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clojurians | clojure | ( or maybe they’re both invalid and :1 just happens to work? ) | 2017-12-15T15:31:32.000463 | Tuyet |
clojurians | clojure | correct | 2017-12-15T15:32:14.000203 | Kareen |
clojurians | clojure | they are both invalid literals | 2017-12-15T15:32:25.000015 | Kareen |
clojurians | clojure | :foo/1 happens to work but it's still invalid | 2017-12-15T15:32:35.000058 | Kareen |
clojurians | clojure | <https://clojure.org/reference/reader> - yeah my “read” of this is that :1 is illegal but accidentally works in some cases | 2017-12-15T15:32:43.000198 | Margaret |
clojurians | clojure | well, no, right? because the reader doesn't determine what a valid keyword is | 2017-12-15T15:32:48.000632 | Rebeca |
clojurians | clojure | yep, I said literal | 2017-12-15T15:33:06.000306 | Kareen |
clojurians | clojure | maybe a strict reading of that reference would also imply `:<http://google.com>` is bad, and keywords of that form are used in core libs (and it’s neither here nor there but the reader does accept them) | 2017-12-15T15:37:09.000135 | Margaret |
clojurians | clojure | it was unsettling to see that being used on purprose | 2017-12-15T15:38:25.000320 | Margaret |
clojurians | clojure | If an implementation doesn't stop you, someone somewhere will do it. :slightly_smiling_face: | 2017-12-15T15:41:31.000368 | Micha |
clojurians | clojure | and think it is a great idea | 2017-12-15T15:41:55.000040 | Rebeca |
clojurians | clojure | there is a lot of background on this - the regex for keywords in the reader is actually wrong, which is why it works | 2017-12-15T15:44:05.000129 | Sonny |
clojurians | clojure | we “fixed” it in 1.6 and found out it broke a lot of existing code | 2017-12-15T15:44:21.000070 | Sonny |
clojurians | clojure | so we unfixed it | 2017-12-15T15:44:28.000182 | Sonny |
clojurians | clojure | Taking advantage of such behavior does put you at some kind of risk of a future version of Clojure reserving characters for other purposes, and now either you update your application or don't run it or its data with that version of Clojure. Given sensitivity to backwards compatibility by core team, I doubt they would break such things for fun. | 2017-12-15T15:45:12.000055 | Micha |
clojurians | clojure | I’d say at this point that there is no chance we will take that away | 2017-12-15T15:45:36.000171 | Sonny |
clojurians | clojure | we did break it, and it wasn’t fun | 2017-12-15T15:45:45.000043 | Sonny |
clojurians | clojure | I notice one can now override `*reader-resolver*` in Clojure 1.9. Has anyone tried this? What scenarios is it useful for? | 2017-12-15T15:48:25.000390 | Edelmira |
clojurians | clojure | If I wanted to write a utility that overrode `*reader-resolver*` to do cool stuff, I would have to `alter-var-root` it rather than `bindings` it so that I can load code with that new reader resolver in place, right? | 2017-12-15T15:49:38.000364 | Edelmira |
clojurians | clojure | thx, after all I did this:
```
(def queue (agent []
:error-handler (fn [a ex]
(l/error ex "slack agent failed")
(restart-agent a @a))))
``` | 2017-12-15T15:50:50.000329 | Gladys |
clojurians | clojure | it’s useful if you want to have control over how namespace-sensitive things resolve (like autoresolved keywords) | 2017-12-15T15:50:56.000156 | Sonny |
clojurians | clojure | Looks like I can affect the behavior of `read-string`:
```
user=> (binding [*reader-resolver* (reify clojure.lang.LispReader$Resolver (resolveAlias [this sym] 'blah))] (read-string "::a/b"))
:blah/b
``` | 2017-12-15T15:51:32.000406 | Edelmira |
clojurians | clojure | It seems to me that that's the only thing I can do with `binding` | 2017-12-15T15:51:54.000333 | Edelmira |
clojurians | clojure | Just want to make sure that's accurate | 2017-12-15T15:51:59.000387 | Edelmira |
