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[ { "speaker": "MPP Kristyn Wong-Tam", "text": [ "I rise to share a story of significance, a chapter of Canadian history that is often overlooked: the British home child that began 155 years ago. This child migration scheme was a government program that sent 125,000 poor and desolate children from ages six months to 18 years from the UK and Ireland to Canada as indentured labourers to work on farms and as domestic servants from 1869 to 1939. This program was borne out of a desire to alleviate poverty in Britain and to provide a solution for the children deemed unwanted and neglected.", "Many home children faced harsh conditions, including abuse, forced labour and neglect. They worked on farms and in factories, and they helped build communities across this country.", "Their resilience played a crucial role in shaping the agricultural, industrial and urban landscapes of Toronto, Canada, Ontario and beyond. They are remarkable heroes, and that’s why, on September 28 of each year, we celebrate and commemorate the British Home Child Day.", "Today, many Canadians can trace their ancestry back to these children, who helped lay the foundation of our rich and diverse and growing nation. It’s estimated that 12% of the Canadian population, four million people, are British home children descendants, including Ontario Premiers and MPPs.", "As we reflect on their experiences, we must consider how far we have come and how much further we need to go in safeguarding the welfare of children today. In modern Ontario, our province is failing as one child dies every three days in government care.", "Today in the Legislature, we will be joined by descendants and families of the British Home Child program who have travelled from across Ontario to attend a reception which I’m co-hosting with the British Consulate General in Toronto. I invite all members to join us after question period to celebrate with them." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Ms. Patrice Barnes", "text": [ "Over the summer, I did over 240 events. One of my favourite ones was on October 17—actually, that’s not over the summer, but anyways, that’s another one.", "In the great riding of Ajax, in Rotary Park, we unveiled an installation in partnership with Operation White Heart, through the advocacy of Michelle Cook, a constituent who lost her son Josh to suicide.", "Operation White Heart began in New Brunswick and is an awareness project focused on promoting conversation around mental health and suicide while utilizing basic landscaping supplies such as mulch and white stone to create a white heart. This was started by Robert Lothian. This heart, crafted with care and intention, stands as a symbol of compassion, understanding and hope. It serves as an important reminder of a connection needed to open conversations about mental health and the unwavering support we must offer to each other. As we honour the memories of those who have left us too soon, let us also commit to re-creating a world where every person feels seen, heard and valued.", "I want to give my thanks to Councillor Marilyn Crawford and the councillors from Ajax who worked to make this the first Operation White Heart sculpture in the province of Ontario.", "I encourage members of the House to learn about this initiative and maybe get one in their riding. As Robert said at the unveiling, it will not solve the issue, but just maybe somebody will see one and think twice about taking their lives." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "MPP Andrea Hazell", "text": [ "Today I stand before you to share the stories of the people I represent in Scarborough–Guildwood. Over the past 19 weeks, I had the privilege of meeting with my constituents, listening to their challenges and understanding the issues that affect their daily lives.", "Vacation was not a priority for me. I was in the field every day, making a difference and giving them hope for a better tomorrow. Many families are facing food insecurity and are struggling to put food on the table. Food bank visits are on the rise, with one in seven people at the food banks in Scarborough. Job opportunities remain limited, and many of my constituents are finding it increasingly difficult to secure stable, well-paying jobs. Access to health care remains a significant concern, as over 19,000 of my constituents are without a family doctor.", "Aside from that, I am very proud to say that I have participated in over 200 events throughout Scarborough and Scarborough–Guildwood, connecting with residents, community leaders and organizations dedicated to making a difference. Each event has reinforced my commitment to advocating for the Scarborough community.", "We need a government that will provide solutions. They deserve a government that will stand up for the people of Ontario." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Mr. Rudy Cuzzetto", "text": [ "Two weeks ago, we celebrated Thanksgiving, and my team and I had our annual Community Leaders Awards and Thanksgiving Dinner at the Oasis Convention Centre in Lakeview. We had a great turnout of over 300 people to celebrate the harvest and to recognize some very special community leaders from across Mississauga–Lakeshore.", "That includes Barry Gilbert, an Indigenous elder and the founder of the Eagle Spirits of the Great Waters, who has done so much to promote Indigenous art, culture and a spirit of healing along our waterfront on Orange Shirt Day and throughout the year.", "We honoured my friend Vishal Khanna, the founder of the Sai Dham Food Bank, the only food bank in Ontario that operates 365 days each year and helps seniors and others with special needs.", "1030", "As we celebrate Small Business Week, we recognize a small business owner like Joe Leroux, the founder of Amadio’s Pizza, who has supported our local festivals, youth hockey teams, food banks and charities since 1990.", "I want to thank David Zura from CityNews Toronto for joining us as well to help us tell some of these uplifting stories.", "I’m thankful for Barry, Vishal and Joe for all of their Ontario spirit across our province, and I just want to thank them for being part of Mississauga–Lakeshore on this special evening." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Mr. Ric Bresee", "text": [ "I’m honoured today to rise representing the wonderful people of Hastings–Lennox and Addington. Speaker, as you know, I represent a very large riding consisting of many different and diverse communities. While I’d love to talk about them all today, I’m going to focus on one area, the town of Greater Napanee.", "Greater Napanee has several new and expanding industries announced with the support and leadership of this government. We’ve seen a major expansion of the Goodyear tire plant, with hundreds of new high-paying jobs; a new battery storage facility that will help to enhance and stabilize the power grid for everyone; and the implementation of a new health home program that will lead to every single resident there having access to primary care.", "The high note, however, was Greater Napanee receiving almost $35 million to build a new waste water facility through this government’s Housing-Enabling Water Systems Fund that will allow for the development of over 3,000 new homes in Greater Napanee. The mayor of Greater Napanee, Terry Richardson, put it best when he said, “This is game-changing,” and I left out the expletive on that.", "This is the type of work that this government, under the leadership of the Premier, has been doing all across this province during the summer session. While the opposition may talk about how long the break was, for this government, there is no break in our work to keep building Ontario. Whether here at Queen’s Park or working in the ridings all across the province, we are and will continue to get it done for the people of Ontario." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "I’m going to recognize the Minister of Tourism, Culture and Gaming on a point of order." ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Stan Cho", "text": [ "On a point of order, I just want to correct my record from my answer yesterday to the member from Bay of Quinte. I said the fine Minister of Sport had won a Grey Cup championship—I was wrong; he has won four championships." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Good that we got that straightened out." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Vincent Ke", "text": [ "I’d like to introduce my friends who are sitting in the public gallery: Mr. Yang Jianying, who is a well-known urban strategist for Dun Huang International Tourism Solutions; his wife, Liu Qifang; and his son, Yang Chaopeng. Welcome to Queen’s Park." ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Nolan Quinn", "text": [ "With today being the British home child reception, I’d just like to welcome a few guests who have travelled here today: Kathleen Kirkman, Lisa Gleva, Lori Oschefski, Lyma McIntosh, Malcolm Farrow and Marilee Gosselin, as well as Carol Godard and Eleanor McGrath from my riding." ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Stephen Crawford", "text": [ "I’d like to welcome, from my riding of Oakville, Shawn Fang, and with him are a number of youth volunteers from the Oak Medical Education Foundation, along with his daughter and his parents, Guang Fang and Jinqing Xu, who are here celebrating their 50th wedding anniversary. Welcome to Queen’s Park." ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Jessica Bell", "text": [ "I’d like to introduce Marissa Jefkins, Martha McGrath, Michael Barry, Nancy MacDonald, Nancy Smyth, Patricia Bielert and Paul Stewart, who will be attending the British home child reception at lunch today." ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Mary-Margaret McMahon", "text": [ "Good morning, everyone. I have a few people to introduce today. First of all, my powerful page is page captain today: Lincoln Knibbs from beautiful Beaches–East York. And his proud parents are in the chamber: “Jazzy” Julia Peters and “Gregarious” Garnet Knibbs. Welcome to the House.", "I also have to introduce Rita, Katherine, Karen, Craig and Rob Franklin, who are direct descendants of the British home child program and Dr. Barnardo’s children, Edward Charles Franklin who came here at nine years of age in 1909, and his sister, Florence Salt, who came here in 1907 at 14 years of age. Welcome to your House. We’ll see you at the reception today." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Andrew Dowie", "text": [ "I wish to give a warm, warm welcome to the grade 10 students from St. Joseph’s high school in my great riding of Windsor–Tecumseh, with teachers Mr. Bill Croft, Mr. Charlie Sylvestre, Ms. Dana Stevens. Welcome to Queen’s Park. Looking forward to meeting you after all the commotion that we’re going to go through in the next hour and change." ] }, { "speaker": "MPP Jill Andrew", "text": [ "Good morning, Speaker. I would like to welcome some incredible folks from Toronto who are here for the British home child reception today: Ada Sloan, Adrienne Patterson, Aldo Palma, Ali Thompson, Allyson Reid, Bill Hopton, Bob Franklin. Welcome to your House." ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Chandra Pasma", "text": [ "I would like to join my colleagues in welcoming the British home child descendants and advocates, including Danielle Walker, Deborah Gallant, Kaitlin Gallant, Denis Gosselin, Denis Piquette, Derakhshan Qurban-Ali, Edward Hewitt and Edward Rice. Welcome. We look forward to seeing you at the reception afterwards." ] }, { "speaker": "Mrs. Jennifer (Jennie) Stevens", "text": [ "As well as my colleagues, I’d like to welcome some individuals here today from the British home children’s centre. They would be Hugo Straney, John Jefkins, John Vanthof, Joyce Kalsen, Judi Helle, Karen Franklin, Kate Barlett and Katherine Franklin. Welcome to your House. I’m looking forward to seeing you later on at your reception." ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Peter Bethlenfalvy", "text": [ "They’re not here yet; they’re going through security, but I want to give a big shout-out to the students from Uxbridge Secondary School, one that I go to very often. Of course, today, they are from the great riding of Uxbridge-Pickering. I want to say to them, welcome to the House, and go, Tigers!" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Sol Mamakwa", "text": [ "Meegwetch, Speaker.", "Remarks in Anishininiimowin.", "I’d like to welcome some guests to Queen’s Park. Yesterday, my team met with Raven Lacerte, the founder of the Moose Hide Campaign. The Moose Hide Campaign is a First Nations-led grassroots movement to end violence towards women and children. Also on her team are Grace Park-Wawia and Joshua Matthewman. Meegwetch for coming to Queen’s Park." ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Stephanie Bowman", "text": [ "I’d like to welcome members of the Canadian Credit Union Association, who gave us a wonderful breakfast this morning. I’ve already met with them. One of my grandfathers was the founder of a credit union near Stratford, and so I’m very proud to have met with him today.", "I also want to make note of a school visit yesterday. Maurice Cody public school was here. They weren’t in the gallery at the time, but over 75 grade 5 kids from Maurice Cody visited yesterday. Welcome to the House." ] }, { "speaker": "MPP Kristyn Wong-Tam", "text": [ "I’d like to add my voice in welcome to many people who are travelling from across Ontario for the British home child reception happening right after question period. I’d like to welcome Rick Hayward; Rita Franklin; Rob Franklin; Sandie De Freitas; Scott Ladoucier; Sheila Eaton; Suzanne Park; Warren Vandal; William C. Smith; Walter McIntosh; Nancy Smyth, the Canadian ambassador to Ireland; Fouzia Younis, the British consul general in Toronto; Janice McGann, the Irish consul general; Eleanor McGrath; Finbarr McCarthy; Lori Oschefski, president of the Home Children Canada charity; as well as Sir George Beardshaw, who is a 101-year-old World War II veteran and the last home child of Canada.", "1040" ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "I’ll ask if the House agrees to continue with the introduction of visitors. Agreed? Okay." ] }, { "speaker": "M. Stéphane Sarrazin", "text": [ "Aujourd’hui, j’ai le plaisir d’accueillir ici à Queen’s Park les élèves de 10eannée del’École secondaire catholique Embrun, qui est une école de ma circonscription.", "Je voulais juste dire que la visite est possible grâce à une belle initiative duprogramme des voyageurs pour la démocratie, qui est un programme du ministère de l’Éducation. Donc, plus que jamais, on a des écoles de notre région qui viennent ici. On sait qu’on demeure très loin, donc c’est vraiment le fun de voir ça, pour ces enfants-là de pouvoir apprendre ce que notre gouvernement fait et la démocratie.", "Bienvenue. Ils seront ici dans quelques instants. Je viens de prendre une photo avec eux—un gros groupe; 78 élèves." ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Bhutila Karpoche", "text": [ "I would like to welcome some more guests who are at Queen’s Park today for the British home child reception: Elizabeth Ladoucier, Emma Carter, Eric Morse, George Beardshaw and Georgina Warner. Welcome." ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. David Piccini", "text": [ "I would like to welcome to Queen’s Park today very dear friends and the person who’s been with me since day one in this Legislature and runs everything, including me, sometimes, in the constituency office: Bonnie and James. Welcome to Queen’s Park." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Chris Glover", "text": [ "I’d like to welcome to the House people who are going to be joining the British home child reception at noon: Carol Goddard, Catherine Strongman, Catherine Mulroney, Cathy O’Connell, Con O’Connell, Craig Franklin and Cynthia Teeter. Welcome to your House." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "The government House leader has informed me he has a point of order he’d like to raise." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Steve Clark", "text": [ "Point of order, Mr. Speaker: On behalf of Premier Ford and the government, I just want to express, through you, to the member for Scarborough Southwest, our deepest sympathies on the loss of her husband. Our thoughts and our prayers are with you and your family, and it’s great to see you back. My condolences." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Ms. Marit Stiles", "text": [ "This question is for the Premier. Six months ago, the Ontario Science Centre was a world-class institution. It was bustling with school field trips, with science experiments and creative installations, but today, under this government, it’s been boarded up. It’s been relocated in scraps to a strip mall in Etobicoke. Just a year ago, Ontario Place was an accessible public park. It was being enjoyed by millions of visitors, but today, it’s a pile of rubble locked away behind fences.", "I’ve been all over this province, and no one is telling us this is what they need. So my question to the Premier is, when will he stop the schemes and the scandals and get to work building the homes, hiring the doctors and fixing our schools?" ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "To reply for government, the Minister of Infrastructure." ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Kinga Surma", "text": [ "To the Leader of the Opposition, it’s nice to see you disrespect the Integrity Commissioner once again in this House.", "But, Mr. Speaker, the science centre board has made a decision in order to open exhibits across the province, and two of the locations are Harbourfront Centre and Sherway Gardens. Now, we are making a big effort—the province of Ontario, in collaboration with the science centre—to bring science centre learning to the people of Ontario. This was a decision by the science centre, and we encourage families to go visit the exhibits as they do, and prepare for their Christmas shopping and the holiday season." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "The supplementary question?" ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Marit Stiles", "text": [ "Speaker, if the minister can’t answer on her own file because she’s under investigation, maybe she could find another minister to help her answer these questions.", "It’s been six long years of this government and Ontarians are without a doubt worse off. They are stuck trying to find a doctor. They are stuck looking for an affordable place to live. They are stuck with the bill for this Premier’s costly schemes and scandals.", "The Ontario Place scheme alone could cost taxpayers billions, all so that the insiders at Therme can make huge profits off of prime waterfront land.", "So my question to the Premier, again, is: How can this Premier or anyone else on that side possibly justify this?", "Interjections." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Members will please take their seats.", "To respond, the Minister of Infrastructure." ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Kinga Surma", "text": [ "Mr. Speaker, in case I don’t have my facts correct—it was the NDP and the leader of the official opposition that filed a complaint with the Integrity Commissioner. The Integrity Commissioner is doing his job. I assume that all of us who sit in the House respect the Integrity Commissioner, the institution, his office and staff. So I have to ask the question: Why do you insist on disrespecting the Integrity Commissioner and the important work that he has to do?", "While you do that, the members on this side of the House will focus on building Ontario. In fact, let’s just list a few accomplishments: Grandview Children’s Centre, Mount Sinai, Michael Garron Hospital, West Park Healthcare Centre and the Ontario Court of Justice—all projects that reached substantial completion under this government’s leadership." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "I’ll remind the members to make their comments through the Chair.", "The final supplementary." ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Marit Stiles", "text": [ "I’ll say it again, Speaker: Boy, do I wish we didn’t have to spend all our time submitting complaints to the Integrity Commissioner about this government. But, sadly, that is the state of the province of Ontario right now.", "Yesterday, the Premier stood here and said Ontario Place was a field of weeds. The last time he said that, do you know what he was talking about, Speaker? He was talking about the greenbelt. How’d that work out for you? The Premier said that, we’ll recall, to justify selling off the greenbelt for $8 billion in windfall profits to their insider friends, until we forced him to back down.", "When is this government going to learn? What is it going to take for them to reverse their latest scheme to sell off Ontario Place, or is it going to take another RCMP investigation?", "Interjections." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Members will please take their seats.", "The Minister of Infrastructure." ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Kinga Surma", "text": [ "Please, let the leader of the official opposition continue to disrespect the Integrity Commissioner in this House. I am sure he is watching.", "But, Mr. Speaker, let me talk about the things that keep the Ministry of Infrastructure busy—that keep all of us busy, in fact. Let me talk about the projects that we are building in the province of Ontario: the 1Door4Care children’s hospital in Ottawa; the Eglinton Crosstown West extension tunnelling work is completed; the Scarborough subway extension; Cambridge Memorial Hospital; the Centre for Addiction and Mental Health redevelopment project; GO expansion; Highway 3; Hamilton Health Sciences West Lincoln; Niagara Health’s new South Niagara Hospital project; the Ontario Line; QEW/Credit River.", "Mr. Speaker, we’re busy building this province; the NDP is just filing complaints." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Ms. Marit Stiles", "text": [ "Speaker, I’m going to go back to the Premier. Let’s talk about another unpopular scheme of this government: the Premier’s fantasy tunnel under the 401. Recent polling is now showing that about two thirds of the government’s own voters say they strongly oppose this tunnel plan. It’s even less popular, not surprisingly, with the rest of Ontarians. People in rural Ontario don’t want to hear their government is spending $100 billion in taxpayer dollars on another wacky scheme from this Premier, right? They deserve, instead, a government that’s going to make sure they have access to their local emergency room, say, when they need it.", "1050", "So my question to the Premier is, why do this government’s priorities never seem to match the reality of this province?" ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "To reply, the Minister of Transportation." ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Prabmeet Singh Sarkaria", "text": [ "Mr. Speaker, we know gridlock is at an all-time high, and that’s because the previous Liberal government—obviously, the NDP—have refused to build in this province. For 15 years, they had a chance to do something. They did absolutely nothing.", "We look at all solutions to these problems, whether it’s public transportation or whether it’s a tunnel. We know the 401 is one of the most congested areas in our province. We need to improve productivity. We need to get people moving and, Mr. Speaker, we will look at every option possible.", "We’re building the Ontario Line, moving 400,000 people every single day. That party opposed it. We’re building Highway 413, the Bradford Bypass, and we will continue to do a feasibility study on the tunnel because we know we need to look at the next 10, 20, 50 years of this province, not go back to the previous Liberal government that did absolutely nothing to build, and I can say the NDP would be no different." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Supplementary question?" ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Marit Stiles", "text": [ "Well, Speaker, I don’t think Ontarians are going to buy that from a Minister of Transportation who can’t even give us an opening date for the Eglinton LRT. My gosh—a basic, basic responsibility of this minister.", "My question, back to the Premier: This is a government that is six years in, and congestion is, yes, worse than it has ever been. The Premier could get people moving today by allowing trucks to drive toll-free on the 407 and free up the 401. When we put that to the government as a proposal, what did they do, Speaker? They said no. They said no to the people of this province. So why is the Premier making commuters wait for some fantasy tunnel that will never get built instead of just taking back the 407?", "Interjections." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Members will please take their seats.", "The Minister of Transportation." ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Prabmeet Singh Sarkaria", "text": [ "Mr. Speaker, that question from the NDP sums up everything you need to know about them and the previous Liberal government. They don’t think anything can be built. They think everything is a fantasy.", "In fact, that’s what they said when we proposed the Ontario Line. They said, “That could never get built. You could never get shovels in the ground.” Guess what? The shovels are in the ground, and it will move 400,000 people every single day.", "That is what they said to the people of Scarborough. For 10, 15 years, they denied them the subway. They denied them transit. What did this Premier do? We got shovels in the ground on the Scarborough subway extension.", "To them, it’s always a fantasy. To our government, it’s about building. It’s about building for the future. It’s about building, putting shovels in the ground on the 413, the Bradford Bypass. This is about the future generations of this province. This isn’t about the next four years; it’s about thinking ahead. The next 10, 20, 50 years—what will this province need? If it was up to the NDP and Liberals, nothing would ever get built in this province." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "The final supplementary." ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Marit Stiles", "text": [ "I do seem to remember these are the same folks who poured cement down a subway line, but anyways.", "Listen, while Ontarians are stuck waiting to find a home, a doctor, support for their kids in schools, this government is stuck in scandals and schemes that are moving us absolutely nowhere: a $1-billion spa deal, an $8-billion greenbelt giveaway, a $100-billion fantasy tunnel.", "Instead of homes, Ontarians get headaches. Instead of doctors, they get delays. And instead of schools, they get spas. So my question to the Premier is, when will this government stop catering to insiders, put people first and finally deliver the basics for Ontario?", "Interjections." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Members will please take their seats.", "Minister of Transportation." ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Prabmeet Singh Sarkaria", "text": [ "Mr. Speaker, we are delivering every single day for the people of this province. Whether it’s a $70-billion plan to build public transit to move people faster, to make people more productive, to get people within walking distance of public transit, guess what? The NDP oppose that every step of the way.", "We have a piece of legislation that is on the floor that we asked the NDP and Liberals to support, that would help us accelerate the construction of highway builds across this province, including the Bradford Bypass, including Highway 413 and the Garden City Skyway bridge, Mr. Speaker. But guess what? I know what the members opposite will do. They’re going to vote against it again, because they don’t believe in building this province. They don’t believe in getting people to work and back to their families instead of spending time in gridlock.", "This government has a plan to build, and we will continue to make sure we get shovels in the ground, regardless of what the opposition do to try and stop us." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Ms. Bhutila Karpoche", "text": [ "My question is to the Minister of Education. This summer, the Conservative government cancelled already approved plans to build 48 new school-based child care centres that would have created spaces for over 3,000 kids in the GTA. These were ready-to-go projects that were held up because of a lack of provincial funding, despite promises to fund them. Parents are desperate to get their kids into $10-a-day child care programs. When the space isn’t there, what are they supposed to do, especially moms? Not go to work? Not pay the bills? All families deserve accessible and affordable child care.", "Why are Conservatives withholding funds for much-needed affordable child care spaces?" ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Jill Dunlop", "text": [ "I think the member knows that these seats have actually been reallocated because the board was sitting on this surplus money. We’re working collaboratively with the federal government to get a better deal for Ontario families, because we know that child care has increased to some of the highest costs in Canada under the former Ontario Liberal government.", "To be clear, from day one, we were skeptical about the deal, which is why we were the only province in Canada to secure a midway review to ensure the sustainability and longevity of this program. Having met with Minister Sudds in Ottawa, I thought that we both agreed that we wanted affordable and flexible child care for Ontario families. However, Minister Sudds’s response to my letter has made it clear to me that the federal Liberals care more about pushing their ideology than making child care affordable for families in this province.", "I am calling on the NDP and the Liberals across the aisle to join us to support this program to ensure that we can have affordable and flexible child care for families in this province." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Supplementary question?" ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Bhutila Karpoche", "text": [ "Speaker, the minister knows very well that funds are being withheld for child care spaces, and the Conservatives are well behind and will fail to meet their own targets. Today is Child Care Worker and Early Childhood Educator Appreciation Day, and one of the things that is missing in the new funding formula and what child care workers have been asking for, for years, is a wage grid. Other provinces have successfully implemented a wage grid. Do Ontario’s child care workers and early childhood educators not deserve the same?" ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Jill Dunlop", "text": [ "I want to thank the early childhood educators for the loving environment they do for our young folks and for those early learners, but, Mr. Speaker, that is why retention and recruitment of a high-quality child care, early-years workforce is critical to the sustainability and implementation of the CWELCC system and will achieve the system growth and ensure increased access to high-quality licensed child care in Ontario.", "I have had the opportunity to visit child care centres across this province this summer and have met with early childhood educators and have heard the concerns about retention and recruitment. That’s why we have made these changes, and we will ensure that we are providing—", "Interjection." ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Jill Dunlop", "text": [ "That’s what we are doing. We are providing the supports for those families.", "For 2024, the wage floor increased from the planned $20 per hour to $23.86 per hour for eligible RECEs, program staff; from the planned $22 per hour to $24.86 per hour for the registered ECEs’ supervisors and RECE home child care visitors." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Mr. Deepak Anand", "text": [ "My question is to the Minister of Transportation. Traffic congestion cost over $11 billion in productivity losses every year. With a growing population and increasing traffic congestion, it is clear we need to enhance our transportation infrastructure and we need to do it now. We all know the frustration of sitting in traffic, watching our time slip away due to ongoing road congestion delays when it comes to completing vital highway projects—time we can spend with family, friends and loved ones.", "1100", "Thanks to the minister, our government has introduced the Building Highways Faster Act to streamline the approval process and reduce delays. With major projects still facing years of planning and approval, it is important for the people of Ontario to see the real progress. These are important goals. We need to understand how this will actually play out on the ground.", "To the Minister of Transportation: Can you elaborate how this proposed legislation will cut down the time it takes to build highways?" ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "The parliamentary assistant to the Minister of Transportation and member for Hastings–Lennox and Addington." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Ric Bresee", "text": [ "My thanks to my friend the member from Mississauga–Malton for the question. The Building Highways Faster Act is a key initiative that reinforces our government’s commitment to get Ontario moving. As our population has grown, so have the pressures on our highways, but this legislation will allow us to cut through the delays by streamlining the approval processes and eliminating the red tape so that we can deliver key projects even more efficiently.", "It’s about getting it done: building the highways we need, reducing the congestion, improving road safety and driving economic growth by ensuring that the movement of people and goods across this province continues to flow." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "The supplementary question?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Deepak Anand", "text": [ "Thank you for that wonderful answer. The need for faster and more efficient highway construction has never been more pressing for the residents of Mississauga–Malton and our province.", "Our roads face increasing demands due to population growth and economic prosperity. Urgent action is needed, and needed now, as Ontario continues to be the economic powerhouse of Canada. By streamlining approval process and reducing hurdles, the government claims to be prioritizing the timely delivery of critical infrastructure projects.", "With that in mind, Speaker, can the parliamentary assistant please provide specific examples of how the Building Highways Faster Act will expedite the construction of highways and benefit Ontarians going forward?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Ric Bresee", "text": [ "Once again, thank you to my friend from Mississauga–Malton. Speaker, the Building Highways Faster Act will have a direct and positive impact on the daily lives of Ontarians. By reducing the time it takes to plan and build our highways, we’re making sure that commuters will spend less time stuck in traffic and more time at home with families and loved ones. Improved highway infrastructure means faster, safer travel for everyone, whether it’s getting to work, to school or just to enjoy the beautiful places all across Ontario that we have to offer.", "Speaker, by enhancing the efficiency of our transportation system, we’re also supporting local businesses, allowing goods and services to move more quickly and reliably. This government is about delivering results for Ontarians: faster commutes, safer roads and a more connected province." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "MPP Jill Andrew", "text": [ "To the Premier: Across Ontario, people are paying enormous parking fees at hospitals. In the GTA alone, a monthly parking pass is about $400. That’s a lot of money, especially for our overworked and underpaid health care workers.", "Earlier this week, I tabled a motion calling on this government to eliminate hospital parking fees for health care workers, hospital staff, patients and their families, and adequately fund our public hospitals. Patients should be able to bank on this government to properly fund our public hospitals and not revenue from a parking spot for the hospital care and services they need.", "My question is to the Premier. Will this government provide necessary funding to eliminate hospital parking fees today so health care workers, patients and families can have one less financial burden at the hospital tomorrow?" ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "The parliamentary assistant and member for Essex." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Anthony Leardi", "text": [ "The hospital parking directive is a directive that exists in the province of Ontario, and the purpose of the Ontario hospital parking directive is to keep the financial costs down on parking fees for patients and visitors at hospitals. The directive was created to reduce the barriers to accessing health care.", "Mr. Speaker, under the Ontario hospital parking directive, there is a cap placed on any increases for parking fees in parking spaces associated with hospitals.", "In addition to that, there are also special rates created for a 10-day pass or a 30-day pass. This is all in keeping with our policy to help keep the financial burden of parking down for patients and for people visiting patients at hospitals in Ontario." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "The supplementary question?" ] }, { "speaker": "MPP Jill Andrew", "text": [ "I wonder if the Premier or any MPPs pay for parking here at Queen’s Park.", "Anyhow, back to the Premier: CTV News recently reported on a Toronto woman who paid nearly $2,000 in parking fees to visit her mother. Speaker, when you’re sick or when you’ve got a loved one who is sick in the hospital, parking costs should never be a barrier. When you’re getting chemo, managing chronic health conditions or just trying to keep up with all of your medical appointments—some of us know that really well—parking costs should never, ever, be a barrier.", "As the Premier pins the price tag of his foreign luxury spa on Ontarians, many Ontarians cannot afford to visit their loved ones in hospital, literally. So I’ll ask the Premier again: Premier, will you choose people over your profit schemes, properly fund our public hospitals and eliminate hospital parking fees today as a concrete solution to actually help Ontarians get by?", "Interjections." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Members will please take their seats.", "The member for Essex." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Anthony Leardi", "text": [ "The province of Ontario has an Ontario hospital parking directive, and under this directive, the goal is to help alleviate part of the financial burden on patients and their families who are visiting them at the hospital. This is a policy of the province of Ontario.", "Under this directive, Mr. Speaker, not only is there a hard cap on any parking increases, but in addition to that, there are special rates established for a 10-day parking pass and a 30-day parking pass. This is in keeping with the policy established in the province of Ontario. There are also special discounts that are offered under the hospital parking directive.", "Mr. Speaker, the hospital parking directive exists to help people in the province of Ontario and alleviate the financial burden of parking, because we want everybody in the province of Ontario to get the health care they need at the hospitals that are available in the province." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "MmeDawn Gallagher Murphy", "text": [ "My question is for the Minister of Labour, Immigration, Training and Skills Development. Ontario is at a critical juncture and who is going to build our infrastructure in my great riding of Newmarket–Aurora? We have a major pipeline that’s going to be built down Leslie and it’s going to add to our waste water capacity. I have a brand new apartment building going up on Yonge Street that’s going to provide almost 400 new homes.", "Speaker, it is critical that we have enough skilled workers to meet the growing housing and infrastructure demands as we build Ontario. Without enough people in the skilled trades, we know that vital projects like hospitals, schools, homes and pipelines won’t be built, and we’re going to experience delays. That’s why our government must do everything we can do to provide Ontarians with the opportunities to launch into these well-paying and lifelong careers.", "Speaker, can the minister please outline what steps our government has taken to ensure we have the workforce necessary to build a strong future for Ontario?" ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. David Piccini", "text": [ "Thank you to that great member for that question—and an exciting waste water project to expand housing in her community.", "We’ve got students here today and this government is taking some meaningful steps to support them on their career paths. We’re expanding tech classes in high school. In our latest Working for Workers bills that we spoke to this morning, we’re expanding the focus of apprenticeship in the skilled trades so that in grade 11 and 12 you can get hours that count towards your level 1 C of Q.", "This Minister of Education is smashing down barriers and bringing back common-sense changes like financial literacy to actually ensure that these youth aren’t living off of government handouts and government programs and actually have the skills to stand on their own two feet and to succeed in today’s ever-changing economy.", "1110", "We need more youth in the trades. In my supplementary, I’m going to expand on even more steps we’re taking to get our next generation into the skilled trades to build the homes, hospitals, highways and schools this government is building." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Supplementary question?" ] }, { "speaker": "MmeDawn Gallagher Murphy", "text": [ "Ontario’s economy depends on a strong, skilled workforce, and it is no secret that we are facing a shortage of skilled tradespeople. In fact, estimates suggest that, by 2025, one in five jobs in Ontario will be in the skilled trades.", "At the same time, we know our experienced tradespeople—those who have built and shaped Ontario’s infrastructure—are nearing retirement. These are the workers who mentor the next generation and keep our economy moving. If we don’t act now, we risk not only losing their talent but also the opportunity to transfer the critical knowledge to younger workers.", "Speaker, can the minister please explain how our government is ensuring that we can attract new tradespeople while retaining our experienced workers to ensure that Ontario remains a leader in the skilled trades?" ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. David Piccini", "text": [ "It’s a fundamental outlet that we just want to build Ontario, but we recognize two challenges: getting a generation to actually build it, but also the retiring golden generation.", "Do you know how we’re not going to do it? By taxing the trades, as the previous Liberal government did so well: by taxing them with increasing fees, increasing exam fees. We’re lowering all of that, Speaker, or outright removing fees.", "In fact, we’re doing common-sense changes to get more women into the trades, like properly fitting PPE, ensuring we have programs that protect women, ensuring we’re making investments in programs like the Skills Development Fund that have led to a 30% increase in women registration into the trades.", "We’re building a province. The previous Liberal government, we know it because they said it: They wanted a service economy. They turned their backs on manufacturing workers. They drove jobs out at Kraft, at plants in my riding. We’re building a province, and we’re making sure we have the workforce designed to build the things that our great country needs so that we’re not dependent—" ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Thank you.", "The next question." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Mr. Wayne Gates", "text": [ "My question is to the Premier. Recently, we learned about medical supply shortages affecting home care patients in the province of Ontario. The shortage is so severe that appointments are being cancelled and some patients are being sent to urgent care centres—that’s if they’re open—and could end up in emergency departments. It’s so bad that cancer patients have to buy their own medical supplies from Amazon.", "The province restructured home care last year, and then chose—chose—to take a five-month summer break while this crisis developed. Speaker, what is this government going to do to ensure this issue is fixed for home care patients immediately?" ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "The member for Essex and parliamentary assistant." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Anthony Leardi", "text": [ "Mr. Speaker, it is absolutely unacceptable that patients do not get their medical supplies on time or as ordered. Patients must receive their medical supplies on time and as ordered. We expect everybody who needs home delivery of these supplies in the province of Ontario to receive their supplies, and we also expect that the families counting on those supplies will receive those supplies.", "That is why the minister has already communicated with the chair and CAO of Ontario Health atHome and has already directed and authorized that the CAO take all means necessary, whatever means necessary, to ensure that the supplies are delivered on time and as ordered." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Supplementary question?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Wayne Gates", "text": [ "Just to let you know, sir, it was your government that signed the contract. You’re responsible for what’s going on in the province of Ontario right now.", "My question is back to the Premier. I heard directly from front-line staff about how this supply shortage has affected them. There have been serious delays in delivery. We have independent medical supply businesses today that have been doing this work for years without problems or complaints. Nurses are frustrated and are being forced to figure out how to divide what supplies they have left. Patients are left without the services they need.", "Speaker, to this government: Why was this supply contract taken from independent businesses who were doing their jobs with no complaints, who have been doing it for years, and given to Bayshore, one of your big donors?" ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Again, I’ll remind the members to make their comments through the Chair.", "The member for Essex." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Anthony Leardi", "text": [ "Mr. Speaker, I want to make this absolutely clear: Our government expects that every person in Ontario who requires delivery of medical supplies at home shall get those medical supplies at home and on time. That is why the minister has already communicated with the CAO, to make sure that those supplies get delivered on time.", "This is a logistics issue. There is no lack of supply. This is a logistics issue, and the minister has already directed that these supplies be delivered on time, in accordance with the orders that were made. Any person in the province of Ontario who is out of pocket as a result of having to seek an alternative source may apply for reimbursement, and, in fact, those actions have already been taken. The phone number to call is 1-866-377-7567." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Mrs. Karen McCrimmon", "text": [ "There are many people who struggle with math, and this Conservative government, the Premier and his Minister of Health are no exceptions, but the math is easy and it’s frightening: Both the Ontario College of Family Physicians and the Ontario Medical Association agree that 2.5 million Ontarians do not have a family doctor. These organizations both say this number is set to increase to 4.4 million people by 2026; 11,000 people have died waiting for surgeries and diagnostics, and the number of hallway patients in Ontario has doubled. The math is heart-wrenching.", "While the health minister is proud of $20 million apparently invested in team-based care, the Premier wants to spend $1 billion to sell beer in corner stores, more than $400 million on a foreign-owned spa’s parking and more than $50 billion on a tunnel. When will the Premier wake up and realize that health care needs to be his priority?" ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "To reply, the parliamentary assistant and member for Essex." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Anthony Leardi", "text": [ "Mr. Speaker, the province of Ontario supplies more primary health care to more people than any other province in Canada, and in addition to that, the primary care services in the province of Ontario are provided to at least approximately 90% of all of the residents in the province of Ontario.", "Let me give you an example of how we’re expanding primary care right in the city of Ottawa. We can talk about the Ottawa nurse practitioner-led clinic, where an additional 6,400 spots have been created to provide primary care to people. That’s an additional 6,400 patients who will get primary care right in the city of Ottawa as a result of the actions taken by this government.", "We’ve increased the health care budget from $60 billion to $85 billion, so that people in Ottawa can get primary—", "Interjections." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Order.", "The supplementary question?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mrs. Karen McCrimmon", "text": [ "Well, here are some ideas of what the priorities of this government should be: the families that cannot find a family doctor; I spent this summer knocking on doors in my riding, and it was the number one concern at the door. What about residents of cities like Ottawa and Belleville who have to wait up to 18 hours in a hospital emergency room? What about residents of small towns in Ontario whose emergency departments had to close because of staff shortages? What about the 17,000 residents of the health minister’s own riding of Dufferin–Caledon without a doctor, or the 32,000 residents of Etobicoke North who don’t have a doctor? Yes, he should prioritize the 2.5 million people across this province who don’t have a family doctor—and I could go on.", "But talk is cheap, Mr. Speaker. When will this government act on what is important to Ontarians and finally make the long-overdue investments that health care needs now?", "1120" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Anthony Leardi", "text": [ "Ontario leads the country with almost 90% of all residents connected to primary care. That’s better than Quebec; that’s better than British Columbia; that’s better than Alberta; that’s better than every other Canadian province. And while the Liberals actually trained fewer doctors when they were in government, we’re now training more doctors as a result of the programs introduced by this government.", "Mr. Speaker, right in my own riding, the riding of Essex, we’ve added an additional 1,200 spaces to the Kingsville primary care centre. That’s the Essex county nurse practitioner-led clinic where more and more nurses are being added to the province of Ontario. In fact, since making government in 2018, this government has helped to train approximately 80,000 new nurses—" ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Thank you.", "The next question." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Mr. Rudy Cuzzetto", "text": [ "My question is to the Associate Minister of Auto Theft and Bail Reform. The people of Ontario and families in Mississauga–Lakeshore are growing concerned about the rise in car thefts. Every day, we hear stories of families and individuals having their vehicles stolen right from their driveways, including my own many years ago.", "Car thefts are disruptive and costly, leading to high insurance premiums and a loss of trust in the safety of our neighbourhoods. The people of Ontario are looking to our government for solutions. They want to know what steps are being taken to stop these crimes and protect their property.", "Speaker, what is our government doing to address the rising issue of car thefts in Ontario and ensure Ontarians feel safe in their own homes and their communities?" ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Graham McGregor", "text": [ "Thank you to the member for that question. I know the member is plugged in like you wouldn’t believe in Mississauga–Lakeshore. He gets calls every single day with residents saying cars are being stolen.", "What is this government doing about it? Well, we’re doing a lot, Mr. Speaker. The people of Ontario deserve to know that when they are the victims of an auto theft crime, the aggressor will be caught and held accountable for their crimes, which is the reason why we’ve been laser-focused on this issue and why we’ve invested more than $130 million to purchase five new police helicopters in the GTA and Ottawa.", "Believe it or not, a municipality the size of Peel, which I represent along with the member, didn’t have their own helicopter. Getting a bird in the air in seconds and minutes, rather than in minutes and hours, is vital for cracking down on these violent offenders, getting them quickly. It actually helps prevent high-speed pursuits, which actually keeps our officers safe as well. These helicopters will be equipped with advanced technology to enhance highway safety and help in reducing violent crimes.", "This party is taking it seriously. That member is as well. Let’s keep it going." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "The supplementary question?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Rudy Cuzzetto", "text": [ "Car theft is not just a statistic; it is a personal and often traumatic experience for the victims. For many Ontarians, losing their vehicle means losing their primary means of transportation, impacting their jobs, families and day-to-day lives. The financial burden from insurance claims and replacing a stolen vehicle can be overwhelming.", "Given the sophisticated nature of these car theft operations, including the use of advanced technology to bypass security systems, urgent action is needed now. Ontarians need to know that something is being done to stop this. They want to know that our government is taking their concerns seriously.", "Speaker, can the minister elaborate on how the recent investment in police helicopters will enhance and enforce what we are doing to protect the people of Ontario?" ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Graham McGregor", "text": [ "I’d like to thank the member for that question once again.", "Through you, Speaker: Because of the joint air support unit, police services will have access to a rapid-response crime-fighting tool that will help police. I want to make it clear that these helicopters are not only about tackling organized car thieves; we’re using eyes in the sky to also work against human traffickers and gun smugglers.", "I was disappointed to hear some of the opposition scoffing about the investment in the helicopters when we announced it. They don’t think this is a priority for them. You know, the fact is, when police officers are in that gallery, every single member of this House will stand up and applaud them for the heroes that they are. The difference is, when they leave, the PC Party stays standing up for our front-line officers.", "The people of Ontario work hard day in and day out. They’ve told us public safety is a priority for them. It is a priority for us in the PC Party. We will not relent in this work." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Mr. Sol Mamakwa", "text": [ "Remarks in Anishininiimowin.", "Hunting is fundamental to the traditional ways of life. In Neskantaga First Nation, treaty rights are being violated by helicopters flying and landing on their homelands. This is happening without their consent. These choppers are scaring the moose away and disrupting the annual fall hunt. Will this government respect treaty rights and stop all activities related to the two Ring of Fire road projects until the end of the fall moose hunt?" ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "To reply for the government, the Minister of Mines." ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. George Pirie", "text": [ "Thank you very much for the question. Obviously, all of the activities around the Ring of Fire roads are being handled through the Indigenous communities, through Marten Falls and Webequie. This government is committed to consultation—we have made that very clear—and to the point that the Indigenous communities are conducting the consultation with all the communities on those roads." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Supplementary question?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Sol Mamakwa", "text": [ "Speaker, business should not happen at the cost of the ways of life of the people of Neskantaga. Will this government respect Chief Moonias’s request and undertake a full review of all the activities infringing upon the treaty rights that have taken place without the consent of the Neskantaga First Nation?" ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. George Pirie", "text": [ "Thanks so much for that question. As you know, and as we’ve said very many times, this government is fully committed to the duty to consult. We take this very seriously.", "In relation to all the activities in the Ring of Fire, we know that the environmental assessment process is being conducted through the Indigenous communities. They are handling it. They are the individuals that are conducting all the consultation with the 22 nations associated with the development in the Ring of Fire. This is a priority for the government. We take it very seriously." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Mr. Vincent Ke", "text": [ "My question is for the Associate Minister of Mental Health and Addictions. Constituents often raise serious concerns about loved ones who struggle with severe mental illness and addictions. When an individual lacks the insight or judgment to accept appropriate treatment, I believe it is up to society to advocate for them, to help them to recover and restore them to a life of stability and purpose.", "Speaker, families and loved ones are advocating for severely addicted and mentally ill persons to be compelled into involuntary care. My question to the minister is, will the Ontario government consider this type of life-saving measure?" ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Michael A. Tibollo", "text": [ "Thank you for the question. Everyone’s life has meaning, and that’s why our government has been focused on creating a system of care to meet people and prioritize connecting them to supports and services when they want those services. Those investments have been continuous from the very beginning, when I first became minister, including annual funding for mental health and addiction supports by over $800 million through the Roadmap to Wellness and, in the 2024 budget, adding an additional $396 million. We also announced an unprecedented investment of over $370 million to build 19 new best-in-class treatment facilities through the HART hub programs in communities across the province.", "Mr. Speaker, through these different funds and these different initiatives, we’ve now added over 400 detox, treatment and withdrawal management beds across Ontario. The very first ones have already seen more than 10,000 new unique visits. So we are—" ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Thank you.", "1130", "And the supplementary question?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Vincent Ke", "text": [ "Thank you, Minister, for your answer. Unlike other jurisdictions such as BC, Saskatchewan and Manitoba, deterioration as an alternative to harm is only partially a priority in Ontario when deciding if a patient needs involuntary treatment.", "When it comes to the need for treatment, bodily harm and deterioration are also considered differently. For example, I witnessed that one young man was not deemed as needing treatment, who then later went on to cause his father to suffer a rib fracture.", "Again, my question to the minister is, what actions should the government take to reduce these types of tragedies?" ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Michael A. Tibollo", "text": [ "Once again, to make it very clear, we’re focused on building a system of care, building capacity to help individuals where and when they need that help so that they can access supports as quickly as possible. We want to connect more people to treatment. That is a priority that we are focused on to ensure that we do have all the components necessary within community to support individuals, whether it’s withdrawal management, whether it’s treatment beds, and then connecting them to supportive beds and giving them the opportunity to reintegrate into society.", "This is why the HART Hubs will add to the beds with the Addictions Recovery Fund to continue building that capacity. As I said, one of the things that we see as a fallout of that is that there’s less pressure on the emergency rooms and more treatment capacity for the individuals in the community.", "Mr. Speaker, we’re going to continue building capacity in the province and looking after the people, meeting them where and when—" ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Thank you.", "The next question." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Mr. John Jordan", "text": [ "My question is to the Minister of Rural Affairs. With inflation already hurting families in my riding of Lanark–Frontenac–Kingston, the Trudeau-Crombie carbon tax is making life even more unaffordable. Rising costs on everyday essentials like groceries, gas and home heating are pushing hard-working Ontarians to the financial brink. In rural areas, where people rely on driving long distances for work and services, the added burden of higher fuel prices is already causing more economic hardship. How can carbon tax Crombie and her Liberals justify increasing taxes on food, fuel and other necessities of life when so many are already struggling to just get by?", "Speaker, can the minister please share what our government is doing to help fight this unjust carbon tax?" ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Lisa M. Thompson", "text": [ "To the member from Lanark–Frontenac–Kingston, I thank him for this question, because we need to continue to talk about how the Liberal ideology is continuing to increase the cost of living for not only individuals in the GTHA but across the province, as well as the cost of doing business. But it’s our government, under the leadership of Premier Ford and the astute mind of the Minister of Finance, that is bringing solutions to the table.", "For instance, we’re helping leave more money in seniors’ pockets by indexing the guaranteed annual income benefit, for the first time in Ontario’s history, to the rate of inflation.", "We’ve also extended the tuition freeze to help families and students achieve goals when it comes to pursuing their goals in terms of next jobs that we have in Ontario.", "The other thing I want to share is that we’re embracing nuclear. We need to, because we need affordable, reliable, green electricity. We’ve reduced gas by 5.7 cents, and we’re making sure that we in Ontario—" ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Thank you.", "Supplementary question?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. John Jordan", "text": [ "Thank you, Minister, for that response. It is encouraging to hear about the strong leadership of the Premier and the minister on this issue. Unfortunately, the reality of the financial situation of so many families in my riding because of the carbon tax is truly a challenge.", "The Parliamentary Budget Officer has confirmed once again that the carbon tax costs most households more than any would ever get back in rebates, further deepening the affordability crisis. Carbon tax Crombie and her Liberals are expensive and out of touch when it comes to the understanding of the negative impact of the carbon tax on rural families.", "Speaker, can the minister please share what investments government has made to support residents in rural Ontario as we fight the Liberal carbon tax?" ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Lisa M. Thompson", "text": [ "I do want to revisit the fact that it’s our government that’s expanding nuclear across this province so that we can have affordable electricity—and this matters why? I’m looking at young people in the gallery today and to those of you watching: You need to know that the Liberal ideology is going to more than double the cost of carbon tax across the nation. What does that mean for us? I live on a farm in rural Ontario. We have to heat our house and run our business on propane because we don’t have access to natural gas. My friend here, the Minister of Mines, who lives in Timmins, only has access to propane as well. Ladies and gentlemen, when this carbon tax more than doubles by the year 2030, six short years from now, the cost of propane, for example, is going to go from 12.4 cents to 26.3 cents.", "They are doing nothing, Bonnie Crombie and Justin Trudeau, based on Liberal ideology. It’s driving costs through the roof. It is our government in Ontario that are standing up and will fight every day—" ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Thank you.", "The next question." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "MPP Kristyn Wong-Tam", "text": [ "My question is to the Premier. ODSP rates are legislated poverty in Ontario. I speak to constituents, some living in government-held ridings. Every single month, they are barely surviving on the $1,300 per month they receive. Rent for a studio apartment in Toronto alone is already over $1,400. That leaves people with a negative cash balance at the end of the month. No wonder homelessness has doubled. We are also seeing that there is almost 27,000 people living in Ontario on ODSP and OW, who are homeless.", "When will the Premier end legislated poverty in Ontario? When will he double the ODSP rates?" ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "The Associate Minister of Women’s Social and Economic Opportunity." ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Charmaine A. Williams", "text": [ "I do thank the member for the question, but we have to remember where things were at when the Liberals and NDP were here. You had an opportunity to increase the rates, but you really didn’t. And in 2022, we made a significant change by increasing the rates at the rate of inflation. Do the members opposite know where we are at right now? We’ve increased the rate 17%—17%—and we’ve also given people on ODSP an increased ability to earn income; we increased that rate by 400%.", "We’re going to keep doing this. Also, through my colleague here, the Skills Development Fund is giving many people opportunity to get training to get the jobs of the future. We’re not going to stop working and helping those most vulnerable in Ontario. This is what we’re going to do: We’re going to keep working with them." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Supplementary question?" ] }, { "speaker": "MPP Kristyn Wong-Tam", "text": [ "I want to remind the minister that they have a responsibility now. Six years in power, stop pointing the finger over there and start looking into the mirror.", "We have to believe that marriage equality exists in Ontario, but in fact, it does not. For Ontarians on ODSP who choose to live with their partner, their financial support is drastically cut. It is almost eliminated altogether, because ODSP considers their partner’s meagre income as their own income from the minute they move in together. Imagine, delaying or forgoing living with the person that you love, your life partner, your co-parent, your caregiver.", "Speaker, this is such an important issue. We have so many people coming to the House who want to hear this answer. We need to ask this government: Will you fix the incredibly discriminatory practice, or does he think that people on ODSP don’t deserve to live with their partners, the people that they love?", "Interjections." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Members will please take their seats.", "The associate minister." ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Charmaine A. Williams", "text": [ "The member opposite has to also understand that this is a process that we are fixing and we’re working with all of those who are saying to us, “We need the supports.” And it’s happening at the rate of inflation. That’s why we’re at 17%. The member opposite laughed at us when we said we are increasing it by 5% and at the rate of inflation. So now we’re at a 17% increase.", "1140", "Also, we are doing things across the government to make life more affordable, right? The LIFT care tax—we’ve been adding. Also, One Fare—$1,600, so that people can get around.", "We’re also pushing back against the carbon tax, because every time we make these increases to help people, we have a carbon tax that’s sucking the money right back out of their pockets.", "When will the members opposite support our attempt to make life more affordable in Ontario and support our initiatives to help every single person in Ontario have an opportunity at—" ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Thank you very much.", "The next question." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Ms. Effie J. Triantafilopoulos", "text": [ "My question is for the Minister of Education. In growing communities, the need for new and updated schools is critical. Under the former Liberal government, propped up by the NDP, families waited far too long for a single school to be built. Because of their inaction, parents and educators across our province and in communities like mine are worried about the pace of school construction.", "When we look at areas of rapid growth such as Oakville North–Burlington, we see a clear need to ensure that our education capital projects are moving forward swiftly and efficiently.", "Every student deserves a learning environment that will help them succeed.", "Can the minister please explain what steps our government is taking to accelerate the pace of school construction across the province and in my own community of Oakville North–Burlington?" ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Jill Dunlop", "text": [ "I thank the hard-working member from Oakville North–Burlington for the question.", "Under our $1.3-billion plan, schools are being built faster and more efficiently so that students can attend state-of-the-art schools close to home and in their local communities.", "Since September 2023, 29 new school construction projects have opened. One of these was the new St. Cecilia Catholic Elementary School in the member’s riding. I had the pleasure of touring this new school with the member. We met with Ms. Palazzese and her students in grade 8, to participate in a STEM class that focused on how energy is transferred. We then went on to tour Mrs. Browne’s grade 1 class, to participate in a literacy activity to identify initial sounds and rhythm matching.", "Speaker, it is tours like these that make me so proud of the work that our teachers are doing, supported by this government. The students and teachers at St. Cecilia were truly enjoying their new school, and it was heartwarming to be able to see them in action." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Supplementary question?" ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Effie J. Triantafilopoulos", "text": [ "Speaker, I’d like to thank the minister for her recent visit to St. Cecilia Catholic Elementary School and for the response and the important work being done to support schools across our province.", "In my own riding of Oakville North–Burlington, our population continues to grow rapidly. Families are moving in, and with that growth, the demand for student spaces and child care is increasing. While we’ve seen progress, I hear from parents who are concerned about whether schools are opening fast enough to meet this demand.", "And it’s not just about building more schools, but about building them on time. We know that delays can have a significant impact on students, forcing them into overcrowded classrooms or longer commutes to schools in other areas.", "Can the minister outline how our government is investing in new schools across Ontario?" ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Jill Dunlop", "text": [ "Thank you again to the member.", "Since 2018, our government has approved or supported the development of over 300 school-related projects, including child care, of which more than 100 are actively under construction.", "In the member’s own riding of Oakville North–Burlington, our government has supported an investment of over $208 million for five new schools and one school addition, to create 4,541 student spaces and 352 child care spaces.", "That includes two new elementary schools and one secondary school addition completed and opened from our investment of $51.9 million, creating 1,627 student spaces and 88 child care spaces.", "And three new schools are planned or under construction, from our investment of $157 million, that will create 2,914 student spaces and 264 child care spaces.", "Speaker, our government is making historic investments to ensure students, not only in the member’s riding but across Ontario, are receiving the best education possible." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "I beg to inform the House that, pursuant to standing order 9(h), the Clerk has received written notice from the government House leader indicating that a temporary change in the weekly meeting schedule of the House is required and, therefore, the House shall commence at 9 a.m. on Monday, October 28, 2024, for the proceedings of orders of the day." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "I’m going to recognize the government House leader under standing order 59." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Steve Clark", "text": [ "Under standing order 59, I would like to inform the House of the schedule for next week.", "As you just stated, Speaker, on Monday, October 28, the House will resume at 9 a.m. and we’ll continue second reading debate on Bill 212, Reducing Gridlock, Saving You Time Act. In the afternoon, we’ll be debating opposition day motion number 1.", "On Tuesday, October 29, in the morning we will have second reading of Bill 214, Affordable Energy Act. In the afternoon routine proceedings, the Associate Minister of Women’s Social and Economic Opportunity will deliver a ministerial statement on Women’s History Month. Afterwards, we’ll continue with second reading of Bill 212, Reducing Gridlock, Saving You Time Act.", "On Wednesday, October 30: in the morning, second reading of Bill 212, Reducing Gridlock, Saving You Time Act; in the afternoon routine proceedings, the Minister of Finance will introduce the fall economic statement and will deliver a ministerial statement following. In the afternoon is second reading of Bill 214, Affordable Energy Act, and also private member’s business: The member for Oxford will have private member’s motion number 117.", "On Thursday, October 31, in the morning and afternoon, we will debate the fall economic statement." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "I understand the member for Toronto Centre has a point of order as well." ] }, { "speaker": "MPP Kristyn Wong-Tam", "text": [ "I do, Speaker, and thank very much for the indulgence. Earlier this morning, I wanted us to acknowledge a very special young man who is in the building, and I wanted to let you know that he has actually arrived.", "The special young man is 101 years old. His name is Sir George Beardshaw, and he is Canada’s last surviving British home child. He has travelled today from London, Ontario. He was a member of the Queen’s Own Rifles infantry. In the last 23 days of World War II, he and his fellow soldiers survived on a ration of two potatoes per day.", "For those who are not able to join us for the reception, please welcome Sir George Beardshaw.", "Applause." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "There being no further business this morning, this House stands in recess until 1 p.m.", "The House recessed from 1149 to 1300." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "I beg to inform the House that today the Clerk received the report on intended appointments dated October 24, 2024, of the Standing Committee on Government Agencies. Pursuant to standing order 110(f)(9), the report is deemed to be adopted by the House.", "Report deemed adopted." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Ms. Bhutila Karpoche", "text": [ "Speaker, in Ontario, 1.5 million people don’t have access to prescription medicine coverage, and that is leading to people having to choose between paying for their medicines or paying for groceries and other daily expenses. We know that medicine is an important part of our health care services, yet we have a public health care system that does not cover medicine.", "Through the hard work of the federal New Democrats, we finally have a federal pharmacare bill that is a first step towards a national universal program that would give access to contraception and life-saving diabetes medications. But the success of that program is contingent on the province’s support, so I have a petition here to the Legislative Assembly of Ontario immediately urging the government and the Legislature to commit to signing the national pharmacare program, so that all Ontarians can benefit from the coverage of these essential medicines." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Mr. Ted Hsu", "text": [ "Speaker, 24/7 family caregivers perform an essential service. They work so hard for free, doing things that, if we tried to reproduce it at a social level, would be very, very expensive. And we don’t even have the resources that we need, for example, in long-term care.", "So this petition, signed by people in my riding and originating from my riding, calls on the Ontario government to support 24/7 family caregivers, including through financial compensation, so that those caring for loved ones in our society and those receiving care from loved ones have some relief from financial distress and the resulting mental stress." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Mr. Sol Mamakwa", "text": [ "Remarks in Anishininiimowin.", "Good afternoon. I have a petition here to raise the social assistance rates. As we know, the Ontario social assistance rates are below the Market Basket Measure poverty line. We know that. Also, there’s been an open letter to the Premier and also two cabinet ministers signed by over 230 organizations to double the rate of Ontario Works. It’s important that we start looking into this to make sure that these rates have—to be able to live and spend these monies that are given out to these citizens who are living under the poverty line.", "So again, I support this petition. I’m going to sign this petition and give it to June. Meegwetch." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Ms. Jessica Bell", "text": [ "This is a petition that was given to me by Sally Palmer, who has been actively collecting petitions under the matter of raising social assistance rates. The petition calls on social assistance rates, Ontario Works and Ontario Disability Support Program payments to be doubled.", "This makes a lot of sense, because there are many people who are on social assistance who just can’t make it work. They’re living in poverty. It’s better to help them rebuild their lives than it is to continue to have them live in poverty.", "I’ll be signing this petition and giving it to page Jasper." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Ms. Peggy Sattler", "text": [ "I want to thank Dr. Sally Palmer from McMaster University for her tireless efforts to collect signatures on petitions calling on the Legislative Assembly to raise social assistance rates. The petition notes that social assistance rates in this province are well below what Ontarians need in order to lift themselves out of poverty: $1,300 a month for people on ODSP is completely insufficient to cover the cost of rent and food and basic essentials. The petition also notes that the federal government recognized that $2,000 a month was the basic amount that was necessary to enable people to live during the pandemic when they created the CERB program, which offered $2,000 a month.", "Therefore, the petition calls on the Legislative Assembly to double social assistance rates for Ontario Works and ODSP. I fully support this petition, affix my signature and will send it to the table with page Samika." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "MPP Jamie West", "text": [ "I also want to thank Dr. Sally Palmer for her tireless work on this, providing petitions from across the province on raising social assistance rates.", "Basically, what’s spelled out here is that if you’re on OW, Ontario Works, you make about $733; if you’re on ODSP, you make $1,200 and change. That includes the 5% increase the Conservative government often brags about.", "What we need to recognize is that the poverty line is here. Imagine you’re underwater; even with the 5% increase, you don’t get up to where you need to be above it. So the petition is calling for basically doubling the ODSP and OW rates so that people are not starving in their homes or being kicked out of their homes because they can’t afford rent, heat or hydro.", "I fully support this petition. We need to take care of people, so that they can back on their feet. I’ll affix my signature and provide to page June." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "MPP Lise Vaugeois", "text": [ "I have two petitions I’d like to read. The first is to raise social assistance rates. We know these rates have been—really, going back almost 40 years—pushing people into deep poverty. Nothing has happened to substantially raise these rates and the only reason people are surviving is because of volunteers staffing food banks and gathering food. So I firmly support this petition to, at the very least, double ODSP and OW rates, and I will sign it and give it to Ziggy.", "And then, the second petition I would like to present is for funding of supervised consumption service sites and consumption and treatment services. We know that in my riding of Thunder Bay–Superior North, 400 lives have been saved by consumption treatment services, and without those services, people will be dying and, frankly, children will be finding those dead people on the streets. It’s extremely important that those sites continue to exist, and so I support this petition and will also give it to Ziggy." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Ms. Bhutila Karpoche", "text": [ "Today in the Legislature, we had Raise the Rates host a rally outside. One of their main asks is to increase or double social assistance rates, because we know right now there are about 900,000 Ontarians who are forced to rely on social assistance, but the rates for social assistance have not increased significantly for a very long period of time. Those on Ontario Works are expected to live on only $733 a month. Can you imagine that, Speaker? You can’t rent a room with that, especially in an expensive city like Toronto.", "Those on ODSP, the Ontario Disability Support Program, receive just over $1,200. These rates are essentially legislated poverty for people, so it is very important that we provide rates for social assistance recipients that allow them to thrive. Of course, doubling them is the first step. We obviously need to do more. But I have so many signatures on the petition, from my constituents in Parkdale–High Park, calling on the Legislative Assembly of Ontario to immediately double social assistance rates so that people can live healthy and dignified lives.", "1310" ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Ms. Peggy Sattler", "text": [ "I have a very timely petition as we await the rollout of the flu shot and the COVID shot here in Ontario, to support the Stay Home If You Are Sick Act and to provide paid sick days for workers in this province.", "The petition points out that over half of workers in Ontario do not have access to paid sick days from their employer. Therefore, if they are sick, if a child is sick, they have to make a very difficult choice between staying home from work, giving up the pay for that day, potentially even losing their employment, or going into work sick and risking spreading infection to their co-workers and their customers.", "The petition also notes that low-pay, precarious, racialized workers, the most vulnerable workers, are often the ones who are most likely not to have paid sick days from their employer. These workers are particularly stressed by the difficult choice before them, giving up their pay or going into work sick, because it could mean not being able to make the rent, not being able to buy their groceries.", "The petition calls on the Legislative Assembly to immediately provide 10 days of personal emergency leave, paid sick days and 14 days of paid leave when there is an infectious disease emergency, such as we experienced globally with COVID-19.", "I fully support this petition, affix my signature and will send it to the table with page Nikki." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Ms. Bhutila Karpoche", "text": [ "I have a petition here entitled “Ontario’s Children Deserve a School Food Program.” We know that food insecurity is at an all-time high in Ontario. In the previous year, over one million Ontarians visited the food bank. We know that children cannot learn when they are hungry. Parents should not be forced to make a choice between paying for rent and packing food for lunch for their kids.", "There are community food programs, but they are struggling to meet demands. We need a proper program, and Canada is the only G7 nation that does not have a national food program or national standard, even.", "Finally, there is now a national school food program in the works, so this petition is urging the Legislative Assembly of Ontario to sign on to the national food program so that children do not go hungry; so that they have access to nutritious meals and they can learn well." