 15 CFR 930.66 and
+submit additional information about proposed seismic surveying for
+offshore oil and gas resource development. On March 13, 2018, N.C.
+DEQ's Division of Coastal Management sent a letter to the U.S. Bureau
+of Ocean Energy Management asking it to refrain from issuing permits to
+seismic companies, as the requested information for the supplemental
+consistency determinations was never received.
+ My administration continues to have concerns about the potential
+impacts of seismic testing on marine resources that could severely
+impact North Carolina's commercial and recreational fisheries. We
+cannot afford to endanger the natural resources that serve as the
+foundation of our tourism industry and coastal economy.
+
+ Question Submitted by Rep. Bishop
+ Question 1. Governors, you both stated your opposition to offshore
+oil and gas development in Federal waters. Governors, do you believe
+that states should have the right to control offshore energy
+development in Federal waters adjoining their coasts?
+
+ Answer. Comments from the governors of coastal states should be of
+paramount importance given that states and communities have the best
+understanding of the environmental, social, and economic implications
+of offshore energy exploration and development and that they are the
+most likely to be directly affected. Overwhelming state opposition to
+oil and gas exploration and development requires significant
+consideration under Federal law, namely the Outer Continental Shelf
+Lands Act (OCSLA) and the Coastal Zone Management Act (CZMA).
+ The OCSLA requires that as part of the 5-year plan review process,
+the Secretary of Interior must solicit and consider comments from the
+governors of affected states. At least 60 days prior to publication of
+the program in the Federal Register, the Secretary must submit the
+program to the governor of each affected state for further comments and
+for the governor to consult with local government leaders.
+Additionally, when the Secretary submits the program to Congress and
+the President, that submission must include an explanation for
+accepting or rejecting any specific recommendations made by a governor,
+per 43 U.S.C. 1344.
+ In addition, section 307 of the Federal CZMA affords states an
+important role in decision making regarding offshore energy development
+based on potential impacts to a state's coastal resources and uses,
+even when that development activity takes place in adjacent Federal
+waters.
+
+ *****
+
+ ATTACHMENTS
+
+ January 17, 2018
+
+The Honorable Ryan Zinke
+Secretary
+U.S. Department of the Interior
+1849 C Street NW
+Washington, DC. 20240
+
+ Dear Secretary Zinke:
+
+ We write today to express our joint opposition to the leasing,
+exploration, development and production of oil and gas in the Atlantic
+Ocean as proposed by the 2019-2024 Outer Continental Shelf Oil and Gas
+Leasing Program. We also write to request that our states and the
+Atlantic Coast be exempt from this program.
+
+ Like Florida, each of our states has unique natural resources and
+an economy that is reliant on tourism as an essential driver. We
+support the notion of energy diversity, but the environmental and
+economic importance of the Atlantic Ocean must be weighed against the
+potential unintended consequences of these types of activities.
+
+ More than one hundred and forty (140) local communities passed
+resolutions opposing offshore drilling in the Atlantic. They have also
+been joined by tourism associations, convention and visitors bureaus
+(CVB's), businesses, trade groups, and legislators from both sides of
+the aisle.
+
+ Not only are ocean and oceanside resources at risk, but also nearby
+bays, estuaries, coastal communities, iconic natural areas, and ports.
+The irreversible impact on ecosystems including marine mammals, fish,
+sea turtles, and other aquatic life that inhabit the ocean offshore is
+gravely concerning, as is potential risk and harm to our state's
+economies, our natural resources, our military installations, and our
+residents.
+ We appreciate the emphasis that you have placed on public input and
+urge you to grant our request to be exempt from this program.
+
+ Sincerely,
+
+ Governor Larry Hogan Governor Dannel P. Malloy
+ Maryland Connecticut
+
+ Governor John C. Carney Governor Roy Cooper
+ Delaware North Carolina
+
+ Governor Charles D. Baker Governor Gina M. Raimondo
+ Massachusetts Rhode Island
+
+ Governor Ralph S. Northam
+ Virginia
+
+ *****
+
+ December 20, 2018
+
+The Honorable Wilbur L. Ross, Jr.
+Secretary
+U.S. Department of Commerce
+1401 Constitution Ave., NW
+Washington, DC. 20230
+
+The Honorable Ryan Zinke
+Secretary
+U.S. Department of the Interior
+1849 C Street NW
+Washington, DC. 20240
+
+ Dear Secretary Ross and Secretary Zinke:
+
+ As the governors of 10 states on the Atlantic seaboard, we write to
+reiterate our strong opposition to seismic airgun surveys and oil and
+gas drilling off our coasts. These activities pose an unacceptable and
+unnecessary threat to our coastal ecosystems and coastal economies. We
+emphatically disagree with the recent decision by the Department of
+Commerce to issue incidental harassment authorizations (IHAs) for
+seismic airgun surveys in the Atlantic Ocean. We urge the Department of
+the Interior to deny permits for seismic airgun surveys in the
+Atlantic. In addition, we adamantly oppose the inclusion of any
+Atlantic Ocean region in the final 2019-2024 National Outer Continental
+Shelf Oil and Gas Leasing Program.
+ The coastal economies in each of our states depend upon vibrant
+tourism and fishing industries. The IHAs would allow five companies to
+conduct seismic airgun surveys in the Atlantic Ocean, despite peer-
+reviewed evidence portending significant harmful impacts to marine
+mammals and fisheries, including endangered species. Seismic airgun
+surveying can cause acute, cumulative, and chronic negative impacts on
+the ability of marine mammals to send and receive signals that are
+essential for feeding, reproduction, raising offspring, and navigation.
+The repeated, loud noises from airgun blasts also risk diminishing
+essential fish stocks for commercial and recreational fishing
+communities in our states.
+ The seismic survey restrictions in the IHAs do not ensure that such
+activities will have a negligible impact on affected species. These
+restrictions, for example, fail to account for the ability of seismic
+airgun pulses to travel over long distances, the correct exposure
+thresholds for changes in species behavior, and the cumulative impacts
+of conducting multiple seismic airgun surveying operations at once. As
+a result, conducting seismic surveys under these authorizations can
+lead to mortality and permanent injury of fish and marine mammals,
+including endangered species such as the North Atlantic right whale.
+ The Atlantic Coast's ocean economy generates more than $98 billion
+in gross domestic product, an economic impact that would be jeopardized
+by seismic airgun surveys and offshore oil and gas drilling. More than
+200 local governments have passed resolutions opposing seismic airgun
+surveying and/or offshore drilling in the Atlantic Ocean. Tourism
+associations, convention and visitors bureaus, businesses, trade
+groups, and elected officials from both sides of the aisle also have
+voiced opposition to these activities.
+ State and local leaders in our states have voiced consistent,
+bipartisan opposition to seismic airgun surveys and offshore drilling.
+We ask that you respect our request and concerns by denying all permit
+applications and issuing no further IHAs for seismic airgun surveys in
+the Atlantic Ocean. In addition, we request that you exclude the
+Atlantic Ocean from the 2019-2024 National Outer Continental Shelf Oil
+and Gas Leasing Program for offshore drilling and deny any future
+activities whose purpose is to support offshore drilling in the
+Atlantic Ocean.
+
+ Sincerely,
+
+ Roy Cooper Henry McMaster
+ Governor of North Carolina Governor of South Carolina
+
+ Dannel Malloy Andrew Cuomo
+ Governor of Connecticut Governor of New York
+
+ Larry Hogan Charlie Baker
+ Governor of Maryland Governor of Massachusetts
+
+ John Carney Ralph Northam
+ Governor of Delaware Governor of Virginia
+
+ Gina Raimondo Phillip D. Murphy
+ Governor of Rhode Island Governor of New Jersey
+
+ ______
+
+
+ The Chairman. Thank you very much, Governor, much
+appreciated.
+ Let me now turn to Governor Baker for your testimony. The
+floor is yours, sir.
+
+ STATEMENT OF THE HON. CHARLIE BAKER, GOVERNOR, STATE OF
+ MASSACHUSETTS, BOSTON, MASSACHUSETTS
+
+ Governor Baker. Thank you, Chairman Grijalva and Ranking
+Member Bishop, for those warm, welcoming remarks. And I want to
+thank the members of the Committee for being here, as well, and
+inviting me to testify on the approach that Massachusetts has
+taken to deal with the very real challenge associated with
+climate change.
+ In Massachusetts, climate change is not a partisan issue.
+While we sometimes disagree on specific policies, we understand
+the science and know the impacts are real because we are
+experiencing them firsthand.
+ Shortly after I took office in January 2015, the snow
+started falling hard. And it didn't end for months. Last
+winter, we saw four major Nor'easters, setting record flood
+levels and causing significant damage to natural resources and
+property. Rising temperatures have led to warmer winters,
+impacting weather-dependent industries like skiing and
+agriculture. Climate change is also warming our coastal waters
+and threatening some of the Nation's most important commercial
+fisheries.
+ While many of these challenges are not new, they are more
+frequent and more damaging than before. While rising
+temperatures and warmer winters have impacted weather-dependent
+industries like skiing, local businesses like Berkshire East
+have adapted to these challenges by diversifying their business
+to include non-winter activities, which now account for 60
+percent of the mountain's revenue. Berkshire East has also
+become the first ski mountain in the world to be 100 percent
+powered by renewable energy.
+ The magnitude of the impacts from climate change requires
+all of us at the Federal, state, and local levels, to work
+together. That is the path we have taken in Massachusetts.
+Massachusetts, via bipartisan legislation, was one of the first
+states in the Nation to establish a long-term requirement to
+reduce carbon emissions by at least 80 percent below 1990
+levels by 2050, while also setting interim targets. We are well
+on our way to reaching our 2020 goal of a 25 percent reduction
+in emissions.
+ The Regional Greenhouse Gas Initiative, a cap and trade
+program encompassing large electric generators across nine
+northeast states, also provides a stable policy to reduce
+emission and allow states to invest in cost-effective energy
+efficiency programs. The investments from this initiative has
+saved ratepayers across the RGGI states an estimated $8.6
+billion.
+ We have also developed regional partnerships with New
+England states, the Canadian provinces, and the Federal
+Government. Utilizing the comparative strengths of different
+regions allows us to obtain competitive pricing on projects
+like hydropower from Quebec.
+ In 2016, we competitively bid and selected an offshore wind
+project on a Federal lease area that will save ratepayers money
+over the next 25 years. This would not have been possible
+without our partnership with the Federal Government, and I
+applaud Congress for providing a predictable investment tax
+credit for this industry, and also the Trump administration's
+Bureau of Ocean Energy Management for working with us to
+quickly review the project and build a new industry here in the
+United States off our eastern shores.
+ We have also been preparing for the ongoing impact of
+climate change. Our administration recently completed a state
+hazard mitigation and climate adaptation plan. Leveraging
+Federal Emergency Management Agency money, the plan is the
+first in the Nation to fully integrate Federal hazard
+mitigation planning requirements with a proactive approach to
+addressing the impacts of climate change.
+ Our administration has also sought to work closely with our
+local communities. Our municipal vulnerability preparedness
+program provides grants and technical assistance to cities and
+towns, so they can assess their vulnerabilities and plan for
+and implement climate change adaptation projects. Importantly,
+these program allows communities the flexibility they need to
+design solutions that work for their unique circumstances.
+ Based on our experience in Massachusetts, I would like to
+share four themes that I believe will help further reduce
+greenhouse gas emissions and increase resiliency across the
+country.
+ First, states and local communities need support from the
+Federal Government. Many Federal initiatives are only available
+after a disaster occurs. Incentives similar to our MVP program
+would help communities address resiliency issues before the
+next disaster. Expanding programs like FEMA's new resilient
+infrastructure grants and increasing funding available to
+states would accelerate existing efforts and galvanize new
+ones.
+ Bipartisan interest in infrastructure funding also holds
+tremendous promise to not only repair and modernize our
+infrastructure, but also make it resilient to changes in
+weather. Federal infrastructure legislation should incorporate
+consideration of climate change emissions, vulnerability, and
+design standards that reflect that changing climate.
+ Both state and Federal governments also need to develop
+public-private partnerships to bring private-sector dollars
+into our communities, while leveraging the knowledge and
+strategic thinking the private sector can bring to this
+challenge.
+ Second, we need strong Federal leadership and a bipartisan
+vision on climate change that prioritizes practical, market-
+driven, and cost-effective solutions, while affording states
+the flexibility to design strategies that work for their unique
+challenges. We believe it is essential for the Federal
+Government to create a target with respect to emission
+reductions that can vary by state or region.
+ In our state's experience, setting an aggressive target for
+reducing greenhouse gas emissions provides the foundation for
+clean energy policy, sends a clear message to industry, and
+enables long-range planning.
+ Third, strong Federal leadership should also include making
+impactful investments in research around both emission
+reductions and climate change adaptation. Federal research and
+development gave us the internet and GPS, technology that has
+changed our lives forever. I believe the Federal Government
+could bring its resources to bear in developing the next
+breakthrough battery cell or other technological advances that
+could help dramatically reduce emissions and radically
+transform our energy future.
+ Fourth, the Federal Government should incorporate climate
+risk and resilience in future Federal spending and planning
+decisions to ensure taxpayer dollars are used wisely. Our own
+Boston Harbor Islands, managed through a partnership between
+state and Federal Government and a non-profit, were already
+threatened by rising sea levels and storm surges.
+ Governors around the country are seeing and responding to
+the effects of climate change in our states and communities.
+This is not a challenge any one of us can solve alone. We need
+collective action from Federal, state, and local governments
+working with the private sector to aggressively reduce our
+greenhouse gas emissions and adapt to the changes that are
+already in motion.
+ I want to thank this Committee for the invitation to speak,
+and I thank my colleague, Governor Cooper, for joining me here
+today. I have submitted written testimony, which goes into more
+detail than my oral remarks. I look forward to working together
+on this challenge, and I am pleased to answer any questions
+from the Committee.
+
+ [The prepared statement of Governor Baker follows:]
+Prepared Statement of Charles D. Baker, Governor of the Commonwealth of
+ Massachusetts
+ Chairman Grijalva, Ranking Member Bishop, and members of the
+Committee, thank you for inviting me to testify today before the House
+Natural Resources Committee on the Commonwealth's approach to the very
+real challenge of climate change. Thank you for addressing this issue
+in a bipartisan manner and for looking to the states who, along with
+cities and towns, are directly taking on this challenge by setting bold
+targets, developing practical and cost effective solutions, and working
+collaboratively across the country.
+ challenges and opportunities in massachusetts
+ In Massachusetts climate change is not a partisan issue--while
+there may sometimes be disagreement on specific policies, we understand
+the science and we know the impacts are real. We know through
+experience that mitigation to clean up our energy supply and
+transportation system, paired with adaptation strategies to reduce risk
+and build resilience can foster strong communities, protect residents
+and natural resources, and contribute to strong economic growth and
+innovation throughout the state.
+ We have seen firsthand the impacts of a changing climate in
+Massachusetts. Shortly after taking office in January 2015, the snow
+started falling, hard, and it didn't end until well into April. What
+was different about those storms was the sheer volume of snowfall, with
+record-breaking amounts in Worcester and Boston. Although it seems
+counterintuitive, climate change is indeed producing higher volume
+precipitation events. As the air and oceans have warmed, higher
+concentrations of water vapor in the atmosphere lead to more intense
+rain and snowfall, and what we are seeing in Massachusetts is part of
+this pattern. In fact, the percentage of rain and snow falling in the
+heaviest 1 percent of storms in the Northeast has increased by over 70
+percent since 1958.\1\ The increasing frequency and intensity of storms
+is something of great concern to us in Massachusetts. Last winter we
+saw four major Nor'easters, setting record flood levels in Boston and
+other coastal communities, and causing significant damage to natural
+resources and infrastructure as well as devastating property loss. We
+have also seen an increase in intense rainfall events, with flash
+flooding and damage to ageing infrastructure in cities like Worcester
+and Lynn.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ \1\ Horton, R., G. Yohe, W. Easterling, R. Kates, M. Ruth, E.
+Sussman, A. Whelchel, D. Wolfe, and F. Lipschultz, 2014: Ch. 16:
+Northeast. Climate Change Impacts in the United States: The Third
+National Climate Assessment, J.M. Melillo, Terese (T.C.) Richmond, and
+G.W. Yohe, Eds., U.S. Global Change Research Program, 16-1-nn.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ While last fall was the wettest ever recorded in Massachusetts, in
+the summer of 2016, we experienced one of the worst droughts on record.
+These droughts greatly strained public and private water supplies in
+many communities and led to significant losses in agricultural
+production, including cranberries, apples, peaches and Christmas trees
+whose growers reported up to 80 percent loss of seedlings. In September
+2016, the U.S. Department of Agriculture designated all 14 counties in
+Massachusetts as primary or contiguous natural disaster areas due to
+losses caused by the drought, making them eligible for Federal disaster
+assistance.
+ Temperatures have also been rising. On the heels of the warmest 3
+years on record, last August was the warmest month ever recorded in
+Massachusetts. This overall warming trend is leading to more frequent
+heat waves that threaten vulnerable population groups, warmer winters
+that impact weather dependent industries like maple syrup and skiing,
+and increases in Lyme disease and other tick and mosquito-borne
+illnesses. Climate change is also warming our coastal waters and
+threatening some of the Nation's most important commercial fisheries
+off the coast of New England. Stretching from Cape Cod to Cape Sable
+Island in Nova Scotia, the Gulf of Maine is warming faster than 99
+percent of the world's oceans. Warming waters have already led to 80
+percent reduction of Atlantic cod habitat over the last decade. Further
+warming is projected to shift lobster populations 200 miles north into
+Canada and enhance the ongoing invasion of green crabs that threaten
+the soft-shell clam industry.
+ By talking with our farmers and fisherman and touring the damage
+after weather events, one theme has become clear to me--while many of
+these challenges are not new, they are not like they used to be. They
+are occurring more frequently and they are more damaging than they ever
+were in the past. The science and economic data bear this out and we
+know that these changes are happening all across the globe. I am all
+too aware of the unique challenges other governors are facing, from the
+deadly wildfires in California and Montana, to permafrost and glacial
+melt in Alaska, to severe heat waves last summer across the Southwest.
+ These impacts come with a growing cost. Federal data from the
+National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration (NOAA) shows that 2017
+was the costliest year for weather and climate disasters with over $300
+billion in total spending.\2\ In New England, the string of Nor'easters
+we saw last March cost the region $2.2 billion and we lost nine lives.
+Since 2015, Massachusetts has also seen at least $200 million in
+disaster damages to our towns and public agencies, which is only a
+fraction of the costs our communities face. The 2015 February blizzards
+alone were devastating--lives were lost, and the storms cost our state
+and local governments $35 million, with total losses exceeding an
+estimated $1 billion.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ \2\ NOAA National Centers for Environmental Information (NCEI) U.S.
+Billion-Dollar Weather and Climate Disasters (2018). https://
+www.ncdc.noaa.gov/billions/.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ In Massachusetts our rural economy and natural resource based
+industries are increasingly threatened by changing seasons, shorter
+winters, and less snow. Warmer temperatures are hitting the ski
+industry particularly hard. Just one mild winter in 2009/2010 cost the
+Northeast ski industry 1,700 jobs and $108 million in economic
+value.\3\ But our ski resorts are responding to this pressure with
+entrepreneurship to diversify their business model and expand into
+recreation and tourism activities outside of the traditional winter
+season.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ \3\ Burkowski, E., and M. Magnussen. 2012. Climate Impacts on the
+Winter Tourism Economy in the United States. Natural Resources Defense
+Council. https://www.nrdc.org/sites/default/files/climate-impacts-
+winter-tourism-report.pdf.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ On the eastern slopes of the Berkshires, Jon Schaefer's family
+business Berkshire East has become the first ski mountain in the world
+to be 100 percent powered by renewables. Concerned about the
+unpredictable cost of energy and the impact of climate change, Mr.
+Schaefer invested in wind and solar, using State and Federal incentive
+programs. The cost savings from installing clean energy allowed him to
+invest in more efficient snow-making equipment while also diversifying
+his business to include off-season activities like zip-lining and white
+water rafting to bring in additional revenue. He reports that 60
+percent of the mountain's revenue now comes from non-winter business,
+resulting in an operation that is much more resilient to the changing
+weather patterns ahead.
+ There are stories like this across the country--stories of family
+businesses, farms, large industry and cities and small towns threatened
+by the changes they are already seeing, but harnessing innovation and
+ingenuity to take on these challenges. But they can't do it alone. The
+magnitude of the impacts from climate change requires all of us to put
+politics aside and act together, quickly and decisively. We still have
+the opportunity to check the severity of future impacts by aggressively
+reducing greenhouse gas emissions and adapting to the changes that are
+ongoing. That is the path we have taken in Massachusetts.
+ a history of bold leadership on climate change and breakthrough
+ mitigation policies
+ The effort to reduce emissions to a level that avoids the most
+catastrophic changes to our climate clearly requires state, national,
+and international leadership. At the same time, there are aspects of
+Massachusetts' own experience in successfully establishing achievable
+goals, working regionally, and fostering innovative breakthroughs that
+could offer lessons for other states, regions, and the Federal
+Government.
+ With the unanimous, bipartisan passage of the Global Warming
+Solutions Act in 2008, Massachusetts became one of the first states in
+the Nation to establish both a long-term requirement to reduce carbon
+emissions by at least 80 percent below 1990 levels by 2050, while also
+setting interim targets every decade. The Act requires us to report our
+emissions annually, track policy effectiveness and develop plans for
+the future. By mid-century this course will yield significant GHG
+reductions, overhaul our energy structure, and lead to significant
+economic and societal change, while the interim targets will guide the
+implementation of cost-effective policies that reflect current
+technology. Clearly, this is an enormous undertaking but developing
+ambitious, yet realistic goals is working. Our 2020 goal of a 25
+percent reduction under that baseline was set ambitiously in 2010 and
+as of 2016 we have reached a 21.4 percent emissions reduction and are
+well on our way to reach the 25 percent limit. Moreover, far from being
+an economic burden, we have seen close to a 70 percent increase over
+1990 levels in our gross state domestic product and clean energy has
+been one of the strongest job growth sectors in our economy in the last
+decade.
+ The Commonwealth's aggressive 2020 goal puts the state on track to
+meet emissions reductions of 26 to 28 percent below 2005 levels by
+2025--the nationally determined U.S. contribution through the Paris
+Agreement of the United Nations Framework Convention on Climate Change.
+Shortly after the announcement of the intent to withdraw the United
+States from the Paris Agreement, Massachusetts joined with a bipartisan
+coalition of states committed to fulfilling the tenets of the Paris
+Agreement by implementing policies to reduce emissions, tracking and
+reporting progress on emissions reductions and accelerating new and
+existing policies to reduce carbon pollution and promote clean energy
+deployment at the State and Federal level. The coalition is now 20
+governors strong.
+ This 2020 goal has not only provided a focus within Massachusetts,
+but it has also compelled us to develop instrumental regional
+partnerships with New England states, the Canadian provinces and the
+Federal Government. Specifically, we have found that utilizing the
+comparative strengths of different regions--whether it is hydropower
+from Quebec or offshore wind in Federal waters--allows us to obtain
+cost-competitive pricing. Every region of our country should have the
+flexibility to develop a unique plan that leverages existing resources
+and economies, but we must seize the opportunity to responsibly reduce
+emissions now.
+ The predictability of the regional clean energy market and
+promotion of clean energy development and trade have also been
+essential to the Commonwealth's success. The Regional Greenhouse Gas
+Initiative (RGGI), a cap-and-trade program encompassing electric
+generators larger than 25 Megawatts across nine states, provides a
+stable policy to reduce emissions and allows states to invest auction
+proceeds in cost-effective energy efficiency programs, including nearly
+$400 million in Massachusetts since its inception. While the program
+marginally increases wholesale electricity pricing, the reinvestment in
+highly cost-effective energy efficiency measures has resulted in $3-$4
+in benefits for every $1 of incremental cost. In Massachusetts,
+businesses across sectors are seizing the opportunity to take advantage
+of energy efficiency programs through our MassSave Program--from
+optimizing efficient cooling technology at the largest data center in
+New England run by the Markley Group, to installing advanced lighting
+at Hannaford, one of the largest supermarket chains in the state, to
+removing redundant motors at Cedar's Mediterranean Foods operations,
+saving over $100,000 annually in energy costs. Our major sports
+facilities, including Fenway Park, have undergone LED lighting upgrades
+that have reduced the park's electricity use by 12 percent. Bottom
+line, we have saved billions in avoided electrical costs for all
+ratepayers by keeping electric load basically flat while our economy
+has grown. The results on New England sports fields have been pretty
+decent as well.
+ In total, the region's greenhouse gas emissions from this sector
+have fallen 50 percent since 2005 and the regional investments from the
+proceeds are estimated to have saved ratepayers across the RGGI states
+a cumulative $8.6 billion. Regulated generators see the value in the
+clarity and the predictability of the program, while businesses support
+the energy efficiency investments that have earned Massachusetts the
+title of the #1 state for energy efficiency in the Nation for 8
+consecutive years.
+ While we have leveraged cost-effective efficiency investments,
+including the installation of over 24.1 million LED light bulbs, energy
+innovation opportunities are accelerating. From further advancements in
+lighting, electrical heating and cooling, and advanced insulation
+improvements that make zero energy consumption for new building
+construction a reality, we now have commercially available efficient
+technology and materials that are transforming our economy.
+ There is no single solution to the challenges we face and we need
+to take a flexible approach that supports the innovations of tomorrow
+while acknowledging the role existing resources like natural gas and
+nuclear power, have played in our success to date. Clean energy
+innovation, guided by targeted research and development and pure
+entrepreneurial initiative, continues to deliver declining energy costs
+and new disruptive technologies. While deploying the cost-effective
+technology of today we should invest in clean energy research and
+development. These investments will likely produce key components of
+our energy future. For example, the ARPA-E program has partnered with
+MIT to move forward with advanced nuclear research to increase reactor
+performance. Harvard University is researching a flow battery that
+utilizes organic molecules to store electricity beyond increasingly
+competitive--but still expensive--electric batteries.
+ Storage completely alters the value proposition for renewable
+energy, presents unique advantages to reconfigure our electric
+distribution system, and can target reductions in the peak electricity
+consumption through timely dispatch. Our Department of Energy Resources
+determined that in Massachusetts, 40 percent of the electrical cost for
+ratepayers occurs during the top 10 percent of the usage hours of year.
+Storage technology can therefore provide both ratepayer and greenhouse
+gas reduction benefits. Massachusetts electric utilities are looking to
+avoid costly upgrades to distribution lines through targeted storage
+deployment, diesel generation on our islands are being replaced with
+storage units, and manufacturers are lowering bills through avoided
+demand charges by curtailing demand with storage during peak demand
+periods.
+ In 2019, we must jettison preconceived assumptions about the costs
+of clean energy and look at the facts. Just 7 years ago, Massachusetts
+considered moving forward with an offshore wind project at a cost of
+roughly 20 cents per-kilowatt and projecting billions in above-market
+costs for ratepayers. In 2016, acting after passage of the bipartisan
+legislation, we issued a competitive Request for Proposals and
+Massachusetts selected an offshore wind project on one of three Federal
+lease areas proposed by Vineyard Wind that represents a cost reduction
+of more than 65 percent below the previous proposal and is projected to
+save ratepayers money. The factors that led to these disruptive prices
+include technology that will increase turbine sizes by nearly three
+times, economies of scale delivered by a larger project, and a
+competitive solicitation that challenged bidders to deliver the best
+price. These industry advancements would not have been possible without
+our critical partnership with the Federal Government. I applaud
+Congress for providing a predictable investment tax credit for this
+industry and also the Trump administration's Bureau of Ocean Energy
+Management for working with us to expeditiously review the project and
+build a new industry in the United States. The Administration has
+recognized the potential economic opportunity of modern offshore wind
+turbines and last December moved forward with lease sales for three
+additional parcels in Federal waters south of Massachusetts. Not only
+did the auction collectively deliver $405 million for the Federal
+Government, but it attracted traditional companies like BP, Shell, and
+the Norwegian state energy company, Equinor. This is a partnership that
+can reduce emissions, save ratepayers money, and provide critical
+revenue to the Federal Government.
+ We can seize this economic opportunity while simultaneously
+realizing the emission reductions afforded by the best available
+science and technology. Congress has come together in the past to
+successfully enact meaningful bipartisan energy and climate change
+legislation that resulted in emission reductions and predictability for
+our business community. Just over 4 years ago, Republicans and
+Democrats came together and developed a compromise that included the
+extension of the renewable investment tax credit allowing Vineyard Wind
+to move forward with an 800 Megawatt project. This credit was
+imperative to the results: emission reductions by over 1.6 million
+metric tons annually, the equivalent of taking 325,000 cars off the
+road and it is estimated that the project will provide over 3,600 local
+full-time equivalent jobs over the life of the project.
+ While we have made significant progress to reduce power sector
+emissions, our next challenge will be transportation. In Massachusetts
+transportation emissions represent close to 40 percent of total
+emissions and continue to climb, while most other sectors are
+declining. In that spirit of regional partnership, this past December,
+we joined eight states and the District of Columbia through the
+Transportation Climate Initiative to work together over the next year
+to develop the framework for a regional program to address greenhouse
+gas emissions in the transportation sector, building on the strong
+foundation provided by RGGI. The announcement follows the recent
+release of the report of the Commission on the Future of
+Transportation, which I appointed to help Massachusetts navigate a
+disruptive transportation future. The report called for the de-
+carbonization of transportation, including collaborating with regional
+partners to develop a carbon pricing mechanism to cap emissions and
+invest revenue back within the state.
+ building a resilient commonwealth
+ In Massachusetts we have focused first on reducing our
+contributions to climate change and building our clean energy economy,
+but our experience with severe weather and natural hazards has made
+clear the importance of preparing for the ongoing impacts of climate
+change. In 2016, I signed an Executive Order to, for the first time,
+pursue an aggressive, integrated effort using sound science to prepare
+state government and partner with our local communities to build
+resiliency for the challenges ahead.
+ One of the first things we did was to partner with the federally
+funded Northeast Climate Adaptation Science Center at the University of
+Massachusetts to understand the climate changes we are seeing now and
+the kinds of changes we will see in the future. Our secretaries of
+Energy and Environmental Affairs and Public Safety and Security led a
+2-year, government-wide effort to complete a State Hazard Mitigation
+and Climate Adaptation Plan. The plan, which leveraged Federal
+Emergency Management Agency (FEMA) money and engaged over 500
+stakeholders, is the first in the Nation to fully integrate Federal
+hazard mitigation planning requirements, with a proactive, forward
+looking approach to addressing the impacts from climate change.
+Throughout the development of the plan, every state agency completed a
+vulnerability assessment of their assets and functions and identified
+initial strategies to increase resiliency.
+ The plan will be used to inform policy, management and spending
+decisions including development of climate change resiliency criteria
+in our capital planning process to ensure that the investments we are
+making today are designed for changing conditions and do not increase
+our exposure to climate risk. While we know we need increased funding
+to deal with these challenges, the first step in this process is making
+sure existing spending is climate-smart and cost-effective.
+ As I mentioned, our local communities are already experiencing
+climate change impacts and are taking leadership themselves on this
+issue--our administration strongly values our municipal partners and
+has sought to work closely together on this challenge. Our Municipal
+Vulnerability Preparedness program (MVP), launched in 2017, builds on
+this partnership by providing grants and technical assistance to
+municipalities so they can assess their vulnerabilities, and plan for
+and implement priority climate change adaptation projects to build
+resiliency and reduce risk. My administration worked with partners
+across the state to develop this community-based program, including the
+Nature Conservancy and the Massachusetts Audubon Society and has
+trained over 300 technical service providers from consulting firms,
+regional planning authorities, engineering companies, small businesses
+and non-profits to lead municipal planning efforts. In its first 2
+years, the MVP program enrolled 44 percent of Massachusetts
+municipalities, and awarded over $8 million in grants.
+ These grants are advancing local resilience innovation--like the
+development of the city of Boston's first ever resilient building code,
+restoration of an urban floodplain in Arlington, and a town-wide road
+stream crossing resiliency strategy in Belchertown. High participation
+from Massachusetts communities underscores the real need and enthusiasm
+for a program that maintains and enhances quality of life, helps to
+repair and replace aging infrastructure with climate-smart solutions,
+and promotes strong local economies while reducing risks and future
+costs. Importantly the program allows communities the flexibility to
+design solutions that work for their unique circumstances, are grounded
+in science and funded by the Commonwealth.
+ These programs cost money, and in fact over the first 4 years of my
+administration we have invested over $600 million on climate change
+mitigation and adaptation actions through our environmental agencies
+alone without raising taxes or fees. Building on this investment, we
+recently worked together with the Legislature to craft an environmental
+bond bill focused on climate change adaptation, environmental
+protection, and recreation that authorizes $2.4 billion of investments
+over 5 years.
+ Now that we have a better understanding of the scope of the
+challenges ahead through our state and local planning efforts, I also
+filed legislation in January calling for a modest increase in the
+excise on property transfers to fund a substantial and sustained
+investment in climate change adaptation to protect property. The
+proposal is estimated to generate $1.3 billion over 10 years that would
+go directly back to cities and towns to invest in climate-smart
+infrastructure and nature-based solutions that protect public health,
+safety, and property across the Commonwealth. Climate-smart
+infrastructure is resilient to damage caused by climate change and
+extreme weather because it is designed to accommodate the climate
+conditions it will experience over its lifetime, rather than historic
+conditions which set the standards for the infrastructure we have
+today. Examples include:
+
+ right-sizing culverts to accommodate increased streamflow
+ from more intense storms;
+
+ removing underutilized dams and restoring floodplains
+ along rivers and streams to prevent flooding;
+
+ installing resilient energy technologies such as
+ microgrids that pair on-site renewables like wind and solar
+ with battery storage to allow a critical facility like a
+ hospital or campus to remain on-line during severe weather;
+
+ employing nature-based solutions such as wetland
+ restoration in urban areas to absorb increased runoff
+ during storms;
+
+ installing artificial oyster reefs and restoring natural
+ coastal habitats to buffer against increased storm surge
+ and sea level rise;
+
+ upgrading combined sewer overflows to separate wastewater
+ from stormwater to ensure cleaner water and fewer flooding
+ events involving untreated sewage; and
+
+ ensuring materials used in roads, bridges, train tracks
+ and other heat sensitive infrastructure can withstand
+ increasing temperatures over their useful life span.
+
+ recommendations and conclusions: commonwealth perspective
+ I would like to share some themes I believe will help make progress
+on reducing greenhouse gas emissions and building resiliency across the
+country based on our experience in Massachusetts.
+Support Local Communities and States
+ Communities need support in the form of incentives, like our MVP
+grant program, to address resiliency issues before the next disaster.
+Many of the current Federal incentives directed through FEMA are only
+available after a disaster occurs, yet for every dollar spent
+proactively on resiliency measures, taxpayers save $6.\4\ One example
+of this type of funding comes from FEMA's new resilient infrastructure
+grants which provide large scale funding support to projects that will
+reduce risks, loss of life, and damages from future disasters. Our
+public and private sector partners are ready to make resilient
+investments in projects that protect our communities, and these matched
+funds ensure that construction can get started. Expanding programs like
+this and increasing funding available to states would accelerate
+existing efforts and galvanize new ones.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ \4\ Natural Hazard Mitigation Saves: 2017 Interim Report. The 2017
+Interim Report (January 2018).
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ Bipartisan cooperation around funding to address the Nation's
+ageing infrastructure also holds tremendous promise to reduce climate
+change vulnerability, help transition to a clean energy economy, spur
+economic development, and build community resiliency. Additional
+Federal funding cannot only repair and modernize our deteriorating
+infrastructure but also help make it resilient to changes in weather.
+Consideration of climate change emissions, vulnerability, environmental
+justice communities, and design standards that reflect a changing
+climate must be incorporated into any infrastructure legislation that
+is filed. Nature-based solutions hold great potential for buffering or
+replacing existing traditional infrastructure and should be explored
+here. Our environmental bond bill includes these types of strategies
+that conserve, restore or mimic the functions of natural ecosystems to
+replace or enhance traditional infrastructure and provide multiple
+benefits for communities in the form of added resiliency, carbon
+sequestration and clean water and air.
+ These types of combined approaches, utilizing traditional
+infrastructure but enhancing its resilience with nature-based
+solutions, are in progress in many places now, including Louisiana,
+following the widespread devastation during Hurricane Katrina. First
+the levees were built higher and stronger, but Louisiana has also been
+incorporating wide-ranging nature-based flooding solutions, including
+restoring wetlands to absorb water, building up barrier islands to
+reduce wave energy and storm surge, and creating oyster reefs to
+protect against flooding as the seas rise.
+ Governments alone cannot sustain the enormous funding needs to
+support local and state resiliency initiatives or the transition to
+clean energy and transportation. Both State and Federal Government need
+to develop public-private partnerships that bring more dollars back to
+our communities while also leveraging the wealth of knowledge and
+strategic thinking the private sector can bring to this challenge.
+Federal Leadership
+ I am proud of our record of climate leadership in Massachusetts,
+and there is much to learn from how states and regions have approached
+this issue; but states cannot solve this problem alone. We need strong
+Federal leadership and a bold bipartisan vision on climate change that
+seeks compromise and prioritizes practical market-based solutions,
+while affording states the flexibility to design strategies that work
+for their unique challenges while continuing to grow their economies.
+ In Massachusetts setting an aggressive target for reducing
+greenhouse gas emissions provides the foundation for our clean energy
+policy, sends a clear signal to industry, and enables us to complete
+long-range planning. We believe it is essential to establish Federal
+emission reduction targets that can vary by state or region with policy
+flexibility for states to design solutions that work for their unique
+circumstances. Such targets would level the playing field and send a
+clear signal to business and industry as we transition to a clean
+energy economy.
+ Our transportation sector targets are particularly important now.
+While predictability and compromise have made cost-competitive
+renewable energy projects possible, recent proposals to roll back the
+current Federal fuel economy standards are creating uncertainty for the
+automobile industry and will undermine national and state emission
+progress. Achieving Massachusetts' 2020 emissions limit assumes a
+strong foundation of Federal fuel economy standards based on
+harmonization with California's Clean Car Program standards which 13
+states including Massachusetts currently follow; states cannot succeed
+in reducing transportation sector emission without these strong
+standards.
