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- The following is a conversation with Keoki Jackson.
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- He's the CTO of Lockheed Martin,
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- a company that through his long history
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- has created some of the most incredible engineering
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- marvels human beings have ever built,
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- including planes that fly fast and undetected,
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- defense systems that intersect nuclear threats that
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- can take the lives of millions, and systems that venture out
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- into space, the moon, Mars, and beyond.
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- And these days, more and more, artificial intelligence
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- has an assistive role to play in these systems.
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- I've read several books in preparation
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- for this conversation.
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- It is a difficult one, because in part,
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- Lockheed Martin builds military systems
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- that operate in a complicated world that often does not
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- have easy solutions in the gray area between good and evil.
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- I hope one day this world will rid itself of war
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- in all its forms.
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- But the path to achieving that in a world that
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- does have evil is not obvious.
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- What is obvious is good engineering
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- and artificial intelligence research
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- has a role to play on the side of good.
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- Lockheed Martin and the rest of our community
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- are hard at work at exactly this task.
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- We talk about these and other important topics
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- in this conversation.
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- Also, most certainly, both Kiyoki and I have a passion for space,
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- us humans venturing out toward the stars.
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- We talk about this exciting future as well.
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- This is the artificial intelligence podcast.
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- If you enjoy it, subscribe on YouTube,
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- give it five stars on iTunes, support it on Patreon,
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- or simply connect with me on Twitter
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- at Lex Freedman, spelled F R I D M A N.
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- And now, here's my conversation with Kiyoki Jackson.
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- I read several books on Lockheed Martin recently.
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- My favorite, in particular, is by Ben Rich,
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- called Skonkork's personal memoir.
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- It gets a little edgy at times.
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- But from that, I was reminded that the engineers of Lockheed
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- Martin have created some of the most incredible engineering
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- marvels human beings have ever built throughout the 20th century
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- and the 21st.
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- Do you remember a particular project or system at Lockheed
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- or before that at the Space Shuttle Columbia
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- that you were just in awe at the fact
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- that us humans could create something like this?
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- That's a great question.
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- There's a lot of things that I could draw on there.
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- When you look at the Skonkorks and Ben Rich's book,
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- in particular, of course, it starts off
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- with basically the start of the jet age and the P80.
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- I had the opportunity to sit next to one of the Apollo
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- astronauts, Charlie Duke, recently at dinner.
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- And I said, hey, what's your favorite aircraft?
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- And he said, well, it was by far the F104 Starfighter, which
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- was another aircraft that came out of Lockheed there.
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- What kind of?
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- It was the first Mach 2 jet fighter aircraft.
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- They called it the missile with a man in it.
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- And so those are the kinds of things
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- I grew up hearing stories about.
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- Of course, the SR 71 is incomparable
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- as kind of the epitome of speed, altitude, and just
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- the coolest looking aircraft ever.
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- So there's a reconnaissance that's
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- a plane that's a intelligence surveillance
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- and reconnaissance aircraft that was designed
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- to be able to outrun, basically go faster
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- than any air defense system.
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- But I'll tell you, I'm a space junkie.
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- That's why I came to MIT.
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- That's really what took me, ultimately, to Lockheed Martin.
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- And I grew up, and so Lockheed Martin, for example,
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- has been essentially at the heart of every planetary mission,
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- like all the Mars missions we've had a part in.
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- And we've talked a lot about the 50th anniversary of Apollo
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- here in the last couple of weeks, right?
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- But remember, 1976, July 20, again, the National Space
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- Day, so the landing of the Viking lander on the surface
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- of Mars, just a huge accomplishment.
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- And when I was a young engineer at Lockheed Martin,
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- I got to meet engineers who had designed various pieces
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- of that mission as well.
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- So that's what I grew up on is these planetary missions,
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- the start of the space shuttle era,
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- and ultimately had the opportunity
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- to see Lockheed Martin's part in what
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- we can maybe talk about some of these here,
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- but Lockheed Martin's part in all of these space journeys
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- over the years.
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- Do you dream, and I apologize for getting philosophical at times,
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- or sentimental, I do romanticize the notion
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- of space exploration.
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- So do you dream of the day when us humans colonize
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- another planet, like Mars, or a man, a woman, a human being,
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- steps on Mars?
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- Absolutely.
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- And that's a personal dream of mine.
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- I haven't given up yet on my own opportunity
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- to fly into space, but from the Lockheed Martin perspective,
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- this is something that we're working towards every day.
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- And of course, we're building the Orion spacecraft, which
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- is the most sophisticated human rated spacecraft ever built.
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- And it's really designed for these deep space journeys,
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- starting with the moon, but ultimately going to Mars.
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- And being the platform from a design perspective,
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- we call the Mars Base Camp to be able to take humans
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- to the surface, and then after a mission of a couple of weeks,
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- bring them back up safely.
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- And so that is something I want to see happen during my time
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- at Lockheed Martin.
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- So I'm pretty excited about that.
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- And I think once we prove that's possible,
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- colonization might be a little bit further out,
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- but it's something that I'd hope to see.
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- So maybe you can give a little bit
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- of an overview of, so Lockheed Martin
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- has partnered with a few years ago with Boeing
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- to work with the DoD and NASA to build launch systems
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- and rockets with the ULA.
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- What's beyond that?
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- What's Lockheed's mission, timeline, and long term
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- dream in terms of space?
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- You mentioned the moon.
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- I've heard you talk about asteroids as Mars.
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- What's the timeline?
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- What's the engineering challenges?
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- And what's the dream long term?
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- Yeah, I think the dream long term is
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- to have a permanent presence in space beyond low Earth
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- orbit, ultimately with a long term presence on the moon
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- and then to the planets to Mars.
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- And it's very interrupting that.
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- So long term presence means sustained and sustainable
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- presence in an economy, a space economy,
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- that really goes alongside that.
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- With human beings and being able to launch perhaps
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- from those, so like hop.
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- You know, there's a lot of energy
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- that goes in those hops, right?
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- So I think the first step is being
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- able to get there and to be able to establish sustained basis,
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- right, and build from there.
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- And a lot of that means getting, as you know,
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- things like the cost of launch down.
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- And you mentioned United Launch Alliance.
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- And so I don't want to speak for ULA,
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- but obviously they're working really hard
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- to, on their next generation of launch vehicles,
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- to maintain that incredible mission success record
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- that ULA has, but ultimately continue
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- to drive down the cost and make the flexibility, the speed,
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- and the access ever greater.
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- So what's the missions that are in the horizon
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- that you could talk to?
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- Is there a hope to get to the moon?
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- Absolutely, absolutely.
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- I mean, I think you know this, or you
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- may know this, there's a lot of ways
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- to accomplish some of these goals.
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- And so that's a lot of what's in discussion today.
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- But ultimately, the goal is to be
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- able to establish a base, essentially
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- in CIS lunar space that would allow for ready transfer
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- from orbit to the lunar surface and back again.
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- And so that's sort of that near term,
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- I say near term in the next decade or so vision,
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- starting off with a stated objective
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- by this administration to get back to the moon in the 2024,
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- 2025 time frame, which is right around the corner here.
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- How big of an engineering challenge is that?
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- I think the big challenge is not so much to go, but to stay.
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- And so we demonstrated in the 60s
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- that you could send somebody up, do a couple of days of mission,
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- and bring them home again successfully.
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- Now we're talking about doing that,
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- I'd say more to, I don't want to say an industrial scale,
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- but a sustained scale.
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- So permanent habitation, regular reuse of vehicles,
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- the infrastructure to get things like fuel, air, consumables,
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- replacement parts, all the things that you need to sustain
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- that kind of infrastructure.
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- So those are certainly engineering challenges.
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- There are budgetary challenges.
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- And those are all things that we're
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- going to have to work through.
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- The other thing, and I shouldn't,
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- I don't want to minimize this.
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- I mean, I'm excited about human exploration,
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- but the reality is our technology
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- and where we've come over the last 40 years, essentially,
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- has changed what we can do with robotic exploration as well.
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- And to me, it's incredibly thrilling.
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- This seems like old news now, but the fact
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- that we have rovers driving around the surface of Mars
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- and sending back data is just incredible.
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- The fact that we have satellites in orbit around Mars
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- that are collecting weather, they're
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- looking at the terrain, they're mapping,
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- all these kinds of things on a continuous basis,
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- that's incredible.
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- And the fact that you got the time lag,
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- of course, going to the planets, but you can effectively
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- have virtual human presence there in a way
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- that we have never been able to do before.
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- And now, with the advent of even greater processing power,
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- better AI systems, better cognitive systems
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- and decision systems, you put that together
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- with the human piece, and we really
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- opened up the solar system in a whole different way.
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- And I'll give you an example.
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- We've got Osiris Rex, which is a mission to the asteroid Benus.
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- So the spacecraft is out there right now on basically a year
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- mapping activity to map the entire surface of that asteroid
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- in great detail, all autonomously piloted, right?
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- But the idea then that, and this is not too far away,
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- it's going to go in.
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- It's got a sort of fancy vacuum cleaner with a bucket.
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- It's going to collect the sample off the asteroid
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- and then send it back here to Earth.
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- And so we have gone from sort of those tentative steps
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- in the 70s, early landings, video of the solar system
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- to now we've sent spacecraft to Pluto.
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- We have gone to comets and brought and intercepted comets.
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- We've brought stardust, material back.
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- So we've gone far, and there's incredible opportunity
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- to go even farther.
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- So it seems quite crazy that this is even possible,
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- that can you talk a little bit about what
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- it means to orbit an asteroid with a bucket to try
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- to pick up some soil samples?
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- Yeah.
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- So part of it is just kind of the,
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- these are the same kinds of techniques
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- we use here on Earth for high speed, high accuracy imagery,
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- stitching these scenes together, and creating essentially
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- high accuracy world maps.
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- And so that's what we're doing, obviously,
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- on a much smaller scale with an asteroid.
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- But the other thing that's really interesting,
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- you put together sort of that neat control and data
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- and imagery problem.
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- But the stories around how we design the collection,
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- I mean, as essentially, this is the sort of the human
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- ingenuity element, right?
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- That essentially had an engineer who had one day he's like,
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- well, starts messing around with parts, vacuum cleaner,
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- bucket, maybe we could do something like this.
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- And that was what led to what we call the Pogo stick
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- collection, right?
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- Where basically, I think comes down,
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- it's only there for seconds does that collection,
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- grabs the, essentially blows the regolith material
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- into the collection hopper and off it goes.
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- It doesn't really land almost.
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- It's a very short landing.
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- Wow, that's incredible.
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- So what is in those, we talk a little bit more about space.
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- What's the role of the human in all of this?
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- What are the challenges?
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- What are the opportunities for humans
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- as they pilot these vehicles in space
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- and for humans that may step foot on either the moon or Mars?
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- Yeah, it's a great question because I just
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- have been extolling the virtues of robotic and rovers,
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- autonomous systems, and those absolutely have a role.
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- I think the thing that we don't know how to replace today
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- is the ability to adapt on the fly to new information.
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- And I believe that will come, but we're not there yet.
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- There's a ways to go.
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- And so you think back to Apollo 13
-
-14:13.600 --> 14:16.920
- and the ingenuity of the folks on the ground and on the spacecraft
-
-14:16.920 --> 14:20.120
- essentially cobbled together a way
-
-14:20.120 --> 14:23.800
- to get the carbon dioxide scrubbers to work.
-
-14:23.800 --> 14:28.280
- Those are the kinds of things that ultimately,
-
-14:28.280 --> 14:31.280
- and I'd say not just from dealing with anomalies,
-
-14:31.280 --> 14:33.640
- but dealing with new information.
-
-14:33.640 --> 14:38.360
- You see something, and rather than waiting 20 minutes
-
-14:38.360 --> 14:41.600
- or half an hour an hour to try to get information back
-
-14:41.600 --> 14:44.000
- and forth, but be able to essentially
-
-14:44.000 --> 14:47.600
- revect around the fly, collect different samples,
-
-14:47.600 --> 14:52.680
- take a different approach, choose different areas to explore.
-
-14:52.680 --> 14:56.680
- Those are the kinds of things that that human presence enables
-
-14:56.680 --> 15:00.240
- that still weighs ahead of us on the AI side.
-
-15:00.240 --> 15:02.160
- Yeah, there's some interesting stuff we'll talk about
-
-15:02.160 --> 15:04.520
- on the teaming side here on Earth.
-
-15:04.520 --> 15:06.400
- That's pretty cool to explore.
-
-15:06.400 --> 15:08.800
- And in space, let's not leave the space piece out.
-
-15:08.800 --> 15:10.320
- So what is teaming?
-
-15:10.320 --> 15:13.880
- What does AI and humans working together in space look like?
-
-15:13.880 --> 15:15.400
- Yeah, one of the things we're working on
-
-15:15.400 --> 15:19.080
- is a system called Maya, which is, think of it,
-
-15:19.080 --> 15:21.360
- so it's an AI assistant.
