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+
+ - A GLOBAL CRISIS: REFUGEES, MIGRANTS, AND ASYLUM SEEKERS
+
+[House Hearing, 116 Congress]
+[From the U.S. Government Publishing Office]
+
+
+ A GLOBAL CRISIS: REFUGEES, MIGRANTS, AND ASYLUM SEEKERS
+
+=======================================================================
+
+ HEARING
+
+ BEFORE THE
+
+ COMMITTEE ON FOREIGN AFFAIRS
+ HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES
+
+ ONE HUNDRED SIXTEENTH CONGRESS
+
+ FIRST SESSION
+
+ Subcommittee on Africa, Global Health,
+ Global Human Rights, and International Organizations
+
+ __________
+
+ FEBRUARY 26, 2019
+
+ __________
+
+ Serial No. 116-5
+
+ __________
+
+ Printed for the use of the Committee on Foreign Affairs
+
+
+[GRAPHIC NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]
+
+
+ Available: http://www.foreignaffairs.house.gov/, http://
+ docs.house.gov,
+ or http://www.govinfo.gov
+
+
+ __________
+
+
+ U.S. GOVERNMENT PUBLISHING OFFICE
+35-363PDF WASHINGTON : 2019
+
+-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
+For sale by the Superintendent of Documents, U.S. Government Publishing Office,
+http://bookstore.gpo.gov. For more information, contact the GPO Customer Contact Center,
+U.S. Government Publishing Office. Phone 202-512-1800, or 866-512-1800 (toll-free).E-mail,
+[email protected].
+
+
+ COMMITTEE ON FOREIGN AFFAIRS
+
+ ELIOT L. ENGEL, New York, Chairman
+
+BRAD SHERMAN, California MICHAEL T. McCAUL, Texas, Ranking
+GREGORY W. MEEKS, New York Member
+ALBIO SIRES, New Jersey CHRISTOPHER H. SMITH, New Jersey
+GERALD E. CONNOLLY, Virginia STEVE CHABOT, Ohio
+THEODORE E. DEUTCH, Florida JOE WILSON, South Carolina
+KAREN BASS, California SCOTT PERRY, Pennsylvania
+WILLIAM KEATING, Massachusetts TED S. YOHO, Florida
+DAVID CICILLINE, Rhode Island ADAM KINZINGER, Illinois
+AMI BERA, California LEE ZELDIN, New York
+JOAQUIN CASTRO, Texas JIM SENSENBRENNER, Wisconsin
+DINA TITUS, Nevada ANN WAGNER, Missouri
+ADRIANO ESPAILLAT, New York BRIAN MAST, Florida
+TED LIEU, California FRANCIS ROONEY, Florida
+SUSAN WILD, Pennsylvania BRIAN FITZPATRICK, Pennsylvania
+DEAN PHILLPS, Minnesota JOHN CURTIS, Utah
+ILHAN OMAR, Minnesota KEN BUCK, Colorado
+COLIN ALLRED, Texas RON WRIGHT, Texas
+ANDY LEVIN, Michigan GUY RESCHENTHALER, Pennsylvania
+ABIGAIL SPANBERGER, Virginia TIM BURCHETT, Tennessee
+CHRISSY HOULAHAN, Pennsylvania GREG PENCE, Indiana
+TOM MALINOWSKI, New Jersey STEVE WATKINS, Kansas
+DAVID TRONE, Maryland MIKE GUEST, Mississippi
+JIM COSTA, California
+JUAN VARGAS, California
+VICENTE GONZALEZ, Texas
+
+
+ Jason Steinbaum, Democratic Staff Director
+ Brendan Shields, Republican Staff Director
+
+
+
+ ------
+
+ Subcommittee on Africa, Global Health, Global Human Rights, and
+ International Organizations
+
+ KAREN BASS, California, Chairman
+
+SUSAN WILD, Pennslvania CHRISTOPHER H. SMITH, New Jersey,
+DEAN PHILLIPS, Minnesota Ranking Member
+ILHAN OMAR, Minnesota JIM SENSENBRENNER, Jr., Wisconsin
+CHRISSY HOULAHAN, Pennsylvania RON WRIGHT, California
+ TIM BURCHETT, Tennessee
+
+
+ C O N T E N T S
+
+ ----------
+ Page
+
+ WITNESSES
+
+Ruiz, Hon. Raul, a Representative in Congress from the State of
+ California..................................................... 9
+Buwalda, Annigje, Executive Director, Jubilee Campaign, USA...... 20
+Mace, Ryan, Grassroots Advocacy and Refugee Specialist, Amnesty
+ International.................................................. 34
+Schwartz, Honorable Eric, President, Refugees International,
+ Former Assistant Secretary of State for Population, Refugees,
+ and Migration.................................................. 45
+
+ APPENDIX
+
+Hearing Notice................................................... 69
+Hearing Minutes.................................................. 70
+Hearing Attendance............................................... 71
+
+
+ A GLOBAL CRISIS: REFUGEES, MIGRANTS, AND ASYLUM SEEKERS
+
+ February 26, 2019
+
+ House of Representatives,
+ Committee on Foreign Affairs,
+ Washington, DC
+
+ The subcommittee met, pursuant to notice, at 2:02 p.m., in
+Room 2200, Rayburn House Office Building, Hon. Karen Bass
+(chairwoman of the subcommittee) presiding.
+ Ms. Bass. Good afternoon, I welcome everyone to the first
+hearing of the 116th Congress for this subcommittee.
+ I want to welcome the new members of our subcommittee.
+ This hearing is now called to order. Without objection,
+members have 5 legislative days in which to submit their
+statements and materials for the record.
+ Since I do not have a gavel, I will just knock on the
+table. So given that there are many new members on this
+subcommittee, I wanted to take time for the first few hearings
+to really do an overview of the jurisdiction. I mean we are
+blessed to have our ranking member here who has been on this
+committee and working in the subject area for more than 3
+decades, but for the new members that are here we really wanted
+to take time and review all of the different subject areas. So
+delving into U.S. policy toward Africa, having a hearing on
+global health, looking at international organizations. And we
+will do this through a series of hearings.
+ I also wanted to invite the members to a meeting that we
+are going to have on March 11th, which will be with all of the
+Ambassadors from the African continent. In April we will do a
+congressional delegation to Africa, looking at the role of the
+U.S. military on the continent. This specific hearing focuses
+on the intersection of global health, human rights, and
+international organizations.
+ The world is experiencing what many experts say is an
+unprecedented humanitarian and displacement crisis. I am sure
+many of us have seen images flash across our TV screen that
+include massive numbers of citizens displaced from Syria,
+Myanmar, the Democratic Republic of the Congo, Yemen and
+others. But we also have to acknowledge that this is also
+happening right here on our own doorstep.
+ According to the U.N. High Commissioner for Refugees in
+2017, more than 68 million people were forcibly displaced
+worldwide. Those displaced included 25 million refugees, 3.1
+million asylum seekers and 40 million IDP's are internally
+displaced persons.
+ People leave their countries for a variety of reasons, but
+most are forcibly displaced due to armed conflict, widespread
+or indiscriminate violence, human rights violations and/or
+persecution. Another category of displaced people includes the
+millions affected yearly by natural disasters, such as
+earthquakes, storms or drought.
+ We can all imagine that the choice to leave one's home
+cannot be easy. After escaping some of the most challenging
+circumstances in their home countries, these migrants,
+refugees, and asylum seekers endure difficult journeys that
+often puts them at risk for exploitation.
+ While there are many more cases, including people displaced
+from Afghanistan, Iraq, Sudan, and South Sudan, the situations
+I have referenced highlight that there are numerous root causes
+for why people are forced to leave. This is why it is critical
+for the United States to continue to support the State
+Department and USAID, given that their programs are often aimed
+at investing in women, girls, and youth. It is better to
+address the root causes for why people have to leave their
+countries.
+ I would be remiss if I did not mention that the United
+States is also confronting our own challenges on how to engage
+with refugees, migrants, and asylum seekers. As we watch images
+of these vulnerable populations making their difficult
+journeys, we have to ask the same questions that we were asked
+if it were the Rohingya, arriving exhausted, hungry and sick,
+after walking for days through jungles or mountains or braving
+dangerous sea voyages. This is important because we should also
+hold ourselves accountable. It is also important because it
+gives us more credibility in the world as we attempt to tackle
+the important issue of displaced persons around the world.
+ I look forward to hearing the testimony of our witnesses as
+we attempt to understand the magnitude of this crisis. I want
+to thank the witness, especially our colleague Representative
+Raul Ruiz.
+ I yield to my friend and colleague, Ranking Member Smith.
+ Mr. Smith. Thank you very much.
+ Madam chair, congratulations to you on taking over the helm
+of this very, very important committee. It has been my
+privilege as you said to be on it as either chairman or ranking
+member since the 1990's. So it is great to be with you and we
+have worked very well together over the last several years. I
+deeply appreciate that.
+ We have been bipartisan on so many important issues, we
+have traveled together to places, we have been denied entry,
+for example DR Congo, but we did get into certainly Ethiopia.
+We have been to as well to South Sudan and had some very
+contentious meetings with Salva Kiir, very much deserved for
+his dropping the ball, particularly when it comes to refugees,
+IDPs, and basic humanitarianism.
+ Today's hearing is an interesting and a complex topic, a
+very important topic. I think it is right that we focus on
+refugees, and IDPs. I would like to side step some of the
+politics and focus instead on one category of people. But
+before I do I would note, and I think it is worth noting, that
+according to CRS the U.S. continues to be the largest donors of
+humanitarian assistance worldwide, providing nearly one-third
+of the total global contributions, more than 7 billion in 2016,
+9.3 billion in 2017 and 9.4 billion in 2018.
+ The U.N. Office for Coordination of Humanitarian Affairs
+anticipates that in 2019 more than 132 million people worldwide
+were requiring humanitarian assistance and protection as a
+result of conflict and disaster. Moreover, the U.N. High
+Commissioner of Refugees says that in 2018 more than 68.5
+million people were forcibly displaced worldwide due to war and
+conflict, widespread or indiscriminate violence and human
+rights violations. A huge number of people of great, great
+burden on each of these individuals and their families. The
+government that often are inadequate because of resources to
+care for them, putting an even more burden on the developed
+countries to step up and to assist.
+ I would point out that, you know, we--the last Congress I
+introduced H.R. 390 to assist those men and women who were
+escaping from ISIS. I chaired no less than 10 congressional
+hearings on their plight. There were 70,000 strong who made
+their way into Erbil. Every one of them a survivor of ISIS'
+genocide. And I am happy to say that the bill was signed into
+law in December, and it is designed to assist those individuals
+who went largely unassisted during several years of genocide by
+ISIS.