+Federal Research, Science and Innovation
+ Strong Federal leadership should also include making impactful
+investments in research to develop technologies that can reduce
+emissions and to design strategies and tools for adapting to the
+ongoing impacts of climate change. The congressional bipartisan effort
+to prioritize clean energy research is paying dividends across this
+country and must be measured in years. The research at the Department
+of Energy and our national laboratories around the country continues,
+and is the key mechanism to release disruptive innovation. It is
+inspiring to consider what this country could accomplish through a
+sustained commitment to clean energy research, while implementing a
+stable and simple commitment to emission reductions.
+ States, communities, businesses, agricultural producers, and
+natural resource managers rely heavily on science, data and management
+tools developed by Federal agencies including NOAA, the U.S. Geologic
+Survey and the Environmental Protection Agency. For example, the
+products provided by the NOAA National Weather Service, including real-
+time data that predicts climate variation on the scale of weeks to
+years, is used to inform decisions on national security, crop prices,
+insurance rates, tourism and recreation, energy, and the transportation
+sector. The Service provides outreach and education to local users
+across the country. We need agencies like NOAA to continue to deliver
+on their service mission by providing the best climate science and
+data, tracking climate change impacts, and helping states and
+communities develop and implement strategies for adaptation to climate
+change.
+Use Climate Change Science and Data to Inform Planning, Policy-Making,
+ and Resource Management
+ In the Commonwealth, we strive to set an example by working to
+incorporate climate risk and vulnerability into all of our decisions
+whether it is through our statewide planning, bonding, policy
+development or grant-making. The Federal Government should also take
+this approach by incorporating climate risk and resilience in all
+future Federal spending and planning decisions to ensure taxpayer
+dollars are used wisely on climate-smart investments. Failing to
+account for climate change impacts like sea level rise and inland
+flooding will put significant assets at risk within their serviceable
+life span and may further expose already vulnerability populations and
+communities to increased risk. Without intervention to adapt over $1
+trillion of coastal property and assets are vulnerable to as little as
+2 feet of sea level rise--a level that may be surpassed before the end
+of the century.\5\
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ \5\ Dahl, K.A., Spanger-Siegfried, E., Caldas, A. and Udvardy, S.,
+2017. Effective inundation of continental United States communities
+with 21st century sea level rise. Elem. Sci. Anth., 5, p. 37. DOI:
+http://doi.org/10.1525/elementa.234.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ In 2013, Federal agencies released climate adaptation plans to
+ensure agencies can continue to meet their mission and serve the
+American public in the face of a changing climate. Like our state plan,
+these plans outlined strategies to reduce the vulnerability of Federal
+programs, assets, and investments to the impacts of climate change.
+Many of our Federal resources across the country are threatened by
+climate change. It is critical that Congress provide oversight to
+ensure that agencies implement these plans and prioritize actions based
+on a long-term, positive return on investment for the American
+taxpayer.
+ This is an issue of particular relevance for this Committee in your
+role providing oversight of our rich public lands. A recent study by
+National Parks Service scientists and independent researchers finds
+that all 417 parks are at risk of significant climate change impacts,
+including the disappearance of glaciers in Glacier National Park and
+increasing wildfires in Yellowstone that could transform the forested
+ecosystem to grassland within the century.\6\ Closer to my home, our
+Boston Harbor Islands, managed through a partnership between State and
+Federal Government and a non-profit are already threatened by sea level
+rise and storm surge.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ \6\ Patrick Gonzalez, et al, 2018. Disproportionate magnitude of
+climate change in United States National Parks. Environ. Res. Lett. 13,
+104001.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ These islands have rich historical and ecological value, provide
+unique recreational opportunities for urban youth, and also offer
+critical defense for Boston Harbor against increasing storm surge.
+
+ Risks are likely to be widespread across many different types of
+Federal holdings, including military installations. A report on climate
+change impacts from the Department of Defense this January \7\ found
+that at least 79 military installations have significant
+vulnerabilities from climate change related risk including wildfires,
+drought, recurrent flooding, thawing permafrost or other threats. These
+bases have already experienced extreme weather, including wildfires in
+2016 and 2017 at the Vandenberg Air Force Base in Southern California,
+permafrost loss on training grounds at Fort Greeley, Alaska, and
+recurrent flooding at bases in Virginia due to sea level rise, land
+subsidence, and changing ocean currents.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ \7\ Report on the Effects of Climate Change to the Department of
+Defense, January 2019. https://partner-mco-archive.s3.amazonaws.com/
+client_files/1547826612.pdf.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ closing
+ Governors around the country are seeing the effects of climate
+change in our states and communities, and we know that the decisions we
+make today will determine our ongoing risk and the well-being of future
+generations. But we also recognize the significant economic opportunity
+at hand to build a new clean energy industry, transform transportation,
+spur research advancements, and better design the resilient communities
+of tomorrow. This is not a challenge the Federal Government can solve
+alone; the severity of the impacts from climate change depends on our
+collective actions as Federal, state and local government, working with
+the private sector to aggressively reduce our greenhouse gas emissions
+and adapt to the changes that are already in motion. I thank the
+Committee for the invitation to speak and look forward to working
+together on this challenge.
+
+ ______
+
+
+ Questions Submitted for the Record to the Honorable Charlie Baker,
+ Governor of Massachusetts
+ Questions Submitted by Rep. Cunningham
+ Question 1. Do you support my beforementioned bill, H.R. 291, the
+Coastal Economies Protection Act?
+
+ 1a. If yes, why?
+
+ 1b. If no, how could we work together to change that?
+
+ Answer. Thank you for your efforts to protect the Atlantic Coast
+from the hazards associated with oil and gas activity and your
+sponsorship of H.R. 291. As I wrote to Secretary Zinke in 2017,
+Massachusetts does not support the inclusion of areas of the North
+Atlantic in the new Five-Year Outer Continental Shelf Oil and Gas
+Leasing Program, and I support Congress taking action to protect the
+Atlantic Coast. As Congress considers legislation regarding energy
+development in Federal waters, I recommend including stronger
+consideration of states' views in the Outer Continental Shelf planning
+process. I do not believe that the Federal Government should move
+forward with oil and gas activity over the objections of a coastal
+state, and I recommend providing specific authority that oil and gas
+activity decision making be cooperatively managed by the states and the
+Federal Government. Massachusetts has worked successfully with the
+Bureau of Ocean Energy Management on developing offshore wind in
+Federal waters and recommend State-Federal task forces on identifying
+where energy development, especially renewable energy, may be
+responsibly sited.
+
+ Question 2. Governor Baker, what does it say about the potential
+impacts of the offshore oil and gas drilling that a Republican such as
+yourself opposes this type of energy development?
+
+ Answer. Massachusetts has long history of managing our commercial
+fishing industry and promoting our state as a tourism destination
+irrespective of party affiliation. I believe it is imperative that the
+Department of the Interior and the Bureau of Ocean Energy Management
+review comments from governors, visit the coastal states, and
+meaningfully engage to develop responsible energy development that
+protects existing industries and has the support of the states. As
+mentioned in my written testimony, in Massachusetts, we have focused
+that partnership on renewable energy development.
+
+ Question 3. Aside from the risks of an offshore oil spill, what
+other harmful impacts might result--either onshore or offshore--from
+opening the Atlantic Outer Continental Shelf to oil and gas
+development?
+
+ Answer. Massachusetts is particularly concerned about the
+interaction with our commercial fisheries, as well as the potential
+effects on endangered species, including the right whale. Massachusetts
+has a historical commercial and recreational offshore fishing industry
+as well as a major tourism industry that relies on the health of our
+ocean and beaches. In addition to the fertile fishing grounds of
+Georges Bank, on our sea scallop fishery--which is responsible for the
+port of New Bedford being the top in the Nation for catch value--would
+be placed at risk by oil and gas development on the Outer Continental
+Shelf.
+
+ Question 4. Governor Cooper and Governor Baker, while we're
+discussing the threats and impacts associated with climate change,
+there's an obvious connection to opening vast new areas of the Atlantic
+Ocean to oil and gas development. At a time when our country needs to
+confront the reality of climate change, what does the Trump
+administration's desire to open the Atlantic coast to unfettered fossil
+fuel development tell you about their priorities about environmental
+protection?
+
+ Answer. As I stated at the hearing, every level of government must
+accelerate efforts to address climate change. Massachusetts will
+continue to move forward with cost-effective greenhouse gas mitigation
+policies from energy efficiency to clean and renewable energy
+development. Every state and every region should be working with the
+Federal Government to implement individual cost-effective mitigation
+strategies that reflect existing economies and unique opportunities
+that would collectively lower emissions by the levels required to avoid
+catastrophic climate change. Local, state, and Federal leadership is
+required to reduce greenhouse gas emissions.
+
+ Question 5. Did either of you have conversations with former
+Secretary Ryan Zinke about his decision to unilaterally exempt Florida
+from offshore oil and gas development, but no other states that have
+equally as valuable and vibrant fishing and tourism industries?
+
+ 5a. Why do you think former Secretary Zinke tried to exempt
+Florida, but no other state?
+
+ 5b. Do you believe former Secretary Zinke potentially violated
+Federal laws when he made the snap decision to exempt a single state
+from his oil and gas leasing plan without going through the required
+public process?
+
+ Answer. I conveyed my concerns about the proposed oil and gas
+activity both in a formal letter and in person during a meeting to
+discuss this issue and the other Department of the Interior polices
+affecting Massachusetts. As stated earlier, energy development in
+Federal waters requires an extensive public process to engage with
+existing industries and ultimately requires a partnership with each
+coastal state.
+
+ Question 6. Why do your administrations oppose offshore oil and gas
+development, and are your positions in line with your state's coastal
+communities and coastal businesses?
+
+ Answer. My administration and our coastal communities are strongly
+aligned in working to protect our commercial fisheries and tourism
+industry, and we seek to further develop our partnership with the
+Federal Government for renewable energy development.
+
+ Question 7. Do you support seismic air gun blasting that is a
+precursor to oil and gas development?
+
+ Answer. Last December I joined a letter to Secretary Ross and
+Secretary Zinke alongside nine other governors of Atlantic coastal
+states to express my firm opposition to seismic air gun surveys and
+coastal oil and gas drilling. Peer-reviewed evidence suggests air gun
+surveys would have harmful impacts on marine mammals and fisheries,
+which could pose a serious risk to the economies of our coastal
+communities. I maintain my position outlined in this letter.
+
+ Question Submitted by Rep. Bishop
+ Question 1. Governors, you both stated your opposition to offshore
+oil and gas development in Federal waters. Governors, do you believe
+that states should have the right to control offshore energy
+development in Federal waters adjoining their coasts?
+
+ Answer. There must be a partnership between the Federal Government
+and the states in energy management in Federal waters and as you noted
+during the hearing this must also apply to Federal land management.
+Regarding, offshore oil and gas development I recommend incorporating
+stronger consideration of states' views of the Outer Continental Shelf
+planning process and do not believe that the Federal Government should
+move forward with oil and gas activity over the objections of a coastal
+state. Rather, I would recommend providing specific authority that oil
+and gas activity decision making be cooperatively managed by the states
+and the Federal Government.
+
+ ______
+
+
+ The Chairman. Thank you very much. I recognize myself for a
+couple of questions. Governors, let me just get this out of the
+way.
+ First of all, do you believe that there is any legitimate
+scientific debate over whether human-induced climate change is
+occurring as we speak?
+ Governor Baker. No.
+ The Chairman. Both of you.
+ Governor Baker. Well, yes, based on the way you asked the
+question.
+ Governor Cooper. No, I do not. There is overwhelming
+scientific consensus that that is the case.
+ Governor Baker. What he said.
+ [Laughter.]
+ The Chairman. Some people argue, though, on that point and
+on that consensus of opinion, that although we know it is
+happening, that humans are a major contributing cause to it,
+that there is no way to stop it, or that it will be far too
+expensive to even try. It is a point of view, it is a reaction
+that you hear.
+ Your comments on that, on those two points.
+ Governor Baker. Well, I guess I would say this. First of
+all, you know, the northeast United States, when I was a much
+younger person, had a huge issue with acid rain, which was
+mostly coming from the Midwest. And that was a big problem, it
+was an environmental issue. There was a lot of debate and
+discussion about it. But a combination of Federal and state
+policies, over time, basically solved it.
+ And if you look at what was done with respect to policy at
+the Federal and state level with regard to the ozone layer,
+while there is still repair going on there, the ozone layer is
+in far better shape than it was 30, 35 years ago: pretty clear
+indications that you can make a difference on big issues with
+policy.
+ And with respect to affordability, I come back to the
+procurement that we just did on offshore wind and the
+hydropower procurement we did, which involves hydropower from
+Quebec. The price points on both of those initiatives, each of
+which are worth hundreds of megawatts of resource to
+Massachusetts families and businesses, both came in at price
+points that, over time, are going to be more cost-effective
+than it would have been to use traditional resources.
+ So, I think the bigger issue here is are you willing to
+sort of head in that direction, be practical, chase cost-
+effective opportunities, and recognize that there are ways to
+get from here to there?
+ And the final thing I will just mention about this, if you
+have farmers or fishermen or resort operators or foresters in
+your communities and in your districts, I promise you they are
+worrying about climate change all the time. And whether it is
+the greenhouse gas emission issue, or the resiliency issue,
+they have major challenges that we should all be taking
+seriously, or we are going to put them all in very significant
+harm's way over time.
+ Governor Cooper. Mr. Chairman, if I might? We can't afford
+not to take urgent action to fight climate change. It is not
+too late, but it soon may be. That is why we need to take
+significant action. And everyone is concerned about cost, but
+can we afford not to do this?
+ And when you look at cost and profits and jobs, a move to a
+clean energy economy brings with it significant jobs. It brings
+a significant economic boost.
+ People may be surprised to know that North Carolina is
+Number 2 in the country in solar energy. How did we get there?
+Well, we forced the utilities to begin using more renewable
+energy. And we set a renewable portfolio standard for our
+utilities. We also took steps to limit our own coal-fired plant
+emissions in North Carolina.
+ So, what has happened is that we have grown this solar
+energy economy and clean energy economy in North Carolina to
+the point where it has political support from both parties
+because of the jobs that it has brought to the area. And now it
+is competitive in cost.
+ A nudge from state government, a nudge from the Federal
+Government, like you have done with tax credits, can move
+something in the right direction so it becomes part of the
+economy. And I think, at the end of the day, in moving to a
+clean energy economy, we are going to save a lot of money in
+health care costs. We are going to save a lot of money for
+these billions of dollars that our states are asking for the
+Federal Government to deal with climate change effects from
+flooding and from snow storms. We are going to make a positive
+difference if we do this.
+ We have to get moving fast. We have taken some small steps,
+our states are working very hard to do what we can. But this
+needs to be a partnership, and we want to work with you.
+ The Chairman. And with the time I have left, another
+argument people use to excuse the Federal Government from
+taking action is saying that we can innovate our way out of it,
+that there is a technological fix over the horizon that we need
+to find, and that, while innovation is important, that is an
+excuse to say we don't need any new laws, we don't need
+regulations, we don't need incentives, we are going to
+technologically innovate our way out of this.
+ Do you believe that that innovation in and of itself is
+enough?
+ Governor Cooper. Innovation is happening right now, with
+battery storage and other technological leaps. But you have to
+make it economically feasible. And state, local, and Federal
+government working together can help to push that along. Yes,
+it is going to require innovation for us to fight climate
+change and to significantly reduce our greenhouse gases, and it
+is a process.
+ But I think that Federal help, I think stopping the roll-
+backs that are occurring right now at the Federal level,
+particularly when it comes to the clean power plan and
+automobile emissions, we don't need to go backward in that
+area. And we need to encourage innovation and technology to
+help move us forward.
+ The Chairman. Thank you. Let me now turn to Mr. McClintock
+for any questions he might have for the governors.
+ Sir.
+ Mr. Bishop. By the way, Grijalva, it is OK. You can take
+your extra 2\1/2\ minutes out of my time.
+ The Chairman. I intended to, sir.
+ [Laughter.]
+ Mr. McClintock. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I noticed in the
+written testimonies, both governors linked climate change with
+the catastrophic fires we have had in the West. My district is
+just southeast of Paradise, California. It encompasses the
+Sierra Nevada from Lake Tahoe past Yosemite Valley and on into
+Sequoia and Kings Canyon National Parks.
+ Last year, wildfires burned nearly 2 million acres in
+California. That is nearly eight times the average annual loss
+of 250,000 acres that we experienced during the last half of
+the 19th century. But if you go back farther into the pre-
+Columbian period, scientists estimate that wildfires destroyed
+between 4\1/2\ million and 9 million acres per year.
+ The Camp Fire recently burned 153,000 acres. It wiped out
+the town of Paradise and claimed 86 lives. But in 1910, the Big
+Burn in Idaho and Montana burned 3 million acres, wiped out
+seven towns, and killed 87 people among a far smaller and
+sparser population.
+ What happened in the intervening time is that the U.S.
+Forest Service was established, and it began actively managing
+our forests, removing excess timber before it could choke off
+the forests and die. And we actively suppressed brush on burned
+lands and on brush lands.
+ But in the 1970s, Congress imposed a series of
+environmental laws that subjected Federal land management to
+endlessly time consuming and, ultimately, cost-prohibitive
+environmental regulations. As a direct result, timber harvested
+from Federal lands has declined about 80 percent, while acreage
+destroyed by fire has increased proportionately. A typical acre
+in the Sierra can support about 80 mature trees. The current
+density is over 300. A single fully grown tree can draw 100
+gallons of water from the soil on a hot day. Drought can
+quickly kill overcrowded forests, and it has.
+ And the problem is climate change doesn't explain the
+dramatic difference between private forests that practice
+active forest management and the Federal lands that don't. The
+boundary lines can often be very clearly seen from the air,
+because of the condition of the forests themselves. Green,
+thriving private forests grow right up to the boundary line.
+And on the other side the forests are morbidly overgrown and
+dying. I think it is quite clever of the climate to decimate
+only the lands that are hamstrung by these Federal
+environmental laws.
+ Now, decaying or burning forests make a mockery of all the
+laws aimed at reducing carbon emissions. Wildfires in the
+United States pump an estimated 290 million tons of carbon
+dioxide into the air every year.
+ So, Governor Cooper, if the climate is warming, doesn't it
+make sense to actively manage our forests so that we can match
+timber density to the ability of the land to support it, so
+that our forests don't die off and burn?
+ Governor Cooper. First, Congressman, we absolutely need to
+take action to fight climate change.
+ Mr. McClintock. Would you address my question?
+ Governor Cooper. But that doesn't----
+ Mr. McClintock. Governor, please.
+ Governor Cooper. Yes, sir.
+ Mr. McClintock. My time is limited, so I have to ask you to
+be responsive.
+ Governor Cooper. Yes, sir. But that doesn't mean we
+shouldn't take steps to be more resilient.
+ My experience in----
+ Mr. McClintock. If droughts are becoming more common,
+doesn't it make sense to provide enough spacing between trees,
+so that snow isn't trapped in dense canopies, and evaporates
+before it can reach the----
+ Governor Cooper. I think any resiliency action that you
+take needs to be balanced with environmental protection. And I
+think you have to rely on scientists and regulators to
+determine what needs to be done.
+ Mr. McClintock. Well, we stopped relying on scientists and
+forest management some time ago. We have let our forests go to
+benign neglect. And we are finding out the results aren't very
+benign.
+ When I visited the Detwiler Fire that forced the evacuation
+of Mariposa almost 2 years ago, the firefighters bitterly
+complained that they couldn't get environmental permits to cut
+preventative fire breaks.
+ Governor, shouldn't we be actively suppressing brush
+buildup and free our firefighters to establish containment
+breaks before a fire starts?
+ Governor Cooper. Congressman, I think if you would join us
+in our fight against climate change, we could join in finding
+ways to make our environment more resilient and make our
+forests more resilient.
+ Mr. McClintock. I mean if we agree on at least these
+common-sense steps, why can't we move forward together with
+them to properly manage our forests, so that they are resilient
+against climate change.
+ Governor Cooper. I think----
+ Mr. McClintock. Governor Baker, you waxed eloquently over
+the use of wind power in Massachusetts. But just yesterday the
+Wall Street Journal published a scathing editorial on the
+experience of Falmouth, Massachusetts that spent $10 million on
+wind turbines, and it has been a disaster.
+ That small town went deeply into debt to finance them. The
+townspeople couldn't bear the noise, the constant flickering
+light as 400-foot windmills turned. Property values plunged 20
+percent. And I wonder how that squares with the bright picture
+that you painted.
+ The Chairman. Governor, a brief answer. The time has run
+out, if you don't mind.
+ Governor Baker. The question you raise, Congressman, is a
+good one, and I will tell you why.
+ I deliberately used the words ``practical'' and ``cost
+effective'' in my remarks on purpose. The fact that I believe
+there are things we need to do with respect to mitigation,
+adaptation, and resiliency because of what is going on with
+climate means I also believe we ought to do things well.
+ My father always used to say that there are two things.
+There is doing the right thing, and then there is doing the
+thing right. And just doing the right thing, doing it wrong,
+doesn't necessarily solve the problem. And there are a whole
+series of issues associated with a well-intended effort.
+ In Falmouth, in many respects, that failed because they
+didn't make a lot of the decisions with respect to where they
+sited them and how they sited them that would have made sense.
+And I think, to some extent, the success that we had with our
+Deepwater Wind procurement was in part our ability to learn
+from a previous experience that we had had in Massachusetts on
+a project that never got developed, where people gave a sole-
+source agreement to a single provider in the middle of
+Nantucket Sound at a very high price, because everybody said
+that was what the market would bear.
+ We put the thing out as a competitive procurement. We said
+we weren't going to pick anybody unless we got competitive
+bids. We spent a ton of time with our colleagues in the
+legislature, making sure that the statute that was written gave
+us the ability to do something that we thought would work. And
+then we took our time in making sure that the procurement we
+put out there was a procurement that would give us the answer
+we were looking for. And we made clear that if we didn't get a
+good bid, we wouldn't take it.
+ And one of the things we did in our statute that made a big
+difference was we framed it as a long-term lease. So, instead
+of having a type of contract that typically exists in this
+environment, where people are constantly having to renew it
+over and over again, we said, ``If you win, you are going to
+have the time you need to amortize the cost of actually making
+the investment in the project returned.''
+ And because of that consistency in the way we bid it, and
+the fact that it was competitive, we got a great price.
+ The Chairman. Thank you, Governor.
+ Governor Baker. I think sometimes when something doesn't go
+the way it should go, everybody blames the concept. Well,
+sometimes we just screw up the way we actually implement it.
+And it makes the concept look bad.
+ The Chairman. Thank you, Governor. And before I get
+admonishment on my time management abilities here, if we could,
+keep the questions and the response to that 5 minutes so that
+everyone that is here will have an opportunity to ask
+questions.
+ Mrs. Napolitano.
+ Mrs. Napolitano. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Welcome, Governors.
+ Governor Cooper, congratulations on your executive order to
+fight climate change. And there is tremendous information that
+can probably be given out to the general public to have them be
+part of the solution, not just the government, because
+sometimes we rely everything on government.
+ One of the things I am looking at is, you stated removing
+underutilized dams and restoring flood plains. That is a great
+point that we need here in Congress, especially funding for
+recycled water and conservation, education to the public, to
+have them understand that we need more water to fight fires and
+to generally provide for the public, for the communities that
+we serve.
+ However, there is reticence in this Committee to fund
+recycled water projects. There used to be 37 million for 17
+western states. I am asking for 500 million for the future,
+because we have to prepare for ongoing drought and ongoing
+fires and everything else.
+ Suggestions? How can we improve public-private
+partnerships? Two of you.
+ Governor Cooper. Well, I think in North Carolina we are
+already doing that. We know that we have a lot of areas that
+are in danger of flooding. We have put advanced flood mapping
+in place. So, now that we know what to evacuate and where areas
+are going to be flooded, we are taking significant mitigation
+steps where we are using buy-outs, elevations, and even
+strategic retreats.
+ Mrs. Napolitano. Do you inform the general public of your
+plan, so they can be supportive of what you are doing?
+ Governor Cooper. Yes, we incorporate what happens with our
+municipalities. They have to make these tough decisions,
+particularly about strategic retreat, because we have come to
+the realization that these floods are going to continue to
+occur, they are going to be fierce. We need to take our----
+ Mrs. Napolitano. How about your aging infrastructure?
+ Governor Cooper. Aging infrastructure, and particularly
+waste water treatment plants that are extremely vulnerable to
+flooding. Helping local governments make sure that they are
+rebuilt and built in a resilient way.
+ I have established the North Carolina Office of Resiliency
+and Recovery. And what we are doing is working with local
+municipalities on catch basins, trying to figure out ways to
+prevent what happens in the future.
+ Mrs. Napolitano. Right.
+ Governor Cooper. In addition to our efforts to fight
+climate change.
+ Mrs. Napolitano. OK, thank you.
+ Governor Baker, what policies can states and city
+governments put into place to build an inclusive green economy?
+ Governor Baker. Well, to just sort of piggyback a little
+bit on your previous question to Governor Cooper--I am a former
+local official. And I get the reason why it is really important
+to have local representation and local voices involved in
+discussions with respect to what happens in their communities.
+And that is why the vulnerability planning effort that we put
+together is a municipal vulnerability planning effort, because
+we want our colleagues in local government and local community
+leaders to be part of those conversations.
+ And as I have said before, you have 351 cities and towns--
+and in Massachusetts, they all have different issues with
+respect to resiliency and adaptation. And we want to make sure
+whatever it is we do is supported at the local level. Because
+if you don't have local support for it, it is not going to
+succeed, whatever it is you are pursuing. And it won't be
+sustained over time.
+ Mrs. Napolitano. Yes.
+ Governor Baker. I agree completely with him on that one.
+ Mrs. Napolitano. Part of what a discussion on the forest
+fires also leads to the fact that we don't fund the agency with
+enough money to do it. And what--with the future threat of more
+fires, we should have enough funding there to be able to help
+them do the job they are meant to do. Do you agree?
+ Governor Cooper. I agree completely. We spend a lot of
+money--and we are grateful for it--on recovery. Not enough of
+that money that is dedicated to states and local governments is
+allowed to be used for mitigation and resilience.
+ And when you look at a flooded area and see homes that have
+been elevated, or areas that have already been bought out and
+now are simply catching flood water, you see the money that we
+are saving from the action that we have taken.
+ So, I would encourage the Congress to give states more
+flexibility to use this recovery funding as we rebuild smarter
+and stronger, as we are trying to do in North Carolina, because
+we know it is coming again. I am going to keep saying we have
+to fight this emission of greenhouse gases, and to fight this
+overall climate change issue here. But we know in the next few
+decades, if we are going to continue to deal with this severe
+weather, we need to be smart about how we rebuild. And us being
+able to use that funding for mitigation and resilience is a
+positive thing.
+ Mrs. Napolitano. Thank you, Governor. I think we have to
+cut, because the Chairman is going to gavel me out. But I tell
+you 20 years ago I tried to put climate change in one of my
+bills, and I lost it because nobody wanted to deal with climate
+change. Thank you.
+ Mr. Bishop. Thank you. I appreciate, once again, you being
+here. Governor Baker, I appreciate you being here.
+ Now, look, Ed Markey used to be part of this Committee, so
+at some point off the record I would like you to tell me how
+you got rid of the Rs at the end of your vowels. You are doing
+that very well.
+ [Laughter.]
+ Mr. Bishop. And just as a hint, if you try to do Ski
+Massachusetts on your license plates, we have already done that
+in Utah. We got copyrighted on that. Don't try to go there.
+ I do want to ask a question of Governor Baker. You talked a
+great deal about working together in a collaborative process,
+the very essence of federalism. And also, you mentioned how
+some of the local people who work these issues on the ground
+know exactly what they are doing. I found in the state of Utah
+some of my best commissioners in rural Utah are those who used
+to work for BLM, and they are extremely pragmatic about what
+can and cannot be done.
+ This is one of those areas that actually is the
+jurisdiction of this Committee, and that is how can we actually
+increase collaboration between the Federal Government and the
+states. And you guys got to figure out state and local
+government, you are on your own, that is your jurisdiction. How
+do we actually increase that collaboration? Or is that
+significant, to increase that collaboration?
+ Governor Baker. I do think on this vulnerability planning
+effort, which the Federal Emergency Management Agency has
+created, a program where states and locals can get together and
+start to work with the Feds around doing sort of what I would
+describe as high-risk analytics and making investments in
+resiliency and adaptation to deal with places that people are
+concerned about, so that the next time there is a storm, the
+next time there is a surge, we don't end up having to deal with
+the same cleanup that FEMA dealt with the time before, I think
+that is, in some respects, one of the best ways for the Federal
+Government to work with states, and with locals.
+ Mr. Bishop. Let me kind of zero in on that. Once again,
+this is our area of jurisdiction. There are statutes on the
+books that say we have to collaborate with you. There is
+nothing in that statute that says what our collaboration
+actually is.
+ Would there be a benefit of actually trying to list what
+steps need to be taken in the collaborative process so indeed
+the states and the Federal Government are working on the same
+page, as opposed to you just groveling before us?
+ Governor Baker. Absolutely.
+ Mr. Bishop. All right.
+ Governor Baker. I think that would be a great idea.
+ Mr. Bishop. And that is within our jurisdiction. However, I
+realize the Appropriations Subcommittee is having a hearing on
+the Anti-Deficiency Act, which has nothing to do with the
+appropriations process. So, eventually I think we will get
+jurisdictional issues worked out in this particular area.
+ Let me talk specifically once again about the concepts that
+were just brought up--and Mrs. Napolitano, she mentioned it
+before she left--this idea of forest fires and what they need.
+And maybe when Mr. Westerman has a chance to talk, he can
+exemplify on this.
+ One of the things that both the Obama and the Trump
+administrations told us is it is not necessarily an issue of
+funding that makes it difficult, it is an issue of what kind of
+powers they have to actually do management practices before the
+fire season takes place.
+ And the other big issue they also dealt with was cost of
+litigation, ever-increasing litigation by special interest
+groups, for which they either backed off what they were
+attempting to do in order to minimize that litigation, or they
+were forced to spend their money defending themselves on the
+litigation. So, what they were asking for is greater
+flexibility in actually managing the land, and help in
+defending themselves. Again, this litigation.
+ I am making the assumption that when we are dealing with
+you on the state level, that those issues are also significant.
+And indeed, the experts on the ground who ask us for this kind
+of help would be saying that same type of thing.
+ Governor Baker. I actually made a note to myself to ask the
+folks who manage our lands. We have significant land that we
+manage, both actively and passively.
+ Mr. Bishop. The nice thing is most of your land is state
+land, and that is great.
+ Governor Baker. What I don't want to do is, I don't want to
+answer this question having not talked to my own people about
+it, but I will do that and make sure we get back to the
+Committee about it.
+ Mr. Bishop. And I appreciate that. And actually, Mr.
+Grijalva--because I won't ask you another question, I am
+running out of time with that. But if we can go to the point in
+future where Utah has as much Federal land as Massachusetts and
+North Carolina have, I will be tickled pink.
+ Governor Baker. I would love that, as long as I get the
+same amount of skiing that you have in Utah.
+ Mr. Bishop. And we will take some of our extra mountains
+and put them in there, so you can actually ski.
+ [Laughter.]
+ Mr. Bishop. And that will include our airflow, so we don't
+have crappy air in the winter. Perfect.
+ I yield back.
+ The Chairman. Thank you, Mr. Bishop.
+ Mr. Costa.
+ Mr. Costa. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman and Ranking
+Member. It sounds like the Governor and the Ranking Member have
+an opportunity to get great things done here, East-West.
+ But I think this is an important hearing for a lot of
+reasons. And clearly, the impacts of climate change are one of
+the most significant challenges we face in the 21st century
+around the world, in this country, and in our respective
+states.
+ I know the San Joaquin Valley that I represent has had
+significant impacts as it relates to the drought conditions,
+the feast or famine with too much rain and water, and trying to
+balance our needs.
+ We think about the planet we live in: 200 years ago we had
+1.7 billion people, today we have a little over 7 billion. And
+by the middle of this century it is expected that we will have
+over 9 billion people. And sustainability and the impact that
+people have on all of our resources is the challenge that we
+face today.
+ We have people living in areas in which people didn't live
+before, where they are impacted by these fires, these floods,
+and these other natural conditions that include hurricanes and
+tornadoes and other weather events.
+ We, in California, have done a lot, I think, to try to
+address the future here in renewable and sustainable sources,
+as have other states--Governors, as you have recommended and
+told us of your own efforts.
+ I think the earlier comment about better coordination
+between the state, local, and Federal efforts needs to be done.
+We talk a lot in kind of broad, general terms. We don't, I
+think, focus enough on how we can coordinate together in
+actually getting something done on the impacts of climate
+change. And a multi-pronged approach, I think, is critical to
+that success.
+ Both governors, let me ask you a few questions here. And I
+am looking this way because, Mr. Chairman, the clock is blocked
+here. So, for those of us who watch it, make sure we get our
+time in. It is a little bit of a handicap.
+ As we continue to see, as you testified, the trends on
+intense weather changes and the impacts there, we have an aging
+infrastructure. We have been talking about a bipartisan
+infrastructure measure. Where do you think the best channeling
+of that funding in transportation and in water infrastructure
+would best be spent in your respective states?
+ Governor Baker. Well, with respect to the issue we are
+talking about today, which is resiliency, I think the biggest
+and best opportunity would be around all of the infrastructure
+that we have that is designed to deal with storms. And much of
+that infrastructure is nowhere near as significant as it needs
+to be----
+ Mr. Costa. When FEMA comes--as they have in various parts
+of the country and they provide support and recovery efforts.
+We were just in Puerto Rico last month, and under the--I am
+trying to remember--Stafford Act, or whatever--they are only
+allowed to spend money to what the previous conditions were of
+that infrastructure.
+ Governor Baker. Right, right.
+ Mr. Costa. That makes no sense. I mean we have to be--and
+if we are repairing--guess what? More hurricanes are going to
+come, more tornadoes are going to come, more floods are going
+to come, and wildfires. We ought to do state-of-the-art
+restoration, don't you think?
+ Governor Baker. Yes. We should be thinking about
+infrastructure going forward, in terms of what the consequences
+will be for bridges, for coverts, for dams, for all of that
+stuff, based on what people anticipate the significant issues
+they will be dealing with will look like. And those are
+different than the ones people were dealing with 100 years ago,
+absolutely.
+ Mr. Costa. Governor Cooper?
+ Governor Cooper. And, Congressman, there is a lot of money
+that comes to states in the wake of disaster. But in the wake
+of disaster is time to talk about that resilient
+infrastructure.
+ People were driving around the state of North Carolina for
+3 or 4 days after Hurricane Florence because Interstate 95 was
+under water.
+ Mr. Costa. OK, I appreciate the examples. I have 30 seconds
+left.
+ To both of you, if you can quickly--there is a call,
+obviously, to provide less stringent environmental regulation
+in an effort to review and rewrite common-sense policies in the
+light of climate change based on sound science. Is that
+reasonable to ask?
+ Governor Baker. I didn't understand----
+ Governor Cooper. I didn't understand what you said, sir.
+ Mr. Costa. There is a sense that maybe we need to rewrite
+environmental regulations in the sense of dealing with these
+impacts of climate change. Is that reasonable to ask, based
+upon new science?
+ Governor Baker. I think we should continually be updating
+our rules and our regulations with respect to new discovery and
+new science. We do it in health care, which is the space I came
+out of in the private sector. We do it in all sorts of areas.
+Yes, I would say definitely here, yes.
+ Governor Cooper. But I would say we don't want to roll back
+environmental safeguards that are helping us to reduce
+greenhouse gas emissions, and therefore fighting climate
+change, while we are doing that.
+ Mr. Costa. Thank you.
+ The Chairman. Mr. Westerman.
+ Mr. Westerman. Thank you, Chairman Grijalva, and thank you,
+governors, for being here today. I have had the opportunity to
+spend quite a bit of time in both of your states. You have
+beautiful states with beautiful forests and clean water there.
+ I get accused sometimes of getting too far into the weeds
+when I start talking about climate, environmental policy. So,
+taking a little bit of a different approach today, I was going
+to submit this to the record, but I haven't got a hard copy
+yet. But this is a Dilbert cartoon. And they are sitting around
+the table, and Dilbert says, ``I have invented a cost-effective
+product to harvest CO2 from the air and turn it into
+construction material,'' and his colleague says, ``So . . . you
+invented a tree.'' And it goes on from there.
+ But you know, when we look at the climate and how we all
+want to be good stewards of it, we know that trees are one of
+the best things on earth to clean the air, to clean water, and
+provide good habitat.
+ Governor Cooper, I am from Arkansas and did a lot of work
+in your state before I got into Congress. I actually did a
+comparison one time of the forested area in Arkansas versus
+North Carolina. And both states are almost exactly the same, 17
+to 18 million acres of forested land in both states, almost the
+same breakdown of hard wood versus soft wood.
+ There is a difference there, though. North Carolina has one
+of the most vibrant forest products industries in the country.
+Even though we have basically the same land mass and the same
+amount of forest, you all produce a lot more wood products than
+we do in Arkansas, although our forest products economy is
+growing and thriving there.
+ So, as we look at this issue of cleaning the air, I would
+like to get your take on how important the forest products
+industry and forest management is in North Carolina to keeping
+your forest pristine, which also helps your water quality and
+your wildlife habitat, and the different kinds of products that
+are made there, and how they may affect the environment.
+ Have you had a chance to get out--I am sure you have--to
+see all of the varied forest products industries in your state?
+ Governor Cooper. Yes, we do have a strong forest product
+industry in North Carolina. I think we have to be careful about
+going too far with it. And I know that our department of
+environmental quality is looking at additional safeguards that
+we may need in order to make sure that our forests are
+protected.
+ I do know, though, that it is an important industry in our
+state, and we are working hard to make sure that our forests
+are managed properly, because we know that those natural
+resources are critically important, not only to clean air, but
+to our tourism, as well, in North----
+ Mr. Westerman. I believe about 68 percent of your forest
+land is privately held and managed by private owners who are
+doing that, just using good science. And you obviously have a
+sustainable forest there to be able to continue with a strong
+forest products industry.
+ I know also that North Carolina is one of the leading
+states in producing wood pellets. Those pellets were driven by
+the fact that Europe put a tax on carbon coming out of some of
+their big coal-fired plants, so that drove them to come to the
+United States to buy renewable pellets. How do you think that
+is affecting the health of the forest in North Carolina, and
+then the global climate as well, being able to use those
+renewable wood pellets to replace coal in Europe?
+ Governor Cooper. There is a concern about the increase of
+the use of wood pellets in North Carolina. There is a concern
+about that, yes.