clojurians | clojure | yes | 2017-12-15T15:52:04.000296 | Sonny |
clojurians | clojure | really best for programmatic reader cases where you are creating the environment (not for general code loading in the RT) | 2017-12-15T15:52:30.000224 | Sonny |
clojurians | clojure | gotcha, that's what I wanted to confirm | 2017-12-15T15:52:47.000298 | Edelmira |
clojurians | clojure | thanks | 2017-12-15T15:52:48.000322 | Edelmira |
clojurians | clojure | I was hoping I could write myself a `with-aliases` macro that lets me define arbitrary aliases in local scope or something | 2017-12-15T15:53:08.000288 | Edelmira |
clojurians | clojure | I think reading has already been done at macro time so that wouldn’t work | 2017-12-15T15:54:16.000059 | Sonny |
clojurians | clojure | yep | 2017-12-15T15:54:28.000602 | Kareen |
clojurians | clojure | yep | 2017-12-15T15:54:32.000425 | Edelmira |
clojurians | clojure | unless I use `push-thread-bindings` and `pop-thread-bindings`.... | 2017-12-15T15:56:36.000212 | Edelmira |
clojurians | clojure | then I could write a `defalias` macro that pushes a new `*reader-resolver*` for the remainder of that file | 2017-12-15T15:57:05.000236 | Edelmira |
clojurians | clojure | but then I don't know when to pop it | 2017-12-15T15:57:15.000218 | Edelmira |
clojurians | clojure | having a `push-thread-binding` escape its lexical context is not a good idea anyway | 2017-12-15T15:59:43.000312 | Kareen |
clojurians | clojure | ```
(ns my.ns)
(defalias o other.ns)
::o/a-keyword
(end-aliases!)
```
:troll: | 2017-12-15T16:00:13.000533 | Edelmira |
clojurians | clojure | if your `push-thread-binding` gets executed from within a `binding`, that `binding `ill pop the wrong thing | 2017-12-15T16:01:07.000056 | Kareen |
clojurians | clojure | if you are going to be gross, hijack the dispatchMacros table in the reader | 2017-12-15T16:01:27.000392 | Rebeca |
clojurians | clojure | haha | 2017-12-15T16:02:06.000163 | Kareen |
clojurians | clojure | brb forking Clojure | 2017-12-15T16:02:13.000402 | Edelmira |
clojurians | clojure | Am I missing something, or does Clojure not have a way to refer to a piece of code from a docstring? I’m hoping to hyperlink between namespaces when an implicit dependency exists. I’ve considered using #_ macros but that invokes a (requires) clause I’d rather avoid. | 2017-12-15T17:02:52.000047 | Mari |
clojurians | clojure | IDE stack is Cursive with a close fallback of Emacs/etc | 2017-12-15T17:03:21.000102 | Mari |
clojurians | clojure | you could use metadata | 2017-12-15T17:04:42.000122 | Jonas |
clojurians | clojure | <@Mari> there is no standardized docstring markup for referring to symbols. | 2017-12-15T17:07:00.000165 | Charity |
clojurians | clojure | instead of encoding it in the doc string and then having a way to parse it out | 2017-12-15T17:07:12.000291 | Jonas |
clojurians | clojure | you could just be explicit with meta data `(defn ^{:refers-to 'other.name-space} foo [] 42)` | 2017-12-15T17:07:14.000158 | Jonas |
clojurians | clojure | <@Charity> okay! glad to know it for sure | 2017-12-15T17:07:30.000175 | Mari |
clojurians | clojure | Some authors use Markdown style `backtick` blocks. I personally like to use `#'foo` or `#'other-ns/foo` var notation in backtick blocks in docstrings. | 2017-12-15T17:07:55.000332 | Charity |
clojurians | clojure | <@Jonas> okay that is interesting. I can do it without require, then? I’ll see whether cursive/etc pick up on it | 2017-12-15T17:07:59.000121 | Mari |
clojurians | clojure | Some of the tools support wiki-style `[[my.other/thing]]` references. | 2017-12-15T17:08:14.000101 | Charity |
clojurians | clojure | `#'` is also a good point, thanks | 2017-12-15T17:08:14.000347 | Mari |
clojurians | clojure | lessee… | 2017-12-15T17:08:23.000027 | Mari |