-
-15:21.360 --> 15:24.160
- And in space, exactly.
-
-15:24.160 --> 15:28.520
- And think of it as the Alexa in space, right?
-
-15:28.520 --> 15:31.680
- But this goes hand in hand with a lot of other developments.
-
-15:31.680 --> 15:35.120
- And so today's world, everything is essentially model based,
-
-15:35.120 --> 15:40.880
- model based systems engineering to the actual digital tapestry
-
-15:40.880 --> 15:43.880
- that goes through the design, the build, the manufacture,
-
-15:43.880 --> 15:47.600
- the testing, and ultimately the sustainment of these systems.
-
-15:47.600 --> 15:52.120
- And so our vision is really that when our astronauts
-
-15:52.120 --> 15:55.160
- are there around Mars, you're going
-
-15:55.160 --> 16:01.520
- to have that entire digital library of the spacecraft,
-
-16:01.520 --> 16:05.440
- of its operations, all the test data, all the test data
-
-16:05.440 --> 16:08.040
- and flight data from previous missions
-
-16:08.040 --> 16:11.760
- to be able to look and see if there are anomalous conditions
-
-16:11.760 --> 16:16.000
- until the humans, and potentially deal with that
-
-16:16.000 --> 16:20.640
- before it becomes a bad situation and help
-
-16:20.640 --> 16:23.160
- the astronauts work through those kinds of things.
-
-16:23.160 --> 16:26.760
- And it's not just dealing with problems as they come up,
-
-16:26.760 --> 16:29.160
- but also offering up opportunities
-
-16:29.160 --> 16:32.440
- for additional exploration capability, for example.
-
-16:32.440 --> 16:35.120
- So that's the vision is that these
-
-16:35.120 --> 16:37.720
- are going to take the best of the human to respond
-
-16:37.720 --> 16:43.480
- to changing circumstances and rely on the best AI
-
-16:43.480 --> 16:48.560
- capabilities to monitor this almost infinite number
-
-16:48.560 --> 16:51.520
- of data points and correlations of data points
-
-16:51.520 --> 16:53.960
- that humans, frankly, aren't that good at.
-
-16:53.960 --> 16:56.200
- So how do you develop systems in space like this,
-
-16:56.200 --> 17:01.560
- whether it's a Alexa in space or, in general, any kind
-
-17:01.560 --> 17:04.880
- of control systems, any kind of intelligent systems,
-
-17:04.880 --> 17:08.600
- when you can't really test stuff too much out in space,
-
-17:08.600 --> 17:10.760
- it's very expensive to test stuff.
-
-17:10.760 --> 17:14.160
- So how do you develop such systems?
-
-17:14.160 --> 17:18.880
- Yeah, that's the beauty of this digital twin, if you will.
-
-17:18.880 --> 17:21.080
- And of course, with Lockheed Martin,
-
-17:21.080 --> 17:24.520
- we've over the past five plus decades
-
-17:24.520 --> 17:28.120
- been refining our knowledge of the space environment,
-
-17:28.120 --> 17:33.240
- of how materials behave, dynamics, the controls,
-
-17:33.240 --> 17:37.160
- the radiation environments, all of these kinds of things.
-
-17:37.160 --> 17:39.880
- So we're able to create very sophisticated models.
-
-17:39.880 --> 17:43.440
- They're not perfect, but they're very good.
-
-17:43.440 --> 17:46.600
- And so you can actually do a lot.
-
-17:46.600 --> 17:51.440
- I spent part of my career simulating communication
-
-17:51.440 --> 17:56.400
- spacecraft, missile warning spacecraft, GPS spacecraft,
-
-17:56.400 --> 17:59.280
- in all kinds of scenarios and all kinds of environments.
-
-17:59.280 --> 18:01.880
- So this is really just taking that to the next level.
-
-18:01.880 --> 18:04.000
- The interesting thing is that now you're
-
-18:04.000 --> 18:07.800
- bringing into that loop a system, depending on how it's
-
-18:07.800 --> 18:10.520
- developed, that may be non deterministic,
-
-18:10.520 --> 18:13.160
- it may be learning as it goes.
-
-18:13.160 --> 18:16.560
- In fact, we anticipate that it will be learning as it goes.
-
-18:16.560 --> 18:22.160
- And so that brings a whole new level of interest, I guess,
-
-18:22.160 --> 18:25.320
- into how do you do verification and validation
-
-18:25.320 --> 18:28.520
- of these non deterministic learning systems
-
-18:28.520 --> 18:32.720
- in scenarios that may go out of the bounds or the envelope
-
-18:32.720 --> 18:35.000
- that you have initially designed them to.
-
-18:35.000 --> 18:39.200
- So this system in its intelligence has the same complexity,
-
-18:39.200 --> 18:41.040
- some of the same complexity a human does.
-
-18:41.040 --> 18:43.640
- And it learns over time, it's unpredictable
-
-18:43.640 --> 18:46.240
- in certain kinds of ways.
-
-18:46.240 --> 18:50.120
- So you also have to model that when you're thinking about it.
-
-18:50.120 --> 18:53.440
- So in your thoughts, it's possible
-
-18:53.440 --> 18:57.240
- to model the majority of situations,
-
-18:57.240 --> 18:59.640
- the important aspects of situations here on Earth
-
-18:59.640 --> 19:02.280
- and in space, enough to test stuff.
-
-19:02.280 --> 19:05.560
- Yeah, this is really an active area of research.
-
-19:05.560 --> 19:07.440
- And we're actually funding university research
-
-19:07.440 --> 19:10.080
- in a variety of places, including MIT.
-
-19:10.080 --> 19:13.720
- This is in the realm of trust and verification
-
-19:13.720 --> 19:17.920
- and validation of, I'd say, autonomous systems in general.
-
-19:17.920 --> 19:20.920
- And then as a subset of that, autonomous systems
-
-19:20.920 --> 19:24.520
- that incorporate artificial intelligence capabilities.
-
-19:24.520 --> 19:27.880
- And this is not an easy problem.
-
-19:27.880 --> 19:29.520
- We're working with startup companies.
-
-19:29.520 --> 19:33.160
- We've got internal R&D, but our conviction
-
-19:33.160 --> 19:39.200
- is that autonomy and more and more AI enabled autonomy
-
-19:39.200 --> 19:42.680
- is going to be in everything that Lockheed Martin develops
-
-19:42.680 --> 19:44.200
- and fields.
-
-19:44.200 --> 19:48.280
- And autonomy and AI are going to be
-
-19:48.280 --> 19:50.080
- retrofit into existing systems.
-
-19:50.080 --> 19:52.400
- They're going to be part of the design
-
-19:52.400 --> 19:54.440
- for all of our future systems.
-
-19:54.440 --> 19:56.680
- And so maybe I should take a step back and say,
-
-19:56.680 --> 19:58.600
- the way we define autonomy.
-
-19:58.600 --> 20:01.400
- So we talk about autonomy, essentially,
-
-20:01.400 --> 20:08.400
- a system that composes, selects, and then executes decisions
-
-20:08.400 --> 20:12.400
- with varying levels of human intervention.
-
-20:12.400 --> 20:15.720
- And so you could think of no autonomy.
-
-20:15.720 --> 20:18.400
- So this is essentially a human doing the task.
-
-20:18.400 --> 20:23.000
- You can think of, effectively, partial autonomy
-
-20:23.000 --> 20:25.720
- where the human is in the loop.
-
-20:25.720 --> 20:29.040
- So making decisions in every case
-
-20:29.040 --> 20:31.040
- about what the autonomous system can do.
-
-20:31.040 --> 20:33.120
- Either in the cockpit or remotely.
-
-20:33.120 --> 20:35.960
- Or remotely, exactly, but still in that control loop.
-
-20:35.960 --> 20:39.800
- And then there's what you'd call supervisory autonomy.
-
-20:39.800 --> 20:42.360
- So the autonomous system is doing most of the work.
-
-20:42.360 --> 20:45.880
- The human can intervene to stop it or to change the direction.
-
-20:45.880 --> 20:47.840
- And then ultimately, full autonomy
-
-20:47.840 --> 20:50.200
- where the human is off the loop altogether.
-
-20:50.200 --> 20:52.760
- And for different types of missions,
-
-20:52.760 --> 20:55.760
- want to have different levels of autonomy.
-
-20:55.760 --> 20:58.280
- So now take that spectrum and this conviction
-
-20:58.280 --> 21:01.120
- that autonomy and more and more AI
-
-21:01.120 --> 21:05.000
- are in everything that we develop.
-
-21:05.000 --> 21:08.960
- The kinds of things that Lockheed Martin does a lot of times
-
-21:08.960 --> 21:12.600
- are safety of life critical kinds of missions.
-
-21:12.600 --> 21:15.920
- Think about aircraft, for example.
-
-21:15.920 --> 21:20.040
- And so we require, and our customers require,
-
-21:20.040 --> 21:23.480
- an extremely high level of confidence.
-
-21:23.480 --> 21:26.360
- One, that we're going to protect life.
-
-21:26.360 --> 21:30.640
- Two, that we're going to, that these systems will behave
-
-21:30.640 --> 21:33.840
- in ways that their operators can understand.
-
-21:33.840 --> 21:36.360
- And so this gets into that whole field.
-
-21:36.360 --> 21:41.320
- Again, being able to verify and validate
-
-21:41.320 --> 21:44.920
- that the systems have been, that they will operate
-
-21:44.920 --> 21:48.040
- the way they're designed and the way they're expected.
-
-21:48.040 --> 21:50.720
- And furthermore, that they will do that
-
-21:50.720 --> 21:55.400
- in ways that can be explained and understood.
-
-21:55.400 --> 21:58.800
- And that is an extremely difficult challenge.
-
-21:58.800 --> 22:00.760
- Yeah, so here's a difficult question.
-
-22:00.760 --> 22:04.360
- I don't mean to bring this up,
-
-22:04.360 --> 22:05.560
- but I think it's a good case study
-
-22:05.560 --> 22:07.840
- that people are familiar with.
-
-22:07.840 --> 22:11.080
- Boeing 737 MAX commercial airplane
-
-22:11.080 --> 22:13.360
- has had two recent crashes
-
-22:13.360 --> 22:15.920
- where their flight control software system failed.
-
-22:15.920 --> 22:19.080
- And it's software, so I don't mean to speak about Boeing,
-
-22:19.080 --> 22:21.040
- but broadly speaking, we have this
-
-22:21.040 --> 22:24.040
- in the autonomous vehicle space too, semi autonomous.
-
-22:24.040 --> 22:27.840
- When you have millions of lines of code software
-
-22:27.840 --> 22:32.080
- making decisions, there is a little bit of a clash
-
-22:32.080 --> 22:35.320
- of cultures because software engineers
-
-22:35.320 --> 22:38.400
- don't have the same culture of safety often.
-
-22:39.440 --> 22:43.120
- That people who build systems like at Lockheed Martin
-
-22:43.120 --> 22:46.480
- do where it has to be exceptionally safe,
-
-22:46.480 --> 22:48.080
- you have to test this on.
-
-22:48.080 --> 22:49.880
- So how do we get this right
-
-22:49.880 --> 22:53.200
- when software is making so many decisions?
-
-22:53.200 --> 22:57.160
- Yeah, and there's a lot of things that have to happen.
-
-22:57.160 --> 23:01.280
- And by and large, I think it starts with the culture,
-
-23:01.280 --> 23:03.320
- which is not necessarily something
-
-23:03.320 --> 23:05.960
- that A is taught in school,
-
-23:05.960 --> 23:07.960
- or B is something that would come,
-
-23:07.960 --> 23:10.840
- depending on what kind of software you're developing,
-
-23:10.840 --> 23:14.240
- it may not be relevant if you're targeting ads
-
-23:14.240 --> 23:15.760
- or something like that.
-
-23:15.760 --> 23:20.600
- So, and by and large, I'd say not just Lockheed Martin,
-
-23:20.600 --> 23:23.720
- but certainly the aerospace industry as a whole
-
-23:23.720 --> 23:27.240
- has developed a culture that does focus on safety,
-
-23:27.240 --> 23:31.000
- safety of life, operational safety, mission success.
-
-23:32.200 --> 23:34.040
- But as you know, these systems
-
-23:34.040 --> 23:36.120
- have gotten incredibly complex.
-
-23:36.120 --> 23:40.720
- And so they're to the point where it's almost impossible,
-
-23:40.720 --> 23:44.840
- state spaces become so huge that it's impossible to,
-
-23:44.840 --> 23:48.880
- or very difficult to do a systematic verification
-
-23:48.880 --> 23:52.280
- across the entire set of potential ways
-
-23:52.280 --> 23:53.760
- that an aircraft could be flown,
-
-23:53.760 --> 23:55.560
- all the conditions that could happen,
-
-23:55.560 --> 23:59.320
- all the potential failure scenarios.