+ I do believe that there are a large number of people who
+are people of faith all over the world, including the people in
+China, who are kind of internally displaced, given that they
+are in concentration camps. Put there deliberately, the Muslim
+Uighurs because of Xi Jinping's horrific crackdown on religion,
+he called it Sinification. It is an effort to say that
+everyone, whether you be Falun Gong, Christian Tibetan
+Buddhist, or a Muslim Uighur, or anyone else need to comport
+with and conform with the communist ideology or else. You go to
+a gulag, you become internally displaced and you are just
+harassed and in many cases tortured.
+ In the last administration we did have trouble with
+allowing Christians from Syria to come into the United States
+and I held hearings on that as well. It was less than one half
+of 1 percent who came as refugees. I think that was
+unfortunate. It could have been rectified. I never got to the
+bottom as to why that was the case.
+ There was reliance on the UNHCR, which I greatly admire and
+respect as an organization. But frankly, there are a lot of
+Christians who simply will not go there. If they did the women
+would be harassed, sexually abused, raped in many cases and the
+men would be beaten. So they chose another route, many went to
+Lebanon, many went to Erbil in the case of the Christians who
+escaped, and again I went and visited, talked to those people,
+and they wondered where was the United States? Why were you not
+helping us? That is being rectified.
+ Anna Eshoo who is the cosponsor of my bill, we had a number
+of bipartisan cosponsors, including the gentlelady who is now
+the chair, really is making the difference to reach out to
+those people who were persecuted and so maltreated.
+ We also need to continue to help the Rohingya in Burma who
+are persecuted, the Ahmadiyya in Pakistan who are considered
+apostate by the Sunni majority and are in greater need of
+asylum as well. Again to underscore, the Muslim Uighurs this
+number approximates what we saw in the second world war. With
+so many people being put into concentration camps.
+ Last year, I had 2 hearings on this. One woman Mihrigul,
+who is a Muslim, Tursen testified and said she was tortured in
+the chair, a hideous device used by the Chinese Government and
+was hoping for death. She goes, I wanted to die, it was just so
+painful. And why was she--she asked her jailer, why am I being
+so maltreated? He said, because you are an Uighur and because
+you are Muslim. Those two things.
+ I think the whole world has to speak up even more
+aggressively to this carnage being visited upon people of faith
+and others who do not conform to the communist dictatorship of
+Beijing. And again we need to do more, always more for
+refugees, IDPs, because they are--and I do see my old friend
+who used to be at the National Security Council for the Clinton
+Administration, who when we had a problem with people who were
+being forced back to Vietnam, pursuant to the comprehensive
+plan of action and I thought it was a very major mistake on
+some but in the Clinton Administration to do so, we had a
+friend and ally in Eric Schwartz, in fighting.
+ I offered an amendment on the floor of the House to deny
+any funding for forced repatriation. It passed unexpectedly,
+people thought it would not. Now I am working with Eric and
+other like mind, but he took the lead within the
+administration. We were able to get rereviews of these
+refugees. 20,000 people who were originally told you do not
+qualify came to the United States. So thank you Eric.
+ Ms. Bass. Thank you very much, Mr. Ranking Member.
+ Let me introduce our first witness, U.S. Representative
+Raul Ruiz, grew up in the community of Coachella, California.
+Where both of his parents were farm workers. Dr. Ruiz graduated
+from UCLA. He went on to Harvard where he earned his medical
+degree as well as a masters of public policy from the Kennedy
+School of government and a masters of public health from the
+school of public health, becoming the first Latino to earn
+three graduate degrees from Harvard University. He completed
+his residency in emergency medicine. And during his training he
+served as a consultant to the ministries of health in both
+Serbia and El Salvador.
+ In 2010, Dr. Ruiz started the Coachella Valley Healthcare
+Initiative which brought together stakeholders from around the
+region to address local healthcare crisis. In 2010 Dr. Ruiz
+flew to Haiti immediately following the 2010 earthquake and
+served as the medical director for the Haitian relief
+organization.
+ The U.S. Army's 82d airborne awarded him the Commander's
+Award for public service. We appreciate you coming in to
+testify and please begin.
+
+ STATEMENT OF THE HON. RAUL RUIZ, A REPRESENTATIVE IN CONGRESS
+ FROM THE STATE OF CALIFORNIA
+
+ Dr. Ruiz. Good morning Chair Bass, and Ranking Member
+Smith. Thank you for the opportunity to testify before the
+subcommittee to discuss a critical and urgent matter, the
+treatment of migrants, refugees and asylum seekers. It is a
+topic I am moved to discuss, because frankly our Federal
+Government needs a lesson on the humanitarian standards that
+should govern our treatment of the individuals in our custody.
+ Some background on me, I am an emergency medicine
+physician, and a graduate of Harvard Medical School. I am also
+a graduate of the Harvard School of public health where I
+specialized in humanitarian aid and disaster response and
+completed a fellowship in the international emergency medicine
+with the Harvard humanitarian initiative.
+ In 2010, I traveled to Haiti immediately following the
+devastating earthquake where I worked alongside the 82d
+airborne division as the medical director of the largest camp
+of approximately 70,000 internally displaced Haitians in
+Petion-Ville Port-au-Prince. Caring for individuals in life or
+death situations is not new to me in the emergency department
+or as medical command or out in the field after a humanitarian
+disaster.
+ I am very familiar with the international humanitarian
+norms that guide our treatment of individuals affected by
+humanitarian crisis. As this committee knows well after the
+atrocities of the Holocaust and World War II, the international
+community came together many times to establish the
+conventions, covenants, and declarations to establish basic
+humanitarian standards. Some of these include the Universal
+Declaration of Human Rights, the International Covenant on
+Civil and Political Rights and the convention against torture
+and other cruel, inhumane or degrading treatment or punishment.
+The implementation of these standards make up the basis of
+humane treatment of all human beings.
+ There are also specific guidelines for the humane treatment
+of migrants, refugees, and asylum seekers. This Sphere
+Handbook, internationally recognized for its use in the
+evaluation, planning, and delivering of humanitarian operations
+set forth guidelines for health, shelter, nutrition, hygiene,
+water supply, and sanitation. International organizations such
+as the U.N. High Commissioner for Refugees and the
+International Committee of the Red Cross have also established
+standard of care for asylum seekers and detention.
+ The United States is currently not meeting these minimal
+basic standards. Following the death of Jakelin Caal, the 7
+year old Guatemalan girl who died in Customs and Border Patrol
+custody last year, I visited the CBP facilities where she was
+held before her death. The conditions I witnessed were
+heartbreaking.
+ Women, infants, toddlers and the elderly packed and piled
+on top of each other in a cold windowless concrete room, so
+many bodies you could not see the floor. Open toilets in
+crowded cells without any privacy. Visibly sick children
+coughing on one another. The facility lacked lifesaving
+equipment and basic medications for infants and toddlers, no
+diapers, no baby food, no formula, no feminine products
+available. In short, they were understaffed, underequipped, and
+unprepared to provide meaningful health screenings to
+individuals in their custody, let alone respond to medical
+emergencies.
+ We are the wealthiest Nation on Earth, but the conditions I
+saw were worse than those I saw in Haiti after their most
+challenging and devastating disaster. It is clear to me that
+these deficiencies put children and our agents at risk. As a
+public health expert I know that if Border personnel had access
+to the necessary resources, training and medical backup, they
+could triage and prevent more tragedies. This is not just about
+treating individuals in our custody in a humane manner, it is
+also a matter of law, both the U.S. law and international law
+give individuals the right to seek asylum.
+ In the event that the Federal Government restricts the free
+movement of an individual, including their detainment by U.S.
+Customs and Border Patrol, then it is the Federal Government's
+responsibility to provide for these basic rights and to ensure
+the protection of their humanity throughout the asylum process.
+That is why I am drafting legislation that would implement a
+basic set of uniformed humanitarian standards that guide the
+way CBP cares for detained asylum seeking children, families,
+and high-risk individuals that reflect our humanitarian values.
+ First, to prevent deaths in CBP custody we need to
+meaningfully address the health needs of individuals entering
+our borders, especially through vulnerable populations like
+infants, children, pregnant women, elderly, and the disabled.
+That requires an initial medical screening including vital
+signs and a basic physical exam to identify risks, signs and
+symptoms of life threatening vulnerabilities.
+ Second, we need a better response to emergencies by having
+emergency medical equipment available for patients of all ages
+and trained medical personnel to administer emergency medical
+care.
+ Third, we need to provide individuals in temporary custody
+with safe, hygenic and humane temporary shelters to address
+public health and uphold human dignity. These are
+straightforward reforms based on the international standards
+outlined previously in my experience working in the emergency
+department and alongside disaster medical assistance teams and
+the U.S. Army in Haiti. They will bring humanity back to our
+treatment of women and children seeking asylum and prevent
+needless loss of live.
+ Migrants, refugees and asylum seekers around the world have
+the courage to leave the devastating and often dangerous
+conditions in their home countries and travel to find safety in
+a better future for themselves and their families. That was the
+case with the men and women who founded our Nation, seeking
+freedom, refuge, and a better life.
+ I look forward to work, with you and CBP to bring the
+conditions that children and families are held under here in
+the United States in line with the basic humanitarian standards
+observed in even the most dire and severe circumstances across
+the globe.
+ [The prepared statement of Dr. Ruiz follows:]
+ [GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]
+
+ Ms. Bass. Thank you very much Dr. Ruiz. We expect votes to
+be called in the next 10 minutes so I am going to keep us--we
+do not have a clock here, but I have my stopwatch, so I will
+keep us to asking questions for 5 minutes. And I will be brief
+to give more opportunity to my colleagues.
+ Dr. Ruiz, given that I do not see the situation ending any
+time soon, on our border, and looking at resources that might
+be proposed by this committee in legislation and you just
+mentioned legislation you were talking about as well, what
+resources, what should we ask USAID or other governmental
+entities to provide on the border?
+ I am also thinking about the people. I hope at another
+hearing we could look at addressing the root causes of why so
+many people were coming from Central America. I mean we are
+providing aid to Central America. But I do not know that that
+aid that we are providing is really getting at the root causes
+so that people do not make the journey in the first place.
+ So I think that is for another hearing. But if you are
+thinking about the people after they leave on that journey,
+what type of aid should we be giving to those countries so that
+once they leave they are dealt with safely? And also when they
+are at the border, what would you recommend?
+ Dr. Ruiz. In terms of aids to the other country or the
+needs of our own country to address----
+ Ms. Bass. Right. Both. I am actually referring to both.
+ Dr. Ruiz. So let us go ahead and first start with the aid
+to other countries. First of all, we know that many, and the
+vast majority, of the asylum seekers were fleeing violence and
+threats, oftentimes due to drug cartel or gang members that
+exist within in what I would refer to as a failed State in a
+nontraditional way in the sense that their own governments
+cannot provide law, order and safety for their communities.
+Oftentimes they are the villages in the remote areas,
+indigenous communities who are socially isolated without the
+social capital to gather and protect themselves that are preyed
+upon.