clojurians | clojure | the meta-data keyword is completely made up by me, so if you wanted ide support, you’d have to add it | 2017-12-15T17:08:54.000252 | Jonas |
clojurians | clojure | ah | 2017-12-15T17:09:43.000074 | Mari |
clojurians | clojure | just trying to say that this isn’t a standardized practice. just a suggestion for how you could start one if you wanted | 2017-12-15T17:09:46.000045 | Jonas |
clojurians | clojure | Cursive is trying hard to resolve it, though. just failing… | 2017-12-15T17:09:54.000494 | Mari |
clojurians | clojure | hm. of course the real problem is that this is across Clojure/ClojureScript code where I can’t exactly write cljc. | 2017-12-15T17:10:32.000029 | Mari |
clojurians | clojure | maybe I will find a way to cljc it, but for now, I have to keep the people reading the code aware. | 2017-12-15T17:11:10.000281 | Mari |
clojurians | clojure | Where would I RFC on such a thing? | 2017-12-15T17:13:12.000179 | Mari |
clojurians | clojure | I’ll take it to <#C0744GXCJ|cursive> in case it appeals… | 2017-12-15T17:14:09.000237 | Mari |
clojurians | clojure | Hey all, I'm wondering in clojure since there aren't really object methods how do I know what functions I can use on something? | 2017-12-15T17:20:10.000034 | Floretta |
clojurians | clojure | For example, how do I know all the methods I can use on a channel made from core.async's (chan)? | 2017-12-15T17:20:40.000071 | Floretta |
clojurians | clojure | Clojure seems to follow this philosophy:
<https://stackoverflow.com/questions/6016271/why-is-it-better-to-have-100-functions-operate-on-one-data-structure-than-10-fun> | 2017-12-15T17:20:59.000313 | Berry |
clojurians | clojure | thanks, but that doesn't really answer my question. For example, I'd expect from that philosophy to be able to do "nth", "count", "map", etc | 2017-12-15T17:22:19.000459 | Floretta |
clojurians | clojure | But none of these actually work so I'm wondering what are the methods that work for chan | 2017-12-15T17:22:35.000245 | Floretta |
clojurians | clojure | I'm not sure if this helps either: you can lookup all the protocols that chan implements, then look at functions that depend on those protocols | 2017-12-15T17:23:31.000042 | Berry |
clojurians | clojure | also, I'm pretty sure you can do something map/transducer like on chans | 2017-12-15T17:23:53.000453 | Berry |
clojurians | clojure | for channels specifically, most of the functions that work with channels can be found at <https://clojure.github.io/core.async/> | 2017-12-15T17:26:54.000227 | Jonas |
clojurians | clojure | hey guys, is there any file reader transducer in any core library? Something that can be used to stream-read from a file, as part of a transducing process? Or should I work up a transducer around lazy file reading myself (which is what I'm about to be doing now) | 2017-12-15T17:26:55.000074 | Kalyn |
clojurians | clojure | <@Kalyn> not sure is worth a lib, is this something useful? <https://gist.github.com/reborg/2d9b31f2209f9b3afd1dc401b3dffc2c#file-split-by-clj-L55> | 2017-12-15T17:28:45.000295 | Eliana |
clojurians | clojure | <@Berry> I'm not really sure what you mean. How would Iook up all the protocols for channel? | 2017-12-15T17:28:48.000021 | Floretta |
clojurians | clojure | <@Jonas> Those are just functions within the core.async namespace, NOT functions that I can use on a ManyToManyChannel | 2017-12-15T17:29:38.000017 | Floretta |
clojurians | clojure | <@Eliana> yes, but doesn't that snippet show a transduction that is specific to the file reader? doesn't it go against the motivation for transducers? as in being generically applicable regardless of the actual input source | 2017-12-15T17:30:44.000275 | Kalyn |
clojurians | clojure | <@Floretta>, there’s not really a great way to obtain a list of every function that takes a ManyToMany channel as it’s first argument | 2017-12-15T17:30:53.000288 | Jonas |