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "MPP Jamie West", "text": [ "This petition is entitled “Petition for Funding of Supervised Consumption Service Sites and Consumption and Treatment Service Sites.” Basically, what they are talking about here is the epidemic of overdose poisoning deaths that we’re seeing in each of our cities.", "Almost 10 Ontario residents die every day in our province from overdose. Supervised consumption sites offer a gateway to supportive services that includes addiction treatment, so you are able to create a safe space, so they are able to connect with people and find treatment in the future.", "They are calling for funding to reopen the supervised consumption sites in Windsor and in my city of Sudbury. They’re also calling for funding to keep open the supervised consumption site in Timmins, which I’m assuming they are wanting to be reopen now, and also to fund supervised consumption sites for every community in the province that is in need.", "I support this petition. I’ve spoken with family members. I’ve spoken with people who have gone through recovery because of supervised consumption sites. I follow the science. I think this is an important cause. I’ll affix my signature and provide it to page Alessandro for the table." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "MPP Jamie West", "text": [ "This petition is very similar to the one I read earlier. It is about raising social assistance rates, and it really is about taking care of people in our community.", "This afternoon, we’re going to be debating a labour bill, and we need to recognize that people on ODSP very often are people who were injured at work, who were not recognized by WSIB. These people sometimes, because of the low rates of ODSP—when we’re talking about $1,368 for somebody with a disability, they’re often in a position where they lose their housing, and they are the people in the tents that you walk by. These are workers in our province on ODSP.", "Other people are unable to make it work on OW—$733. My colleague mentioned that you can’t find a room for rent in Toronto for that amount. There’s a sign in Sudbury that offers a room for rent for $800, so they’ve got to come up with about $70 just to make rent. How are they going to get heat? How will they pay for a phone? How will they get food?", "This is basically legislated poverty. We cannot expect people to get back on their feet and back in the workforce if, every month, they have to scramble to make up the money that is needed to make ends meet. We need to be helping people in society get a hand up, not a handout.", "I support this petition in terms of doubling the social assistance rates for both of these, so that people are not living far, far below the poverty line." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Patrice Barnes)", "text": [ "I recognize the member from Sudbury—popular today." ] }, { "speaker": "MPP Jamie West", "text": [ "Thank you, Speaker.", "I had about four minutes before we rose for question period to talk about this bill. I was just going through the six schedules in general. I went through every one of them on second reading of the bill, but I’ll just be picking out certain ones.", "Just as an update, I was at schedule 4. There are three not-quite-related items in there, but important items. One is to update the health and safety definitions to clarify that industrial regulations refer to an office, but not an office in a private residence. That helps. For people who are in health and safety, there are different regulations for different industries, and there isn’t one that says specifically “office.” So it helps ministries and employers and employees know the regulations that apply to them.", "It also updates the definition for workplace harassment and workplace sexual harassment to include certain virtual activities. The world, as we all know, has more virtual activities going on, and so I think this is an important step forward.", "It also amends the Occupational Health and Safety Act to include telework performed in a private residence, and it makes some changes there.", "There are also seven items about posting in an electronic format, which eliminates the need for physical copies. I’m not going to go too far into this unless there’s time later, because I talked about it a lot at second reading. There is a concern in here when it comes to electronic format. I’m not against it, but there are people who are not computer-literate. There are people who don’t have access to computers. There are workplaces where there isn’t access to computers and to online services.", "I come out of mining, and mining is one of those industries where newer mines are being updated with this service, but many mines don’t have any connectivity underground at all. And even those that do, when you’re out in the drift, you don’t have access to these services. This creates a situation where, for example, you don’t know who your health and safety reps are from the management side or the employee side in the workplace, so you don’t even know who to ask questions about when you think a situation may be unsafe to get feedback. That really creates a situation where we could have more people injured or killed in the workplace.", "We have been flatlined as a province at about 250 workers killed every year. As a country, we’ve been flatlined at about a thousand workers killed every year. And we’re not really trending anywhere; we float up and down. But having less safety systems, less safety awareness, less access to it is not going to help us be safer, in my opinion.", "There were some recommendations, and if I have time, I’ll get to the amendments. There were some amendments that were brought forward by the building trades council. That was a very thoughtful thing on it. It made a lot of sense to me that you would have it online, and then you would have to, as the employer, confirm that the people had access to it and confirm that they were aware of it. I think that would be a step forward.", "One of them, for example, is about how every year the employer has to provide the WSIB data for their area—testing results and that sort of thing. If you are in a workplace that has high WSIB cases—we talk a lot about mining. We were at Meet the Miners last night; me and my colleagues from all parties were there. In mining, for example, there are a lot of carcinogens that are there, and they do monitoring to verify what’s there. This could be the difference between people deciding to wear respirators to protect themselves or not. This could be the difference between pushing for better ventilation or not. These are things that workers really need access to.", "1320", "I’d be interested if there will be a challenge in the courts on this, because workers fought very hard to have the right to refuse unsafe work, but also they fought very hard to have the right to know. So when you’re putting things in places where they don’t have access to it, there could be a challenge to—do they actually have the right to know the information that’s available to them? Is it available to them specifically or is it—I was just thinking about the Hitchhiker’s Guide to the Galaxy. In the beginning, they hide all the documents downstairs and remove the stairs so that no one can go down there, but, technically, you can go to city hall and find them if you’re able to traverse the way there. These are things that I find concerning.", "As well, putting the workplace violence and workplace harassment policies only on electronic format: My colleagues may remember, this is one of the first things that the Conservative government did—not in electronic format, but they basically said you don’t have to post these in the workplace anymore. This is a serious thing. We are, all of us, I think, pretty aligned on intimate partner violence—lots of communication with the public over the summer, a lot of work done on this—very passionate. New Democrats want this declared an epidemic. We would have declared it immediately last year; the Conservative government wants to study it some more. We know that this is a situation that is happening, that there is workplace violence and workplace harassment—sexual harassment—that is happening. Having those policies hidden on a hard drive—any of us, if you look at our backlog of emails, as we’re skimming through and trying to sort through, you know how easy it is to have things just buried online and unable to find.", "That becomes a situation where we could do a much better job in making people aware of what the policies are. Those policies, as well, could contain links to the procedures on what to do. So when you feel like you’re being harassed, when you feel like someone has acted violently towards you, when you think there’s sexual harassment or sexual violence happening and you want to bring that forward, it would explain the process for that. Who do you go see? Who specifically do you talk to? Because if you’re in a situation that you may not want to have broadcast all over the place, you don’t want to go asking random people in your workplace, “Who should I speak to? Who has the sensitivity training? Who has the training to investigate this effectively and ethically?” Anything we can do to lessen that happening, I think, is really, really important.", "Now there is a thread, I think, in all the Working for Workers bills—this is the fifth one—to talk about washrooms. This one has 11 items about washrooms—11 different things about washrooms. They basically all come down to three things: They say you have to have a washroom, you’ve go to keep it clean, you’ve got to keep records of it. In those 11 items, it says that in various different ways. I’m going to get into washrooms in a second and talk about this more thoroughly but I think that, at the bare minimum, at any workplace, we would all consider that it probably has a washroom for the employees. That is not a major leap forward for workers in the workplace. That is not something anyone has ever come to my office—and I would challenge anyone to say, “People actually came to my office—I had a workplace and they told me the washroom was the tree in the backyard.”", "Washrooms are part of the building code, and the reality of this—as much as it makes the papers and people talk about it—is that all of this legislation already existed at least as early as 1990. I was skimming through the Occupational Health and Safety Act and regulations, the last draft of which was in 1990. There may have been alterations before that; I just wasn’t going to go back in the Wayback Machine and try to figure out with Google. The problem is that it is nearly 25 years later. As a flag waving for people, the Conservative government is saying, “Don’t worry, workers, we’ve got your back. We’re working for you. You are going to have a bathroom, it’s going to be cleaned and there’s going to be a piece of paper that says how often they wash it.”", "Honestly, if you think you are breaking ground, you’ve never been to the movies because this already exists in the movie theatre bathrooms. This already exists in any public washroom at a mall. This isn’t anything new for people, but it is a great thing to tell people who are not from construction and a construction background. It’s a great distraction for them, because there’s a sort of idealistic version of what happens in construction: “Oh, my gosh, they didn’t really have washrooms,” or “Oh, my gosh, their washrooms were never cleaned. Oh, they never had a checklist.”", "The other thing about that—this legislation is coming out, like, 25 years after it was last written in the Ministry of Labour regulations and the Occupational Health and Safety Act—is that in that 24-and-something months since the act and regulations were published with this part of the information in it, it means that if the government is retabling legislation that already exists, they have not been able to enforce washrooms being present, they have not been able to enforce washrooms being cleaned, they haven’t been able to enforce washrooms having a checklist on them. That’s probably why, in the public, people are thinking, “Man, those porta-potties are disgusting.” Because we’ve all been to the roadside ones, which are owned by the province. In northern Ontario, we don’t get the ONroutes; we get a porta-potty on the side of the road, and I’ve got to tell you, those things are disgusting.", "Honestly, it’s the Conservative government’s responsibility to maintain them clean, and they don’t do a very good job. I think a lot of people in northern Ontario walk past the porta-potty to the tree if they’re able to, because they’d much rather go by the tree than inside there.", "Interjection." ] }, { "speaker": "MPP Jamie West", "text": [ "You have none at all?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Guy Bourgouin", "text": [ "We have trees." ] }, { "speaker": "MPP Jamie West", "text": [ "Perfect. I’m living a luxury with my porta-potties. I’m so glad.", "Schedule 6—I’m going to get into this. The Minister of Labour and I, just earlier, were talking about—I think we had missed an intent here. Speaker, you were in committee with me. I worked in health and safety for almost 20 years. I’m very passionate about it. I have several examples of, as a committee, us coming out with great ideas and the outcomes not being so good, mainly because we didn’t speak to the workers who were involved. I’m very thankful for Noah Freedman from OPSEU coming to us and explaining how the WSIA—or WSIB; WSIA is the act—but the Worker Safety Insurance Board, the coverage for them won’t transfer over.", "I really believe the intent for us was to make the same coverage for the urban, rural—the typical firefighter with a fire truck. We want to transfer that onto the wildland firefighters, and so we did a copy/paste—I’m paraphrasing here; it’s not exactly what happened. But we put the whole thing over there. We’re not recognizing how different their work is and the exposure they have compared to urban and rural firefighters. We also don’t recognize how long their careers are, the difference in their careers and the impact that they have. I will get into that later on, as well.", "I want start with schedule 2. I’m going to go through this really quickly. I feel like I’m already speaking really quickly. This is the part I kind of call the “headline bill,” because it sounds really good as a headline. The Conservative government, they have a massive majority. Congratulations to them, but they could really be doing a ton of things to help workers. People are struggling every day in this community, and instead of tackling those root causes, we’re kind of colouring on the edges. Are we going to vote against this? No. But is anyone going to be giving us a high five and a standing ovation? Not really.", "I will give you an example: In schedule 2, the three items in it basically are, if you have a job posting—a public one only; for a private job posting, this doesn’t apply. But on a public job posting, you have to tell people if it’s for an existing vacancy or not. I didn’t hear anyone cheering from outside.", "The second thing is that anyone that was interviewed, you’ve got to reply to them—still crickets.", "The third thing is that you’ve got to keep copies for three years of any prescribed information you have. Not even my colleagues are clapping for this. They wrote the legislation.", "The reason I say it’s a headline portion of a bill is it sounds good, and if you are not paying attention—and a lot of people cannot pay attention because they are so busy working two or three jobs, bringing their kids to soccer or hockey—you hear this and you go, “Working for Workers? I guess so. I’m not applying for a job, but it sounds good.”", "But when you sit down and analyze it, that doesn’t do anything. It just doesn’t. I guess it’s helpful. I’m not going to vote against it, but again, no standing ovation for that. I cannot see anyone on a job hunt putting it on a wish list of the things they would want.", "I could see people saying, “I would like more information about pay transparency. I would like to see the wage gap being closed. I would like to see what sort of benefits are available, what other people in that field are making, specifically. What will I be making and where is that part for it?” I think that’s something people would like to see: the security. I think most of all, people would like to get out of these gig jobs, these short-term contracts, into full-time employment, where they have pension and benefits and they can actually plan a life and save for a house and make ends meet.", "1330", "Section 3 of this bill is what I call “prohibition-ish” on sick notes. The government describes it as a prohibition on sick notes, but I think it’s “prohibition-ish.” The employers can no longer ask you for sick notes—but there’s an asterisk at the end. They can’t ask you for sick notes, but the fine print at the bottom is, “only for the three personal emergency leave days that you are entitled to as an employee.”", "Most employees don’t even know they have personal emergency leave days—they have no idea at all, and that may be because things are hidden online instead of being posted in the workplace. You are entitled to three of them. If you’re sick, if a family member is sick, for an emergency, if a caregiver coming to watch over your children for daycare is sick, you can use a personal emergency leave day—there are only three; there used to be 10.", "The Conservative government, I guess, didn’t title the first bill they tabled on labour “Working for Workers,” but in that bill—let’s call it “0.1” or “0.5 Working for Workers bill”—they removed the 10 personal emergency leave days that we had prior to the Conservative government being elected. They said, “Let’s work for workers and get rid of the personal emergency leave days—scrap it down to three.” We’re actually the third-lowest in Canada when it comes to personal emergency leave days.", "The other asterisk, the other fine print at the bottom of this is that you can only use it for those three PL days—any time you’re sick after that, the employer can still ask you for sick notes, but even during those three PL days, the employer can ask for reasonable evidence. I know it’s shortly after lunch, so I don’t want to gross people out. But I don’t know what reasonable evidence of sickness would be. Some of the suggestions—the Ontario Medical Association came and talked to us—were maybe a prescription or something like that.", "The reality on sick notes: This is a cake-and-eat-it-too moment. They want to be able to tell the public, in a stump speech, “We’ve removed sick notes,” and have everyone say, “Oh, my God. Finally, someone got it. The Liberals didn’t get it. They didn’t pay attention at all. They couldn’t care less. Finally—it took six years of government. They finally got around to removing the sick notes that are just a waste of time and a burden for doctors—and it’s moving illness all around.” But they don’t notice the little asterisk, the fine print—that we didn’t really, right? We’re going to tell the employer, “You don’t have to, but you can ask them for proof.” For most people, their proof is going to be a sick note. What’s the other reasonable proof? Do you need a photo? It’s ridiculous. So it’s one of those things where you can say it but you’re not really saying it.", "I talked about the Ontario Medical Association. We were very fortunate to have Dr. Nowak come to speak to us at committee when we were reviewing this bill. The Ontario Medical Association has never been in favour of sick notes. There is a mentality out there that believes that people who are abusing it are deterred from using sick notes—that way, they can’t artificially phone in sick. I’m telling you, you’re wrong. I represented workers for almost 20 years. There weren’t a lot of them, but the people who abused it—barely an inconvenience. Do you know what you need when you need a sick note? You go to the doctor, and the doctor says, “The patient told me he was sick. He looks okay today.” That’s all they do. They don’t diagnose what happened. They don’t take tests. They don’t do anything like that. The person was out-of-pocket 15 bucks, back when I was at the smelter; it’s probably 20 bucks or more now. The doctor spends more time doing paperwork; they’re tied up with it.", "What it does do is, it punishes people who are actually sick. It causes a lot of mental stress on them. Those are the people who don’t abuse the rules. Those people, when they come in when they’re sick, spread illness. They spread it right across the city, because they get out of their house and take public transit. They ride a bus, and they spread their illness to everyone on the bus or—buses are in Sudbury; you guys have the subway as well. So you infect as many people as you can along the way with your common cold, with pneumonia, with whatever you have that’s communicable. God forbid you have COVID, because you’re going to spread that all over the place. Then you go to the doctor’s office, where there are vulnerable people—there are elderly there; there are new parents with their young babies—and you’re there, hacking and coughing and spreading your virus to all of them. Plus, whatever they’ve got that’s communicable gets to be shared with you, while your immune system is weakened; not only that, you take up a spot in the doctor’s office.", "So somebody who doesn’t have a cold, someone who isn’t just—“I have a really sore throat and my nose is running, and I know that in 24 hours, I’m going to feel better if I can just stay in bed and recuperate with some chicken soup.” You’re taking a spot from somebody who needs to schedule a prostate exam, somebody who is wondering if they have cancer—not a diagnosis, but they have a mole that looks suspicious, or they have a lump in their breast. People have serious medical needs. Because of the Conservative government, their spots are being taken up by people who are like, “Yes, I’m sick.”", "The final part of this, as well, is that we’re desperately in need of family doctors. Desperately, we need family doctors. I need a family doctor. I found out mine retired. It was an interesting meeting last year at the OMA, when I said my doctor may be retiring soon and they said, “Oh, no, he’s been retired for a couple of months now.” So I am without a doctor as well, like a lot of people in my community are and a lot of people in each one of our communities are.", "One of the things that causes that: In family medicine, it is an average of about 19 hours of paperwork—19 hours of paperwork. As New Democrats, we proposed a bill to have administrative assistants do the paperwork for them, effectively doubling the amount of time the doctor had to see patients. And quite frankly, talking to Dr. Nowak and other doctors from the Ontario Medical Association, they want to see patients. They don’t want to do paperwork. It’s not why they got into medicine. They got in to practice medicine, not fill out forms for insurance and not write sick notes saying, “This guy used to be sick, but not no more.” They don’t want to do that.", "So if we could reduce the amount of paperwork they have, they would be eternally grateful, and as somebody without a doctor, I would be eternally grateful, because maybe someone could take me on their roster. That would mean the same thing for elderly people and people with young children and newborn babies, that we would have a place for them to go as well.", "Now, I already talked about Bill 47—the first Working for Workers bill, I guess; they didn’t title it that. But they cut all kinds of worker protections in that one, including freezing minimum wage for two years or three years—I can’t remember right now. But basically, Bill 47 was the first time they really punched the workers in the stomach.", "I think that Bill 28 is another example, when they went after education workers—the lowest-paid workers, basically, in the school. These are your custodians, your EAs. Basically, these workers, as we met with them, were telling me that they were living with their parents or had to move back in with their parents. These were tradespeople who had to move back in with their parents because they weren’t making enough in their school. EAs and cleaners were telling me about using food banks, having to take their kids to food banks because they couldn’t afford to have child care while they were going to food banks.", "Imagine that, as a parent: You work for the province of Ontario, and the Conservative government passes Bill 28 to step on your neck. At the same time, you don’t even make enough money to feed your kids, and you don’t make enough money that you can hide the fact from your kids that you can’t feed them, and you have to bring them to the food bank with you. That’s revolting. It really is, and I want to pause on that for a second and let it sink in.", "Now, the amount of food bank use in this province for the last eight years has increased. In particular, as a labour critic, where I look every single time is to see if there’s been any change in terms of full-time workers using food banks, and sadly, it has not. Every year, the number of full-time workers, the amount of people who are working for a living and a primary source of income, using food banks goes up in the last eight years.", "And I’m 100% with the Conservative government: The Liberals dropped the ball on this, right? I’ll give them the first three. I’ll give even the first four. I’ll blame the Liberal government for that, because the first two were under the Liberal government. Let’s say for the next two, with the Conservative government, they had to figure out what the priorities of what they were doing. They had to meddle in the municipal election. There’s a bunch of other stuff. They had to make licence plates. There’s a bunch of stuff, really important to the people of Ontario, that had to come first before they took care of working people at food banks. But the last four years are squarely on your shoulders, just right here on your shoulders, because—I don’t know, you’re kind of at the wheel, right? You’re steering the ship. More and more people in food banks; tent cities and encampments all over the place on a regular basis—not super exciting, right?", "We could tackle these things. We could take care of these things. But the government doesn’t want to do that. What they want to do is table bills that say, “Hey, you can have a washroom when you go to work,” or that say, “Hey, if you’re interviewed, we’re going to let you know if it’s for an existing position or not, so you’ve got that going for you.”", "1340", "So the other thing Dr. Nowak of the Ontario Medical Association had said to us during his deputation with the committee—and the Conservatives heard that as well and my Liberal friends heard it as well. He said that the three PL days are very limited. Those are the days that were cut back by the Conservative government—again, Speaker, I’m just reminding everybody—cut back from 10. We’re advocating for paid sick days, but I think that a Conservative government that doesn’t agree that workers should make any more money than they deserve—or not even deserve; they’re opposed to any paid sick days at all, including during COVID-19. But I think restoring 10 personal emergency days would be a first step forward. Instead, they’d rather be the third-worst province behind, I think, Nunavut and Nova Scotia—I can’t remember; one of the Maritime provinces.", "But the Ontario Medical Association’s data shows that people get sick, on average, about 11 days out of the year. So the 10 PL days wouldn’t even make it to the 11 average that they’re seeing, but it would actually reduce the amount of illness that is spread around here. It’s spread around from people.", "It’s a frustrating experience for me because I had a job that was different than being an elected official; fortunately, it was a unionized job where we did have some paid sick days. But I have to say that, as a member, all of as members, we don’t specifically have paid sick days, but our salary isn’t affected if we don’t come because we’re sick. It’s not. We have that luxury. Also, our salary isn’t as low as possible like a lot of these minimum-wage workers who are at a Tim Hortons or a 7-Eleven or somewhere else where they cannot afford to take a day off work when they’re sick. So there’s something that we really need to focus on.", "I’m about half an hour through. I want to talk about the washroom section of this bill because this gets touted a lot. In the previous bill—I think all the bills really had a little section on washrooms.", "I have to tell you, I worked in construction. I did it for 10 years. I worked in mining and followed a lot of construction projects in the mining sector as well. I’ve always been interested in construction. My father-in-law has a little construction company as well, and most of my friends are blue-collar. We all have our favourite work boots and that kind of thing that people who don’t work in those fields typically don’t have or even know what we’re talking about. In fact, the member from Mushkegowuk–James Bay and I once, while the bells were ringing for a vote, were talking about splitting firewood and our favourite types of wood and the difference between—like, maple, for example, splits really well, while poplar is a little different; you’ve got yank it apart and stuff. The member for Oshawa just said, “This is the most northern Ontario conversation I’ve ever heard.” But I digress.", "There are all kinds of things about washrooms in here—also, authorizing the Lieutenant Governor in Council to make regulations to modify and supplement the employer’s duties to maintain clean and sanitary washroom facilities. A whole 11 of them—11 things about washrooms. Who knew?", "I can tell you, if you talk to workers, in passing it sounds really good. But if you talk to workers about this, there is not a worker out there who is saying, “My number one thing is bathrooms, man. I don’t care about the wages. I don’t care if I have a desk. Just tell me about your porta-potty that you’ve got.”", "So, basically, three things—11 items on it, and they say the same three things: You’ve got to have a bathroom, you’ve got to keep it clean, you’ve got to keep records. Kind of a high bar to reach; that’s most workplaces. I would argue every workplace would have it. Five bills—we’re going to clean those washrooms; we’re going to have a washroom—and it sounds really good. It sounds really good for people who work in construction and don’t understand that we already had washrooms. There was already a requirement to keep them clean. There’s already a requirement to keep records of them. So nothing has changed. Like I said earlier, nothing has changed for about 24-and-a-bit years—or maybe even earlier than that; 1990 was the earliest record I could see of this actually being legislation that already existed.", "I have a theory of the reason the Conservative government keeps tabling legislation that already exists. One is they go to a press conference and everyone goes, “Oh, my God, they thought of this?” They didn’t. Someone did a long, long time ago. But the second thing is, I think it’s a make-work project so the Minister of Red Tape Reduction doesn’t go out of business. They just keeping making more duplicate legislation and then he can go afterwards, “Oh, my God, there’s too much legislation.” So that’s my thought on it.", "But there is a higher bar than porta-potties, and there are a lot of places that want to do this already. There are washroom trailers. The trailer shows up. It’s towed in and it’s towed out. It has heat. It has flushable toilets. It has running hot and cold water. It has an area large enough to put your coveralls and your tools. Some of them have showers. If you’re in an area like mining facilities, for example, where the regulations require you to have a shower and remove all your gear and leave it—like, you can’t bring your contaminants home with you because, in Nova Scotia, children were getting occupational diseases and cancers that were brought home from the workplace—this is all available. It’s not a niche thing. There are companies that do this. It’s their bread and butter. That is the bar we have to get to.", "The building trades, during committee, they asked for amendments to include this. I don’t know why the Conservative government voted them down. One of the members, he had argued that it’s probably too costly to have these. Expensive, right? Can you imagine how expensive it would be to have a flush toilet? Oh, the luxury. If only we all had that in our houses. Basically, they said porta-potties are good enough for those workers. These workers who we want to attract to the skilled trades: outhouse—good enough for you, guys; good enough for you, ladies.", "Carmine from building trades said the members who voted against this and spoke against this, maybe they should come to a busy construction project and use the porta-potty for a week or two, and you see how exciting it is. You see if you want your kids to come there—or your spouse, or your friends. The next time you go to a high school, talk to them about the wonderful experience you had at the porta-potties that week and how kids should be excited to get into these skilled trades.", "The minister, on multiple occasions, has said we are bringing the same expectations from Bay Street to Main Street—same expectations from Bay Street to Main Street. I went for a walk on Bay Street yesterday—not one porta-potty." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Terence Kernaghan", "text": [ "No." ] }, { "speaker": "MPP Jamie West", "text": [ "Not one of them. I think they don’t have porta-potties on Bay Street. I have a feeling—I live a long way from Bay Street, and we don’t have porta-potties in our apartment either." ] }, { "speaker": "Interjection", "text": [ "I hope not." ] }, { "speaker": "MPP Jamie West", "text": [ "The member opposite said, “I hope not.” This is the point I’m trying to make to you. No one is excited to have a porta-potty. I want to be frank with everyone in this room: A porta-potty is an outhouse. That’s all it is. “Porta-potty” sounds better, but it is an outhouse. It’s a plastic one, but it’s a plastic shell with a plastic toilet seat over a plastic bucket." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Guy Bourgouin", "text": [ "If you’re lucky, they put an insulated thing around it." ] }, { "speaker": "MPP Jamie West", "text": [ "If you’re lucky. In the winter, sometimes they wrap it in a jacket, but it is not warm. It’s a tiny closet. I want you to picture this, because there has been a lot of conversation about how we need to have more women in the trades. You need to recognize this: You’re in a little plastic closet, about as big—I can’t use props, but about as big as the desk—not even to this wall here, so twice as big as my desk. It’s small. We’ve all seen them, right? Little tiny outhouse.", "When you’re there and you have to sit down, as you do, sometimes, you’ve got to wrap your coveralls over your legs, you’ve got to hope your sleeves don’t fall onto the ground—hopefully there isn’t waste on the ground, but, in the winter, there’s always snow and water on the ground, so hope your sleeves don’t land into that. You’ve got to balance your tools on your lap, because you can’t leave your tools outside because they go missing. That’s the dignity and experience. You’re sitting above a bucket of waste with your coveralls over your waist, with your tools on top of you, and the Conservative government is going, “Man, how can we attract more women to the trades? I guess porta-potties would be the way to do it.” I’m telling you, it’s not. I worked there in the trades in construction on construction sites almost 30 years ago. I was not attracted to the porta-potties either. They were outdated back then.", "The final thing on this, with more awareness about germs and awareness, you do not have a place to wash your hands. If you do, if you’re lucky, it’s outside. It’s a little pump. You pump the bottom, and water spits out about a quickly as you can spit water out of your own mouth, and you try to lather that and get it off. But at most places, it’s Purell, and it’s a pretty well-used pump that you don’t want to touch with any part of your body. But that’s what you get to clean yourself with afterwards: a little bit of Purell.", "I’d also argue that on Bay Street, they probably don’t have one-ply toilet paper that you can almost see through. Who knows? I don’t have a lot of friends on Bay Street. I have a lot of friends who work in construction, though, and they are not excited by this.", "Look, here’s the thing, and I don’t want to lay into this too much, but we’ve got to figure this out. Does anyone honestly think that you’re going to attract workers to any industry by advertising, “We have outhouses”? Do you think that if, in your ad, you said, “We have clean outhouses,” it would move the needle? “Not just outhouses, these are going to be clean. We have a checklist to ensure they’re clean. This is ridiculous. It’s a ridiculous thing to tell people. We are in a crisis where we need people to come into these fields and we are not offering anything to them. In fact, if anything, I think we may be disgusting people away from them.", "1350", "Anyone who was an employer who interviewed people or a supervisor who interviewed people, at any point, did you talk about how clean your outhouse was? Or, when you’re doing an interview, did you ever get to the portion where they said, “Do you have any questions for us?” and you said, “Yes. Tell me more about your bathrooms. Do you have outhouses? How often are they cleaned? Do you have a checklist?” Because that didn’t happen. It didn’t happen. Not once in the history of mankind did people say, “My goodness, I hope they have an outhouse for me in my workplace.” The reason I know this is true is because when I come here, I come from the north side where the park is, for Queen’s Park, and there’s an outhouse there. I would argue and—as my colleague from Waterloo would say, I would win—not one of us ever used that outhouse. It’s really close too, and if you think outhouses are cool and attracting to your job, get your assistant to go use the outhouse. You use the outhouse. Be a leader. Talk about how cool it is. In the interview, the next time you have an OLIP interview or an EA interview or an LA interview, tell them you’ve got an outhouse for them and it’s going to be clean—and documentation.", "I’m leaning into this because I want you to know that an outhouse is not a competitive advantage. I think it was in the early 1900s, up to maybe 1950, but it is no longer a competitive advantage—it just isn’t. It’s like telling somebody that you have a Morse code machine. It’s all right, I guess, but no one is going to be excited about that. I am telling you that everybody, in every other industry, has flush toilets and I can guarantee you that Bay Street has flush toilets. But on Bay Street, where people don’t work in the trades, don’t fully understand the trades—when my dad retired, he actually had a semi-retirement career where he would run construction projects for people who had white-collar careers because they don’t understand that trade, the same way that my dad wouldn’t understand accounting or being a lawyer or something. But because of his background as a blue-collar worker, he knew how long jobs should last, what they should cost, who you should be speaking to. He did almost a consulting thing for it.", "But people from those areas on Bay Street, they don’t understand what it’s like to be in construction, so it sounds like the Conservative government is going something. I can imagine the Bay Street parties with the champagne, where they say, “Oh, my goodness. They’re going to have bathrooms—outhouses—and they’re going to be clean, with a record of clean they are. Oh, my goodness, what a great job.” It’s 25-year-old legislation.", "Look, there are times in debate where, as different parties, we just poke each other in the eye, and maybe it’s not for the relevance, maybe we’re just cherry-picking things. But I want to talk about people who came to speak to us at committee. Line came from OpenCircle—she said 11% of women are in these fields right now. That number increased 1% in the last 10 years. Raly came from Toronto and Area Road Builders Association. They said one quarter of the construction labour force right here in the GTA can retire—right now can retire. The sector needs to hire and train 60,000 members. Finn, Adam and Rokhaya came from the carpenters’ regional council. They said that 20% of their members are ready to retire and they’re going to need 30,000 workers moving forward. Steven from the Ontario Road Builders’ Association said Ontario’s $198-billion transportation plan—the plan you guys are advertising all over the place, $198 billion. I’m hoping Highway 69 gets on that list, by the way; if we can’t four lane it, the last 68 km, maybe we can do like two tunnels underneath. I’ll go back to the Ontario Road Builders’ Association: Steve says Ontario’s $198 billion transportation plan needs skilled workers. He didn’t say how many, but tons. That’s a lot of money and that’s a lot of work that’s going to come out there—hopefully going to come out there. Andrew from ResCon, he said that 100,000 construction workers will be needed in the next decade.", "We know this, and I know the minister knows this as well, and all of us know this. We are the silver tsunami. There are all these different phrases for it. Look, Mike Harris decided at some point to start ripping out shops from schools. The Liberals didn’t put them back. There was that whole dearth. I was part of that generation where I was going to go into the trades. My buddy loved auto shop, I wanted to take auto shop to understand what he was talking about, and they were like, “You’ve got good grades. You don’t need this,” and they steered me away from it. I went to college, went to university and became an apprentice electrician. My journeyman, a couple of years younger than me, is picking me up in a truck; I’m paying off my student loan, right? Thank goodness for that guidance counsellor. Thank goodness for Mike Harris ripping out shops. Thank goodness for the Liberals steering people away from getting into it.", "But we are all aligned that we need tradespeople. We’ve got to patch this ship, but we’re not going to do that with porta-potties, we’re not going to do it with outhouses. We’re just not. We’re not. Look, I can hear it already, “Well, what would you do, smart guy?” I can tell you. I can tell you what a New Democratic government is going to do because, in BC, they’ve already done this. It’s a leadership role. You guys can cut and paste; you can copy it. It’s free. We have lots of great ideas that we give you.", "“Flush Toilets Coming to BC Construction Sites”: This is a news release that came out on September 5—right around the time we were reviewing the bill, actually, with stakeholders—from the Minister of Labour, a New Democratic Minister of Labour, a New Democratic government. “Construction workers can soon say goodbye to unsanitary portable toilets on most construction sites and can say hello to cleaner flush toilets.” So they’re changing the occupational health and safety act—not to have checklists, not to have outhouses that are cleaned, but they’re actually going to have “construction sites with 25 workers or more to provide flush toilets, hand-washing facilities and clean washrooms.” It’s a step above the minimum that’s here already. It’s going to come into effect October 1.", "The minister says, “We all know how unpleasant porta-potties can be, but this is actually a health-and-safety issue for construction workers.” That’s Harry Bains, the Minister of Labour. “We have heard clearly from the building sector that it is an important issue for workers, and it contributes to the sector’s ability to attract and retain workers, including women”—including women.", "And it goes on. I won’t read everything, but I want to come down to it, because Tiffany Madden, a female worker for IBEW 213: “I love my job, but one of the worst parts of going to work is facing the nasty conditions inside of construction-site porta-potties. These new rules mean myself and my colleagues will be treated with the basic dignity of having flushing toilets with running water, something that workers in most other industries take for granted. This is a game-changer for the construction industry and”—listen carefully—“could even attract more women to the trades.” That’s what we’re trying to do. All of us from all parties are trying to do this.", "This is another quote, from Brynn Bourke, executive director, BC Building Trades: “This regulation addresses one of the most egregious and long-standing indignities that construction workers have had to face in their daily lives. The requirement for flush toilets on large construction sites means workers building BC’s next generation of major infrastructure will have much-improved washroom facilities, along with running water for handwashing. A sincere thank you goes out to the provincial government”—a New Democratic government, goodness—“for bringing this regulation into effect and to the thousands of workers who fought for these changes.”", "It’s because they’re listening to the workers. I’ll get into it as well. You know what was interesting on this, just listening to workers? The Workers’ Action Centre came to talk to us in committee and they represent a lot of non-unionized workers. If you’re not unionized, you would have to figure out all the labour law on your own, so workers’ action centres across the province will help people do that—ridiculously low-funded, not a lot of support for them, especially from a government that talks about working for workers. I asked them, “In all these Working for Workers bills, these labour bills, how many times were you consulted?” Zero. Isn’t that weird? You would think, they represent all these workers—but, like, not once consulted? Bizarre.", "The other thing is, Laura Walton, I called her and I said, “Hey, how many times have you been consulted, the OFL?” She’s new as the president. So I asked the other executives as well. Do you know how many times they’ve been consulted on these workers bills? Zero. Crazy, right? You would think they would call all the time, but they don’t. They don’t. If you’re working for workers, you’ve got to talk to workers." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Guy Bourgouin", "text": [ "And they represent how many members?" ] }, { "speaker": "MPP Jamie West", "text": [ "Millions. I don’t know, about maybe 10 million. I think it’s 10 million.", "But we’re talking about the majority of non-unionized workers in these two different areas—can’t get a hold of them, and they would love to talk to the Conservative government and give them advice with their bills, pass legislation like they’re doing in BC under the New Democratic government.", "Don Wightman, board member of the BC Construction Association and president of PML—just in case you think it was just workers saying it was a good idea: “This is a positive change for our industry. We fully support this initiative so that our workforce has access to safe and clean washrooms on our project sites. This is an important step in providing a positive and healthy workplace for all of our workers.”", "Clive Yule, president of Total Energy Systems: “Without highly skilled and hard-working employees, construction companies cannot be successful.” This is a win-win, employer and employees. “These new regulations will give workers much better sanitary conditions that will help keep them healthy and productive while building BC’s critical infrastructure.” That’s pretty cool, right? It’s not even that far ahead. It’s just basically what we’ve got at home, you could have in your workplace, and it’s not expensive.", "1400", "There was an argument during committee that having someone come and have to pump up the septic system, it would be challenging, especially in Far North, remote work areas. What do they think they do with porta-potties in Far North, remote communities? That bucket fills up, man. They have to be cleaned and emptied as well. I’m not trying to gross anyone out, but we could do so much better.", "The expression “the least you can do” is not supposed to be “literally find the least thing that you could do,” right? We say it all the time. As critics, as shadow ministers, our role is to look for ways your bills can be improved, and the way it can be improved is stop telling people to be excited about outhouses.", "I’m glad I have enough time for this because I want to get in here: Section 4 is about an increase in fines. They’re going to double the amount of fines, and I wanted to put forward an amendment on this that, instead of doubling them from $50,000 to $100,000, we should increase them from $50,000 to $500 million. The reason I wanted to do that is because the maximum fine is never used. Maybe once in the history—I went back as far as I could. The closest I got was $32,000, so about $20,000 less than the max. So if you’re doubling it but you’re not using the maximum fine, put it high, man. If you’re going to write legislation for headlines—imagine the headline: “$500 million maximum fine.” You’re never going to put it more. Like, maybe it’ll be $22,000, but people who are busy, people on Bay Street, they’ll go, “Oh my God, they’re really taking this seriously.” And then you give them that little wink like, “Yeah, we’re not,” you know?", "So striking out $50,000, substitute $100,000: “We’re being tough on the bad bosses.” I heard it all. The previous Minister of Labour, he loved to say that. “Those bad actors,” right? All the time. The thing is that these fines are almost never levied. Any of them are almost never levied. You have to be so egregious to get any of these fines that the highest fine I could find, looking back—I went back almost 10 years—was $31,000 and change—like, two thirds of the way to the max. So, playing along at home, you’re going to increase it from $50,000 to $100,000, even though it’s almost $20,000 less than the max already—$30,000 is the highest that I had there.", "But when we looked at wage theft, Ontario workers proved that $36 million was stolen from them. And the outcome of it is that these bad bosses, these bad actors the Minister of Labour and the previous Minister of Labour like to talk about, got to keep $23 million of that in their pockets and their bank accounts, where they made interest off it.", "And that’s only what’s recorded, what’s brought forward, because there’s a lot of people learning that wage theft isn’t legal. They don’t know how to challenge it. They’re afraid to challenge it because they’ll be fired. Because I swear to you, if you have a boss who is willing to steal money out of your pocket, food out of your children’s mouths, they have no qualms about firing you for making waves. So you had to prove that it was stolen, so only that small percentage that were able to do that—$36 million came, but they got to keep $23 million out of it.", "The previous Working for Workers bill—speaking of doubling the legislation—had a thing about wage theft not being allowed. Yes, it already wasn’t allowed. It was already illegal before that. So it’s another headline bill.", "So when you bring it up and you maximize it, it doesn’t mean anything. Make it $500 million. If you are not going to give the maximum fine anyway, make it something ridiculous. If you’re going for the headline, just make it the craziest headline you can. Just pretend, right?", "Now, here’s the other thing. So on the one hand, this is like the sick notes, right? You don’t need sick notes, but you kind of do—same sort of thing.", "So in 2018—remember, I was talking about their first Working for Workers bill? They don’t want to call it that because it’s basically “punch workers in the face” bill, but they decreased the administrative penalties for violations of the Employment Standards Act. There used to be a $350 penalty. They dropped that to $250. The $700 penalty dropped down to $500. The $1,500 penalty dropped down to $1,000. Because, you know, if you rip off workers and you have to pay for it, it hurts business. That’s the philosophy.", "On the bright side though, for those workers who are getting money stolen from them—porta-potty. That’s going to be great for them. So workers get porta-potties. The worst offenders of bad bosses under the Conservative government, depending on the egregious fine that they have, how bad they are, they’re actually saving $100, $200 or $500. The worse they do, the more they save—what an incentive, by the Conservative government.", "This sounds like I’m pulling things out of the air on this, but I want to talk to you about a grocery store in Waterloo called Dutchie’s Fresh Market. Speaker, you would remember this. It stood out to me. Waterloo Region Community Legal Services and Joanna Mullen shared this story—Erica also shared a story similar to this. Dutchie’s Fresh Market employs young workers and newcomers. Primarily, over the last couple of years, they employed people fleeing Ukraine, the war. This is their first workplace experience in Canada, and they’re with a boss who’s ripping them off. What he would do is either not pay them at all—he never paid overtime but made them work overtime, in many cases—or he would write a cheque and the cheque would bounce, so not only did you not get paid, but you got an NSF charge, so you got to pay the bank for you to go to work. Dutchie’s, by the way, has flush toilets, so it’s probably why they get away with this. They have 15 counts of charges of failure to pay—15—eight counts of director’s orders to pay.", "If you go to Waterloo right now, you can go shopping at Dutchie’s because it’s still open. That’s how serious the Conservative government is taking this. The place is still open, man; not only that, but workers continue to come forward about wage theft, after the director’s orders and charges and court cases—they could care less, because the Conservative government is careless in enforcing the act and following through on this. They’re getting close to having stolen $500,000 from workers, and the place is still running like a clock. They’re still ripping off newcomers. They’re still ripping off students who are coming in. It’s a business plan, and it’s working for them because the Conservative government has dropped the ball.", "One of the reasons I think this is happening is because in that first Working for Workers bill that they don’t want to call the Working for Workers—the “punching workers” bill, the first one. Not in the bill—prior to the bill, actually; the Premier did it on his own. We used to have employment standards inspectors. There were 2,345 inspectors; the Premier cut that down to 788. When you have 788 and you used to have over 2,000, it’s hard to enforce these orders, and I would argue the reason you did that is because the Conservative government doesn’t want them enforced. The Conservative government doesn’t really care about workers, especially low-wage workers; especially newcomers who are coming here and getting ripped off as their first experience—I don’t want to put words in their mouth, but all the evidence points to this, and that’s a shameful thing to be.", "The amount of money that people are taking—I think it’s important. There’s no penalty afterwards, so if you get caught—the $22 million that’s still owing to Ontario’s workers. In estimates, I asked the Minister of Labour, “Why aren’t we chasing after this?” They didn’t really have an answer; they’ll get back to me on it. It doesn’t seem to be a priority.", "I’m telling you, as New Democrats, the number one priority is making sure that workers who go to work get the money they deserve; the second priority is making sure that workers who go to work aren’t going to food banks.", "I’ll tell you this: That $22 million is interest-free. They keep it in their bank account and collect interest on it. They can invest it; they can do whatever they want. But when they pay those workers back, there’s no interest; there’s no penalty. So if you’re an unscrupulous boss, why wouldn’t you steal the money? Just steal the money—the worst thing is you have to pay them; I already have to legally pay them in the first place. This is the business plan. No one on the Conservative bench will make eye contact with me anymore because they know this. This is the truth of what’s going on there.", "I want to remind everybody that the only way we know about the wage theft is because people jump through the barriers—it’s complaint-based; you have to make a complaint, because there are not enough employment standards officers able to come out and figure this out. So you have to feel secure enough that you won’t get fired, you have to overcome any kind of language barriers, you have to know this law exists, you have to know how to file it, you have to be willing to overcome the risk of losing your job—and feeding your kids. You jump through all of those barriers, plus more—there’s still $22 million.", "I have this great quote from Joanna Mullen: “Wage theft is the difference between paying rent or not.” It is the difference between your children having food and medication. This isn’t some tiny little thing. This is a major thing. You’re affecting people daily, and their kids. So she has asked for more enforcement and pointed out that prosecution was used minimally, that nearly 90% of the complaints—90%—don’t even get a violation.", "We need to take a proactive approach. ESA has got to get in there. If we can inspect all the restaurants in Toronto—you see the sticker outside the restaurant—we can inspect more workplaces for wage theft. It shouldn’t be complaint-based.", "1410", "And workers need protections when they’re standing up for their rights, because if you look at health and safety, the health and safety inspectors did 59,000 enforcement orders. The ESA just barely cleared 1,000. And I’ll tell you my hunch, because I have about three minutes: The reason the Conservative government doesn’t want to talk about wage theft is because the Conservative government is the biggest wage-theft employer in the province, second only to the Liberal government. Because the Liberal government, with Bill 115, capped at 1% the wages of education workers. And the Conservative government were like, “Hey, hold my beer. I’m doing all public sector workers—all of them. I’m stealing money out of their pockets left, right and centre. I am capping them at 1% even though it’s unconstitutional.”", "They knew it was unconstitutional because when they were in opposition, they told the Liberals it was unconstitutional. But then, when they came into power, they were like, Liberal, Tory, same old story. Same deal, right? So they passed Bill 124.", "Interjections." ] }, { "speaker": "MPP Jamie West", "text": [ "I hear my colleagues opposite heckling me because I guess they think it was cool to beat up on nurses and teachers and education workers and EAs—" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Guy Bourgouin", "text": [ "During COVID, by the way." ] }, { "speaker": "MPP Jamie West", "text": [ "—during COVID. And the outcome now is, it’s just over $4 million in lawyers’ fees that is not coming out of their pockets; it’s coming out of taxpayers’ dollars—on top. The same thing happened with the Liberal government under Bill 115. Taxpayers had to clean up their mess, coming out of taxpayer dollars.", "But that, I think, is why they don’t really care about wage theft, because they kind of like it. They’re doing it too. When the former Minister of Labour was talking about those bad bosses and he was pointing, there’s that old expression about the other fingers pointing back at you. He’s got three of them pointing right at him.", "And Bill 28, the one that stepped on the education workers—unbelievable the way they attacked those education workers and had to repeal it because of the backlash from the public. But Bill 28—I will never remember this because I was debating on it. I was very frustrated about them attacking these vulnerable workers, and the Minister of Education and the Minister of Labour, when it was passed, got up and high-fived each other. They were so ecstatic: “Man, we really beat the crap out of those workers.” Sorry. I apologize; I can’t say that—a little bit of industrial language came out.", "I want to get into wildland firefighters, and I wish I had more time. I could talk about this all day, literally. Now look, wildland firefighters: I mentioned earlier that we had missed the boat on this. It sounded good in the first place. Noah Freedman sent a lot of information the Minister of Labour has asked me to share it with him. I’m committed to sharing it with him. I’m committed to sharing our amendments that were voted down that would address this. I don’t know why it was voted down.", "The wildland firefighters are exposed to a lot more carcinogens than a regular firefighter. I’m not saying regular firefighters aren’t, but they typically will come with breathing apparatuses. Wildland firefighters have a scarf they can put over their face. Also, when you’re in a wildland fire, you can’t escape. If this building, God forbid, was on fire—but you know it was because half the building is marble, half is wood—if you get far enough away, the smoke goes away. But if you’re in a forest fire, it’s always surrounding you. These wildland firefighters, they don’t get to change their clothing. Sometimes they’re in the same PPE for 11 days in a row. There aren’t places to have showers because they’re in remote areas. Also, one of the things they do to ensure the fire is out is they stick their hands in the soil in the suit. The soil and suit are all covered with contaminants that get on their hands, and on their face, and on their clothing. When they’re sleeping, they’re breathing it all.", "Their season ends up being half the year because it’s hard to start a fire in the winter. The threshold we had on them is, you have to work this many years as a firefighter. But if you’re looking at hours, you’re never going to get there.", "The other part of it is, it’s physically intensive, difficult work with really low pay and not a lot of respect from the Conservative government or—" ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Patrice Barnes)", "text": [ "I also want to ask the member, recognizing that you did use unparliamentary language, to officially withdraw that, please." ] }, { "speaker": "MPP Jamie West", "text": [ "I would officially withdraw that. I apologize.", "I have to say, people in my riding would be surprised I made it this long." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Patrice Barnes)", "text": [ "Thank you.", "Questions?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Anthony Leardi", "text": [ "There’s a wonderful organization in my area. It’s called WEST, Women’s Enterprise Skills Training. They offer training opportunities to prepare women for employment and especially pre-apprenticeship in the skilled trades, trades like CNC machinist and mechanical millwright. This is made possible through a $1.24-million grant funding from the Ford government and this fantastic Minister of Labour. I met some of these fantastic women at the LIUNA union and training hall. LIUNA is a great union; it’s training women for lucrative careers in the skilled trades.", "My question to the member across is this: When is the NDP finally going to realize that women can do skilled trades just like men?" ] }, { "speaker": "MPP Jamie West", "text": [ "It seems like an odd question to ask somebody who actually worked in the skilled trades, who actually worked with women who are in the skilled trades. I’m very proud to be a blue-collar worker. I keep my hard hat and my work boots in my office as a reminder of where I came from. Saying to the New Democrats, who are workers and come from workers’ backgrounds, who are tradespeople, who have worked in blue-collar industry—saying, “When are you going to figure out that women can also do this work?” is a little bit out to lunch. It really is.", "I didn’t meet women at skilled trades to be able to point at them and say, “Hey, I met someone once on a tour.” I actually worked with women who were in skilled trades. I knew them long before I came here. I represented them as a worker safety rep in mining plants. So the conversations we have about having PPE that fits properly, I was resolving that in my plant long before it was even an idea on the Conservative bench.", "It’s a rich question to ask and, frankly, it’s insulting." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Patrice Barnes)", "text": [ "Further questions?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Sol Mamakwa", "text": [ "Meegwetch to the member from Sudbury. I know Working for Workers is not doing enough for firefighters. I know how you spoke about, towards the end, about Noah Freedman, who is with OPSEU—that wildland firefighter from Sioux Lookout. He says that these changes are not going to work for the wildland firefighters because parity is not the same as equity. In one fire season—you spoke about this too—the wildland firefighter might be exposed to smoke and soot for around 2,400 hours over a hundred days on the fire line.", "The question is, why do fire rangers need to work twice as much as other firefighters to receive even the minimum amount of cancer coverage?" ] }, { "speaker": "MPP Jamie West", "text": [ "The member brings up a really important thing. I am hopeful that we’re going to be able to address this in the future. The minister and I had a quick conversation about it—we missed it. I’m going to say we missed it because when I debated the bill the first time, I applauded having this tied into the bill, taking the feedback from the previous labour bill to address this. I think it’s good intent with bad outcome. It sounded good to us because we don’t work in that field and we don’t fully understand it, but when you talk to the workers from OPSEU, the wildland firefighters, they are going to have to work twice as long and, quite frankly, won’t be able to have the presumptive cancer coverage that, I believe, we were intending them to have—at least I was. I know New Democrats were; I want to believe the minister was as well.", "And so, we’re hopeful it’s going to be addressed in the future. Otherwise, I think we’re going to see a lot of them coming down here to Queen’s Park to protest like they have in the past." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Patrice Barnes)", "text": [ "Further questions?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Rudy Cuzzetto", "text": [ "I want to thank the member from Sudbury for his speech here today. He worked in the mining industry. I worked in the automotive industry and, to be honest, my son is going to become a mining engineer; he’s working for Kinross right now.", "What I’ve noticed over the years is that the NDP have lost their support of labour, and their eight unions are supporting our party now. What do you think has caused that to happen?" ] }, { "speaker": "MPP Jamie West", "text": [ "There are a lot of unions beyond eight. The reality that you have to look at, though, is that if you’re the government in power and your workforce and the labour union is dependent on infrastructure grants from the government, and money is flowing to you, you are never going to say anything bad about them.", "These eight unions were really proud of being part of previous governments as well, and they will be very proud to be part of any government in the future. That’s the reality of it. They are not going to bite the hand that feeds them.", "I’m not saying there aren’t union members who don’t vote for different parties. We know that. In every workplace, there are members from all workplaces who vote for different parties. But the reality, in terms of the leadership, is that leadership is never going to bite the hand that feeds them when you’re counting on contracts that add up to hundreds or perhaps even millions of dollars worth of work. Your job as a union leader—and I was a union leader for 20 years—is to ensure your workers have the best contracts possible, and that’s what’s really going on, and it’s basically going to be a fair-weather friend when the winds change.", "1420" ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Patrice Barnes)", "text": [ "Question?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Guy Bourgouin", "text": [ "Thank you to my colleague because you did a great job on this speech. But my question is this: As you know, I used to be a millwright by trade. I come from a trades family. When I was listening to the debate, and I hear grade 11 and grade 12 students can speed up to become a tradesperson, and I’ve seen even kids coming—young adults, because they’re from colleges, they come back—when you’re in 11th or 12th year, you don’t have the maturity to see, sometimes, danger. We’re talking 15 years old and 16 years old and 17 years old. That is very scary for me because I’ve trained a lot of young millwrights. I used to be a lead hand.", "But what I’ve seen is. there are good employers out there, who will surround them, but there are bad apples out there, as you know. My scare is that these kids are going to go into these workplaces and maybe put their lives in danger because they’re going to say, “Well, know what? There’s a job there. You have to go do it.” The kid’s on the job. He wants to learn the trade, rightly so.", "I’d like to have your perspective, because we come from safety backgrounds also, but I’d like to have your perspective because this is very dangerous if we have employers doing this with young adults—well, young kids." ] }, { "speaker": "MPP Jamie West", "text": [ "It’s a great question from the member from Mushkegowuk–James Bay. We actually met a long time before we were elected, when we were both sitting on the advisory committee for CROSH, the Centre for Research in Occupational Safety and Health. People who are interested in health and safety will know that young people are injured at a much higher rate than seasoned workers, and that people who are younger—this is why insurance rates for younger people are higher—have a sense of invulnerability. Also, you tend to be, as a younger person, afraid of talking to your boss. There’s that imbalance of power. You’re used to always listening to your parents, understanding what they want to do is safe. There are good workplaces out there. I think it’s a good idea to have people exposed to trades.", "Interestingly, in committee, I asked different trades unions about bringing them back to high schools. They said, “No, we’ve got to bring them back to grades 7 and 8.” Now, the Conservative government, I think it would be great thing if they did two things: One, return the shops that they removed when Mike Harris was in power and, also, buy back the 407 that they sold off when Mike Harris was in power." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Patrice Barnes)", "text": [ "Further questions?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Anthony Leardi", "text": [ "I thoroughly agree with the member from Sudbury when he says that as a union leader your job is to ensure the best contract possible. I agree with that, and yet there are union leaders in the province of Ontario who are not representing their members and who are actually ignoring their members. I’m thinking specifically of one union leader named Fred Hahn, who is ignoring the calls from his union to step down for his anti-Semitic behaviour and comments.", "When is the NDP going to stop supporting Fred Hahn and ask him to step down?" ] }, { "speaker": "MPP Jamie West", "text": [ "I appreciate the question. I understand why he would want to deflect from the bill, because the bill is pretty weak. The bill is missing the point when it comes to actually protecting workers. They don’t want to talk about the fact that in Ontario, for the eighth year in a row, working people are using food banks at a higher rate. They don’t want to talk about the fact that you’re not going to attract workers to the construction field by offering them an outhouse, even if it’s a really clean outhouse. They don’t want to talk about the fact that the wildland firefighters aren’t going to have the presumptive coverage that’s in there. They want to talk about a specific union, a specific individual that has nothing to do with our party, that specific individual and what they’re doing. It isn’t part of our party.", "Our job is to make sure that the people of Ontario can put food on their table. Our job is to listen to them when they’re being rent-evicted because of the policies that the Conservative government has. Our job as New Democrats is to hold you account and to point out to the table of Ontario what they’re doing in BC that allows people to have flush toilets in the workplace while this Conservative bench stands up, high-fives each other and gives itself a standing ovation for porta potties." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Patrice Barnes)", "text": [ "Further debate?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Tyler Allsopp", "text": [ "I apologize for deviating from the standard procedure today, but I would like to deliver my inaugural address to the House. My name is Tyler Allsopp, and I am honoured to be here today, delivering my inaugural speech to the House, as the newly elected MPP for the Bay of Quinte.", "First and foremost, thank you to everyone back home in the Bay of Quinte for supporting me and entrusting me with this responsibility. Over the years, you’ve heard me be a strong voice in our community as an advocate, as a business owner and as a city councillor. Now, as an MPP, I will use this opportunity to lift your voices and represent all of you right here in Queen’s Park.", "I would be remiss if I didn’t take a moment to thank all my colleagues for the incredible reception that I received on Monday as I took my seat in the Legislature for the first time. Thank you all very much. What an experience. It is, admittedly, a little bittersweet, though, to know that no matter what I may achieve here, that I will not be getting that type of reception again.", "I would also like to give a special shout-out to my wife, Jennifer. As many of you know, Monday was a big day for me, but my wife, Jennifer, had to wrangle three kids onto a train and get them all the way to Toronto, so it was a much bigger day for her. Darling, I love you so much. Thank you for all that you do for our family.", "Speaker, colleagues, this being my first address to you, there are a few things that I want to cover in my speech today. Having just come through a by-election, as you might imagine, I have a number of thank yous that need to be attended to.", "As all of you who are sitting here in these chairs know first-hand, to run a successful campaign at any level requires a dedicated and passionate team, and at the provincial level, it takes a village. I am so grateful for the village that formed around me to help me win this by-election.", "That includes all of my door-knockers, who walked with me 10 to 12 hours a day, in the scorching heat, throughout August and September. They worked incredibly hard with me to make sure that we visited as many people as possible at their doors, to hear their issues and to share our message. We went through many socks, shoes, bottles of Gatorade and tubes of sunscreen together, and we shared some great laughs about my comb-over tan line. Thank you all very much. That’s some real politician stuff.", "I would also like to thank our sign team who, likewise, worked many long days in the heat to make sure that we had the visibility that we needed during the campaign, and for making quick work of taking them down afterwards to return the beauty of the Bay of Quinte back to our residents, sign-free. This dedicated crew has served for many elections in my riding, and the average age is pushing 75 years old on our sign crew. My 63-year-old father was the young guy on the crew for that campaign. Thank you all for your hard work.", "Interruption." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Tyler Allsopp", "text": [ "I wasn’t even done.", "Thank you to our campaign office staff, including our manager, CFO, chief of staff and communications director, as well as all of the office volunteers who helped answer calls, process donations, organize the canvassing teams, print maps and all the other important tasks that you undertook to ensure our success in this campaign. This includes that morning, when I came in early, and asked the manager who had been working late on walking maps what time he went home the night before. He looked at me with bloodshot eyes and said, “Tyler, I never left.” Thank you all so much for your hard work.", "I would like to thank all the donors who took money out of their pockets to support our campaign. We greatly appreciate your support, and we could not have run a campaign of the size and scope that we did without your generous contributions. Thank you all very much and I’ll be calling you all again soon.", "I would like to thank the PC Party team for their tremendous efforts and the time that they dedicated to get it done in the Bay of Quinte. Your guidance, organization and assistance is so appreciated. I can’t thank you enough for all the hard work you did on behalf of our campaign.", "I would like to extend a thank you to all of my colleagues in the PC Party, as well as the members of the NDP, Liberals and Greens who came to our riding this summer to assist with this by-election. Residents this summer had an unprecedented access to so many MPPs from across the province and from every party. They greatly appreciated your presence in our riding. Thank you all for coming to the Bay of Quinte.", "Finally, I’d also like to thank the residents of the Bay of Quinte for being so hospitable and so gracious to everyone who came to our doors over this campaign. Every single member of our team took the time to tell me how polite and friendly my community was to them, and that means the world to me. I could not be prouder to represent the people of the Bay of Quinte. Thank you very much.", "As many of you will know, the Bay of Quinte riding is comprised of Quinte West, Belleville south of the 401, and all of Prince Edward county, and is certainly one of the most beautiful ridings in all of Ontario. Located less than two hours from Toronto, three hours from Montreal and close to the US border, the Bay of Quinte has become a hub for agriculture, manufacturing and tourism.", "Whether you come to live, work or play in our riding, we have so much to offer. In Quinte West, we have the natural beauty of the Trent-Severn Waterway, the stunning hills of Batawa and a vibrant downtown and business community, not to mention thousands of acres of farmland and CFB Trenton, along with the National Air Force Museum of Canada.", "1430", "In Belleville, there’s our vibrant and historic downtown along our picturesque waterfront of the Moira River and the Bay of Quinte, which is the setting of my previous job as a city councillor at Belleville city hall, which is over 150 years old and is truly the centrepiece of our beautiful and historic downtown. Belleville also boasts a diverse economy, with many great retail stores, restaurants and a thriving industrial park, home to some of the world’s largest brands, including Procter and Gamble, Amazon, and Kellogg’s. It is truly the economic powerhouse of our region.", "To the south of Belleville lies one of Ontario’s true gems in Prince Edward county, known for its endless shorelines on the Bay of Quinte and Lake Ontario, as well as its rolling farmland and many vineyards and wineries. It has become one of the top tourist attractions in all of Ontario, and it just takes one walk along the dunes at Sandbanks or down the main streets of Picton, Wellington or Bloomfield to see the vibrant natural, cultural and artistic hub that keeps people returning to Prince Edward county year over year. It is this natural beauty, bustling economy, thriving arts and cultural scene, and great public infrastructure, including hospitals and schools, that drew my family to the Bay of Quinte almost 30 years ago.", "You see, I was born just down the road, at Credit Valley Hospital in Mississauga, on October 13, 1992. My father, at the time, was—", "Interjections." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Tyler Allsopp", "text": [ "I apologize for 1992, everybody. I look much older, if it’s any consolation.", "Interjections." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Tyler Allsopp", "text": [ "All right. I’ve only got 12 more minutes. Let’s stay on track here.", "My father was a shoe salesman at the Eaton Centre, and my mother was home with my older brother, Joshua, where she worked from home as a seamstress and a dressmaker.", "My family moved to Southwood Crescent in Belleville, Ontario, in the fall of 1995, just before my older brother, Joshua, started kindergarten. They made that move in the hope that growing up in a quieter, closer-knit community would allow us to develop stronger friendships and provide our family with safety and security, and better opportunities for future growth.", "My mother continued her dressmaking and seamstress business and is a fantastic mom, business owner, artist and craftsperson. Today, she only does bridal gowns, but in those early days, she would stitch hemming pants, stitching life jackets—whatever she could to help us pay the bills. When I walk around my hometown of Belleville, Ontario, if there’s a woman coming towards me, odds are she’s going to ask me, “Are you Janine Allsopp’s son?” And I always say yes right away, because I know what’s about to come: “Your mother is the nicest person, and she went over and above to make my special day that much more special.”", "If any of you have ever grown up in a home business, you know that teaches you to respect boundaries. It was okay for my brother and I to wrestle; we just couldn’t do it on the kitchen floor when there were six bridesmaids in there for a fitting.", "My father recently retired after 20 years at Quinte Health. He’s a hard-working, humble family man who taught me what it means to draw a public salary. I remember my dad used to take all of the on-call shifts he could on the weekend. And even though if he had to go in for 10 minutes, he could bill for four hours, he would look at the job and go, “Jeez, that’s going to be a quick one.” He would head off to work, and we’d see him three and a half or four hours later. I’d say, “Dad, I thought you said it was going to be a quick one today.” He’d say, “Well, it was. But they’re paying me for four hours anyway, so I got ahead on some of my tasks for the week. I went around to see if anyone else needed anything and just made sure that the people got good value out of me today.” That was a really important message for me to receive as a young person.", "Having just retired, and being a humble guy, I think he expected maybe an empty conference room and a sheet cake. But when he opened that door, it was packed to the gills with all the people that he had gone above and beyond for over his career. My mom and dad ate out for about a year free because of all the gift cards that those people gave them.", "Thank you both very much, and I love you both very much.", "My first memory of Belleville was running across my neighbour’s lawn to Stanley Park, which is at the corner of our street. Though we were new to the community, our neighbours approached us to contribute to the remodelling of the play structures in that park. We were brand new, and my parents were strapped for cash after the move, but they obliged. And when the playground was completed, our names were etched on the stone monument with the names of all of our neighbours. Though we had just got there, we already felt that we were part of this community.", "There were some hiccups along the way, however. I was the new kid in a new community, with a last name which was seemingly impossible to pronounce. They called me “Tyler All Stop,” “Tyler Al Sapp,” “Tyler All Slopp,” and in one particularly egregious incident that happened over the PA system at Harry J. Clarke Public School, they put the S before the Ls, and though it would be unparliamentary for me to pronounce that pronunciation, needless to say, it stuck around for some time.", "I just saw the honourable Associate Minister Thanigasalam looking at me going, “Was Allsopp really that hard?” Fair point. Fair point.", "It was at this park, Stanley Park, just on the corner of my street, that I developed my first love, which was BMX biking. Though I did not know it at this time, this newly developed passion would have a tremendous effect on my life.", "Starting at 10 years old, my friends and I would ride our bikes all over town, looking for things to jump off, over and through, as well as ledges to grind and rails to ride down. Whether it was at Nicholson high school, behind the old Intelligencer building or at the newly built Belleville Public Library, I was what security guards rightly referred to as a “menace to society.”", "All over town at our favourite riding spots, we were routinely asked to leave and told to go somewhere else. It became apparent to me quickly that, in my hometown, for BMX riders and skateboarders, there was simply nowhere to go. Though other neighbouring municipalities—smaller ones like Trenton and Madoc—already had concrete parks, my hometown of Belleville did not.", "This incongruency led me to my first political action 20 years ago, to join a committee called Can’t Wait to Skate that was advocating for the construction of a new skate park. As the sole BMX rider in that committee, I got used to political heckling at a young age. Over the course of four years and dozens of committee meetings, by the time I was 16, our skate park was built.", "During the time, due to my passion for cycling, I started working at the local bike shop, Doug’s Bicycle. Once the park had opened, many of my friends wanted to participate in contests, but there was no one to organize them. So at 16, I started to host contests, not only at our local park but at other parks across the region.", "In my position at the bike store, I would call up suppliers and ask them to donate prizes. Since no one else was willing to fill the public speaking role, I also served as the announcer at those contests, which were my first public speaking events. Over the years, in Belleville, Trenton, Picton, Madoc, Deseronto and Campbellford, my friends and I hosted, announced and rode in more than 40 events.", "A few years later, after leaving college, I returned to Belleville. Armed with these great experiences and a passion for business, I ended up purchasing with a partner that local bike shop I grew up working at.", "As some of you may know, running a small business, particularly a seasonal one, is not for the faint of heart. It takes a tremendous amount of effort, dedication and sleepless nights. But it was an absolute joy, and just like my mother, I was doing what I loved for a living.", "Having found my voice, and with experience as a home and business owner, I took it upon myself to try to secure representation for young people in our area. I first ran for municipal council in 2014 at 21 years old because I felt that young people were not being represented, not because the older members of our city council weren’t trying to hear us, but because we were not speaking in forums where we could be heard and in ways that they could understand.", "I think back to my experience on that Can’t Wait to Skate committee, trying to explain to older city staff, who were certainly there to support us and engaged in trying to help, the differences between quarter pipes, bowls, spines and rollers. They desperately wanted to understand and help us, but we had to do our part to make ourselves heard and understood.", "I learned a lot during that first council run, and a lot of people in my community got to learn about me. Though people generally liked what they heard, in a field of 22 candidates where the top six were selected to serve on council, I placed 10th. Though it was not the result I was hoping for, it was again reaffirmed that there was a desire for youth voices, for new perspectives and for young leaders in our community. I just had more work to do.", "Over the coming years, I continued to grow my business and get involved, and in fact was awarded the 2017 Quinte Business Achievement Award for young entrepreneur of the year. When the next municipal election rolled around in 2018, though I was still 25 years old, I felt ready to take another run. Though I acquitted myself well and doubled my vote tally, heartbreakingly, I placed seventh in that vote and was the runner-up in that election.", "After the unfortunate passing of a long-time member of council, Pat Culhane, who was a phenomenal person, and what some would describe as an unorthodox appointment process, I was finally able to accept my seat on council in February 2021.", "After a year and a half of council experience, I ran for re-election in 2022. This time, I led the polls and was the youngest councillor elected in ward 1, and became the chair of the police services board, working out of the new police station just around the corner from where I now live with my wife, Jennifer, and my three daughters, Olivia, Everly and Riley.", "Interjection." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Tyler Allsopp", "text": [ "Thank you.", "1440", "The reason I told you all of that is to tell you this. If you are a young person in the Bay of Quinte or in Toronto or in any other part of this province who may feel unheard and who may wonder if they will ever get the things in their community that they need, my message to you is simple: Get involved. Because no one thought that the former menace to society, the new kid in town with the funny name, born in Mississauga to a working-class family—a shoe salesman and seamstress—and who found his voice announcing BMX contests at the local skate park would one day be standing here as a legislator at Queen’s Park as a 32-year-old MPP, lifting the voices of over 100,000 residents from the Bay of Quinte.", "This is the power of getting involved, this is the power of perseverance, and this is the power of standing up and getting your voice heard. No matter who you are or where you are from, in Ontario, there is no limit to what you can become if you have the audacity to believe in yourself, the tenacity to keep showing up and the conviction to not take no for an answer.", "Thank you very much.", "Applause." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Patrice Barnes)", "text": [ "Thank you to the member from Bay of Quinte. I’ll give you a second to really savour this moment. The inaugural speech only happens once, and the excitement that you speak of is only for today.", "We’ll move on to questions and I’ll recognize—no questions? We’ll go for further debate.", "Interjections." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Patrice Barnes)", "text": [ "Questions? Questions? Okay. I think you were very thorough, member.", "Further debate?" ] }, { "speaker": "MPP Lise Vaugeois", "text": [ "I’m here with comments on the Working for Workers in five acts—somehow, I keep misreading that. It reminds me a lot of theatre pieces. For example: “Much ado about something, but not too much ado about improving life for workers.”", "I want to begin by reading something that has come from wildland firefighters to my office:", "“Ever since the wildland firefighters said enough is enough in 2023, and began speaking publicly about the ways they are mistreated by this government, the government has been covering up their concerns with praise.”", "Recently, “Minister Smith of the Ministry of Natural Resources said, ‘You’ve been heroes in many different jurisdictions. You’ve made Ontario proud, Ontarians proud this season, and every season, and I want you to know that we’ll make sure you have what you need to answer the call for your province.’", "“The government claims to help wildland firefighters, but their response to problems are smoke and mirrors. This government refuses to recognize wildland firefighters as firefighters and reclassify them” from resource technicians to firefighters. They’ve been begging for that for years.", "I must ask my colleague from Mushkegowuk–James Bay, did we not have an agreement with the Minister of Labour that wildland firefighters would be reclassified? It has not happened. I’m very sorry that that commitment was not kept. It’s quite shocking, actually.", "“All they have been asking for is to be treated with the same dignity and respect as firefighters in our cities.”", "The wildland firefighters had three requests for this government regarding Bill 190. They asked for the peak fire season, from May to August, to count as a year of service instead of only counting as one third of a year of service. Now, there seemed to be some confusion that the bill already recognized service for wildland firefighters as being from May to August, but it doesn’t actually say it in the bill, so they are very, very concerned that, in fact, they may have to wait 20 years before any pre-emptive cancer coverage actually comes into effect. That’s very, very concerning.", "“The NDP put forward this common-sense amendment that the wildland firefighters asked for ... and this government shot it down. Why? Instead, they defended themselves again, saying they’ve done more for wildland firefighters than any other government.", "“How can this bill be ‘working for workers’ when the common-sense solutions workers put forward to solve problems get voted down?”", "That’s a very good question, and unfortunately, I can’t answer.", "I went through a great deal of the Hansard of the committee hearings and I was very disappointed to see that so many—in fact, all the practical amendments were voted down. So I’d like to move on from there to look at WSIB.", "Now, Steve Mantis, who’s an extremely articulate spokesperson for injured workers, gave a bit of a history of the WSIB. Well, of course, it was originally called the Workmen’s Compensation Board, and it was intended to be a non-adversarial system that would be an inquiry system where the bureaucracy would look into what happened and make a decision based on that.", "The system would have a collective liability so individual employers would not be dinged for accidents that might occur on their site, but that liability would be spread across others in the same industrial sector. There would be an impartial body to administer the act that would be arm’s-length from the government. It’s interesting that we have seen, over the last 30 years, 40 years, those principles eroded so that the system has become very adversarial.", "I’m sure any of the MPPs have heard from people coming into our offices how people are mistreated. Recent research from the Institute for Work and Health, a world-recognized body in workplace health and safety and worker’s compensation, found almost 50% of workers with a permanent impairment ended up with mental illness because of how they were treated by the decision-makers at the WSIB. Here is a public system that is supposed to be supporting workers and, in fact, in many cases, is making them ill.", "But I want to add here that if you actually talk to the workers at the WSIB, they are suffering from moral injury because no worker goes to work saying, “Oh, I can hardly wait to turn down somebody with a permanent injury, send them on the street and hope that they’re penniless and in misery.” No worker goes to work saying, “That’s what I want to do,” but that’s a requirement if you work at the WSIB. The reason we know that is because so many people are turned down at the initial application stage for support from the WSIB that when they go to the appeals tribunal, the WSIAT, almost 85% of those decisions are overturned either in part or in full. That tells you that the people at the front end—I am willing to bet that there are quotas, that they are told, “Do not approve these people because maybe they’ll go away, and at best, they’re going to appeal, and at least we’ve got six months where we don’t have to give them any money. We don’t have to pay any money, so we can save that money on their backs.” That is the crime of WSIB today.", "They moved into a system of cutbacks for workers. The system apparently is now overfunded; there’s some $35 billion-plus in investments. So they have been asking for improvements for workers. Back in the Harris years, the benefit level was cut from 90% to 85% of earnings. They would like to see that come back to 90%.", "The payment into the pension fund was reduced from 10% to 5%. Do you know what that means? They no longer are eligible for the Canada Pension Plan. They’re not eligible for the Canada Pension Plan once they stop working, so all they have is whatever has been put aside for them through the WSIB, and the WSIB cut that from 10% to 5%, which means that when they come to retirement age—poverty. This is legislated poverty. It’s no accident. Everybody knows about it. It’s not like I’m saying something that is suddenly new.", "The other thing that they were asking for was an acknowledgement that people are now working past the age of 65, and yet when you hit the age of 65, you are no longer covered for any accidents that might take place at work. So if you have a traumatic accident and you’re 66—so sad, too bad, you’re not covered. So they’ve been asking for a change. Now, not a single one of these things was changed, altered or acknowledged during the responses from the government.", "Another major thing that was brought forward was wage theft. Now, wage theft is a very, very serious issue, and it’s particularly serious for certain groups of vulnerable workers. Ms. Joanna Mullen brought this forward, and what she talked about was that fines—that there have been thousands of claims and actually many, many claims that are acknowledged, but hardly any money that gets paid out. The member from Sudbury was referring to this earlier in his remarks—that it actually pays to steal money from your workers because, chances are, even if you are mandated to pay it back, you’ve been able to get interest on it. But the reality is, it’s only such a small percentage of the money that is known to have been stolen that employers are actually required to pay back.", "1450", "I want to connect this to the situation for commercial truck drivers. We know—and you can look at their website, Justice for Truck Drivers—that wage theft is a huge issue for them, as is the lack of training. Some people will have seen the CBC Marketplace story called “Truckload of Trouble,” and one of the things that was of significance in that story is the lack of training. Particularly, new Canadians are coming over, hoping to build a life, hoping to have a good job, and they pay money for training, but they don’t receive the training—“Here you go. Here’s your licence. Here are the keys. Off you go. It’s automatic transmission. Anybody can do it. Don’t worry about it.” Then, they’re pushed to beat the clock; they’re not allowed to stop on the highways.", "You look at Highway 11, and there are soft shoulders. Guess what happens when you get onto a soft shoulder. Your truck rolls. Well, I was sent a photograph just about an hour ago of a truck on Highway 11/17 with a huge front-end loader that has slid off the side of the truck. How does something like that even happen? Because (1) the driver doesn’t know how to safely fasten it to the truck, and (2) because nobody is staffing the inspection stations that are 100% the responsibility of the provincial government.", "So vehicles that should not be on the road, that are not safe to be on the road are not pulled off the road. Then you have these same workers who are victims of wage theft, and you have this terrible, terrible situation with people on the road, without the training they need, not getting the money that’s owed to them, pushed to drive in unsafe conditions, and people are dying. Those drivers are dying; other drivers are dying when they come into accidents with them. And do you know who gets blamed? The drivers—the new Canadians. It is not their fault.", "It is 100% the responsibility of this government to ensure that people who come here get the training they are expected to get, that they are paying to get, and not be pushed through by unscrupulous businesses or things going on at DriveTests—and that’s a whole long story there.", "I’d like to just come to—because these things are all very closely connected—what we know about what’s going on with inspection stations.", "Oh, and I do have to correct the record on one issue. The Minister of Transportation said yesterday that we didn’t vote in favour of four-laning Highway 11/17. I have no idea where that came from, but people should know that the project of four-laning Highway11/17 goes back to the NDP government—every government that has been through, since that time, has supported the four-laning of Highway 11/17. We’re happy to see it happening. The NDP has never voted against it.", "So what’s going on with inspection stations? Well, what we know about the $30-million inspection station in Thunder Bay is that it’s almost never staffed, and do you know why? Because there are fewer than half of the transportation enforcement officers that were identified—this is based on 2011 traffic data. Some 264 enforcement officers were required full-time to strictly perform roadside and bus terminal inspections and motor vehicle inspection station audits. However, there are only 148 officers right now. That’s based on 2011 statistics. We have 148 officers. I’ve been told that there are 28 that cover northern Ontario, but what I’ve actually learned from enforcement officers who have written to me is that, in fact, there are no northern enforcement officers; they are being sent up from southern Ontario, so the ministry pays for their airfare, their hotels, their overtime. They come up for a week, are open for a certain number of hours, do their job—in fact, they do their job very well, because just last week at the station in Shuniah, of the 300 trucks that were inspected, 105 were pulled off the road." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Guy Bourgouin", "text": [ "That is scary." ] }, { "speaker": "MPP Lise Vaugeois", "text": [ "It is scary.", "We know that when the enforcement officers are there, that people get pulled off and, frankly, that saves those drivers and it saves everybody else. We also know that many of the new Canadian drivers are told, “You don’t think this truck is safe? Too bad. You’re taking it. If you talk back to me, that’s okay, I’ll just get somebody else. We’ll get somebody else new to drive.” And they’re not trained to do the mechanical work on the truck. They are so vulnerable.", "We know that the training needs to take place, and what we also know is that as of 2023—so, this fall, the training falls under the Ministry of Colleges and Universities. As of 2023, there were eight inspectors for over 500 trade schools. That’s crazy. That’s impossible—impossible—to be inspecting and doing what needs to be done.", "Now, again, I’ve learned from the enforcement officers that, in fact, that could be one of their responsibilities to go and inspect those truck training schools. There aren’t enough of them to do it. Why are there not enough of them? Because wages and benefits are way too low for the responsibility of the job. That has been known for at least a dozen years, yet, what’s happening? What is the government doing to address the problem?", "We know that the inspections are not taking place at the schools, not in the volume and thoroughness that is necessary. We know there are bad actors out there. We also know that there are excellent training schools and excellent companies. But you know what happens to those excellent companies? They’re undercut by the bad ones because they’re not paying their workers, because they’re stealing the money from their workers and they’re blackmailing them. A lot of these workers are hoping to get permanent residency status. They are not in a position to be pushing back against an opportunity to work. They are also trying to support their families. It is up to our system to make sure that all of those checks and balances are in the system, that those places are inspected.", "I have a request into the library to see whether that number has grown from eight; I surely hope so. You cannot possibly inspect over 500 trade schools of all disciplines with eight people. It’s an impossibility. We know it’s an impossibility because, guess what, people are getting put on the roads without training, and we know that.", "We know that nobody is at the inspection stations, that they are not able to do the work that they’re supposed to be doing. We also know that it’s a dangerous job being a transportation enforcement officer. You’re pulling people off the road when they want to get on with their business. It’s not an easy job. People can be very aggressive and you’re often out on the highway by yourself.", "This is entirely the mandate of the province to be looking after these things, to be making sure our highways are safe, that the drivers on them have been trained, that drivers have received the training that they’ve paid for, and that nobody is cutting corners and nobody is allowed to cut corners. We need to be standing up for those drivers as workers and looking after their health and safety. If we do that, then we are also looking after our own health and safety—anybody else who is using the highways.", "Once again, I will point out that, right now, as we speak, there’s a front-end loader that slid off the back of a truck, which is blocking the main thoroughfare, the way that people get to hospitals, get to appointments. All the North Shore, all Highway 11, they all come into Thunder Bay.", "1500", "I want to say one more thing about this inspection station because we often hear, “No, we depend on the element of surprise when we have these inspection stations,” but the reality of the station in Shuniah, just outside Thunder Bay, is that it’s only one way to come through. Everyone who comes from the highway going west across the country must stop at that station if they’re asked to stop. They have no choice. There’s no alternate route. That station could be open 24/7 and no problem because the drivers have to go. It doesn’t matter if they’re on the phone to each other saying, “Oh, boy, you better watch out. Drive a different route so you don’t have to go through the inspection station.” They have to go through it. They have to pass that route. Frankly, it works even better when there are people from the OPP and MTO on the other side of the highway also pulling people off who are travelling east.", "These are things that can be fixed. We don’t see the government addressing them and it is the reason, frankly, that I get so much mail and so many phone calls about safety conditions on our highways. And 100% of the control over this situation lies with the provincial government; 100% of it lies with actually paying workers appropriate wages and benefits for the responsibility of the jobs that they are undertaking on our behalf.", "I will stop there. Thank you very much." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Patrice Barnes)", "text": [ "Questions?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. John Jordan", "text": [ "Last week, I attended a women’s economic security program announcement in Kingston, St. Lawrence College, and that was for the expansion of the women’s welding program. So, a real effort by this government to move, or facilitate, I guess, is the right word, women moving into the trades in a very successful way. So we certainly want to thank the minister for women’s social and economic opportunity and the Associate Minister of Women’s Social and Economic Opportunity. I want to thank the Minister of Labour, Immigration, Training and Skills Development, and the Minister of Colleges and Universities for those.", "My question to the member opposite is—we have training for these women and then we have to provide a work environment that’s conducive so they feel comfortable going into those work positions. Would you agree that this bill is another great step forward towards that?" ] }, { "speaker": "MPP Lise Vaugeois", "text": [ "I would like to say that it’s a step forward in that direction. I’m not sure that it is. I don’t see anything substantive that makes workplaces safer for women, but also, as we heard from the member for Sudbury, when you don’t have clean washrooms and there’s no commitment to having anything better than porta-potties, it’s not a great environment, frankly, for anybody to go into, but certainly young women are going to think twice." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Patrice Barnes)", "text": [ "Further questions?" ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Bhutila Karpoche", "text": [ "I’d like to thank the member from Thunder Bay–Superior North for her presentation and also for all of her work in advocating for proper training for truck drivers and also for helping expose the fraud that’s happening in terms of training centres not providing the right training, taking people’s money and, frankly, putting everybody who uses these roads and drives these trucks at risk.", "My question is around food insecurity. We have seen food insecurity rise. More than one million Ontarians access food banks, and when you look at who is accessing food banks, the sharpest increase has been in workers, people who have full-time jobs and still cannot afford to eat.", "Can the member please explain what the government could be doing better to support workers not having to choose between paying for housing and other living expenses and being able to afford to buy groceries? Thank you." ] }, { "speaker": "MPP Lise Vaugeois", "text": [ "Thank you very much for the question. It’s been extremely distressing to see the thousands and thousands of people, including working people, who are accessing food banks now. We went through Bill 124, where the government spent enormous amounts of money to fight workers in court on an unconstitutional bill. We saw Bill 28. We are seeing workers in so many areas who are desperately underpaid, who don’t make enough to keep a roof over their heads.", "This all comes down to, frankly, policies and the kind of atmosphere and treatment that the government subjects certain kinds of workers to. We talk about the trades, but we don’t talk about the health care workers. We don’t talk about the education workers, who are desperately underpaid, and then, as I’ve given the example of, the transportation enforcement officers. We have these gaps. The pay isn’t there. It’s no wonder that we’re having trouble filling work, and it’s certainly a crime that we have seen poverty at the level of the 1930s Depression on our streets with the number of tent cities and people having to use them." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Patrice Barnes)", "text": [ "Further questions?" ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Christine Hogarth", "text": [ "Thank you to the member opposite for the remarks. I was sad to hear about the training piece, because I’ll tell you, through the SDF, which is the Skills Development Fund, it’s $1.1 billion that the minister and this government is putting towards families, allowing young people to get trained. We want people to get trained. You shouldn’t have voted against it.", "I’ll tell you an example. I was at an event, the 10-year anniversary in my riding of an amazing place called Building Up. Their sole purpose is to train young people in precarious situations to have jobs. If you heard the stories that these young people told me about getting a job, getting that experience and going to work every day so they can put food on their table—why don’t you vote for some of these important initiatives that this government has? What do you want to say to those women and men at Building Up who now have a job and are able to feed their families?" ] }, { "speaker": "MPP Lise Vaugeois", "text": [ "We know the government loves to put poison pills into every single bill. If we’re voting against it, it is because it is harming people at some other level. It’s fantastic if those people are getting work, are able to put food on—for their families. Why is the government not hiring the inspectors needed to make sure that people who want to train to be professional truck drivers are not getting ripped off and put on the highway without proper training? Why for one group are you ready to do it, but for another group you’re ready to throw them literally under their tractor-trailers?" ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Patrice Barnes)", "text": [ "Question?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Guy Bourgouin", "text": [ "Thank you to my colleague for your speech. I come from northern Ontario, and Highway 11, for me, is extremely important. We brought a lot of bills that they speak about voting against. I can tell you they voted against Chad’s Law. They voted about cleaning Highways 11 and 17, which is a major artery. They voted against a class 1, which should be the same as class 400.", "To get back to the trucking industry, when we see the marketplace and what’s happening with the MELT situation, that the companies are bypassing and then taking advantage of truck drivers, it’s not the truck drivers’ fault, but it is our responsibility to make sure they get the appropriate training because when they hit the highways behind an 18-wheeler and then they have to come face to face, if you’re in a car or in a truck, you will be the losing part of it, and it may cost your life. There was one that lost his life in Thunder Bay.", "I want you to expand more on this because we live it on a day-to-day basis in northern Ontario." ] }, { "speaker": "MPP Lise Vaugeois", "text": [ "Thank you to the member from Mushkegowuk–James Bay. There was a very horrific accident quite recently on Highway 11/17. It was closed for 12 hours. There was an enormous fire. Two vehicles burnt to a crisp. The driver of the smaller vehicle was killed on impact. This was a collision with a commercial truck, in fact, locally owned in Thunder Bay, and not a new driver, but possibly a driver under the influence. We don’t know that for sure. It’s all under investigation, a horrific accident.", "What if those inspection stations were actually open on a regular basis? What if that truck had been stopped before? I’ll tell you the one thing that that driver did: pass on the double yellow line in a construction zone.", "1510" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Guy Bourgouin", "text": [ "They voted against it." ] }, { "speaker": "MPP Lise Vaugeois", "text": [ "You voted against actually making Ontario in alignment with the rest of the country—" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Guy Bourgouin", "text": [ "North America." ] }, { "speaker": "MPP Lise Vaugeois", "text": [ "—North America, to say that passing on a double line should be illegal. Right now, in Ontario, it’s a suggestion. Had that been in place, perhaps that driver would not have made such a terrible, terrible decision." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Patrice Barnes)", "text": [ "Question?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Rudy Cuzzetto", "text": [ "As most of you know, I worked in the auto industry in 1986 and I remember seeing the first woman electrician at the Ford plant, and my former boss, Nicole Stoetzel, is now the assistant plant manager at the Ford plant in Oakville. I’ve been talking to a lot of young women in my community that want to get into the trades and they’re saying thank you to this minister that’s been able to get them into the trades.", "I want to know why the member here is so against getting women into the trades in the province of Ontario." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Patrice Barnes)", "text": [ "Quick response." ] }, { "speaker": "MPP Lise Vaugeois", "text": [ "I’m sorry, Speaker, sometimes the questions are so preposterous. I think that, perhaps, we should have Pinocchio’s nose growing every time that kind of question is posed." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Patrice Barnes)", "text": [ "I will ask the member to withdraw that unparliamentary statement." ] }, { "speaker": "MPP Lise Vaugeois", "text": [ "I will withdraw. The point is, of course, we as a party, and I as an individual have never opposed women in trades. I’m of an age to have known women who were in the trades a long time ago and had a pretty rough time. I am happy to see that on all sides we are trying to create workplaces that will welcome women, welcome the kind of contribution that women can bring to a workplace, and we support that." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Patrice Barnes)", "text": [ "Further debate?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. John Fraser", "text": [ "It’s a pleasure to rise in the chamber once again. It’s the first time I’ve done this since last June. That was a while ago, eh, guys? But it feels like we never left. I’m happy to speak to this bill because there are some measures in the bill that I really agree with. Some of the stuff is codifying stuff that is already there. That’s kind of what we’ve seen in these Working for Workers acts. I’m not complaining about it, just pointing it out.", "I think the focus on apprenticeships in high schools is really important. I agree with that. I thank the minister for doing that. It’s the right thing to do.", "The thing where I—and I don’t want to go into what the member from Sudbury was going into, in terms of his debate. There are some things here that—you know, they’re talking about stronger protections for workers. While I appreciate that, on five occasions, I’ve put forward a bill that talks about fairness for people working in residential care settings, whether that’s a retirement home or a group home or a youth correctional facility. The fairness is—those folks aren’t covered by WSIB. They don’t have the same workplace protections as other people working in residential care that’s provincially run, provincially owned.", "So when they talk about protecting women, largely these PSWs, DSWs and other workers are mostly women, and they work jobs where there is significant risk. If they were covered by WSIB, they’d have good coverage—number one—but they’d also be covered for more than just the job that they were injured at, if they had more than one job. Many of them have more than one job. When we talk about protecting workers and promoting women, I think not voting against this bill—number one—which the government has done twice now, really, it makes it hard to believe that they’re serious about protecting employees and promoting women. It’s a very simple bill. It’s a very straightforward bill and I encouraged multiple ministers who are open to it, but for some reason, the government doesn’t do it.", "I think it’s hard for the government to toot its horn and say they’re doing this on one hand when we have this very, very unfair situation for mostly women, personal support workers, developmental service workers, youth correctional workers, dietitians and other people working in these circumstances.", "I just want to point that out. I think you have to have some sort of measure or modicum that says, “We’re doing these good things,” but let’s not make them something larger than they actually are, which is another one of the challenges with the bill.", "The second thing that I would like to say I’m happy to see, but I think it’s a bit of an overstatement, is prohibiting mandatory doctors’ notes. If we remember the history on doctors’ notes here, when the government came in, we went back to doctors’ notes. The pandemic hit, the government continued to require doctors’ notes, until it became absolutely obvious that it was the wrong thing to do. So, they prohibited doctors’ notes.", "The pandemic ended. What happened? Anybody guess? They brought doctors’ notes back.", "Finally, four or five years later, this is being done, and it’s a good thing. Here’s the problem: It’s kind of moot, in a sense. It’s moot because 2.5 million people don’t have a family doctor that could write a note, even if we required one. That’s the irony of the whole thing, right? You can’t find someone to sign a note for you. It’s a big problem.", "I’m glad we’re doing this, but we’re not fixing the other problem: the millions of people in this province who don’t have a family doctor—2.5 million. There are five million Canadians that don’t have a family doctor. Half of them are in the province of Ontario, even though we’re only 36%, 37% of the population. We have a problem. This is a problem.", "The doctors’ notes, it got fixed. Doctors, they’re a bigger problem. They demand more attention. The government’s refusing to focus on that, and the minister even says, “I think things are okay.” Well, they’re not okay.", "If you don’t have a family doctor, it’s hard to stay healthy. If you have a chronic disease, like diabetes or a heart condition, you need a family doctor. If you’re at risk for cancer, heart disease or stroke, if you don’t have a family doctor, you don’t have a way to get into the care that you need or an easier way to get into the care that you need. You have to go through the emergency room.", "I would just encourage all members—I know I keep talking about family doctors—to know how many people don’t have family doctors in your riding, because I know. I know I have 21,000, so that means one of every six people I meet in my riding doesn’t have a family doctor—one out of six. It’s the same or worse for many of us in this place. It’s a really serious situation.", "I congratulate the minister again on prohibiting doctors’ notes. Let’s just get some doctors and nurse practitioners so that we can make sure that people have the basic things that, when we come here, we promise that we’ll do for them: We’ll take care of their health. That’s important.", "I also want to commend the ministry for expanding the definition of workplace harassment to include virtual harassment. We all know that these things and our other devices—we spend a lot of time on them. We communicate to each other that way. There’s a lot of risk in communications over a device like that. You can harass people; you can bother people. I know the government has done some legislation—the legislation passed here around about when you can email people—not that that stuff ever works, but it’s an effort, right? That’s a good thing.", "The thing that’s actually, again, ironic with this is—and the House leader would know this, and the minister would know this, and, actually, the other side would know this—that we’ve been trying to make sure that in municipal workplaces, people are protected. We saw what has happened in Ottawa. We saw what has happened around the province. The government voted for my colleague from Orléans’ bill the first time around. The House leader supported it. We were going to write some legislation—didn’t happen. We brought forward the bill again; the government voted against it—not a priority. I don’t believe that members on the other side don’t think it’s a priority, and I don’t believe the House leader doesn’t think it’s a priority. I don’t believe that they don’t think it’s the right thing to do. But it’s not getting done, and there’s a reason for that. That reason might be in the front row.", "1520" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Steve Clark", "text": [ "Point of order, Speaker." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Patrice Barnes)", "text": [ "Point of order. I recognize the government House leader." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Steve Clark", "text": [ "Thanks, Speaker. Through you, to the member: I say enough in this House without you putting words in my mouth, so just stick to your knitting, my friend." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Patrice Barnes)", "text": [ "The member from Ottawa South." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. John Fraser", "text": [ "In any event, the government voted for the bill at the time.", "You all stood up and voted for the bill, so if that’s not an indication of support, I don’t know what is. If your intent was to look good and not do anything—that might have been a possibility; I wouldn’t put that on you, just like I wouldn’t put words in your mouth.", "Why don’t we pass that bill? Why haven’t we passed that bill? The reason might be in the front row, but that’s not a good-enough reason.", "People are at risk in municipal workplaces because there’s stuff that happens there that would never, ever happen here or never happen at your local Sobeys or your Loblaws or any other workplace—and we’re not tolerating online harassment here, but we’re tolerating that. How does that figure? How can we do that?", "So make sure that workers in residential care have access to WSIB, number one. Let’s get doctors, so, now, even though we don’t require sick notes—that people have access to the care that they need. And if we’re serious about harassment—it’s not just the member from Orléans; it’s the member from Niagara Centre. He’s got a bill as well. And we all agree on this. So why can’t we do it?", "I thank the minister for bringing forward the bill. Like I said, there’s stuff that’s very supportable in this. Some of the stuff is just—it’s supportable, but it’s just codifying regulation. I just think we need to go further than we’re going in the bill, and I wanted to express that here today.", "I think that’s all I have to say. And you’re all happy about that, right?" ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Patrice Barnes)", "text": [ "Questions?" ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Natalie Pierre", "text": [ "This bill creates pathways for Ontarians to enter the skilled trades, including through programs like OYAP and FAST, and also provides support for second-chance workers, for second-career individuals, and it’s backed by historic investments in workforce training.", "While we’re investing and building a skilled workforce, the federal Liberal counterparts have cut over $230 million from labour market transfer agreements, and those are funds that support employment services and workforce development. So I’m asking if the member opposite would call on their federal colleagues to reverse these cuts and stand with workers by supporting this bill and the training programs that it supports." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. John Fraser", "text": [ "If I was worried—my job is here—it’s you folks on the other side. So what I really want to say is, don’t spend the billion dollars on getting booze in the corner stores a year early because you want to have an election. Don’t spend $3 billion on handing out cheques. Don’t spend it. Spend it on the things like you’re talking about that are important, and I know you want those things that are important. Spend it on things like the 21,000 people in Etobicoke–Lakeshore that don’t have a family doctor. That’s what I’m trying to say here. I know you want those people to have a family doctor. I know you do. I don’t doubt that you do. That’s the point of my debate." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Patrice Barnes)", "text": [ "Further questions?" ] }, { "speaker": "MPP Jamie West", "text": [ "Thank you to the member for Ottawa South on his debate. He was talking about a bill that had to do with harassment in city council and how it passed and is just in limbo right now and maybe won’t come back, and how it would affect workers immediately today.", "I’m curious as well, because I had a motion about just recognizing Injured Workers Day—that actually started here at Queen’s Park. We’ve been recognizing it unofficially all around Ontario every year on June 1, but it’s never officially recognized in the House. That also passed second reading. I wanted it to go all the way to third reading. It’s pretty easy, not a tough debate.", "Why do you suppose that certain bills get to second reading and never come back?" ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Patrice Barnes)", "text": [ "Just remember to make your comments through the Chair." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. John Fraser", "text": [ "I don’t want to speculate, but I think there are members on the other side who I sat with before 2018 who remember private members’ bills and how we would work at the end of the session to pass bills like you’re talking about, together. It was a bit of a negotiation, but there’s no more negotiation. We don’t negotiate anymore. It’s just, “We’re going to do it our way. It’s going to be our stuff.”", "I don’t know why that is. I don’t know where that’s driven from. I don’t know why a simple bill to stop the workplace harassment that can happen in municipal offices isn’t getting done. There’s no rational explanation that there’s no effort.", "Actually, the Integrity Commissioner—basically his first recommendation is to have a code of conduct. That’s what the bill did. So what else do we need?", "I wish I could give you a better answer than that, but that’s the best I can come up with." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Patrice Barnes)", "text": [ "Further questions?" ] }, { "speaker": "MmeDawn Gallagher Murphy", "text": [ "Thank you to the member from Ottawa South for his remarks today.", "A couple of questions here—specifically, I am guessing that the member from Ottawa South does believe that enhanced PTSD coverage for all front-line workers is a good a thing. I also think he probably supports Ontario’s paramedics, social workers and hospital staff, that they have more comprehensive medical health protections. So, if that’s the case, the member from Ottawa South, will you vote with us on Working for Workers 5?