+ Mr. Westerman. But that was all driven by a mandate from a
+government saying you had to get the coal out of the plants.
+So, they wanted to replace that with a bio-fuel. And North
+Carolina, obviously being on the East Coast and having the
+abundant forests they have, were a really good supplier to help
+in Europe to offset carbon emissions over there.
+ Governor Cooper. I don't know about that, Congressman. I
+don't know about that.
+ Mr. Westerman. Are we going to get a second round of
+questions?
+ Real quickly, Governor Baker, the Quabbin in Massachusetts
+is a great example of how to manage forests and get clean
+water. Boston relies on that. It is a wonderful system, and I
+wish we could mimic that other places around the country.
+ I yield back.
+ Governor Baker. So, just two things. We have planted
+thousands and thousands and thousands of trees since we took
+office for exactly the reason you just raised. And we have
+about 4 million acres of forest in a state with 6\1/2\ million
+acres, overall. And about a million acres are managed by the
+Commonwealth.
+ Planting trees is one of the best----
+ The Chairman. Thank you.
+ Governor Baker. Give us some money to plant trees, we will
+plant trees. They also help with soil runoff and a whole bunch
+of other things, as well.
+ The Chairman. Mr. Sablan.
+ Governor Baker. And the most interesting thing about it has
+been that the relationship between the sportsmen community and
+the environmental community over the importance of forest and
+wildlife habitat.
+ The Chairman. Mr. Sablan.
+ Mr. Sablan. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman.
+ Governor Baker and Governor Cooper, welcome. Thank you for
+being here. Thank you for your leadership on climate change you
+are both demonstrating in your states.
+ Getting to the question, a little history, background, is
+in 2016, our bureau of environmental and coastal quality
+developed a 5-year strategy that noted that although the
+development surge in Saipan, one of the islands in the Northern
+Marianas, would result in dramatic loss of green space and
+permeable natural surface, particularly in shore land
+locations, the political leadership were calling for even less
+regulatory oversight and for expedited permit processing. And
+that leads me to no longer be hopeful that my political
+leadership would join your U.S. Climate Alliance.
+ But having said that, and someone mentioned earlier about
+people being displaced from their homes. Over the past 2 years
+alone, hundreds of thousands of Americans have been forced from
+their homes, some of them as recent as Puerto Rico, Irma and
+Maria. And in the future we will see many more people who need
+to permanently move because their homes will become
+uninhabitable, either by rising sea levels or hurricanes and
+typhoons. The people of the Northern Marianas will be
+especially hard hit.
+ So, what can states and the Federal Government do in order
+to more effectively address displacement due to climate change?
+ Governor Cooper. Congressman, in North Carolina I think we
+have seen it just as you have, that the people who can afford
+it the least often get hit the hardest in these natural
+disasters. And one of our problems that we have right now is
+the issue of affordable housing, being able to find safe,
+affordable places for people to live.
+ In the wake of this disaster, I think it is helping us put
+together a plan on affordable housing across the state. That is
+something that is going to require public-private partnerships,
+and investments, and trying to get developers into making sure
+that more affordable housing is constructed in areas that are
+not in flood plains and in danger of being destroyed during
+these disasters. It is a human tragedy.
+ And I look forward to your ideas. And we certainly can
+provide you with some of ours on how we do that.
+ The Chairman. And Governor Baker?
+ Governor Baker. I would just get back to the question
+Congressman Costa asked about rebuilding to the standard of
+what it was before. I mean, clearly, we need to be taking a
+much more forward-looking approach to the way we handle that
+stuff, because building to the standard that existed before
+will be nowhere near as resilient as you need to be to deal
+with many of those issues.
+ Mr. Sablan. Right, and I agree with you, Governor Baker,
+because where I come from, the Northern Marianas, we just had a
+super-typhoon, I think the second-largest in U.S. history. And
+we are not actually a wealthy community.
+ So, what took people years to build as their homes were
+destroyed, demolished. And FEMA has inspections. Some of them
+got awarded $6,000. So, they were made an offer: ``We can take
+you and move you to another location away from the Northern
+Marianas until you can get your structure rebuilt.'' The $6,000
+is going to take care of 20 percent, maybe, of the cost of the
+building, if at all.
+ So, that person, this family, will move and probably never
+come back. And from a case where our population is hardly, very
+little over 50,000, we need all our people to remain at home.
+But it is not. So, yes, I agree. FEMA encourages this
+relocation.
+ And my time is up. Thank you very much.
+ The Chairman. Thank you very much.
+ Mr. Graves.
+ Mr. Graves. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I appreciate the time.
+Governors, I want to thank you very much for being here.
+ Governor Cooper, I know that--I am from Louisiana. We sent
+many volunteers and rescue teams to your state----
+ Governor Cooper. Thank you, sir.
+ Mr. Graves [continuing]. Following--I am trying to
+remember--Chris, Matthew, Florence, Michael, a number of storms
+you have had in recent years. I have been praying for you all
+and working closely with your delegation.
+ Two things, real quick.
+ You mentioned some of these resiliency measures on--I think
+it was October 3, the President signed the Disaster Recovery
+and Reform Act into law. That law that we worked closely with
+your delegation in putting together does provide some
+additional flexibility and dollars on more resilient
+reconstruction, to where we are not rebuilding the same things
+over and over again, and I urge you to take a look at that.
+ Next, on the duplication of benefits letter you sent to the
+White House, in regard to your recovery we are working
+closely--our governor has done the same thing--we are working
+closely----
+ Governor Cooper. Have you gotten an answer yet?
+ Mr. Graves. Blood pressure is going up a little bit,
+potentially filing a lawsuit, but we will be working closely
+with you all on that.
+ Governor Cooper. OK.
+ Mr. Graves. I also spent a good bit of time in Pisgah,
+Linville, Bent Creek, a lot of your real jewels over there. You
+have a great state.
+ Governor Baker, reading about some of the things that your
+state has done in regard to emissions reduction and climate
+change, it is interesting. Our states, again, south Louisiana,
+Massachusetts, very different. I heard you in your testimony
+talking about ski slopes. And, of course, the Ranking Member
+was discussing that, as well. We would love to have that. We
+have some resource issues. Ski slopes aren't really conducive
+to south Louisiana.
+ Some of the top industries in Massachusetts, it is
+technology patents, venture capital, computing technology. Some
+areas that aren't necessarily licensing, aren't necessarily
+energy or emissions intensive. My home state of Louisiana, we
+are one of the top energy producers in the Nation, one of the
+top refiners in the Nation, one of the largest petrochemical
+industries in the Nation, one of the largest industrial
+corridors in the Nation. It is a very different economy.
+ Your home state of Massachusetts, according to the EIA,
+part of the Department of Energy, they indicated that your
+state has virtually no oil and gas production. Yet, just within
+the last few years, your state has averaged over 1 quadrillion
+BTUs of fossil fuels being used to just operate your state,
+over 1 quadrillion BTUs of fossil fuels being consumed for
+everything going on in the state of Massachusetts.
+ In Revere, you have one of the three home heating oil
+reserves. Much of your, if I remember right, coal and natural
+gas, approximately 70 percent of the energy production in your
+state is from coal and natural gas. That comes from Louisiana,
+it comes from other states.
+ My home state of Louisiana, we are blessed with natural
+resources. We are blessed with port systems and have a big
+industrial corridor. How do you reconcile what you are able to
+do based on your economy, versus the challenges in Louisiana
+based on what our economy is founded on?
+ Governor Baker. Well, our view on this issue for the better
+part of the past decade has been to make the kinds of
+investments that can either reduce our draw on energy when we
+produce productivity, or continue to redefine our source points
+for energy, generally.
+ And if you look at the last 10 years, or even go back
+before that, maybe the last 20, we have had significant
+increase in our gross state product. We have had modest
+population growth. We have had modest increase in the number of
+vehicle miles driven, and a 20 percent reduction in our
+greenhouse gas emissions over that same period of time. And the
+energy draw generally has been flat over the same period,
+because we have gotten more productive about how we actually
+use energy.
+ And I think in some respects that is one thing that we
+haven't really talked about at all today. One of the biggest
+and best opportunities we all have with respect to climate
+change and greenhouse gas emissions, generally, is energy
+efficiency. Our Mass Save program----
+ Mr. Graves. And, Governor, I agree. I need to reclaim my
+time because I am about----
+ Governor Baker. We have installed 24 million LED lights----
+ Mr. Graves [continuing]. To run out right now, but I do
+appreciate that you all have taken steps, I do. But I also
+think it is important to recognize that states in some cases
+are fundamentally differently.
+ Governor Baker. Agreed.
+ Mr. Graves. Years ago I calculated the amount of energy
+that Massachusetts consumed, and I think it was 24 times more
+energy than they produced. So, you built three LNG terminals, a
+lot of energy is coming in from Louisiana and other states.
+ Mr. Chairman, I want to ask to insert in the record two
+things.
+ First, and it is interesting, it is a letter asking the
+President to increase global oil production--to increase global
+oil production. And that letter is signed by Senators Cantwell,
+Schumer, Menendez, and Markey.
+ Second, Mr. Chairman, I ask unanimous consent to include in
+the record a statement that shows the average electricity
+prices for each state, indicating the state of Massachusetts
+has electricity prices that are usually the top or the second
+top in the continental United States, more than double that of
+the state of Louisiana.
+ The Chairman. Thank you. Without objection.
+
+ [The information follows:]
+
+ United States Senate
+ Washington, DC 20510
+
+ May 23, 2018
+
+The President
+The White House
+Washington, DC 20500
+
+ Dear Mr. President:
+
+ World crude oil prices increased over 75 percent in the past year,
+with some market analysts expecting prices to approach $100 per barrel
+in the coming months. Elevated fuel prices are a burden on every
+family, business, and farm and threaten our nation's continued economic
+growth and global competitiveness. Today, we call on you to use all of
+your authority to take timely action to pressure the Organization of
+the Petroleum Exporting Countries (OPEC) and cooperating countries to
+increase world oil supplies in order to lower prices at the pump during
+the upcoming summer driving season.
+ The U.S. Energy Information Administration (EIA) attributes current
+increases in crude oil prices to ``falling global oil inventories,
+heightened market perceptions of geopolitical risks, and strong global
+economic growth signals.'' Indeed, global oil supplies have been
+relatively flat over the last two years, despite record U.S. crude oil
+production, because of an agreement between the OPEC and non-OPEC
+countries like Russia to decrease their oil production by around 1.7
+million barrels per day starting in January 2017. Since the agreement
+has been in place, those countries have actually reduced production by
+over 2.4 million barrels per day.
+
+ Surging oil prices have made gas station fill-ups more expensive.
+According to the EIA, gasoline prices will average $2.95 per gallon
+this summer, 61 cents higher than last year. That means the average
+U.S. household will be forced to pay $167 more in fuel costs this
+summer driving season as compared to the same period last year. Diesel
+fuel, essential for transporting American goods to market, will average
+64 cents more per gallon than last summer, and prices could top $4 per
+gallon in some states.
+
+ The impact of rising fuel prices on our economy and on family
+budgets is significant and widespread. According to a recent analysis
+by Goldman Sachs, the run up in oil prices will roughly cancel out the
+effects from tax reductions this year, with the greatest impact on
+households that can least afford it.
+
+ Last month, you said it was unacceptable for OPEC to artificially
+inflate oil prices. We agree and urge you to work with our
+international partners to take the following actions to make sure OPEC
+does not continue to suppress world crude oil supplies, and to protect
+domestic policies that help consumers:
+
+ Leverage your personal relationship with Saudi Crown
+ Prince Mohammad bin Salman to urge Saudi Arabia to use
+ their swing capacity to increase world oil supplies.
+
+ Send Energy Secretary Perry to the June 22, 2018, OPEC
+ meeting in Vienna, Austria to personally communicate the
+ importance of maintaining stable crude oil prices.
+
+ Initiate World Trade Organization dispute proceedings
+ against countries engaged in anticompetitive practices that
+ artificially inflate world oil prices.
+
+ Work with our European allies and China, which last year
+ surpassed the United States as the world's largest oil
+ importer, to put pressure on oil exporting nations.
+
+ Direct the Federal Trade Commission, Commodities Futures
+ Trading Commission, and the Department of Justice to
+ exercise vigorous oversight over oil markets.
+
+ Maximize the use of more environmentally friendly and
+ domestically produced biofuel alternatives by protecting
+ the Renewable Fuel Standard.
+
+ Abandon your Administration's stated plan to roll back
+ fuel economy standards that otherwise will save the average
+ car owner more than $6,000 over the life of the car and cut
+ the nation's oil consumption by over two million barrels
+ per day by 2025.
+
+ The current run up in world oil prices is effectively a tax on
+every American family's discretionary budget, except that the money
+goes to the OPEC cartel rather than the U.S. Treasury. Adding to our
+constituents' pocketbook concerns is their understanding that our
+nation's continued dependence on oil is at the heart of many of our
+nation's greatest economic, environmental, and national security
+challenges.
+
+ Sincerely,
+
+ Maria Cantwell Robert Menendez
+ Washington New Jersey
+
+ Charles Schumer Edward J. Markey
+ New York Massachusetts
+
+
+ ______
+
+
+Submission for the Record by Rep. Graves
+[GRAPHIC NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]
+
+ Mr. Graves. Thank you. I yield back.
+ The Chairman. Also insert in the record--NOAA just released
+their recap today for the U.S. and Global Climates for 2018. A
+couple of highlights in that release, in that report: 2018 was
+the fourth hottest year on record for our planet, falling
+behind only 2015, 2016, and 2017; in 2018 the United States was
+warmer than average, and the wettest in 35 years; in 2018 there
+were 14 weather and climate disasters, each with damages over
+$1 billion, total cost $91 billion. And this is a report that
+was released as of today by NOAA. And we want that entered into
+the record, as well.
+ Mr. Bishop. Are you asking for objections?
+ The Chairman. Without objections, I hope.
+
+ [The information follows:]
+
+Submission for the Record by Rep. Grijalva
+
+ Just now, NOAA released their recap for U.S. and global climate for
+2018. A couple highlights from this report:
+
+ 2018 was the 4th hottest year on record for our planet,
+ falling behind only 2015, 2016, and 2017.
+
+ The 2018 Arctic sea ice extent was its second smallest
+ since recordkeeping began, only behind 2017.
+
+ In 2018, the United States was warmer than average, and
+ the wettest in 35 years.
+
+ In 2018, there were 14 weather and climate disasters each
+ with damages over $1 billion, total cost was $91 billion.
+
+ NOAA: 2018 was 4th Hottest Year on Record for the Globe
+
+ U.S. Experienced $14 Billion Disasters in a Warmer- and Wetter-Than-
+ Average Year
+
+2018 Global Temperature and Sea Ice
+
+ For 2018, the average temperature across global land and
+ ocean surfaces was 1.42+F (0.79+C) above the 20th century
+ average. This was the fourth highest among all years in the
+ 1880-2018 record,.behind 2016 (highest), 2015 (second
+ highest), and 2017 (third highest). Nine of the warmest
+ years have occurred since 2005, with the last 5 years
+ (2014-2018) ranking as the five warmest years on record.
+
+ In a separate analysis of global temperature data,
+ released today, NASA scientists also determined 2018 to be
+ the fourth warmest year on record. Analyses from the United
+ Kingdom Met Office and the World Meteorological
+ Organization ranked 2018 among the top four warmest years
+ on record.
+
+ Sea Ice: Average annual sea ice extent in the Arctic was
+ approximately 4.00 million square miles, just edging
+ 2017,as the second smallest annual average in the 1979-2018
+ record. The annual Antarctic sea ice extent was 4.20
+ million square miles. This was the second smallest annually
+ averaged value on record, about 77,000 square miles larger
+ than the previous record set in 2017.
+
+2018 Annual U.S. Temperature and Precipitation
+
+ Much of the contiguous U.S. was warmer than average,
+ particularly west of the Rockies and across the coastal
+ Southeast, which were characterized by much-above-average
+ temperatures, within their warmest 10 percent of the
+ record. Fourteen states across the U.S. had annual
+ temperatures among the 10 highest on record. Arizona:
+ second highest; New Mexico: third highest; and California:
+ fourth highest. Most of the Northern Plains and Upper
+ Midwest experienced near-normal temperatures. South Dakota
+ and Nebraska, respectively, observed annual average
+ temperatures 0.4+F and 0.1+F below their 20th century
+ averages, marking the first year since 2014 that any state
+ observed a temperature nominally cooler than its 20th
+ century average.
+
+ The 2018 nationally averaged precipitation for the
+ contiguous U.S. was 34.63 inches. This total was 4.69
+ inches above average, the wettest in the past 35 years, and
+ third wettest since record keeping began in 1895. The total
+ was largely driven by record and near-record annual
+ precipitation across much of the eastern United States.
+ Nine eastern states--Delaware, Maryland, Massachusetts, New
+ Jersey, North Carolina, Pennsylvania, Tennessee, Virginia
+ and West Virginia--experienced their wettest year on
+ record. Much of the West and Pacific Northwest experienced
+ a drier than normal year.
+
+2018 Weather Events
+
+ There were 14 weather and climate disasters with losses
+ each exceeding $1 billion during 2018. These disasters
+ included: two tropical cyclones (Hurricanes Florence and
+ Michael), one western wildfire disaster comprised of
+ several constituent fire complexes over several months,
+ eight instances of severe convective storms (hail, tornado,
+ and/or damaging winds), one large drought episode, and two
+ winter storms. The 14 events, in total, claimed at least
+ 247 lives and cost $91 billion. About $73 billion of this
+ total was attributable to three events: Hurricanes Michael
+ ($25 billion) and Florence ($24 billion), and the complex
+ of western wildfires ($24 billion).
+
+ In other notable extremes, during a 24-hour period
+ spanning April 14-15, 2018, a rain gauge at Waipa Garden,
+ near Hanalei on the Hawaiian island of Kauai, observed
+ 49.69 inches of rainfall. This is the largest verified
+ amount of precipitation observed in 24 hours in the United
+ States. The previous record of 43 inches was set at Alvin,
+ Texas, in July 1979.
+
+January 2019 U.S Temperature, Precipitation and Drought
+
+ January 2019 average temperature for the contiguous U.S.
+ was 32.7+F, 2.6+F above average and ranked among the
+ warmest third of its historical record. Near-normal
+ temperatures generally prevailed in the eastern half of the
+ country, while the West was above average for the month.
+ Although short-lived, a cold outbreak near the end of the
+ month gripped much of the Midwest and Northeast, where many
+ daily cold records were set.
+
+ The contiguous U.S. precipitation total for January was
+ 2.49 inches, 0.18 inch above average. Large portions of the
+ Northeast recorded much-above-average precipitation. Rhode
+ Island and Vermont each had their eighth wettest January on
+ record. This was the sixth consecutive month with
+ nationally averaged precipitation categorized as above
+ average or much above average.
+
+ According to the January 29 U.S. Drought Monitor report,
+ 16.5 percent of the contiguous U.S. was in drought, down
+ more than five percentage points since the end of December.
+ Drought improved across much of the Southwest and
+ California.
+
+For More
+
+ A more complete summary of climate conditions and events can
+be viewed at: http://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/sotc/global/ and http://
+www.ncdc.noaa.gov/sotc/national/
+
+ Summary of 2018 Billion Dollar Weather and Climate Events
+
+ There were 14 weather and climate disasters with losses
+ each exceeding $1 billion during 2018. These disasters
+ included: two tropical cyclones (Hurricanes Florence and
+ Michael), one western wildfire disaster comprised of
+ several constituent fire complexes over several months,
+ eight instances of severe convective storms (hail, tornado,
+ and/or damaging winds), one large drought episode, and two
+ winter storms.
+
+ [GRAPHIC NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]
+
+
+ The 14 events, in total, claimed at least 247 lives
+ and had total losses estimated at $91 billion. About $73
+ billion of this total was attributable to three events:
+ Hurricanes Michael ($25 billion) and Florence ($24
+ billion), and the complex of western wildfires ($24
+ billion)
+
+ 2018 marked the eighth consecutive year with eight or more
+ billion dollar disasters, exceeding the long-term average
+ of 6.2 per year. This was 4th highest total number of
+ events, behind the years 2017 (16), 2011 (16) and 2016
+ (15). It was also the eighth year in the period of record
+ (1980-present), and seventh since 2008, with at least 10
+ billion-dollar disasters.
+
+ 2018 also had the 4th highest total costs ($91 billion)
+ behind the years 2017 ($312.7 billion), 2005 ($220.8
+ billion) and 2012 ($128.6 billion) when adjusted for
+ inflation.
+
+ 2018 experienced a historically damaging wildfire season
+ ($24.0 billion), a new U.S. annual record, exceeding the
+ previous $18.0 billion wildfire cost record set in 2017.
+
+ ______
+
+
+ The Chairman. Mr. Huffman.
+ Mr. Bishop. No, Mr. Westerman has something for the record,
+too, maybe.
+ The Chairman. Yes.
+ Mr. Westerman. While we are submitting for the record, I
+would like to submit this Dilbert cartoon to the record.
+ [Laughter.]
+ Mr. Westerman. It explains the photosynthetic process.
+
+ [The information follows:]
+ [GRAPHIC NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]
+
+
+
+ Mr. Huffman. Mr. Chairman, that is one of the more
+substantive submittals I have seen from the other side.
+ The Chairman. That one will be framed.
+ Mr. Huffman.
+ Mr. Huffman. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thank you for having
+this hearing. It is so important that we have an honest
+conversation about climate change. And while Ranking Member
+Bishop wondered where this is heading--obviously, it is too
+early to say which policy prescriptions and solutions this
+Committee may eventually support, but you have to begin with
+the kind of conversations, science-based, fact-based, policy-
+based that we are having in this room.
+ And what better way to have it than this bipartisan duo of
+governors? I am struck, in listening to your testimonies, that
+when honest people simply listen to the facts, listen to the
+science, and try to solve problems for those they represent,
+the party labels kind of melt away and we just become problem
+solvers. That is refreshing.
+ This Committee and this Congress need to hear more of that.
+This country needs to hear more of that. Because, frankly, I
+think America is tired of the shrill, fact-free partisan food
+fight that has tended to be what they see when we talk about
+climate change. So, thank you both so much for being here.
+ Governors, I want to ask you about offshore drilling. You
+know that the Trump administration has proposed issuing new
+leases for offshore drilling that would potentially affect each
+of your states. You might say that they want to make your
+states' economies look a little more like my friend, Garret
+Graves' economy in Louisiana, which is still reeling in many
+respects from the BP oil spill.
+ What does new offshore drilling represent, from your
+perspective? Is it a threat? What would it do to the coastal
+economies of your states?
+ Governor Cooper. North Carolina says not off our coast. We
+oppose seismic testing. We oppose offshore drilling. We have
+too much invested in our tourism economy and our commercial and
+recreational fishing economy and our ports. We cannot tolerate
+a disaster of epic proportions which could occur.
+ We have continued to file comments, we have stated our
+opposition, we have met with Federal authorities, and will
+continue to oppose it in North Carolina, just like over 200
+bipartisan local governments have passed resolutions opposing
+offshore drilling off of the North Carolina coast.
+ Mr. Huffman. Governor Baker?
+ Governor Baker. It is pretty unanimous support for not
+drilling off the coast of Massachusetts, as well, for many of
+the same reasons. We have one of the most important fisheries
+in the United States. The New Bedford scallop fishery is more
+than $1 billion. I think it is the largest, from a dollar
+basis, of any fishery in the United States.
+ We also have demonstrated that the best and biggest
+opportunity, we believe, for offshore energy activity is around
+Deepwater Wind. And just to put a point on that, we put our bid
+out, we took the best of the bids that we got. Rhode Island
+took one of the bids, Connecticut took one of the bids. And New
+York, New Jersey, Virginia, and Delaware all of a sudden got
+very interested in Deepwater Wind when they saw the price
+points on the procurement that we had negotiated.
+ And the Federal Government, the Bureau of Ocean Energy
+Management, put a series of Federal leases out on Federal
+waters to see what kind of bids they would get on those, and
+they got tremendous bids on that. And I think if we are looking
+for a way to grow energy resources on the East Coast, my view
+would be let's do the Deepwater Wind, which I believe has huge
+potential.
+ But the tourism industry, the fishery industry, there are a
+lot of really good reasons not to be doing offshore drilling
+off the coast----
+ Mr. Huffman. We have never heard of a catastrophic wind
+spill off our coast.
+ [Laughter.]
+ Mr. Huffman. So, that seems like a prudent course.
+ Governor Baker, you referred a little bit to this when you
+talked about climate change impact on your fisheries, and this
+is something you do very much have in common with Louisiana.
+You have a thriving and very vibrant commercial fishing
+industry.
+ But I understand that the Gulf of Maine is one of these hot
+spots for ocean warming. It is warming much faster than most
+other parts of the ocean. Could you speak to what that is doing
+to the movement of these fish that have historically been
+there, how that might impact the seafood industry that you
+represent, and coastal fishing communities?
+ Governor Baker. Well, if you think particularly about cod
+and lobster, which are probably two commercial fishing
+industries that are as identified with Massachusetts and Maine
+as any you are going to find--in fact, there is a cod that is
+actually hanging on the wall in our State House of
+Representatives chamber, because that is considered to be kind
+of the----
+ Mr. Huffman. Sacred.
+ Governor Baker. Yes, exactly. And that cod fishery is
+moving north. And the lobster fishery is moving north, as well.
+We are all very concerned that, as the water continues to warm
+in the Gulf of Maine, it could have huge implications for the
+shellfish industry, as well.
+ It is a very big problem, and it is one that you don't have
+to project out. It is already happening, and it is there, and
+you can see it in the data. And you can see it when you talk to
+any of the folks who are part of those fishing communities.
+ Mr. Huffman. Thank you both for your leadership. I yield
+back.
+ The Chairman. Thank you very much.
+ Mr. Lowenthal.
+ Dr. Lowenthal. Thank you. And I want to thank the
+panelists, both----
+ The Chairman. Mr. Lowenthal, I just want to be respectful
+of the governor's time. We probably have him for the rest of my
+colleagues--they are gracious enough for an additional 10
+minutes. Maybe if we can--and then we will have to end at that
+point.
+ Dr. Lowenthal. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
+ The Chairman. I apologize----
+ Dr. Lowenthal. In my 10 seconds, I would like to talk about
+the speed by which we move toward zero carbon economies. In
+your experience, and you both have stated in your testimony
+that you set targets for the reduction of greenhouse gases. Can
+you share with us some of your thoughts about what we can do at
+the Federal level in setting targets? And what are the
+obstacles you received, or you found in doing this? How far can
+we go?
+ Because I am leaning toward what is the balance between a
+regulatory approach and an incentive, market-driven approach?
+Can they complement each other? Or should we just have one
+versus the other?
+ Governor Cooper. We have set a goal in North Carolina of a
+40 percent reduction by the year 2025. And one thing we know,
+it is going to take a balanced approach. For example, our
+renewable portfolio standard, we are making requirements of our
+utilities to increase their renewable energy production, while
+at the same time we are doing things to encourage zero-emission
+vehicles, energy efficiency. I mean it has to be a combination
+of all of the above.
+ One thing I do know is that the United States needs to be a
+world leader again in this issue. And anything that you can do
+from a Federal perspective to make that happen, we would
+appreciate it. Our 20-state Climate Alliance represents about
+47 percent of the population of the United States, and a little
+over half of the gross domestic product. So, we do have a
+strong voice that we want the United States to be a leader in
+this again. And anything that you can do, legislatively from
+your bully pulpit to make that happen is greatly appreciated.
+It is absolutely necessary.
+ Governor Baker. And I would just say a couple things. One
+is I do think the most important thing is to establish long-
+term goals and objectives, because that helps the private
+sector plan. The second thing I would say is that the goals and
+objectives can vary from region to region. And I think that,
+back to the Louisiana versus Massachusetts issue, that is a
+legitimate issue.
+ The regional greenhouse gas coalition that we put together
+with the northeastern states around electricity and energy
+production has been incredibly effective at reducing greenhouse
+gases through energy production.
+ And we are currently talking to the same states about doing
+something in transportation, which I believe will have similar
+implications for nudging people and encouraging people to move
+to zero-emission-type vehicles over time. And as I said in my
+remarks before, our economy has continued to perform, even as
+our actual energy use has stayed completely flat, and our
+greenhouse gas emissions have gone down.
+ I think one of the things that is important here is, we
+have created state-based incentives to encourage our utilities
+and to encourage our businesses to head in this direction. And
+we have about 100,000 jobs now in Massachusetts that are
+related to the green economy, getting back to the point that
+Governor Cooper made previously, which is even in Massachusetts
+the solar industry has been very successful at finding a path
+forward.
+ And we are now pairing solar investments with storage, and
+that is another area where the Federal Government can play a
+big role. I mean storage has tremendous potential, and it has
+tremendous potential on both price and on environmental issues.
+ The time we typically burn the most environmentally
+dangerous fuels at the highest price is when it is really cold
+out, or really hot out, and we are paying a ton for what we
+get, and most of the time it is our most environmentally
+dangerous sources. And I think storage is a big opportunity to
+do something about that, and that is a place where the Feds
+could really play a big role.
+ Dr. Lowenthal. I just want to say one thing. Thank you for
+that. I represent the port area of Long Beach, Los Angeles. We
+are the largest complex. We have reduced our greenhouse gas
+effect by 80 percent and had the greatest economic growth
+because of that. So, there are a lot of models out there.
+ The last thing is, I think that there are regional
+differences. I am glad that Representative Graves mentioned it,
+the difference between Louisiana and Massachusetts. You pointed
+that out. I think the transition to a green economy, which we
+are doing, and green energy, is going to have to deal with
+that, the transition in workers and resources to different
+regions. And I think it is important that he at least mentioned
+it, even though I think we have differences of opinion on how
+we reach that goal.
+ Governor Baker. I mean I have always been--Texas is a very
+big oil and gas state. It also is a very big wind and solar
+state. It is a big energy state. And I wonder if that is one of
+the ways we could think about some of these issues, going
+forward.
+ The Chairman. Mr. Cox.
+ Mr. Cox. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I thank Governor Cooper,
+Governor Baker for being here today.
+ Every day, when I come to work for the people of
+California's Central Valley, I think about how what we do is
+going to affect their lives, particularly in these rural
+communities that I represent. And while it is clear as day that
+climate change is real, according to the National Climate
+Assessment, rural communities in particular face more challenge
+obstacles responding to climate change, because they are so
+highly dependent on our natural resources.
+ And, certainly in California, we have seen those direct
+impacts, the heat waves, the fires, the droughts. And we all
+know it is only going to get worse unless we do something about
+it.
+ But my particular concern and interest--and to you,
+Governor Baker, because I know that you worked in the
+healthcare industry--is really the linkage between climate
+change and public health. And particularly public health, how
+it is going to affect our rural communities.
+ Governor Baker. I think the two things I would speak to on
+that, the first is, obviously, the air quality issue, which
+Congressman Bishop mentioned before. There are definitely air
+quality issues associated with climate, and those air quality
+issues translate into issues around asthma, emphysema, and
+other both acute and chronic conditions that are associated
+with that.
+ The second thing I would say with respect to the rural
+piece is the rural communities generally have difficulty not
+just with climate, but with access to what I would describe as
+sort of modern and sort of standard operating procedure
+technology that you see in other places.
+ I mean one of the biggest things we have been working on in
+western Massachusetts, which has many hill towns and many rural
+communities, is broadband, which is a really big issue, in
+terms of economic development and sort of just future capacity
+to support and serve the people who live in those communities,
+and provide jobs and economic opportunity. And I think, in many
+ways, the strategy around rural communities needs to be about a
+lot of things, one of which relates to energy and the climate.
+ But there are a lot of things we should be doing with rural
+communities, because they have very different issues that they
+need to worry about.
+ Mr. Cox. Yes, thank you, I appreciate the comments
+regarding the air quality. San Joaquin Valley is the worst air
+quality basin in the Nation. And it is not getting any better.
+It is such a shame that we get to see the mountains once or
+twice a year, right after a nice rainfall.
+ And Governor Cooper, I don't know if you had----
+ Governor Cooper. When we, in North Carolina, forced the
+Tennessee Valley Authority to significantly reduce coal-fired
+plant emissions, there was a demonstrable positive effect on
+public health. That matters a great deal.
+ And from the rural perspective, farmers are getting hit
+hard by the effects of climate change. And they know it. And
+you hear from them, because in North Carolina now we have made
+significant state appropriation to get some immediate help to
+our farmers, many of them hit by flood after flood, storm after
+storm, who are now beginning to make the decision this is just
+not worth it. It is not worth it to be in this business. That
+should be a frightening result, not only for my state, but for
+the rest of the country and the world, for that matter.
+ Mr. Cox. Amen.
+ Mr. Chairman, I yield back the rest of my time.
+ The Chairman. Thank you, and to the governors, our
+appreciation. Thank you very much for your testimony. Members
+have up to 3 days to submit questions that we will forward to
+you. And if you would be gracious enough to respond to them,
+particularly the Members that didn't have an opportunity today
+to ask questions or make comments and have a dialogue with you.
+ Governor Baker. Thank you for that, Mr. Chairman.
+ Mr. Bishop. Can I just say one last thing? I will be
+actually asking some questions, as well, to you, specifically
+on Mr. Huffman's response or questions on offshore drilling,
+that if you think the governors or the states have a right or
+at least a say on what happens in Federal waters off your
+shores.
+ And if your answer is yes, then I am going to wonder why my
+governor doesn't have a right and a say on Federal lands within
+my state. Anything short of that is hypocritical, and that
+issue is something that is the jurisdiction of our Committee.
+ The Chairman. Thank you very much, governors.
+ Governor Baker. Thank you, I appreciate it.
+ The Chairman. And we very much appreciate it and thank you
+for initiating this very important discussion and solution
+seeking here in this Committee.
+ With that, let me invite the second panel up and we will
+begin then. And I will begin the questioning with the Members
+that didn't have an opportunity for the second panel. OK,
+senior Members?
+ [Pause.]
+ The Chairman. Let me resume the meeting and welcome the
+second panel. Let me introduce the second panel.
+ We have Ms. Elizabeth Yeampierre, the Executive Director of
+UPROSE; Ms. Nadia Nazar, Co-Founder and Co-Executive Director
+of Zero Hour Movement; Dr. Kim Cobb, Professor of Earth &
+Atmospheric Sciences and the Director of the Global Change
+Program at the Georgia Institute of Technology; Ms. Paula
+DiPerna, Special Advisor, CDP North America; Reverend Lennox
+Yearwood, President and CEO of Hip Hop Caucus; Mr. Derrick
+Hollie, President of Reaching America; and Dr. Judith Curry,
+President of Climate Forecast Applications Network.
+ As with the first panel, all statements are limited to 5
+minutes. Your entire statement will be part of the hearing
+record.
+ I explained the lights. Yellow means you have 1 minute.
+Red--for the sake of everybody having their questions and
+additional time to engage with the witnesses today, we would
+hope that you would stop at that point.
+ Let me begin with Ms. Nazar. Your 5 minutes--thank you for
+being here. I appreciate it, and I am looking forward to your
+comments and your perspective.
+
+ STATEMENT OF NADIA NAZAR, CO-FOUNDER, CO-EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR,
+AND ART DIRECTOR, ZERO HOUR MOVEMENT; CO-ORGANIZER OF THE YOUTH
+ CLIMATE MARCH, PERRY HALL, MARYLAND
+
+ Ms. Nazar. Thank you for inviting me to be here today. I
+would first like to acknowledge that we are on the land of the
+Piscataway Indian Nation, an indigenous tribe. My name is Nadia
+Nazar. I am 16 years old, and I am a junior in high school in
+Baltimore, Maryland. I am an artist and environmentalist. I
+have dedicated my time and efforts to the community and animals
+on this planet since I was 12 years old. I am a founder of the
+youth-led climate organization Zero Hour.
+ We say this is Zero Hour because this is zero hour to act
+on climate change. In fact, Zero Hour will soon launch a
+nationwide campaign for youth to educate their peers about
+climate justice.
+ Climate change has already impacted my future. Scientists
+say we will be at irreversible climate chaos by the year 2030
+if we don't drastically reduce our emissions right now. I will
+be 28 years old in 2030.
+ Our world is already experiencing the impacts of global
+warming, and living conditions will only get closer and closer
+to the extremes. Humanity has pushed this planet to the edge.
+And, from my view, it seems that few in the policy and
+political world are paying attention to the consequences of our
+actions over the generations.
+ The climate crisis exasperates problems that are already
+prevalent, especially in developing nations. Clean water, a
+vital element to life, is becoming even more scarce. Extreme
+weather and natural disasters are now the norm, creating new
+crises against vulnerable populations.
+ The United States is historically the largest emitter of
+greenhouse gases. But those who are facing the most severe
+consequences are the people in developing countries and those
+in lower-income communities. People in poverty have less access
+to resources needed to survive when climate extremes take
+place.
+ Marine life, such as sea turtles and whales and other
+species are facing a mass extinction, because of the warmer
+ocean waters that we humans have caused. My community in
+Baltimore depends on the Chesapeake Bay. These warming waters
+will not only harm future generations of my community, but it
+will also harm generations around the world that rely on bodies
+of water for their livelihoods.
+ It seems here in Washington the policy makers have for far
+too long put the interests of fossil fuel corporations and
+other carbon-emitting industries over the health and prosperity
+of the people, the wildlife, and this planet. The lives of my
+generation have been disregarded for far too long.
+ You should put the interests of your future generations
+first, not just because it is the right thing to do, but
+because many of us have the right to vote in just a couple of
+years. We care about clean air and clean water, and we will be
+voting for those who want to address climate change head on.
+ Some of my friends say they don't want to have children,
+because they are worried about the kind of lives they would
+have to live on a warming planet. In the future, asthma rates
+will be higher, there will be less access to food, and more
+extreme natural disasters in weather will occur, all due to
+climate change.
+ Climate change not only threatens the future of my
+generation, but it continues to displace and kill people. My
+family in Kerala, India experienced the floods that occurred
+there this past summer. These floods displaced approximately
+800,000 people and killed 483 people. Around the same time my
+friends in Ellicott City, Maryland experienced floods that
+caused landslides and infrastructural damage in a historical
+city.
+ Climate change has been happening. Climate change is
+happening. Climate change will continue to happen. Climate
+change is my future, unless you do something about it right
+now. My generation includes your children and your
+grandchildren.