+ What we can do to provide assistance to create that order
+and safety and security for their populations would be very
+helpful. There are many who come as economic migrants and
+building the opportunities for microloans for example for women
+and children. Studies have shown that that has helped in places
+like India and Africa to foster a community development at a
+grassroots community level, which will give them hope
+opportunity and the means to provide for themselves and their
+family.
+ In terms of the United States, my legislation and my focus
+is on the what, creating these basic humanitarian standards and
+allowing CBP and Department of Homeland Security to determine
+the how, because they will need flexibility to meet these
+specific needs. So what is in the what. For example, I think
+that they need to be able to have partnerships or have more
+individuals who know how to conduct a questionnaire, and vital
+signs, and a rudimentary physical examination, especially
+starting with vulnerable populations like infants, toddler,
+pregnant women, elderly and the disabled. And then once
+identified an abnormality to be able to consult with an
+emergency care professional who can then triage and determine a
+short, medical plan of observation or treatment or even
+immediate evacuation.
+ If that was done in Antelope Wells, where Jakelin Caal was
+detained, then she would still be alive today, because no child
+looks healthy 8 hours before they die of septic shock. Right?
+They do not look healthy. If you had just done a rudimentary
+vital signs on the child, you would have found most likely,
+temperature, fast heart rate, and that would have alerted to
+you that there was something wrong with the child.
+ Ms. Bass. They did not have the resources. They were not
+medical people.
+ Dr. Ruiz. They did not have the resources and they did not
+have the care. So resources making sure that there is medical
+equipment for infants and toddlers, which there was none. You
+need resources like basic formula, baby food. Oftentimes
+families and individuals were given a box with a burrito,
+infants, neonates, toddlers that is not what they eat so they
+do not eat that. Being able to provide an sufficient amount of
+clean water, as well as nutrition caloric intake of an adult
+and age specific weight based for children is important.
+ Other things like soap, and toothbrush, and toothpaste. And
+a facility where they can wash their hands or bath daily will
+go a long way with public health. When you pile individuals in
+a concrete room that is cold and you keep the lights on and
+people are awake all night, all day their immune system
+decreases. When you add the stressors of what they have gone
+through, including being exposed to people coughing and
+sneezing on them, you are going to infect everybody and--with a
+common cold or what other virus that may exist that they
+acquired at that facility.
+ Being able to have enough private clean toilets, latrines
+for a certain amount of people in the international
+humanitarian norms. It is usually one latrine for 15, 20
+individuals. We work with international organizations to
+provide that amount of latrines in Port-au-Prince in Haiti.
+ So those are some of the equipment for example,
+temperature, adequate clothing, and blankets, and bedding. What
+I saw at the Border Patrol station were very thin aluminum
+sheets and they pretty much tried to sleep on the floor,
+oftentimes they would make accommodations so that their child
+could sleep on their arm, or on their chest so they wouldn't
+have to sleep on the floor.
+ These were the--diapers for babies was also very important,
+because a child's feces is more infectious than an adult's
+feces. If you do not provide diapers or a disposal area where
+you can throw them away and wash your hands afterwards, then
+you are risking exposure to everybody and that is just basic,
+basic public health.
+ Ms. Bass. Thank you. Mr. Smith.
+ Mr. Smith. Thank you very much doctor for your testimony.
+ Let me just ask you, you said the U.S. border facility in
+Lordsburg was understaffed, underequipped and unprepared to
+provide meaningful health screenings to people in their
+custody, let alone emergency medical services. Has that
+changed?
+ Dr. Ruiz. The CBP has requested some change after our
+encounter. They requested more fundings through the
+appropriations to be able to contract with healthcare
+professionals.
+ When I went to the border, the agents were still devastated
+from the death of Jakelin Caal. They are humans, they are
+fathers as well, and mothers so they were in sorrow. They often
+expressed anxiety and fear of now dealing with families and
+children where they have no experience and no training to do
+so. They are welcoming these resources and these norms.
+ Mr. Smith. When were you in Lordsburg?
+ Dr. Ruiz. I think it was in December I believe. It was
+Antelope Wells in December. I went as a delegation with the
+congressional Hispanic Caucus.
+ Mr. Smith. So like in January, do you know if any of it has
+been fixed?
+ Dr. Ruiz. There are certain areas that they are focusing
+more bringing in these resources, but I cannot tell you to the
+full extent whether or not the systemic problem has been fixed.
+They have not started training----
+ Mr. Smith. But you and your staff recontact like a month
+later----
+ Dr. Ruiz. Sure.
+ Mr. Smith [continuing]. Did they tell you, we got this
+fixed? We are doing health training we are doing----
+ Dr. Ruiz. No. We have been following up with the
+commissioner and task forces within CBP. I have been advising
+the task force for CBP on these humanitarian and public health
+criteria and standards. They are still developing their
+recommendations for the Secretary of DHS. So this is a work in
+progress. It has not been fixed.
+ Mr. Smith. But given, you know, the very dire picture that
+you paint, it seems to me by the next week they should have
+been moving heaven and Earth to get this fixed. That is not the
+case?
+ Dr. Ruiz. Well I agree with your assessment that they
+should have been moving heaven and Earth to meet those
+criterions. They started looking into how to do it, but I do
+not believe these standards have been met.
+ Mr. Smith. OK. Is Lordsburg the exception or is it the rule
+for these facilities?
+ Dr. Ruiz. Well, I think that the facilities that we visited
+were one of the most remote and rural areas. So it was probably
+one of the more worse case scenarios. However, the problem that
+we see is that the conditions or the current treatment is very
+vague and inconsistent throughout the different Border Patrol.
+ Part of that is a lack of fundamental understanding of how
+to respond to the humanitarian needs of asylum seeker which our
+laws permit and which we have been accustomed to within the
+international humanitarian community. So what we need is a
+systematic way to bring in these humanitarian norms and
+standards and have training for our agents and those within the
+agency so we can meet those requirements.
+ Mr. Smith. Doctor, is this a new problem or does this
+predate this new administration?
+ Dr. Ruiz. I believe we have had----
+ Mr. Smith. If I could, I have had hearings in the past and
+I asked questions previously, many questions about whether or
+not for example neglected tropical diseases were being screened
+for since there are many who could be carrying worms or other
+parasites and I got a big, we do not know. And we followed up,
+and we keep asking. My question would be, you know, is this
+something that happened within the last 2 years or does this
+predate this administration?
+ Dr. Ruiz. Well, the movement of asylum seeking migrants has
+been going on for several years and predates this
+administration.
+ Mr. Smith. Right. But in terms of the crisis and the lack
+of providing essential medical healthcare to those in need, is
+this brand new?
+ Dr. Ruiz. This is an issue that has not been addressed,
+period. So----
+ Mr. Smith. Even before this administration?
+ Dr. Ruiz. Even before, yes.
+ Mr. Smith. It is important, because we want to be fair to
+all players.
+ Dr. Ruiz. See, I think it is important to understand.
+ Mr. Smith. We want to get it right.
+ Dr. Ruiz. This is something we have been talking to CBP
+about. And they recognized that they were not designed to
+address the humanitarian needs of families and children. And
+that is why this is a great opportunity for us as legislators
+and experts in the field to come together in a bipartisan way
+to help the CBP reform so that they can address the
+humanitarian needs of asylum seekers.
+ Mr. Smith. But again, I just wanted to make clear for the
+record that it does predate the Trump administration. Yes?
+ Dr. Ruiz. Yes, the lack of humanitarian norms within a
+system has never been in our CBP.
+ Ms. Bass. Thank you.
+ Mr. Smith. If I could ask one more followup question----
+ Ms. Bass. Oh, sure.
+ Mr. Smith. Unaccompanied minors was absolutely, you know, a
+great focus as it should be, I went to one of the shelters and
+there were staff from one of my centers who was there as well,
+that is in New Jersey. And frankly I was shocked on the upside
+just how well they were being treated.
+ Dr. Ruiz. Where?
+ Mr. Smith. They do not us to tell you. I will tell you off
+the record, because they do not want people knowing where it
+is, but it is in New Jersey. And there must have been 40 young
+people there and they were very well treated. Now there could
+be others where they are very poorly treated. Cory Booker's
+staff was there with ne and Leonard Lance was there, and I was
+there. We stayed for hours asking questions, talking to young
+people who were there.
+ So I always wanted to get it clear, one, if this is all
+brand new, because I think it is long-standing, because we have
+had hearings in this Congress that predated Trump. And there
+has been a call for significant increases in humanitarian aid
+by the administration.
+ Dr. Ruiz. Yes.
+ Mr. Smith. I think that is a good thing and I think we need
+to provide that. So you would agree with that.
+ Dr. Ruiz. And also I just want to make it clear that
+unaccompanied minors are detained in several situations. They
+are not--they are with ICE and that is one set of facilities,
+and then they are also in the care of the Office of Refugee
+Resettlement under the Department of Homeland Security. And
+they oftentimes contract with nonprofits and community agencies
+which provide homes and programs and education.
+ So what we are not--we are not seeing that model which I
+also visited a location in Los Angeles throughout the whole
+system and there are unaccompanied minors that do not get
+treated or have the services like those that are under the care
+of the Office of Refugee Resettlement.
+ Mr. Smith. Thank you.
+ Ms. Bass. I am going to move on. Mr. Phillips.
+ Mr. Phillips. Thank you, Chairwoman Bass. And greetings to
+my esteemed colleague. I celebrate your extraordinary position
+for this work. I am grateful to you.
+ My first question is relative to funding and the White
+House has acknowledged that we have a humanitarian crisis at
+the border, asked for funding. We approved I think $414 million
+if I recall correctly. Do you believe that is an adequate
+amount to fulfill the response to the humanitarian
+responsibilities?
+ Dr. Ruiz. No, I do not think that that is sufficient to
+meet the what that we need to address. But that is a very good
+first step. Those conversations occurred within the appropriate
+appropriations subcommittees. And we have been working with the
+appropriations subcommittees of Department of Homeland Security
+to identify these humanitarian norms.
+ So right now there is a working relationship to get the
+requests inline with what these humanitarian norms are and that
+was the 2019 appropriations bill that we just passed. In 2020
+there will be another step to bring them in line to the
+humanitarian standards that should exist in CBP custody.
+ Mr. Phillips. OK. I know we have to run, one more quick
+question if I might. Are you familiar with the country around
+the world that does this better than we do, and if so that we
+should look to as a source of best practices?
+ Dr. Ruiz. You know I think that the source of best
+practices would be within the international humanitarian
+community. If you look at organizations that manage large
+internally displaced camps and refugee camps throughout the
+globe, ICRC and some practices from the U.N. commissioner for
+refugees and Doctors Without Borders who do this day in and day
+out, oftentimes at risks of their own life in the most dire
+disasters in the most impoverished countries. And they are able
+to meet the nutritional water needs to provide a camp that is
+reflective of human dignity. And so I think that working with
+them and realizing what their standards are would be a very
+good idea.