-
-23:59.320 --> 24:01.120
- Now, maybe that's soluble one day,
-
-24:01.120 --> 24:03.360
- maybe when we have our quantum computers
-
-24:03.360 --> 24:07.520
- that our fingertips will be able to actually simulate
-
-24:07.520 --> 24:11.280
- across an entire almost infinite state space.
-
-24:11.280 --> 24:16.280
- But today, there's a lot of work
-
-24:16.280 --> 24:20.960
- to really try to bound the system,
-
-24:20.960 --> 24:24.760
- to make sure that it behaves in predictable ways,
-
-24:24.760 --> 24:29.080
- and then have this culture of continuous inquiry
-
-24:29.080 --> 24:33.160
- and skepticism and questioning to say,
-
-24:33.160 --> 24:37.320
- did we really consider the right realm of possibilities,
-
-24:37.320 --> 24:40.160
- have we done the right range of testing?
-
-24:40.160 --> 24:42.400
- Do we really understand, in this case,
-
-24:42.400 --> 24:44.640
- human and machine interactions,
-
-24:44.640 --> 24:46.160
- the human decision process
-
-24:46.160 --> 24:49.480
- alongside the machine processes?
-
-24:49.480 --> 24:51.520
- And so that's that culture,
-
-24:51.520 --> 24:53.520
- we call it the culture of mission success
-
-24:53.520 --> 24:54.960
- at Lockheed Martin,
-
-24:54.960 --> 24:56.720
- that really needs to be established.
-
-24:56.720 --> 24:58.120
- And it's not something,
-
-24:58.120 --> 25:02.160
- it's something that people learn by living in it.
-
-25:02.160 --> 25:05.240
- And it's something that has to be promulgated,
-
-25:05.240 --> 25:07.120
- and it's done from the highest level.
-
-25:07.120 --> 25:10.160
- So I had a company of Lockheed Martin, like Lockheed Martin.
-
-25:10.160 --> 25:12.480
- Yeah, and the same as being faced
-
-25:12.480 --> 25:14.000
- at certain autonomous vehicle companies
-
-25:14.000 --> 25:15.760
- where that culture is not there
-
-25:15.760 --> 25:18.600
- because it started mostly by software engineers,
-
-25:18.600 --> 25:20.400
- so that's what they're struggling with.
-
-25:21.440 --> 25:25.720
- Is there lessons that you think we should learn
-
-25:25.720 --> 25:27.280
- as an industry and a society
-
-25:27.280 --> 25:30.240
- from the Boeing 737 MAX crashes?
-
-25:30.240 --> 25:34.720
- These crashes, obviously, are either tremendous tragedies,
-
-25:34.720 --> 25:37.800
- they're tragedies for all of the people,
-
-25:37.800 --> 25:41.240
- the crew, the families, the passengers,
-
-25:41.240 --> 25:43.160
- the people on the ground involved.
-
-25:44.280 --> 25:49.080
- And it's also a huge business and economic setback as well.
-
-25:49.080 --> 25:51.720
- I mean, we've seen that it's impacting, essentially,
-
-25:51.720 --> 25:53.840
- the trade balance of the US.
-
-25:53.840 --> 25:58.360
- So these are important questions.
-
-25:58.360 --> 26:00.200
- And these are the kinds of,
-
-26:00.200 --> 26:03.040
- we've seen similar kinds of questioning at times.
-
-26:03.040 --> 26:06.000
- We go back to the Challenger accident.
-
-26:06.960 --> 26:10.640
- And it is, I think, always important to remind ourselves
-
-26:10.640 --> 26:11.960
- that humans are fallible,
-
-26:11.960 --> 26:14.040
- that the systems we create,
-
-26:14.040 --> 26:16.560
- as perfect as we strive to make them,
-
-26:16.560 --> 26:18.960
- we can always make them better.
-
-26:18.960 --> 26:21.760
- And so another element of that culture of mission success
-
-26:21.760 --> 26:24.960
- is really that commitment to continuous improvement.
-
-26:24.960 --> 26:27.480
- If there's something that goes wrong,
-
-26:27.480 --> 26:31.160
- a real commitment to root cause
-
-26:31.160 --> 26:33.320
- and true root cause understanding,
-
-26:33.320 --> 26:35.080
- to taking the corrective actions
-
-26:35.080 --> 26:38.880
- and to making the future systems better.
-
-26:38.880 --> 26:43.880
- And certainly, we strive for no accidents.
-
-26:45.160 --> 26:47.760
- And if you look at the record
-
-26:47.760 --> 26:50.440
- of the commercial airline industry as a whole
-
-26:50.440 --> 26:53.360
- and the commercial aircraft industry as a whole,
-
-26:53.360 --> 26:57.640
- there's a very nice decaying exponential
-
-26:57.640 --> 27:01.680
- to years now where we have no commercial aircraft accidents
-
-27:01.680 --> 27:04.760
- at all, our fatal accidents at all.
-
-27:04.760 --> 27:08.360
- So that didn't happen by accident.
-
-27:08.360 --> 27:11.640
- It was through the regulatory agencies, FAA,
-
-27:11.640 --> 27:14.400
- the airframe manufacturers,
-
-27:14.400 --> 27:18.680
- really working on a system to identify root causes
-
-27:18.680 --> 27:20.520
- and drive them out.
-
-27:20.520 --> 27:23.880
- So maybe we can take a step back
-
-27:23.880 --> 27:25.520
- and many people are familiar,
-
-27:25.520 --> 27:28.840
- but Lockheed Martin broadly,
-
-27:28.840 --> 27:31.240
- what kind of categories of systems
-
-27:32.120 --> 27:34.280
- are you involved in building?
-
-27:34.280 --> 27:36.240
- You know, Lockheed Martin, we think of ourselves
-
-27:36.240 --> 27:39.880
- as a company that solves hard mission problems.
-
-27:39.880 --> 27:42.080
- And the output of that might be an airplane
-
-27:42.080 --> 27:44.640
- or a spacecraft or a helicopter or radar
-
-27:44.640 --> 27:45.680
- or something like that.
-
-27:45.680 --> 27:47.920
- But ultimately we're driven by these,
-
-27:47.920 --> 27:50.240
- you know, like what is our customer?
-
-27:50.240 --> 27:52.680
- What is that mission that they need to achieve?
-
-27:52.680 --> 27:55.480
- And so that's what drove the SR 71, right?
-
-27:55.480 --> 27:57.840
- How do you get pictures of a place
-
-27:59.000 --> 28:02.160
- where you've got sophisticated air defense systems
-
-28:02.160 --> 28:05.440
- that are capable of handling any aircraft
-
-28:05.440 --> 28:07.440
- that was out there at the time, right?
-
-28:07.440 --> 28:10.440
- So that, you know, that's what you'll do to an SR 71.
-
-28:10.440 --> 28:12.480
- Build a nice flying camera.
-
-28:12.480 --> 28:16.040
- Exactly, and make sure it gets out and it gets back, right?
-
-28:16.040 --> 28:18.280
- And that led ultimately to really the start
-
-28:18.280 --> 28:20.440
- of the space program in the US as well.
-
-28:22.200 --> 28:24.920
- So now take a step back to Lockheed Martin of today.
-
-28:24.920 --> 28:29.040
- And we are, you know, on the order of 105 years old now,
-
-28:29.040 --> 28:32.400
- between Lockheed and Martin, the two big heritage companies.
-
-28:32.400 --> 28:34.600
- Of course, we're made up of a whole bunch of other companies
-
-28:34.600 --> 28:36.120
- that came in as well.
-
-28:36.120 --> 28:39.800
- General Dynamics, you know, kind of go down the list.
-
-28:39.800 --> 28:42.600
- Today we're, you can think of us
-
-28:42.600 --> 28:44.840
- in this space of solving mission problems.
-
-28:44.840 --> 28:48.440
- So obviously on the aircraft side,
-
-28:48.440 --> 28:53.000
- tactical aircraft, building the most advanced fighter aircraft
-
-28:53.000 --> 28:55.120
- that the world has ever seen, you know,
-
-28:55.120 --> 28:57.880
- we're up to now several hundred of those delivered,
-
-28:57.880 --> 29:00.080
- building almost a hundred a year.
-
-29:00.080 --> 29:04.120
- And of course, working on the things that come after that.
-
-29:04.120 --> 29:07.720
- On the space side, we are engaged in pretty much
-
-29:07.720 --> 29:12.720
- every venue of space utilization and exploration
-
-29:13.160 --> 29:14.280
- you can imagine.
-
-29:14.280 --> 29:18.040
- So I mentioned things like navigation timing, GPS,
-
-29:18.040 --> 29:22.400
- communication satellites, missile warning satellites.
-
-29:22.400 --> 29:24.760
- We've built commercial surveillance satellites.
-
-29:24.760 --> 29:27.640
- We've built commercial communication satellites.
-
-29:27.640 --> 29:29.200
- We do civil space.
-
-29:29.200 --> 29:32.320
- So everything from human exploration
-
-29:32.320 --> 29:35.000
- to the robotic exploration of the outer planets.
-
-29:36.000 --> 29:39.080
- And keep going on the space front.
-
-29:39.080 --> 29:40.640
- But I don't, you know, a couple of other areas
-
-29:40.640 --> 29:44.520
- I'd like to put out, we're heavily engaged
-
-29:44.520 --> 29:47.360
- in building critical defensive systems.
-
-29:47.360 --> 29:51.640
- And so a couple that I'll mention, the Aegis Combat System,
-
-29:51.640 --> 29:55.680
- this is basically the integrated air and missile defense system
-
-29:55.680 --> 29:58.640
- for the US and allied fleets.
-
-29:58.640 --> 30:02.840
- And so protects, you know, carrier strike groups,
-
-30:02.840 --> 30:06.560
- for example, from incoming ballistic missile threats,
-
-30:06.560 --> 30:08.480
- aircraft threats, cruise missile threats,
-
-30:08.480 --> 30:10.080
- and kind of go down the list.
-
-30:10.080 --> 30:13.240
- So the carriers, the fleet itself
-
-30:13.240 --> 30:15.280
- is the thing that is being protected.
-
-30:15.280 --> 30:18.120
- The carriers aren't serving as a protection
-
-30:18.120 --> 30:19.360
- for something else.
-
-30:19.360 --> 30:21.840
- Well, that's a little bit of a different application.
-
-30:21.840 --> 30:24.360
- We've actually built the version called Aegis Assure,
-
-30:24.360 --> 30:27.960
- which is now deployed in a couple of places around the world.
-
-30:27.960 --> 30:31.000
- So that same technology, I mean, basically,
-
-30:31.000 --> 30:35.360
- can be used to protect either an ocean going fleet
-
-30:35.360 --> 30:37.840
- or a land based activity.
-
-30:37.840 --> 30:39.680
- Another one, the THAAD program.
-
-30:41.040 --> 30:44.720
- So THAAD, this is the Theater High Altitude Area Defense.
-
-30:44.720 --> 30:49.120
- This is to protect, you know, relatively broad areas
-
-30:49.120 --> 30:53.400
- against sophisticated ballistic missile threats.
-
-30:53.400 --> 30:57.760
- And so now, you know, it's deployed
-
-30:57.760 --> 30:59.880
- with a lot of US capabilities.
-
-30:59.880 --> 31:01.960
- And now we have international customers
-
-31:01.960 --> 31:04.520
- that are looking to buy that capability as well.
-
-31:04.520 --> 31:07.000
- And so these are systems that defend,
-
-31:07.000 --> 31:10.080
- not just defend militaries and military capabilities,
-
-31:10.080 --> 31:12.400
- but defend population areas.
-
-31:12.400 --> 31:16.320
- And we saw, you know, maybe the first public use of these
-
-31:16.320 --> 31:20.200
- back in the first Gulf War with the Patriot systems.
-
-31:21.200 --> 31:23.120
- And these are the kinds of things
-
-31:23.120 --> 31:25.960
- that Lockheed Martin delivers.
-
-31:25.960 --> 31:27.960
- And there's a lot of stuff that goes with it.
-
-31:27.960 --> 31:31.520
- So think about the radar systems and the sensing systems
-
-31:31.520 --> 31:35.200
- that cue these, the command and control systems
-
-31:35.200 --> 31:39.560
- that decide how you pair a weapon against an incoming threat.
-
-31:39.560 --> 31:42.600
- And then all the human and machine interfaces
-
-31:42.600 --> 31:45.400
- to make sure that they can be operated successfully
-
-31:45.400 --> 31:48.040
- in very strenuous environments.
-
-31:48.040 --> 31:51.840
- Yeah, there's some incredible engineering
-
-31:51.840 --> 31:54.440
- that I'd ever find, like you said.
-
-31:54.440 --> 32:00.440
- So maybe if we just take a look at Lockheed history broadly,
-
-32:00.720 --> 32:02.960
- maybe even looking at Skunk Works.
-
-32:04.200 --> 32:07.240
- What are the biggest, most impressive,
-
-32:07.240 --> 32:11.160
- biggest, most impressive milestones of innovation?