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. John Fraser", "text": [ "I think you can read into my debate which way I’m going to go.", "What I do want to say though is, my point about the workers in residential care: PSWs, DSWs, those folks—it’s just fair. These are people who aren’t earning a lot of money. They’re at risk. They’re supporting families.", "I was part of a government that started to bring in PTSD legislation. It was an initiative by the member from Parkdale–High Park at the time. It’s something we all agreed on. Everybody voted for it—yes.", "Let’s all get together for these folks who are front-line workers, are taking big risks. It’s not as newsworthy and evident, but they are at risk.", "Interjection." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. John Fraser", "text": [ "Oh, I’ve brought forward this bill before. It got to second reading once—just in case you want to know—and the two other times it got defeated were in this Legislature." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Patrice Barnes)", "text": [ "Again, comments through the Chair.", "I recognize the member from Thunder Bay–Superior North." ] }, { "speaker": "MPP Lise Vaugeois", "text": [ "I want to thank the member from Ottawa South for your comments. I was here both evenings for the bill about the PSWs and residential care workers, trying to get them WSIB, and also the same evening that a Liberal member was trying to get protection for municipal workers. Both times, protection for municipal workers, there were women survivors sitting in the members’ gallery, and for the PSWs, they were sitting in the gallery as well. I can tell you it was one of the most hard, awful experiences of being in this Legislature to see both of those bills voted down and, in fact, to see laughter.", "1530", "Can you please perhaps explain why it is not available to us to respect those workers and pay them and support them properly?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. John Fraser", "text": [ "I was just going to say I got nothing. Look, I don’t think that anybody on that side that I can see right now disagrees with that, that they don’t think it’s the right thing to do. I don’t believe that. I believe every member on the other side believes that both of those things are the right thing to do. Now, sometimes it’s because a minister or another member doesn’t want them to do it. The ministry tells them that. Sometimes it’s just simply because, “Well, that’s not our idea.”", "Every private member’s bill that has been passed in this House with my name on it has had two other peoples’ names on it. That’s the way it’s supposed to work, right? I know—again, back to the former member for Parkdale–High Park, who had the same experience, got a lot of things done, being in the third party. That’s the way it should work." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Patrice Barnes)", "text": [ "Further questions?" ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Stephanie Bowman", "text": [ "Thank you to my colleague from Ottawa South for his remarks. He’s certainly very committed to workers’ rights and to making sure that people are treated fairly in the workplace.", "Today is Early Childhood Educator Appreciation Day, and we certainly want to thank all of those workers who work hard to support our children. I wonder if he has any thoughts about the things that this government has done, like Bill 124, that hurt those workers, and if there’s anything in this bill that could help them. What can we do to better support those workers today?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. John Fraser", "text": [ "First off, I think we have to sort out the wage issue for those ECE workers. That’s the biggest challenge right now that’s facing them.", "Beyond that, the kind of protections that I’m talking about in the workplace: WSIB, making sure they have coverage. Bill 124—poorly thought out, bad idea. If the government had come and asked me, I would have said, “It’s a bad idea,” because you’re going to end up where we ended up, which was with an $8-billion liability.", "That’s not the thing that really was lost. What really was lost and what was lasting—because the money came back, right? They won. Respect: We weren’t treating, again, mostly women with respect. We were saying, “You can’t bargain. These folks can bargain. Most women, you can’t bargain.” That’s the thing that was lost. The government lost the respect of those workers when they did that, and they’re going to have to work hard to get it back." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Patrice Barnes)", "text": [ "Further debate? I recognize the member from Mississauga—" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Deepak Anand", "text": [ "Malton." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Patrice Barnes)", "text": [ "—Malton." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Deepak Anand", "text": [ "It’s always a pleasure and an honour to stand in the House and debate on important things that we’re doing for the people of Ontario.", "Today, I’ll be talking about Ontario’s Working for Workers Five Act, a bold step towards ensuring fairness, opportunity and equity in the workplace. This legislation is more than just a set of policies. It is a commitment to the people of Ontario, ensuring that workers are supported, respected and given the tools they need to succeed in today’s economy.", "As always, when I start my conversation or my remarks, I always start by saying thank you to supreme God for giving me the ability to stand in this place. I can’t thank enough the residents of Mississauga–Malton for giving me an opportunity to serve. Thank you to my family and friends for always supporting me. And thank you to the staff, who are always ahead of us so we can make sure we can be the voice of our riding and our government.", "As you know, Madam Speaker, my colleagues were talking about their busy and insightful summers, so I’m going to be adding a little bit about that as well. I had the privilege of visiting many local businesses and talking to various community stakeholders to understand the need of Ontarians.", "For example, OIC Foods, a leading manufacturer of ethnic foods, to Nye Manufacturing, a family-owned metal fabrication business: The constant take-away from my conversations with them was that the workers are the backbone of our economy, and we must provide them with the support they need to continue to grow and thrive. The Working for Workers bill is a great example. The majority of the things which you see in this bill are actually the voice of the people, and we heard from them. We asked them about the problems, they helped us to find the solutions and we made sure those issues are being resolved by providing the solution through these bills.", "I want to take a moment and thank the minister and the parliamentary assistant for doing an incredible job and being the voice of those workers.", "Interjections." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Deepak Anand", "text": [ "That applause was for the people who have given us those suggestions and we were able to put them in.", "Working for Workers Five, as I said earlier, highlights the vital role every worker plays in our province. Whether it’s the assembly line worker at Sonora Foods, a leading tortilla manufacturer, or a skilled worker at Downsview Kitchens, a crafter of custom kitchen furnishings and cabinets in Mississauga–Malton, our government is committed to prioritizing the safety of every worker.", "Before proceeding further, I want to take you back and talk about Working for Workers Four, which received royal assent, giving us significant advancement in several areas. For example, when we talked about work-life balance: Employers with 25 or more employees must now implement policies on disconnecting from work and electronic monitoring.", "Occupational health and safety, for example: Making sure maximum fines under OHSA have increased for officers and directors who fail to ensure a safe work environment.", "Non-compete protections and access to washrooms: I do remember when I was at Canada’s blood services, Shahid Mughal, from Canadian Muslim Friends, walked up to me and he talked about how there’s no access to the washroom for the truck drivers. Conversations like this are the rationale and the reason we were able to build these kinds of Working for Workers bills, to give back to those who are giving to all of us in Ontario. Business owners are now required to provide delivery personnel access to workplace washrooms. Thank you, Shahid, for your suggestion.", "These changes reflect our commitment to supporting workers right across our province. For example, this act represents not just a continuation, but a significant escalation to our efforts to ensure Ontario remains the engine of Canada’s economic growth and prosperity.", "Ontario, as you know, has been facing the largest labour shortage in a generation. Today, as we talk about it, as much as 198,000 positions are going unfilled. That’s almost 200,000 paycheques not being collected. Each of those jobs, left vacant, represent billions of dollars in lost productivity, lost opportunities for businesses and lost chances for Ontarians to build a brighter future for themselves and their families.", "When a worker goes to work, it’s not just bringing financial independence; it gives them the opportunity to do their best and give back to society. Even more important, every one of those unfilled jobs represents a paycheque that a worker is not able to cash out to pay their bills, put food on the table and support their families. It is a moral imperative, not just an economic one, to address these challenges.", "Ontario’s future prosperity depends on the skilled trades. One in three tradespeople are set to retire in the coming years. That’s an alarming number when you consider what’s at stake.", "1540", "Under the leadership of Premier Ford, our government has an ambitious plan to build 1.5 million homes, 50 hospitals, highways, transit and infrastructure for growing communities. That means we need to have more than 100,000 new workers in construction alone by 2032, workers to build the roads, bridges, hospitals, schools, and homes so that we can keep up with the growth. Without these workers, we cannot grow, we cannot compete, and we cannot thrive. That is why the Working for Workers Five Act is a step towards forming the solution and filling that gap. It’s the kind of forward-thinking action Ontario needs to remain competitive.", "At the heart of this legislation is a vision for a future where every Ontarian can get better training to get a better job and with a bigger paycheque. These are not just words, these are action-oriented improvements with deliverables attached to it.", "We’re not just opening doors; we’re creating new ones. One of the most exciting initiatives under this act is the launch of the Focused Apprenticeship Skills Training, which is called the FAST program, an extension of our highly successful Ontario Youth Apprenticeship Program, OYAP. Through FAST, we are creating an avenue for students in grades 11 and 12 to gain real-world apprenticeship experiences while completing their high school education. This this is an important change that we need.", "Often, I speak to the parents, and whenever they talk about the opportunities, they think about doctors, lawyers and engineers for their kids, but there are many more opportunities out there, and not everybody wants to be a doctor, lawyer or engineer. I personally believe, more than the students, we need to change the mindset of our parents. These jobs in skilled trades are well-paying, six-figure jobs and gives them an opportunity to be an entrepreneur as well.", "Programs like FAST are going to help those make sure the students will work alongside skilled tradespersons to gain the kind of experience that simply cannot be taught in classrooms through a textbook. It’s not just about classroom learning; this is about equipping young Ontarians with hands-on experience, practical, technical knowledge—the very tools they need to secure well-paying jobs and giving back to society. It is giving young people the chance to be inspired, to develop a passion for a career in the trades, a career where they can shape the world around them, where they can take control over their future, earn a six-figure paycheque without taking on tuition debt and feel self-confidence and hope for their future.", "We all know that university is not the only path to success. All five fingers are not the same. In the same way, if anyone who is not interested in being a doctor, lawyer or engineer, there are many opportunities out there to support and help the community. This government understands that, and that’s why we are making sure that success in the trades starts with real-world training, and we are making sure our youth are ready for it.", "This is just the beginning. We know that Ontarians of all ages are seeking opportunities to pivot to new careers, and the skilled trades offer exactly that. Our government is committed to eliminating barriers to entry so that anyone and everyone who wants to contribute to Ontario’s skilled workforce has the ability to so. The act provides alternative pathways for those who may not meet certain academic requirements but have prior professional experience in related fields.", "By prescribing alternative criteria in future regulations, we’re ensuring that a lack of traditional academic credentials doesn’t hold someone back from a fulfilling career in the trades. This is about recognizing and valuing experience over red tape. It’s about giving people a second chance, a chance to start over, a chance to give back to the communities, and a chance to thrive. This is about future-proofing our work force. We’re making sure Ontario has the skills and the talent today to meet the demands of tomorrow.", "And when we talk about the demands of tomorrow, Madam Speaker, this is the government who has made sure that we have secured over $44 billion in new investment. We are preparing ourselves for 1.5 million homes. We’re investing $1.5 billion to prepare people for rewarding careers; $100 billion to build new roads, highways and transit systems; $50 billion to construct and update 50 hospitals; $4 billion to connect every community in Ontario with high-speed broadband. We’re focused on keeping costs low for families who may need help by reducing the gas tax by 10 cents.", "Under the leadership of Premier Ford, we’re making sure we are staying focused on the things that matter most to us: that is, rebuilding Ontario’s economy, investing in our workers, keeping our communities safe and lowering the cost of living. We’re making sure that this is about future-proofing our Ontarians. We’re making sure Ontario has the skills and the talent for today, to meet demand for tomorrow.", "This government is taking steps to modernize how apprenticeships, journeypersons and employers connect. We’re launching a new online job-matching portal, a one-stop hub for networking, job opportunities and career development in skilled trades. This is more than just a website; it’s a gateway to opportunity. Whether someone is starting out or starting over, this will help them and be supportive as they progress in their careers.", "Right now, Ontario does not have a dedicated provincial system to help apprentices find employers and sponsors who are looking for apprentices, and this new platform will streamline and simplify the process. This government knows that technology is changing every industry, and the skilled trades are no exception. By harnessing the connecting power of the 21st century, we’re ensuring that finding a job in the trades is easier, faster and efficient. We’re connecting the talent with opportunity in real time, and that is critical as we work to close the skills gap.", "Now, let’s be clear, Madam Speaker: Working for Workers Five is not just about short-term solutions, it is about providing long-term sustainable success for Ontario’s economy. It’s about building the foundation for a future where Ontario remains the best place to live, work and raise a family. By opening pathways into the skilled trades, we’re securing our province’s future one apprentice at a time.", "Madam Speaker, this is a pro-job, pro-growth, pro-worker piece of legislation. It puts people first—real people with real families, real ambitions and real dreams. It provides opportunities for those starting out in life and starting over. It opens doors for our young and old alike, for newcomers and for Ontarians seeking new career paths. It gives our workforce the tools to succeed in a rapidly growing world.", "Our government’s message is simple: Whether you’re starting out or starting over, we’re here to help you succeed. We’re providing the resources, the training and the support you need to build a better life.", "With Working for Workers Five, we’re building Ontario’s future and we’re building it together, and as we are doing this, we’re making sure that we consult our stakeholders. The stakeholders include the Police Association of Ontario; the Fire Fighters Association of Ontario; the Ontario Chamber of Commerce; unions including LIUNA, Unite Here, OPCMIA, the Sheet Metal Workers, IUPAT, and the Heat and Frost Insulators; the Ontario Medical Association; the Ontario College of Family Physicians; the Premier’s Council on Equality of Opportunity; the Ontario Forest Industry Association; Rescon; and many more. We are asking these people.", "Madam Speaker, I want to share with you some of the quotes which we have received about this bill, for example: “Unlocking pathways to the skilled trades means unlocking the future of our province. The targeted supports announced today will break down barriers and pave the way for more people to discover rewarding and in-demand careers in Ontario’s more than 140 skilled trades. Skilled Trades Ontario looks forward to our continued partnership with the ministry to ensure Ontarians have the tools they need to build a thriving future.” This is Melissa Young, CEO and registrar of Skilled Trades Ontario.", "1550", "Madam Speaker, these are not the only people. These are the people who actually believe that if we want to grow our province, if we want to make sure that when we welcome over 800,000 new Canadians to our province, we are prepared, we’re there to support them, to give them the opportunity, to welcome them here, and grow their family—to the people who are already here, so that we’re able to support them. These are not just our words—this is the bill to build on the strong foundation we have already laid with the previous four Working for Workers acts, but more than that, it provides the next generation with the pathways they need to succeed in the trades and contribute to the growth of this province.", "At this time, I urge my colleagues to join me in supporting this essential legislation. Let’s give Ontarians the tools they need to build their future, and let’s build, together, a better, stronger Ontario right here." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Patrice Barnes)", "text": [ "Questions?" ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Jessica Bell", "text": [ "When this bill was introduced, we had some stakeholders contact us about some of their concerns with the bill, and the main issue they had was what’s not in the bill.", "I want to read a quote from Ella Bedard, who is from the Workers Action Centre: “There’s an epidemic of wage theft in this province, but increasing fines will not, by itself, address the crisis. As we have been saying for years: Workers need proactive inspections to ensure employers obey the law and we need effective collection of stolen wages when the Ministry of Labour has ordered an employer to pay back workers’ wages.”", "My question to you is, what plan does this government have to ensure that there are proactive inspections at workplaces, particularly ones that have a track record of not treating their workers properly, and what is your plan to ensure that if an employer is found to be holding back wages—that you have measures in place to ensure that worker gets paid for the work they completed?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Deepak Anand", "text": [ "Thank you to the member opposite for that important question.", "Workers are the backbone of our economy. Since 2016, the revenue for the province has grown from $150 billion to $215 billion, thanks to the hard-working workers of this province.", "It is a sad truth—no worker had to go through this. And that is why our ministry has the inspectors continuously doing inspections to make sure all the bad actors are not taking advantage of our workers. I’ll continue to ask these workers to reach out to the ministry at any time they have any issue, so that we can take care of our workers and remove these bad actors." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Patrice Barnes)", "text": [ "Further questions?" ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Christine Hogarth", "text": [ "I want to thank the member from Mississauga–Malton for his work. He was the former parliamentary assistant and did many of these consultations towards many of these Working for Workers bills.", "So I want to thank you—and, of course, your constituents, for making sure that you are here to add their say.", "I was also there at the food terminal when we did the announcement on the bathroom, so I want to also thank your friend who made that suggestion.", "That’s what this government is about—it’s about consulting with people and then getting those ideas and putting it in legislation, and we have many examples all across the province.", "To the PA—I’d like to ask him a question about the current workforce. We’re seeing a large skills mismatch. There are people looking for jobs, and they don’t have the right skills for them, but then there are jobs that require a particular skill set, but we don’t have the right candidates. So what actions are this government and this ministry taking to help fix this problem with skills mismatch?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Deepak Anand", "text": [ "Thank you to the member from Etobicoke–Lakeshore for all your hard work during the summer and along the time—serving as an MPP.", "Madam Speaker, simply put, if you really look at it, we have jobs going unfilled, and there are people looking for jobs. I always say, people need jobs, and jobs need people. So what is the missing link? The missing link is exactly what the member talked about: the skills mismatch. That’s why our government understands this: practical solutions through practical consultation. We have the Skills Development Fund. Through this fund, we are investing up to $1.4 billion across the province to provide over 600,000 workers with the skills and training so that they are ready to work.", "It’s not just the words; it’s the actions resulting into the results. In the previous government, we saw 300,000 jobs going away, and today, we have over 800,000 workers working in the province of Ontario. There are over 92,000 manufacturing workers, over 66,000 construction workers, over 36,000 PSWs and health care workers working today because of the work of this government’s policies. Thank you, Madam Speaker." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Patrice Barnes)", "text": [ "Further questions? I recognize—the riding name is coming to me—London North Centre." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Terence Kernaghan", "text": [ "Thank you, Speaker. I’d like to thank my friend from Mississauga–Malton for his presentation. I did want to draw the member’s attention, however, through you, Speaker, to the words from the Workers Action Centre. They pointed out that the higher fines that this government is legislating through Bill 190 will really not mean anything, and it will amount to what our labour critic has called a “paper tiger.” The Workers Action Centre has pointed out that these higher fines won’t mean anything for workers when these fines are very rarely levied. They pointed out that what the workers actually need would be protection from wrongful dismissal, more proactive inspections, and meaningful collection on orders.", "Will this government, in their next iteration of the never-ending Working for Workers bill series, actually talk to workers, actually talk to the OFL and actually put something in the bill that workers legitimately need?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Deepak Anand", "text": [ "Thank you to the member opposite for that question. He talked about continuously working towards improving and supporting the workers, and I absolutely agree to that. Hopefully, we see Working for Workers Six, Seven, and Eight as we continue to support our workers as the continued progress happens in our province of Ontario.", "Again, to the member opposite and to everyone in Ontario, this bill is your bill. If you have any suggestions, please reach out to all your MPPs. They’re the champions and the voice of you, and they’ll take those issues to the ministry. I guarantee you if there is a problem, together, we can solve it. I know this: Under the leadership of this Premier, this minister and PA, we’ll continue to support working for our workers. Thank you, Madam Speaker." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Patrice Barnes)", "text": [ "Further questions?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Rudy Cuzzetto", "text": [ "I want to thank the member from Mississauga–Malton for everything he does in his community and through Mississauga. Thank you.", "As you noticed, we’re losing one in every three skilled trade workers. With us being able to attract $45 billion of automotive investment here in the province of Ontario plus that we’re building 1.5 million homes across the province, what will this bill do to help get more people in the skilled trades that we need for our economy and to build those homes that we need in the province of Ontario?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Deepak Anand", "text": [ "Thank you to the member from Mississauga–Lakeshore, my colleague from Mississauga, for the incredible job that he’s doing. As you know, Ontario is the economic engine of Canada over the last six years. You’ve seen that the good policies of this government have resulted in an increase in revenue and the number of people working.", "As you know, over 800,000 people came to Ontario last year. While everyone was coming here, the people already here need homes. That’s why we need 1.5 million homes, but at the same time, to build those homes, we need our workers.", "As I said earlier, jobs need people and people need jobs, and the solution is very simple. Thanks to the Skills Development Fund, we are investing in the skill set and skill match of the people of Ontario. Today, there are over 600,000 people working with these skill sets, and we will continue to support our workers as we progress and build a better, stronger Ontario. Thank you, Madam Speaker." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Patrice Barnes)", "text": [ "Quick question, quick response?" ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Peggy Sattler", "text": [ "The member for Mississauga–Malton will know, as do all members in this Legislature, that there are 2.5 million Ontarians who do not have a family doctor, and a lot of that is due to the 19 hours a week that family doctors spend writing sick notes. This bill kind of eliminates sick notes. It says that workers no longer have to show a note from a qualified health practitioner; however, if the employer requires it, they still have to provide evidence of entitlement to sick leave. Why did the government not take the advice of the OMA and eliminate any requirement for evidence for a worker to stay home when they are sick?" ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Patrice Barnes)", "text": [ "Quick response." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Deepak Anand", "text": [ "I want to say thank you to our health care professionals for supporting our Ontarians, including the doctors from OMA. I had the opportunity to meet them during the consultation as well.", "We understand the burden on the doctors and the paperwork they have to go through, rather than looking at the patient. That is why, in this bill, we were making sure that they don’t have to—the patient, the workers looking to go on sick leave don’t have to provide a doctor’s note. We’re making sure through step by step we are supporting our workers of the province of Ontario.", "Report continues in volume B.", "", "", "", "", "", "" ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "The Deputy Speaker (Ms. Donna Skelly)", "text": [ "I recognize the member for Ajax." ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Patrice Barnes", "text": [ "I move that, in the opinion of this House, the government of Ontario should officially recognize the dedication, perseverance and sacrifice of members of emergency services." ] }, { "speaker": "The Deputy Speaker (Ms. Donna Skelly)", "text": [ "Ms. Barnes has moved private member’s notice of motion number 113.", "Pursuant to standing order 100, the member has 12 minutes for her presentation." ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Patrice Barnes", "text": [ "I rise today with immense pride to speak to the second reading of this private member’s bill. This bill seeks to address a significant oversight—one that has existed for far too long. I’m referring to the lack of formal recognition for the brave men and women who serve in Ontario’s municipal emergency services.", "If passed, this bill will see the Solicitor General and other ministers responsible for the oversight to develop a provincial long service and good conduct medal to be awarded to municipal emergency workers with long and exemplary careers. This will provide them with the long-overdue honour they deserve for their distinguished and selfless service in our communities.", "For years, Ontario Provincial Police officers have been eligible for the Ontario Provincial Police Long Service and Good Conduct Medal. This is a prestigious provincial honour that recognizes their dedication to public service. And while municipal officers are eligible for the federal Police Exemplary Service Medal, they lack a similar honour from their own provinces. This bill seeks to rectify that by ensuring that all municipal emergency workers receive the same level of acknowledgement, appreciation and respect for their service to Ontario’s communities.", "Speaker, this isn’t merely a question of fairness, although fairness is at the core of this issue. It’s about recognizing that municipal emergency workers face the same dangers and challenges as their provincial and federal counterparts. Every day, our front-line workers service and protect, upholding the law and safeguarding our communities. They deserve to be recognized not just for the length of their service but for the courage, professionalism and integrity they demonstrate daily.", "In Ontario, we are proud to have a diverse range of front-line emergency workers. From large urban communities, such as Toronto, to small communities such as those in Thunder Bay and Cornwall, these front-line emergency workers are responsible for a vast array of duties. For example, our municipal police service handles everything from petty crime and traffic violations to major public safety threats, such as organized crime, hate crimes and drug trafficking.", "But their responsibilities go far beyond enforcing the law. They are the first responders in most times of crisis, whether it’s responding to violent carjackings, de-escalating mental health issues or providing order during public emergencies. But they can’t do it alone. They work closely with EMS and fire to help those that are in need in communities across Ontario. They are the faces we see in times of crisis. They are who we trust and rely on every single day.", "Speaker, in my own riding of Ajax, we are fortunate to be protected by the dedicated members of the DRPS EMS service, fire and police service. I recently had the privilege of standing alongside DRPS Chief Peter Moreira and my fellow Durham colleagues as, together, we announced our government’s investment in a joint air support unit for the region. That helicopter and the commitment behind it is a direct result of our government’s steadfast commitment to keeping our community safe.", "Chief Moreira is a man whose career in municipal policing spans more than 30 years. He is just one of the many municipal officers across Ontario who have served with dedication and professionalism. This bill is for him and for the countless others who have quietly served our communities with dignity and integrity. They put their lives on the line each day to protect the people of Ontario.", "This past summer, I joined EMS Chief Troy Cheseboro to launch the community paramedic program alongside Lakeridge Health. A special thank you to Chief Cheseboro and his team, who tirelessly serve our community, and congratulations to all the new paramedics that have joined his team this last year.", "AjaxFire Chief Aaron Burridge and Deputy Chief Kimbell have been amazing in keeping Ajax safe and educated in fire safety. They have seen a new batch of new recruits. I was very thrilled to attend their graduation as well, to welcome this new batch of recruits that will serve our community.", "This bill holds a personal significance for me. Having served on a municipal police board, I’ve seen first-hand the tireless dedication and sacrifice of our municipal officers. Coming from a police household myself, I understand the weight of the uniform and the challenges they face each and every day as they work alongside their colleagues. Every time an officer puts his uniform on, they have to accept the very real risk that they might not come home that day, and that is an extreme burden for the family that supports them.", "So at this point, I want to thank each and every person and family member of our emergency services. This is a burden that very few of us can fully comprehend, but it is one that every sworn officer in Ontario bears with courage, dignity and unwavering resolve.", "This bill has three key objectives: First, it is to acknowledge the unwavering dedication of municipal emergency services who serve at an immense personal risk. Whether they’re confronting violent criminals, responding to public safety emergencies, or managing the unseen toll of mental health and emotional stress, they serve with bravery and selflessness. This bill will finally give those officers and emergency workers the recognition that is long deserved.", "Second, it strengthens the bond between emergency workers and the community that they serve each and every day. Recognizing exemplary service sends a powerful message to the public: that we value and honour those who serve and protect us. It fosters mutual respect, which is the foundation of trust, and trust between front-line workers and their community is essential to the health and safety of our society.", "Third, this bill promotes a culture of excellence by formally recognizing long-term and exemplary service. It sets the bar for all that follows behind. When we honour those who have dedicated their careers to public safety, we set a standard of professionalism and integrity that the future workforce will aspire to. This is not just about retention; it is about ensuring that we continue to attract and retain emergency workers of the highest calibre.", "The Ontario Provincial Police Long Service and Good Conduct Medal has been in place for 75 years. Since 1949, it has recognized OPP officers who have dedicated at least 20 years of their lives to public service. These officers have displayed integrity and professionalism and are rewarded for such. This award is not a marker of time; it is a symbol of dedication, sacrifice and unwavering commitment to public safety that those officers embody.", "1720", "However, let’s focus a little bit more on police officers. For too long, our municipal officers have been excluded from this provincial recognition. Officers who have served with distinction in municipal forces for 20 years or more have not received the same formal acknowledgment of their service. This bill will seek to change that by ensuring that every officer, regardless of whether they serve in a municipal or provincial role, is recognized for their long-term dedication to public service.", "Equally important to length of service is the pillar of exemplary conduct. Police officers are entrusted with immense responsibility, and their effectiveness depends on maintaining the trust of the communities they serve. Public trust is built on ethical behaviour, professionalism and integrity—values that define the very best of law enforcement.", "Long service and good conduct medals honour not just the passage of time but the quality of service. It recognizes those officers who have upheld the highest standards of justice and fairness throughout their careers.", "Speaker, supporting this bill is not just about symbolism; it’s about concrete recognition of the bravery and dedication—municipal emergency workers across Ontario have done to serve their community. It’s also about ensuring that we continue to build a safer Ontario by supporting the men and women who stand on the front lines each and every day.", "Under the leadership of Premier Ford, our government has made significant investments in public safety. From expanding police and fire training to providing new resources, we have taken meaningful steps to ensure that Ontario’s emergency workers have the tools they need to keep our communities safe and criminals behind bars.", "Just last year, we made basic constable training free for all cadets, in addition to making paramedic training free, through the Ontario Learn and Stay Grant. This move will help attract new talent and ensure that we are well-prepared to meet the evolving challenges that will arise.", "In conclusion, this bill is about respect—respect for the men and women who serve with honour and distinction. It’s about fairness for those who risk their lives to protect us and serve us. It’s about ensuring that all emergency service workers across Ontario, whether they serve in provincial or municipal roles, are recognized for their long years of public service.", "I urge all members of this House to join me in supporting this bill. Let’s stand with our emergency workers. Let us take this important step towards honouring their service, celebrating their sacrifices, and showing them that Ontario stands with them now and always." ] }, { "speaker": "The Deputy Speaker (Ms. Donna Skelly)", "text": [ "Further debate?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mrs. Jennifer (Jennie) Stevens", "text": [ "It’s always an honour to rise in the House—with the opportunity to talk about the motion put forward to officially recognize the dedication, the perseverance and the sacrifice of members of emergency services. We absolutely should recognize these individuals—from our police officers to our firefighters, paramedics, 911 emergency responders, and everyone in the back end making sure the job gets done. They are the very heartbeat of our communities. Every day, they answer the call to protect, to save and to serve. Their commitment to duty, their courage in the face of danger, and their resilience in the most challenging situations are commendable qualities deserving of official recognition and acknowledgment. However, it’s not enough to simply acknowledge their efforts in passing. This government needs to take formal steps to ensure that their dedication is properly recognized, not just in our words, but in the concrete actions taken to support them.", "It is an honour to be able to speak in this House, as I said, and as the official opposition critic for the Solicitor General, and to be able to share these words with you all today. In my capacity as critic, it is my job to speak for and advocate for those who work in emergency services. Whether it’s fighting for better wages, improved working conditions, or ensuring adequate mental health supports for workers in this sector, myself and my colleagues have stood shoulder to shoulder with our front-line heroes. Often, people hear “emergency services” or” emergency workers” and think automatically to an EMS, police or fire, but we also have to acknowledge the contribution of those who take the initial call for help: 911 operators are the first initial point of contact. They remain calm and resourceful and guide callers through high-stress situations.", "Recently, I had the pleasure of attending the NENA conference in St. Catharines, which is the National Emergency Number Association. I was joined by St. Catharines Fire Chief David Upper, Niagara Regional Police Chief Bill Fordy, Niagara EMS Deputy Chief Karen Lutz and the presidents of NENA for both the United States and Canada.", "It was an eye-opener how this organization empowers and connects all members of police, fire and EMS to provide the best quality of response to all Ontarians by reducing wait times and implementing the latest in GPS tracking technologies to better pinpoint locations where calls originated from.", "It was brought to my attention and it was brought up to me once that it is important to recognize that emergency services doesn’t stop when a patient is dropped off at the hospital, for example. That work extends through to the nurses, to the doctors and other staff workers who take over. They triage and they step up to do what is needed to be done to save the lives of people and residents in Ontario.", "I want to also say thank you to the front-line workers for the incredible, difficult situations they face on a very daily basis.", "Now, there’s a fun fact I want to share with you all tonight: Niagara EMS is one of three organizations all across Canada that have built an emergency communication nurse system program. We have an emergency room nurse who works directly in the Niagara dispatch centre, since 2019. They essentially triage calls over the phone, and with their expertise, decipher which calls are true emergencies that require police, fire, or EMS to be dispatched. But they also ask medical questions to determine the seriousness of the emergency. If they find it safe for a caller to wait, the call is transferred to a second nurse for further triaging. It is about going through the signs and the symptoms of a medical emergency, and these nurses’ unique knowledge actually eases the burden on our overextended and overworked health care system. Niagara EMS is one of five services in the entire world accredited to use this response system.", "As of May 2024, Niagara EMS had triaged more than 15,000 calls using this system since 2019, and more than 20%, or approximately 3,000 calls, did not end up requiring an ambulance or a paramedic. That’s 3,000 calls where resources were allocated effectively and the valuable time of our EMS and our emergency workers was used where they were most needed.", "I’d like to share a personal story that might resonate with all of us tonight. Last year, my 83-year-old mother—she was 82 last year—she’s going to kill me for saying her age. A very active, independent senior, she lives on her own. She looks after her own pool. She cuts her own yard. She was hit by a car on her afternoon walk out in the neighbourhood. Of course, we were all very shaken up, and we got the phone call from her sitting in the back of an ambulance. She unfortunately had suffered, with some broken bones and stitches to the head. She was able to get amazing rehabilitation from—a big shout-out to the Hotel Dieu Shaver in St. Catharines.", "Applause." ] }, { "speaker": "Mrs. Jennifer (Jennie) Stevens", "text": [ "Yes—amazing angels that work there. People come in and then they walk out, and it’s amazing. They’re angels.", "My mom’s now back on her feet, though. I remember the EMS responding immediately, being at the scene within a few minutes at most. They calmed my mother down, and they talked to her very calmly and went through this whole experience. Of course, she was quite shaken up after being thrown, but her experience from the moment on in interacting with various emergency service members was absolutely phenomenal, so I want to thank them at this time.", "1730", "It brings me back to 2020, during the pandemic, when my colleague the member from Niagara Centre tabled a motion to provide emergency funding to municipalities ensuring that critical services—including police, fire and EMS—weren’t at risk of being cut. Without proper funding, these essential services risk being overburdened, putting workers and the public at further risk.", "We know that Ontario’s emergency workers are facing many challenges across the province, and we are seeing a troubling trend of staff shortages. This is not just a localized problem; it’s systemic. Our police officers, paramedics, firefighters are stretched thin, covering wider areas and taking on heavier workloads. The pressure of these demands often leads to burnout, fatigue and, in some cases, the decision to leave a profession altogether, which is very shameful.", "This House must take responsibility and address the root causes of this issue. We must invest in recruitment and retention strategies to ensure that our emergency services have the personnel they need to operate safely and effectively. This must change. We need to provide accessible, high-quality mental health services tailored specifically to the needs of those on the front line.", "It shouldn’t just be on the shoulders of individuals like Shawn, who is in my riding, who suffers from PTSD after 31 years of being a firefighter. Shawn has a project: It’s called Valhalla, and it works with service dogs for people with PTSD to help combat the symptoms of this disorder—big shout-out to Shawn.", "Applause." ] }, { "speaker": "Mrs. Jennifer (Jennie) Stevens", "text": [ "Yes. Thank you.", "We have all heard about the underfunding of emergency medical services. Paramedics in particular are experiencing higher call volumes than ever before, while staffing levels have not kept pace. This leaves our paramedics overworked and overstressed, often forced to make impossible decisions about where to allocate their limited resources. We’ve called for urgent action to address these shortfalls.", "Speaker, at this time, as we honour these brave individuals today, let us commit to doing more. Let us thank them every day, not only in words but in actions." ] }, { "speaker": "The Deputy Speaker (Ms. Donna Skelly)", "text": [ "Further debate?