+ Mr. Phillips. And employing that in their home country.
+ Dr. Ruiz. Yes.
+ Mr. Phillips. I appreciate it.
+ Dr. Ruiz. Yes.
+ Ms. Bass. Thank you very much. I really appreciate you
+coming as our expert witness. I appreciation your input, I look
+forward to joining you on your legislation.
+ Dr. Ruiz. Thank you.
+ Ms. Bass. So votes have been called. I am going to recess
+subject to call of the chair and I would encourage members to
+return. I believe we have two votes so we should be back in
+half hour, 45 minutes. Thank you.
+ [Recess.]
+ Ms. Bass. Could I call the panel forward? Eric Schwartz,
+Ryan Mace, and Annigje Buwalda.
+ Thank you very much, thank you for your patience. Sorry we
+were pulled away for votes, but we are going to go ahead and
+get started.
+ Eric Schwartz has been the president of Refugees
+International since June 2017. He has a 3 decade career focused
+on humanitarian and human rights issues. Between 2009 and 2011
+he served as U.S. Assistant Secretary of State for Population
+Refugees and Migration. As assistant secretary he was credited
+with strengthening the State Department's humanitarian advocacy
+around the world initiating and implementing critical
+enhancements to the U.S. refugee settlement program and raising
+the profile of global migration issues in U.S. foreign policy.
+ Ryan Mace is the grassroots advocacy and refugee specialist
+for Amnesty International. He works to mobilize constituent
+pressure to advance AI USA major advocacy initiatives, in
+addition to lobbying Congress to protect and advance the rights
+of refugees and asylum seekers.
+ Our third witness and I am sorry if I mispronounce your
+name. Miss Buwalda. From 1991 through the present time Ann
+Buwalda has served as executive director of Jubilee Campaign
+USA, focusing on international religious freedom, advocating
+for the release of prisoners of conscious and resettlement of
+refugees combatting trafficking for the protection of children
+and providing support to victims, in practice since 1992, Ms.
+Buwalda founded the law firm Just Law International in 1996, a
+firm handling all aspects of immigration law, including asylum
+and refugee cases.
+ Thank you very much and you can begin your testimony. And
+we have your full statement so if you could summarize in 5
+minutes, that would be greatly appreciated.
+ And I will keep a clock here.
+
+ STATEMENT OF ANNIGJE BUWALDA, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR, JUBILEE
+ CAMPAIGN, USA
+
+ Ms. Buwalda. Thank you. I would like to thank Chairwoman
+Bass----
+ Ms. Bass. If you could turn your microphone on.
+ Ms. Buwalda. I would like to thank Chairwoman Bass, Ranking
+Member Smith and members of the subcommittee for providing the
+opportunity to address the panel on the crisis of religious and
+ethnic minority refugees and asylum seekers in Thailand and
+elsewhere.
+ The U.S. has traditionally been a beacon of hope for the
+oppressed and persecuted suffering around the world. And even
+in one of his statement Ronald Reagan said, quote ``Can we
+doubt that only a divine providence place this land, this
+island of freedom here for as refuge for all the people who
+yearn and breathe to be free.''
+ It is a sincere hope that today's hearing will contribute
+to renewing the calling that the divine Providence has placed
+on this land. Jubilee campaign seeks to draw the subcommittee's
+attention to the need to protect and aid religious minority
+refugees. Under both international refugee law and domestic
+asylum law, one of the five grounds of protection is a well-
+founded fear of persecution on account of one's religion. At
+times religious refugees have been placed behind other types of
+refugees, indeed that was one of the reasons that the
+International Religious Freedom Act of 1998 was so needed and
+it has been a remarkably effective tool since then and we are
+very pleased with many of the provisions within it.
+ Those provisions I think need to be applied as it relates
+to refugees and refugee processing. My testimony today seeks to
+expose the circumstances in Thailand pertaining to a vulnerable
+refugee population, those seeking asylum from Pakistan.
+Verifiable statistics are difficult to obtain but we currently
+estimate that there are 3,000 to 4,000 Pakistani Christians in
+Thailand who fled religious persecution and whose cases are
+pending, some of them are approved and awaiting resettlement,
+but some cases are closed and affording them with no place to
+go.
+ I would like to feature in today's testimony the case of
+Michael D'Souza, who on account of his denial by the UNHCR in
+Bangkok, Thailand of his case, he was forced to stay in their
+immigration detention facility in deplorable conditions, so
+much so after 1 year of suffering through that and no hope, he
+returned to Pakistan. Michael D'Souza was brutalized by the
+very people he feared would persecute him. His case should not
+have been denied and he remains stranded in Karachi, Pakistan.
+ I use his case to demonstrate the fact that cases that are
+putting forward their claim as believers in a faith should be
+provided with opportunities to have their cases heard more--
+with more reasonableness. We have found with many of the cases
+within the UNHCR in Bangkok, there are denials because there is
+an unreasonable standard and burden of proof placed upon them.
+ We have many cases, as do colleagues of ours who assist
+with this refugee processing where it clearly appears to us
+that the UNHCR in Bangkok has placed a higher burden of proof
+on Pakistani Christian asylum seekers. This is something which
+we have attempted to place attention on. We have approached
+UNHCR, they are sympathetic, but the conditions in terms of the
+interviews have not changed and we wish to see that change take
+place.
+ We also wish to point out that the conditions in the
+immigration detention centers within Bangkok and Thailand are
+absolutely deplorable. We want to mention the Montagnard asylum
+seekers from Vietnam who are stranded also in Bangkok. There is
+upwards of 500 of them. They are in the horrible situation at
+the IDC detention center where they are actually mothers are
+separated from their children and not allowed to even give them
+breastfeeding. So the conditions there are horrible. This is a
+very vulnerable religious minority community of Montagnards
+that need help there.
+ There are many issues and reasons for why this is taking
+place that we have submitted within our written submission for
+my testimony today. And it is my hope that we can enable the
+UNHCR in Bangkok to do a better job of paying attention to
+religious minority asylum seeker cases.
+ And finally, I wish to mention that we desperately need
+additional numbers for refugee resettlement to the United
+States. We do not believe that there is sufficient attention
+placed on this vulnerable population of refugees. And we wish
+to see that the United States admissions program would accept
+more of them. Thank you.
+ [The prepared statement of Ms. Buwalda follows:]
+ [GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]
+
+ Ms. Bass. Thank you very much. Mr. Mace. Hold on 1 second.
+ Go ahead.
+
+ STATEMENT OF RYAN MACE, GRASSROOTS ADVOCACY AND REFUGEE
+ SPECIALIST, AMNESTY INTERNATIONAL
+
+ Mr. Mace. Thank you for having us here. Chairwoman Bass,
+Ranking Member Smith, and members of the subcommittee, thank
+you for inviting us to this hearing. You have my submitted
+testimony so I will be summarizing it today.
+ My name is Ryan Mace and I am a refugee specialist At
+Amnesty International, USA global human rights movement. Last
+November I joined an AMNESTY delegation traveling to Jordan and
+Lebanon where we had the opportunity to hear from dozens of
+refugees. As global displacement has reached historic highs,
+affecting every region of the world, we must remember, this is
+a global crisis, but people are at its core. Refugees are human
+beings with human rights, rights that are at risk.
+ Unfortunately countries around the world have responded
+with restrictive policies and fail to offer permanent
+protection on a scale that even begins to match the need. This
+is born out with the drastic reduction to refugee resettlement
+globally and an increase and detention used to deter and punish
+people who seek asylum. We are now helping lead this race to
+the bottom. Whether it is the Muslim refugee or asylum bans,
+increased detention of asylum seekers or targeting NGO human
+rights defenders, these policies can rightly be viewed as a
+violation of human rights. It is no exaggeration to say that
+the ability of people to seek safety and enjoy lasting
+protection is not only at risk, it is in crisis.
+ I would like to tell you about a Syrian refugee family that
+has been living in Lebanon since 2013. Mr. Amari, father of
+four children aged 4 to 11 shared his two priorities with me.
+His first is the education of their children. Sadly more than
+half of refugee children in Lebanon attend no school at all.
+ His second is to ensure they do not have to rely on others
+generosity to get by. In late 2016 they were notified they
+would be resettled to Richmond, Virginia. They packed up their
+bag and were ready to go. With the announcement in January 2017
+of the Muslim ban their dreams were shattered, they would not
+be going to Richmond. We come in peace, he said to us. We are
+looking for security and safety. We are asking for your help.
+The U.S. refugee program has long been a partnership between
+the Federal Government, local communities and private
+investments built up over decades.
+ Today it is needlessly at risk. At its peak the program
+admitted over 200,000 this year we will be lucky if we get to
+20,000. The dramatic decrease in resettlement has put untenable
+pressure on refugee hosting countries around the world,
+countries including Turkey, Uganda, Jordan, and Lebanon all
+whose significant populations of refugees straining their
+social service programs.
+ In recent years many countries have designed policies to
+keep people from ever even accessing their borders, putting up
+barrier after barrier to keep them out. States are violating
+their right to seek asylum. Forcing them to wait for weeks or
+longer in unsafe conditions or make the terrible decision to
+take dangerous routes to safety.
+ Since 2016, European governments have practically shut down
+Mediterranean sea routes that refugees have used in the past
+with devastating results.
+ In the U.S., Amnesty International has documented the
+dangerous trend of pushing back asylum seekers at the U.S.
+southern border in a recent report titled You Don't Have Any
+Rights Here. The report titled quotes a CBP official speaking
+to a Brazilian mother in Texas last year as they separated her
+from her child. That is the message that our frontline
+officials are communicating to those in search of safety.
+ Unfortunately, many migrants and asylum seekers around the
+world are detained, often in appalling conditions and for
+indefinite periods. In Libya, migrants and refugees in
+detention centers are routinely exposed to torture, extortion
+and rape. In the U.S., over 40,000 people are held in detention
+any given day. Everyone should have the right to freedom from
+arbitrary detention and detention should always be the last
+resort.
+ The assault on refugees and asylum seekers has now reached
+such heights that even advocates are targeted. An increasing
+number of countries are enacting policies to limit refugee
+rights organizations from doing their critical work. Here in
+the U.S., asylum advocates have reportedly been targeted by
+authorities, including facing criminal prosecution for
+providing water to exhausted migrants in the desert.
+ Here we are, 2 years later and the Amari family is still in
+limbo, without a permanent home, despite one waiting for them
+in the U.S. As an advocate, I feel powerless, but the members
+of this committee have the power to change this family's life
+and others like them.
+ These are our recommendations, first the U.S. should
+restore its commitment to refugee resettlement. Second, this
+cannot be the last time this subject is before this committee
+or this Congress. I am glad to hear that that will be the case.