-
-32:11.160 --> 32:13.560
- So if you look at stealth,
-
-32:13.560 --> 32:15.200
- I would have called you crazy if you said
-
-32:15.200 --> 32:16.760
- that's possible at the time.
-
-32:17.880 --> 32:21.280
- And supersonic and hypersonic.
-
-32:21.280 --> 32:24.000
- So traveling at, first of all,
-
-32:24.000 --> 32:27.280
- traveling at the speed of sound is pretty damn fast.
-
-32:27.280 --> 32:29.680
- And supersonic and hypersonic,
-
-32:29.680 --> 32:32.160
- three, four, five times the speed of sound,
-
-32:32.160 --> 32:34.360
- that seems, I would also call you crazy
-
-32:34.360 --> 32:35.760
- if you say you can do that.
-
-32:35.760 --> 32:38.080
- So can you tell me how it's possible
-
-32:38.080 --> 32:39.560
- to do these kinds of things?
-
-32:39.560 --> 32:41.080
- And is there other milestones
-
-32:41.080 --> 32:45.040
- and innovation that's going on that you can talk about?
-
-32:45.040 --> 32:49.000
- Yeah, well, let me start on the Skunk Works saga.
-
-32:49.000 --> 32:51.520
- And you kind of alluded to it in the beginning.
-
-32:51.520 --> 32:54.920
- I mean, Skunk Works is as much an idea as a place.
-
-32:54.920 --> 32:59.520
- And so it's driven really by Kelly Johnson's 14 principles.
-
-32:59.520 --> 33:02.000
- And I'm not gonna list all 14 of them off,
-
-33:02.000 --> 33:04.480
- but the idea, and this I'm sure will resonate
-
-33:04.480 --> 33:06.240
- with any engineer who's worked
-
-33:06.240 --> 33:09.440
- on a highly motivated small team before.
-
-33:09.440 --> 33:13.400
- The idea that if you can essentially have a small team
-
-33:13.400 --> 33:17.280
- of very capable people who wanna work
-
-33:17.280 --> 33:20.520
- on really hard problems, you can do almost anything.
-
-33:20.520 --> 33:23.280
- Especially if you kind of shield them
-
-33:23.280 --> 33:26.680
- from bureaucratic influences,
-
-33:26.680 --> 33:30.680
- if you create very tight relationships with your customer
-
-33:30.680 --> 33:34.360
- so that you have that team and shared vision
-
-33:34.360 --> 33:38.280
- with the customer, those are the kinds of things
-
-33:38.280 --> 33:43.040
- that enable the Skunk Works to do these incredible things.
-
-33:43.040 --> 33:46.360
- And we listed off a number that you brought up stealth.
-
-33:46.360 --> 33:50.520
- And I mean, this whole, I wish I could have seen Ben Rich
-
-33:50.520 --> 33:53.880
- with a ball bearing rolling across the desk
-
-33:53.880 --> 33:55.880
- to a general officer and saying,
-
-33:55.880 --> 33:58.400
- would you like to have an aircraft
-
-33:58.400 --> 34:01.800
- that has the radar cross section of this ball bearing?
-
-34:01.800 --> 34:04.280
- Probably one of the least expensive
-
-34:04.280 --> 34:06.320
- and most effective marketing campaigns
-
-34:06.320 --> 34:08.440
- in the history of the industry.
-
-34:08.440 --> 34:10.680
- So just for people not familiar,
-
-34:10.680 --> 34:12.800
- I mean, the way you detect aircraft,
-
-34:12.800 --> 34:14.680
- so I mean, I'm sure there's a lot of ways,
-
-34:14.680 --> 34:17.360
- but radar for the longest time,
-
-34:17.360 --> 34:20.680
- there's a big blob that appears in the radar.
-
-34:20.680 --> 34:22.360
- How do you make a plane disappear
-
-34:22.360 --> 34:26.200
- so it looks as big as a ball bearing?
-
-34:26.200 --> 34:28.040
- What's involved in technology wise there?
-
-34:28.040 --> 34:32.480
- What's broadly sort of the stuff you can speak about?
-
-34:32.480 --> 34:34.680
- I'll stick to what's in Ben Rich's book,
-
-34:34.680 --> 34:39.000
- but obviously the geometry of how radar gets reflected
-
-34:39.000 --> 34:42.400
- and the kinds of materials that either reflect or absorb
-
-34:42.400 --> 34:46.480
- are kind of the couple of the critical elements there.
-
-34:46.480 --> 34:48.080
- I mean, it's a cat and mouse game, right?
-
-34:48.080 --> 34:52.960
- I mean, radars get better, stealth capabilities get better.
-
-34:52.960 --> 34:57.680
- And so it's a really game of continuous improvement
-
-34:57.680 --> 34:58.520
- and innovation there.
-
-34:58.520 --> 35:00.160
- I'll leave it at that.
-
-35:00.160 --> 35:04.720
- Yeah, so the idea that something is essentially invisible
-
-35:04.720 --> 35:06.440
- is quite fascinating.
-
-35:06.440 --> 35:08.920
- But the other one is flying fast.
-
-35:08.920 --> 35:13.240
- So speed of sound is 750, 60 miles an hour.
-
-35:15.360 --> 35:18.480
- So supersonic is three, Mach three,
-
-35:18.480 --> 35:19.320
- something like that.
-
-35:19.320 --> 35:21.640
- Yeah, we talk about the supersonic obviously
-
-35:21.640 --> 35:24.120
- and we kind of talk about that as that realm
-
-35:24.120 --> 35:26.720
- from Mach one up through about Mach five.
-
-35:26.720 --> 35:31.720
- And then hypersonic, so high supersonic speeds
-
-35:32.040 --> 35:34.800
- would be past Mach five.
-
-35:34.800 --> 35:37.160
- And you got to remember Lockheed, Martin,
-
-35:37.160 --> 35:39.080
- and actually other companies have been involved
-
-35:39.080 --> 35:42.240
- in hypersonic development since the late 60s.
-
-35:42.240 --> 35:45.360
- You think of everything from the X 15
-
-35:45.360 --> 35:48.040
- to the space shuttle as examples of that.
-
-35:50.080 --> 35:54.360
- I think the difference now is if you look around the world,
-
-35:54.360 --> 35:57.360
- particularly the threat environment that we're in today,
-
-35:57.360 --> 36:02.360
- you're starting to see publicly folks like the Russians
-
-36:02.520 --> 36:07.520
- and the Chinese saying they have hypersonic weapons
-
-36:07.560 --> 36:12.560
- capability that could threaten US and allied capabilities.
-
-36:14.280 --> 36:18.840
- And also basically the claims are these could get around
-
-36:18.840 --> 36:21.840
- defensive systems that are out there today.
-
-36:21.840 --> 36:24.520
- And so there's a real sense of urgency.
-
-36:24.520 --> 36:28.160
- You hear it from folks like the undersecretary of defense
-
-36:28.160 --> 36:30.800
- for research and engineering, Dr. Mike Griffin
-
-36:30.800 --> 36:32.800
- and others in the Department of Defense
-
-36:32.800 --> 36:37.200
- that hypersonics is something that's really important
-
-36:37.200 --> 36:41.040
- to the nation in terms of both parity
-
-36:41.040 --> 36:43.120
- but also defensive capabilities.
-
-36:43.120 --> 36:46.200
- And so that's something that we're pleased.
-
-36:46.200 --> 36:49.240
- It's something Lockheed, Martin's had a heritage in.
-
-36:49.240 --> 36:53.800
- We've invested R&D dollars on our side for many years.
-
-36:53.800 --> 36:56.240
- And we have a number of things going on
-
-36:56.240 --> 36:59.760
- with various US government customers in that field today
-
-36:59.760 --> 37:01.520
- that we're very excited about.
-
-37:01.520 --> 37:04.520
- So I would anticipate we'll be hearing more about that
-
-37:04.520 --> 37:06.240
- in the future from our customers.
-
-37:06.240 --> 37:08.880
- And I've actually haven't read much about this.
-
-37:08.880 --> 37:10.840
- Probably you can't talk about much of it at all,
-
-37:10.840 --> 37:12.760
- but on the defensive side,
-
-37:12.760 --> 37:15.600
- it's a fascinating problem of perception
-
-37:15.600 --> 37:18.360
- of trying to detect things that are really hard to see.
-
-37:18.360 --> 37:21.560
- Can you comment on how hard that problem is
-
-37:21.560 --> 37:26.560
- and how hard is it to stay ahead,
-
-37:26.680 --> 37:29.200
- even if we're going back a few decades,
-
-37:29.200 --> 37:30.480
- stay ahead of the competition?
-
-37:30.480 --> 37:33.680
- Well, maybe I, again, you gotta think of these
-
-37:33.680 --> 37:36.480
- as ongoing capability development.
-
-37:36.480 --> 37:40.720
- And so think back to the early phase of missile defense.
-
-37:40.720 --> 37:44.120
- So this would be in the 80s, the SDI program.
-
-37:44.120 --> 37:46.440
- And in that timeframe, we proved,
-
-37:46.440 --> 37:48.920
- and Lockheed Martin proved that you could hit a bullet
-
-37:48.920 --> 37:50.320
- with a bullet, essentially,
-
-37:50.320 --> 37:53.240
- and which is something that had never been done before
-
-37:53.240 --> 37:56.200
- to take out an incoming ballistic missile.
-
-37:56.200 --> 37:58.760
- And so that's led to these incredible
-
-37:58.760 --> 38:01.880
- hit to kill kinds of capabilities, PAC 3.
-
-38:03.160 --> 38:07.040
- That's the Patriot Advanced Capability Model 3
-
-38:07.040 --> 38:08.160
- that Lockheed Martin builds,
-
-38:08.160 --> 38:10.740
- the THAAD system that I talked about.
-
-38:12.120 --> 38:13.880
- So now hypersonics,
-
-38:13.880 --> 38:17.560
- you know, they're different from ballistic systems.
-
-38:17.560 --> 38:19.520
- And so we gotta take the next step
-
-38:19.520 --> 38:21.160
- in defensive capability.
-
-38:22.680 --> 38:25.520
- I can, I'll leave that there, but I can only imagine.
-
-38:26.520 --> 38:29.160
- Now, let me just comment, sort of as an engineer,
-
-38:29.160 --> 38:33.440
- it's sad to know that so much that Lockheed has done
-
-38:33.440 --> 38:37.640
- in the past is classified,
-
-38:37.640 --> 38:40.960
- or today, you know, and it's shrouded in secrecy.
-
-38:40.960 --> 38:44.720
- It has to be by the nature of the application.
-
-38:46.200 --> 38:49.200
- So like what I do, so what we do here at MIT,
-
-38:49.200 --> 38:53.920
- we'd like to inspire young engineers, young scientists,
-
-38:53.920 --> 38:56.480
- and yet in the Lockheed case,
-
-38:56.480 --> 38:59.720
- some of that engineer has to stay quiet.
-
-38:59.720 --> 39:00.920
- How do you think about that?
-
-39:00.920 --> 39:02.120
- How does that make you feel?
-
-39:02.120 --> 39:07.120
- Is there a future where more can be shown,
-
-39:07.120 --> 39:10.600
- or is it just the nature, the nature of this world
-
-39:10.600 --> 39:12.760
- that it has to remain secret?
-
-39:12.760 --> 39:14.920
- It's a good question.
-
-39:14.920 --> 39:19.920
- I think the public can see enough of,
-
-39:21.160 --> 39:24.960
- including students who may be in grade school,
-
-39:24.960 --> 39:27.160
- high school, college today,
-
-39:28.160 --> 39:31.760
- to understand the kinds of really hard problems
-
-39:31.760 --> 39:33.360
- that we work on.
-
-39:33.360 --> 39:36.160
- And I mean, look at the F35, right?
-
-39:36.160 --> 39:40.640
- And obviously a lot of the detailed performance levels
-
-39:40.640 --> 39:43.160
- are sensitive and controlled.
-
-39:43.160 --> 39:48.160
- But we can talk about what an incredible aircraft this is.
-
-39:48.160 --> 39:50.480
- It's a supersonic, super cruise kind of a fighter,
-
-39:50.480 --> 39:54.560
- a stealth capabilities.
-
-39:54.560 --> 39:57.920
- It's a flying information system in the sky
-
-39:57.920 --> 40:01.480
- with data fusion, sensor fusion capabilities
-
-40:01.480 --> 40:03.200
- that have never been seen before.
-
-40:03.200 --> 40:05.280
- So these are the kinds of things that I believe,
-
-40:05.280 --> 40:08.000
- these are the kinds of things that got me excited
-
-40:08.000 --> 40:08.960
- when I was a student.
-
-40:08.960 --> 40:12.240
- I think these still inspire students today.
-
-40:12.240 --> 40:17.040
- And the other thing, I mean, people are inspired by space.
-
-40:17.040 --> 40:20.200
- People are inspired by aircraft.