+ I see climate change as an issue that connects everyone and
+everything on our planet. This is not just about changes in the
+weather. It is about these changes that will impact and harm
+populations all around the world. If there is no food because
+plants can't grow due to extreme drought, that can cause war.
+And the most vulnerable populations oppressed by racism, the
+patriarchy, colonialism, and more will be the ones who suffer.
+ These are the people who are so often left out of
+conversations, conversations about the quality of the air and
+water, about energy, and about how we treat this land. We at
+Zero Hour believe that not only have the voices of the Nation's
+youth been ignored, but others, as well: women, people of
+color, indigenous communities, and some of our most vulnerable
+populations.
+ How can we progress toward an equal and equitable society
+of justice if we can't listen to those who make up our country?
+ I believe that everyone must work together, united and with
+compassion, on this issue. Those who hold the most power and
+influence in our society should work with those working in our
+local communities. I ask of you, Congress, to work with the
+grass roots climate movement, including the youth, and listen
+to them in order to bring sustainable change swiftly in time
+for my generation and I to be able to enjoy life, liberty, and
+the pursuit of happiness. Thank you.
+
+ [The prepared statement of Ms. Nazar follows:]
+ Prepared Statement of Nadia Nazar, Co-Founder, Zero Hour Movement
+ Hello, my name is Nadia Nazar. I am 16 years old and I am currently
+a junior in high school. My SATs are in 2 months, and even though I'm
+swamped with my academic studies and obligations, climate change is so
+important to me that I'm here to talk to you about this crisis and the
+impact it will have on me and my peers' future. I need your help to
+solve this crisis that is taking away my future.
+ I live near Baltimore, Maryland. I was born and raised there. Both
+of my parents are immigrants from Kerala, India. I have been surrounded
+by nature for as long as I can remember, and I'm sure you have too. My
+mother is a marine biologist and every year she would take me to the
+National Aquarium. I would stare at the stingrays, sharks, turtles,
+jellyfish, and seahorses as they swam by my tiny self. The beauty of
+life in the ocean was absolutely mesmerizing. As I got older, people
+would tell me about how humans kill these animals. I'd always wonder
+why, and I still do.
+ I have been studying climate since I was in the 8th grade and I
+have become increasingly troubled by the dangerous impact of climate
+change to people, wildlife, and the planet.
+ That is why I co-founded Zero Hour, a youth-led organization, with
+three friends online. We were youth who just wanted a livable planet.
+This organization became Zero Hour, a youth led climate organization.
+We organized the Youth Climate March on July 21, 2018. We had a Youth
+Climate Lobby Day, where 180 youth from across the country lobbied for
+the Zero Hour Platform and the No Fossil Fuel Money Pledge. We also had
+a Youth Climate Art Festival where we brought together art, music, and
+climate action. I love my work with Zero Hour because we push for
+change on all levels. Change starts from the ground up; we must work
+locally, nationally, and globally. One of the key aspects of Zero
+Hour's platform is that it provides a variety of solutions
+systematically, and for individuals. Climate change is an issue that
+needs to be fought on a global and at a household level in order to
+achieve a livable planet.
+ Zero Hour will soon be launching a campaign that will educate youth
+across the country about climate justice and how systems of oppression
+intersect with the climate crisis.
+ I am the Co-Executive and Art Director of Zero Hour. I wake up
+early to go to school. Send out e-mails on the school bus, during
+lunch, and on the school bus home. I do my homework and then work for
+Zero Hour for hours. I stay up till 1 a.m. almost every night, sometime
+3 a.m., doing calls, e-mails, and homework for my AP classes. That's
+how important this issue is to me.
+ This lifestyle is something I'd never imagine myself pursuing. I
+always saw myself having a normal high school experience with my
+friends. But I had to act on climate because it just didn't seem many
+of the adults were. We are spending our teenage years, which you only
+have once, are being spent organizing for something we didn't choose to
+happen to us. None of us wanted this burden to be passed down onto us.
+ Why do we have to clean up the mess that past generations, and YOUR
+GENERATION, has left us?
+ People always ask if I have hope. As a young climate activist,
+people look to youth like me and see hope. Every time that happens I
+lose hope, because the adults are looking for us to solve the problem.
+But how can we solve it if many people doing nothing. My hope is equal
+to the time we have left. We have such little time left, so we must act
+upon that hope, not just stare at it ignorantly from a distance. Adults
+are glad that we are taking action, but we need YOU adults to take
+action too. We, the youth, need everyone to act in order to solve
+climate change, before it is too late.
+ According to the United Nations Intergovernmental Panel on Climate
+Change report, that time is in 11 years. We have until 2030 to kick our
+addiction to fossil fuels if we want to have a chance at keeping
+warming below 1.5C. I will be 28 years old in 2030. The rest of my
+life, then, will depend on the decisions we make today. As the latest
+National Climate Assessment shows, I've already lived my whole life in
+a changed climate.
+ My peers have similar worries.
+ Youth all over the world have held strikes from school to bring
+attention to climate change, and its effect on my generation. On March
+15, youth from all across the United States will be on strike to
+protest and demand climate action. Specifically, Zero Hour and the
+youth striking will be asking you, Members of Congress, to support the
+Green New Deal and act on climate. Please, listen to the youth of this
+country.
+ Climate change may not have affected you personally yet, but many
+individuals all around the world are already coping with the effects
+from the suffocating and deadly wildfires in California to the massive
+flooding from the most vicious hurricanes our United States has ever
+seen.
+ The magnitudes of natural disasters will only continue to increase
+as climate change grows stronger. There will be more floods. Deserts
+will be drier. This past summer's heatwave has already shown that
+summer is getting hotter. These irregular weather patterns are from the
+changing climate. Climate is different than weather, but climate has a
+significant impact on the weather.
+
+ Here are some more natural disasters from just the past 3 years:
+
+
+
+
+Nov. 8, 2018 Paradise, CA Camp Fire 79
+
+Sept. 13, 2018 Carolinas Hurricane 42+
+ Florence
+
+Sept. 9, 2018 Guam, Marshall Super Typhoon 69+
+ Islands, Mangkhut
+ Philippines, and
+ southern China
+
+July 23, 2018 Redding California The Carr Fire 8/1,604 homes
+ destroyed
+
+July, 2018 Japan Japan Flooding 122+
+ and Mudslides
+
+May 2, 2018 Western and Northern India Dust Storms 125+
+ India
+
+Jan. 9, 2018 Southern California Montecito 21/129 homes
+ Mudslides destroyed
+
+Aug. 14, 2018 Sierra Leone, West Sierra Leone 1000+
+ Africa floods and
+ landslides
+
+Aug. 17, 2017 Houston, Texas Hurricane Harvey 68
+
+Aug. 30, 2017 Hurricane Irma 52
+
+July 2017 Indian Subcontinent 2017 South Asian 1,300+
+ floods
+
+Sept. 16, 2017 Puerto Rico and Hurricane Maria 2,975
+ Virgin Islands
+
+Jan. 23, 2016 U.S. Northeast Winter Storm 49
+ Jonas
+
+Sept. 28, 2016 Atlantic Ocean Hurricane Matthew 603
+
+
+
+ Systems of oppression have magnified the effects of climate change.
+Systems including--racism, patriarchy, colonialism, homophobia,
+ableism--have made the effects of climate change disproportionately
+affect certain groups of people.
+ People of color are disproportionately incarcerated, with black
+people incarcerated at more than five times the rate of white people.
+Prisoners were forced to clean up toxic areas after the BP oil spill.
+They're also fighting wildfires, and cleaning up after hurricanes and
+floods. In the event of a natural disaster, prison protocol (in some
+prisons) is to lock prisoners in their cells while the staff evacuates
+the building, leaving prisoners to die if the prison is hit. Example,
+when Hurricane Katrina hit New Orleans. This past weekend, the inmates
+at the Metropolitan Detention Center in Brooklyn were left without heat
+during the frigid temperatures of the polar vortex, that was linked to
+climate change.
+ Often, the majority of industrial fossil fuel projects are
+constructed around or near minority neighborhoods, impacting the health
+of those peoples.
+ And climate change's impacts are even more dire in developing
+countries.
+ Colonialism refers to control over a piece of land and its people
+by a more dominant power. One example on the negative impact climate
+change has with colonialism, patriarchy, and racism is the impact on
+girls of color in the United States who are the missing and murdered
+Indigenous girls. Fossil fuel companies hire land men to build
+pipelines carrying crude oil through Indigenous lands. Some of these
+men rape native girls on their land. Monica Jack, Aielah Saric-Auger,
+and Cheyenne Begay are some of the Indigenous women that have been
+assaulted on their land. These are just a few of the girls that were
+endangered. And trans-native girls are more likely to be victim to
+sexual assault by some of these men that build the pipelines. Sometimes
+pipelines leak crude oil into the water source. This pollutes drinking
+water for the Indigenous people.
+ Homophobia, the hate against the LGBTQIA community, has led
+transgender people to be two times more likely to be homeless. Just
+last week, many homeless people passed away due to the extremely cold
+temperatures. Many homeless people don't have access to the resources
+to survive when climate extremes take place.
+ Many people's voices in the climate crisis who make up our country
+have been ignored. The Indigenous communities have been ignored. People
+of color have been ignored. Women have been ignored. The LGBTQIA
+community have been ignored. Disabled people have been ignored. The
+Youth have been ignored. To solve climate change, we must work with the
+people, the wildlife, and nature.
+ I was given the honor and opportunity to speak at the United
+Nations for International Day of the Girl last October 11. I spoke
+about climate change's effect on girls around the world. Climate
+change's effects are intruding on a successful life filled with
+happiness for many girls in developing countries. After natural
+disasters, sexual violence in the area increase. Girls are more likely
+to be raped in disaster struck areas.
+ I stood next to a girl from the Philippines at the International
+Day of the Girl event. I will never forget her story. Her name was
+Hani. Her community in the Philippines was hit with a typhoon. She lost
+many things including important legal documents and more. But she also
+lost her best friend.
+
+ I don't want to lose my best friend.
+
+ I don't want to lose my brother.
+
+ I don't want to lose my family in India.
+
+ I don't want to lose myself.
+
+ The youth who fight day and night for you to take action on climate
+change don't want to lose out on their future. That is why we fight,
+and why we will continue to fight.
+ One cause of climate change that many people overlook is industrial
+animal agriculture. This industry has contributed to between 14.5 and
+18 percent of the greenhouse gas emissions in the atmosphere.
+ What disappoints many other youth and I, is that there are elected
+officials prioritizing money from fossil fuel corporations over the
+lives of my generation. I hope you aren't one of them.
+ Our relentless greed, our relentless thirst for things that don't
+make us happy, has taken away our connection from earth. Basic
+necessities--food, shelter, air, water--have been critically endangered
+because we are in a mass extinction. It is surreal that profit is being
+put above the people. Adults have been compromised by greed.
+ Not only are these actions of these corporations hurting people,
+but it is also harming the wildlife of this planet. Earth is now in the
+6th mass extinction in all of history. More species are reaching
+extinction. The last mass extinction was the one that killed all the
+dinosaurs. Humanity's legacy on earth will be that we killed a
+significant amount of species on this planet. As Elizabeth Kolbert
+said, if you look closely in your backyard you can see species going
+extinct at this moment. Humanity cannot survive without the
+biodiversity of the environment.
+ I have to take an inhaler multiple times a week, sometimes multiple
+times a day. Clean air is a necessity of life. How can ``Life, Liberty,
+and the Pursuit of Happiness'' be pursued when clean air and clean
+water is harder to have?
+ The United States' inaction on climate change is violating my right
+to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness as a citizen of the
+United States.
+ I ask that you push your efforts into climate legislation, for the
+sake of my generation. I ask that you believe in science. I ask that
+you make sure the sacrificed time and efforts of the youth are not
+ignored. I ask that you recognize climate justice.
+ I ask that you listen to my voice.
+
+ ______
+
+
+ The Chairman. Thank you very much.
+ Ms. Yeampierre, Executive Director, UPROSE, the floor is
+yours.
+
+STATEMENT OF ELIZABETH YEAMPIERRE, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR, UPROSE,
+ CO-CHAIR OF THE CLIMATE JUSTICE ALLIANCE, BROOKLYN, NEW YORK
+
+ Ms. Yeampierre. Buenos dias. My name is Elizabeth
+Yeampierre. I am the Co-Chair of the Climate Justice Alliance,
+an inter-generational alliance of more than 68 front-line
+community organizations, movement networks, and movement
+support groups rooted in Indigenous, African-American, Latinx,
+Asian-Pacific Islander, and poor white communities living on
+the front lines of climate change, as well as the dig, burn,
+drive, dump industries causing the climate crisis.
+ I am also Executive Director of UPROSE. It is a woman-of-
+color-led inter-generational organization founded in 1966
+dedicated to environmental and social justice. We are home to
+the largest gathering of young people of color and climate
+justice, the Climate Justice Youth Summit. We are located in
+Sunset Park, Brooklyn, a diverse community of color made up
+predominantly of people of color and immigrants. We have a
+poverty rate of nearly 26 percent above the city average, and
+far above the national average.
+ From a climate perspective, we are an industrial waterfront
+community exposed to flooding from hurricanes and storm surges,
+as was the case in 2012 when Superstorm Sandy hit.
+ Like climate change, the conditions of our communities are
+the consequence of a long history of extraction. We share
+legacies of fighting colonialism, as well as race, class, and
+gender oppression, while advocating for environmental justice.
+Our communities are the first and most impacted by the storms,
+fires, floods, and droughts, and are disproportionately
+burdened by the pollution, poverty, and systemic violence
+associated with the multi-national corporations driving these
+ecological crises.
+ Puerto Rico is the most recent and drastic example of a
+land ravaged by corporate extraction, with people left to fend
+for themselves after years of colonialism, austerity, and
+neglect. The double disasters of Hurricanes Maria and Irma
+created an opportunity for disaster capitalists to profit from
+people's suffering in a time of social and economic
+devastation. The same thing took place in the Gulf South for
+black and indigenous communities after Hurricane Katrina.
+ Climate change solutions must honor human rights and
+respect front-line leadership through the solutions that are
+proposed.
+ Elsewhere, the extractive economy continues to harm entire
+communities, as is the case with uranium mining in New Mexico,
+which affects over 60 indigenous nations. The southwest United
+States was declared a national sacrifice zone in the Federal
+energy policy of the 1970s.
+ This means that environmental safeguards were not enforced,
+thus endangering human life. Drinking water is tainted with
+uranium and arsenic, and there is a high rate of cancer, heart
+disease, and lung disease. Uranium mining is a key element of
+nuclear energy, which is considered renewable energy in most
+Federal clean energy policy initiatives.
+ You can understand why we do not support the use of large-
+scale bio-fuel, bio-mass, mega-hydro dams, nuclear energy, or
+energy derived from burning waste. They are usually developed
+in our backyards, where we live, work, play, and pray, and they
+do not reduce emissions at the source of extraction, only
+prolonging any real solutions to the climate crisis.
+ To effectively tackle climate change, we must invest in a
+just transition. A just transition will not be smooth, but must
+be just, leaving no worker or community behind. Front-line
+communities and an economic framework that moves us away from
+extraction must be at the center of any effort to address
+climate change.
+ All around the country there are examples of front-line
+communities developing projects that engage in innovative
+infrastructure, further control, and create jobs. Some are at
+the early stages, while others are ready to be scaled up and
+replicated. They will benefit more people and communities if
+there is political will, public investment, and incentives to
+do so.
+ The fossil fuel industry receives millions in subsidies.
+Imagine what communities are already forging comprehensive
+solutions to the climate crisis could do with a reallocation of
+these subsidies. My organization, UPROSE, just recently
+partnered with the New York City Economic Development
+Corporation, Solar One, and Co-Op Power, to create the first
+community-owned solar cooperative in the state of New York.
+ On a larger scale, we advocate for turning the area's
+industrial sector into an economic engine able to build for the
+region's climate adaptation future. Offshore wind alone can
+deliver power to New York City, displacing the need for dirty
+power plants. But just as importantly, it would position the
+city at the center of this emerging industry, driving local
+economic development.
+ For years in another part of the country, the residents of
+Highland Park, Michigan suffered high energy costs and
+blackouts, along with massive flooding. When the municipality
+was in a financial crisis, the local energy company repossessed
+1,000 street lights, leaving the residents in the dark.
+Soulardarity, a local environmental justice group and a CJA
+member stepped in and designed a system for installing solar
+power lights.
+ Soulardarity created a bulk purchasing program that is
+training residents in the solar installation and
+weatherization, readying them to step into clean energy jobs.
+They are using education and organizing to literally make light
+of a dark situation.
+ Front-line communities know what is at stake. The question
+is, will legislation aid our communities' future survival, or
+hinder it? I hope, for all of our sakes, it will be the former.
+The bottom line is that our communities are not sacrifice
+zones, and they have been for too many years. Gracias.
+
+ [The prepared statement of Ms. Yeampierre follows:]
+Prepared Statement of Elizabeth Yeampierre, Executive Director, UPROSE;
+ Co-Chair, Climate Justice Alliance
+ My name is Elizabeth Yeampierre. I am Co-Chair of the Climate
+Justice Alliance, a national organization that links 68 organizations
+across the United States and Puerto Rico. I am also Executive Director
+of UPROSE, Brooklyn's oldest Latinx organization. Founded in 1966,
+UPROSE is dedicated to environmental and social justice and part of the
+national frontline climate justice movement representing those most
+impacted by climate change.
+ UPROSE is located in Sunset Park, Brooklyn. It is a diverse
+working-class community where over half of the residents are People of
+color/immigrants, mostly of Latinx descent. We have a poverty rate of
+nearly 26 percent, above the city average and far above the national
+average. Housing affordability is a major crisis, with nearly half of
+my neighbors being rent-burdened and the city undergoing extreme
+gentrification that will only worsen with the expansion of Opportunity
+Zones.
+ From a climate perspective, we are an industrial waterfront
+community exposed to flooding from hurricanes and storm surges, as was
+the case in 2012 when Superstorm Sandy hit. As a poor and working-class
+community, housing displacement and disruption of services due to
+storms and other severe weather affect our people much more acutely
+compared to residents of affluent communities with more resources.
+Further, on a day-to-day basis, disproportionate exposure to fossil
+fuel pollution and other climate change impacts, such as extreme heat,
+is built into New York City's policy fabric, transportation planning,
+and economic development, all arising from racism that compounds the
+pollution impacts with socioeconomic inequities. The oppression of low
+wages and underfunded schools in our community is exacerbated by high
+rates of asthma and other pulmonary diseases, heart disease, and lung
+cancer, which further restrict my neighbors' economic and educational
+potential.
+ the climate justice alliance
+ The Climate Justice Alliance (CJA) is an alliance of more than 68
+frontline community organizations, movement networks, and movement
+support groups rooted in Indigenous, African American, Latinx, Asian
+Pacific Islander, and poor white communities living on the frontlines
+of climate change, as well as the ``dig, burn, drive, dump'' industries
+causing this crisis.
+ Like climate change, the conditions of our communities are the
+consequence of a long history of extraction. We share legacies of
+fighting colonialism, as well as race, class and gender oppression,
+while advocating for environmental justice. And we share vision, values
+and principles that guide our environmental, economic, and social
+justice organizing. Our communities are the first and most impacted by
+the storms, fires, floods and droughts, and are disproportionately
+burdened by the pollution, poverty and systemic violence associated
+with the multi-national corporations driving these ecological crises.
+ Puerto Rico is the most recent and drastic example of a land
+ravaged by corporate extraction, with people left to fend for
+themselves after years of colonialism, austerity and neglect. The
+double disaster of Hurricanes Irma and Maria created an opportunity for
+``disaster capitalists'' to profit from people's suffering in a time of
+social and economic devastation. The same thing took place in the Gulf
+South for Black and Indigenous communities after Hurricane Katrina.
+Climate change solutions must honor human rights and respect frontline
+leadership through the solutions that are proposed.
+ Elsewhere, the extractive economy continues to harm entire
+communities, as is the case with uranium mining in New Mexico, which
+affects over 60 Indigenous nations. The southwest United States was
+declared a ``National Sacrifice Zone'' in the Federal Energy Policy of
+the 1970s. This means that environmental safeguards were not enforced,
+thus endangering human life. Drinking water is tainted with uranium and
+arsenic and there is a high rate of cancer, heart disease, and lung
+disease. Uranium mining is a key element of nuclear energy which is
+considered renewable in most Federal clean energy policy initiatives.
+You can understand why we do not support the use of large-scale
+biofuel, biomass, mega-hydro dams, nuclear energy, or energy derived
+from burning waste. They are usually developed in our backyards, where
+we live, work, play and pray and they do not reduce emissions at the
+source of extraction, only prolonging any real solutions to the climate
+crisis.
+ toward a just transition
+ To effectively tackle climate change, we must invest in a Just
+Transition toward specifically local, living economies of scale.
+ Just Transition is a vision-led, unifying and place-based set of
+principles, processes and practices that build economic and political
+power to shift from an extractive economy to a regenerative economy--
+not just for workers but for whole communities. This means approaching
+production and consumption cycles holistically and waste-free.
+ This transition away from fossil fuels itself must be just and
+equitable, redressing past harms and creating new relationships of
+power for the future through reparations, living wage jobs and economic
+and social development that aims to address historical harm and
+discrimination. If the process of transition is not just, the outcome
+will never be.
+ It is clear from the scientific data that we must move away from
+fossil fuels. It will not be smooth but the transition must be just,
+leaving no worker or community behind. Frontline communities and an
+economic framework that moves us away from extraction must be at the
+center of any effort to address climate change.
+ Climate change demands that we live with what we need instead of
+what we want. Everywhere people are learning to do this, and frontline
+communities are leading the way and reclaiming their traditions.
+ new york's first solar cooperative is community owned
+ All around the country there are examples of frontline communities
+developing projects that engage innovative infrastructure, further
+local control, and create jobs. Some of these projects are in the early
+stages. Others are ready to be scaled up and replicated in ways that
+will benefit more people and communities if there is public investment
+and incentives to do so. The fossil fuel industry receives millions in
+subsidies. Imagine what communities already forging comprehensive
+solutions to the climate crises could do with the reallocation of those
+subsidies.
+ My organization, UPROSE, partnered with the NYC Economic
+Development Corporation, Solar One and Co-op Power to create the first
+community-owned solar cooperative in New York State.
+ On a larger scale, we advocate for turning the area's industrial
+sector into an economic engine able to build for the region's climate-
+adaptable future. Offshore wind alone can deliver power directly to New
+York City, displacing the need for dirty power plants. But just as
+importantly, it would position the city at the center of this emerging
+industry, driving local economic development.
+ This industry will revitalize our working waterfront and create
+thousands of blue-collar industrial jobs. The Department of Energy
+expects 40,000 new jobs in the sector by 2030. Those jobs will be
+located wherever the ports and the work force are. This could move our
+region away from the fossil fuels that threaten our climate while
+blunting the forces of real estate speculation that are disrupting our
+communities. An offshore wind hub in Sunset Park would serve as an
+innovative model of economic development that would transform our
+energy system and provide pathways to a middle class income for
+workers. It would act as a bulwark against extractive real estate
+interests and position the city as a leader on climate change solutions
+at the national level. From the very local to a much larger scale,
+frontline communities like ours are working to operationalize creative
+solutions that address local needs.
+ educating for the future, solving problems now
+ For years, in another part of the country, the residents of
+Highland Park, Michigan suffered high energy costs and energy blackouts
+along with massive flooding. When the municipality was in financial
+crisis, the local energy company repossessed 1,000 streetlights,
+leaving the residents in the dark. Soulardarity, a local environmental
+justice group and a CJA member, stepped in and designed a system for
+installing solar-powered street lights. They have installed 7 solar-
+powered streetlights and created a proposal for the City to finance and
+install a full 1,000, re-lighting the streets and providing affordable
+internet and civic engagement tools. Building on its commitment to
+energy democracy and community empowerment, Soulardarity created a bulk
+purchasing program that is training residents in solar installation and
+weatherization, readying them to step into clean energy jobs as they
+become available, and has deployed $30,000 of solar lighting and other
+products in Highland Park and neighboring communities. They are using
+education and organizing to literally make light of a dark situation.
+The group is shortly releasing a Blueprint for Energy Democracy, a plan
+to make Highland Park a global model of sustainability and democracy,
+and collaborating with a diverse array of stakeholders to advance the
+plan, and advocating for state and Federal actors to provide financial
+resources and technical assistance to bolster community plans.
+ expanding solar while growing community jobs
+ In Chicago, CJA member Little Village Environmental Justice
+Organization (LVEJO), which is based in a low-income, mainly Latinx
+immigrant neighborhood, worked hard to directly represent environmental
+justice communities in the state of Illinois' Future Energy Jobs Act
+(FEJA) by insisting that it focus on health, environmental justice, and
+economic justice opportunities. With unprecedented funds directed to
+low-income environmental justice communities, LVEJO developed access to
+a solar panel training program delivered in communities across the
+state that prioritizes community members that were formerly
+incarcerated or had aged out of the foster care system. FEJA programs
+were designed to bring the benefits of solar energy to low-income
+communities, whether or not they are able to install the panels on
+their homes, including energy sovereignty opportunities for low-income
+communities to build ownership of solar systems. The group is also at
+the center of a plan to repurpose a closed down coal-fired power plant,
+with the goal of using it for community-run projects.
+ These are but a few examples of how our communities are developing
+concrete projects to address the climate crisis. There are many more
+that look at the different tipping points and sectors needed to halt
+the climate crisis and if we want to ensure a healthy future for future
+generations we must start prioritizing and scaling them now.
+ following the lead of the frontlines and acting now
+ Today, we are at the tipping point with little time to waste. We
+urgently need a Just Transition to be centered in community-driven
+Climate Action Bills, coupled with a commitment to Just Recovery and
+Rebuilding Infrastructure. Simply put, we must have legislation that
+clearly prioritizes investments in scalable projects like those
+mentioned today that reduce emissions at the source and address the
+historical harm and discrimination communities like mine have faced for
+centuries.
+ Investment in just development plans around the Nation through
+block grants earmarked for community-based organizations and community
+development funds would go even further to repair historical harm and
+center community innovation for water, land, air, and energy resources,
+in both urban and rural areas, as well as Indian Country.
+ Frontline communities know what is at stake, the question is: will
+legislation aid our communities' future survival or hinder it. I hope
+for all our sakes it will be the former.
+
+ ______
+
+
+ Questions Submitted for the Record by Rep. Haaland to Ms. Elizabeth
+ Yeampierre, Executive Director, UPROSE
+
+Ms. Yeampierre did not submit responses to the Committee by the
+appropriate deadline for inclusion in the printed record.
+
+ Question 1. Can you share with us some of the disproportionate
+impacts climate change has on underserved and underrepresented
+communities? Are there ways that climate change impacts indigenous
+peoples to an even greater extent?
+
+ Question 2. The Tohono O'odham Nation is having an especially
+difficult time securing the Federal funding it needs to respond to the
+devastation of Hurricane Rosa. This systemic breakdown follows a
+pattern set by Hurricanes Katrina, Maria, and so many others, in which
+underrepresented groups bear the brunt of natural disasters.
+
+ 2a. Can you speak to the financial burden climate change puts on
+underserved communities?
+
+ 2b. Why it is so important that the government work to fund
+adaptation, mitigation, and response efforts in these areas?
+
+ Question 3. We've seen the dire reports from the international
+scientific community, and even from the current Administration about
+the need to act on climate to avoid disastrous long-term outcomes.
+However, it's important we recognize that some communities are reliant
+on fossil fuel investments as a revenue base for their schools,
+hospitals and other essential services. How can we invest in those
+communities to ensure they are not left behind in a clean energy
+transition?
+
+ ______
+
+
+ The Chairman. Thank you.
+ We will turn Kim Cobb.
+
+ STATEMENT OF KIM COBB, GEORGIA POWER CHAIR, DIRECTOR, GLOBAL
+ CHANGE PROGRAM, ADVANCE PROFESSOR, EARTH AND ATMOSPHERIC
+ SCIENCES, GEORGIA INSTITUTE OF TECHNOLOGY, ATLANTA, GEORGIA
+
+ Dr. Cobb. Thank you. I thank Chairman Grijalva and Ranking
+Member Bishop for allowing me to contribute to this important
+conversation about our Nation's future. My message today is
+simple: the data and the science could not be more clear. It is
+time to act.
+ There are many no-regrets, win-win actions to reduce the
+growing cost of climate change. But we are going to have to
+come together to form new alliances in our home communities,
+across our states, and, yes, even in Washington.
+ I know I speak for thousands of my colleagues when I say
+that scientists all over the country are willing and eager to
+assist policy makers and the design of data-driven defenses
+against both current and future climate change impacts.
+ As a professor at the Georgia Institute of Technology for
+the last 15 years, my research uses samples collected from the
+remote Pacific to reconstruct past climate variations. Our
+records are consistent with countless other records indicating
+that the rate in magnitude of recent climate change dwarf
+natural climate variability over the last millennium.
+ I love my work, but 3 years ago, I witnessed something that
+would change my life forever. In 2015, we received funding from
+the National Science Foundation for a series of field
+expeditions to document the evolution of a strong El Nino event
+projected that winter. I had waited 15 years for this
+scientific opportunity. However, little did I know that warming
+ocean temperatures 6 degrees Fahrenheit warmer than average
+would kill up to 90 percent of the coral at our study site. And
+I had a front-row seat to that carnage.
+ And 2016 would go on to become the worst global-scale coral
+bleaching and mortality event on record, and the warmest year
+on our planet since records began. Personally, 2016 was my
+wake-up call. Unfortunately, the last years brought a number of
+devastating wake-up calls much closer to home. Hurricanes
+Harvey, Lane, and Florence decimated entire communities,
+delivered record-breaking rainfall, while Hurricanes Maria and
+Michael decimated entire communities with their force,
+including many in my home state of Georgia.
+ The National Climate Assessment, released this last
+November by a consortium of 13 Federal agencies, documents how
+climate change loads the dice in favor of extreme precipitation
+events, and how warmer oceans fuel larger tropical storms. On
+the other side of the country, record-breaking wildfires raged
+across California, linked to prolonged drought and warmer
+temperatures.
+ The economic toll of these disasters can be measured in the
+hundreds of billions of dollars. However, their real toll, the
+vast human suffering left in their wake, is immeasurable. And
+beyond these deadly extremes, a host of additional climate
+change impacts represent a growing threat to ecosystems and
+communities alike. Sea levels are rising with up to 6 feet of
+global sea level rise projected this century. Drought threatens
+water supplies across the western United States with no end in
+sight. The oceans are becoming more acidic, as excess carbon
+dioxide reacts with sea water. And, as of today, 2018 will
+officially take its place as the fourth warmest year on record
+behind 2016, 2017, and 2015.
+ Climate change impacts are now detectable all across
+America, and they will get worse. That is the bad news. I am
+sure you are ready for some good news, and there is plenty to
+go around.
+ The good news is that science can help inform measures to
+help protect communities, as well as our oceans, forests,
+parks, waterways, and wildlife from the most devastating
+impacts of climate change. Here, early action is essential to
+the success of these approaches delivering vast returns on
+investment.
+ Many jurisdictions, from the local to the Federal, have
+developed a suite of climate adaptation measures informed by
+rigorous science, stakeholder engagement, and cost benefit
+analysis. But we must accelerate these efforts. Toward that
+end, a national climate assessment provides an actionable
+blueprint for such adaptive measures, including an in-depth
+assessment of climate impacts on ecosystem structure, function,
+and services.
+ The other good news is that it is not too late to avoid the
+most damaging impacts of future climate change. We have the
+tools we need to dramatically reduce greenhouse gas emissions.
+And in doing so, we will enjoy cleaner water, cleaner air, and
+healthier communities.
+ The rapid expansion of renewable energy across the Nation
+demonstrates a strong appetite for carbon-free, clean power.
+Even so, U.S. greenhouse gas emissions were up 3 percent last
+year.
+ The bottom line is that we are running out of time.
+Comprehensive Federal policies are needed to speed the
+transition to low-carbon energy sources. Top on the list must
+be a price on carbon to reflect the true cost of continued
+fossil fuel emissions and to incentivize consumers, companies,
+and the market to find the cheapest, most effective means of
+reducing emissions.
+ With or without a price on carbon, increased energy
+efficiency is a win-win strategy that can deliver energy cost
+savings, while reducing harmful air pollution.
+ Last, there is a strong case you made that we can deploy
+our vast forests, grasslands, and coastal marshes in service to
+natural carbon sequestration. At its most basic level, this
+means designing strategies to safeguard these environments with
+their rich carbon reserves in the face of continued climate
+change.
+ As a climate scientist, I have to wonder how bad will it
+have to get for us to recognize that climate change represents
+a clear and present threat, and to act decisively to protect
+ourselves. I am heartened by recent polls showing that nearly
+three in four Americans are concerned about global warming and
+support a range of policy options to address it. As a mother to
+four young children, I am inspired by the sea of young people
+demanding that we not squander their chances for climate
+stability.
+ I urge this Committee to capitalize on the vast trove of
+climate science findings by: (1) protecting our natural
+resources and the communities that depend on them from known
+climate change impacts; and (2) using Federal lands to advance
+climate solutions, rather than expanding the scope of the
+climate change problem. Thank you.
+
+ [The prepared statement of Dr. Cobb follows:]
+ Prepared Statement of Dr. Kim Cobb, Professor, Earth & Atmospheric
+ Sciences; Director, Global Change Program, Georgia Institute of
+ Technology
+ I thank Chairman Grijalva and the rest of the Committee for
+allowing me to contribute to this important conversation about our
+Nation's climate future. My message today is simple: there are many no-
+regrets, win-win actions to reduce the growing costs of climate change,
+but we're going to have to come together to form new alliances, in our
+home communities, across our states, and yes, even in Washington. I
+know I speak for thousands of my colleagues when I say that scientists
+all over the country are willing and eager to assist policy makers in
+the design of data-driven defenses against both current and future
+climate impacts. It is not too late to alter the damaging trajectory of
+inaction. There are plenty of prizes for early, meaningful action.
+These include cleaner air and water, healthier, more resilient
+communities, a competitive edge in the low-carbon 21st century global
+economy, and the mantle of global leadership on the challenge of our
+time. I'm confident that through respectful discourse, we will
+recognize that our shared values unite us in seeking a better tomorrow
+for all Americans.
+ My own journey began 20 years ago, at the Scripps Institution of
+Oceanography, where my research focused on extracting records of past
+climate variability and change from far-flung, remote islands in the
+deep tropics. At the time, I never thought that I would ever find
+myself testifying to Congress about climate change. I was a passionate
+and dedicated student of our earth system, eventually settling into a
+rewarding academic career at the Georgia Institute of Technology, where
+I teach courses on energy and climate change, and manage a lab full of
+instruments and student research assistants. Over the last 15 years, I
+have published over 60 peer-reviewed articles, been awarded a
+Presidential Early Career Award for Scientists and Engineers, and am
+currently a Lead Author for the Sixth Assessment Report of the
+Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change. Together with my students
+and collaborators, I work to advance the tools and approaches of in my
+chosen field of paleoclimatology, in part by generating more and better
+records of past climate change. Such records help us peer into the
+distant future by quantifying the response of the climate system to
+past climate forcings, including greenhouse gases. I've led over 20
+expeditions to the middle of the Pacific, SCUBA-diving on abundant,
+diverse reefs where the largest corals are 10-ft tall and contain 100
+or more years of past climate data.
+
+ But 3 years ago, I witnessed something that would change my
+personal and professional life forever.
+
+ In 2015, we received funding from the National Science Foundation
+for a series of field expeditions to document the evolution of a strong
+El Nino event projected that winter. I was giddy with the expectation
+of scientific discovery. After all, I had waited 15 years for this
+opportunity. What I could not have predicted was that ocean
+temperatures 6 degrees Fahrenheit warmer than usual would kill up to 90
+percent of the coral at our study site over 9 months. And I got a
+front-row seat to the carnage. By early 2016, even the largest corals
+would succumb--corals that had lived through record-breaking El Nino's
+in 1983 and 1998. And the carnage was global--scientists report that by
+2017, up to 75 percent of global reefs had experienced bleaching-level
+heat stress and for up to 30 percent of reefs, heat stress reached
+lethal levels (Eakin et al., 2018). Reefs in Hawaii and Florida were
+not spared. It will take decades for our study site to recover, but
+with ocean warming accelerating (Cheng et al., 2019), we know that the
+next ocean heat wave is lurking around the corner. 2016 was my wake-up
+call.
+ Unfortunately, 2017 and 2018 brought a number of devastating wake-
+up calls much closer to home. As a physical climate scientist, I am
+trained to focus on data, and their uncertainties, but let me cut to
+the chase: many of the natural disasters in past years bear the
+unmistakable signature of climate change. Hurricanes Harvey, Lane, and
+Florence delivered record-breaking rainfall (National Weather Service)
+while Hurricanes Maria and Michael decimated entire communities with
+their force, including many in my home state of Georgia. The National
+Climate Assessment (hereafter NCA, 2018)--released this last November--
+documents how climate change loads the dice in favor of extreme
+precipitation events, and how warmer oceans fuel larger tropical
+storms. On the other side of the country, record-breaking wildfires
+raged across California, linked to prolonged drought and warmer
+temperatures (Abatzoglou and Williams, 2016). The economic toll of
+these disasters can be measured in the hundreds of billions of dollars.
+However, their real toll--the vast human suffering left in their wake--
+is immeasurable.
+ And beyond these deadly extremes, a host of additional climate
+change impacts represent a growing threat to ecosystems and communities
+alike. Sea levels are rising, with 6-ft of global sea level rise
+projected this century (Sweet et al., 2017; NCA, 2018). Drought
+threatens water supplies across the western United States (NCA, 2018),
+with no end in sight. The oceans are becoming more acidic as excess
+atmospheric carbon dioxide reacts with seawater (NCA, 2018). A warming
+ocean holds less oxygen, increasing the risk for deadly coastal hypoxia
+events (NCA, 2018). All of these trends are expected consequences of
+climate change--most through fairly straightforward physics and
+chemistry--and all have been borne out by repeated sets of
+observations.
+ The National Climate Assessment outlines the region-by-region and
+sector-by-sector impacts of ongoing climate change. The report makes
+clear that climate change is already impacting the lives of many
+Americans, with outsize impacts to those who can least afford it. The
+report singles out indigenous communities as uniquely vulnerable, given
+their economic and cultural dependence on natural resources. But
+there's plenty of threats to go around--America's farmers, fishermen,
+coastal residents, children, the elderly, and low-income families sit
+squarely in the crosshairs of climate change. As a resident of the
+southeastern United States, I am particularly concerned about the high
+concentration of vulnerable populations in our region, given that
+studies predict a pile-on of escalating climate impacts in our region
+(e.g. Hsiang et al., 2017).