+Third, this Congress must support legislation that overturns
+destructive policies that target these populations. And
+finally, our government has long been a leader in helping
+displaced populations around the world and we must continue to
+play that role.
+ In closing, the world is rightly wondering if the U.S. is
+still an active partner in offering protection for those who
+need it most. We need to listen to refugees and asylum seekers
+and from those directly working with them.
+ I thank the committee and look forward to your questions.
+ [The prepared statement of Mr. Mace follows:]
+ [GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]
+
+ Ms. Bass. Thank you.
+ Mr. Schwartz.
+
+ STATEMENT OF THE HONORABLE ERIC SCHWARTZ, PRESIDENT, REFUGEES
+ INTERNATIONAL, FORMER ASSISTANT SECRETARY OF STATE FOR
+ POPULATION, REFUGEES, AND MIGRATION
+
+ Mr. Schwartz. Thank you for the opportunity to testify on
+these critical issues. Members have referenced the numbers at
+the end of 2017. There were nearly 70 million people worldwide
+confronted by persecution and by human rights violations and
+24.5 million of those people were refugees, those outside their
+countries of origin, and about 40 million were internally
+displaced.
+ According to the well respected organization, Development
+Initiatives, governments and the private sector spend over $27
+billion annually in humanitarian aid. The United States is the
+largest donor. But as a percentage of GDP, we are not near the
+top. And U.S. aid amounts to less than 1 percent of the Federal
+budget.
+ So what are some of the key issues on refugees and
+migration confronting this Congress? First, there is the issue
+of support for refugee solutions, solutions that have been
+overwhelmingly endorsed by governments in a recently adopted
+Global Compact on Refugees, solutions which are reflected in
+international programs supporting education and employment of
+refugees, in countries like Jordan, like Turkey, like Uganda,
+like Ethiopia and others.
+ The United States had been at the forefront of this
+solutions effort, but frankly, policies have shifted. With the
+Trump administration pressing for dramatic cuts in humanitarian
+aid, opposing the Global Compact on Refugees, and slashing U.S.
+refugee resettlement. Congress has a role to push back against
+these measures. And the dramatic decrease of refugee
+resettlement, in particular Muslim majority countries, should
+be the subject of careful oversight.
+ On the challenge of global forced migration generally, and
+despite the administration's decision to boycott another set of
+negotiations around a new agreement, or compact, on global
+migration that was also overwhelmingly endorsed by governments,
+Members of Congress should press for substantial increases in
+support, in funding, for key initiatives that were envisioned
+in that global migration agreement. These include efforts to
+minimize drivers of forced migration in countries of origin,
+measures to ensure respect for migrant rights, enhanced
+pathways for regular immigration and alternatives to migrant
+detention.
+ On another critical issue, the rights and well-being of
+refugee women and girls, Congress should seek to lift
+restrictions on aid for sexual and reproductive health
+services, and on services related to response to gender-based
+violence, restrictions that have been imposed by the
+administration. And those should be particularly alarming in
+light of violence against women and girls in places like Burma,
+otherwise known as Myanmar, South Sudan, and the Democratic
+Republic of the Congo. And Congress should reject actions that
+politicize humanitarian aid. In 1984, it was the Reagan
+Administration that declared that a hungry child knows no
+politics. And we should be deeply concerned by departures from
+this principle, reflected for example by the administration's
+decision to end humanitarian aid to Palestinian civilians due
+to the political positions of Palestinian leaders. This has had
+serious consequences for life sustaining assistance and
+Congress should protect aid to civilians at risk without
+discrimination.
+ Finally, Congress cannot ignore refugee protection at home,
+where we have recently witnessed measures that dramatically
+limit the ability of Central Americans to make claims for
+asylum. Beyond enacting legislation to ensure that the
+administration acts consistent with U.S. law and values,
+Congress could legislate, should legislate a special refugee
+and humanitarian resettlement program to address humanitarian
+challenges at our southern border. We have done it with Soviet
+Jews, we have done it with Cubans, we can do it with Central
+Americans.
+ The consensus--the consensus in our country for respect of
+refugee rights--that is a consensus that has always been a
+fragile one, with loud voices of intolerance often appealing to
+our fears, rather than to our ideals and our interests. And
+this is precisely why at this moment in history the voices of
+Members of Congress are so critical. I urge that you use those
+voices in Washington and beyond the beltway to ensure a
+brighter, a more affirming, and a successful future for all
+Americans.
+ Thank you.
+ [The prepared statement of Mr. Schwartz follows:]
+ [GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]
+
+ Ms. Bass. Thank you very much. I appreciate your patience
+through our voting and the recess that we took. And would like
+to ask questions that focus on recommendations for what you
+think that we could be doing, how we could direct our
+assistance.
+ Mr. Mace, you talked about restoring the refugee
+resettlement piece. I would like for you to elaborate a little
+more on that. You also spoke about the Muslim ban. And knowing
+that that is a policy that I do not see changing at any time,
+but what can we do in terms of as Congress as we put
+legislation forward to support refugees in terms of resources
+that we could give. What are some examples?
+ And I would ask that of all of the witnesses, but will
+start with Mr. Mace.
+ Mr. Mace. Sure, thank you for the question. On resettlement
+first, just in terms of the recommendation itself, our ask
+would be to see if restored this cannot be a new normal. The
+goal is 30,000 for this Fiscal Year and as I said we will not
+even get to 20,000 if we continue at this rate. We cannot let
+that be a new normal. We cannot let that be a new normal now
+and in future administrations as well.
+ And would encourage Congress to through appropriations make
+that clear, make that clear to the administration that that is
+not what we want. In terms of the Muslim ban, and in terms of
+Syrians in particular I spoke of the Amari family from Syria.
+There are 5.7 million people, Syrians, refugees and UNHCR has
+actually said that they are one of the populations in highest
+need of resettlement. The U.S. has settled 40, to date, four,
+zero this fiscal year. I think that anyone could say we can do
+better than that, especially when we are faced with such need.
+ And I would echo others on the panel that we should really
+call as in times past the Congress has said we are in an
+emergency, we are in an urgent situation, we need to recognize
+that, it does not matter, we do not need to wait for the end of
+the Fiscal Year to do that. I understand the President has a
+lot of power with setting the refugees' admissions goal, but
+Congress has power too and should reassert that.
+ Ms. Bass. Thank you.
+ Ms. Buwalda.
+ Ms. Buwalda. I would like to make a comment to that. I do
+not see it as a Muslim ban. I see it as a ban specific to
+countries because we represent Christians in the very same
+countries that have the same--that are suffering under the same
+plight of being unable to come to the United States. And these
+are minorities within those countries that are subject to the
+ban.
+ And so I wish to make that point for the record. Thank you.
+ Ms. Bass. Mr. Schwartz.
+ Mr. Schwartz. Yes, I appreciate the question and in my
+testimony, it was very important that every part of my
+testimony had a section on what Congress can do. And let me
+talk a little bit about some ideas there.
+ First, oversight is really important. In 2016, we resettled
+more than 9,000 Somalis. In 2016, we resettled more than 12,000
+Syrians. As of January 31, those numbers were respectively 14--
+not 14,000--14 and 13. Since 9/11, we have resettled 1 million
+refugees more or less. In those years since 2001 there is not
+one case, there is not one case of an American citizen being
+killed in an act of terror perpetrated by a resettled refugee.
+ In 10 years we had more than 250,000 people killed by gun
+violence. We have resettled 1 million refugees since 9/11, not
+one case of a refugee being responsible for an act of terror
+that led to the loss of an American life. Yet, we have gone
+from 9,000 Somalis in 2016 to 14 Somalis in 2018-2019. So that
+requires oversight. You need counterterrorism experts who are
+not in the government to get in here and talk about evidence-
+based policy. So oversight is critical.
+ Second, I think the Congress can legislate a refugee
+resettlement program. The President, yes, under our current
+program has the authority to determine the number of refugees
+who come in. But if you want to resettle 100,000 Central
+American refugees, and humanitarian cases and family cases,
+over a 5 year period, you can legislate that. And why not? To
+create a more orderly process at our border. To practice at
+home what we are preaching abroad to so many other
+governments.The President himself in 2017 at the United Nations
+declared that countries should take care of refugees who are
+close to their homes. Well, Central America is at our border
+and are pretty close to their homes.
+ So you could legislate, coming from this committee, the PRM
+Bueau could implement it, a refugee resettlement, program.
+ Ms. Bass. Did you say PRM?
+ Mr. Schwartz. The State Department's Bureau of Population
+Refugee and Migration.
+ I will just give you a couple of other recommendations: you
+could legislate support for the U.N. Relief and Works Agency
+for Palestine Refugees--an agency that by all impartial
+accounts, including a General Accounting Office report, has
+diligently sought to implement humanitarian assistance. Yet all
+of that aid was cutoff by the Trump administration. You could
+legislate programs that have been cutoff on the protection of
+women and girls in humanitarian situations; you can do all of
+that and much more.
+ Ms. Bass. Thank you. Before I go to my esteemed colleague
+here, my ranking member, it was interesting what you said about
+Christians minorities in those countries when the ban was put
+in place, the target was the Muslim population, I think it is
+unfortunate that Christians are being--there is consequences
+for them as well, but remember that was the original intent. It
+was changed to be countries for it to follow the Supreme Court.
+ Mr. Ranking Member.
+ Mr. Smith. Thank you so much, Madam Chair.
+ Thank you all for your testimoneys, it provides a great
+deal of guidance and wisdom I think for the subcommittee, it is
+deeply appreciated and all of your work for decades in most
+cases.
+ Let me just ask a couple of questions. You know, your
+point, Mr. Schwartz, I think was very well taken about people
+not being killed by refugees but there are threats out there as
+we all know, and maybe there have been some but they were not
+identify by police or whatever as refugees. And your point on
+gun violence I thought it was very well taken as well.
+ There is right now in the news we hear about the so-called
+ISIS bride from Alabama who has called for sleeper cells with
+ISIS to kill Americans, especially during patriotic holidays
+such as Veterans Day, Memorial Day. I remember during the
+Balkan war, I was there frequently in Bosnia and Croatia. And
+when the fighting went into Kosovo, was in Stankovich refugee
+camp in Macedonia, met with many of the people there and
+frankly the open door welcoming for people from that camp to
+the United States. Many of them disembarked in my district.
+ They came to McGuire Air Force Base. Many of us went out to
+the airplanes and met them. Some of those people I am sure I
+met when I was at the camp because I was there for hours. But
+there was one guy who became part what they called the Fort Dix
+Five who had become radicalized at some point. And they were
+trying--because he lived at Fort Dix, which is adjacent to
+McGuire.
+ Mr. Smith. And he was the weapons procurer, and they
+planned on a mass killing of servicemembers and their families
+and Fort Dix. They originally intended on bringing pizza and
+with it AK-47s and other--to just kill people wantonly and
+horribly. Luckily, that was thwarted by the FBI and by--so
+there are threats.