-
-40:22.000 --> 40:25.360
- Our employees are also inspired by that sense of mission.
-
-40:25.360 --> 40:27.560
- And I'll just give you an example.
-
-40:27.560 --> 40:32.640
- I had the privilege to work and lead our GPS programs
-
-40:32.640 --> 40:34.400
- for some time.
-
-40:34.400 --> 40:37.800
- And that was a case where I actually
-
-40:37.800 --> 40:41.040
- worked on a program that touches billions of people
-
-40:41.040 --> 40:41.680
- every day.
-
-40:41.680 --> 40:43.480
- And so when I said I worked on GPS,
-
-40:43.480 --> 40:45.240
- everybody knew what I was talking about,
-
-40:45.240 --> 40:47.800
- even though they didn't maybe appreciate the technical
-
-40:47.800 --> 40:51.320
- challenges that went into that.
-
-40:51.320 --> 40:54.960
- But I'll tell you, I got a briefing one time
-
-40:54.960 --> 40:57.400
- from a major in the Air Force.
-
-40:57.400 --> 41:01.640
- And he said, I go by call sign GIMP.
-
-41:01.640 --> 41:04.320
- GPS is my passion.
-
-41:04.320 --> 41:05.720
- I love GPS.
-
-41:05.720 --> 41:08.960
- And he was involved in the operational test of the system.
-
-41:08.960 --> 41:11.680
- He said, I was out in Iraq.
-
-41:11.680 --> 41:17.280
- And I was on a helicopter, Black Hawk helicopter.
-
-41:17.280 --> 41:21.440
- And I was bringing back a sergeant and a handful of troops
-
-41:21.440 --> 41:23.800
- from a deployed location.
-
-41:23.800 --> 41:26.600
- And he said, my job is GPS.
-
-41:26.600 --> 41:27.800
- So I asked that sergeant.
-
-41:27.800 --> 41:31.360
- And he's beaten down and half asleep.
-
-41:31.360 --> 41:34.080
- And I said, what do you think about GPS?
-
-41:34.080 --> 41:35.120
- And he brightened up.
-
-41:35.120 --> 41:35.920
- His eyes lit up.
-
-41:35.920 --> 41:39.240
- And he said, well, GPS, that brings me and my troops home
-
-41:39.240 --> 41:39.960
- every day.
-
-41:39.960 --> 41:41.080
- I love GPS.
-
-41:41.080 --> 41:43.760
- And that's the kind of story where it's like, OK,
-
-41:43.760 --> 41:46.440
- I'm really making a difference here in the kind of work.
-
-41:46.440 --> 41:48.920
- So that mission piece is really important.
-
-41:48.920 --> 41:51.720
- The last thing I'll say is, and this
-
-41:51.720 --> 41:54.840
- gets to some of these questions around advanced
-
-41:54.840 --> 41:59.560
- technologies, they're not just airplanes and spacecraft
-
-41:59.560 --> 41:59.960
- anymore.
-
-41:59.960 --> 42:02.760
- For people who are excited about advanced software
-
-42:02.760 --> 42:06.040
- capabilities, about AI, about bringing machine learning,
-
-42:06.040 --> 42:10.120
- these are the things that we're doing to exponentially
-
-42:10.120 --> 42:13.120
- increase the mission capabilities that
-
-42:13.120 --> 42:14.280
- go on those platforms.
-
-42:14.280 --> 42:15.920
- And those are the kinds of things I think
-
-42:15.920 --> 42:18.400
- are more and more visible to the public.
-
-42:18.400 --> 42:21.440
- Yeah, I think autonomy, especially in flight,
-
-42:21.440 --> 42:23.880
- is super exciting.
-
-42:23.880 --> 42:28.040
- Do you see a day, here we go, back into philosophy,
-
-42:28.040 --> 42:35.120
- a future when most fighter jets will be highly autonomous
-
-42:35.120 --> 42:37.720
- to a degree where a human doesn't need
-
-42:37.720 --> 42:40.640
- to be in the cockpit in almost all cases?
-
-42:40.640 --> 42:43.520
- Well, I mean, that's a world that to a certain extent,
-
-42:43.520 --> 42:44.240
- we're in today.
-
-42:44.240 --> 42:47.800
- Now, these are remotely piloted aircraft, to be sure.
-
-42:47.800 --> 42:53.920
- But we have hundreds of thousands of flight hours a year now
-
-42:53.920 --> 42:56.240
- in remotely piloted aircraft.
-
-42:56.240 --> 43:00.720
- And then if you take the F 35, I mean,
-
-43:00.720 --> 43:04.640
- there are huge layers, I guess, in levels of autonomy
-
-43:04.640 --> 43:10.040
- built into that aircraft so that the pilot is essentially
-
-43:10.040 --> 43:13.280
- more of a mission manager rather than doing
-
-43:13.280 --> 43:16.560
- the data, the second to second elements of flying
-
-43:16.560 --> 43:17.160
- the aircraft.
-
-43:17.160 --> 43:19.920
- So in some ways, it's the easiest aircraft in the world
-
-43:19.920 --> 43:20.840
- to fly.
-
-43:20.840 --> 43:22.480
- I'm kind of a funny story on that.
-
-43:22.480 --> 43:27.280
- So I don't know if you know how aircraft carrier landings work.
-
-43:27.280 --> 43:30.760
- But basically, there's what's called a tail hook,
-
-43:30.760 --> 43:33.760
- and it catches wires on the deck of the carrier.
-
-43:33.760 --> 43:39.360
- And that's what brings the aircraft to a screeching halt.
-
-43:39.360 --> 43:41.800
- And there's typically three of these wires.
-
-43:41.800 --> 43:43.480
- So if you miss the first, the second one,
-
-43:43.480 --> 43:45.920
- you catch the next one, right?
-
-43:45.920 --> 43:49.280
- And we got a little criticism.
-
-43:49.280 --> 43:50.880
- I don't know how true this story is,
-
-43:50.880 --> 43:52.360
- but we got a little criticism.
-
-43:52.360 --> 43:56.200
- The F 35 is so perfect, it always gets the second wires.
-
-43:56.200 --> 44:00.880
- We're wearing out the wire because it always hits that one.
-
-44:00.880 --> 44:04.600
- But that's the kind of autonomy that just makes these,
-
-44:04.600 --> 44:06.880
- essentially up levels what the human is doing
-
-44:06.880 --> 44:08.520
- to more of that mission manager.
-
-44:08.520 --> 44:12.040
- So much of that landing by the F 35 is autonomous.
-
-44:12.040 --> 44:14.000
- Well, it's just the control systems
-
-44:14.000 --> 44:17.960
- are such that you really have dialed out the variability
-
-44:17.960 --> 44:19.720
- that comes with all the environmental conditions.
-
-44:19.720 --> 44:20.800
- You're wearing it out.
-
-44:20.800 --> 44:24.320
- So my point is, to a certain extent,
-
-44:24.320 --> 44:27.320
- that world is here today.
-
-44:27.320 --> 44:30.000
- Do I think that we're going to see a day anytime soon
-
-44:30.000 --> 44:31.840
- when there are no humans in the cockpit?
-
-44:31.840 --> 44:33.320
- I don't believe that.
-
-44:33.320 --> 44:36.680
- But I do think we're going to see much more human machine
-
-44:36.680 --> 44:38.760
- teaming, and we're going to see that much more
-
-44:38.760 --> 44:40.480
- at the tactical edge.
-
-44:40.480 --> 44:41.480
- And we did a demo.
-
-44:41.480 --> 44:43.760
- You asked about what the Skunkworks is doing these days.
-
-44:43.760 --> 44:46.200
- And so this is something I can talk about.
-
-44:46.200 --> 44:51.200
- But we did a demo with the Air Force Research Laboratory.
-
-44:51.200 --> 44:52.600
- We called it HAV Raider.
-
-44:52.600 --> 44:59.760
- And so using an F 16 as an autonomous wingman,
-
-44:59.760 --> 45:02.480
- and we demonstrated all kinds of maneuvers
-
-45:02.480 --> 45:06.280
- and various mission scenarios with the autonomous F 16
-
-45:06.280 --> 45:09.640
- being that so called loyal or trusted wingman.
-
-45:09.640 --> 45:11.320
- And so those are the kinds of things
-
-45:11.320 --> 45:15.400
- that we've shown what is possible now,
-
-45:15.400 --> 45:18.960
- given that you've upleveled that pilot to be a mission manager.
-
-45:18.960 --> 45:22.280
- Now they can control multiple other aircraft,
-
-45:22.280 --> 45:25.000
- they can almost as extensions of your own aircraft
-
-45:25.000 --> 45:27.160
- flying alongside with you.
-
-45:27.160 --> 45:30.240
- So that's another example of how this is really
-
-45:30.240 --> 45:31.560
- coming to fruition.
-
-45:31.560 --> 45:35.120
- And then I mentioned the landings,
-
-45:35.120 --> 45:38.080
- but think about just the implications
-
-45:38.080 --> 45:39.800
- for humans and flight safety.
-
-45:39.800 --> 45:41.800
- And this goes a little bit back to the discussion
-
-45:41.800 --> 45:45.720
- we were having about how do you continuously improve
-
-45:45.720 --> 45:48.920
- the level of safety through automation
-
-45:48.920 --> 45:52.120
- while working through the complexities that automation
-
-45:52.120 --> 45:53.320
- introduces.
-
-45:53.320 --> 45:55.520
- So one of the challenges that you have in high performance
-
-45:55.520 --> 45:57.480
- fighter aircraft is what's called Glock.
-
-45:57.480 --> 45:59.960
- So this is G induced loss of consciousness.
-
-45:59.960 --> 46:02.800
- So you pull 9Gs, you're wearing a pressure suit,
-
-46:02.800 --> 46:05.760
- that's not enough to keep the blood going to your brain,
-
-46:05.760 --> 46:07.760
- you black out.
-
-46:07.760 --> 46:12.320
- And of course, that's bad if you happen to be flying low,
-
-46:12.320 --> 46:17.520
- near the deck, and in an obstacle or terrain environment.
-
-46:17.520 --> 46:22.400
- And so we developed a system in our aeronautics division
-
-46:22.400 --> 46:26.040
- called Auto GCAS, so Autonomous Ground Collision Avoidance
-
-46:26.040 --> 46:27.400
- System.
-
-46:27.400 --> 46:30.080
- And we built that into the F16.
-
-46:30.080 --> 46:33.000
- It's actually saved seven aircraft, eight pilots already.
-
-46:33.000 --> 46:35.840
- And the relatively short time it's been deployed,
-
-46:35.840 --> 46:39.320
- it was so successful that the Air Force said,
-
-46:39.320 --> 46:41.480
- hey, we need to have this in the F35 right away.
-
-46:41.480 --> 46:46.400
- So we've actually done testing of that now in the F35.
-
-46:46.400 --> 46:50.200
- And we've also integrated an autonomous air collision
-
-46:50.200 --> 46:51.000
- avoidance system.
-
-46:51.000 --> 46:53.000
- So I think the air to air problem.
-
-46:53.000 --> 46:56.000
- So now it's the integrated collision avoidance system.
-
-46:56.000 --> 46:58.760
- But these are the kinds of capabilities.
-
-46:58.760 --> 46:59.920
- I wouldn't call them AI.
-
-46:59.920 --> 47:04.040
- I mean, they're very sophisticated models
-
-47:04.040 --> 47:08.080
- of the aircraft's dynamics coupled with the terrain models
-
-47:08.080 --> 47:12.240
- to be able to predict when essentially the pilot is
-
-47:12.240 --> 47:14.840
- doing something that is going to take the aircraft into,
-
-47:14.840 --> 47:18.120
- or the pilot's not doing something in this case.
-
-47:18.120 --> 47:23.280
- But it just gives you an example of how autonomy can be really
-
-47:23.280 --> 47:25.960
- a lifesaver in today's world.
-
-47:25.960 --> 47:29.160
- It's like an autonomous automated emergency
-
-47:29.160 --> 47:30.520
- braking in cars.
-
-47:30.520 --> 47:35.080
- But is there any exploration of perception of, for example,
-
-47:35.080 --> 47:39.640
- detecting a Glock that the pilot is out,
-
-47:39.640 --> 47:42.960
- so as opposed to perceiving the external environment
-
-47:42.960 --> 47:46.000
- to infer that the pilot is out, but actually perceiving
-
-47:46.000 --> 47:47.320
- the pilot directly?
-
-47:47.320 --> 47:48.880
- Yeah, this is one of those cases where
-
-47:48.880 --> 47:52.040
- you'd like to not take action if you think the pilot's there.
-
-47:52.040 --> 47:54.160
- And it's almost like systems that try
-
-47:54.160 --> 47:56.880
- to detect if a driver is falling asleep on the road,
-
-47:56.880 --> 48:00.000
- right, with limited success.
-
-48:00.000 --> 48:03.400
- So I mean, this is what I call the system of last resort,
-
-48:03.400 --> 48:06.880
- right, where if the aircraft has determined
-
-48:06.880 --> 48:10.880
- that it's going into the terrain, get it out of there.