+ Climate change also represents a major threat to national security,
+a ``threat multiplier,'' in the words of a 2015 Department of Defense
+report (DOD report Ref ID 8-6475571). In the last month, a new
+Department of Defense report highlights the risk that current and
+future climate change poses to its infrastructure (DOD report Ref ID 9-
+D30BE5A). It notes that 53 installations are currently subject to
+recurrent flooding, growing to 60 at risk over the next 20 years.
+ Climate change impacts are now detectable all across America. And
+they will get worse. That's the bad news. I'm sure you're ready for
+some good news, and there is plenty to go around.
+ The good news is that science can help inform measures to protect
+communities, as well as our oceans, forests, parks, waterways, and
+wildlife, from the most devastating impacts of climate change. Here,
+early action is essential to success, delivering vast returns on
+investment.
+ Many jurisdictions--from the local to the Federal level--have
+developed a range of adaptation measures informed by the best science,
+stakeholder engagement, and rigorous cost-benefit analysis. But the
+adaptation portfolio is still spotty, and nowhere near the scale
+justified by the set of well-established climate impacts. Toward that
+end, The National Climate Assessment provides an actionable blueprint
+for such adaptive measures, including an in-depth analysis of climate
+impacts on ecosystem structure, function, and services. For example,
+the report highlights a key role that our Nation's natural resources,
+such as coastal wetlands, which can protect communities from rising
+seas while delivering a range of other valuable ecosystem services. The
+National and Regional Climate Adaptation Science Centers (https://
+casc.usgs.gov) provide a mechanism to accelerate adaptation planning
+and implementation to protect our Nation's natural resources and
+safeguard the critical services that they provide.
+ And there is plenty of room for innovation and advanced technology
+to assist communities in quantifying their unique risks and
+vulnerabilities to specific climate-related threats. At Georgia Tech,
+teams of scientists and engineers are teaming up with city and county
+officials in and around Savannah, Georgia to design and deploy sensors
+for monitoring water levels and air temperatures in real time, from
+neighborhood to neighborhood (see https://www.sealevelsensors.org).
+ The other good news is that it's not too late to avoid the most
+damaging impacts of future climate change. We have the tools we need to
+dramatically reduce greenhouse gas emissions. And in doing so, we will
+enjoy cleaner water, cleaner air, and healthier communities.
+ The rapid expansion of renewable energy across the Nation
+demonstrates a strong appetite for carbon-free, clean power on the part
+of private homeowners and large utilities alike. Even so, U.S.
+greenhouse gas emissions were up 3 percent last year (Rhodium Group,
+2019). The bottom line is that we are running out of time.
+Comprehensive Federal policies are needed to speed the transition to
+low-carbon energy sources. Top on the list must be a price on carbon,
+to reflect the true costs of continued fossil fuel emissions, and to
+incentivize consumers, companies, and the market to find the cheapest,
+most effective means of reducing emissions.
+ As much as we need to ramp up low-carbon energy production, we also
+have a huge opportunity to dramatically reduce emissions in the near
+term through energy efficiency, while delivering energy cost savings to
+consumers and corporations alike. It's worth noting that efficiency
+gains come with significant health benefits, largely from reduced air
+pollution, and are effective even without a price on carbon. A 2018
+energy efficiency scorecard by the American Council for an Energy
+Efficient Economy (ACEEE) reports state-by-state gains in energy
+efficiency, with the winners providing a wide range of policy
+instruments to achieve large-scale gains. In general, southeastern
+states like Georgia rank near the bottom of the list, despite high
+energy burdens that leave many low-income families struggling to afford
+their monthly energy bills (ACEEE, 2017). In this case, policies that
+promote energy efficiency will improve living conditions for many of
+the most vulnerable members of society. And of course, improved energy
+efficiency will be critically important going forward, as demand for
+cooling increases across many areas of the country.
+ I became a passionate spokesperson for energy efficiency after
+Georgia Tech undergraduates showed me what could be achieved by
+partnering with local businesses as part of the ``Carbon Reduction
+Challenge'' (http://carbonreduction.gatech.edu). In one semester, 30
+students routinely design and implement strategies to save their
+organizational partners energy, simultaneously banking carbon
+reductions and cost savings. During one Challenge, student teams
+brought 12 million lbs of CO2 reductions to fruition, simply
+by identifying low-hanging interventions to champion with their large
+partner organizations. That's the CO2 equivalent of 20 homes
+going 100 percent solar for 20 years, except this CO2
+savings didn't cost money. It made money.
+ Last, there is a strong case to be made that we can deploy our vast
+forests, grasslands, and coastal marshes in service to natural carbon
+sequestration, in a variety of forms. At its most basic level, this
+means designing strategies to preserve our mature forests, grasslands,
+and wetlands, with their rich soil carbon reserves, in the face of
+continued climate change.
+ Listening to the stories of those whose lives have already been
+destroyed by climate change I have to wonder: How bad will it have to
+get for us to recognize that climate change represents a clear and
+present threat, and to act decisively to protect ourselves and the
+natural resources that we all depend on?
+ As a climate scientist, I'm heartened by recent polls showing that
+nearly 3 in 4 Americans are concerned about global warming, and support
+a range of policy options to address it (Leiserowitz et al., 2018). 72
+percent of Americans think that global warming is happening, 62 percent
+understand that it is mostly human-caused, and 72 percent of Americans
+think that global warming is important to them personally. On policy
+options, 68 percent of Americans support a carbon tax, and 82 percent
+support tax rebates for energy efficiency and solar panels. The path
+forward is clear.
+ And as a mother to four young children, I'm heartened by the sea of
+young people demanding that we not squander their chances for climate
+stability.
+
+ I urge this Committee to center the robust findings of climate
+science in making critical policy decisions about our Nation's natural
+resources by:
+
+ 1) moving to protect these resources, and the communities that
+ depend on them, from the suite of ongoing, well-established
+ climate change impacts; and
+
+ 2) ensuring that our use of Federal lands is geared toward advancing
+ climate solutions, rather than expanding the scope of the
+ climate change problem.
+
+ references and resources (listed in the order that they appear)
+2014-2017 coral bleaching event:
+
+Eakin, C.M., et al., Unprecedented three years of global coral
+bleaching 2014-17. Sidebar 3.1. [in State of the Climate in 2017].
+Bulletin of the American Meteorological Society, 99(8), S74-S75, 2018.
+
+https://coralreefwatch.noaa.gov/satellite/analyses_guidance/
+global_coral_bleaching_ 2014-17_status.php
+
+Hughes, T.P. et al., Spatial and temporal patterns of mass bleaching of
+corals in the Anthropocene. Science, 2018.
+
+https://www.climate.gov/news-features/understanding-climate/
+unprecedented-3-years -global-coral-bleaching-2014-2017
+Ocean warming:
+
+Cheng, L., et al., How fast are the oceans warming? Observational
+records of ocean heat content show that ocean warming is accelerating.
+Science, 363. doi: 10.1126/science.aav7619, 2019.
+Hurricane records:
+
+https://www.weather.gov/lch/2017harvey
+
+https://www.weather.gov/mhx/Florence2018
+
+https://weather.com/storms/hurricane/news/2018-08-28-lane-hawaii-
+tropical-cyclone-rainfall-record-one-year-after-harvey
+Fourth National Climate Assessment:
+
+USGCRP, 2018: Impacts, Risks, and Adaptation in the United States:
+Fourth National Climate Assessment, Volume II: Report-in-Brief
+[Reidmiller, D.R., C.W. Avery, D.R. Easterling, K.E. Kunkel, K.L.M.
+Lewis, T.K. Maycock, and B.C. Stewart (eds.)]. U.S. Global Change
+Research Program, Washington, DC, USA, 186 pp.
+On wildfires and climate change:
+
+Abatzoglou, J.T. and A.P. Williams, Impact of anthropogenic climate
+change on wildfire across western US forests. Proceedings of the
+National Academy of Sciences, 2016.
+Sea level rise:
+
+Sweet, W.V., R.E. Kopp, C.P. Weaver, J. Obeysekera, R.M. Horton, E.R.
+Thieler, and C. Zervas, 2017: Global and Regional Sea Level Rise
+Scenarios for the United States. NOAA Technical Report NOS CO-OPS 083.
+NOAA/NOS Center for Operational Oceanographic Products and Services.
+Regional impacts of climate change:
+
+Hsiang, S., et al., Estimating economic damages from climate change in
+the United States. Science, 2017.
+
+Climate Impact Lab (http://www.impactlab.org/research/estimating-
+economic-damage-from-climate-change-in-the-united-states/)
+DOD reports on climate change:
+
+https://archive.defense.gov/pubs/150724-congressional-report-on-
+national-implications-of-climate-change.pdf?source=govdelivery
+
+https://partner-mco-archive.s3.amazonaws.com/client_files/
+1547826612.pdf
+Energy efficiency scorecards by state:
+
+https://aceee.org/sites/default/files/publications/researchreports/
+u1808.pdf
+Energy burdens in the low-income southeastern U.S. households:
+
+https://aceee.org/fact-sheet/southeast-low-income-series
+U.S. greenhouse gas emissions for 2018:
+
+https://rhg.com/research/preliminary-us-emissions-estimates-for-2018/
+Climate polling results:
+
+http://climatecommunication.yale.edu/visualizations-data/ycom-us-2018/
+
+http://climatecommunication.yale.edu/publications/climate-change-in-
+the-american-mind-december-2018/
+
+Leiserowitz, A. et al. Climate change in the American mind: December
+2018. Yale University and George Mason University. New Haven, CT: Yale
+Program on Climate Change Communication, 2018.
+
+ ______
+
+
+ Questions Submitted for the Record by Rep. Haaland to Dr. Kim Cobb,
+Professor, School of Earth & Atmospheric Sciences, Georgia Institute of
+ Technology
+ Question 1. This Committee has frequently discussed and will
+continue to discuss wildfire safety and forest management. Can you
+please explain the role that climate change plays in altering wildfire
+patterns?
+
+ Answer. Data are now clear--the frequency and extent of western
+U.S. wildfires are increasing. The U.S. National Climate Assessment
+(specifically Chapter 6: Forests; https://nca2018.globalchange.gov/
+chapter/6/) lays out the compound hazards that climate change poses to
+our nations forests, particularly in the vulnerable western United
+States. Most of these risks are directly associated with increased fuel
+loading linked to warmer temperatures, either directly or indirectly.
+For one, pine bark beetles have increased their geographic range as
+winters have become more mild, killing hundreds of millions of trees in
+the last decade, and creating an abundance of dead trees to fuel
+wildfires. Prolonged drought has also played a key role, weakening
+forest resistance to the pine bark beetles and drying out the landscape
+to add to the available fuel load. Severe drought in the western United
+States is directly linked to climate change, as warmer soil
+temperatures drive evaporation while decreased snow pack leaves mess
+water available for summer streamflow. These trends are expected to
+continue to exacerbate the risk of wildfires across the western United
+States. Regionally specific trends in wildfires call out the extreme
+vulnerability of the southwestern United States to wildfire, noting
+impacts to water quality and quantity that have profound societal
+impacts (Chapter 25: Southwest; https://nca2018.globalchange.gov/
+chapter/25/). The National Climate Assessment notes a number of
+potential mitigation strategies to minimize the losses associated with
+wildfires, including maintaining the health of forest ecosystems by
+minimizing habitat fragmentation by human land use decisions. The
+report also highlights the role for data-driven forest wilderness
+management strategies such as allowing naturally ignited fires to burn
+where safe to do so, as well as pre-emptively setting low-intensity
+prescribed burns in reducing wildfire risk.
+
+ Question 2. For over a decade, Congress has struggled to extend
+meaningful protections to important American landscapes--landscapes
+that protect wildlife habitat and provide valuable economic,
+ecological, and recreational benefits.
+
+ 2a. Do protected landscapes play any role in helping humans and
+wildlife adapt to climate change?
+
+ 2b. What do we risk when we fail to extend these protections?
+
+ 2c. How do policies that encourage energy extraction on public
+lands impact the climate?
+
+ Answer. Protected landscapes play a vital role in increasing the
+``adaptive capacity'' of natural systems, the communities that live in
+them and/or depend on them for a variety of ecosystem services. The
+2018 National Climate Assessment defines ``adaptive capacity'' as ``the
+ability of human and natural systems to prepare for, adjust to, respond
+to, and recover from experienced or anticipated climate impacts''
+(Chapter 28: Adaptation; https://nca2018.globalchange.gov/chapter/28/).
+This is perhaps most clear along the coasts, where salt marshes and
+mangroves serve as important natural barriers to reduce the risks of
+coastal flooding while delivering a range of additional ecosystem
+services to support local fisheries, tourism, and recreational
+activities. However, protected corridors across the nation's interior
+are cited as a critical mechanism to allow wildlife to migrate to more
+hospitable climatic zones as temperature and rainfall patterns shift.
+Most obviously, continued warming will place acute stress on
+temperature-sensitive species that might be mitigated by a northward or
+upslope shift in the range of those species to cooler temperatures.
+Habitat fragmentation represents a significant barrier to such natural
+redistributions of terrestrial species as they adapt to climate change.
+In the previous answer, I referred to the importance of maintaining
+forest health through habitat protection in bolstering our defenses
+against wildfires fueled by weakened forests. Wherever possible, data-
+driven forest management practices are also effective tools to aid
+local communities in reducing the risk of wildfires under continued
+climate change.
+ The National Climate Assessment outlines a number of specific
+threats to ecosystems, ecosystem services, and biodiversity in Chapter
+7 (https://nca2018.globalchange.gov/chapter/7) for your further review.
+The health of our nation's ecosystems is inextricably tied to human
+welfare in the following areas, especially through freshwater quality
+and availability, and economic and cultural dependence on specific
+species. When we fail to deploy data-driven defenses to protect
+ecosystems, we are putting American health, welfare, and prosperity at
+risk by reducing our capacity to adapt as a society to continued
+climate change. At the same time, we would be forsaking the important
+role that our ecological systems are playing in sequestering carbon--a
+critical climate service.
+ Continued expansion of fossil fuel extraction across our nation's
+public lands represents a serious risk to current and future
+generations of Americans, who will face a warmer world characterized by
+increasingly severe climate change impacts. Increased fossil fuel
+production drives increased consumption, increasing emissions during a
+time when we must move aggressively to stem the most dangerous impacts
+of climate change. The National Climate Assessment details the dozens
+of specific risks that are now detectable across every community in
+America, and highlights the compounding risk of unmitigated climate
+change for every year that we fail to curb our emissions growth. The
+data could not be more clear. The many benefits of early action could
+not be more clear. Instead of using our precious public lands to
+compound the climate change problem, we should be using these precious
+national resources in the design of data-driven strategies to protect
+communities from climate change, assist key species in their efforts to
+adapt to climate change, expand our portfolio of low-carbon energy, and
+enhance our nation's natural carbon sinks.
+
+ ______
+
+
+ The Chairman. Ms. DiPerna?
+
+STATEMENT OF PAULA DiPERNA, SPECIAL ADVISOR, CDP NORTH AMERICA,
+ NEW YORK, NEW YORK
+
+ Ms. DiPerna. Thank you for the opportunity to testify here
+today. And no doubt disclosure information on our CDP platform
+touches all the states represented on the Committee, and I
+thank you for your service to the Nation.
+ CDP North America, formerly known as the Carbon Disclosure
+Project, is a non-profit that operates for the public good.
+Today, roughly 500 companies in the United States, including 70
+percent of the S&P 500, disclosed to us and through us their
+quantitative and qualitative information about their
+environmental performance, and the imperatives they perceive.
+ Our standardized annual information request is signed off
+on by roughly 500 investor enterprises, represent over $94
+trillion in cumulative assets and most of the financial service
+sector of the world. Our signatories use disclosure as a gauge
+on corporate strategic advantages and vulnerabilities, and a
+reference for making investment decisions.
+ If you stroll through our data, you would find there more
+than 15 years of evidence of the doability, desirability, and
+necessity of reducing greenhouse gas emissions to address
+climate change expressed voluntarily by companies themselves,
+many of whose shareholders are public pension funds, and thus
+relevant to much of the American people.
+ As for me, you have my full resume. But suffice it to say
+here that I have seen the climate change issue from 360
+degrees, from coral reefs to carbon markets, literally, working
+closely with both economist Richard Sandor to help him design
+the world's first integrated cap and trade, the pioneering
+Chicago Climate Exchange, and with oceans explorer Jacques-Yves
+Cousteau, seeing the first President Bush twice at the Oval
+Office to discuss climate change.
+ President Bush signed the United States to the landmark
+United Nations Framework Convention on Climate Change, to which
+the United States remains a signatory, even if the United
+States has pulled out of the Paris Agreement. And we now stand
+alone among nations outside the global consensus, and also
+likely missing out on opportunities to use coherent policy,
+state and local and Federal, to maximize jobs creation and
+future-proof our crumbling infrastructure.
+ Sometimes it is said that American companies are concerned
+that strong policies will hurt business. On the contrary,
+companies are quite concerned about climate change itself. And
+following I will share with you a few examples from almost all
+of your districts and states--probably all--and refer you to my
+written testimony and other materials of CDP for further
+details.
+ In Arizona and Colorado, for example, Arizona Public
+Services, 6,300 new employees serving 1.2 million customers,
+has said, ``Risks associated with forest fires are not new. But
+scientists have indicated that as the global temperatures
+increase, there is a greater risk of drought and a correlated
+increase in risk and intensity of forest fires. Potential
+threat is very real.''
+ Of course, we have heard very much today about the burning
+in California. It is not only the trees. The downgrade of most
+of the utilities in California directly affects American
+people. The credit rating downgrade is very, very significant,
+rating companies from stable to negative by Moody's and S&P and
+Fitch's.
+ In Connecticut, Stanley Black and Decker, an employer of
+nearly 60,000 Americans, has stated, ``Climate change can have
+potentially devastating impacts on our supply chain, should
+drought or flood occur.''
+ In Ohio, American Electric Power, which has 17,500
+employees and 5 million customers across 11 states, including
+Texas, Louisiana, Kentucky, and West Virginia, in their SEC
+filing has said, ``Climate change risk is considered a major
+and material issue for AEP.''
+ And on the issue of regulatory uncertainty, AEP is on the
+record as saying, ``Additionally, in recent years legal
+challenges to almost every major EPA rulemaking have added
+additional uncertainty and cost. While environmental
+regulations mentioned will have a large impact on our
+operations, the uncertainty regarding climate change regulation
+or legislation is a more challenging risk to manage.''
+ In Texas, companies such as Chevron, Dupont, and Total have
+described risks in their disclosure pertinent to the need for
+storm barrier protection for oil facilities.
+ Florida, Harris Corporation, with close to 17,000
+employees, is worried that their data centers will be affected
+as temperatures rise and they lose ``ambient cooling
+potential.''
+ On the supply chain front, Johnson and Johnson, based in
+New Jersey with 134,000 global employees, is worried about
+climate change, extreme weather disrupting not only demand for
+products, but disruptions in manufacturing and distribution
+networks of vital medicines, and afraid that it will affect the
+overall design and integrity of our products and operations.
+ Atlanta, Coca Cola, 90,000 companies, is worried about
+agricultural products, including sugar cane, corn, and citrus.
+Coca Cola has said, ``The affordability of our products and,
+ultimately, our business could be negatively impacted.''
+ In Nevada, even Caesar's Palace is not immune from climate
+change. Its parent has said they are virtually certain to see
+short-term increase in cost, due to a shortage of
+precipitation.
+ Even before the Paris Agreement, we were getting risks on
+supply chain. And if it wasn't from soup to nuts, it is soup to
+tomatoes. For example, Campbell's Soup cited water risks and
+climate change as very significant and of concern. And ConAgra
+has said, ``they have seen delayed tomato harvesting due to
+unseasonably cool weather.''
+ Dr. Pepper, of course, is worried about water. It is one of
+their main ingredients, and has said, ``A portion of our cost
+of sales, or $2.5 billion, could be at risk through increased
+costs to our supply chain.''
+ I could go on and on. I will not. I know my time is up, and
+I will be happy to answer any questions.
+ Thank you again.
+
+ [The prepared statement of Ms. DiPerna follows:]
+Prepared Statement of Paula DiPerna, Special Advisor, CDP North America
+ Thank you for the opportunity to testify here today on climate
+change and the recognition of its economic importance among businesses,
+investors, and consumers--all, of course, constituents. No doubt the
+CDP Platform has a touch point with all the states represented here on
+the Committee and I thank you for your service to the Nation.
+ A word about CDP: CDP-North America, formerly known as the Carbon
+Disclosure Project, is a non-profit organization that operates for the
+public good. Today, roughly 500 companies in the United States disclose
+to us and through us quantitative and qualitative information about
+their environmental performance and imperatives they perceive. Our
+annual request for this information is standardized and signed by
+roughly 550 institutional investors, asset owners and asset managers,
+our signatories, who represent over $94 trillion in cumulative assets,
+and most of the financial services sector of the world. They use our
+disclosure as a reference on corporate environmental performance,
+strategic advantages and vulnerabilities, and a gauge for making
+investment decisions.
+ The CDP disclosure platform also provides companies with
+information needed to benchmark to their peers, and we make this
+information available to the general public.
+ If you took a stroll through our data, in sum, you would find more
+than 15 years of evidence of the do-ability, desirability and necessity
+of addressing climate change, expressed by companies themselves, as
+well as evolving corporate, investor and consumer attitudes on the
+topic.
+ In short, we are the ``go to'' platform for companies to disclose
+how climate change is affecting their businesses. And what affects
+business affects average Americans directly--floods, power outages and
+disrupted supply chains means people can't get to work--who pays them
+for that time missed? Climate change is, in sum, a here and now issue
+that will hurt the poor and disenfranchised most of all.
+ A word about me: My resume is part of my written testimony but
+suffice it to say here that I have seen the climate change issue from
+360 degrees, from coral reefs to carbon markets, literally, having
+helped spearhead, with renowned economist Richard Sandor, the world's
+first integrated cap-and-trade system, the pioneering Chicago Climate
+Exchange, also known globally as CCX; as well as with oceans pioneer
+Jacques-Yves Cousteau to visit the first President Bush in the Oval
+Office and his Cabinet to discuss these issues, resulting in the United
+States signing the landmark Framework Convention on Climate Change, to
+which the United States remains a signatory even if the United States
+has pulled out of the Paris Agreement. This withdrawal has left the
+United States the only nation on Earth to stand outside the circle of
+consensus that climate change must be addressed, not only because of
+the risks it poses, but the extraordinary opportunities that addressing
+it represents as we redesign, retool, rebuild and refit almost all our
+critical infrastructure, generating jobs and helping the United States
+regain dominance of 21st century technological innovation and
+manufacturing. For example, in Maryland, Lockheed Martin Corporation,
+which has more than 590 facilities in 50 U.S. states and employs
+approximately 100,000 people worldwide, in our disclosure identified
+the use of lower-emission energy sources as a $21 billion opportunity.
+ The International Labour Organization (ILO) forecasts that ``24
+million new posts will be created globally by 2030,'' with the caveat
+that, ``the right policies to promote a greener economy must also be in
+place for this to happen, along with better social safety nets for
+workers.
+ Sometimes it is said that American companies are worried about
+regulation on climate change hurting business. On the contrary,
+companies are quite concerned about climate change itself, and what
+they do need, above all is the certainty level playing field
+established by public policy, especially as all the other nations in
+the world enact rules that could hamper the ability of a U.S. company
+to compete as they struggle to smooth out uneven legal and operational
+requirements across global operations.
+ I will share with you here a few examples of what key companies are
+doing or have disclosed about risks they face, and climate change
+related losses and costs they have incurred already. I refer you to my
+written testimony and CDP itself for further details and examples.
+ In Arizona and the Colorado River Basin, Arizona Pinnacle West
+Capital Corporation, which owns Arizona Public Services, with 6,300
+employees and serving 1.2 million customers, identified catastrophic
+fires as an enterprise top risk in 2017-2018, with a potential
+financial risk of over $50 million. The company said ``Risks associated
+with forest fires are not new, but scientists have indicated that as
+the global temperatures increase, there is a greater risk of drought
+and a correlated increase in risk and intensity of forest fires,'' they
+state. ``Forest fires could threaten not only communities that APS
+serves, but also our vast network (35,000+ miles) of electric
+transmission lines and facilities . . .. The potential threat is very
+real.''
+ In Connecticut: Stanley Black and Decker, employer of nearly 60,000
+Americans, stated, ``Climate change can have potentially devastating
+impacts on our supply chain should drought or flood occur.'' It
+estimated a potential loss of $118 million associated with supply chain
+disruption of primary materials and minerals used in their products
+from droughts in Chile and droughts and floods in Western Australia
+alone. SBD lists suppliers in USA, Israel, Brazin and Mexico as being
+potentially affected by drought.
+
+ In Ohio, American Electric Power Company, responsible for employing
+17,500 people, and serving 5 million customers across 11 states,
+including Texas, West Virginia, Louisiana, and Kentucky, has disclosed:
+
+ ``Climate change risk is considered a major and material issue
+ for AEP,'' adding ``AEP has invested to ensure its system is
+ reliable and resilient over more than a century. However, as
+ the generation fleet transitions to lower carbon and
+ intermittent resources and other infrastructure ages,
+ additional capital investment is needed for resiliency.
+ Additionally, public discourse about climate-related weather
+ events has also prompted public interest in resiliency
+ investment.'' And in 2017, about regulatory uncertainty, AEP
+ said, ``Additionally, in recent years, legal challenges to
+ almost every major EPA rulemaking have added additional
+ uncertainty and cost. This uncertainty can lead to uneconomic
+ decisions being made during the planning process as the
+ ultimate goals are subject to change. These uneconomic
+ decisions will lead to increased capital and operating costs.
+ While general environmental regulations mentioned above will
+ have a large impact on AEP operations, the uncertainty
+ regarding climate regulation or legislation is a more
+ challenging risk to manage.''
+
+ In Texas, companies such as Chevron, Dupont, and Total described
+risks in their CDP disclosure pertinent to the need for storm barrier
+protection for oil facilities.
+ In Florida, Jacksonville-based Harris Corporation, with close to
+17,000 employees, identifies increased severity of extreme weather
+events such as storms, cyclones and floods risks as a current and
+direct risk to its operations. Their disclosure states, ``For data
+centers, reduction in operational efficiency and increased component
+failure rates as increases in average temperatures and associated
+humidity will affect baseline design parameters. For example, the loss
+of ambient cooling potential. Changes in humidity may also lead to
+changes in patterns and rates of equipment corrosion. Higher humidity
+levels may also lead to new requirements to maintain internal
+environments within system tolerance ranges, as excess condensation can
+cause short-circuiting or water ingress.'' Harris also said it will,
+``expand the scope of events we consider in our planning to include
+more frequent and unusually disruptive storms in these locations, as
+well as the impacts of increased/more severe winter storms on our
+operations in the Midwest and Northeast.''
+ Also of general interest, in 2017, 96 companies disclosing to CDP
+disclosed that they have set an internal carbon price, indicating that
+they accept and understand that greenhouse gas emissions carry a hidden
+cost to their business which they seek to make visible using a
+projected surrogate cost, an internal carbon price. 245 companies have
+stated they would disclose their internal carbon pricing by 2019. And
+many companies using this internal mechanism indicate they do so
+because they wish to be better prepared for eventual regulation and/or
+are operating in a jurisdiction where they already face mandatory
+requirements, such as in the EU or in China.
+ Among the companies using an internal carbon is Oklahoma Gas and
+Electric, which employs 2,500 people and serves more than 800,000
+electricity customers. Citing opportunities ahead, OG&E also disclosed
+that it ``has leveraged its advantageous geographic position to develop
+renewable energy resources and completed transmission investments to
+deliver the renewable energy. The Southwest Power Pool (SPP) has begun
+to consider and authorize the construction of transmission lines
+capable of bringing renewable energy out of the wind resource area in
+western Oklahoma, the Texas Panhandle and western Kansas to load
+centers by planning for more transmission to be built in these areas.''
+ In fact, given the links between drought and water availability,
+and anticipated scarcities in predictable water supply, 88 companies
+have also begun using internal water prices to better gauge rising
+costs and risk.
+ Also, of general interest, far from denying the science of climate
+change, companies are bending over backward to establish reduction
+targets that are in line with the demand of climate change science on
+the scope and rate of emissions reductions, known as Science Based
+Targets or SBTIs. As of the end of 2018, 150 disclosing companies
+disclosed they had or were in the process of setting SBTs, as compared
+to 128 companies in 2017 and 88 in 2016.
+ With regard to disruption of supply chains due to extreme and
+unpredictable weather, some may question whether there is a direct link
+between changing climate and the increases in extreme or unpredictable
+weather we have been experiencing of late, but the preponderance of
+scientific evidence establishes a strong likelihood. Some examples of
+what companies anticipate follow:
+
+ Johnson and Johnson, headquartered in New Jersey and employing
+134,000 people, states ``changes to global climate, extreme weather and
+natural disasters could affect demand for our products and services,
+cause disruptions in manufacturing and distribution networks, alter the
+availability of goods and services within the supply chain, and affect
+the overall design and integrity of our products and operations.''
+ Michigan based GM, employing 180,000 people, has an ``active''
+crisis center that ``watches the weather 24/7'' and begins contacting
+suppliers when extreme weather events are forecasted, the system was
+partly developed in reaction to the Tohoku earthquake and the Thai
+floods in 2011. ``People felt pretty good because none of our
+production or manufacturing facilities were in the way,'' but those
+events impacted both GM's direct suppliers and the suppliers of its
+suppliers.
+ In Georgia, Atlanta-based Coca-Cola Company employs over 90,000
+Americans. Coke and its bottling partners use many key ingredients in
+the manufacture and packaging of their beverage products. that are
+derived from agricultural commodities such as sugarcane, corn, sugar
+beets, citrus, coffee and tea. Coca-Cola has stated, ``Increased demand
+for food products and decreased agricultural productivity in certain
+regions of the world as a result of changing weather patterns may limit
+the availability or increase the cost of such agricultural commodities
+and could impact the food security of communities around the world . .
+. the affordability of our products and ultimately our business and
+results of operations could be negatively impacted.''
+ In Nevada, even Caesar's Palace is not immune from climate change
+impacts. Its parent company, Caesar's Entertainment in Las Vegas,
+foresees increased operating costs as ``virtually certain'' in the
+short-term due to increasing temperatures and reduced precipitation in
+areas where water resources are more limited such as the U.S. southwest
+and their properties in Southern Africa and Egypt. Caesar spends
+``approximately $15 million per year on water utilities, a 10 percent
+increase in water prices due to increasing temperature causing water
+supply issues would represent a cost increase of up to $1.5m.'' Rising
+mean average temperature will impact Caesars supply chain. ``Caesars
+requires a steady stream of fresh produce and other food sources to
+stock our restaurants and kitchens. Our supply chain has been impacted
+by temperature fluctuations that have cause us to source from
+alternative suppliers. The relative magnitude has thus far been low on
+our total business operations. However, if enough suppliers face major
+climate related impacts the future magnitude could be substantial.''
+ In fact, this very day in Las Vegas, we are conveying a conference
+on protecting supply chains and other related issues in Las Vegas co-
+sponsored by Caesar's, to be attended by concerned large procurement
+entities as Walmart, Los Angeles Department of Water and Power, Johnson
+& Johnson and JBS, a $28 billion meat packaging and distribution
+company with 78,000 employees or so.
+ With regard to supply chain disruption, the source of risk is
+eclectic and widespread, and many U.S. companies have acknowledged this
+likelihood as credible for some time.
+ For example, as early as 2014, the year before the Paris Agreement
+was signed, we issued a report specifically focused on these
+disruptions and risks cited literally ranged if not from soup to nuts,
+soup to tomatoes.
+ For example, Campbell's Soup cited water risks and climate change
+for all its products due to threats to agriculture and Con Agra told us
+literally, ``we have experienced weather-related sourcing challenges,
+such as delayed tomato harvesting due to unseasonably cool weather.''
+ Gap and the VF Corporation told us that both drought and its
+opposite, increased precipitation, had reduced cotton production in
+India and China, and were contributing factors in the rise of global
+product prices.
+ Sears, ill-fated, told us as early as 2011 that it faced more than
+$14 million in expenses just from repairing and replacing buildings and
+goods that were the direct or indirect result of extreme weather, as
+well as another $8.7 million due to flood damage that year alone.
+ Dr. Pepper Snapple Group said, ``water is the main ingredient in
+substantially all of our products and climate change may cause water
+scarcity and a deterioration of water in areas where we maintain
+operations . . . a portion of our cost of sales, or $2.5 billion, could
+be at risk through increased costs to our supply chain.'' Concerns
+about water issues laced through the disclosures of Pepsi Co and other
+beverage companies as well.
+ And, after Superstorm Sandy in the New York area, the venerable
+utility Con Edison reported that the costs of restoration in just two
+counties, Orange and Rockland, were $431 million and $90 million
+respectively.
+ Obviously, events such as these affect the lives of people directly
+in myriad ways we have seen, from blackouts to hospital patients having
+to be evacuated in their beds to costs passed on to consumers, loss of
+work days, etc.
+ As to investors and the capital markets, of substantial recent
+note, Moody's, which by its own wording ``strives to be the rating
+agency of choice,'' issued just recently in January this year its
+General Principles for Assessing Environmental, Social and Governance
+Risks, to better inform its users in this evolving field cited the
+bankruptcy filing by PG&E, which employs 20,000 people, related to the
+catastrophic forest fires in California. Moody's said ``. . .From a
+climate-related time horizon perspective, it could [also] be argued
+that the effects of climate change crystallized into event risk more
+rapidly than PG&E expected, adding, ``We highlighted this in 2018, when
+we noted that `long term climate change risks like droughts and
+wildfires are manifesting faster than regulators and legislators can
+react to protect [PG&E] from exposure.' ''
+ Also just last month, Standard and Poor's ratings stated, ``we
+lowered our credit rating on Edison International and its subsidiary
+Southern California Edison . . . and placed all of our ratings on the
+companies on Creditwatch with negative implications'' which ``reflects
+the increased likelihood that Edison will continue to experience
+catastrophic wildfires due to climate change.'' S&P similarly
+downgraded San Diego Gas and Electric Company, for the same reasons.
+Subsequently, Fitch Ratings also revised its rating outlook for Edison
+International, from stable to negative adding ``given the unprecedented
+size of recent wildfires, future multi-notch downgrades cannot be ruled
+out.''
+ These credit ratings changes may seem far from the American people,
+but in fact they reflect a drain on financial stability and borrowing
+power of key employers and infrastructure providers, not so much linked
+to the longer term impact climate change but the here and now impact of
+related unpredictable and extreme weather events--causing hardship and
+heartbreak for the ordinary Americans who suffer loss of life and
+property.
+ Yet, on the other hand, recognizing that addressing climate change
+is essential to long term financial value creation, mainstream
+investors are also recognizing the significant upside of shifting
+capital to companies that take environmental and social factors into
+strategic account in their business management. According to the
+Sustainable Investment Forum of the United States, for example, which
+tracks relevant data:
+
+ ``Sustainable, responsible and impact (SRI) investing in the
+ United States continues to expand at a healthy pace. The total
+ U.S.-domiciled assets under management using SRI strategies
+ grew from $8.7 trillion at the start of 2016 to $12.0 trillion
+ at the start of 2018, an increase of 38 percent. This
+ represents 26 percent--or 1 in 4 dollars--of the $46.6 trillion
+ in total U.S. assets under professional management.''
+
+ And, in a basic core indication of how integrated low carbon
+efficiency has become, the S&P 500 carbon efficient index, which
+overweights carbon efficient companies and underweights carbon
+intensive companies, is now tracking virtually to a T with the
+venerable classic S&P500, an alignment that indicates if nothing else
+that it does not cost mainstream companies or their shareholders, if
+low carbon intensity and energy efficiency are prioritized. On the
+contrary.
+ And as for constituents and consumer preferences, CDP disclosure
+can also shed light.
+ Minnesota headquartered Best Buy reported that by promoting ENERGY
+STAR certified products, Best Buy U.S. helped its customers realize
+utility bill savings of more than U.S. $45 million in 2018. ENERGY STAR
+is a response to the increased demand for low-carbon products.
+ And Ohio-based American Electric Power Company states: ``AEP has
+increasingly seen customers look to deploy low or no-carbon generation
+resources as a means of supplanting, replacing, or offsetting
+electricity provided by AEP. AEP is actively pursuing deploying
+utility-scale and community scale distributed resources which provide
+our customers with a more cost-effective solution in utilizing low and
+no-carbon energy.''
+ PepsiCo says: ``Any negative perception (whether valid or not) of
+PepsiCo's response to climate change or water scarcity could result in
+adverse publicity and could adversely affect PepsiCo's business,
+financial condition or results of operations. Changes in consumer
+preference, for example, due to a negative reaction to PepsiCo's
+reputation relative to the environment could adversely affect PepsiCo's
+business, for example, a 1-percent impact on PEP's market value
+(defined as our market capitalization) would equate to $1.6 billion.''
+ I could go on and on, but will not. In sum, climate change is
+present and costly to companies and average Americans, and the United
+States has made itself more vulnerable, not less. Thank you and I will
+be glad to answer any questions.
+
+ ______
+
+
+ The Chairman. Thank you very much.
+ Reverend Yearwood, the floor is yours, sir.
+
+ STATEMENT OF LENNOX YEARWOOD, JR., PRESIDENT AND CEO, HIP HOP
+ CAUCUS, WASHINGTON, DC
+
+ Rev. Yearwood. Thank you to Chairman Grijalva and the
+entire Committee for having me here today. And thank you to the
+other panelists for your commitment to solving climate change.
+I especially love Zero Hour and UPROSE.
+ My name is Reverend Lennox Yearwood, Jr. I am the President
+and CEO of the Hip Hop Caucus. And all of you, Republicans and
+Democrats, are invited to be part of the Hip Hop Caucus--a
+little joke there to start off the testimony.
+ [Laughter.]
+ Rev. Yearwood. But let me get right to it. As Americans, we
+face challenges head on. Climate change is not a Democrat issue
+or a Republican issue; it is a human issue. This crisis is
+complex. It impacts all of us and future generations, and those
+with the least resources are impacted first and worst. But we
+know how to solve this crisis. We must make a just transition
+off of fossil fuels to a 100 percent clean, renewable energy
+economy that works for all.