+ And I am just wondering, you might speak to it. How do we
+mitigate those threats? How does the vetting process become
+even more aggressive? I know when we had the last
+administration here, they talked about very high degrees of
+vetting. And I know the current administration is doing the
+same.
+ Second, if I could, Ms. Buwalda, you speak very eloquently
+about the crisis in Thailand, and it is Christians, it is Falun
+Gong who are being sent back to China, it is Montagnard, the
+500 who are being mistreated there, Christians. But your 10 to
+30 percent of the Pakistani Christians that are granted refugee
+status is appalling. And I am wondering, you know, what do you
+recommend we do to hold UNHCR accountable, I have sent letters
+to them. I have talked to officials, we have talked to the
+UNHCR and we seem to get nowhere.
+ Is it a very poor staff on the ground, and Human Rights
+Watch has spoken about this as well, or is it something
+different that we are talking about, you know, there is just
+not enough people?
+ But what is the problem and how do we fix that? Because
+that is seems to me to be a huge, huge problem. And your
+elaboration of the case of Michael D'Souza after being beaten,
+goes to Thailand seeking help, comes back to Pakistan, and
+then, as you point out, his two sisters-in-law were beaten as
+well. If that is not well-founded fear of persecution, I do not
+know what is.
+ So hopefully the UNHCR will do a far better job. You know,
+many of us have been very concerned with them over the years.
+The secretary general who used to be the head of the UNHCR, I
+met with him many times when they were sending women who would
+make their way out of North Korea into China, many of whom
+would be forced into human trafficking. And as you know, I
+wrote the laws on human trafficking, including the Trafficking
+Victims Protection Act. We had women testify here in this room
+who they were sent back by the Chinese Government in clear
+contravention of the refugee convention to which they are
+signers of. I mean, maybe you guys want to speak to that as
+well because I find that appalling as well.
+ And just briefly, maybe Eric you could speak to--you know,
+many of our concerns with UNRWA is the fomenting of anti-
+Semitism and anti-Americanism, but particularly anti-Semitism.
+I have hearings on that as well. The textbooks, maybe you can
+speak to whether or not they have been in all cleaned up to get
+rid of all the anti-Semitic hate that are then inculcated into
+the minds and the hearts of young children pursued under UNRWA.
+ On the humanitarian side, food, medicines, I am with you,
+just get it to whoever is in need, period. But if you could
+speak to that.
+ Mr. Schwartz. Well, should I respond?
+ Mr. Smith. You can start, yes.
+ Mr. Schwartz. You raised a couple of important issues
+Congressman Smith, and thank you. And thank you for your kind
+words before. I am very grateful for the opportunity to have
+worked with you on that and other issues through the years.
+ First, let me say that my concern about the UNRWA decision
+was that it was explicitly and demonstrably an unprincipled
+decision. The President tweeted 1 day that, you know, if
+Palestinian political leaders do not--I do not have the quote,
+but essentially--do not toe the political line, we are going to
+stop aid. And then the next day the U.N. Ambssador to the
+United Nations, in response to a specific question about UNRWA,
+alluded to the same issue that the President alluded to. If the
+political leaders do not toe the line, that aid ends.
+ Now, whatever your views about UNRWA, that is obnoxious,
+unacceptable, and in conflict with the American commitment to
+the Good Humanitarian Donorship Principles, to which we have
+subscribed. That aid should be based on need, and the political
+opinions and views of political leaders should not impact
+whether or not----
+ Mr. Smith. Can I interrupt for a second? How do we get the
+educational piece fixed----
+ Mr. Schwartz. OK. I am going to get to that. So my point
+was that that decision was an unprincipled decision.
+ My second point is that I would refer you to the General
+Accounting Offices, I believe it was 2017, or the General
+Accountability Office, their name has changed; the 2017 report
+on UNRWA. And I think what it demonstrates is this is an
+organization which is doing the very best it can--and doing
+good work in trying to ensure that principles of tolerance and
+impartiality are promoted in its materials--under very
+difficult circumstances. And if UNRWA was not doing that,
+nobody would.
+ And so I would refer all Members of Congress to that GAO
+report, because from my perspective, it reveals that this is an
+organization that is operating in a difficult environment and
+doing very good work in trying to push principles of tolerance,
+impartiality, aid-based on need, human rights promotion, in
+circumstances where they are using, you know, national
+curriculum, et cetera. So they are pushing against efforts at
+discrimination and bias. That does not mean that they are
+completely successful in eliminating it, but they are pushing
+in the right direction.
+ Should I address your security question, because I do not
+want to--I can wait.
+ Ms. Bass. Why do not we have the other two people respond.
+We are quite a bit over time, and I want to give my other
+colleagues a chance to ask questions.
+ Ms. Buwalda. I would like to speak to your question with
+regard to the UNHCR's adjudication. And I believe that there is
+definite need of improvement. One of the reasons for why it
+occurred in terms of denial rates being so high is that they
+have an unbalanced burden of proof placed upon them, a
+skepticism. We had a UNHCR official describe how--just the
+basic skepticism of Pakistani Christian asylum seekers there
+that demonstrated that they are probably systemwide within
+Bangkok not effectively handling these cases.
+ From 2016 to 2017, there was an effort to bring backlogs
+down. What they did was rush cases through. The fastest way for
+doing that is to deny them. And that also came with adverse
+credibility claims. With an adverse credibility claim you have
+almost no chance on any appeal and you are left hopeless. The
+anecdotal evidence we have and information we have is
+significant in terms of the numbers.
+ I would also like to point out that the UNHCR--their own
+reports are demonstrating that Pakistani Christians suffer
+persecution. One of the examples I gave in my testimony I
+submitted is that of Talib Masih. Talib Masih was listed in
+their own report prior to them denying his case for asylum in
+Bangkok. And we worked very hard. His case has been reversed,
+but now he has no place to go. He cannot come--he has not been
+referred to any country at this stage, 1 year later, for
+resettlement. So we are remaining concerned about him and
+others that should be resettled.
+ Mr. Mace. And if I may, briefly, just on UNRWA, I will say
+that when I was in Jordan and Lebanon, we also went to
+Palestinian refugee camps, it was one of the first places we
+went. And I just echo what you said, Congressman, that
+ultimately it is about ensuring this aid gets to those who need
+it most.
+ A Shatila camp we were in in Beirut, it was one of the most
+over-crowded places just--and because of the Syrian refugee
+crisis, it is the numbers--it is just the density is extreme.
+And we asked people at UNRWA about what do these cuts tangibly
+mean? Education was one of the first things they said. And
+that, you know, they have--other donors have helped fill in the
+gaps, but they were very worried about what the years to come
+mean if the U.S. does not restore its commitment. And would
+certainly encourage them to come before this committee or the
+full committee to really hear from them because I definitely
+think that they would have much to say in response, to you.
+ Just on the vetting, I just want to say that of refugees in
+general, the refugees who are resettled to the U.S. are by far
+and away the most vetted of any population, period. Probably in
+the world. And certainly we should always look to improve this
+program and make sure that this program is safe. We want this
+program to be safe. It is safe. And I think that this President
+and the previous Presidents have looked to that. And let's make
+sure this program works and is actually doing the goals that we
+set out at the start of the year, which it is currently not.
+ Ms. Bass. Thank you very much.
+ Representative Wild.
+ Ms. Wild. Thank you, madam chair. And thank you to all of
+you for being here to educate us about what I consider to be a
+very, very important issue.
+ Mr. Mace, you sort of anticipated the question that I was
+going to ask Ms. Buwalda, but I was going to go ahead and ask
+her at this point. There is a perception, which is I believe
+not true, that refugees are not properly vetted. And this may
+be perpetuated by our administration, maybe it is not. But
+could you address, without going into exhaustive detail, the
+type of vetting that refugees undergo before they are allowed
+to come and live here?
+ Ms. Buwalda. Yes, Congresswoman. The vetting system is very
+detailed and multilayered. There is actually a very in depth
+review that takes place. There are all kinds of background
+checks. There is even, as I understand it, DNA testing. In
+certain communities, such as in Syria, they go to the
+neighborhoods where the person claims to be from to determine
+whether those neighborhoods had terrorist activities, et
+cetera.
+ There is a data base that, you know, overlap in terms of
+how vetting takes place. I am completely in agreement with my
+copanelists here that the vetting process is extensive. And I
+do believe that there is--you know, there may always be room
+for improvement, but I do believe the vetting process is
+extensive on this population. And, consequently, it is amongst
+the lowest populations that we would have a threat from.
+ There are other types--I am an immigration attorney, there
+are other times of visas where there is no vetting. And so this
+is significant vetting that does take place.
+ Ms. Wild. And how long does the process take, if you know?
+ Ms. Buwalda. Due to the overlapping, it can be--the
+shortest is well over a year, and the longest ones because of
+overlapping, one will expire, another one start, it can be 2, 3
+years.
+ Ms. Wild. Thank you.
+ Mr. Mace, I have heard it said that the vast majority of
+people, wherever they were born, would prefer to stay in their
+home country if they can do so safely and receive adequate
+nutrition and so forth. Has that been your experience, and what
+you have observed?
+ Mr. Mace. In terms of people wanting to go back to their
+home countries?
+ Ms. Wild. Or--I guess my question is really based--and it
+is more of a statement, I suppose, that refugees are leaving
+untenable situations. Is that fair to say?
+ Mr. Mace. Absolutely. And I think it is important to note
+that no one wants to leave their home, but if you are forced to
+based on what you believe, a war, violence, that is not a
+choice. And, you know, when we were in Jordan and Lebanon, we
+met well--almost 100 refugees throughout the course of our
+trip, and we would always ask, Syrians in particular, we would
+ask, do you feel comfortable to go home? Every single one said,
+no, not right now. Some would say, I would like to go back, but
+the conditions are not right right now. And then some said, I
+will never be able to go back. If I go back, I have nothing to
+go back to. If we go back, my son will be conscripted into the
+army. My name is on--these are just different things that
+people--my name is on a list, and if I go back, I will die.
+Someone point blank said that.
+ So I think it just goes to the point that, yes, some people
+do want to go back, but the conditions are not right. And,
+unfortunately, these crises that we are talking about, they
+just go on and on, and we are seeing people who live in
+protracted displacement, intergenerational refugees. I mean, I
+met children of refugees who were born in the country that they
+are in now. So, yes.
+ Ms. Wild. Thank you.
+ I want to ask you a followup to that, and it may sound like
+a rhetorical softball question, but it is actually one that I
+would like to hear you articulate about, and Mr. Schwartz and
+Ms. Buwalda, also if you care to. And that is, why is it
+important for the United States to lead the way in this
+humanitarian crisis?