-
-48:10.880 --> 48:12.960
- And this is not something that we're just
-
-48:12.960 --> 48:15.680
- doing in the aircraft world.
-
-48:15.680 --> 48:18.600
- And I wanted to highlight, we have a technology we call Matrix,
-
-48:18.600 --> 48:21.960
- but this is developed at Sikorsky Innovations.
-
-48:21.960 --> 48:26.080
- The whole idea there is what we call optimal piloting,
-
-48:26.080 --> 48:30.560
- so not optional piloting or unpiloted,
-
-48:30.560 --> 48:32.240
- but optimal piloting.
-
-48:32.240 --> 48:35.880
- So an FAA certified system, so you
-
-48:35.880 --> 48:37.400
- have a high degree of confidence.
-
-48:37.400 --> 48:40.560
- It's generally pretty deterministic,
-
-48:40.560 --> 48:43.880
- so we know that it'll do in different situations,
-
-48:43.880 --> 48:49.240
- but effectively be able to fly a mission with two pilots,
-
-48:49.240 --> 48:51.560
- one pilot, no pilots.
-
-48:51.560 --> 48:56.720
- And you can think of it almost as like a dial of the level
-
-48:56.720 --> 48:59.480
- of autonomy that you want, so it's
-
-48:59.480 --> 49:01.320
- running in the background at all times
-
-49:01.320 --> 49:04.040
- and able to pick up tasks, whether it's
-
-49:04.040 --> 49:10.160
- sort of autopilot kinds of tasks or more sophisticated path
-
-49:10.160 --> 49:12.040
- planning kinds of activities.
-
-49:12.040 --> 49:15.200
- To be able to do things like, for example, land on an oil
-
-49:15.200 --> 49:19.480
- rig in the North Sea in bad weather, zero, zero conditions.
-
-49:19.480 --> 49:20.880
- And you can imagine, of course, there's
-
-49:20.880 --> 49:24.560
- a lot of military utility to capability like that.
-
-49:24.560 --> 49:26.480
- You could have an aircraft that you
-
-49:26.480 --> 49:28.280
- want to send out for a crewed mission,
-
-49:28.280 --> 49:31.880
- but then at night, if you want to use it to deliver supplies
-
-49:31.880 --> 49:35.600
- in an unmanned mode, that could be done as well.
-
-49:35.600 --> 49:39.960
- And so there's clear advantages there.
-
-49:39.960 --> 49:41.840
- But think about on the commercial side,
-
-49:41.840 --> 49:44.560
- if you're an aircraft taken, you're
-
-49:44.560 --> 49:46.080
- going to fly out to this oil rig.
-
-49:46.080 --> 49:48.000
- If you get out there and you can't land,
-
-49:48.000 --> 49:51.200
- then you've got to bring all those people back, reschedule
-
-49:51.200 --> 49:53.080
- another flight, pay the overtime for the crew
-
-49:53.080 --> 49:55.280
- that you just brought back because they didn't get what
-
-49:55.280 --> 49:57.240
- they were going to pay for the overtime for the folks that
-
-49:57.240 --> 49:58.640
- are out there on the oil rig.
-
-49:58.640 --> 50:00.680
- This is real economic.
-
-50:00.680 --> 50:03.480
- These are dollars and cents kinds of advantages
-
-50:03.480 --> 50:06.000
- that we're bringing in the commercial world as well.
-
-50:06.000 --> 50:09.120
- So this is a difficult question from the AI space
-
-50:09.120 --> 50:11.600
- that I would love it if we were able to comment.
-
-50:11.600 --> 50:15.360
- So a lot of this autonomy in AI you've mentioned just now
-
-50:15.360 --> 50:17.040
- has this empowering effect.
-
-50:17.040 --> 50:20.400
- One is the last resort, it keeps you safe.
-
-50:20.400 --> 50:25.200
- The other is there's with the teaming and in general,
-
-50:25.200 --> 50:29.120
- assistive AI.
-
-50:29.120 --> 50:33.160
- And I think there's always a race.
-
-50:33.160 --> 50:36.960
- So the world is full of the world is complex.
-
-50:36.960 --> 50:41.160
- It's full of bad actors.
-
-50:41.160 --> 50:43.600
- So there's often a race to make sure
-
-50:43.600 --> 50:48.960
- that we keep this country safe.
-
-50:48.960 --> 50:52.120
- But with AI, there is a concern that it's
-
-50:52.120 --> 50:55.080
- a slightly different race.
-
-50:55.080 --> 50:56.760
- There's a lot of people in the AI space
-
-50:56.760 --> 50:59.600
- that are concerned about the AI arms race.
-
-50:59.600 --> 51:02.280
- That as opposed to the United States
-
-51:02.280 --> 51:05.400
- becoming having the best technology
-
-51:05.400 --> 51:09.160
- and therefore keeping us safe, even we lose ability
-
-51:09.160 --> 51:11.520
- to keep control of it.
-
-51:11.520 --> 51:16.800
- So the AI arms race getting away from all of us humans.
-
-51:16.800 --> 51:19.440
- So do you share this worry?
-
-51:19.440 --> 51:21.080
- Do you share this concern when we're
-
-51:21.080 --> 51:23.400
- talking about military applications
-
-51:23.400 --> 51:26.520
- that too much control and decision making
-
-51:26.520 --> 51:31.640
- capabilities giving to software or AI?
-
-51:31.640 --> 51:34.120
- Well, I don't see it happening today.
-
-51:34.120 --> 51:38.040
- And in fact, this is something from a policy perspective.
-
-51:38.040 --> 51:39.920
- It's obviously a very dynamic space.
-
-51:39.920 --> 51:42.800
- But the Department of Defense has put quite a bit of thought
-
-51:42.800 --> 51:44.280
- into that.
-
-51:44.280 --> 51:46.560
- And maybe before talking about the policy,
-
-51:46.560 --> 51:48.920
- I'll just talk about some of the why.
-
-51:48.920 --> 51:52.640
- And you alluded to it being sort of a complicated and a little
-
-51:52.640 --> 51:54.040
- bit scary world out there.
-
-51:54.040 --> 51:57.280
- But there's some big things happening today.
-
-51:57.280 --> 52:00.600
- You hear a lot of talk now about a return to great powers
-
-52:00.600 --> 52:05.400
- competition, particularly around China and Russia with the US.
-
-52:05.400 --> 52:09.400
- But there are some other big players out there as well.
-
-52:09.400 --> 52:13.400
- And what we've seen is the deployment
-
-52:13.400 --> 52:20.480
- of some very, I'd say, concerning new weapons systems,
-
-52:20.480 --> 52:24.520
- particularly with Russia and breaching some of the IRBM,
-
-52:24.520 --> 52:26.040
- intermediate range ballistic missile
-
-52:26.040 --> 52:29.480
- treaties that's been in the news a lot.
-
-52:29.480 --> 52:33.640
- The building of islands, artificial islands in the South
-
-52:33.640 --> 52:38.720
- China Sea by the Chinese, and then arming those islands.
-
-52:38.720 --> 52:42.880
- The annexation of Crimea by Russia,
-
-52:42.880 --> 52:44.800
- the invasion of Ukraine.
-
-52:44.800 --> 52:47.160
- So there's some pretty scary things.
-
-52:47.160 --> 52:51.640
- And then you add on top of that, the North Korean threat has
-
-52:51.640 --> 52:52.960
- certainly not gone away.
-
-52:52.960 --> 52:56.680
- There's a lot going on in the Middle East with Iran in particular.
-
-52:56.680 --> 53:02.360
- And we see this global terrorism threat has not abated, right?
-
-53:02.360 --> 53:06.080
- So there are a lot of reasons to look for technology
-
-53:06.080 --> 53:08.160
- to assist with those problems, whether it's
-
-53:08.160 --> 53:11.240
- AI or other technologies like hypersonage, which
-
-53:11.240 --> 53:13.000
- was which we discussed.
-
-53:13.000 --> 53:17.280
- So now, let me give just a couple of hypotheticals.
-
-53:17.280 --> 53:22.320
- So people react sort of in the second time frame, right?
-
-53:22.320 --> 53:27.760
- You're photon hitting your eye to a movement
-
-53:27.760 --> 53:30.600
- is on the order of a few tenths of a second
-
-53:30.600 --> 53:34.440
- kinds of processing times.
-
-53:34.440 --> 53:38.240
- Roughly speaking, computers are operating
-
-53:38.240 --> 53:41.560
- in the nanosecond time scale, right?
-
-53:41.560 --> 53:44.640
- So just to bring home what that means,
-
-53:44.640 --> 53:50.640
- a nanosecond to a second is like a second to 32 years.
-
-53:50.640 --> 53:53.920
- So seconds on the battlefield, in that sense,
-
-53:53.920 --> 53:56.600
- literally are lifetimes.
-
-53:56.600 --> 54:01.920
- And so if you can bring an autonomous or AI enabled
-
-54:01.920 --> 54:05.480
- capability that will enable the human to shrink,
-
-54:05.480 --> 54:07.480
- maybe you've heard the term the OODA loop.
-
-54:07.480 --> 54:12.120
- So this whole idea that a typical battlefield decision
-
-54:12.120 --> 54:15.800
- is characterized by observe.
-
-54:15.800 --> 54:19.040
- So information comes in, orient.
-
-54:19.040 --> 54:21.240
- What does that mean in the context?
-
-54:21.240 --> 54:23.040
- Decide, what do I do about it?
-
-54:23.040 --> 54:25.160
- And then act, take that action.
-
-54:25.160 --> 54:27.320
- If you can use these capabilities
-
-54:27.320 --> 54:30.400
- to compress that OODA loop to stay
-
-54:30.400 --> 54:32.200
- inside what your adversary is doing,
-
-54:32.200 --> 54:37.640
- that's an incredible, powerful force on the battlefield.
-
-54:37.640 --> 54:39.120
- That's a really nice way to put it,
-
-54:39.120 --> 54:41.680
- that the role of AI in computing in general
-
-54:41.680 --> 54:46.000
- has a lot to benefit from just decreasing from 32 years
-
-54:46.000 --> 54:49.680
- to one second, as opposed to on the scale of seconds
-
-54:49.680 --> 54:51.480
- and minutes and hours making decisions
-
-54:51.480 --> 54:53.400
- that humans are better at making.
-
-54:53.400 --> 54:54.960
- And it actually goes the other way, too.
-
-54:54.960 --> 54:57.160
- So that's on the short time scale.
-
-54:57.160 --> 55:00.600
- So humans kind of work in the one second, two seconds
-
-55:00.600 --> 55:01.520
- to eight hours.
-
-55:01.520 --> 55:04.320
- After eight hours, you get tired.
-
-55:04.320 --> 55:07.480
- You got to go to the bathroom, whatever the case might be.
-
-55:07.480 --> 55:09.720
- So there's this whole range of other things.
-
-55:09.720 --> 55:16.560
- Think about surveillance and guarding facilities.
-
-55:16.560 --> 55:20.480
- Think about moving material, logistics, sustainment.
-
-55:20.480 --> 55:23.280
- A lot of these what they call dull, dirty, and dangerous
-
-55:23.280 --> 55:26.160
- things that you need to have sustained activity,
-
-55:26.160 --> 55:28.000
- but it's sort of beyond the length of time
-
-55:28.000 --> 55:30.920
- that a human can practically do as well.
-
-55:30.920 --> 55:34.200
- So there's this range of things that
-
-55:34.200 --> 55:39.080
- are critical in military and defense applications
-
-55:39.080 --> 55:43.200
- that AI and autonomy are particularly well suited to.
-
-55:43.200 --> 55:45.840
- Now, the interesting question that you brought up
-
-55:45.840 --> 55:49.840
- is, OK, how do you make sure that stays within human control?
-
-55:49.840 --> 55:52.320
- So that was the context for the policy.
-
-55:52.320 --> 55:56.160
- And so there is a DOD directive called 3,000.09,
-
-55:56.160 --> 55:58.520
- because that's the way we name stuff in this world.
-
-56:01.720 --> 56:04.240
- And I'd say it's well worth reading.
-
-56:04.240 --> 56:07.240
- It's only a couple pages long, but it makes some key points.
-
-56:07.240 --> 56:09.480
- And it's really around making sure
-
-56:09.480 --> 56:14.840
- that there's human agency and control over use
-
-56:14.840 --> 56:20.240
- of semi autonomous and autonomous weapons systems,
-
-56:20.240 --> 56:23.800
- making sure that these systems are tested, verified,
-
-56:23.800 --> 56:28.200
- and evaluated in realistic, real world type scenarios,
-
-56:28.200 --> 56:29.960
- making sure that the people are actually
-
-56:29.960 --> 56:32.440
- trained on how to use them, making sure
-
-56:32.440 --> 56:36.160
- that the systems have human machine interfaces that
-
-56:36.160 --> 56:39.320
- can show what state they're in and what kinds of decisions
-
-56:39.320 --> 56:41.080
- they're making, making sure that you
-
-56:41.080 --> 56:45.800
- establish doctrine and tactics and techniques and procedures
-
-56:45.800 --> 56:48.240
- for the use of these kinds of systems.