+ Many communities, cities and states across our country, are
+leading the way on climate solutions. I urge every member of
+this Committee to visit places and people who have gone through
+climate disasters, and visit communities, projects, and
+businesses that are implementing clean energy and climate
+solutions. When you visit these communities, it will become
+very clear that climate change is a civil and human rights
+issue.
+ In 1960, four African-American college students sat at the
+Woolworth's lunch counter in Greensboro, North Carolina to
+desegregate the South. They were courageous beyond belief in
+standing up for equality. Today, young people like Nadia across
+the table from me and across this country are courageously
+standing up not only for equality, but for our existence.
+Climate change is our lunch counter moment for the 21st
+century.
+ Young people are organizing, marching, and coalition-
+building, and they are leading the call for solutions like a
+Green New Deal. They are doing it because they know that the
+science on climate change is undeniable. But also because, like
+all of us here today, they have watched as people have died in
+Hurricanes Harvey, Maria, Irma, Katrina, and Superstorm Sandy.
+They have seen the families who have lost everything to fires
+that have ripped across the West. They have been part of
+peaceful movements opposing fossil fuel developments led by
+Lakota people at Standing Rock and the Gwich'in people in the
+Arctic Refuge.
+ So, the question is what are you, as members of this
+Committee, going to do? It is my prayer that you call up at
+least as much courage as young people standing up around the
+country, and that you act now, and you act boldly and
+courageously. If this Committee and bold chambers of Congress
+don't urgently come together, put the people of this country
+first, put God first, and put your political party to the side
+to solve climate change, we don't make it beyond 12 years from
+now without huge amounts of death, destruction, and suffering.
+ As an officer in the U.S. Air Force Reserve Chaplain Corps,
+I had to ponder the unique relationship between military and
+faith. In the military we need our faith, not only to
+strengthen us in battle, but we need our faith to guide us to
+do what is right. We need you to use your faith to guide you to
+do what is right.
+ If you are approaching climate change as a partisan,
+political issue, your faith is leading you astray. We, the
+American people, need you to have courage to do what is right.
+It is your courage that can put our country and the world on
+the path of solving climate change.
+ In the words of Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr., ``We must
+learn to live together as brothers or perish together as
+fools.''
+ Thank you, and may God be with you and with us all.
+
+ [The prepared statement of Rev. Yearwood follows:]
+ Prepared Statement of Rev. Lennox Yearwood Jr., President & CEO, Hip
+ Hop Caucus
+ Thank you to Chairman Grijalva and the entire Committee for having
+me here today.
+ And thank you to the other panelists for your commitment to solving
+climate change.
+ My name is Rev. Lennox Yearwood Jr. I am the President and CEO of
+Hip Hop Caucus.
+ As Americans we face challenges head on. Climate change is not a
+Democrat issue or a Republican issue. It is a human issue, and
+therefore, we must look to God and our faith to guide us.
+ This crisis is complex. It impacts all of us and future
+generations, and it's those with the least resources that are and will
+continue to be impacted first and worst.
+ But we know how to solve this crisis. We must transition off of
+fossil fuels to a just 100 percent clean energy economy that works for
+all.
+ Many communities, cities, and states across our country are leading
+the way on climate solutions. I urge every member of this Committee, if
+you have not yet, to visit places and people who have gone through
+climate disasters, and to visit communities, projects, and businesses
+that are implementing clean energy and climate solutions.
+ The fossil fuel industry receives billions of dollars of taxpayer
+subsidies. You are subsidizing an industry that is killing Americans
+with their pollution and climate disasters. Further, the Trump
+administration's attacks on basic public health and environmental
+safeguards mean even more death sentences, particularly for the poor.
+Clean air, clean water, and solving climate change are inextricably
+linked.
+ In 1960 four college students sat at the Woolworth's lunch counter
+in Greensboro, North Carolina to desegregate the south. They were
+courageous beyond belief in standing up for equality.
+ Climate Change is our lunch counter moment for the 21st century.
+ Today, like those brave students, young people across this country
+are courageously standing up not only for equality, but for our
+existence. Young people are organizing, marching, and coalition
+building, and they are calling for a Green New Deal.
+ And they are doing it because they know that the science on climate
+change is undeniable. But also because, like all of us here today, they
+have watched as people died in Hurricanes Harvey, Maria, Irma, Katrina,
+and in Superstorm Sandy. They have seen the families who have lost
+everything to fires that have ripped across the West. They have been a
+part of the peaceful movements opposing fossil fuel developments led by
+the Lakota people at Standing Rock and the Gwich'in people in the
+Arctic Refuge.
+ The question is, what are you, as members of this Committee, going
+to do? It is my prayer that you call-up at least as much courage as the
+young people standing up around the country, and that you act, you act
+now, and you act boldly and courageously.
+ We do not make it beyond 12 years from now without huge amounts of
+death, destruction, and suffering, if this Committee, and both chambers
+of Congress don't urgently come together, putting the people of this
+country first, putting God first, and putting your political party to
+the side, to solve climate change.
+ As an officer in the U.S. Air Force Reserve Chaplain Corps, I had
+to ponder the unique the relationship between military and faith. What
+I realized is that in the military we need our faith not only to
+strengthen us in battle, but we need our faith to guide us to always do
+what is right.
+ We need you to use your faith to guide you to do what is right. If
+you are approaching climate change as a partisan, political issue, your
+faith is leading you astray. We, the American people, need you to have
+the courage to do what is right. It is your courage that can put our
+country and the world on the path to solving climate change.
+ May God be with you. Thank you and God bless.
+
+ ______
+
+
+ The Chairman. Thank you.
+ Mr. Hollie, the floor is yours, sir.
+
+ STATEMENT OF DERRICK HOLLIE, PRESIDENT, REACHING AMERICA,
+ BENNSVILLE, MARYLAND
+
+ Mr. Hollie. Greetings, Chairman and members of the
+Committee. Thank you for the opportunity to speak. My name is
+Derrick Hollie, President of Reaching America, an organization
+I developed to address complex social issues that are impacting
+the African-American community.
+ We are focused on solutions not based on right- or left-
+wing views, but what makes sense for a more united America. One
+of the issues that we do the most work on is addressing and
+reducing energy poverty.
+ What is energy poverty? Energy poverty exists when low-
+income families or individuals spend upwards of 30 percent of
+their total income on their electric bill. And when that
+happens, it puts people in tough situations and having to make
+tough choices, like do I eat today, or do I pay the electric
+bill? Do I get this prescription filled, or do I fill up my gas
+tank? I can't even give the kids a couple of dollars today
+because I have to pay the electric bill.
+ And for many Americans, particularly in the minority
+community, we face these challenges every single day. And the
+African-American community, we don't have the luxury to pay
+more for green technologies. We need access to affordable
+energy to help heat our homes, power our stoves, and get back
+and forth to work.
+ And through Reaching America, I have had the opportunity to
+reach and talk to thousands of African-Americans who all talk
+about one thing: the question of rising costs of energy, along
+with the fees and subsidies that they have to pay that they
+don't benefit from, and how they struggle to keep up with it.
+ My passion for energy is deeply rooted. When I first
+graduated from college, I worked for Norfolk Southern Railroad
+as a brakeman. And I can couple the cars, I could switch the
+tracks, I knew how to tighten up the brakes and everything. I
+worked at Lamberts Point in Norfolk, Virginia. Our job and
+responsibility was loading coal ships that transported coal all
+around the world. So, I have always asked myself the question.
+If our natural resources are good enough for other countries,
+then why is it not good enough for us right here at home?
+ And in addition to that, my grandfather was a black coal
+miner in southwest Virginia. So, it is safe to say if it wasn't
+for the energy industry, I wouldn't be here to talk to you all
+today.
+ When the government creates policies, its first priority
+should be the welfare of the people, especially those impacted
+the hardest, rather than big business and special interest
+groups looking for a handout.
+ I am also a member of Project 21, a national black
+leadership organization. And in our blueprint for A Better Deal
+for Black America, we focus on 10 key areas for reform,
+including minority impact assessments for new regulations. This
+would be a major step toward increasing economic opportunities
+and having input from governors and community leaders, much the
+same way that qualified opportunity zones were developed and
+will create a level of trust in communities that never existed
+before.
+ After all, the government requires environmental impact
+studies and statements to estimate the effects of projects like
+roads and buildings on nature. Shouldn't the government act
+similarly when it comes to how regulations impact the
+population, or a particular market segment?
+ A minority impact assessment would create a list of all
+positive, all negative impacts a proposed regulation would
+have, and the factors including employment, wages, consumer
+prices, home ownership, job creation, et cetera. The regulatory
+impact would then be analyzed for its effect on minorities, in
+contrast to the general population.
+ The bottom line: any policy that contributes to energy
+poverty is a bad one for low income and minority communities.
+ Fortunately, our Nation has an abundant supply of natural
+gas that is the solution to our Nation's energy questions.
+ Recent polar vortex temperatures last week dropped so low
+in some areas that windmills couldn't even turn. We have to
+have a Plan B. Natural gas is clean. The U.S. Energy
+Information Administration reports that almost two-thirds of
+the CO2 emissions from 2006 through 2014 came from
+the fuel shifting toward natural gas.
+ Natural gas is reliable. It is efficient. And it meets the
+needs of our Nation's grid. And natural gas is also affordable.
+And for many Americans, this allows them not to have to choose
+to keep the lights on or feed their families.
+ In closing, I am all for protecting the environment. I am a
+licensed captain, had the opportunity to take my boat to
+Florida and back, and the coastal waterways are beautiful. So,
+I am all for the environment. However, until we figure out a
+way to harness the sun and the wind to sustain ourselves, we
+need to use what we have, especially if it could lower energy
+costs, create jobs, and boost the economy.
+ That is my time. Thank you.
+
+ [The prepared statement of Mr. Hollie follows:]
+ Prepared Statement of Derrick Hollie, President, Reaching America
+ Greetings Chairman Grijalva, Ranking Member Bishop and members of
+the Committee. Thank you for this opportunity to speak.
+ I'm Derrick Hollie, president of Reaching America, an education and
+policy organization I developed to address complex social issues
+impacting African American communities.
+ We're focused on solutions not based on right- or left-wing views
+but what makes sense for a more united America.
+ One of the issues Reaching America does the most work on is
+reducing energy poverty across the board.
+ Energy Poverty exists when low income families or individuals spend
+up to 30 percent of their total income on their electric bill. And when
+this happens, people have to make tough choices like, do I eat today or
+pay the electric bill? Do I get this prescription filled or fill up my
+car with gas? We all know someone who faces these choices every month.
+ For members of the African American community, Energy Poverty is a
+reality. Members of our community don't have the luxury to pay more for
+green technologies. We need access to affordable energy to help heat
+our homes, power our stoves and get back and forth to work each day.
+ Through Reaching America I've had the opportunity to speak with
+thousands of African Americans in several states who question the
+rising cost of energy along with fees and subsidies they don't benefit
+from and how they struggle to keep up.
+ My passion for energy is deeply rooted, after graduating from
+college I worked as brakeman for Norfolk Southern Railways at Lambert's
+Point in Norfolk, Virginia. Our job and responsibilities was loading
+coal ships that transported coal all around the world and I constantly
+ask the question, ``If our coal and natural resources are good enough
+for other countries--why is not good enough for us here at home. My
+grandfather was also a black coal miner in southwest Virginia. It's
+safe to say if it weren't for the energy industry, I wouldn't be here
+to speak with all of you today.
+ When the government creates policy, its first priority should be
+the welfare of the people, especially those impacted the hardest,
+rather than big businesses and special interests looking for a handout.
+ I'm also a member of Project 21, a National Black Leadership
+Organization. In our Blueprint for A Better Deal for Black America we
+focus on 10 key areas for reform including ``Minority Impact
+Assessments'' for new regulations. This would be a major step toward
+increasing economic opportunities. And having input from governors and
+community leaders the same way ``Qualified Opportunity Zones'' were
+created will establish a level of trust in communities that never
+existed before.
+ After all, the government requires environmental impact statements
+to estimate the effects of projects like roads and buildings on nature.
+Shouldn't the government act similarly when it comes to how regulations
+impact the population?
+ A minority impact assessment would create a list of all the
+positive and negative impacts a proposed regulation would have on
+factors including employment, wages, consumer prices and homeownership.
+This regulatory impact would then be analyzed for its effect on
+minorities in contrast to the general population.
+ The bottom line: any policy that contributes to energy poverty is a
+bad one for low income families and minority communities.
+ Fortunately, our Nation has an abundant supply of natural gas that
+is a solution to our Nation's energy questions. Recent polar vortex
+temperatures dropped so low in some areas that windmills couldn't turn.
+We need a plan B.
+ Natural gas is clean. The U.S. Energy Information Administration
+reports that almost two-thirds of the CO2 emission
+reductions from 2006-2014 came from the fuel shifting toward natural
+gas.
+ Natural gas is also reliable. Natural gas generation efficiently
+meets the needs of our Nation's energy grid.
+ And natural gas is affordable. For many Americans, this allows them
+to not have to choose whether to keep the lights on or feed their
+families.
+ In closing, I'm all for protecting the environment and clean energy
+however until we have figure out a way to harness the sun, wind and
+water to sustain ourselves, we need to use what we have especially if
+it can lower energy cost, create jobs and boost the economy.
+
+ ______
+
+
+Questions Submitted for the Record by Rep. Hice to Mr. Derrick Hollie,
+ President, Reaching America
+ Question 1. Mr. Hollie, I represent the 10th District of Georgia,
+much of which is extremely rural. Now when I say ``rural'' different
+people get different things in their heads, so let me explain. When I
+say ``rural'' that means that in some parts of my district my
+constituents have to park at the Chick-fil-A to let the kids sit in the
+car to get WiFi to do their homework. When I say ``rural'' that means
+in other parts of my district my constituents have to drive to an
+entirely different county to get to a grocery store.
+
+ So, I was struck by a remark you made in your testimony that,
+``When the government creates policy, its first priority should be the
+welfare of the people, especially those impacted the hardest . . .''
+
+ You would agree then that if policies like the Green New Deal
+encourage energy poverty for rural, low income, and minority
+communities that we need to immediately hit the pause button on those
+ideas? And why would that be a prudent step?
+
+ Answer. That's the essence of the Minority Impact Assessment.
+Before a regulation is enacted, it should go through a process to see
+how it might specifically impact certain populations. Before a Green
+New Deal proposal to phase out the combustion engine in favor of
+electric vehicles is enacted, for example, it should be seen if this is
+feasible for specific communities. Can people in GA 10 afford a Telsa?
+What costs will come to the district to put electric car charging
+stations ``everywhere'' as prescribed by the Green New Deal FAQ? Can an
+electric car do the things that people in GA 10 need a vehicle to do
+(i.e. rural jobs)? The Minority Impact Assessment acts as a ``cooling
+saucer'' to prevent regulations from imposing unrealistic expectations
+on specific people and communities.
+
+ Question 2. One of the main reasons many of our founders supported
+federalism was because it provided for ``laboratories of
+experimentation'' \1\ and regulatory diversity. What works best for
+some parts of the country does not necessarily work best for other
+areas. In my home state, we have almost completed two of the first
+nuclear reactors to be built in roughly 50 years at Plant Vogtle.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ \1\ New State Ice Co. v. Liebmann, SCOTUS, 1932.
+
+ Georgia has also been a leader in other clean energy sources like
+solar and hydro energy production. Plant Vogtle works hand in glove
+with other clean energy technologies. And nuclear will continue to
+provide cheap, clean energy when the sun is not shining or to refill
+the reservoir overnight at clean pumped-storage hydroelectric plants
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+like our Rocky Mountain facility.
+
+ But the Green New Deal would ban nuclear energy--which would
+effectively harm rural and low-income communities in my district and
+state. Mr. Hollie, how might your proposed Minority Impact Assessment
+prevent laws or regulations from banning affordable energy solutions
+for these communities?
+
+ Answer. The Minority Impact Assessment would look at proposed
+regulation to ensure that it does not have a disparate impact on
+minority communities by affecting factors such as income, home prices,
+access to jobs and quality of life issues. Losing affordable, reliable
+and efficient power for a source that increases energy costs and breeds
+energy poverty does not make sense. The Minority Impact Assessment will
+identify these disparities--if Congress acts to instate Minority Impact
+Assessment requirements.
+
+ Question 3. Mr. Hollie, one last question for you. The Green New
+Deal would ban most private cars to be replaced with ``high-quality and
+modern mass transit.'' Mr. Hollie, if you lived in a county that didn't
+even have a grocery store and you needed your personal transportation
+to get food for your family, does it sound like the Green New Deal is a
+policy designed to help rural, low income, and minority communities, or
+a policy designed for the milieu--the wealthy and cultural elite?
+
+ Answer. I can't image using public transit to do the grocery
+shopping for my family in the bustling suburbs of Washington, DC area
+much less rural Georgia. For many people, a car or truck is freedom.
+Freedom to pursue the employment best for them. Freedom to associate
+with family, friends and like-minded people. Freedom to shop next door,
+across town or across county or state lines. There is also a potential
+limitation on freedom that comes with relying on a government entity to
+take you from point A to point B. Too often policy is presented that
+does not represent what's best for the people who are impact the
+hardest. The Green New Deal calls for environmental impact studies and
+I would highly urge Congress to also include Minority Impact
+Assessments.
+
+
+ ______
+
+
+ The Chairman. Thank you very much.
+ Dr. Curry.
+
+ STATEMENT OF JUDITH A. CURRY, PRESIDENT, CLIMATE FORECAST
+ APPLICATIONS NETWORK, RENO, NEVADA
+
+ Dr. Curry. I thank the Chairman, the Ranking Member, and
+the Committee for the opportunity to offer testimony today.
+ I am concerned that both the climate change problem and its
+solution have been vastly over-simplified. This over-
+simplification has led to politicized scientific debates and
+policy gridlock. My testimony is presented today in the spirit
+of acknowledging the complexity of the problem, and proposing
+pragmatic ideas that can break the gridlock.
+ Climate scientists have made a forceful argument for a
+future threat from climate change. Man-made climate change is a
+theory whose basic mechanism is well understood, but the
+potential magnitude is highly uncertain.
+ If climate change were a simple, tame problem, everyone
+would agree on the solution. Because of the complexities of the
+climate system and its societal impacts, solutions may have
+surprising unintended consequences that generate new
+vulnerabilities. In short, the cure could be worse than the
+disease. Given these complexities, there is plenty of scope for
+reasonable and intelligent people to disagree.
+ Based on current assessments of the science, man-made
+climate change is not an existential threat on the timescale of
+the 21st century, even in its most alarming incarnation.
+However, the perception of a near-term apocalypse and alignment
+with a range of other social objectives has narrowed the policy
+options that we are willing to consider.
+ In evaluating the urgency of emissions reductions, we need
+to be realistic about what this will actually accomplish.
+Global CO2 concentrations will not be reduced if
+emissions in China and India continue to increase. If we
+believe the climate models, any changes in extreme weather
+events would not be evident until late in the 21st century. And
+the greatest impacts will be felt in the 22nd century and
+beyond.
+ People prefer clean over dirty energy, provided that the
+energy source is reliable, secure, and economical. However, it
+is misguided to assume that current wind and solar technologies
+are adequate for powering an advanced economy. The recent
+record-breaking cold outbreak in the Midwest is a stark
+reminder of the challenges of providing a reliable power supply
+in the face of extreme weather events.
+ With regards to energy policy and its role in reducing
+emissions, there are currently two options in play. Option
+Number 1: do nothing, continue with the status quo. Or, Option
+Number 2: rapidly deploy wind and solar power plants with the
+goal of eliminating fossil fuels in one to two decades.
+ Apart from the gridlock engendered by considering only
+these two options, in my opinion, neither gets us where we want
+to go. A third option is to re-imagine the 21st century
+electric power systems with new technologies that improve
+energy security, reliability, and cost, while at the same time
+minimizing environmental impacts.
+ However, this strategy requires substantial research
+development and experimentation. Acting urgently on emissions
+reduction by deploying 20th century technologies could turn out
+to be the enemy of a better long-term solution.
+ Since reducing emissions is not expected to change the
+climate in a meaningful way until late in the 21st century,
+adaptation strategies are receiving increasing attention. The
+extreme damages from recent hurricanes, plus the billion-dollar
+losses from floods, droughts, and wildfires emphasize the
+vulnerability of the United States to extreme events. But it is
+easy to forget that U.S. extreme weather events were actually
+worse in the 1930s and 1950s.
+ Regions that find solutions to current impacts of extreme
+weather and climate events will be better prepared to cope with
+any additional stresses from climate change, and to address
+near-term social justice objectives.
+ The industry leaders that I engage with seem hungry for a
+bipartisan, pragmatic approach to climate policy. I see a
+window of opportunity to change the framework for how we
+approach this. Bipartisan support seems feasible for pragmatic
+efforts to accelerate energy innovation, build resilience to
+extreme weather events, pursue no-regrets pollution reduction
+measures, and better land use practices.
+ Each of these efforts has justifications independent of
+their benefits for climate change. These efforts provide the
+basis of a climate policy that addresses both near term
+economic and social justice concerns, and also the longer term
+goals of mitigation.
+ This ends my testimony. Thank you.
+
+ [The prepared statement of Dr. Curry follows:]
+ Prepared Statement of Judith A. Curry, President, Climate Forecast
+ Applications Network
+ I thank the Chairman, Ranking Member and the Committee for the
+opportunity to offer testimony today on `Climate Change: The Impacts
+and the Need to Act.' I am President of Climate Forecast Applications
+Network (CFAN) and Professor Emerita and former Chair of the School of
+Earth and Atmospheric Sciences at the Georgia Institute of Technology.
+I have devoted four decades to conducting research on a variety of
+topics related to weather and climate.
+ By engaging with decision makers in both the private and public
+sectors on issues related to weather and climate, I have learned about
+the complexity of different decisions that depend, at least in part, on
+weather and climate information. I have learned the importance of
+careful determination and conveyance of the uncertainty associated with
+our scientific understanding and particularly for predictions. I have
+found that the worst outcome for decision makers is a scientific
+conclusion or forecast issued with a high level of confidence that
+turns out to be wrong.
+ I am increasingly concerned that both the climate change problem
+and its solution have been vastly oversimplified.\1\ For the past
+decade, I have been promoting dialogue across the full spectrum of
+understanding and opinion on the climate debate through my blog Climate
+Etc. (judithcurry.com). I have learned about the complex reasons that
+intelligent, educated and well-informed people disagree on the subject
+of climate change, as well as tactics used by both sides to try to gain
+a political advantage in the debate.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ \1\ Curry, JA and Webster PJ, 2011: Climate science and the
+uncertainty monster. Bull. Amer. Meteorol. Soc., 92, 1667-1682. http://
+journals.ametsoc.org/doi/pdf/10.1175/2011BAMS3139.1.
+
+ With this perspective, my testimony focuses on the following issues
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+of central relevance to climate change, its impacts and need to act:
+
+ The climate knowledge gap
+
+ The climate change response challenge
+
+ The urgency (?) of CO2 emissions reductions
+
+ Resilience, anti-fragility and thrivability
+
+ Moving forward with pragmatic climate change policies
+
+ the climate knowledge gap
+ Climate scientists have made a forceful argument for a future
+threat from man-made climate change. Man-made climate change is a
+theory in which the basic mechanism is well understood, but the
+potential magnitude is highly uncertain. Scientists agree that surface
+temperatures have increased overall since 1880, humans are adding
+carbon dioxide to the atmosphere, and carbon dioxide and other
+greenhouse gases have a warming effect on the planet.
+ However, there is considerable disagreement about the most
+consequential issues: whether the recent warming has been dominated by
+human causes versus natural variability, how much the planet will warm
+in the 21st century, whether warming is `dangerous', and whether
+radically reducing carbon dioxide (CO2) emissions will
+improve the climate and human well-being in the 21st century.
+ The scientific conflict regarding the theory of man-made climate
+change is over the level of our ignorance regarding what is unknown
+about natural climate variability. Why do climate scientists disagree
+on the relative importance of natural versus man-made climate change?
+The historical data is sparse and inadequate. There is disagreement
+about the value of different classes of evidence, notably the value of
+global climate model simulations and paleoclimate reconstructions from
+geologic data. There is disagreement about the appropriate logical
+framework for linking and assessing the evidence in this complex
+problem.\2\ Further, politicization of the science and the consensus
+building process itself can be a source of bias.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ \2\ Curry, JA, (2011). Reasoning about climate uncertainty, https:/
+/link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s10584-011-0180-z.
+
+ Apart from these broad sources of disagreement, there are two
+sources of misconception and uncertainty that are of particular
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+relevance to climate policy making:
+
+ Projections of 21st century climate change
+
+ Linking extreme weather events to man-made climate change
+
+ With regards to projections of 21st century climate change,
+Sections 11.3.1.1 and 12.2.3 of the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate
+Change (IPCC) 5th Assessment Report (AR5) describe uncertainties in the
+climate model-based projections. Climate models consistently indicate
+that the mean global temperature of the planet will rise with
+increasing CO2 emissions. However, these models show
+systematic errors in the simulated global mean temperature that are
+similar in magnitude to the size of the historical change we are
+seeking to understand.\3\ The likely \4\ range of estimates of the
+sensitivity of global warming to doubling of CO2 as reported
+by the IPCC AR5 varies by a factor of 3, from 1.5 to 4.5+C.\5\ Apart
+from uncertainties in climate model projections that focus primarily on
+the impact of increases in greenhouse gases, we do not have sufficient
+understanding to project future solar variations, future volcanic
+eruptions, and decadal to century variations in ocean circulations.
+Finally, existing climate models are unable to simulate realistically
+possible extreme outcomes, such as abrupt climate change or a rapid
+disintegration of the West Antarctic Ice Sheet. Hence global climate
+models provide little relevant information regarding very unlikely but
+potentially catastrophic impacts--whether caused by man-made climate
+forcing or natural processes or some combination.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ \3\ Mauritsen et al., (2012). Tuning the climate of a global model,
+https://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1029/2012MS000154.
+ \4\ >66% probability.
+ \5\ IPCC AR5 WG1 Report, https://www.ipcc.ch/report/ar5/wg1/.
+
+ Among the greatest concerns about climate change are its impacts on
+extreme events such floods, droughts, heat waves, wildfires and
+hurricanes. However, there is little evidence that the recent warming
+has worsened such events. The IPCC Special Report on Extreme Events \6\
+acknowledges that there is not yet evidence of changes in the global
+frequency or intensity of hurricanes, droughts, floods or wildfires.
+The recent Climate Science Special Report from the Fourth National
+Climate Assessment (NCA4) \7\ reported the following conclusions abut
+extreme events and climate change:
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ \6\ IPCC Special Report on Extreme Events, http://www.ipcc.ch/
+report/srex/.
+ \7\ 4th National Climate Assessment, Vol 1, https://
+www.globalchange.gov/nca4.
+
+ ``Recent droughts and associated heat waves have reached
+ record intensity in some regions of the United States;
+ however, the Dust Bowl era of the 1930s remains the
+ benchmark drought and extreme heat event in the historical
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ record.'' [Ch. 6]
+
+ ``Detectable changes in some classes of flood frequency
+ have occurred in parts of the United States and are a mix
+ of increases and decreases. Extreme precipitation is
+ observed to have generally increased. However, formal
+ attribution approaches have not established a significant
+ connection of increased riverine flooding to human-induced
+ climate change.'' [Ch. 8]
+
+ ``State-level fire data over the 20th century indicates
+ that area burned in the western United States decreased
+ from 1916 to about 1940, was at low levels until the 1970s,
+ then increased into the more recent period.'' [Ch. 8]
+
+ ``[T]here is still low confidence that any reported long-
+ term increases in [hurricane] activity are robust, after
+ accounting for past changes in observing capabilities'' [Ch
+ 9]
+
+ With regards to the perception (and damage statistics) that severe
+weather events seem more frequent and more severe over the past decade,
+there are several factors in play. The first is the increasing
+vulnerability and exposure associated with increasing concentration of
+wealth in coastal and other disaster-prone regions. The second factor
+is natural climate variability. Many extreme weather events have
+documented relationships with natural climate variability; in the
+United States, extreme weather events (e.g. droughts, heat waves and
+hurricanes) were significantly worse in the 1930s and 1950s.\8\
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ \8\ Curry, JA, 2014. Senate EPW testimony, http://judithcurry.com/
+2014/01/16/senate-epw-hearing-on-the-presidents-climate-action-plan/.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ While climate models predict changes in extreme weather events with
+future warming, the time of emergence of any man-made signal relative
+to the large natural variability in extreme weather events is not
+expected to be evident until late in the 21st century, even for the
+most aggressive scenarios of future warming.
+
+ When considering the predictions of additional climate change
+impacts in the NCA4, pay attention to the confidence level ascribed to
+their conclusions. The NCA4 defines the confidence levels as follows:
+
+ ``Low: Inconclusive evidence (limited sources
+ extrapolations, inconsistent findings, poor documentation
+ and/or methods not tested, etc.), disagreement or lack of
+ opinions among experts.''
+
+ ``Medium: Suggestive evidence (a few sources, limited
+ consistency, models incomplete, methods emerging, etc.),
+ competing schools of thought.''
+
+ ``High: Moderate evidence (several sources, some
+ consistency, methods vary and/or documentation limited,
+ etc.), medium consensus.''
+
+ ``Very high: Strong evidence (established theory, multiple
+ sources, consistent results well documented and accepted
+ methods, etc.), high consensus.''
+
+ These categories defy the common understanding of the words used to
+describe them.\9\ The words used to describe `High confidence' include
+`Moderate evidence, medium consensus,' which are more descriptive of
+the common understanding of medium confidence. The words used to
+describe `Medium confidence' include: `a few sources, limited
+consistency, models incomplete, methods emerging; competing schools of
+thought,' that are more descriptive of the common understanding of low
+confidence.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ \9\ https://judithcurry.com/2019/01/02/national-climate-assessment-
+a-crisis-of-epistemic-overconfidence/.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ Apart from these semantic issues, there are very few conclusions of
+meaningful impacts in the NCA4 that are associated with `very high'
+confidence or even `high' confidence. For conclusions associated with
+low, medium and even high confidence, there is substantial room for
+scientific disagreement.
+ the climate change response challenge
+ In response to the threat of man-made climate change, the United
+Nations Framework Convention on Climate Change (UNFCCC) has established
+an international goal of stabilization of the concentrations of
+greenhouse gases in the atmosphere.
+
+ This framing of the climate change problem and its solution has led
+to the dilemma of climate response policy that is aptly described by
+Obersteiner et al: \10\
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ \10\ Obersteiner, et al. (2001). Managing Climate Risk, http://
+www.iiasa.ac.at/Admin/PUB/Documents/IR-01-051.pdf.
+
+ The key issue is whether ``betting big today'' with a
+ comprehensive global climate policy targeted at stabilization
+ ``will fundamentally reshape our common future on a global
+ scale to our advantage, or quickly produce losses that can
+ throw mankind into economic, social, and environmental
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ bankruptcy.''
+
+ In their `Wrong Trousers' essay,\11\ Prins and Rayner argue that we
+have made the wrong choices in our attempts to define the problem of
+climate change and its solution, by relying on strategies that worked
+previously for `tame' problems. A tame problem is well defined, well
+understood, and the appropriate solutions are agreed upon. Cost-benefit
+analyses are appropriate for tame problems, and the potential harm from
+miscalculation is bounded.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ \11\ Prins and Rayner, 2007. The wrong trousers: radically
+rethinking climate policy, http://eureka.bodleian.ox.ac.uk/66/.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ By contrast, climate change is better characterized as a `wicked'
+problem, which is a complex tangle characterized by multiple problem
+definitions, methods of understanding that are open to contention,
+'unknown unknowns' that suggest chronic conditions of ignorance, and
+lack of capacity to imagine future eventualities of both the problem
+and the proposed solutions. The complex web of causality may result in
+surprising unintended consequences to attempted solutions, that
+generate new vulnerabilities or exacerbate the original harm. Further,
+the wickedness of the climate change problem makes it difficult to
+identify points of irrefutable failure or success in either the
+scientific predictions or the policies.
+ Overreaction to a possible catastrophic threat may cause more harm
+than benefits and introduce new systemic risks, which are difficult to
+foresee for a wicked problem. The known risks to human well-being
+associated with constraining fossil fuels may be worse than the
+eventual risks from climate change, and there are undoubtedly some
+risks from both that we currently do not foresee.
+ The wickedness of the climate change problem is further manifested
+in the regional variability of the risks. Balancing the risks of
+climate change and the policy response is very difficult across
+different regions and countries that face varying risks from climate
+change, energy poverty and challenges to economic development. Some
+regions may actually benefit from a warmer climate. Regional
+perceptions of a preferred climate or `dangerous' climate change depend
+on societal values and vulnerability/resilience, which vary regionally
+and culturally. Climate has always changed, independently of human
+activity, so climate change is nothing new. Further, our current
+preferences for avoiding a particular climate of the future fail to
+account for human creativity and ingenuity in creating new technologies
+and social and political structures that will condition our perceptions
+and the consequences of climate change.
+
+ Climate-related decisions involve incomplete information from a
+fast-moving and irreducibly uncertain science. There are many different
+interests and values in play, the relevant timescales are long and
+there is near certainty of surprise. In the context of decision making,
+`deep uncertainty' \12\ refers to:
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ \12\ Walker et al. (2016): Deep Uncertainty. doi:10.1007/978-1-
+4419-1153-7_1140.
+
+ situations in which the phenomena are still only poorly
+ understood and experts do not know or cannot agree on
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ models that relate key forces that shape the future;
+
+ modeling and subjective judgments are used rather than
+ estimates based upon previous experience of actual events
+ and outcomes; and
+
+ experts cannot agree on the value of alternative outcomes.
+
+ The climate change problem arguably meets all three of these
+criteria for `deep uncertainty'.\13\ Acknowledgement of deep
+uncertainty surrounding a problem and its solutions does not imply that
+`no action' is needed. Rather, it implies that decision-analytic
+frameworks should be selected that are consistent with deep
+uncertainty.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ \13\ Curry (2018). Climate uncertainty and risk. https://
+indd.adobe.com/view/da3d0bde-1848-474d-b080-f07200293f91.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ Robust and flexible policy strategies can be designed that account
+for uncertainty, ignorance and dissent. Robust strategies formally
+consider uncertainty, whereby decision makers seek to reduce the range
+of possible scenarios over which the strategy performs poorly. Flexible
+strategies can be quickly adjusted to advancing scientific insights and
+new conditions that arise.
+ Justification for addressing the climate change problem is
+transitioning away from precaution to a risk management approach that
+addresses the economics of preventing losses from climate change. The
+World Bank has a recent paper entitled Investment decision making under
+deep uncertainty--application to climate change \14\ that summarizes
+decision-making methodologies that are able to deal with the deep
+uncertainty associated with climate change, including robust decision
+making and Climate Informed Decision Analysis.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ \14\ http://elibrary.worldbank.org/content/workingpaper/10.1596/
+1813-9450-6193.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ The Hartwell Paper,\15\ published by the London School of Economics
+in cooperation with the University of Oxford, argues that:
+``decarbonisation will only be achieved successfully as a benefit
+contingent upon other goals which are politically attractive and
+relentlessly pragmatic.'' The Hartwell Paper analyzes many alternative
+policy approaches to decarbonization. The authors remind us that: ``it
+is not just that science does not dictate climate policy; it is that
+climate policy alone does not dictate environmental or development or
+energy policies.''
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ \15\ Hartwell Paper, http://eprints.lse.ac.uk/27939/.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ The Breakthrough Institute has proposed Climate Pragmatism,\16\ a
+pluralistic approach based on innovation, resilience and no regrets.
+This pragmatic strategy centers on efforts to accelerate energy
+innovation, build resilience to extreme weather, and pursue no regrets
+pollution reduction measures. Each of these three efforts has
+justifications independent of their benefits for climate mitigation and
+adaptation. Further, this framework does not depend on any agreement
+about climate science or the risks posed by CO2 emissions.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ \16\ http://thebreakthrough.org/blog/Climate_Pragmatism_web.pdf.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ the urgency (?) of co2 emissions reductions
+ In the decades since the 1992 UNFCCC Treaty, global CO2
+emissions have continued to increase, especially in developing
+countries. In 2010, the world's governments agreed that emissions need
+to be reduced so that global temperature increases are limited to below
+2+C.\17\ The target of 2+C (and increasingly 1.5+C) \18\ remains the
+focal point of international climate agreements and negotiations.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ \17\ http://unfccc.int/essential_background/items/6031.php.
+ \18\ https://www.ipcc.ch/sr15/.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ The original rationale for the 2+C target is the idea that `tipping
+points'--abrupt or nonlinear transition to a different climate state--
+become likely to occur once this threshold has been crossed, with
+consequences that are largely uncontrollable and beyond our management.
+The IPCC AR5 considered a number of potential tipping points, including
+ice sheet collapse, collapse of the Atlantic overturning circulation,
+and permafrost carbon release. Every single catastrophic scenario
+considered by the IPCC AR5 (WGII, Table 12.4) has a rating of very
+unlikely or exceptionally unlikely and/or has low confidence. The only
+tipping point that the IPCC considers likely in the 21st century is
+disappearance of Arctic summer sea ice (which is fairly reversible,
+since sea ice freezes every winter).
+ In the absence of tipping points on the timescale of the 21st
+century, the 2+C limit is more usefully considered by analogy to a
+highway speed limit: \19\ driving at 10 mph under the speed limit is
+not automatically safe, and exceeding the limit by 10 mph is not
+automatically dangerous, although the faster one travels the greater
+the danger from an accident. Analogously, the 2+C (or 1.5+C) limit
+should not be taken literally as a real danger threshold. An analogy
+for considering the urgency of emissions reductions is your 401K
+account: if you begin making contributions early, it will be easier to
+meet your retirement goals.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ \19\ http://www.carbonbrief.org/blog/2014/12/two-degrees-a-
+selected-history-of-climate-change-speed-limit/.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ Nevertheless, the 2+C and 1.5+C limits are used to motivate the
+urgency of action to reduce CO2 emissions. At a recent U.N.