+ And I ask you that from the perspective of a legislator who
+has a district where a number of my constituents may very well
+articulate the idea that we should just be taking care of what
+is happening right here in America, and why do we need to get
+involved with people from around the world who are suffering
+through these humanitarian crises.
+ So give us some words of--some pearls of wisdom of what we
+can say to address that to people who express that.
+ Mr. Mace. Sure, I would love to speak briefly and hear from
+my colleagues here.
+ First of all, when the U.S. leads, others follow. And, you
+know, we do not have to look that far back when we were the
+leader. We are not the leader in resettlement anymore, period.
+And last year, in 2018, not the calendar year, there were 55--a
+little over 55,000 people who resettled, not to the U.S.,
+globally. And 22,000 or so of which was in the U.S., so we are
+not even the leader anymore.
+ A few years ago it was well over 100,000. There are 1.4
+million people who need access to resettlement. I think anyone
+can say the U.S. can do better. And, importantly, on our U.S.
+refugee admissions program, it is a program that started in
+1980 with the 1980 Refugee Act, it is a program that has been
+built up, like I said, with communities like yours, all across
+the country, and it benefits our communities. It is such--it
+revitalizes--refugees are--they are everything and anything
+because they are just like us.
+ So I just do not understand anyone who says that refugees
+do not contribute to the United States. And we have seen that,
+not only here in the U.S., but all around the world.
+ Ms. Wild. Thank you.
+ I am going to actually ask you, Mr. Schwartz, but rather
+than going into that question because I saw something in your
+written testimony that I did not hear talked about today, and
+that is what the effect of the global gag rule is on this
+crisis. And you mention it in your written testimony, and I
+would just like to hear from you briefly on it.
+ Mr. Schwartz. Yes, the restrictions against provision of
+these services to women if the organizations concerned provide
+abortion-related services, even if they are not being done with
+U.S. funds, is a significant problem.
+ Now, the State Department and USAID emergency assistance is
+exempted. However, there is a lot of assistance that goes to
+the building of resilience that is critical for humanitarian
+emergencies that is cutoff. And also of significant concern is
+the complete cutoff of support for the U.N. Fund for Population
+Activities, which includes, you know, critically important
+assistance for services related to sexual and reproductive
+health, for prevention and response to gender-based violence.
+ But I also want to comment on your last question. I mean,
+nobody suggests that the world--that the United States or the
+countries of the global north--will resettle the majority of
+the world's refugees. Even at 1.4 million, you are at about 4
+percent, 4 or 5 percent--maybe 4 or 6 percent. But the
+Government of Turkey is hosting 3 1/2 million refugees, the
+Government of Jordan is hosting upwards of a million refugees,
+the Government of Bangladesh is hosting a million refugees, the
+Ethiopia is hosting 900,000 refugees or more, and we are going
+around the world saying to these governments, this is what you
+must do. This is your responsibility.
+ How in heaven's name can we not demonstrate that we have
+skin in the game, that we are going to demonstrate a modicum of
+leadership by saying, perhaps we will resettle 100,000
+refugees, which is a drop in the bucket. And so it is really
+critically important we do that.
+ Finally, I ran the U.S. refugee resettlement program. I do
+not want to take too much of your time, but I would be happy to
+talk about the security issues----
+ Ms. Bass. We need to move on.
+ Ms. Wild. Madam chair, my time is up, and it is my fault
+for asking very extensive questions. I pass to----
+ Ms. Bass. Representative Omar.
+ Ms. Omar. Thank you, Chairwomen Bass.
+ Hello, everyone. Thank you so much for being part of this
+important discussion. It is interesting to hear people say, I
+wonder what this process is or what refugees are like in the
+United States. But as a refugee and as someone who has gone
+through the process of vetting, I know the many years my family
+waited in a refugee camp to be able to resettle in the United
+States. And I know with certainty the kind of anxieties that a
+lot of families have as they await the opportunity to get
+resettled and start a new life.
+ I just wanted to kind of look at and follow with the line
+of questioning that Congresswoman Wild had around what happens
+when we lower the refugee cap here, and how that could lead to
+other countries following pursuit and lowering the cap of
+refugees that they welcome into their own countries, and we are
+at risk of that because when we lead others follow. And I think
+we are setting a really bad example around the world right now.
+ But I wanted to also up lift what these particular policies
+that this administration has, it is really all about--according
+to the refugee processing portal, 68.1 percent of the 22,491
+refugees admitted in 2018 were Christians, 15.5 were Muslim,
+9.3 were animists, Buddhists, or Hindu. Only 369 refugees were
+admitted from the countries included in the modified travel ban
+or the Muslim ban.
+ The breakdown is as such. From Chad, only one refugee was
+admitted who was Muslim, and in totality only one person. In
+Iran, 41 were admitted. Of that 41, 23 were Christians, 8
+Muslims, 5 Baha'i, and 3 Siberian Mandaeans, 1 Jewish, and 1
+had not declared a faith. From Libya, we only admitted one
+person, and that person was Muslim. From North Korea, we
+admitted five, four Christians, one Buddhist. From Syria, we
+admitted 62, 42 were Muslim, 20 were Christians. From Somalia,
+we admitted 257. Venezuela is zero. And two from Yemen.
+ So when we think about--and we consider the harsh crack-
+downs on asylum seekers from Central America, the policy that
+is the Muslim ban and the sharp drop in the refugee
+resettlement during this administration, do you, Mr. Schwartz,
+agree that the President's immigration policies are not really
+based on whether we favor legal or illegal, whether it is about
+safety and security, but it is rather about the kind of people
+that we think we should be welcoming into this country?
+ Mr. Schwartz. I am deeply concerned, Representative Omar,
+as a former dean of a public affairs school that sits in your
+district, that hosted at our school many Somali students. I am
+concerned about the dramatic decline in resettlement of
+refugees from Muslim majority countries. I think it merits the
+scrutiny of the Congress, and it is a source of concern.
+ This is not a mystery. President Trump has said that he
+does not really want the United States to be resettling very
+many refugees, I mean, it is what it is. The reason I think
+this happens, and this relates to the security question, is,
+look, security screening is very important, and the FBI is
+involved in it, the intelligence community is involved in it,
+the Department of Homeland Security is involved in it.
+ It can be a complete obstacle to resettlement of refugees
+from Muslim majority countries or it does not have to be, and
+the difference is leadership. If the President of the United
+States said to those agencies, ``this has to work, and I am
+going to throw the resources necessary in terms of
+adjudicators, in terms of intelligence, et cetera, to meet the
+objective of resettling reasonable numbers of these
+populations", it would happen.
+ But it is not happening because this administration, is
+just not interested in that outcome, so it is not prepared to
+devote the resources necessary to get through the process. That
+is what is happening. And I think it is very unfortunate.
+ As a practical matter, the way Congress can address the
+resettlement issue, at this point in this administration
+because of the plenary authority of the President to decide how
+many refugees are coming in every year, the way you can address
+it is the way I suggested in my testimony. Get consensus on a
+Central American refugee resettlement program or some
+resettlement program, and legislate it. And that is how you can
+effect it.
+ But with the President's posture on this issue and his
+untrammeled authority to decide how many people are going to
+come in, the Congress is not going to significantly alter that
+process. It is just not going to happen. And it is a tragedy,
+and it speaks poorly about who we are as a country, but it is
+what it is.
+ Ms. Omar. So sometimes there are a lot of conversations we
+have that are not really rooted in fact. There are people
+within my home State of Minnesota who will say there are
+thousands of Somalis coming in every single day being resettled
+without your knowledge. The President himself was unfortunately
+in my State and said something to that regard. And in the last
+year, one Somali family was resettled in our State.
+ But I also want to go back to a statement that was made on
+the committee and just kind of have some facts be used to
+address that. You know, the ISIS bride was mentioned, and it is
+a fact that the ISIS bride was not a refugee that was resettled
+in this country. It is a fact that she was not an immigrant,
+but an American born to a family of diplomats. And so I would
+love to hear from you, Mr. Schwartz, or any of the panelists,
+when you state earlier that the refugees are the most vetted
+and have not been part of causing terror or taking American
+lives in this country.
+ Can you actually address that with some actual facts? Do
+you have numbers or some things to help us cleanse us of this
+hateful rhetoric that we have developed in thinking that people
+who are coming to this country to seek a new life are the ones
+that are causing us harm, and one that is making our
+communities unsafe and turning us against each other because,
+you know, for the most of Minnesotans who are of refugee
+background, most of us came as children, and we went through
+years of vetting and went through the process of becoming a
+citizen. I mean, we have been fingerprinted, tested, more than
+any American has ever been who was born in this country.
+ And so it saddens me and it is frustrating really and
+angering to hear people say that we are a threat to society
+when we are tested and policed and surveilled more than any
+member of our society.
+ So can you please help me out and put some facts to this?
+ Ms. Bass. Well, actually, we have gone over on time, so if
+one of you want to briefly respond, and then I want to make a
+few comments before I move on to Ms. Houlahan.
+ Mr. Schwartz. Well, just very briefly. I think security
+screening is legitimate. But I also think policy has to be
+evidence-based. I think if you have an immigration program, and
+we have an immigration program, you know, some of the people
+who come into your country are going to commit crimes, at lower
+rates than native Americans, but that is going to happen, so
+policy has to be evidence-based. And I think we have durable
+and responsible screening procedures.
+ The Cato Institute, a conservative think tank in
+Washington, estimated that between 1975 and 2015, the
+likelihood of an American losing their lives at the hands of a
+refugee was one in 3.64 billion, which means almost
+nonexistent. And so I think policy has to be evidence-based. We
+have to have responsible screening procedures, but policies
+have to be evidence-based.
+ Ms. Bass. Thank you. So before we move on to our last
+member, let me just say that in this hearing we went over
+beyond 5 minutes because it is difficult when one person does
+it then not to allow everyone else. In the future, though, I do
+want our hearings to stick to 5 minutes, and then after
+everybody has had a chance to speak, if there is time left,
+then we can have people return for a second round.
+ Representative Houlahan.
+ Ms. Houlahan. Thank you. And thank you to my colleagues as
+well for their impassioned conversation and to you all for
+coming today, and to Mr. Mace and Mr. Schwartz for spending
+time with me last week on the phone, and bringing me up to
+speed on this.
+ I am the daughter of a refugee who came here 70 years ago,
+and these issues are critically important to me as well. I am
+trying to find a solution, just like I think everyone here, to
+being the Nation that we have been promised and the Nation that
+has given us so much, as both of us sitting here on the stage--
+many of us here.
+ And so what I am trying to figure out though also is--I am
+also from a community that is struggling right now, they have
+jobs that are open and they cannot find people to fill those
+jobs. They are in danger in the case of one industry in
+particular of literally going out of business, five generations
+of people have farmed mushrooms in my community, we no longer
+can find the labor who would like to do this, and those
+businesses are going under.