-
-56:48.240 --> 56:52.880
- And so, and by the way, I mean, none of this is easy,
-
-56:52.880 --> 56:56.480
- but I'm just trying to lay kind of the picture of how
-
-56:56.480 --> 56:59.080
- the US has said, this is the way we're
-
-56:59.080 --> 57:02.600
- going to treat AI and autonomous systems,
-
-57:02.600 --> 57:04.600
- that it's not a free for all.
-
-57:04.600 --> 57:08.120
- And like there are rules of war and rules of engagement
-
-57:08.120 --> 57:10.600
- with other kinds of systems, think chemical weapons,
-
-57:10.600 --> 57:13.080
- biological weapons, we need to think
-
-57:13.080 --> 57:15.760
- about the same sorts of implications.
-
-57:15.760 --> 57:17.920
- And this is something that's really important for Lockheed
-
-57:17.920 --> 57:20.680
- Martin, I mean, obviously we are 100%
-
-57:20.680 --> 57:26.400
- complying with our customer and the policies and regulations.
-
-57:26.400 --> 57:30.760
- But I mean, AI is an incredible enabler, say,
-
-57:30.760 --> 57:32.360
- within the walls of Lockheed Martin
-
-57:32.360 --> 57:35.640
- in terms of improving production efficiency,
-
-57:35.640 --> 57:38.240
- helping engineers doing generative design,
-
-57:38.240 --> 57:42.040
- improving logistics, driving down energy costs.
-
-57:42.040 --> 57:44.320
- I mean, there's so many applications.
-
-57:44.320 --> 57:47.440
- But we're also very interested in some
-
-57:47.440 --> 57:50.000
- of the elements of ethical application
-
-57:50.000 --> 57:51.800
- within Lockheed Martin.
-
-57:51.800 --> 57:56.720
- So we need to make sure that things like privacy is taken care
-
-57:56.720 --> 57:59.240
- of, that we do everything we can to drive out
-
-57:59.240 --> 58:03.440
- bias in AI enabled kinds of systems,
-
-58:03.440 --> 58:06.280
- that we make sure that humans are involved in decisions
-
-58:06.280 --> 58:10.600
- that we're not just delegating accountability to algorithms.
-
-58:10.600 --> 58:14.480
- And so for us, I talked about culture before,
-
-58:14.480 --> 58:17.840
- and it comes back to sort of the Lockheed Martin culture
-
-58:17.840 --> 58:19.200
- and our core values.
-
-58:19.200 --> 58:21.680
- And so it's pretty simple for us to do what's right,
-
-58:21.680 --> 58:24.200
- respect others, perform with excellence.
-
-58:24.200 --> 58:27.880
- And now how do we tie that back to the ethical principles
-
-58:27.880 --> 58:31.960
- that will govern how AI is used within Lockheed Martin?
-
-58:31.960 --> 58:35.520
- And we actually have a world, so you might not know this,
-
-58:35.520 --> 58:37.680
- but they're actually awards for ethics programs.
-
-58:37.680 --> 58:41.400
- Lockheed Martin's had a recognized ethics program
-
-58:41.400 --> 58:43.600
- for many years, and this is one of the things
-
-58:43.600 --> 58:47.760
- that our ethics team is working with our engineering team on.
-
-58:47.760 --> 58:51.240
- One of the miracles to me, perhaps a layman,
-
-58:51.240 --> 58:53.680
- again, I was born in the Soviet Union,
-
-58:53.680 --> 58:58.400
- so I have echoes, at least in my family history of World War
-
-58:58.400 --> 59:02.080
- II and the Cold War, do you have a sense
-
-59:02.080 --> 59:06.120
- of why human civilization has not destroyed itself
-
-59:06.120 --> 59:09.120
- through nuclear war, so nuclear deterrence?
-
-59:09.120 --> 59:12.760
- And thinking about the future, this technology
-
-59:12.760 --> 59:15.080
- of our role to play here, and what
-
-59:15.080 --> 59:20.440
- is the long term future of nuclear deterrence look like?
-
-59:20.440 --> 59:25.760
- Yeah, this is one of those hard, hard questions.
-
-59:25.760 --> 59:28.960
- And I should note that Lockheed Martin is both proud
-
-59:28.960 --> 59:31.480
- and privileged to play a part in multiple legs
-
-59:31.480 --> 59:35.880
- of our nuclear and strategic deterrent systems
-
-59:35.880 --> 59:41.800
- like the Trident submarine launch ballistic missiles.
-
-59:41.800 --> 59:47.320
- You talk about, is there still a possibility
-
-59:47.320 --> 59:49.080
- that human race could destroy itself?
-
-59:49.080 --> 59:54.520
- I'd say that possibility is real, but interestingly,
-
-59:54.520 --> 59:58.600
- in some sense, I think the strategic deterrence
-
-59:58.600 --> 1:00:03.400
- have prevented the kinds of incredibly destructive world
-
-1:00:03.400 --> 1:00:07.280
- wars that we saw in the first half of the 20th century.
-
-1:00:07.280 --> 1:00:10.880
- Now, things have gotten more complicated since that time
-
-1:00:10.880 --> 1:00:12.280
- and since the Cold War.
-
-1:00:12.280 --> 1:00:16.560
- It is more of a multipolar, great powers world today.
-
-1:00:16.560 --> 1:00:19.000
- Just to give you an example, back then,
-
-1:00:19.000 --> 1:00:21.840
- there were in the Cold War timeframe
-
-1:00:21.840 --> 1:00:24.160
- just a handful of nations that had ballistic missile
-
-1:00:24.160 --> 1:00:25.960
- capability.
-
-1:00:25.960 --> 1:00:28.200
- By last count, and this is a few years old,
-
-1:00:28.200 --> 1:00:31.200
- there's over 70 nations today that have that,
-
-1:00:31.200 --> 1:00:38.000
- similar kinds of numbers in terms of space based capabilities.
-
-1:00:38.000 --> 1:00:42.520
- So the world has gotten more complex and more challenging
-
-1:00:42.520 --> 1:00:46.040
- and the threats, I think, have proliferated in ways
-
-1:00:46.040 --> 1:00:49.480
- that we didn't expect.
-
-1:00:49.480 --> 1:00:51.920
- The nation today is in the middle
-
-1:00:51.920 --> 1:00:55.280
- of a recapitalization of our strategic deterrent.
-
-1:00:55.280 --> 1:00:58.680
- I look at that as one of the most important things
-
-1:00:58.680 --> 1:01:00.240
- that our nation can do.
-
-1:01:00.240 --> 1:01:01.840
- What is involved in deterrence?
-
-1:01:01.840 --> 1:01:08.000
- Is it being ready to attack?
-
-1:01:08.000 --> 1:01:11.520
- Or is it the defensive systems that catch attacks?
-
-1:01:11.520 --> 1:01:13.120
- A little bit of both, and so it's
-
-1:01:13.120 --> 1:01:16.600
- a complicated game theoretical kind of program.
-
-1:01:16.600 --> 1:01:23.280
- But ultimately, we are trying to prevent the use
-
-1:01:23.280 --> 1:01:24.880
- of any of these weapons.
-
-1:01:24.880 --> 1:01:28.000
- And the theory behind prevention is
-
-1:01:28.000 --> 1:01:33.280
- that even if an adversary uses a weapon against you,
-
-1:01:33.280 --> 1:01:37.600
- you have the capability to essentially strike back
-
-1:01:37.600 --> 1:01:40.800
- and do harm to them that's unacceptable.
-
-1:01:40.800 --> 1:01:44.880
- And so that will deter them from making use
-
-1:01:44.880 --> 1:01:48.000
- of these weapons systems.
-
-1:01:48.000 --> 1:01:50.760
- The deterrence calculus has changed, of course,
-
-1:01:50.760 --> 1:01:56.320
- with more nations now having these kinds of weapons.
-
-1:01:56.320 --> 1:01:59.120
- But I think from my perspective, it's
-
-1:01:59.120 --> 1:02:05.000
- very important to maintain a strategic deterrent.
-
-1:02:05.000 --> 1:02:08.760
- You have to have systems that you will know will work
-
-1:02:08.760 --> 1:02:10.920
- when they're required to work.
-
-1:02:10.920 --> 1:02:12.640
- And you know that they have to be
-
-1:02:12.640 --> 1:02:16.440
- adaptable to a variety of different scenarios
-
-1:02:16.440 --> 1:02:17.680
- in today's world.
-
-1:02:17.680 --> 1:02:20.320
- And so that's what this recapitalization of systems
-
-1:02:20.320 --> 1:02:23.200
- that were built over previous decades,
-
-1:02:23.200 --> 1:02:26.640
- making sure that they are appropriate not just for today,
-
-1:02:26.640 --> 1:02:29.080
- but for the decades to come.
-
-1:02:29.080 --> 1:02:32.160
- So the other thing I'd really like to note
-
-1:02:32.160 --> 1:02:40.120
- is strategic deterrence has a very different character today.
-
-1:02:40.120 --> 1:02:42.360
- We used to think of weapons of mass destruction
-
-1:02:42.360 --> 1:02:45.720
- in terms of nuclear, chemical, biological.
-
-1:02:45.720 --> 1:02:48.640
- And today we have a cyber threat.
-
-1:02:48.640 --> 1:02:54.320
- We've seen examples of the use of cyber weaponry.
-
-1:02:54.320 --> 1:02:58.520
- And if you think about the possibilities
-
-1:02:58.520 --> 1:03:03.880
- of using cyber capabilities or an adversary attacking the US
-
-1:03:03.880 --> 1:03:07.560
- to take out things like critical infrastructure,
-
-1:03:07.560 --> 1:03:12.840
- electrical grids, water systems, those
-
-1:03:12.840 --> 1:03:16.280
- are scenarios that are strategic in nature
-
-1:03:16.280 --> 1:03:19.040
- to the survival of a nation as well.
-
-1:03:19.040 --> 1:03:23.000
- So that is the kind of world that we live in today.
-
-1:03:23.000 --> 1:03:26.640
- And part of my hope on this is one
-
-1:03:26.640 --> 1:03:30.840
- that we can also develop technological systems,
-
-1:03:30.840 --> 1:03:33.640
- perhaps enabled by AI and autonomy,
-
-1:03:33.640 --> 1:03:38.600
- that will allow us to contain and to fight back
-
-1:03:38.600 --> 1:03:42.840
- against these kinds of new threats that were not
-
-1:03:42.840 --> 1:03:46.280
- conceived when we first developed our strategic deterrence.
-
-1:03:46.280 --> 1:03:48.360
- Yeah, I know that Lockheed is involved in cyber.
-
-1:03:48.360 --> 1:03:52.040
- So I saw that you mentioned that.
-
-1:03:52.040 --> 1:03:54.440
- It's an incredibly change.
-
-1:03:54.440 --> 1:03:57.360
- Nuclear almost seems easier than cyber,
-
-1:03:57.360 --> 1:03:58.680
- because there's so many attack.
-
-1:03:58.680 --> 1:04:01.720
- There's so many ways that cyber can evolve
-
-1:04:01.720 --> 1:04:03.400
- in such an uncertain future.
-
-1:04:03.400 --> 1:04:05.800
- But talking about engineering with a mission,
-
-1:04:05.800 --> 1:04:09.680
- I mean, in this case, your engineering systems
-
-1:04:09.680 --> 1:04:13.880
- that basically save the world.
-
-1:04:13.880 --> 1:04:18.040
- Well, like I said, we're privileged to work
-
-1:04:18.040 --> 1:04:20.000
- on some very challenging problems
-
-1:04:20.000 --> 1:04:23.360
- for very critical customers here in the US
-
-1:04:23.360 --> 1:04:26.920
- and with our allies abroad as well.
-
-1:04:26.920 --> 1:04:30.800
- Lockheed builds both military and nonmilitary systems.
-
-1:04:30.800 --> 1:04:32.960
- And perhaps the future of Lockheed
-
-1:04:32.960 --> 1:04:35.360
- may be more in nonmilitary applications
-
-1:04:35.360 --> 1:04:38.320
- if you talk about space and beyond.
-
-1:04:38.320 --> 1:04:41.480
- I say that as a preface to a difficult question.
-
-1:04:41.480 --> 1:04:46.200
- So President Eisenhower in 1961 in his farewell address
-
-1:04:46.200 --> 1:04:49.080
- talked about the military industrial complex
-
-1:04:49.080 --> 1:04:52.800
- and that it shouldn't grow beyond what is needed.
-
-1:04:52.800 --> 1:04:55.880
- So what are your thoughts on those words
-
-1:04:55.880 --> 1:04:58.800
- on the military industrial complex,
-
-1:04:58.800 --> 1:05:04.080
- on the concern of growth of their developments
-
-1:05:04.080 --> 1:05:07.120
- beyond what may be needed?