clojurians | clojure | <@Eliana> mmm on second thought maybe you are right and this is just trivial | 2017-12-15T17:32:28.000027 | Kalyn |
clojurians | clojure | whynot | 2017-12-15T17:34:24.000003 | Floretta |
clojurians | clojure | a couple things, 1) ManyToManyChannel is a concrete type, <https://github.com/clojure/core.async/blob/0498ba69fda5d930e3e7568cc90ca933c19c42ca/src/main/clojure/cljs/core/async/impl/channels.cljs#L30> | 2017-12-15T17:35:07.000255 | Jonas |
clojurians | clojure | and you often want to program against abstract types instead of concrete types | 2017-12-15T17:35:19.000206 | Jonas |
clojurians | clojure | 2) since clojure’s protocol system is open | 2017-12-15T17:35:41.000181 | Jonas |
clojurians | clojure | at runtime, more protocols can be extended to work with the concrete type of ManyToManyChannel | 2017-12-15T17:36:12.000197 | Jonas |
clojurians | clojure | Do you have a specific idea about how a possible API would look like in this case? Trying to understand if there is room for improvement | 2017-12-15T17:36:31.000276 | Eliana |
clojurians | clojure | 3) in addition, anyone could write a function that takes a ManyToManyChannel as it’s first argument | 2017-12-15T17:36:52.000122 | Jonas |
clojurians | clojure | or if the ManyToManyChannel was added to more protocols, then at any point, any protocol can start working with ManyToManyChannel | 2017-12-15T17:38:03.000129 | Jonas |
clojurians | clojure | for most clojure functions, the types that functions expect aren’t annotated anywhere | 2017-12-15T17:38:53.000033 | Jonas |
clojurians | clojure | so even if you went through every function in every namespace, there’s not typically a good way to ask if a particular function accepts a particular type | 2017-12-15T17:39:50.000074 | Jonas |
clojurians | clojure | basically, clojure tends to adopt an approach that is dynamic and open which makes it more difficult to answer questions like “which functions work with the type?” | 2017-12-15T17:41:39.000291 | Jonas |
clojurians | clojure | but makes a lot of other designs easier | 2017-12-15T17:42:01.000106 | Jonas |
clojurians | clojure | I was under the impression that things like `(take 1 (drop 40000000 (iterate inc 1)))` would take constant memory but it doesn’t appear so. Could somebody explain what exactly happens here? | 2017-12-15T17:57:02.000315 | Lester |
clojurians | clojure | I get “Out of memory” on a constrained system while running this | 2017-12-15T17:57:57.000178 | Lester |
clojurians | clojure | <@Lester>, how constrained? | 2017-12-15T18:02:55.000246 | Jonas |
clojurians | clojure | it’s <http://repl.it|repl.it> so I have no idea, but the memory assigned there must be somewhat small | 2017-12-15T18:03:22.000193 | Lester |
clojurians | clojure | but that shoudn’t matter if my assumption that this will take constant memory is correct | 2017-12-15T18:03:48.000213 | Lester |
clojurians | clojure | I think it does take constant memory | 2017-12-15T18:04:39.000277 | Jonas |
clojurians | clojure | my thinking was that `iterate` will return a lazy seq, `drop` will basically throw away elements as it goes and `first` will just cut the remaining lazy-seq and everything will be garbage collected | 2017-12-15T18:05:09.000244 | Lester |
clojurians | clojure | and those 40M elements won’t be allocated anywhere | 2017-12-15T18:05:27.000379 | Lester |
clojurians | clojure | that was my impression as well | 2017-12-15T18:07:09.000196 | Jonas |
clojurians | clojure | the one common issue is “hanging onto the head” | 2017-12-15T18:07:54.000210 | Jonas |
clojurians | clojure | I fail to see that in my example | 2017-12-15T18:08:14.000193 | Lester |
clojurians | clojure | <https://repl.it/repls/CultivatedAridStegosaurus> | 2017-12-15T18:08:15.000240 | Lester |
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