+ What I am trying to understand is in a world where we have
+these caps, which are not being met. In a world where we have
+these jobs, which are being unmet as well, how do I help as a
+legislator to match the supply and the demand without being,
+you know, crass about human lives, I am just trying to figure
+out how it is that we can figure out how to match what is
+clearly a group of people who would desperately like to fill
+those jobs and desperately like to be part of the American
+dream, and a community that would desperately like to have them
+be there?
+ I am wondering from you all, have you seen any programs
+that work, that can marry up these two groups with one another?
+Is there anything that you have seen either at the State or
+local level, or frankly, at the Federal level? We spoke about
+the idea of having this special Central American refugee
+policy, I was really intrigued about that. Can you put some
+bones to that kind of an idea? And that I think is largely--the
+large part of my question.
+ Mr. Mace. I would just say briefly that, first of all, when
+I was in the region, one of the very first things people would
+say, besides education, if they had kids it was always
+education of their kids, and that I want to work. I want to
+have a meaningful job. And whether that is in the country they
+are in or if they are resettled, everyone wants to work, they
+do not want to be reliant on aid.
+ In terms of that, I think that it is not surprising you
+have heard from people in your district. All across the country
+there are so many different industries and places that actually
+benefit from refugees, immigrants, asylees, refugee,
+immigrants, they contribute to our country in so many vibrant
+ways.
+ I think the first thing I would say is in terms of a
+refugee programing, when we are talking about that, we just
+need to call for an increase in the program. I think that there
+is other ways of looking at it, and I would say that it might
+be worth exploring. You know, at Embassy International we have
+a community sponsorship program where we encourage amnesty
+members to sign up to be sponsors of refugees, aligned with
+their local resettlement agency, like LIRS, IRC, HIAS and I
+think that there is innovative things that we could look to to
+say maybe there are ways that we can work together.
+ But I think it is important to note that what makes our
+program, the U.S. refugee admissions program such a good one,
+is that we do not value people based on their education, based
+on anything except to say who is most in need, who is most
+vulnerable, and that is where the U.S. refugee admissions
+program should always start.
+ Mr. Schwartz. I presume you are not talking about the
+regular immigration law means of bringing employees in. And so,
+you know, what Mr. Mace said is true. The refugee program has
+been of pristine in that it has focussed on refugee admissions
+based on the five criteria related to persecution, and I honor
+that. But I would not oppose, and I think a special initiative
+focused on Central America, that broadens the categories to
+include other types of forced migrants.
+ Not every forced migrant is a refugee. But people who feel
+they need to leave their homes, and who we all would agree they
+should be leaving their homes due to violence and other
+factors. Forced migrants, you know, are in need. And in this
+special situation, I think there are opportunities for special
+legislation that captures both refugees and other forced
+migrants.
+ I would refer you to a Washington Post piece by Roberto
+Soro of USC and Alex Aleinikoff of the New School, the former
+INS legal counsel, that discusses this particular program in
+some detail.
+ Ms. Houlahan. Thank you very much. I will yield back.
+ Ms. Bass. Thank you very much, I appreciate that. Mr.
+Smith, would you like to----
+ Mr. Smith. Thank you, madam chair. And, again, thank you
+for calling this very important hearing. I did want to ask Mr.
+Schwartz, if I could, you know, you mentioned the GAO report,
+which I have read, but there was a declassified GAO report, as
+you know, that just came out, and that tells a different story.
+A profoundly different story with, of course, to UNRWA and the
+textbooks. It does point out that UNRWA and state have taken
+steps to identify and address potentially problematic content
+of textbooks used in UNRWA schools, and there is about 370 of
+those schools.
+ But then it says, due to financial shortfalls, and this is
+before there was any cut, UNRWA officials told GAO that UNRWA
+did not train teachers or distribute the complimentary teaching
+materials. They point out in their report, this is GAO, again,
+that there was inaccurate information conveyed by the U.S.
+Department of State to Congress, and omitted potentially useful
+information, and bottom line, without a fuller explanation,
+Congress may not have the information it needs to oversee
+efforts to identify and address potentially problematic
+textbook content.
+ So my concern is, are we talking about an initiative that
+looked good? Had a great deal of surface appeal, but when it
+came down to implementation, it was an absolute sham. This GAO
+report, the one that was just declassified, makes it pretty
+clear that there are really serious problems that--I have had
+hearings myself in this hearing room where textbooks that are
+used to train, to educate young Palestinian children, contain
+the most horrific hate against Jews imaginable. And, you know,
+that is absolutely unacceptable.
+ Remember in that great South Pacific, Rodgers and
+Hammerstein, there is a famous song in there, You Have Got To
+Be Taught To Hate. That it needs, you know, it is inculcated in
+the minds of these young people. Well, if the textbooks are
+rife with anti-Semitic hatred, that needs to be called out and
+excised, and that is what we have been calling for.
+ I met with the UNRWA board many times myself in the past
+and it kept calling for that. Now we have a GAO report that
+makes it pretty clear, still a problem. You know, they did what
+looked like on the surface was something, then it was not
+implemented at the school.
+ I would just say this for the record, and I know we have a
+fundamental difference when it comes to the right to life
+issue. I believe that unborn children are--should be respected.
+That abortion is violence again children, whether it is
+dismemberment or chemical poisoning, the end result is the
+same. That child, that girl or that boy dies. I do believe that
+there are two victims in every abortion, both the mother and
+the baby.
+ That said, in 1984 when Ronald Reagan announced the Mexico
+City policy, there were many people who said, nobody will
+accept these terms and conditions. I offered the amendment in
+1984 on the floor of the House to protect the Mexico City
+policy, and that argument was made over and over and over again
+by my very distinguished and respected colleagues, who I like
+and respect, but disagreed on this issue.
+ Now, we found out during Reagan, Bush and Bush who had the
+Mexico City policy in place, that just about everybody accepted
+those terms and conditions because we do not want to be in the
+position of facilitating the killing of unborn children. You
+know, I know you know this, and I think most people know it.
+Just look at what first baby pictures are now all about. The
+picture of the child in utero, the ultrasound. And parents
+proudly send that out to grandparents and friends, and say,
+here is what the little girl or little boy looks like. Abortion
+is the antithesis of that because it either dismembers that
+little baby or kills that baby with chemical poisoning.
+ We are, out of an abundance of concern for children, the
+New Protect Life policy in global health, it is designed to
+say, let's look at birth as an event. It is not the beginning
+of life, but as an event, and protect to the greatest extent
+possible those children. The original or the current analysis
+is almost every foreign NGO in the world, not all, but almost
+every one, has accepted the terms and conditions that have been
+promulgated by the administration.
+ So the money is flowing, it is flowing to organizations
+that are doing the great work on the ground. So I, do believe
+some day people will look back upon us, and say, how could a
+country that so strongly protected other human rights could not
+see that those children had value and worth? I know we
+disagree, but that is where I am coming from. They are
+children, they deserve our respect, and hopefully our
+protection. And, minimally, not our financial facilitation of
+their demise. But if you could maybe speak to this one as well.
+ Mr. Schwartz. Yes, I have to respond. I just have to
+comment. First of all, Representative Smith, you know how much
+I admire your commitment to humanitarianism and to the rights
+and well-being of refugees, it goes without saying. But we have
+some differences.
+ On the UNRWA issue, I was referring to the classified
+report. I was not referring to an unclassified report. I have a
+different view on that report, because I believe that in an
+imperfect world we have an organization operating in an
+extremely difficult climate. I believe that organization is a
+force for positive movement on humanitarian issues, and I
+believe that their removal from that situation, which would be
+facilitated by a U.S. cut in aid, would have dramatic and
+negative implications for the Palestinian people.
+ If I can take off my Refugees International hat for a
+second, I also believe it would have negative political
+consequences. I think it would strengthen the position of
+radicals in the region. So that is my first point on UNRWA.
+ On the other issue, I am not advocating U.S. support for
+abortion-related services, but I am saying that I think this
+policy, because it prevents assistance to organizations that
+use other funds to undertake such activities, I believe this
+policy does more harm than good. And so we have a difference of
+opinion about that.
+ Ms. Bass. So let me just before I close us out. Oh,
+Representative Omar?
+ Ms. Omar. Could I?
+ Ms. Bass. Sure.
+ Ms. Omar. Sorry. Thank you. I just thought of--I had a
+round table on immigration issues for recess week in my
+district, and two of the participants were lawyers who went to
+go help in our southern border to assist some of the asylum
+seekers there. They were speaking about some of the things that
+they witnessed. I just noticed that, Mr. Schwartz, you had
+mentioned that in your testimony--and so I wanted to ask you
+about this policy of metering and whether it is within
+international law to do that.
+ Then I wanted to ask you about our--what has our historic
+capacity at that border crossing has been and what does
+processing look like right now?
+ Mr. Schwartz. Well, understanding the lateness of the hour,
+I will try to be very brief.
+ Ms. Bass. Thank you.
+ Mr. Schwartz. The testimony speaks for itself. I think that
+practices of the administration have run afoul of our
+commitments under the Refugee Convention and Protocol, and
+under U.S. implementing legislation around that.
+ Criminalizing people who cross between ports of entry is in
+violation of Article 31 of the Convention because it says to
+somebody who crosses, we are going to put you in prison first
+and charge you, and then maybe we will consider whether or not
+you are a refugee. That is not the way to do it. So I have
+concern about that.
+ I have a concern about a policy that returns people to
+Mexico in circumstances where the conditions in northern Mexico
+are very dangerous, where people do not have access to lawyers,
+where there is very little or no due process, and there is the
+risk of returning to situations where people's lives or freedom
+may be threatened.
+ So for all of those reasons, I think Congress should be
+acting to legislate remedies here, and I think the policy is an
+unfortunate one.
+ Ms. Bass. Thank you very much.
+ Before I wrap up, I want to thank all of the witnesses for
+your testimony, for your time, and for your recommendations. As
+my colleague said, we do have differences of opinion. We have
+differences of opinion when it comes to a woman's right to
+choose. As a mother and as a grandmother, it is kind of
+difficult to hear the descriptions of what an abortion is or an
+abortion is not. What I worry about is is that when we have
+policies that try to govern what women do with their bodies, it
+really only applies to poor women, and that is my concern.
+ I worry about women in other countries, that there is cases
+in Central America where women are criminalized, incarcerated,
+because they had a miscarriage, and it is not clear whether it
+was a miscarriage because of natural reasons or it was an
+abortion. So in 2019, the idea that many countries are still
+criminalizing women is of great concern to me. I just kind of
+hope when we move forward in this committee that, we
+acknowledge the differences, but sometimes I do not think the
+graphic descriptions are necessary for the point to be made.
+ And with that, I adjourn.
+ [Whereupon, at 4:50 p.m., the subcommittee was adjourned.]
+
+ APPENDIX
+
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+
+ [all]
+