-
-1:05:07.120 --> 1:05:12.400
- That what may be needed is a critical phrase, of course.
-
-1:05:12.400 --> 1:05:14.960
- And I think it is worth pointing out, as you noted,
-
-1:05:14.960 --> 1:05:19.360
- that Lockheed Martin, we're in a number of commercial businesses
-
-1:05:19.360 --> 1:05:23.960
- from energy to space to commercial aircraft.
-
-1:05:23.960 --> 1:05:28.640
- And so I wouldn't neglect the importance
-
-1:05:28.640 --> 1:05:32.160
- of those parts of our business as well.
-
-1:05:32.160 --> 1:05:34.480
- I think the world is dynamic.
-
-1:05:34.480 --> 1:05:38.880
- And there was a time, it doesn't seem that long ago to me,
-
-1:05:38.880 --> 1:05:41.840
- was I was a graduate student here at MIT
-
-1:05:41.840 --> 1:05:43.320
- and we were talking about the peace
-
-1:05:43.320 --> 1:05:45.760
- dividend at the end of the Cold War.
-
-1:05:45.760 --> 1:05:49.200
- If you look at expenditure on military systems
-
-1:05:49.200 --> 1:05:55.640
- as a fraction of GDP, we're far below peak levels of the past.
-
-1:05:55.640 --> 1:05:59.120
- And to me, at least, it looks like a time
-
-1:05:59.120 --> 1:06:02.920
- where you're seeing global threats changing in a way that
-
-1:06:02.920 --> 1:06:06.920
- would warrant relevant investments
-
-1:06:06.920 --> 1:06:10.920
- in defensive capabilities.
-
-1:06:10.920 --> 1:06:18.520
- The other thing I'd note, for military and defensive systems,
-
-1:06:18.520 --> 1:06:21.440
- it's not quite a free market, right?
-
-1:06:21.440 --> 1:06:25.720
- We don't sell to people on the street.
-
-1:06:25.720 --> 1:06:29.440
- And that warrants a very close partnership
-
-1:06:29.440 --> 1:06:34.280
- between, I'd say, the customers and the people that design,
-
-1:06:34.280 --> 1:06:39.200
- build, and maintain these systems because
-
-1:06:39.200 --> 1:06:44.920
- of the very unique nature, the very difficult requirements,
-
-1:06:44.920 --> 1:06:49.440
- the very great importance on safety
-
-1:06:49.440 --> 1:06:54.560
- and on operating the way they're intended every time.
-
-1:06:54.560 --> 1:06:57.680
- And so that does create, and it's frankly
-
-1:06:57.680 --> 1:06:59.560
- one of Lockheed Martin's great strengths
-
-1:06:59.560 --> 1:07:01.920
- is that we have this expertise built up
-
-1:07:01.920 --> 1:07:05.440
- over many years in partnership with our customers
-
-1:07:05.440 --> 1:07:08.360
- to be able to design and build these systems that
-
-1:07:08.360 --> 1:07:11.600
- meet these very unique mission needs.
-
-1:07:11.600 --> 1:07:14.400
- Yeah, because building those systems very costly,
-
-1:07:14.400 --> 1:07:16.120
- there's very little room for mistake.
-
-1:07:16.120 --> 1:07:19.000
- I mean, it's just Ben Rich's book and so on
-
-1:07:19.000 --> 1:07:20.360
- just tells the story.
-
-1:07:20.360 --> 1:07:22.440
- It's nowhere I can just reading it.
-
-1:07:22.440 --> 1:07:24.400
- If you're an engineer, it reads like a thriller.
-
-1:07:24.400 --> 1:07:30.680
- OK, let's go back to space for a second.
-
-1:07:30.680 --> 1:07:33.080
- I'm always happy to go back to space.
-
-1:07:33.080 --> 1:07:38.320
- So a few quick, maybe out there, maybe fun questions,
-
-1:07:38.320 --> 1:07:40.520
- maybe a little provocative.
-
-1:07:40.520 --> 1:07:46.560
- What are your thoughts on the efforts of the new folks,
-
-1:07:46.560 --> 1:07:48.840
- SpaceX and Elon Musk?
-
-1:07:48.840 --> 1:07:50.880
- What are your thoughts about what Elon is doing?
-
-1:07:50.880 --> 1:07:55.320
- Do you see him as competition, do you enjoy competition?
-
-1:07:55.320 --> 1:07:56.440
- What are your thoughts?
-
-1:07:56.440 --> 1:08:00.160
- First of all, certainly Elon, I'd
-
-1:08:00.160 --> 1:08:03.200
- say SpaceX and some of his other ventures
-
-1:08:03.200 --> 1:08:08.160
- are definitely a competitive force in the space industry.
-
-1:08:08.160 --> 1:08:09.880
- And do we like competition?
-
-1:08:09.880 --> 1:08:11.520
- Yeah, we do.
-
-1:08:11.520 --> 1:08:15.480
- And we think we're very strong competitors.
-
-1:08:15.480 --> 1:08:20.800
- I think competition is what the US is founded on
-
-1:08:20.800 --> 1:08:24.680
- in a lot of ways and always coming up with a better way.
-
-1:08:24.680 --> 1:08:29.480
- And I think it's really important to continue
-
-1:08:29.480 --> 1:08:33.000
- to have fresh eyes coming in, new innovation.
-
-1:08:33.000 --> 1:08:35.480
- I do think it's important to have level playing fields.
-
-1:08:35.480 --> 1:08:38.760
- And so you want to make sure that you're not
-
-1:08:38.760 --> 1:08:42.800
- giving different requirements to different players.
-
-1:08:42.800 --> 1:08:47.560
- But I tell people, I spent a lot of time at places like MIT.
-
-1:08:47.560 --> 1:08:50.600
- I'm going to be at the MIT Beaver Works Summer Institute
-
-1:08:50.600 --> 1:08:52.120
- over the weekend here.
-
-1:08:52.120 --> 1:08:55.040
- And I tell people, this is the most exciting time
-
-1:08:55.040 --> 1:08:58.400
- to be in the space business in my entire life.
-
-1:08:58.400 --> 1:09:02.960
- And it is this explosion of new capabilities
-
-1:09:02.960 --> 1:09:06.960
- that have been driven by things like the massive increase
-
-1:09:06.960 --> 1:09:10.920
- in computing power, things like the massive increase
-
-1:09:10.920 --> 1:09:15.120
- in comms capabilities, advanced and additive manufacturing,
-
-1:09:15.120 --> 1:09:18.800
- are really bringing down the barriers to entry
-
-1:09:18.800 --> 1:09:21.880
- in this field and it's driving just incredible innovation.
-
-1:09:21.880 --> 1:09:23.600
- It's happening at startups, but it's also
-
-1:09:23.600 --> 1:09:25.400
- happening at Lockheed Martin.
-
-1:09:25.400 --> 1:09:27.600
- I did not realize this, but Lockheed Martin, working
-
-1:09:27.600 --> 1:09:31.360
- with Stanford, actually built the first cubes that
-
-1:09:31.360 --> 1:09:35.120
- was launched here out of the US that was called Quakesat.
-
-1:09:35.120 --> 1:09:37.440
- And we did that with Stellar Solutions.
-
-1:09:37.440 --> 1:09:41.640
- This was right around just after 2000, I guess.
-
-1:09:41.640 --> 1:09:45.480
- And so we've been in that from the very beginning.
-
-1:09:45.480 --> 1:09:50.080
- And I talked about some of these like Maya and Orion,
-
-1:09:50.080 --> 1:09:54.760
- but we're in the middle of what we call smartsats and software
-
-1:09:54.760 --> 1:09:58.800
- to find satellites that can essentially restructure and remap
-
-1:09:58.800 --> 1:10:02.400
- their purpose, their mission on orbit
-
-1:10:02.400 --> 1:10:06.520
- to give you almost unlimited flexibility for these satellites
-
-1:10:06.520 --> 1:10:08.000
- over their lifetimes.
-
-1:10:08.000 --> 1:10:10.200
- So those are just a couple of examples,
-
-1:10:10.200 --> 1:10:13.440
- but yeah, this is a great time to be in space.
-
-1:10:13.440 --> 1:10:14.360
- Absolutely.
-
-1:10:14.360 --> 1:10:20.160
- So Wright Brothers flew for the first time 116 years ago.
-
-1:10:20.160 --> 1:10:23.040
- So now we have supersonic stealth planes
-
-1:10:23.040 --> 1:10:25.440
- and all the technology we've talked about.
-
-1:10:25.440 --> 1:10:29.280
- What innovations, obviously you can't predict the future,
-
-1:10:29.280 --> 1:10:32.440
- but do you see Lockheed in the next 100 years?
-
-1:10:32.440 --> 1:10:36.800
- If you take that same leap, how will the world of technology
-
-1:10:36.800 --> 1:10:37.840
- and engineering change?
-
-1:10:37.840 --> 1:10:39.320
- I know it's an impossible question,
-
-1:10:39.320 --> 1:10:42.920
- but nobody could have predicted that we could even
-
-1:10:42.920 --> 1:10:45.800
- fly 120 years ago.
-
-1:10:45.800 --> 1:10:50.640
- So what do you think is the edge of possibility
-
-1:10:50.640 --> 1:10:52.680
- that we're going to be exploring in the next 100 years?
-
-1:10:52.680 --> 1:10:55.440
- I don't know that there is an edge.
-
-1:10:55.440 --> 1:11:00.760
- We've been around for almost that entire time, right?
-
-1:11:00.760 --> 1:11:03.840
- The Lockheed Brothers and Glenn L. Martin
-
-1:11:03.840 --> 1:11:07.960
- starting their companies in the basement of a church
-
-1:11:07.960 --> 1:11:11.840
- and an old service station.
-
-1:11:11.840 --> 1:11:14.240
- We're very different companies today
-
-1:11:14.240 --> 1:11:15.720
- than we were back then, right?
-
-1:11:15.720 --> 1:11:17.680
- And that's because we've continuously
-
-1:11:17.680 --> 1:11:21.680
- reinvented ourselves over all of those decades.
-
-1:11:21.680 --> 1:11:24.320
- I think it's fair to say, I know this for sure,
-
-1:11:24.320 --> 1:11:27.840
- the world of the future, it's going to move faster,
-
-1:11:27.840 --> 1:11:29.320
- it's going to be more connected,
-
-1:11:29.320 --> 1:11:31.640
- it's going to be more autonomous,
-
-1:11:31.640 --> 1:11:36.160
- and it's going to be more complex than it is today.
-
-1:11:36.160 --> 1:11:39.680
- And so this is the world as a CTO of Lockheed Martin
-
-1:11:39.680 --> 1:11:41.560
- that I think about, what are the technologies
-
-1:11:41.560 --> 1:11:42.720
- that we have to invest in?
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-1:11:42.720 --> 1:11:45.480
- Whether it's things like AI and autonomy,
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-1:11:45.480 --> 1:11:47.280
- you can think about quantum computing,
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-1:11:47.280 --> 1:11:49.120
- which is an area that we've invested in
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-1:11:49.120 --> 1:11:53.520
- to try to stay ahead of these technological changes
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-1:11:53.520 --> 1:11:56.280
- and frankly, some of the threats that are out there.
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-1:11:56.280 --> 1:11:58.360
- And I believe that we're going to be out there
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-1:11:58.360 --> 1:12:00.840
- in the solar system, that we're going to be defending
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-1:12:00.840 --> 1:12:04.960
- and defending well against probably military threats
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-1:12:04.960 --> 1:12:08.120
- that nobody has even thought about today.
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-1:12:08.120 --> 1:12:12.400
- We are going to be, we're going to use these capabilities
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-1:12:12.400 --> 1:12:15.720
- to have far greater knowledge of our own planet,
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-1:12:15.720 --> 1:12:19.320
- the depths of the oceans, all the way to the upper reaches
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-1:12:19.320 --> 1:12:21.400
- of the atmosphere and everything out to the sun
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-1:12:21.400 --> 1:12:23.440
- and to the edge of the solar system.
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-1:12:23.440 --> 1:12:26.760
- So that's what I look forward to.
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-1:12:26.760 --> 1:12:30.840
- And I'm excited, I mean, just looking ahead
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-1:12:30.840 --> 1:12:33.360
- in the next decade or so to the steps
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-1:12:33.360 --> 1:12:35.320
- that I see ahead of us in that time.
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-1:12:35.320 --> 1:12:38.240
- I don't think there's a better place to end.
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-1:12:38.240 --> 1:12:39.600
- Okay, thank you so much.
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-1:12:39.600 --> 1:12:41.800
- Lex, it's been a real pleasure and sorry,
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-1:12:41.800 --> 1:12:43.400
- it took so long to get up here,
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-1:12:43.400 --> 1:13:05.680
- but glad we were able to make it happen.
-