+Climate Summit, (former) Secretary-General Ban Ki-moon warned that:
+``Without significant cuts in emissions by all countries, and in key
+sectors, the window of opportunity to stay within less than 2 degrees
+[of warming] will soon close forever.'' \20\ Actually, this window of
+opportunity may remain open for quite some time. The implications of
+the lower values of climate sensitivity found by Lewis and Curry \21\
+and other recent studies is that human-caused warming is not expected
+to exceed the 2+C `danger' level in the 21st century. Further, there is
+growing evidence that the RCP8.5 scenario for future greenhouse gas
+concentrations, which drives the largest amount of warming in climate
+model simulations, is impossibly high, requiring a combination of
+numerous borderline impossible socioeconomic scenarios.\22\ A slower
+rate of warming means there is less urgency to phase out greenhouse gas
+emissions now, and more time to find ways to decarbonize the economy
+affordably and with a minimum of unintended consequences. It also
+allows for the flexibility to revise our policies as further
+information becomes available.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ \20\ http://unfccc.int/un-climate-summit-ban-ki-moon-final-
+summary/.
+ \21\ Lewis and Curry (2018), https://journals.ametsoc.org/doi/
+10.1175/JCLI-D-17-0667.1.
+ \22\ https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/
+S0360544217314597.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ Is it possible that something truly dangerous and unforeseen could
+happen to Earth's climate during the 21st century? Yes it is possible,
+but natural climate variability (including geologic processes) may be a
+more likely source of possible undesirable change than man-made
+warming. In any event, attempting to avoid such a dangerous and
+unforeseen climate by reducing fossil fuel emissions will be futile if
+natural climate and geologic processes are dominant factors. Geologic
+processes are an important factor in the potential instability of the
+West Antarctic ice sheet that could contribute to substantial sea level
+rise in the 21st century.\23\
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ \23\ Curry (2018). Sea level and climate change. https://
+curryja.files.wordpress.com/2018/11/special-report-sea-level-rise3.pdf
+(section 4.2.2). Whitehouse et al. (2019) https://www.nature.com/
+articles/s41467-018-08068-y.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ Under the Paris Agreement, individual countries have submitted to
+the UNFCCC their Nationally Determined Contributions (NDCs). Under the
+Obama administration, the U.S. NDC had a goal of reducing emissions by
+28 percent below 2005 levels by 2025. Apart from considerations of
+feasibility and cost, it has been estimated \24\ using the EPA MAGICC
+model that this commitment will prevent 0.03+C in warming by 2100. When
+combined with current commitments from other nations, only a small
+fraction of the projected future warming will be ameliorated by these
+commitments. If climate models are indeed running too hot,\25\ then the
+amount of warming prevented would be even smaller. Even if emissions
+immediately went to zero and the projections of climate models are to
+be believed, the impact on the climate would not be noticeable until
+the 2nd half of the 21st century. Most of the expected benefits to the
+climate from the UNFCCC emissions reductions policy will be realized in
+the 22nd century and beyond.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ \24\ Lomborg (2015), https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/
+10.1111/1758-5899.12295.
+ \25\ Curry (2017). Climate models for laypersons, https://
+www.thegwpf.org/content/uploads/2017/02/Curry-2017.pdf.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ Attempting to use carbon dioxide as a control knob to regulate
+climate on decadal to century timescales is arguably futile. The UNFCCC
+emissions reductions policies have brought us to a point between a rock
+and a hard place, whereby the emissions reduction policy with its
+extensive costs and questions of feasibility are inadequate for making
+a meaningful dent in slowing down the expected warming in the 21st
+century. And the real societal consequences of climate change and
+extreme weather events (whether caused by man-made climate change or
+natural variability) remain largely unaddressed.
+ This is not to say that a transition away from burning fossil fuels
+doesn't make sense over the course of the 21st century. People prefer
+`clean' over `dirty' energy--provided that all other things are equal,
+such as reliability, security, and economy. However, assuming that
+current wind and solar technologies are adequate for providing the
+required amount and density of electric power for an advanced economy
+is misguided.\26\
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ \26\ Clack et al. (2017), https://www.pnas.org/content/114/26/6722.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ The recent record-breaking cold outbreak in the Midwest is a stark
+reminder of the challenges of providing a reliable power supply in the
+face of extreme weather events, where an inadequate power supply not
+only harms the economy, but jeopardizes lives and public safety. Last
+week, central Minnesota experienced a natural gas `brownout,' as Xcel
+Energy advised customers to turn thermostats down to 60 degrees and
+avoid using hot water.\27\ Why? Because the wind wasn't blowing during
+an exceptionally cold period. Utilities pair natural gas plants with
+wind farms, where the gas plants can be ramped up and down quickly when
+the wind isn't blowing. With bitter cold temperatures and no wind,
+there wasn't enough natural gas.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ \27\ https://www.powerlineblog.com/archives/2019/01/why-green-
+energy-is-futile-in-one-lesson.php.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ A transition to an electric power system driven solely by wind and
+solar would require a massive amount of energy storage. While energy
+storage technologies are advancing, massive deployment of cost
+effective energy storage technologies is well beyond current
+capabilities.\28\ An unintended consequence of rapid deployment of wind
+and solar energy farms may be that natural gas power plants become
+increasingly entrenched in the power supply system.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ \28\ https://webstore.iea.org/technology-roadmap-energy-storage.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ Apart from energy policy, there are a number of land use practices
+related to croplands, grazing lands, forests and wetlands that could
+increase the natural sequestration of carbon and have ancillary
+economic and ecosystem benefits.\29\ These co-benefits include improved
+biodiversity, soil quality, agricultural productivity and wildfire
+behavior modification.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ \29\ https://www.ipcc.ch/site/assets/uploads/2018/02/
+ipcc_wg3_ar5_chapter11.pdf.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ In evaluating the urgency of CO2 emissions reductions,
+we need to be realistic about what reducing emissions will actually
+accomplish. Drastic reductions of emissions in the United States will
+not reduce global CO2 concentrations if emissions in the
+developing world, particularly China and India, continue to increase.
+If we believe the climate model simulations, we would not expect to see
+any changes in extreme weather/climate events until late in the 21st
+century. The greatest impacts will be felt in the 22nd century and
+beyond, in terms of reducing sea level rise and ocean acidification.
+ resilience, anti-fragility and thrivability
+ Given that emissions reductions policies are very costly,
+politically contentious and are not expected to change the climate in a
+meaningful way in the 21st century, adaptation strategies are receiving
+increasing attention in formulating responses to climate change.
+ The extreme damages from recent hurricanes plus the recent billion
+dollar disasters from floods, droughts and wildfires, emphasize that
+the United States is highly vulnerable to current weather and climate
+disasters. Even worse disasters were encountered in the United States
+during the 1930s and 1950s. Possible scenarios of incremental worsening
+of weather and climate extremes over the course of the 21st century
+don't change the fundamental storyline that many regions of the United
+States are not well adapted to the current weather and climate
+variability, let alone the range that has been experienced over the
+past two centuries.
+ As a practical matter, adaptation has been driven by local crises
+associated with extreme weather and climate events, emphasizing the
+role of `surprises' in shaping responses. Advocates of adaptation to
+climate change are not arguing for simply responding to events and
+changes after they occur; they are arguing for anticipatory adaptation.
+However, in adapting to climate change, we need to acknowledge that we
+cannot know how the climate will evolve in the 21st century, we are
+certain to be surprised and we will make mistakes along the way.
+ `Resilience' is the ability to `bounce back' in the face of
+unexpected events. Resilience carries a connotation of returning to the
+original state as quickly as possible. The difference in impact and
+recovery from Hurricane Sandy striking New York City in 2012 versus the
+impact of Tropical Cyclone Nargis striking Myanmar in 2008 \30\
+reflects very different vulnerabilities and capacities for bouncing
+back.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ \30\ Webster, (2008). Myanmar's Deadly Daffodil. http://
+webster.eas.gatech.edu/Papers/Webster2008c.pdf.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ To increase our resilience to extreme weather and climate events,
+we can `bounce forward' to reduce future vulnerability by evolving our
+infrastructures, institutions and practices. Nicholas Taleb's concept
+of antifragility \31\ focuses on learning from adversity, and
+developing approaches that enable us to thrive from high levels of
+volatility, particularly unexpected extreme events. Anti-fragility goes
+beyond `bouncing back' to becoming even better as a result of
+encountering and overcoming challenges. Anti-fragile systems are
+dynamic rather than static, thriving and growing in new directions
+rather than simply maintaining the status quo.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ \31\ Taleb, (2012). Antifragile: Things That Gain From Disorder.
+Random House.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ Strategies to increase antifragility include: economic development,
+reducing the downside from volatility, developing a range of options,
+tinkering with small experiments, and developing and testing
+transformative ideas. Antifragility is consistent with decentralized
+models of policy innovation that create flexibility and redundance in
+the face of volatility. This `innovation dividend' is analogous to
+biodiversity in the natural world, enhancing resilience in the face of
+future shocks.\32\
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ \32\ Lynch: Policy Diversity: Creative Potential or Wasteful
+Redundancy? https://slideplayer.com/slide/6265255/.
+
+ Similar to anti-fragility, the concept of `thrivability' has been
+articulated by Jean Russell: \33\
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ \33\ Russell, (2013). https://www.amazon.com/Thrivability-Breaking-
+through-World-Works/dp/1909470287.
+
+ ``It isn't enough to repair the damage our progress has
+ brought. It is also not enough to manage our risks and be more
+ shock-resistant. Now is not only the time to course correct and
+ be more resilient. It is a time to imagine what we can generate
+ for the world. Not only can we work to minimize our footprint
+ but we can also create positive handprints. It is time to
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ strive for a world that thrives.''
+
+ A focus on policies that support resilience, anti-fragility and
+thrivability avoids the hubris of thinking we can predict the future
+climate. The relevant questions then become:
+
+ How can we best promote the development of transformative
+ ideas and technologies?
+
+ How much resilience can we afford?
+
+ The threats from climate change (whether natural or human caused)
+are fundamentally regional, associated not only with regional changes
+to the weather/climate, but with local vulnerabilities and cultural
+values and perceptions. In the least developed countries, energy
+poverty and survivability is of overwhelming concern, where there are
+severe challenges to meeting basic needs and their idea of clean energy
+is something other than burning dung inside their dwelling for cooking
+and heating. In many less developed countries, particularly in South
+Asia, an overwhelming concern is vulnerability to extreme weather
+events such as floods and hurricanes that can set back the local
+economies for a generation. In the developed world, countries are
+relatively less vulnerable to climate change and extreme weather events
+and have the luxury of experimenting with new ideas: entrepreneurs not
+only want to make money, but also to strive for greatness and transform
+the infrastructure for society.
+ Extreme weather/climate events such as landfalling major
+hurricanes, floods, extreme heat waves and droughts become catastrophes
+through a combination of large populations, large and exposed
+infrastructure in vulnerable locations, and human modification of
+natural systems that can provide a natural safety barrier (e.g.
+deforestation, draining wetlands). Addressing current adaptive deficits
+and planning for climate compatible development will increase societal
+resilience to future extreme events that may possibly be more frequent
+or severe in the future.
+ ways forward
+ Climate scientists have made a forceful argument for a future
+threat from man-made climate change. Based upon our current assessment
+of the science, the threat does not seem to be an existential one on
+the timescale of the 21st century, even in its most alarming
+incarnation. However, the perception of man-made climate change as a
+near-term apocalypse and alignment with range of other social
+objectives has narrowed the policy options that we're willing to
+consider.
+ Effectively responding to the possible threats from a warmer
+climate is challenging because of the deep uncertainties surrounding
+the risks both from the problem and the proposed solutions. The
+wickedness of the climate change problem provides much scope for
+disagreement among reasonable and intelligent people.
+
+ With regards to energy policy and its role in reducing emissions,
+consider the following three options:
+
+ 1. Do nothing, continue with the status quo.
+
+ 2. Rapidly deploy wind and solar power plants, with the goal of
+ eliminating fossil fuels on the timescale of 1-2 decades.
+
+ 3. Re-imagine 21st century electric power generation and
+ transmission systems with new technologies that improve
+ energy security, reliability and cost while at the same
+ time minimizing environmental impacts.
+
+ The current climate/energy policy debate seems to be #1 versus #2;
+in my opinion, neither of these options gets us where we want to be in
+terms of thriving economically and minimizing the environmental impact
+of energy generation. #3 in principle can usher in a new era of
+abundant, clean energy, but we can't put an arbitrary timetable/
+deadline on this; it will require substantial research, development and
+experimentation. In the meantime, muddling along with some combination
+of #1 and #2 can improve the situation somewhat. Ironically, acting
+urgently on emissions reduction by massively deploying solar and wind
+power could entrench natural gas in the power system and turn out to be
+the enemy of a better long-term solution. Focusing on #3 has the
+potential to eliminate the current gridlock of debating #1 versus #2,
+and provides the best option for a long-term solution.
+ A regional focus on adapting to the risks of climate change allows
+for a range of bottom-up strategies to be integrated with other
+societal challenges, including growing population, environmental
+degradation, poorly planned land-use and over-exploitation of natural
+resources. Even if the threat from global warming turns out to be
+small, near-term benefits to the region can be realized in terms of
+reduced vulnerability to a broad range of threats, improved resource
+management, and improved environmental quality. Securing the common
+interest on local and regional scales provides a basis for the
+successful implementation of climate adaptation strategies and
+addressing near-term social justice objectives.
+
+ Bipartisan support seems feasible for pragmatic efforts to:
+
+ accelerate energy innovation
+
+ build resilience to extreme events
+
+ pursue no regrets pollution reduction measures
+
+ Each of these three efforts has justifications independent of their
+benefits for climate mitigation and adaptation. These three efforts
+provide the basis for a climate policy that addresses near-term
+economic and social justice concerns and the longer-term goals of
+mitigation.
+ The role for climate science and climate scientists in the policy
+process has been complex. In the past 20 years, dominated by the IPCC/
+UNFCCC paradigm, scientists have become entangled in an acrimonious
+scientific and political debate, where the issues in each have become
+confounded. This has generated much polarization in the scientific
+community and has resulted in political attacks on scientists on both
+sides of the debate. A scientist's `side' is often defined by factors
+that are exogenous to the actual scientific debate. Debates over
+relatively arcane aspects of the scientific argument have become a
+substitute for what should be a real debate about politics and values.
+ Scientific progress is driven by uncertainty and disagreement;
+working to resolve these uncertainties and disagreements drives the
+knowledge frontier forward. Attempts by government policy makers to
+intimidate climate scientists \34\ whose research or public statements
+are perceived to be in opposition to preferred policy narrative are
+enormously detrimental to scientific progress.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ \34\ http://www.hillheat.com/articles/2015/02/24/rep-grijalva-asks-
+for-conflict-of-interest-disclosures-from-gops-go-to-climate-science-
+witnesses.
+---------------------------------------------------------------------------
+ I am making one `ask' today: please allow climate science and the
+research process to proceed unfettered by political attacks on
+scientists. We need to acknowledge that climate-related decisions
+involve incomplete information from a fast-moving and irreducibly
+uncertain science. Uncertainty and disagreement is what drives the
+knowledge frontier forward; please help that process to flourish. Only
+in the most simple-minded policy making frameworks does scientific
+uncertainty and disagreement prescribe `no action.'
+ It is up to the political process (international, national, and
+local) to decide how to contend with the climate problem, with all of
+its uncertainties, complexity and wickedness. The challenge is to open
+up the decision-making processes in a way that is more honestly
+political and economic, while giving proper weight to scientific
+reason, evidence and uncertainty.
+
+ ______
+
+
+Question Submitted for the Record by Rep. Hice to Dr. Judith A. Curry,
+ President, Climate Forecast Applications Network
+ Question 1. Dr. Curry, as you are probably aware, Dr. William
+Happer, Professor Emeritus of Physics and Princeton University,
+suggests that climate modeling is an extremely difficult problem
+because the climate involves the interaction between the atmosphere and
+the oceans, which are both extremely turbulent fluids. He notes that it
+is not difficult to write the partial differential equations that
+describe our climate, but that even our most powerful supercomputers
+cannot solve these equations leading scientists to replace them with
+simplified computer models that toss out much of the detail of the real
+atmosphere and oceans leading us to less robust data and conclusions.
+
+ How would you respond to that?
+
+ Answer. To answer questionssuch asthe oneput forward by
+Representative Hice, in 2017 I wrote a report entitled ``Climate models
+for the layman'' that explains how climate models work and their
+limitations. An online link to the report: https://www.thegwpf.org/
+content/uploads/2017/02/Curry-2017.pdf.
+
+ With regards to Representative Hice's specific question regarding a
+statement by Dr. William Happer, I regard Dr. Happer's statement to be
+correct. Thejustification for my conclusion is summarized in the report
+linked to in the previous paragraph.
+
+ ______
+
+
+ The Chairman. Thank you very much, and to the whole panel,
+our appreciation for your valuable and important testimony.
+ Let me turn to my colleague, Mr. Neguse, for questions.
+ Mr. Neguse. First, I want to thank the Chairman for holding
+this hearing. It is a breath of fresh air, particularly for us
+new Members who have just joined the Congress, that the Natural
+Resources Committee is undertaking this important work, and
+that its first hearing is on such an important topic.
+ I would respectfully disagree with Dr. Curry, in terms of
+your framing around the existential nature of this issue. I
+think climate change is an existential threat.
+ I think of this in the context of being a new, young
+father. I am 34 years old. My wife and I just had our first
+child, a daughter, Natalie. She is 5 months old. Much of our
+work here in the Congress is ultimately making sure that the
+world she inherits is a better one than perhaps the world that
+we inherited. And one need look no further than the IPCC report
+and a variety of other studies to see just how catastrophic the
+consequences of climate change will be for her generation if we
+don't take decisive action, and if we don't do so now.
+ And I can tell you that, certainly in my community in
+Colorado, we are feeling the impacts of climate change already.
+I have a report here that I will respectfully ask be submitted
+into the record, the most recent report from the Department of
+the Interior with respect to the impacts of climate change in
+Rocky Mountain National Park.
+ I represent Colorado's 2nd Congressional District, Northern
+Colorado. Fifty-two percent of my district is Federal public
+land, and we see very clearly the impacts of climate change in
+Rocky Mountain National Park and elsewhere. My constituents see
+it every day. Rising temperatures have led to snow melting
+faster, which causes increased flooding and erosion, and
+negatively impacts Colorado's fresh water supply, 70 percent of
+which comes from our snow. At Rocky Mountain National Park, the
+studies have shown that temperatures have risen 3 to 4 degrees,
+significantly affecting the plants and animals that call the
+park home.
+ I am very excited about the opportunity to take
+comprehensive, holistic, and significant action to solve this
+issue, actions like the Green New Deal, which I support, along
+with several of my colleagues. I have introduced legislation to
+protect over 400,000 acres of public lands in my state, in
+Colorado, so that we can ensure that those lands are not sold
+to the highest bidder and opened up to oil and gas development
+and the rest.
+ So, at the end of the day, I think this was the defining
+issue of our time. And I thank the witnesses, with respect to
+their activism, in trying to push for common-sense solutions
+that will ultimately protect the planet for all of our
+children.
+ My question goes to Mr. Hollie. I heard your testimony with
+respect to energy poverty, I think, as you described it, and
+the issues around affordability. I don't know if you are aware
+of this--I think you referenced natural gas as being ``clean.''
+ According to the NAACP's Clean Air Task Force report,
+African-American communities face an elevated risk of cancer
+due to air toxic emissions from natural gas development, and
+over 1 million African-Americans live in counties that face a
+cancer risk above the EPA's level of concern from toxins
+emitted by natural gas facilities. I am curious how you would
+respond to that statistic.
+ Mr. Hollie. My response would be all of our energy sources
+have some type of downside to them, even coal. We look at the
+wind turbine----
+ Mr. Neguse. Well, I would agree with you there, Mr. Hollie.
+ Mr. Hollie. Right, right.
+ Mr. Neguse. Coal certainly has a negative impact, as does
+natural gas----
+ Mr. Hollie. If I could finish, sir.
+ Mr. Neguse. Proceed.
+ Mr. Hollie. Even the wind turbines this winter, a couple
+weeks ago, couldn't operate. The downside. But we know for a
+fact that liquid gas, natural gas, is the cleanest way and the
+most affordable way right now for people in this country.
+ Mr. Neguse. Well, I am not sure I understand your
+comparison of windmills to the toxins and potential cancer
+risks associated with natural gas emissions.
+ But nonetheless, I will say, I understand that you have
+written a number of editorials. And obviously, from your
+testimony today, support the development of fossil fuels, coal,
+and natural gas.
+ Mr. Hollie. Energy exploration.
+ Mr. Neguse. And I understand that your organization,
+Reaching America, that you have utilized that organization to
+make those views known. Is that a fair----
+ Mr. Hollie. That is a fair assessment.
+ Mr. Neguse. I also understand that your organization is a
+partner with a group called Explore Offshore. Is that correct?
+ Mr. Hollie. We are a member of that organization, yes.
+ Mr. Neguse. OK, and that is a project of the American
+Petroleum Institute.
+ Mr. Hollie. They are associated with them, yes.
+ Mr. Neguse. OK. Does your organization receive any funding
+from fossil fuel companies or corporations?
+ Mr. Hollie. No, we do not.
+ Mr. Neguse. With that, I yield back. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
+ The Chairman. Thank you very much.
+ Mr. Gohmert.
+ Mr. Gohmert. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
+ I am curious, Reverend Yearwood. From your testimony it
+sounds like you support the Green New Deal. Is that fair?
+ Rev. Yearwood. That is correct.
+ Mr. Gohmert. You had mentioned your position as a chaplain
+in the military. And some of us have real concerns about
+closing every base and cutting our military by 50 percent, but
+that is interesting that you support those.
+ Rev. Yearwood. Well, the military was one of the key
+institutions of our government that actually has spoken about
+the threats of climate change.
+ Mr. Gohmert. Right. And Green New Deal is going to take
+care of that by making us basically indefensible. With a 50
+percent cut, we will not be able to protect ourselves properly
+from the threat of Russia, China, or even ISIS from there, and
+closing all bases overseas, but that is interesting.
+ Also, I couldn't help think back as I listened to Mr.
+Hollie, your testimony, to the giant here in the U.S. Congress
+named John Dingell. He was chairman of the Energy and Commerce
+Committee when Democrats took the majority back in January 2007
+through January 2011. For 50 years he and, as I understand, his
+father had wanted some kind of universal health care, and he
+was thrilled that he was going to get to chair that into being.
+ But my understanding was the Speaker of the House, now
+Speaker again, wanted two things out of his Committee. They
+wanted the universal health care bill, Obamacare, and cap and
+trade. And he made the public statement, because that jacks up
+the cost of energy, like you have been talking about. And, as
+you know, the people that are impacted, it isn't the rich, they
+can afford it.
+ So, he made the statement the cap and trade bill is not
+only a tax, it is a great big tax. And, of course, the Nation's
+poor were the ones that would be most impacted. But because of
+his comment he was fired as chairman of the Energy and Commerce
+Committee. Mr. Waxman was made chairman. And, as he famously
+said, ``We not only don't want your input, we don't need your
+votes.'' So, he pushed it through, and it never became law.
+ But as you testified, that does come back to mind. And I
+had an 80-year-old lady say, ``I am scared. My cost of energy
+to heat my home is going up. And I was born in a home that only
+had a wood-burning stove, and I am afraid I am going to die in
+a home that can only afford a wood-burning stove.''
+ And I said, ``I am really sorry to be the bearer of bad
+tidings, but probably your wood-burning stove is going to end
+up being illegal.''
+ But it is tragic. And it is the poor that suck it up, when
+we push these kinds of things. So, I appreciate your
+perspective very much.
+ Dr. Curry, let me ask you very quickly. Has there ever been
+any climate change more dramatically than what killed off the
+dinosaurs?
+ Dr. Curry. Climate has always varied. Sometimes there are
+extreme events that maybe get an asteroid or comet impact, or
+something like that. But the ocean, volcanic eruptions, there
+are many sources of natural variability on all timescales.
+ So, when you see the climate changing, you can't
+immediately assume that it is all caused by humans. There is a
+strong natural----
+ Mr. Gohmert. Do you think we are causing the polar ice caps
+on Mars to melt?
+ Dr. Curry. No.
+ Mr. Gohmert. That is probably the sun, apparently.
+ But let me--my time is running out, but I appreciate all
+our witnesses. But the comparison of the civil rights effort, I
+mean, that was unconstitutional activity by the government, and
+it just strikes me so ironic that if the climate change and the
+Green New Deal comes into law, it is saying we are giving up
+our freedom and putting all our faith in the government because
+of the civil rights violations to begin with. It is just rather
+ironic.
+ But my time has expired, I yield back.
+ The Chairman. Mr. Levin.
+ Mr. Levin. Thank you, Chair, for this opportunity to
+finally, after many years, have a hearing on climate change.
+And I want to thank our witnesses, along with our governors,
+who signaled a bipartisan desire to see strong Federal action.
+ Let's cut to the chase. The overwhelming scientific
+consensus has left no doubt--no doubt--that we are facing a
+climate crisis. And it is long past time to stop undermining
+science and evidence. The report that we saw this morning from
+NOAA and NASA shows that the 5 warmest years recorded since
+1880 are the last 5 years. This isn't that hard to figure out.
+Now must be the time to accept reality. This is reality. And we
+have to begin focusing on solutions.
+ And I want to thank the young people who are here for
+leading the way on initiatives like the Green New Deal.
+ We must not wait to accelerate the deployment of renewable
+energy or energy-efficient buildings or electrify our
+transportation infrastructure.
+ I am from the great state of California, where I have been
+involved in climate and energy policy for a long time, and I
+have heard the nay-sayers every step of the way. But what we
+have done is we have demonstrated beyond any shadow of a doubt
+that, if you protect the environment and innovate with the
+clean energy jobs of the future, you will grow the economy at
+the same time. And our solar industry in California is a clear
+example of that.
+ We must also not advocate our global leadership on the
+issue of climate change, or subcontract our energy and
+environmental policies to a handful of big polluters who ignore
+science and common sense. And we must not sit by as
+unprecedented climate change impacts the health and safety and
+the economy of our communities.
+ I am confident that a strong majority of the American
+people are with us, and even a strong majority of my colleagues
+in the House and Senate. The question is whether we have the
+courage to act on climate. And this hearing is just one step of
+many that we are going to need to take in that direction.
+ The transition to a more sustainable future has been my
+life's work, and will be a critical aspect of my service in
+Congress. I hope that we can put politics aside, if even for
+just a moment, and focus instead on science and evidence and
+our future.
+ And like my friend, Mr. Neguse, I have two young children
+at home, and this is about leaving the planet better for them
+than how I found it.
+ With that, I actually do have a couple of questions for Dr.
+Cobb.
+ Dr. Cobb, I want to thank you for your work. We have seen
+numerous studies over the past few months that climate change
+is wreaking havoc on ecosystems, and that we have potentially
+lost two-thirds of all species that were on the planet before
+the Industrial Revolution. Why is the preservation of
+biodiversity so important for resiliency to climate change, and
+what steps can we take to preserve biodiversity, particularly
+as the Natural Resources Committee?
+ Dr. Cobb. Thank you for that question, the opportunity to
+address that.
+ I think I made clear in the testimony that I provided that
+any number of indicators of our ecosystem's health are already
+showing steady declines with respect to climate change impacts.
+The National Climate Assessment lays that out item by item.
+ But to your question about biodiversity. Diversity of
+species is critical to the function of ecosystems, and, in
+turn, those ecosystem services that we rely on. We might turn
+to the functioning of coastal ecosystems and recognize the
+importance of functioning ecosystems that provide fishermen
+with livelihoods and many other kinds of tourist-related
+services, as well.
+ So, this has a distinct value to Americans that has been
+shown again and again and again. And certainly science tells us
+some of the ways that this Committee can help to promote
+biodiversity and increase ecosystem resilience and, therefore,
+support the communities that depend on these services. Some of
+those ways include, as I mentioned, protecting the lands that
+these species depend on, and using the best science and
+evidence to inform the support of these ecosystems and the
+critical species that support their function. So, that is just
+one way.
+ Thank you very much.
+ Mr. Levin. I represent a district, California's 49th
+District, with over 50 miles of coastline. And my friends at
+the Scripps Institute of Oceanography agree with you, Dr. Cobb,
+that we absolutely must face the reality, the changing
+temperature of our oceans, the obvious coastal erosion,
+unprecedented. And if we don't act, future generations will
+regret our lack of action. Now is our moment to lead. This
+should not be a partisan issue; this should be based on science
+and evidence. And if we can actually focus on facts for a
+change, maybe we will get somewhere. I yield back.
+ Ms. Yeampierre. I would like to, if possible, make a
+comment, as one of two women of color that is on this panel,
+particularly because climate change is going to impact front-
+line communities more than any other. And the people who are
+leading the women of color in these communities, their children
+are the ones that are going to be impacted.
+ We can't talk about these ecosystems devoid of talking
+about the impact on human rights and on the people affected.
+More than 5,000 Puerto Ricans died. That is not nothing. That
+is not just an ecosystem. That was an entire island that was
+affected.
+ In the Philippines around 2012, 10,000 Filipinos died. We
+have had Superstorm Sandy that affected life all over New York
+City and New Jersey, and the infrastructure was destroyed.
+ So, I just really don't want to talk about this in silos,
+we are not talking about whole communities, and not treating
+this issue in a way that is holistic. If we don't lead with how
+this is going to impact the people least responsible for
+creating climate change, the people who live within their
+carbon footprint, the people who are engaged in urban forestry,
+doubling the amount of open space, stopping the siting of power
+plants, then we will----
+ Mr. Grijalva. I am not cutting you off----
+ Ms. Yeampierre [continuing]. Miss the reason why we have
+this panel.
+ The Chairman. The time is up, and we want to stay within
+the protocol.
+ Ms. Yeampierre. All right. Thank you, I appreciate it, but
+I just want to make sure----
+ The Chairman. With all due respect. Thank you.
+ Ms. Yeampierre [continuing]. That folks address those
+things.
+ The Chairman. Mr. McClintock, please.
+ Mr. McClintock. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I do want to talk
+about science and evidence.
+ Professor Curry, are we experiencing the highest
+temperatures in the planet's history.
+ Dr. Curry. No.
+ Mr. McClintock. When have we seen higher temperatures?
+ Dr. Curry. Oh, a very long time ago, and at least in some
+regions, they may be equally as high about 1,000 years ago,
+during the Medieval warm period.
+ Mr. McClintock. So, long before the Industrial Revolution?
+ Dr. Curry. Yes.
+ Mr. McClintock. Are we experiencing the highest levels of
+atmospheric carbon dioxide in the planet's history?
+ Dr. Curry. No. Historically, we are a little bit on the low
+side, actually, in the current era.
+ Mr. McClintock. Are we experiencing the worst droughts in
+recorded history?
+ Dr. Curry. Definitely not.
+ Mr. McClintock. Are we experiencing the most ferocious
+hurricanes in recorded history?
+ Dr. Curry. No. In recent history, in the 1950s in the
+Atlantic, the land-falling hurricanes were actually worse than
+what we have seen in recent decades.
+ Mr. McClintock. I am reminded of a poem by Ogden Nash, who
+wrote, ``The ass was born in March, the rains came in November.
+`Such a flood as this,' he said, `I scarcely can remember'.''
+ But our recorded history, as well as our paleoclimatology
+informs us that there have been periods where carbon dioxide
+levels have been much higher than they are today, temperatures
+have been much higher and lower than they are today, and long
+before the significant carbon dioxide emissions of human
+civilization. Is that correct?
+ Dr. Curry. Yes.
+ Mr. McClintock. A study published in Lancet a few years ago
+noted that cold weather kills far more people than warm
+weather. What do you see as the greater threat?
+ Dr. Curry. Well, obviously, it depends on the location. But
+I think the statistics, overall, across a wide variety of
+locations do support that cold weather kills more than hot
+weather.
+ Mr. McClintock. During the recent cold wave, those states
+that relied excessively on wind and solar saw electricity
+outages. Would you say that the greatest single threat in
+extreme weather, either hot or cold, is a lack of electricity?
+ Dr. Curry. Yes. Even during hurricanes, what kills a lot of
+people is the lack of electricity, which has all sorts of
+trickle-down effects on other things that are needed to save
+lives during those experiences.
+ Mr. McClintock. How does an over-reliance on wind and solar
+generation affect our ability to provide abundant, reliable,
+and affordable electricity?
+ Dr. Curry. Well, it doesn't work without natural gas.
+Natural gas is the perfect partner for wind and solar, because
+of the intermittency, because you can fire up a gas burner and
+fire it back down. And energy trading, natural gas trading, is
+what has, I think, stabilized the price of natural gas that
+actually helps make wind and solar be affordable.
+ So, until such time as there are advanced storage
+technologies, we are going to rely on natural gas as a partner.
+ Mr. McClintock. Let me get to that, if I can.
+ Mr. Hollie, we heard earlier from the governor of
+Massachusetts about all of their green energy policies, also
+the governor of North Carolina. My home state of California has
+adopted even more radical policies. They say they are helping
+the poor, but I just checked. In Massachusetts, those policies
+have produced the 11th highest gasoline prices in the country.
+California now has, as a result of these policies, the 2nd
+highest gasoline prices in the country. Massachusetts and
+California are tied for the 6th highest electricity prices in
+the country.
+ How are poor people helped by paying needlessly sky-high
+prices for gasoline and electricity?
+ Mr. Hollie. Sir, I don't have a lot of research to point
+to. All I have is my anecdotal research. The thousands of
+people that I speak to struggle every single day to pay their
+electric bill. And the one thing that they talk about is just
+the need for affordable, reliable energy that we have here in
+this country. So, if we can find a way to reduce the
+regulations that allow people access to that energy, I think it
+would go a long way in helping them to reduce the cost of
+energy for them.
+ Mr. McClintock. Dr. Curry, a gridlocked car creates twice
+the NOx contaminants and six times the carbon contaminants per
+mile traveled as a car moving at peak efficiency. Doesn't it
+make more sense to add highway capacity to resolve our chronic
+traffic congestion if carbon emissions are the goal of
+reducing?
+ Dr. Curry. A transportation policy is much tougher to
+figure out than power production. It is a very complex issue,
+and I would like to see us re-envision what that should be for
+the 21st century, rather than adding patches to our current
+system.
+ Mr. McClintock. If we are going to be able to store less
+moisture in the mountains as snow, does it make sense to build
+more dams, so that we can store surplus water from wet years so
+that we have it in dry years?
+ Dr. Curry. It certainly does. Water resource management is
+a big issue, but there are environmental challenges associated
+with dams and reservoirs, also. So, it needs a lot of planning
+to make all this do what you really want it to do.
+ Mr. McClintock. Thank you.
+ The Chairman. Ms. Haaland.
+ Ms. Haaland. Thank you, Chairman. Welcome to all of you and
+thank you so much for taking time to be with us today. I would
+like to take this opportunity to thank you and my colleagues
+for entrusting me with the responsibilities of Vice Chair of
+this Committee and the chairship for the Subcommittee on
+National Parks, Forests, and Public Lands. I look forward to
+working with you and my colleagues to protect our public lands
+and to meet our obligations to our indigenous communities.
+ To that point, this hearing is important and an appropriate
+place to begin this Congress. As we heard from all our
+witnesses, climate change poses an unprecedented threat to our
+communities and our environment.
+ Last year, in my state of New Mexico, the Ute Park Fire
+burned tens of thousands of drought-stricken acres, while the
+city of Santa Fe experienced a once in 1,000-year flood.
+Meanwhile, a vast methane cloud hovers over the northwest
+corner of New Mexico, and this Administration has worked to
+weaken the rules on methane emissions from oil and gas
+operations.
+ Methane is more than 80 times more powerful than carbon
+dioxide at trapping heat, and is responsible for about a
+quarter of the warming we are experiencing today.
+ Nearby in Arizona, Hurricane Rosa inundated the Tohono
+O'odham Nation, nearly overtopping their dam, trapping
+residents behind impassible roads, and forcing evacuations.
+Hurricanes have almost never reached this part of Arizona
+before.
+ Climate change has forced us to live in a new normal, in
+which fires, floods, droughts, and hurricanes wreck our
+communities and our national heritage. And it is now time for
+us to act.
+ I first would like to just thank Ms. Nazar for your
+commitment and your sacrifice to the things you believe in. I
+almost want to apologize to you and the youth of this world,
+who go to bed every night worrying about what will happen to
+our communities because of climate change. And I just want to
+recognize your presence here. It means a great deal to me and
+to many of us. So, thank you very much.
+ Ms. Yeampierre, I think you are best equipped to answer
+this question, so I will ask it to you.
+ Right now, the EPA and Interior Department are run by
+former lobbyists for coal and oil companies. The New York Times
+reported last year that a coal magnate was essentially getting
+his entire wish list of energy de-regulations approved by this
+Administration.
+ What role do you believe this corporate capture of the
+Administration will play in being able to address the climate
+crisis?
+ Ms. Yeampierre. I think that the de-regulation is
+exacerbating the climate crisis, particularly in front-line
+communities and in indigenous communities.
+ You are from New Mexico, where you have nuclear energy and
+uranium in the lungs and the water and people. It is affecting
+60 nations and tribes. The decisions that are being made to
+support an old-school way of thinking about energy are really
+racing us toward extreme catastrophic events.
+ The truth is that even in places like Kentucky, people are
+moving away from coal. One of our organizations, which is with
+the Climate Justice Alliance, Kentuckians for the Commonwealth,
+are working at operationalizing just transitions that move
+people away from having to depend on an economic system that
+has destroyed their lives and limited their livability.
+ So, while people in communities are doing that, you have an
+EPA that is racing toward, actually moving policies that are
+basically taking us back in time. It is really dangerous, and
+it is a contribution to actually making us look like the day
+after tomorrow.
+ And it is unfortunate that this old-school, dated way of
+thinking about how we basically consume and use energy is
+really creating more problems for our communities. I think
+that, honestly, people in different parts of the world are way
+ahead of us, and that the United States is really looking like
+this clunky old-school machine that can't keep up, not only
+with the technology, but the science. So, it is frightening.
+ EPA has always had people in there that are in the pockets
+of the lobbyists, really slowing down the cogs and making it
+impossible for us to move as fast as the climate is changing.
+So, now what we are seeing is really dangerous. That is what I
+would contribute.
+ Ms. Haaland. I appreciate that very much.
+ Mr. Chairman, in the interest of time, I will submit other
+questions in writing. Thank you.
+ The Chairman. Thank you very much.
+ Mr. Hern.
+ Mr. Hern. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thank you all for
+testifying today as expert witnesses on climate change. Each of
+you has spent your careers involved in climate policy and have
+helped to generate various solutions to the problem of climate
+change.
+ Mr. Hollie, your work to reduce energy poverty has been
+truly remarkable, and your testimony today reflects your well-
+versed stances on climate change issues. One part of your
+testimony that interests me a lot was where you wrote, ``The
+government requires environmental impact studies to estimate
+the effects of projects like roads and buildings on nature.
+Shouldn't the government act similarly when it comes to how
+regulations impact the population?''
+ Mr. Hollie. Yes, sir.
+ Mr. Hern. Would it surprise you that we tried to put that
+into a rule last week and it was voted down by our friends
+across the aisle? So, we would evaluate the impact of our
+policies on a cost benefit analysis.
+ Mr. Hollie. Sure. No, I did not know that, sir.
+ Mr. Hern. Thank you.
+ Dr. Curry, your testimony reflects your wealth of knowledge
+on these issues, and gives great insight into the climate
+change debate. In particular, you discuss the increasing
+concern you have that the climate change problem has been over-
+simplified. I agree with this statement, as I feel that an
+overly simple, one-size-fits-all--we are smarter than everybody
+else in Washington, DC--as we heard our opening statements
+today from our Ranking Member--approach to climate change
+should lead to serious issues, as what may work for one state
+may not work for another.
+ Would you please elaborate on the problems that an
+expensive, one-size-fits-all, top-down solution might cause, if
+implemented?
+ Dr. Curry. Well, a whole host of unintended consequences,
+some of which we can't even imagine right now. And because of
+that, we need to avoid the hubris of thinking that we can
+predict what the future climate will do, and that we can
+actually control the climate.
+ If we were somehow successful in putting all these policies
+into place and getting CO2 emissions down to zero, I
+think we would be unpleasantly surprised at how little impact
+this actually has on the things that worry us most about
+extreme weather events, and things like that.
+ Sea level rise is not--we are not going to turn that one on
+a dime, things like that. It is very tough to change the
+climate, has a whole lot of inertia in the system. Many
+timescales. The Pacific responds very slowly. So, even with
+success in reducing the CO2 emissions down to zero,
+it would be a long time to turn the corner on having that
+actually impact the climate.
+ So, we need to do some of the more bottom-up type things.
+And the states are wonderful laboratories for trying out all
+these adaptation resilience kind of policies, and I think we
+should try to figure out how to help that flourish, the so-
+called innovation dividend.
+ Mr. Hern. Since you brought that up, last week I had the
+fortunate opportunity--we have an organization called Grand
+River Dam Authority that is a public-private partnership in our
+state of Oklahoma that has been around since the 1930s that was
+formed originally by the government through some grants to
+build some dams to lock up energy so that we could use that to
+handle flooding on the Arkansas River, the McClellan-Kerr
+Navigation System, as it came to be in the 1960s.
+ We also have in our industrial park in Pryor, Oklahoma, the
+largest Google server farm in their company. It relocated there
+to take over a Gatorade plant with the qualification that they
+would only use renewable power. We had a conscious decision,
+even though it is not in my district--the state, the GRDA had a
+conscious decision to make on free-market enterprise. Do we
+want that there? Do we want to go through the cost of upgrading
+the grid, upgrading the technology to conform to the purchase
+of Google's 100 megawatts? And we felt like the cost benefit
+analysis of that made sense.
+ It was a small plant at that time. It has since quadrupled
+in size. And, from all the Google people that I have talked to,
+they are so proud of the relationship in a free-market
+environment, working with renewable credits to get to where
+they are at so that, on the grid, GRDA has a great mixture of
+hydro, solar, wind, coal, and natural gas.
+ To the testimony from Mr. Hollie earlier, that you have to
+have backups on this, so that the cost of having a battery-type
+environment when you don't have solar and you don't have wind,
+that you can actually have power to fuel and to warm our homes
+and businesses around our particular districts and our states
+and our country.
+ Thank you for your time. Thank you for testimony. I yield
+back my time.
+ The Chairman. Thank you, sir.
+ Mr. McEachin.
+ Mr. McEachin. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
+ First of all, thank you for your leadership on the most
+urgent threat facing our planet: climate change.
+ I want to thank the panelists for being here today. And in
+particular, I am very happy to see my good friend, Reverend
+Yearwood, here today.
+ Reverend, I have enjoyed working with you over the past 2
+years, and I look forward to our continued partnership. In that
+vein, Reverend, I want to start with you.
+ Amazingly, it has been articulated today that there is a
+mistaken idea that moving toward a clean energy economy will
+hurt low-income communities and communities of color. I need
+you to speak to what the rising health and economic costs of
+climate change would be for those communities, specifically if
+we fail to move in that direction.
+ Rev. Yearwood. Thank you, Congressman, for that question.
+ First, we can definitely fight poverty and pollution at the
+same time. And let me say clearly that the assessment that Mr.
+Hollie--respectfully, I disagree completely with what he put
+forth as the idea that people of color are not concerned about
+the climate, about climate change, about the environment, about
+their health.
+ Mr. Hollie. I didn't say that.
+ Rev. Yearwood. We know that 200,000 Americans are dying
+yearly because of air pollution. We know that we have millions
+of children and millions of adults who have asthma, emphysema,
+and are getting cancer. We know that 68 percent of people of
+color, black people, are living within 30 miles of coal-fired
+power plants. We know that the de-regulations or the mercury
+rule and the car rule and many of the rules being rolled back
+by EPA would hurt people of color.
+ So, one of the things here that I just want to say. And,
+Mr. Hollie, please understand the reason why I was making this
+assessment is this. For me, as a minister, having buried a
+young girl because of asthma, that mother no longer cares about
+how much that utility bill would have cost. That child I had to
+bury because of asthma. She would have much more been concerned
+about dealing with a particular matter in the atmosphere.
+ So, the health concerns are one of the key concerns that
+are within the communities of color. The idea that we are not
+also concerned about our future and the future generation is,
+frankly, absurd. The idea that we don't care that we first and
+worst will be hurt by climate change is outlandish.
+ The fact, for me, being from Louisiana and seeing what
+happened with Hurricane Katrina, or Harvey in Houston, those
+are the kind of things that have a huge impact on communities
+of color. So, to sit up here honestly at this critical moment
+and to then purport the idea that people of color are somehow
+making the decision that they are more concerned about their
+energy bill than their health, their energy bill than their
+life, then that is literally ludicrous.
+ If you think anybody--and it was come to earlier about this
+was Black History Month and civil rights. The idea that poverty
+is also put upon with communities of color is also outlandish.
+This is not about this poor people of color, but poor white
+people also, as a matter of fact, want clean air and clean
+water.
+ As I said earlier, climate change is a civil rights issue.
+ Mr. McEachin. Thank you very much, Reverend.
+ Am I pronouncing this correctly? Is it Yeampierre, Ms.
+Yeampierre?
+ Ms. Yeampierre. It is Yeampierre, yes.
+ Mr. McEachin. How do we make sure that, as we move toward a
+clean energy economy, that we invest greener technologies in
+low-income communities and communities of color so they are not
+left behind? How do we do that?
+ Ms. Yeampierre. Whether it is in Michigan, whether it is in
+Detroit or in Brooklyn, New York, or Richmond, California,
+whether it is fracking going on in people's backyards,
+communities of color and front-line communities, whether they
+are in Indian Country, are working on operationalizing just
+transitions. They are looking at different economies of scale,
+anything from community-owned solar to trying to figure out how
+they can create food systems that will withstand the changes
+that are coming.
+ And there has to be an investment in those communities. And
+we also need to start thinking about governance differently.
+Climate change is going to disrupt governance. The idea is that
+we need to start creating transformational partnerships with
+communities that are on the front line, and that are engaging
+in this kind of transformation.
+ The other thing is that the needs are different everywhere
+in the country. So, the needs of a rural community are not the
+same as an urban community. Folks that are dealing with
+mountain-top removal in Appalachia are dealing with different
+kinds of challenges. So, it isn't cookie-cutter, but it is a
+commitment to try to work with people on the ground, and being
+led by the ground in partnership, because that is what it is
+going to take.
+ Climate change is not going to--top-down solutions are not
+going to be sustained over time. They just don't work. People
+on the ground are going to have to lead. And we are going to
+have to be partners in those kinds of decisions, and sharing
+and creating a space where we share expertise and information
+with each other.
+ When the Reverend is talking about Louisiana, in my mind
+all I am thinking about was those floating black bodies. As
+people of African ancestry, that is the truth for all of us all
+over the United States, right? I think about Puerto Rico, I
+think about Louisiana. So, I think that it is really important
+that those communities that are leading and are doing the work,
+that they not be marginalized, and that they be supported and
+invested in.
+ The Chairman. Thank you----
+ Mr. McEachin. Thank you so much.
+ I yield back, Mr. Chairman.
+ The Chairman. Thank you.
+ Mr. Lamborn.
+ Mr. Lamborn. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I am going to
+concentrate with my questions and comments on the proposals
+that are out there to deal with climate change. I don't want to
+talk about climate change, the science behind it, the man-made
+role. I want to talk about the proposals that are on the table
+to deal with it.
+ And the main proposal that I have seen so far is the Green
+New Deal. I hear that my colleagues on the other side of the
+aisle may have some proposals coming forward to flesh this out,
+but right now, all we have is the Green New Deal, and we
+already have presidential contenders endorsing it.
+ We have the Green Party, that has talked a lot about it. I
+am going to use a few of their facts and figures. They say--and
+if you go to GP.org--that the transition to a Green New Deal
+will cost $13 trillion.
+ Right now, here is our dependence on hydrocarbons: 82
+percent of U.S. electricity is generated from coal, natural
+gas, and nuclear, leaving 18 percent from renewables and
+hydropower.
+ When it comes to transportation, we have 30,000 commercial
+air flights a day. I don't think a single one of those is
+powered by renewables. We have 250 million cars and trucks on
+the road. People in the United States travel 11 billion miles a
+day, and the vast majority of that is hydrocarbon powered. Some
+electric vehicles, some alternatives like propane and bio-fuel.
+ The Department of Defense, in particular--I am also on the
+Armed Services Committee--they spend a lot of money on energy,
+$13 billion a year. Much of that, if not most of that, is
+hydrocarbon-based.
+ According to the Green Party, in their plan for the Green
+New Deal, we would have to close all overseas bases and we
+would lay off 1.4 million people, both military and civilian.
+ To me that is very extreme. And this has to do something
+with the goal of no hydrocarbons by the year 2030, 11 years
+from now. So, I am going to just ask--I will start with you,
+Dr. Hollie. Is that realistic?
+ Mr. Hollie. No, sir. And you actually mentioned that 80
+percent of our total energy sources come from fossil fuels. I
+know that it has been that way since the turn of the century.
+It was that way when my grandfather was a black coal miner in
+southwest Virginia. It was that way when I was working for
+Norfolk Southern. And even the last EPA Director, Gina McCarthy
+under the Obama administration, stated that we were going to
+need fossil fuels at least through 2050.
+ Mr. Lamborn. And Dr. Curry?
+ Dr. Curry. The problem that I see with a massively
+ambitious top-down policy like the Green New Deal is: (a) what
+if we can't do it? What if we are wrong? And there are all
+sorts of things. It is not a problem that is amenable to that
+kind of a solution. That is why I propose more of a bottom-up
+kind of approach, the so-called innovation dividend, so we can
+try lots of different things, lots of solutions, and see what
+works.
+ Mr. Lamborn. I have to really agree with you. I think that
+the ingenuity and hard work and creativity of the American
+people is a real solution here, and should not be left out. We
+shouldn't--like you said, top-down from government coercion,
+government control, that sounds too much like a Soviet, 5-year
+plan, or something like that, which is simply not going to
+work.
+ I understand that if someone comes into Congress--you only
+have to be 25 years old to be a Member of Congress, and we have
+young people that bring a lot of great qualities, but maybe
+they don't bring a lot of life experience. So, I guess I can
+understand if someone hasn't a lot of life experience, and they
+are proposing something that is extremely unrealistic. Well,
+impossible, impossible.
+ But what I don't understand is if adults and grown-ups, who
+are older and more mature, are also advocating something that
+is impossible. And I see that with some of the presidential
+contenders who are throwing their names out there. They are
+plugging for something that is literally impossible.
+ With that, Mr. Chairman, I am going to yield back the
+balance of my time.
+ The Chairman. Well, let me put a pitch in for myself.
+ Ms. Yeampierre. Mr. Chairman, with all due respect, I just
+want to say----
+ The Chairman. No, we have to follow----
+ Ms. Yeampierre [continuing]. Our movements have been led by
+young people.
+ The Chairman. We have to follow the protocol.
+ Ms. Yeampierre. Our movements of civil rights divestment in
+South Africa, all led by young people. Let's not try to put
+them in a box.
+ The Chairman. Ma'am, the protocol and decorum for this,
+with all due respect, please. I mean we are trying to run this
+meeting in the way that is orderly. And while you might have an
+opinion and want to interject it at that moment, unless you are
+recognized, you can't. I appreciate that.
+ Let me put in a plug for myself, Mr. Lamborn. As an old-
+timer, I happen to agree with some of what our colleagues are
+saying here today, and some of our witnesses have said today. I
+don't know if that puts me out of step with my age group, but I
+would suggest that the vast majority of Americans feel the way
+I do.
+ But anyway, Ms. Velazquez.
+ Ms. Velazquez. Thank you, Mr. Chairman and Ranking Member.
+ I am very proud to be the Representative of a leading
+voice, an activist on climate change, Ms. Elizabeth Yeampierre.
+ Thank you for your service and for your activism. I would
+like to ask you the first question. As an advocate for climate
+justice with its ethical and political implications, what would
+you say to someone who thinks we should ignore climate change,
+despite low-income communities being disproportionately at risk
+from its impact?
+ Ms. Yeampierre. Congresswoman, it is wonderful to see you.
+You have been a champion for environmental justice for years,
+since even before it became a sexy thing. You have been doing
+it for all of your districts for so many years that I am
+honored to be speaking in front of you.
+ I don't engage climate deniers. I think it slows us down
+and wastes our time. I engage people who are at the margins,
+who don't know that they are living at the intersection of
+injustice and climate change. And I try to inspire and provide
+information to those people, so that they know that their lives
+are at risk and the future of their children is at risk.
+ I want folks in our communities to know that things like
+power plants that are run by gas produce NOx, SOx, PM2.5 and
+all of those particulates that get trapped in the air passages
+of our children and our elders because our elders are going to
+be tremendously vulnerable in the face of climate change.
+ So, that is what I do. I try to reach people's hearts and
+minds. But first they need to have hearts and minds.
+ Ms. Velazquez. Thank you.
+ Ms. DiPerna, in which countries do you see businesses
+making the greatest efforts toward addressing climate change?
+And why is that the case?
+ Ms. DiPerna. Thank you.
+ Ms. Velazquez. And I am sorry if this question has been
+asked.
+ Ms. DiPerna. No, no.
+ Ms. Velazquez. I was absent from this important hearing
+because I am the Chair of the Small Business Committee and we
+were holding a hearing on the government's shutdown impact on
+small businesses.
+ Ms. DiPerna. Well, first of all, the question wasn't asked.
+And second, as a New Yorker, I am also delighted to see you.
+And thank you for your decades, years of service.
+ With regard to companies in our country, it isn't that they
+are not doing anything. On the contrary, they see the risks, as
+I said earlier, and are being driven to take proactive measures
+to protect their business supply chains, and so on.
+ But with regard to your question, these companies operate
+in a global environment more and more. For example, you have
+the European Union, which has instigated very, very strong
+regulations, particularly looking at the fiduciary
+responsibility of companies and are they operating within
+parameters that recognize the risks they may face. And, of
+course, shareholders are ordinary people very often. They are
+not just rich people--401(k)s are involved.
+ With regard to some interesting things going on, for
+example, China--I know there is lots of controversy about
+China, but China has declared an ecological civilization. It is
+built into their national program. They are making tremendous
+investments in solar energy. Morocco has taken tremendous steps
+to establish targets.
+ And with all due respect to all the debate, this is not an
+either-or situation. Precisely, we need an energy mix.
+Precisely, we have to use a bit of natural gas to make
+renewables less expensive. I mean, this is definitely not an
+either-or. And it is certainly not a choice between top-down or
+bottom-up. This is a very complex problem, which has been
+stated. Everybody has a stake in it. And companies are very
+much benefiting and would benefit from a smoothing of the
+requirements, so that they don't have to have different
+operations, one country to the other. That is very expensive.
+ Ms. Velazquez. Thank you.
+ Ms. DiPerna. Thank you.
+ Ms. Velazquez. Ms. Yeampierre, a huge barrier for
+sustainable communities, whether large or small, seems to be
+management, waste management. As a member of the Transform
+Don't Trash campaign, how can we urge largely populated cities
+to be aggressive when asking steps toward zero waste?
+ Ms. Yeampierre. I was invited to speak in Amsterdam by an
+international organization that is trying to get businesses to
+become more sustainable and take responsibility for their
+practices. All over the world, businesses know that they will
+suffer and they will lose income because of climate change.
+ And, then, locally, we have been working with small
+businesses to become climate adaptable, because they are
+literally the heart of, the economic driver in our community.
+ So, I think, going toward zero waste is really important.
+When we started working with the small businesses, and we were
+trying to get them to move away from Styrofoam, we also
+presented them with alternatives that were affordable and the
+idea of creating cooperatives, so that they could reduce the
+cost. There are all kinds of things that we can do with
+businesses so that we can move them away from using products
+and working in a way that makes them unsustainable. So, that is
+happening locally.
+ Ms. Velazquez. Thank you.
+ I yield back my time.
+ The Chairman. Thank you.
+ Mr. Gosar.
+ Dr. Gosar. I thank the Chairman. I just heard that we are
+citing China as being a good actor. A net increase in new coal
+plants were built in 2017 with China accounting for 34 of the
+61 megawatts that were actually generated. Wow, China is the
+biggest polluter in the world. India right behind them.
+ Mr. Hollie, I have to come back to you. I have heard
+statements that climate impacts different communities.
+ Mr. Hollie. Yes, sir.
+ Dr. Gosar. What communities are hit most by the policies
+like the Green New Deal?
+ Mr. Hollie. Minority and low-income communities, just
+because we cannot afford the rise in cost that will be
+associated with these policies.
+ And, like I said, many people are struggling right now to
+pay their energy bills.
+ Dr. Gosar. Well, this is interesting, because I keep
+hearing this thing about energy. Are you familiar with baseload
+energy versus intermittent energy?
+ Mr. Hollie. Somewhat.
+ Dr. Gosar. OK. So, I guess what we have to look at is
+baseload energy happens all the time, 24/7. But intermittent,
+like solar and wind, if the wind doesn't blow and the sun
+doesn't shine, it isn't going to work.
+ Mr. Hollie. Right.
+ Dr. Gosar. OK? There is a very big difference along those
+applications.
+ The problem that we have with baseload energy, with new
+technology, is molten-salt batteries don't work real well. The
+other side is not interested in rare earths, and the mining
+capacities of those that actually help us with new technology
+called battery capacity. So, we have a problem.
+ Because it is convenient in Phoenix, Arizona, when you need
+energy at the middle of the day, when you don't get it, or at
+night time, when temperatures are at 120. It is kind of hard to
+tell minority groups, ``Just live with it.''
+ Mr. Hollie. Yes, sir. I would agree with that. And that is
+one of the things that I would disagree with the Reverend here
+is I never said that, we don't agree that climate change does
+not exist. However, my point is until we find a way, a solution
+to harness those renewables to sustain ourselves, then we have
+to use what we've got. And we have an abundance of affordable
+and reliable energy in this country, and we need to use it.
+ Dr. Gosar. Oh, I agree. In fact, one of the companies in
+northern Scottsdale in Arizona uses sun during the day and gas
+at night, because it delivers uniform delivery on our grid. So,
+very important to do that.
+ But I want to concentrate on something else. I am a
+dentist, so science is a big deal to me. And if we are talking
+about carbon sequestration, it seems to me like what we want to
+have is a very dynamic, engaging forest.
+ Dr. Curry, would you agree?
+ Dr. Curry. I think land use is a very big deal, including--
+--
+ Dr. Gosar. I want to get more specific: photosynthesis,
+like plants take in clean oxygen, right, and produce carbon
+dioxide. No, they take in carbon dioxide, produce oxygen. They
+take in dirty water, produce clean water.
+ So, it seems to me, if we really want to address this, we
+want to look at the best carbon trap we have, which is a
+healthy, vibrant forest. And I have heard over and over again
+that climate change is the problem with our forest burning up.
+That is not the case.
+ I am from Arizona. Ponderosa forests are 40 to 60 trees per
+acre. That is fact. That is what a healthy forest should look
+like. But what we have, because of lawsuit after lawsuit after
+lawsuit, we have 800 to 1,000 trees per acre. These starving
+trees raise to the sunlight, and what ends up happening is when
+we get these fires, they are no longer landscape fires on the
+grasslands, they are treetop fires.
+ And I want to quote exactly what we saw last year.
+Wildfires--this is PolitiFact: ``Wildfires produce more of one
+key pollutant, particulate matter, than cars both in California
+and nationwide. Particulate matter is a mixture of microscopic
+particles and liquid droplets that, when inhaled, can affect
+the heart and lungs and cause serious health problems.''
+ I heard this all along this panel right here, about asthma
+and all that stuff. Listen to this: ``According to U.S.
+Geological Survey, wildfires in California in 2018 released
+enough--roughly equivalent of 86 million tons--of heat-trapping
+carbon dioxide, the same amount of carbon emissions that are
+produced in a year providing electricity for an entire state.''
+ So, if we are going to concentrate on this carbon
+sequestration, I think we ought to be looking at our forests
+being adaptive. I am part of the Western Caucus. We had a
+number of different opportunities to look at good neighbor. In
+fact, one of the most liberal bastions in my state, Coconino
+County, passed a bond levy to actually start thinning the
+forest so they had a dynamic interface to stop the fire, Number
+1, and Number 2 is get it more dynamic for carbon
+sequestration.
+ Would you agree with all those synopses, Dr. Curry?
+ Dr. Curry. Most of it. The life cycle of a forest is--it
+has a complex interaction with CO2. At some point it
+becomes not so much of a sequestration. So, managing forests to
+prevent wildfires and to maximize the CO2 uptake is
+certainly a sensible policy.
+ Dr. Gosar. And one quick indulgence. A dynamic forest is
+young trees, medium-growth trees, and old-growth trees, because
+what we know is young and medium-growth trees produce more
+oxygen than they do carbon, as the older the tree gets the less
+they do.
+ Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
+ The Chairman. Thank you very much.
+ Mr. Horsford.
+ Mr. Horsford. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. I am very
+excited that you have given us this opportunity to really have
+a robust discussion around climate change. This is an issue
+that is very important to each of us individually,
+collectively, to the future of our children.
+ My oldest son, who is now a freshman in college, asks me
+all the time, ``When is Congress going to act to address the
+issues of climate change?''
+ As we have heard here today, the impacts of climate change
+become greater every year. In my home state of Nevada, a desert
+state, it is particularly vulnerable to the changing climate.
+By 2050, it is projected that the city of Las Vegas will
+experience 106 days per year with temperatures upwards of 105
+degrees.
+ To provide context, Las Vegas currently averages 70 days
+per year with temperatures more than 100 degrees. It is hot in
+Vegas. But the fact that we are having those many days per year
+over 100 degrees is just one example.
+ Even more concerning, by 2050 the typical number of heat-
+wave days in Nevada is projected to increase from 15 days per
+year to 55 days per year. According to the Ready Public Service
+campaign of the Department of Homeland Security, extreme heat
+results in the highest number of annual deaths among all
+weather-related hazards.
+ Mr. Chairman, sadly, seniors and children are at greatest
+risk of death during heat waves. Lake Mead, which supplies
+water to more than 90 percent of Las Vegas, and roughly 25
+million people throughout Nevada, California, and Arizona,
+continued to deplete at an alarming rate, due to increasing
+temperatures caused by climate change. And in 2016, Lake Mead,
+which is fed by the Colorado River, reached its lowest level on
+record, and now holds just 37 percent of its original capacity.
+ As occurrence of extreme heat rises, the depletion of the
+Colorado River and Lake Mead is projected to worsen in the
+future. Additionally, more than 1.2 million people living in
+Nevada, or 46 percent of our state's population, live in areas
+at elevated risk of wildfire. As extreme temperatures increase,
+especially in drought years, the risk of wildfires will
+continue to rise.
+ So, the people of Nevada, like people across the United
+States, are looking for solutions. And they are looking for
+this Congress to act.
+ Ms. DiPerna, I want to ask you whether your organization,
+which works with businesses to understand the business investor
+impacts, if you can talk to me about the heat waves and drought
+and how they are a significant concern, and how water issues,
+particularly around companies and investors, are dealing with
+this particular issue, and if there are examples that you know
+in our home state of Nevada.
+ Ms. DiPerna. Well, as a matter of fact, today we are having
+our supply chain conference in Las Vegas. And, as I mentioned
+in my testimony, Caesar's Entertainment is very concerned about
+the cost of water. They have facilities in very dry areas,
+southern Africa, and so on. Dr. Pepper, I mentioned, is also
+concerned. Every company is worried about water.
+ And Dr. Cobb mentioned the carbon pricing. I think it would
+be interesting for you all to know that most companies in the
+country, including Oklahoma Gas and Electric, are using
+internal carbon prices to gauge the potential cost of these
+sort of hidden hitchhikers, which are these carbons that go up
+into the atmosphere that we don't see, but which cost us
+something. So, people are using an internal carbon price in
+anticipation of regulation, or to deal with existing
+regulations in the jurisdictions where they are covered by
+regulation.
+ On the water matter, because of increasing water scarcity,
+companies have begun to also set an internal water price,
+because they need to begin to come to terms with the increase
+in cost of water, the increasing scarcity. And even more to the
+point, the increasing lack of usability. Water is potable or
+usable. We are beginning to have less potable and certainly
+less usable, unless we spend a lot of money to clean it.
+ Now, here is where the impact on the poor is potentially
+catastrophic, because they will have to pass that cost on.
+There will never be one other drop of water on this Earth. It
+is all here. You can't make water, so we are into an ultimate
+scarcity there. And I think that I can provide you with a lot
+of information from our water disclosure. Company after company
+is concerned about water. And the IT industry, in particular,
+because they need to cool those data centers with water. So,
+their energy costs are climbing. Cooling is becoming a very big
+cost.
+ So, it is a complex system. You can't tease out one little
+bit. But you are the government of the entire country, and so
+we all look to you to put all the pieces together.
+ Thank you.
+ The Chairman. Mr. Graves.
+ Mr. Graves. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
+ Dr. Cobb, I missed some of your comments earlier, but I
+understand you had raised concerns about energy production and
+fisheries, and I just wanted to make note that my home state of
+Louisiana, we produce more offshore energy in the Federal
+waters than any other state. In fact, I think we would take the
+other five states that produce and multiply times four, that is
+how much offshore energy we produce.
+ We are also the top fisheries producer, in terms of
+commercial fisheries in the continental United States. There is
+a habitat that is created by the energy infrastructure. I don't
+think we have done a great job managing that, in regard to--I
+think we can take advantage of rigs to reefs programs and
+others. But I did just want to make note that that is really
+the hotbed ecosystem or habitat for many of the fisheries in
+Louisiana.
+ In the first panel, I brought up a letter from May 2018.
+That letter was signed by Senators Schumer, Cantwell, Menendez,
+and Markey. That letter was written to the President of the
+United States, asking that the President work with our OPEC
+allies to increase--to increase--global oil production.
+ I am going to say that again. Senators Menendez, Markey,
+Cantwell, and Schumer, May 2018, asking the President to work
+with OPEC to increase oil production, saying that increased
+production will result in lower energy prices.
+ Yet, it was interesting in that the first panel, some of
+the governors that were here, talked about how their efforts to
+help to reduce emissions were benefiting everyone. But I
+looked, for example, at the state of Massachusetts that was
+represented here. Their kilowatt hour electricity cost was more
+than twice that, more than 200 percent that of my home state of
+Louisiana, which I just thought was interesting.
+ Mr. Hollie, I am just curious. Could you share any
+reflections on just that balance of how do we pursue a climate
+policy agenda legislation, while at the same time not adversely
+affect our citizens? How do we strike that balance?
+ Mr. Hollie. Yes, sir. I actually had the chance to visit
+your state over the summer.
+ Mr. Graves. Come back any time, any of you.
+ Mr. Hollie. Down to Port Fourchon, where we had the
+opportunity to see where all the on-shore operations take place
+for all the offshore.
+ And also when I took the tour of Port Fourchon, they talked
+about how countries come from around the world to study the
+Gulf because it is so rich in wildlife and the environment.
+ So, what that says to me is that energy exploration can co-
+exist with wildlife and the environment. So, as long as we have
+that to look at and use as a gauge, I think that is a great
+place to start.
+ Mr. Graves. Thank you. And let me be clear, we have some
+extraordinary coastal challenges.
+ Ms. Yeampierre--did I do that OK? We can engage. I am not a
+climate denier, I just have really struggled with how we find
+the right balance in sort of criteria that we use here to move
+forward on legislation.
+ I am curious, Dr. Curry. One of the rule changes that I
+tried to make in this Committee last week was a rule that would
+cause us to evaluate the job impacts and economic impacts, and
+try to quantify temperature and sea rise impacts and other
+things on legislation we progressed.
+ Do you have any thoughts on how do we properly use criteria
+or metrics to determine which legislation is actually going to
+be helpful, in balance, in what may be weighted too hard toward
+job losses, or too hard toward other things that is just not
+really advancing a public win or a public goal? Does that make
+sense?
+ Dr. Curry. Well, sort of. This is why I called climate
+change a wicked problem, why myself and others refer to it as a
+wicked problem. It is hard to even define the problem. The
+boundaries just seem to ever expand. The impacts are very wide.
+No matter what policy we propose, there is bound to be
+unintended consequences. So, it is a big challenge to sort
+through all that.
+ And the approach to me that seems to work the best is where
+communities and states work to secure their common interests,
+which are very specific to their location, their economy, their
+population, their vulnerabilities, as we try to sort through
+this, rather than a big, top-down mandate.
+ So, that is my thinking on the subject. I wish there was a
+simple silver-bullet solution, but there isn't.
+ Mr. Graves. Thank you. And to comply with my commitment, I
+am going to yield back my 8 seconds.
+ The Chairman. You are very kind, thank you.
+ The bell was about votes being called. Before adjourning
+the meeting, let me thank the panel, the second panel. As many
+of the questions, the perspectives my colleagues have brought
+up when they asked you questions--and rather than repeat the
+same ones over again, let me just thank Ms. Nazar. Thank you
+very much. I think your presence here and your testimony talks
+about us looking beyond our nose, as Members of Congress, to
+think about the future, your generation, generations to follow.
+ And this issue of climate change, what I did learn today is
+that maybe we are not in full-blown, full-throated denial as we
+were. We are into a different phase, which is climate change
+avoidance. And what can we do to stall, change, tinker with the
+science, raise issues that are meant to slow any solution-
+seeking or policies or legislative initiatives to deal with
+this very urgent problem.
+ Ms. Yeampierre and Reverend, thank you very much. The
+front-line communities and communities most impacted in a
+disparate way by unabated climate change and no solution
+seeking and an afterthought in the policy making, you made sure
+that those are front and center in the discussion around issues
+of justice, equity, access, and inclusion, and I want to thank
+you for that. That is very, very important.
+ Too often, we make policies at this level, and then have to
+backtrack because, obviously, the impact was never dealt with.
+And as we seek solutions, that equity has to be part of the
+discussion all the way down.
+ Dr. Cobb, thank you very much for bringing to bear what I
+think is essential in the solution seeking, that is empirical
+information and science, and we will go from there. That having
+been absent in the last 2 years, that is no longer going to be
+the case. Our guidepost needs to be science and facts and
+empirical information. And if those are the guideposts, we can
+move forward. And I have every intention of making sure that is
+central to the discussion.
+ I also want to thank Ms. DiPerna for bringing to light
+about businesses. And with or without regulations, that, in
+anticipation of what is coming, they are preparing. And just as
+the economic engines of this country of us in this world are
+preparing for climate change, we should be preparing for
+everyone else, to make sure that we confront this and deal with
+it. So, I appreciate your information very much.
+ And on that note, let me thank you. It is the first
+hearing. I appreciate your indulgence, as I failed to manage
+the clock accurately, but it all worked out. And we will go
+forward. Each Subcommittee will now take upon itself from this
+Committee to have a similar hearing dealing with that
+jurisdiction, as we go forward.
+ This Committee, as Mr. Bishop said, has a lot under the
+jurisdiction. We feel we over 20 percent of the legislative
+adaptation and solution--public lands, waters, oceans, and the
+jurisdiction that is brought, and we intend to pursue it that
+way. It is a task that we can't ignore, and your testimony
+today made it abundantly clear that it is something we can't
+ignore, and in urgency we must deal with it with haste, and not
+stall, avoid, or ignore it.
+ Thank you very much.
+ The meeting is adjourned.
+
+ [Whereupon, at 1:36 p.m., the Committee was adjourned.]
+
+ [ADDITIONAL MATERIALS SUBMITTED FOR THE RECORD]
+
+ Prepared Statement of the Hon. Debbie Dingell, a Representative in
+ Congress from the State of Michigan
+ Thank you, Chairman Grijalva and Ranking Member Bishop, for
+convening this hearing to discuss the threat of climate change and next
+steps to address this issue.
+ As a Member of Congress from Michigan, the Great Lakes State, I
+understand firsthand the importance of addressing climate change and
+safeguarding our environment for future generations.
+ The Great Lakes are fundamental to our Nation's environmental and
+economic well-being. As the single largest surface freshwater source on
+Earth, the Great Lakes watershed supports countless wildlife and serves
+as an important source of fresh drinking water to tens of millions of
+Americans, whose health is directly tied to that of the Great Lakes
+ecosystem.
+ Climate change threatens to destabilize this ecosystem, putting the
+health and well-being of my constituents and millions of others at
+risk.
+ Additionally, we have already seen the impact of climate change
+through increased incidence of deadly wildfires in the western United
+States, as well as stronger and more destructive hurricanes on the Gulf
+and Atlantic Coasts.
+ The cause of these extreme events is indisputable. According to the
+Trump administration's own National Climate Assessment released last
+year, ``Earth's climate is now changing faster than at any point in the
+history of modern civilization, primarily as a result of human
+activities.''
+ Simply put, climate change is already threatening our public
+health, our economy, and our national security.
+ The magnitude of this threat demands bold action, and we must work
+to address this urgent issue without delay.
+ We must promote renewable energy, commit to investing in new
+technology, and redouble our conservation efforts to mitigate, adapt,
+and reverse the growing climate threat.
+ Additionally, we must rejoin our partners in the international
+community by committing to the Paris Climate Accord and taking strong
+action to limit future greenhouse gas emissions.
+ There is not a single American who will be unaffected by climate
+change, and I look forward to working with all my colleagues,
+regardless of background or party, to take serious action to address
+climate change.
+ It is my hope that today's hearing underscores the need for bold
+climate action. We must put our differences aside and take the
+aggressive actions needed to safeguard our planet for future
+generations.
+
+ ______
+
+
+ Prepared Statement of the Hon. Jody B. Hice, a Representative in
+ Congress from the State of Georgia
+ Look, everyone knows I'm a dyed-in-the-wool Georgia Bulldogs fan,
+and it sure was fun seeing our two running backs face off in the Super
+Bowl this past Sunday. However, I would be remiss if I did not thank
+former Georgia Tech professor, Dr. Judith Curry and current Georgia
+Tech professor, Dr. Kim Cobb for being with us today. The Georgia
+Institute of Technology is one of the most important public research
+universities in our Nation and the world, and we thank you both for
+lending your expertise to us here today.
+
+ ______
+
+
+ FACEBOOK,
+ Washington, DC
+
+ February 8, 2019
+
+Hon. Raul Grijalva, Chairman,
+Hon. Rob Bishop, Ranking Member,
+House Committee on Natural Resources,
+1324 Longworth House Office Building,
+Washington, DC 20515.
+
+ Dear Chairman Grijalva, Ranking Member Bishop, and distinguished
+members of the Committee:
+
+ We appreciate your leadership in convening the hearing, ``Climate
+Change: Impacts and the Need to Act,'' and we thank you for the
+opportunity to submit this statement. Climate change deserves close
+attention and creative solutions by both policymakers and industry
+leaders.
+ At Facebook, we are prioritizing our work to combat climate change,
+especially as it relates to our own sustainability objectives. As you
+know, sustainability within corporations is more than simply operating
+responsibly. We are working to minimize the impact of our energy,
+emissions, and water usage, protect workers and the environment in our
+supply chain, and partner with others to develop and share solutions
+for a more sustainable world. Our goal is to support the communities we
+are a part of and to make a bigger positive impact on the world.
+ Creating and maintaining facilities that contribute positively to
+our communities is a top priority for our company. Specifically,
+Facebook has set a science-based target to reduce our emissions by 75
+percent by 2020. Between 2011 and 2017, Facebook avoided emitting over
+2 million metric tons of CO2 thanks to these efforts--the equivalent of
+taking 266,000 vehicles off the road for a year.
+ Facebook was one of the first companies to commit to supporting our
+facilities with 100 percent renewable energy in 2011, and our goal is
+to hit that target by 2020. Our data centers are among the most energy
+efficient in the world. For each new data center Facebook builds, we
+add new renewable energy to the same electric grid as our facilities,
+and we do it in a way that often increases options for other businesses
+in those communities. We are proud that just last month, a report from
+Bloomberg New Energy Finance found that Facebook was the largest
+corporate purchaser of renewable energy last year worldwide.
+ Facebook embraces our responsibility and opportunity to impact the
+world beyond our operations. For example, we use rigorous sustainable
+design standards to ensure that our facilities are constructed with
+responsible materials, utilize natural daylight, and are energy and
+water conscious. All of our data centers have achieved LEED Gold
+certification.
+ As the Committee continues its work on climate change, we look
+forward to being part of the conversation on how companies like
+Facebook can have an impact on this important issue.
+
+ Sincerely,
+
+ Kevin Martin,
+ Vice President, U.S. Public Policy.
+
+ ______
+
+
+[LIST OF DOCUMENTS SUBMITTED FOR THE RECORD RETAINED IN THE COMMITTEE'S
+ OFFICIAL FILES]
+
+Submission for the Record by Rep. Grijalva
+
+ -- NOAA Report, U.S. and Global Climate for 2018.
+
+Submission for the Record by Rep. Neguse
+
+ -- ``Climate Change in Rocky Mountain National Park,''
+ National Park Service, U.S. Department of the
+ Interior, March 2014.
+
+ [all]
+