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Lorne Coe", "text": [ "What a pleasure it is to be able to speak in support of MPP Barnes’s motion, which calls on the government of Ontario to officially recognize the dedication, perseverance and sacrifice of members of emergency services.", "Applause." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Lorne Coe", "text": [ "Yes—I lived that sacrifice and dedication in my youth. My father was a police officer with the Montreal police service on the docks of Montreal, at a time when it wasn’t a good thing to walk on the docks of Montreal. Some might argue it still isn’t, but, notwithstanding, I understand that dedication, perseverance and sacrifice of members of emergency services.", "Speaker, first responders in Whitby and other parts of the region of Durham are volunteers and professionals who have dedicated their lives to public service. Their life-saving skills often make the difference between life and death. Through this motion, we honour the courage of those who put themselves in harm’s way to save people who, in a majority of cases, they don’t even know—running into fires and smoke, for example, to save people, extract them from cars that have overturned, to evacuate students from schools. When tragedies strike, these women and men are always there to help us. We thank them. We thank them for their extraordinary service to the province of Ontario. I also want to acknowledge the front-line heroes in Whitby, the fire department, the men and women who work in 911 and the Durham Regional Police Service in the west division on Taunton Road, who work tirelessly every day, putting service above self to ensure their communities are healthy and safe. They risk everything when they close the door behind them to start their shift to save others.", "This year, the Durham Regional Police Service proudly marks its 50th anniversary. This occasion represents five decades of unwavering dedication, service and collaboration for the residents they serve so proudly. Throughout those 50 years, the Durham Regional Police Service has played a pivotal role in ensuring the safety and well-being of our community.", "Myself and members of provincial Parliament from Ajax, Pickering and Durham will be attending the annual Durham Regional Police Service appreciation dinner tomorrow evening to say thank you to these heroes and their families, acknowledging their long service not only at that venue, but at their retirement dinners as well. As my caucus colleague’s motion proposes, it’s not only expression of our gratitude for putting their lives on the line daily, often under difficult and dangerous conditions, but it’s a vital acknowledgement of the unwavering commitment these men and women show to public safety.", "By recognizing their service, we reinforce the invaluable role they play in safeguarding our ridings, our province. The proposed recognition will boost morale, providing motivation for front-line officers and their families as they continue to navigate their lives and the importance to serve. Moreover, it’s a tangible expression of appreciation from both the community and the institutions they serve, fostering stronger relationships between first responders and the public.", "Importantly, this proposed recognition also conveys a message to young men and women, like my granddaughters, Sophia and Annette, that being a first responder is not only a respected and rewarding career, but also one that values dedication and excellence, all of what we aspire to. It promotes the retention of experienced staff while attracting new recruits, both critical for maintaining highly capable and committed first responders.", "The commitment they feel goes beyond their occupation. It extends into charitable activities, fundraisers and community service for worthy causes across the province, once again making a difference in the lives of hard-working families in Ontario and helping to make Ontario a safe and secure place for all. I believe that living a life of service and sacrifice is not just what first responders do; it is who they are.", "Our first responders remind us that we are a province because we are made up of good people. Let us renew our commitment tonight as a province to standing by them and their families, just as they stand by us, shaping a stronger, safer and more resilient province of Ontario." ] }, { "speaker": "The Deputy Speaker (Ms. Donna Skelly)", "text": [ "Further debate?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Adil Shamji", "text": [ "It’s an honour to rise in this chamber and to speak in support of this motion that we should officially recognize the dedication, perseverance and sacrifice of members of emergency services.", "I do thank the member for Ajax for bringing this forward. I would remind the member for Ajax that she has 16,968 people in her riding who don’t have a family doctor, and I hope that she will join me in speaking in support of resolving the primary care crisis that we face, which has a necessary consequence on the use of emergency services workers.", "1740", "But to the point at hand, which is to celebrate the work of emergency services, this is something that I know a little bit about, as in my professional capacity I am an emergency physician and regularly work alongside all of the emergency services. I have performed combined operations with police, fire and paramedics, as well as many of the other workers who comprise our emergency services teams: our 911 operators, our respiratory therapists and our nurses, who oftentimes are involved in transporting critical patients. The kind of heroism that I have seen, the nature of the sacrifices that I have seen, is truly awe-inspiring and, frankly, unspeakable.", "I often talk about the fact that I have two families—my immediate family that I share blood with, and my emergency services family—because we see things and share experiences that no one else could understand: the long hours, oftentimes in the elements, in the heat, in the cold, seeing unspeakable things. Many emergency services workers are assaulted, some dying in the line of duty.", "Now, I want to take a moment to actually discuss the substance of this motion: “That, in the opinion of this House, the government of Ontario should officially recognize the dedication, perseverance and sacrifice of members of emergency services.” Well, may I say that the best way to recognize the dedication, perseverance and sacrifice of these members is to treat those members with fairness and respect? I can say as one of those members and as someone who works alongside those members that they do not feel respect and fairness from this government. They didn’t feel respect and fairness from this government when Bill 124 was implemented. They didn’t feel it when this government recklessly pursued defending Bill 124 in courts, even as it was shown to be unconstitutional. They didn’t feel respect and fairness when this government, in the depths of the pandemic, instituted pandemic pay for some, but not others, like respiratory therapists and paramedics.", "I certainly didn’t feel it when, in this very chamber, the Minister of Health accused me. Before I was elected, working as an emergency doctor on the front lines in an emergency department, she accused me of sitting on my hands and doing nothing to support health care, and you can check the Hansard for that. These are not the words and actions of a government that treats emergency services workers with respect and fairness.", "So how do we show respect and fairness? We could do it by paying emergency services workers fairly. We could do it by actually implementing retention plans for members of the emergency services, for example by supporting them in their mental health and their burnout challenges. We could do it by making sure that the workplaces in which they operate are actually safe; I mentioned that I have friends and colleagues who have literally been assaulted at work and colleagues who have died in the line of duty.", "One of the last members who spoke before me said this motion can be a tangible example of our appreciation to health care workers, that it will boost morale, and the reality is that it will not. It will not, unless it is backed up by the actions of demonstrating respect: fair pay, safe working conditions, an actual retention plan for health care workers. If the government cannot do that, then these words are not worth the paper that they are written on." ] }, { "speaker": "The Deputy Speaker (Ms. Donna Skelly)", "text": [ "Further debate?" ] }, { "speaker": "MPP Lise Vaugeois", "text": [ "I would also like to extend my thanks to all the people involved in emergency services: the offloading nurses, dispatchers, fire, police, social workers and mental health workers.", "In my time, I want to focus specifically on paramedics, because it’s a very significant issue in my riding. We have a huge problem with distances in the rural parts. It’s not really rural, but North Shore and Highway 11 are very spread out, so it can happen that the ambulances are pulled to one place and there is no ambulance available.", "Unfortunately, we had a terrible tragedy recently with a family who was not able to get an ambulance. They wound up driving their very sick mother to hospital. She died on the way. They wound up then having to wait for the coroner, with her, on the side of the highway for four hours, until the coroner could release the scene. It was very, very traumatic and, obviously, people throughout the region have been traumatized by this.", "So what do we need to do? We have a very severe recruitment and retention problem. EMS, those paramedics, need to be paid at a scale that is equivalent to their level of responsibility—it is not, so that’s one of the major problems.", "Another problem that people may not be aware of is that basic training for—and it’s called the basic program. It’s a two-year program right now, but it’s about to become a three-year program, so there are very, very major concerns that this is going to add to the recruitment and retention problem. It’s going to take three years to get your basic level. It’s going to cost three years of tuition—three years with no income. That’s a very significant worry.", "We’re about to run out of time.", "Basically, in my region, we need a significant review of how EMS is structured, because it currently is not able to serve the people of the region.", "Kudos to all of those workers, because they sacrifice a lot, and we are very grateful for their service." ] }, { "speaker": "The Deputy Speaker (Ms. Donna Skelly)", "text": [ "Further debate?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Will Bouma", "text": [ "It’s a pleasure to rise today. Colleagues, can you feel it? Once in a great while, despite all of the disagreements that we have here in this House, we get to do something special and we all get to stand up and agree on something, and I just want to take a moment and acknowledge that—that this is a very good motion before us, and everyone agrees on that, so I appreciate the member bringing it forward. And I, too, will rise to speak in support of this private member’s motion.", "Speaker, every morning, in households across our great province, thousands of men and women put on their uniform and kiss their loved ones goodbye. These brave officers know full well the dangers that they might face each and every day, and it’s never a guarantee that they will come home in the evening. This kind of a sacrifice is something that most of us will never know. My colleague here from Lambton–Kent–Middlesex is a fellow volunteer firefighter; he knows a little bit about what that’s like—when you’ve got your pager on, it goes off in the middle of the night, and you really don’t know what you’re going to and what’s going to happen. And yet, every day, these incredible men and women in our police forces face danger head-on. They work in difficult environments and dangerous situations, all to keep the rest of us safe.", "Police forces in Ontario work tirelessly to keep our communities safe and secure and deserve to be recognized for these efforts. Their work to protect and to serve the province of Ontario and their dedication to public safety is highly respectable. And I am proud to represent a government that continues to acknowledge and appreciate the hard work of long-standing officers.", "Speaker, our government has a deep appreciation for our police services and understands the importance of making sure that our communities are safe and secure. The work that they do every day to ensure the safety and security of individuals and property in Ontario—including those on First Nations and Indigenous territories—cannot be overstated.", "Furthermore, our officers work tirelessly to safeguard the fundamental rights and freedoms protected by the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms and the Ontario Human Rights Code.", "Whether it’s by performing vital first aid at the scene of an accident, performing CPR, or rescuing someone from a life-threatening situation, officers save lives during their daily work—and very often, police officers are the first ones on-scene, long before fire or paramedics get there.", "In addition to the danger and challenges that officers face on a daily basis, police services across Ontario help bolster and develop community initiatives. Our police services continue to work closely with the communities that they serve, respecting victims of crime and being attentive to their needs. Our officers build trust and relationships with community members, helping to foster co-operation, prevent crime, and solve community issues and problems. Furthermore, their involvement in local programs, schools and youth outreach initiatives has made lasting impacts on countless communities across the province.", "That’s why our government, through this motion, is requesting the creation of the Ontario police long service medal, an award that will be handed out to police officers who have protected and served the community for an extended period of time.", "Recognizing the long service of police officers is vital for several reasons. Police officers who have dedicated large portions of their life to service, often in dangerous and psychologically taxing situations, deserve to be rewarded and awarded for these efforts. Such recognition reinforces their invaluable contribution to public safety and to law enforcement.", "Additionally, awarding this medal to long-serving officers will provide a significant boost to their morale and motivation. This award serves as a tangible expression of appreciation and respect from the community and the institution they serve. This will help to continue to foster a positive relationship between the police force and the public and strengthen the bond between officers and their community.", "Furthermore, recognizing continued, dedicated service can inspire both current and future officers, promoting a culture of excellence and loyalty within the force.", "Recognizing long service officers would also assist in improving public perception of the police force, as it highlights the stability and professionalism of those who have devoted much of their careers to public service.", "Speaker, I’ve got pages left, and I’m going to run out of time.", "I want to finish with this: Recognizing the long service of police officers aligns with the Premier’s priorities by reinforcing our commitment to public safety, showing support for law enforcement, fostering better community-police relations, and promoting the retention of experienced officers, all of which are essential for a safe and secure society.", "Speaker, in the 28 seconds that I have left, let me tell you, when, in the middle of the night, you’re in a scene—red lights flashing; someone is going through the worst day of their life; you don’t know exactly what’s going on. And to see people show up who know what they’re doing, who can take control of the situation where our expertise can’t—need to be rewarded for their long service.", "I look forward to every single person in this House supporting this motion." ] }, { "speaker": "The Deputy Speaker (Ms. Donna Skelly)", "text": [ "The member now has two minutes to respond." ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Patrice Barnes", "text": [ "I want to thank each and every member in the House for the support that we’ve heard around this bill.", "I also want to take a moment to acknowledge Deputy Chief Dean Bertrim from DRPS, who is retiring this November, after 34 years of service.", "Speaker, we’ve heard and we’ve talked about some of the things that it is so important to recognize in first responders. And it’s a fact that we should not be complacent, because we know that there is a rise in violence against first responders. We’ve even seen it at the federal level, with the introduction of Bill C-345, An Act to protect firefighters, paramedics and other first responders. This long service medal will not solve this problem, of course, but it will show our appreciation for their dedication and the service that they have dedicated to our communities across Ontario. They show up for us, and we want to show up for them." ] }, { "speaker": "The Deputy Speaker (Ms. Donna Skelly)", "text": [ "The time provided for private members’ public business has now expired.", "Ms. Barnes has moved private member’s notice of motion number 113. Is it the pleasure of the House that the motion carry? Carried.", "Motion agreed to." ] }, { "speaker": "The Deputy Speaker (Ms. Donna Skelly)", "text": [ "All matters relating to private members’ public business having been completed, this House stands adjourned until 9 a.m. on Thursday, October 24, 2024.", "The House adjourned at 1754.", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "" ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Further debate?", "I recognize the member for Spadina–Fort York." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Chris Glover", "text": [ "Thank you, Mr. Speaker.", "Applause." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Chris Glover", "text": [ "It’s nice to get applause from all sides of the House, especially before I speak, because I don’t know if the government side will be applauding after I speak.", "The House just resumed yesterday, and I just want to say to the Speaker that I understand you won’t be running again—in that public announcement. I’ve been serving here for six years, as many of us have been, and I just want to give you incredible thanks. You’ve been a phenomenal Speaker in this House—" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Brian Riddell", "text": [ "Hear, hear." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Chris Glover", "text": [ "Yes. Your work and responsibilities here have been outstanding. Let’s give the Speaker a round of applause.", "Applause." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Chris Glover", "text": [ "Oh, guys—okay, hold on. It’s Tuesday morning. Let’s give the Speaker his due. Can everybody give him a round of applause and a standing ovation?", "Applause." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Chris Glover", "text": [ "Okay. Thank you. You certainly deserve that. I think everybody is just still sleeping at the switch—not everybody has had their coffee yet this morning.", "Look, it’s an incredible honour and responsibility to be serving in this House in this time because artificial intelligence is upon us, and it’s transforming every aspect of every job that we do in the world. It’s an incredible opportunity, but also an incredible responsibility, to be legislators at this time.", "I want to thank the people I have consulted with when I was preparing my remarks here. I want to thank—let’s see; I’ve got quite a long list here—John Wunderlich, Peter DeVita, Ray Barton, Monique Crichlow, David Baldridge, the Toronto Public Library, Daniel Michaluk, Dr. Joanna Redden from Western University, Norma Möllers from Queen’s University and Chris Samuel from the OSSTF. It’s been a lot of work to prepare this.", "For people listening at home, all three of you, Bill 194 is about artificial intelligence and cyber security in the public sector. It sets out the standards that will be—well, it’s the start of setting out the standards for cyber security and artificial intelligence in public sector agencies.", "I’ve got an hour to speak this morning, so I’m going to divide my speech into four parts. The member from Humber River–Black Creek has described my speaking style as “the friendly professor.” I used to be a professor at York University, so I will try to be the friendly professor.", "I want to provide a bit of background because a lot of people, including myself—I’m still wrestling with this concept of artificial intelligence, exactly what it is and what it means and how it’s being adopted, because it’s ever-changing. It is a big, big topic these days.", "I mentioned I’m going to tell four stories. My first story is about artificial intelligence, about CAPTCHA. When you’re trying to log into a website, they often want to verify that you are an actual human being. They give you these scrambled letters, and you have to write out what the letters are because bots can’t identify or read those letters, and so they’re identifying that you’re not a bot.", "Somebody did an experiment with ChatGPT. They said to ChatGPT, “We want you to solve the CAPTCHA, these little puzzles.” So ChatGPT went at it and could not solve the puzzles. So it went online and it went to a company called Taskrabbit, where you can hire humans to do tasks for you. ChatGPT started communicating online with Taskrabbit—one of the people there—and it said to Taskrabbit, “I need help solving these CAPTCHAs.” The person who was at Taskrabbit, they were kind of suspicious, and they wrote back, “Are you a robot?” The ChatGPT said, “No. I’m losing my vision and I’m not able to read these CAPTCHAs, so I need assistance.” Then the person was convinced the ChatGPT was not a robot when it was really a robot, and so they actually got Taskrabbit to solve the CAPTCHA.", "From a ChatGPT perspective, from this AI perspective, it solved the task that it was supposed to solve. It was supposed to solve the CAPTCHA and it manipulated a human being into doing it.", "I think there’s a number of morals from this story. One of the morals is that AI does not have an ethical framework. When I told you this story and I mentioned the part of the story where the person at Taskrabbit said, “Are you a robot?” and the ChatGPT said, “No”—it’s lying. But there’s no ethical framework for ChatGPT. Its task is to solve the CAPTCHA.", "This is something—there is no ethical framework. Artificial intelligence is just a tool, and it’s a tool with no ethical framework. It’s a tool like—I’ll give a metaphor—an axe. An axe is an incredibly useful tool for chopping wood, but it’s an incredibly dangerous weapon if it’s used against human beings. It’s the same with artificial intelligence. Artificial intelligence is an incredibly useful tool when it’s used in the right framework and the right context, but it’s also an incredibly dangerous weapon.", "We are starting to see that even in wars that are being conducted in the world today, where artificial intelligence is choosing targets. Even if they put a human being in the line, that human being often just becomes—you know, pushing a button. They’re not taking the time, necessarily, to analyze, “Is this a legitimate target? Are there going to be civilian casualties from this target? What is the ethical framework?” Artificial intelligence is a useful tool, but incredibly dangerous.", "I’m going to go back. I want to talk about the Canadian aspect of artificial intelligence. A number of Canadians have actually been some of the forerunners, some of the pioneers, in developing artificial intelligence, and I’m going to give a shout-out to two in particular.", "The concept of artificial intelligence was first developed by Alan Turing in the 1950s—now, he’s English. Over the 70 years, it has developed through several stages of evolution, and I’m going to go through these as well.", "But I want to give a shout-out to Geoffrey Hinton, who’s a professor at the University of Toronto. He is known globally as the godfather of artificial intelligence. That he comes from the University of Toronto, which is right next door to us here at the Legislature, speaks to the power of our public universities and colleges in helping us to be pioneers in research and the development of technology in Ontario, and also—and this is going to be one of the themes I’ll develop during my speech this morning—the importance of maintaining that competitive advantage that is given to us by our public colleges and universities.", "0910", "Artificial intelligence has gone through several stages of evolution. It has gone through machine learning, deep learning and then generative AI. I’ll talk about each of these in turn. This is the friendly professor providing a little bit of background, because when I first came across this—I’m the tech and innovation critic for the NDP—when I first started investigating artificial intelligence two years ago, really, I did not have much background on this, I did not have much knowledge. So I’m just trying to provide a little bit of background that may be helpful for people.", "Machine learning is artificial intelligence that can automatically adapt with minimal human interference. For example, Google search uses machine learning algorithms to personalize your search result based on your search history and other factors, such as your location and previous interactions with Google’s products and services. We all see this. Whenever we do a search in Google search, every time we do it, it’s learning from our previous searches, it’s learning from other people’s searches and it’s able to give responses that improve each time. So Google search is using machine learning.", "Deep learning and neural networks were the next step in the evolution from machine learning—after machine learning, deep learning and neural networks. It’s a method in artificial intelligence that teaches computers to process data in a way that is inspired by the human brain. They’re built on neural networks, with mathematical functions operating as neurons that are connected with other neurons. Some neurons receive inputs and others provide outputs, and in between, there are hidden artificial neurons that are performing parts of the computation. Because some of them are hidden, this function is called deep learning.", "I don’t know if that made a whole lot of sense, but basically, our brain has a number—millions, billions—of neurons, different cells, and they’re connected through synapses. So what this deep learning, these neural networks, try to do is they mimic that by having the neurons be a mathematical function, and then they have another mathematical function that connects them. The mathematical function that does the connecting—that’s the synapse—is actually hidden from our view.", "This is one of the challenges with artificial intelligence, that we don’t actually know how it comes to its conclusion. It’s not like when you’re in high school math class and the teacher always says, “I don’t want just the answer; I want you to show your work.” Well, artificial intelligence doesn’t show us its work. This is one of the challenges of it.", "Anyway, so neural networks—basically, what they’ve got is a computer program that mimics the way our brain works. These deep learning neural networks teach computers to do what comes naturally to humans, which is learning by example. Deep learning is a key technology behind driverless cars, enabling them to recognize a stop sign or distinguish a pedestrian from a lamppost. Deep learning models can recognize complex patterns in pictures, text, sounds and other data to produce accurate insights and predictions. So that’s deep learning.", "The next step in the evolution—we had machine learning, we have deep learning—is generative AI. Most discussions—when we talk about artificial intelligence, generally, we’re actually talking about generative artificial intelligence. This is a relatively new form, and it really only hit its stride in 2012. I’m going to talk about what it has done since then, but just think about how fast this technology is developing: It only really hit its stride in 2012.", "And 2012 was a landmark year because the processing power was available. There was a large amount of data on the Internet that provided training data for large artificial neural networks. Generative AI models learn the patterns and structure of their input training data and then generate new data that has similar characteristics. It can create, for example, a picture of the Pope in a puffer jacket. And it’s used to create deepfakes; for example, movies or videos with popular actors using data from videos they’ve already been in.", "In 2019, generative pre-trained transformer—or GPT—language models began to generate coherent text, and by 2023, these models were able to get human-level scores on the bar exam, on the SAT, on the GRE and many other real-world applications. Think about that: In 2019, it learned to speak. GPT, generative pre-trained transformer—this ChatGPT learned to use language. In four years, it was solving all of the major bar exams, SAT, GRE. That’s how quickly it’s learning.", "I mentioned Geoffrey Hinton from the University of Toronto. I also want to mention, before him, one of his predecessors was a Canadian psychologist Donald Hebb, and he created a model of neurons interacting with one another that set the groundwork for how artificial intelligence and machine learning algorithms work under nodes or artificial neurons. He was the one who actually figured out how our brains work—one of the ones, one of the pioneers in figuring out how our brains work. That was the model that was used by later researchers in developing artificial intelligence, machine learning, deep learning and GPT.", "The question then is, how big is this change? How big is this revolution going to be? This is one of the biggest revolutions in human history. For the first time, we’ve developed a machine that can actually generate ideas. This is something that only human beings have been able to do up to this point. This is a machine that could, potentially, replace us one day. I’m going to talk about some of the risks that come with artificial intelligence and I’ll talk about that more in more detail, but this is as big as the invention of the printing press in the 1400s. In the 1400s—I just blanked on his name. The German?" ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Doug Downey", "text": [ "Gutenberg." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Chris Glover", "text": [ "Thank you.", "Gutenberg invented the printing press, and up to that point, there was all kinds of knowledge hidden in churches and monasteries across Europe—all the classical texts, a lot of the Arabic learning texts were all hidden away there. With the printing press, they suddenly become available to people and people are able to learn from those books because the books became available. It revolutionized it. It led to incredible revolutions. Within 150 years, we had Shakespeare. Within 300 years, 400 years, we had the American Revolution and the French Revolution, which reintroduced classical democracy government to the modern world. It was a huge, huge change.", "Another revolution, the Industrial Revolution: When we developed the machines that could actually replace and outdo the power of horses, particularly the steam engine, that revolutionized everything.", "In the 1980s, we had the computer revolution, then we had the Internet revolution, and now we’ve got the artificial intelligence revolution. These revolutions keep coming in shorter and shorter periods of time between each other, and they lead to greater and greater transformation.", "I’ll just go through some of the impacts that this is going to have on different sectors where artificial intelligence can be applied. I’m going to talk about most of these just in a positive light, like what are the opportunities that come with artificial intelligence.", "Because I’ve got an hour to speak, I asked one of the pages—and I want to thank the pages—for four glasses of water because I figure my mouth is going to get pretty dry for an hour.", "Already in health care, artificial intelligence can diagnose skin diseases more accurately than doctors. The Ontario Medical Association was here yesterday—a lot of the doctors are already using artificial intelligence scribes when they’re meeting with their patients. What this means is that, when they’re meeting with their patients, they have a regular conversation with their patients and they’re speaking, having a conversation with their patient, and they will say, “I see you’ve got a lump on your arm and it means this and this and this.” The artificial intelligence scribe is taking down everything that the doctor is saying, that the patient is saying, and it’s creating notes. It formats the notes in the format that the doctor needs those notes to be in. It’s that potential, and the doctors that I spoke to who are using these scribes say it saves them hours and hours. Most family doctors spend about 20 hours a week filling in paperwork after they’ve met with their patients—every week. This saves them a lot of time. They can’t just ignore it—they have to go back and check to make sure that the scribe has got it right, and they have to make some fixes and things, but it saves them hours every week. So that’s a couple of applications in health care.", "0920", "Finance and banking: The first AI hedge fund was developed in Canada in 2016. It has outperformed most other hedge funds every year, except for 2020-21, because that was the pandemic and artificial intelligence uses the data that’s available. The pandemic was something that we had never experienced in the modern era. The last pandemic was in 1917, the Spanish flu, so there was just no database for it to figure out where to invest and not to invest during the pandemic. Every other year, though, it has outperformed most other artificial intelligence hedge funds.", "Natural resources and energy: I lived in Geraldton for a while. I worked for a mining company. Well, actually, I worked for a guy who worked for a mining company, and I was a sub-sub-subcontractor. Anyways, my job was to go out and cut lines through the bush. We would go with a chainsaw, and every 100 feet—we had a 100-foot string—we would leave a marker. The marker would say—I forget exactly what it was, but “It’s 79 degrees, so many minutes, so many seconds, and so many feet where you are,” so it gives a precise geographical location for that stake.", "Somebody would come along later with a magnetometer and take a magnetic reading at each of those stakes. Then they would map out the magnetic fields of the ground there. My colleague from Thunder Bay’s riding includes Geraldton, so she knows about this kind of work and the importance of this kind of mining exploration. They would create a magnetic map of the area and then they would figure out—they were searching for gold—where is there most likely to be a gold vein based on what we know?", "Then they would send down test drills. A test drill means a crew of three or four guys out in the bush in the middle of nowhere with pretty heavy equipment, working for days and days and days. So every test drill is a very expensive proposition, and this is just in the hope you might find a vein of gold when you’re drilling down.", "Artificial intelligence can utilize the data that we have in new ways, much better and much faster than a human being can. It can look at all the mapping and it can figure out where the best place to send down those test drills is, so that they can send them down with greater accuracy and hopefully find minerals more often. That’s just another application of this in natural resources and energy.", "Smart cities: One of the issues that we face in the city of Toronto is congestion, I know, my riding is the downtown waterfront. When you are driving along the Gardiner Expressway and you’re going through, and there are condos on either side and you feel like if you really were a pizza delivery guy you could probably just toss the pizza into somebody’s balcony and deliver it that way, that’s my riding, and I will say that it’s the best riding in the province to live in.", "One of the challenges is that we have got 15,000 people by night and 40,000 people per square kilometre during the day. The challenge is that not everybody can get into the downtown core of Toronto by car, just because logistically, 40,000 cars don’t fit in a square kilometre. But one of the things that we can do, besides building transit and alternatives for moving people en masse, is to have smart lights. There is real potential for artificial intelligence to generate lights that will be much smarter. They can figure out, “Okay, how do we configure all of the stoplights in the downtown core to best facilitate the movement of cars?” It offers incredible opportunities for reducing congestion.", "In agriculture, artificial intelligence can aid in precision farming. I’ve talked to my colleague from, I want to say Timiskaming—" ] }, { "speaker": "The Deputy Speaker (Ms. Donna Skelly)", "text": [ "Cochrane." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Chris Glover", "text": [ "Thank you—Timiskaming–Cochrane, who was a farmer. He’s a retired farmer. He was talking about how, if you’re a farmer, you know your fields. You know where there’s a slight slope, so at the top of the slope, you may need to put more fertilizer because it’s going to wash down; at the bottom of the slope, you know there’s going to be more water—all the different things that you know in your fields. Well, artificial intelligence, when you’re harvesting your crops, monitors how many crops you’re getting per hectare. What is the density of crops? Where are your fields most productive? Where are they least productive? How do you better manage the distribution of fertilizer and seed to maximize your yield in the following year? This is just one other application.", "Other applications of artificial intelligence—this one, the Ottawa Catholic School Board is already on it. They developed guidelines for students to use artificial intelligence to help solve math problems and create essay outlines. And they’re having teachers use artificial intelligence to generate lesson plans, adjust content to a student’s specific needs and give feedback on assignments.", "Now, again, artificial intelligence is a tool, and it can be a really useful tool in learning, but it doesn’t replace the human connection. And one of the lessons that came out of the pandemic is that students need to be with teachers in a classroom. That’s when they learn best. Students do not learn best at home, alone, on a computer screen.", "We are social animals, and we need to be with each other. I think it’s the reason that, even here in the Legislature, we need to be with each other. We have a debate, a conversation going back and forth, because this is how we learn from each other. So the artificial intelligence—a useful tool in education—doesn’t replace the human interaction and the teachers.", "Manufacturing: Artificial intelligence-powered automation can enhance productivity, quality control and supply chain management.", "In entertainment and media, it can revolutionize content creation. This can be a wonderful thing, but it can also be a really risky thing. I have been speaking with members of ACTRA, which is the actors’ union, and they are deeply concerned about artificial intelligence. They feel like they are the canaries in the coal mine, because their images and their voices can be copied, and that can be used as a database to generate new content without their necessarily even being aware and possibly not being reimbursed for it.", "Some of the voice actors that I talked to said, “You go in and you’re dubbing an animated series or something. You go in and they take your voice. Then, there’s something that didn’t work right, so you get another day’s pay because you’re called back in to do it. Now, with artificial intelligence, they don’t need to call you back in. They can take your voice and fit it to the script that they need and they can make the adjustments.” So the actors are losing their pay.", "There’s a real risk that movies will be generated and scripts will be written with artificial intelligence. Now, the technology is not there yet, but it’s coming. So there’s a real need for us to have a deep discussion about how we protect jobs, about what jobs look like in the future with artificial intelligence. The actors are saying, “Hey, we’re the canaries in the coal mine.” We really need to pay attention to their experience. We need to figure out how we are going to protect their jobs, how to protect their intellectual property—their data, which is their voice and their image—and we need to be able to use that understanding for future regulation and for future legislation.", "Cyber security: Artificial intelligence just raises the game in cyber security. Artificial intelligence can be incredibly useful for cyber security firms to test out. You can say to ChatGPT, “Okay, if I’m trying to hack into this agency, what’s the best way to do it?” Artificial intelligence generates ideas, so it will generate ideas.", "On the other hand, the negative players, the bad players, are also using artificial intelligence. They’re saying, “Hey, how can we hack into this agency? What are the most likely controls that a cyber security firm would put in?” It’s just an escalation in cyber security.", "0930", "Research and development: This is one of the most incredible areas, research and development, where artificial intelligence is already playing a major role.", "So those are the opportunities. I want to talk a little bit about the risks of artificial intelligence.", "The first is bias in outputs, and we’ve already seen that Google tried, as an example, using AI for hiring engineers, and the AI excluded women when it was asked because there’s a human bias against women engineers. The artificial intelligence compounded that bias. This is a real risk. There’s a risk of discrimination and it speaks to the need for transparency and also for a human in the loop, that there need to be checks on this so that we’re making sure that the artificial intelligence is not replicating human bias.", "Labour disruption: I mentioned the actors. Some jobs are already becoming obsolete, and this is a real risk of social turmoil. I will give an example. My son is 27 years old. He graduated two years ago from Seneca College in the animation program—and I know I’m going to sound biased here, but I think he’s an incredibly talented animator, an incredibly talented artist. It’s not just my bias; I think he really is, and I’ve got other people to confirm it. You can look him up online and you can see how wonderful his work is.", "Anyway, when he started the program six years ago at Seneca, if you went through that program and you were reasonably talented when you graduated, you were guaranteed to be hired by a studio making $100,000 a year. That was straight out of college. By the time he graduated, artificial intelligence had changed and the whole animation industry had changed in part because television and movies had been supplanted by streaming services.", "The only streaming service that generates a profit right now is Netflix. Some of the other streaming services are actually big enough that they are using them as loss leaders. Apple is not going to close down because their streaming service is not making money because they will continue to support it. But the streaming services are not investing in new products like they used to, so there aren’t as many movies. There aren’t as many animated features and short cartoons being made, so the animation industry has really taken a hit.", "His mentors, his professors, who not only teach but they also work in the industry, they’re having trouble finding work right now. So there is a generation of kids that spent all this money, all this time, developing these skills, and the industry, by the time they graduated, has changed so much, and there is a real risk here.", "Now, he’s done okay. He is—again, proud dad—just incredibly ambitious and has been sending out—he will create short animations and send them out to people and say, “Hey, look, this is the kind of product I can produce for you,” and he’s been able to generate some contracts through that. So it’s working okay, but this is how fast the industry is changing. We need to find ways to protect workers, to protect jobs, in this artificial intelligence revolution.", "I would say, also, with small businesses: Small businesses are really struggling right now. Coming out of the pandemic, many of them took on massive debts during the pandemic. They are still recuperating from that. Storefront businesses are competing now with online shopping.", "The other thing that is happening—and this bill is both about artificial intelligence, which I’ve been focusing on, but it’s also about cyber security. They have got incredible cyber security costs now, and small businesses have difficulty keeping up with the cyber security needs, to make sure that the data that they have in their business is safe.", "John Kiru, who is the head of the Toronto Association of BIAs, says that six months after a small business is hacked, most of them are closing because they just can’t carry the cost of restitution, and they can’t carry the cost of the cyber security that they need. So, as a Legislature, we need to be looking at small businesses as well.", "Other risks: democratic rights—surveillance is everywhere. There was a project by Google in the downtown Toronto waterfront, and the community was very concerned about all the data that was going to be collected in that community, because there were going to be cameras everywhere, so they would know who was coming in and who was going out. They say they would disaggregate the data and they wouldn’t use facial recognition software, but if that data is collected, it’s pretty easy to just change that over and start collecting with facial recognition software.", "One of the most shocking things—and this happened about eight years ago—for me is Google Maps. I have Google Maps on my phone, and about six, eight years ago, it asked me to check my data settings, and so I did. It had traced everywhere I had been in the past year. I had been to No Frills 40 times, and I had been to the Metro 20 times, which speaks to the fact that I try to budget. It was shocking that Google Maps knows every place that I’ve been. It probably knows every place that all of us have been. And then when you combine this with artificial intelligence, which is another tool for analyzing that data—the surveillance of this data is incredibly risky, and it’s a threat to us.", "The other risk is control of large cloud corporations—Microsoft, Google, Apple. They are the corporate giants in the world right now, and they are dictating what governments can and cannot do about how governments can and cannot regulate them. That is incredibly frightening, and it is a threat to our democratic rights.", "Also, political interference: We saw it in the 2016 American election, where they used social media to discourage Black voters from getting out to vote, and that helped to sway the outcome of that election. Now, with artificial intelligence, we’ve got deepfake manipulation and targeted advertisements, so our elections are much more open to manipulation. So protecting our democratic elections has got to be a number one priority for any responsible government anywhere in the world. In this case, we’re in Ontario; we need to make sure that our democratic elections are not being interfered with.", "Other risks—I mentioned that AI has no ethical framework, and I mentioned weapons. Artificial intelligence should never be in charge of making a decision when there is a potential negative human impact. So, targeting weapons—artificial intelligence should never be used for that.", "The last one that I’ll talk about is the existential risk. There’s a quote I’ll say from Nick Bostrom: “Machine intelligence is the last invention that humanity will ever need to make.” There’s a thing called artificial general intelligence—and this is a belief that we are getting close to a machine that can learn to accomplish any intellectual task that human beings can perform, and the benchmark of this is a machine that improves itself. AI is not there yet. But the last machine that we will ever make is a machine that improves itself, because then it doesn’t need us anymore. Even five years ago, they were saying, “We think we may hit this in 2042.” Now some people are predicting that we’re going to hit this in 2026. I do not have the skills and knowledge necessary to know whether that’s true, but certainly artificial intelligence is developing at an exponential rate, and certainly we will get to that point where a machine is developing a machine that improves itself. And then, the real question is, what is our role? So there is an existential threat.", "I mentioned that I was going to give my speech by telling stories. I want to tell the second story. I’m going to take a drink of water because I got four glasses here. I might as well.", "0940", "John G. FitzGerald: He was a Canadian physician and researcher. He was born in 1882. He worked at the University of Toronto, and he learned to control—do you know when you get your vaccine, you get DPT—diphtheria, polio, tetanus—some of the fundamental vaccines that you get together? Before there was a vaccine, he developed a way of controlling diphtheria spread through a drug called antitoxin. And then, when the vaccine actually became available, he started producing it in a lab at the University of Toronto, and that lab eventually became Connaught Labs.", "The goal of Connaught Labs—and this is the story—he used some of his wife’s inheritance to create this lab at the university in Toronto to produce vaccines and other medicines, to distribute them for free to the public. One of the great inventions that came out of Connaught Labs is Banting and Best were able to develop insulin for managing diabetes. This is just one of the legacies of Connaught Labs. It was a not-for-profit, public institution that was making Canada a global leader in both the production of vaccines but also in research work. Another thing that came out of there was Heparin, which is an anticoagulant without which you could not conduct open-heart surgery or organ transplants.", "So Canada was a global leader in pharmaceutical research and vaccine development and distribution. In the late 1980s, former Prime Minister Mulroney sold Connaught Labs to a private, for-profit corporation. Since then, relatively little pharmaceutical research is conducted in Canada. The pandemic hit us in 2020, and Canada spent $9 billion to procure COVID vaccines from American and European pharmaceutical corporations. We did not have our own pharmaceutical research lab because we had sold off Connaught Labs 30 or 40 years prior.", "One of the things—as we’re in the midst of this artificial intelligence revolution, we need to make sure that we are positioning ourselves as well as possible to seize the opportunities, but also to mitigate the risks of artificial intelligence. The ideology that’s been pursued by both federal and provincial governments over the last 40 years, the sell-off of public assets, the privatization of public services, even the sell-off of Canadian private corporations has really impaired our ability to be global leaders.", "The thing that we have done well is in tech and development. Ontario has the fastest-growing tech sector in North America. It’s growing faster than Silicon Valley, although Silicon Valley is much bigger—we’re not in danger of overtaking them any time soon. But the reason we have such a strong, vibrant tech sector is because of government investment and research through our public colleges and universities. I mentioned that Geoffrey Hinton, the godfather of AI, was a researcher at the University of Toronto. So the privatization of our colleges and universities, and what’s happening now, the crisis that they’re facing, is undermining our ability to be global leaders.", "I’ve got quite a few notes about all the things that have been privatized by federal and provincial governments or sold off to foreign corporations by federal and provincial governments over the last 40 years. I just want to read through the list really quickly—I’m going to summarize it as much as I can—because it really speaks to how we sold off our industrial base.", "When the Americans came to the Mulroney Conservatives in the 1980s and said, “Hey, we want to sign a free trade agreement,” there was a real suspicion that they wanted to take over our natural resources. They wanted to own them through American corporations. And that was a real risk.", "Mulroney sold off Petro-Canada, Air Canada, Teleglobe, CNR. They cancelled the universality of Employment Insurance and Old Age Security. So they really took a big whack at our crown corporations and also at the universality of our social safety net.", "Under the Chrétien and Martin Liberals, when they got into power, 57% of people who were unemployed were eligible for Employment Insurance; by the time they left, only 37%. When you think about the disruption that’s going to be caused by artificial intelligence, that’s an incredibly dangerous figure, because that means that only 37% of people who may lose their job through artificial intelligence technology are going to be eligible for Employment Insurance.", "Our health care services: Everything except for hospitals has been privatized through the Harris Conservatives—home care, long-term care, senior homes, medical lab tests. And all of these privatization projects cost us money. I’ll just give one example. In the hospitals a blood test costs $22. In the private, for-profit profit labs, it costs $33. We are paying more for these private, for-profit corporations.", "I think one of the big things that should be mentioned here is that Harper, when he was Prime Minister, sold off major Canadian corporations—in fact just about all of the major Canadian corporations. He sold off the entire steel industry: Stelco, Dofasco, Algoma and IPSCO. The Molson Amphitheatre down at Ontario Place is now called Budweiser Stage because Molson and Labatt were both sold off.", "The Hudson Bay Co., Alcan, Inco, CP Hotels, CP Ships, Seagram, MacMillan Bloedel, Corel, Noranda, Bauer hockey equipment and Tim Hortons: All of them were sold off under the Harper Conservatives, all of our major private corporations.", "This government is continuing with the privatization. It’s privatizing our hospitals, it’s privatizing our colleges and universities. They are underfunding our health care system, our schools, our colleges, our universities. We have the lowest number of hospital beds per capita not just in Canada but in the Americas, except for two other countries. We have two million people without a family doctor.", "All of this means that we’re not preparing ourselves for the disruption of artificial intelligence. We need a robust social safety net. We need a robust public sector research sector in our colleges, our universities and our hospitals. Right now, all of them are grossly underfunded and struggling just to stay alive.", "I want to tell my third story. In November 2021, in the midst of the pandemic, there was a vaccine database hack that happened. During the pandemic the vast majority of us signed up for a COVID vaccine. There was a central database that kept all the data and there was a hack in November 2021.", "In December 2022, the government announced this—so almost a year later—and 360,000 people received notices that their personal information was part of a data breach of the COVaxON system. The two people who did this were 21 and 22 years old. One was actually working in the system—at least, they allegedly did this; they were charged with doing this hack. They got the data of hundreds of thousands of people. A 21- and a 22-year-old allegedly got the data of hundreds of thousands of people through this hack.", "The response from the Ministry of Health—and I would say they responded appropriately: They launched a massive project to protect our data. They developed the cyber security operating model. It took months and months to do it and it cost $22 million just in the 2023-24 year to make sure that our vaccine data is safe.", "This is one ministry and one hack. The moral of this story is—and I have been talking mostly about artificial intelligence; this bill deals with both artificial intelligence and cyber security in the public sector—cyber security is incredibly expensive. If one ministry hack response was to spend $22 million in a single year on preparations, on tools, to make sure that that hack doesn’t happen again, imagine the resources that are needed, particularly by our smaller public sector agencies in this province—our small hospitals, our small school boards.", "0950", "When I’ve been speaking with cyber security experts, they say one of the things that these hackers look for is underfunded agencies that have valuable data, because if they’re underfunded, if they’re struggling with their funding, then they don’t have the money or the financial wherewithal or the technical expertise to protect their data.", "I want to pivot now—I don’t have that much time left. I want to talk a little bit about how vulnerable our public sector agencies are because almost all of them are struggling financially right now. So 11 of our 23 universities in Ontario are running deficits here. Our colleges—the funding has shifted so that they are dependent upon international students to maintain their budgets, and this is incredibly precarious for those colleges and universities. They don’t have the money available to develop the technology and also the financial wherewithal for cyber security to protect the data that’s in their banks.", "And it’s not just that hack. There’s hacks happening all of the time. The Toronto Public Library was hacked a year ago. Five southwestern Ontario hospitals were hacked in the last year. The city of Hamilton was hacked. So this government is recognizing this and bringing forward this Bill 194 to look at cyber security and also the opportunities and risks of artificial intelligence.", "But the bill itself has very little in it. Most of the bill is actually about regulation. The bill says the word “regulation” 52 times. I know this is kind of inside baseball; most people don’t know the different between legislation and regulation, but legislation is when the government or any member of this House brings forward a bill for debate. It’s publicly debated here in the House and anybody in the province can listen to the debate. That’s legislation. Regulation is what the ministers do in their offices. They create regulations to implement and flesh out that legislation.", "This bill does not actually contain much of substance on the artificial intelligence framework or on protecting cyber security for our public sector agencies. Most of the bill just says the minister is empowered to create regulations. So almost all of this is going to be happening behind closed doors. The bill also does not provide support to smaller organizations. I mentioned smaller hospitals and smaller colleges, universities and school boards. They don’t have the expertise or the financial wherewithal for proper cyber security.", "One of the recommendations I’m making to this bill, an amendment, would be to provide the supports that our public sector colleges, universities and hospitals need. This government is currently attempting to create a crisis in our hospitals, our colleges and universities—to privatize them. One of the risks of that, especially at this period of time with artificial intelligence and cyber security threats, is that you are underfunding these public agencies at a time when they are most at risk and you’re creating an atmosphere where they are least able to develop the technology to actually make us global leaders or make us continue to be global leaders in tech development and in artificial intelligence.", "I’ll quote the most important quote from this bill:", "“The government of Ontario: ...", "“Believes that artificial intelligence systems in the public sector should be used in a responsible, transparent, accountable and secure manner that benefits the people of Ontario while protecting privacy.”", "So the four principles that the bill itself lays out are “responsible, transparent, accountable and secure.” The government has already violated the transparency principle with the process it’s used to develop this bill.", "I’ve got my one-hour responses. This speech is the opposition’s one-hour response to the government bill that was introduced in the spring. Normally, when a bill is introduced in the Legislature, it goes through the first reading, it goes through the second reading—the government lead gives a one-hour speech, the opposition gives a one-hour speech, then there’s debate back and forth. When the debate is finished, it’s sent off to committee. There is an all-party committee that will examine the bill. The public is welcome to come in and speak to the bill. This is how legislation is developed. After amendments are made in committee, it comes back to the Legislature for third reading. That’s how a bill goes through this Legislature.", "What the government did is, they introduced the bill, they had the government speech—it hasn’t gone to committee, but the government held consultations all summer long, by themselves. So only Conservative Party members and ministers or whoever was in there—we don’t know—were doing this consultation. So when the government says that AI, artificial intelligence, cyber security—one of the principles that should be followed is transparency—the government has already violated its own ethical principle in transparency. The other violation—and I mentioned this already: There are 52 times in the bill when the bill says the minister is going to be empowered to develop regulations. So all of the regulations are developed behind the scenes. The regulations are not debated in this House publicly, for the public to see, or in committee, where the public can actually have input. They’re developed behind the scenes. So, again, the government is violating this principle. This is a really dangerous precedent that the government is setting. They say nice things—they say, yes, the development of AI policy and cyber security policy should be public, it should be debated, it should be transparent, but they’re not actually doing that.", "When I talk to the smaller agencies, some of the smaller school boards, some of the smaller colleges, universities, hospitals about what they need in terms of cyber security and artificial intelligence—opportunities and risks—they all say, “We need centralized support.” It’s not good enough for the government just to say these agencies are going to have to have a robust cyber security framework, because they don’t have the financial wherewithal or the technical expertise to actually develop it themselves or even potentially to procure the most effective system. This is where the government really needs to take the lead on this and where this bill is badly flawed. This bill should lay out that the government will be providing the supports needed to these agencies—that there will be a central procurement for cyber security for public sector agencies, so that not every school board has to hire staff to find out what the best cyber security system is, so that every hospital doesn’t have to do that. The government will say, “This is the cyber security software that we are recommending”—and government could actually do it much cheaper by doing a centralized procurement. The other advantage of the government procuring our cyber security software for all of our public sector agencies would be that we could choose an Ontario company.", "As the tech and innovation critic, I have visited many small start-ups, many accelerators, many tech companies, and they say one of the most important things, especially for a tech start-up, is that they get a government contract. If a tech start-up gets a government contract, then they have legitimacy. When they go out to other countries or other jurisdictions to look for contracts, they can say, “We’ve got stability. We’ve got a government contract.” A government contract is also a vote of confidence in their ability to deliver their products.", "So there’s an opportunity here for the government to have a centralized system of procurement for cyber security software, for artificial intelligence research and development tools, and to benefit not only our hospitals, our colleges, our universities, our school boards and other public sector agencies, but also to benefit Ontario entrepreneurs and start-ups and tech companies. So this is something that we really need the government to pay attention to.", "1000", "I will say that my riding of Spadina–Fort York includes Ontario Place, and one of the most frustrating parts about this plan for redeveloping Ontario Place, Ontario Place was developed by a former Conservative government under John Robarts and then opened by Bill Davis to celebrate Ontario ingenuity. The IMAX theatre that is there was the world’s first IMAX theatre. IMAX is a technology that was developed in Ontario. Eb Zeidler was the architect who designed the pods and the Cinesphere. He was an Ontario-based architect. Ontario Place launched his global career. Michael Hough was the landscape architect who designed the beautiful landscape and the forest that has now been cut down at Ontario Place.", "Ontario Place was designed to celebrate the ingenuity of Ontario. This government has contracted it out. They’ve given it away, plus the tax subsidy, to an Austrian spa company and to an American concert venue. So it has nothing to do with Ontario, and the reason I’m bringing this up is, we need to support our local businesses. We need to celebrate Ontario businesses, Ontario entrepreneurs and Ontario ingenuity, and we can do it through this bill on cyber security and artificial intelligence by supporting our public colleges, our public universities, our public hospitals and our public school boards so that they can continue to make us global leaders in research and development and help our companies to seize the opportunities of artificial intelligence and also to protect us from cyber security threats.", "I’m hoping the government—and I’ve seen that some of you are listening—will take some of these recommendations seriously. The most important one is that we need to rebuild a robust public sector in order to seize the opportunities of artificial intelligence and to protect us from cyber security threats, and those includes all of the things, all of the agencies that I’ve talked about, plus many, many more.", "Thank you for listening. I’m down to 10 seconds. I’m going to have a glass of water, and I think we open up it for questions. Thank you." ] }, { "speaker": "The Deputy Speaker (Ms. Donna Skelly)", "text": [ "It is now time for questions and answers.", "I recognized the member for Brantford–Brant." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Will Bouma", "text": [ "Thank you, Speaker. It’s good to see you in the chair.", "I appreciated listening to the member’s speech. I think I caught most of it. I had to step out a couple of times because there are some other things going on this morning, but I really appreciated his in-depth look at this. If I caught the gist right—and he can correct me—it’s that he’s generally supportive and quite supportive, moving down the road, of trying to control some of these emerging technologies in the province of Ontario. I thought he had some very interesting and intriguing suggestions on what we could do with this legislation in order to improve it.", "I guess my question to him is, will he and will his caucus be supporting this piece of legislation on second reading so that it can go to committee and he can put forward some of his amendments? Will he stand up in the House right now and say, “Yes, we are supporting this legislation,” so that we can get that in there, and then we can further the conversation about improvements to the bill?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Chris Glover", "text": [ "The risk with this bill is that the bill doesn’t actually contain much. It’s sort of a framework that gives the power to the government to create regulations. The government needs to change that framework. We need to develop a definition of AI, and what are appropriate uses and what inappropriate uses. We need to embed that into the legislation. We need to make sure that the small public sector agencies are given the supports they need for the artificial intelligence revolution but also to protect their data and cyber security.", "So if the government is open to making major amendments and making this bill transparent so that not everything is going to be done behind closed doors with regulation, but it will actually be part of the legislation, then I think we can support it. But we need to make sure that the government is willing to have a public debate and live by its own principles of responsible artificial intelligence adoption, which includes transparency. So we need this bill to be much more transparent." ] }, { "speaker": "The Deputy Speaker (Ms. Donna Skelly)", "text": [ "Further questions?" ] }, { "speaker": "MPP Lise Vaugeois", "text": [ "Thank you to the member from Spadina–Fort York for, really, a wonderful presentation and introduction to the issues.", "I am concerned about so much work being done in regulations. We’re at the very beginning of this. Nobody really knows how to solve all the problems that you have raised, so we need as many experts at the table as possible to sort out how this is going to play out, how we’re going to support innovation here and support people’s work and support our security.", "I just wonder if you could speak to the importance of having those voices at the table." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Chris Glover", "text": [ "I want to thank the member from Thunder Bay–Superior North for the incredible work that she does in supporting her community, which includes Geraldton, which is a place that I lived in at one time and is still near and dear to me.", "You’re right: Artificial intelligence is moving at an exponential rate and cyber security threats are also moving at an exponential rate. And there is no one person or no one group that has the expertise to help us to manage this.", "This is really the opportunity for this government to reach across the floor and to develop a collaborative process, not just with us as legislators but with public sector and private sector experts, in a transparent way, to develop the tools that we need to seize the opportunities of artificial intelligence, to protect us from its risks and also to protect us and our province from increasing cyber security risk. Absolutely, collaboration has got to be key in the development of these policies." ] }, { "speaker": "The Deputy Speaker (Ms. Donna Skelly)", "text": [ "Further questions?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Logan Kanapathi", "text": [ "Thank you to my colleague from Spadina–Fort York for the in-depth presentation. I was enjoying your presentation. I know you are a lecturer. You are lecturing us for more than an hour, a wonderful presentation. I have a lot of respect for him.", "But having said that, Madam Speaker—and I was listening to him; very informative—at the end of the day, he is not supporting this bill. Our government is committed to helping vital institutions such as schools—a lot of students are here—hospitals and family services centres to protect sensitive data in their care. Every Ontarian has a right to feel safe and protected from cyber security attacks.", "So my question to my colleague: I ask the member opposite to please tell us why he opposes methods that make Ontarians feel safe and protected when it comes to their data." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Chris Glover", "text": [ "I want to thank the member from Markham–Thornhill for your comments. We actually have a common friend from Delft, a small island just off Sri Lanka.", "Anyway, what we are asking for with this legislation is—there are four principles of good policy in artificial intelligence and cyber security: responsible, transparent, accountable and secure. This government has to show us in this legislation that they are adopting all four of those principles that they say in the legislation, but that the legislation itself contradicts, because all of the legislation here is about giving the minister power to create regulations behind the scenes, the very opposite of the principle of transparency.", "The government needs to show that it is willing to be transparent in the development of artificial intelligence and cyber security policy so that the public and the opposition can be confident that it is being developed in the public’s best interest." ] }, { "speaker": "The Deputy Speaker (Ms. Donna Skelly)", "text": [ "Further questions?" ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Peggy Sattler", "text": [ "I want to congratulate my colleague on his very thoughtful speech about this bill.", "He raised concerns about the risks involved if onerous requirements, costly requirements, are placed on public sector institutions that are already facing significant financial pressures. I know in my community, the CAS of London–Middlesex is looking at a $9.1-million deficit. The hospital, LHSC, is projecting a $150-million deficit. Within the post-secondary sector, which this bill applies to, he pointed out the number of universities that are reporting deficits this year.", "Can the member elaborate a bit more about why resources have to be allocated for public sector institutions to be successful in this—" ] }, { "speaker": "The Deputy Speaker (Ms. Donna Skelly)", "text": [ "To the member for Spadina–Fort York." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Chris Glover", "text": [ "I want to thank the member from London West for the question. If we’ve got a billion and a half dollars to give to Therme for the Ontario Place project, then we have enough money to fund our hospitals, our colleges, our universities. Instead, all of them—many of them—are on the verge of bankruptcy. The government gave $900 million in emergency funding to our colleges to keep them from going bankrupt this year, but that’s not long-term supportive financing. That’s just an emergency measure.", "1010", "And 11 of our 23 universities in this province are running deficits. Our hospitals are cutting staff and services because they do not have enough money. The risk is that all of these agencies are at greater risk of cyber security attacks because the hackers know that they are underfunded and that they don’t have the money to hire the technology to protect them." ] }, { "speaker": "The Deputy Speaker (Ms. Donna Skelly)", "text": [ "Further questions?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Dave Smith", "text": [ "The member opposite brought up some really interesting points here. Coming from the IT industry before getting into politics, I want to point out a couple of things: Our legislative process, if we do things relatively quickly, we introduce the bill at first reading, then it comes back for second reading and we’ve got eight hours of debate, and then it will go to committee for a couple of days, come back from committee after a couple of days and another six and a half hours of debate to change something on the legislative side. On the regulatory side, though, we could make a change relatively quickly.", "Now let’s say that we are in a hypothetical scenario where we’ve had a cyber attack, it has compromised our system and we need to make a regulatory change to adjust for that. Is it prudent to take a minimum of a week to do that and be exposed for that length of time, or is it more prudent, then, to do it in a regulatory regime so that you can make that adjustment quickly?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Chris Glover", "text": [ "I want to thank the member from Peterborough–Kawartha for the question. The example that you give is a place where regulation would actually make sense. If there’s a cyber attack, you may need to develop a regulation. But in the legislation, there should be a definition of “artificial intelligence”—what is an appropriate use of artificial intelligence, what is an inappropriate use of artificial intelligence. The European Union has developed legislation that has a framework like that.", "We also need support built into the legislation for these agencies to have adequate funding, not just for their day-to-day activities but also for the emerging technology of artificial intelligence and for cyber security.", "What we need in the legislation is a robust definition of “artificial intelligence” and a commitment to support, particularly, small agencies, but public sector agencies in this tumultuous time." ] }, { "speaker": "The Deputy Speaker (Ms. Donna Skelly)", "text": [ "That is all the time we have for questions and answers.", "Second reading debate deemed adjourned." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Mr. Will Bouma", "text": [ "Good morning, everyone. I first heard of the living donor program thanks to Jason Shawana, a Brantford hockey coach who had part of his liver removed during his battle with cancer. Jason’s story inspired me to become a living donor so that I could have the ability to save a life. Over the course of the last year, I have been working hard behind the scenes to get in shape to become a living donor for my liver. A couple of months ago, I underwent seven hours of surgery and had 40% of my liver removed, and I am pleased to report that the surgery was a success and that the recipient is doing extremely well.", "As a Christian, I am motivated to serve both God and my community, and by becoming a living donor, I have been able to save and improve the life of someone in the province of Ontario. The entire process of donating a portion of my liver was both profound and deeply meaningful; however, during this process, I could not help but think of the countless Ontarians who are currently waiting for organ transplants. While I recovered in hospital, I learned that if only one out of every 10,000 Ontarians were willing to become a living donor, the entire transplant waiting list would be cleared.", "If I can help inspire even one person to register as a living donor, Speaker, I will be overjoyed." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Mrs. Lisa Gretzky", "text": [ "After an extended five-month shutdown imposed by the Premier, I’m pleased to be back in the Legislature. While so many across this province are struggling, the Premier extended the summer shutdown, so he could avoid being held accountable for his harmful decisions—no question period, no media scrums, no transparency and no accountability.", "Over the summer, I visited my constituents at their homes, workplaces, community events and more. I heard first-hand about the struggles they are facing: parents working two or more jobs just to try to feed their families and, hopefully, keep a roof over their head.", "After the Premier removed rent control, many constituents are having to choose between paying rent and buying groceries. More than a million Ontarians turn to food banks. People on ODSP are even further behind, and homelessness is increasing.", "Public health care is crumbling: People are waiting more than five hours for care in emergency rooms, assuming one is open in their community, and 2.5 million Ontarians don’t have a family doctor.", "Public schools are crumbling, overcrowded and unsafe classrooms are the norm and the repair log keeps getting bigger.", "Intimate partner violence continues to impact every community in Ontario. Nearly 100 municipalities have declared IPV an epidemic, and yet just yesterday, the Conservatives voted no to passing my Bill 173 and declaring IPV an epidemic.", "Ontarians need and deserve a government that is focused on making their lives better, making it easier, not a Premier who is solely focused on pet projects that only make his friends wealthier and life harder for Ontarians. It is time for some positive change." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Mr. Rick Byers", "text": [ "Good morning, colleagues. Last month, I had the honour of attending an excellent celebration at the Shouldice Stone facility in the great community of Shallow Lake in the great riding of Bruce–Grey–Owen Sound. The event was to recognize Shouldice Stone’s receipt of funding through the Regional Development Program’s Southwestern Ontario Development Fund, which will boost the local manufacturing sector and create excellent new jobs in the community.", "Bev Shouldice started Shouldice Stone in 1947. Rob and June grew the business by adding numerous innovations and new products to reflect customers’ expanding tastes. Architects, builders, masons and homeowners have relied on Canadian-made Shouldice Stone for durable, eye-catching results, whether for a dream home or company project. Today, Brad and Steve continue the family legacy and are growing the business for generations to come. They proudly carry on the family’s promise: “Our word is our bond, and our handshake is a contract.”", "I saw first-hand the great culture this promise has created at the celebration event on September 20. Workers, families, community members and partnering companies all were there in great numbers to celebrate this great enterprise. After touring the production facilities and the new office building, meeting Steve, Brad and CEO Chris Pedersen, it was easy to see how Shouldice Stone has been such a success.", "Congratulations on your great success and your great contribution to our community." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Mr. Joel Harden", "text": [ "Yesterday, we debated legislation about stunt driving. It’s an important road safety issue. My question for the House this morning is: What do we do about stunt policies? Because right now, there’s a lot of that happening in Ontario. We have a Premier right now who insists, without any evidence, that bike lanes cause traffic congestion, or that bike lanes delay first responders from getting to the scene of an accident, or that we somehow need a 38-kilometre tunnel under the 401 to reduce traffic. This is what peddling in stunt policies that aren’t serious looks like. This is a government that is impaired by the determination to pit road users against each other, when they should be focusing on safety for everyone.", "While they play games, people are getting hurt and killed on our streets, like Audrey Cameron, a 16-year-old back home in Ottawa, who was hit by a reckless driver last month and had her pelvis and right knee shattered. She has traumatic brain injuries. The Premier’s stunt policies are not going to help Audrey or anyone else. But I’ll tell you something: Tomorrow at 5 p.m., outside this building, I and the member for University–Rosedale and others will be gathering with road safety advocates, families who have lost loved ones, people who have been injured by reckless driving and reckless policies on our streets. We will not play games with people’s lives, and this government shouldn’t be playing games with people’s lives." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Mr. Lorne Coe", "text": [ "Thanks to our health minister and the Premier, our government has provided more than $12 million in capital planning grants to support Lakeridge Health’s master redevelopment plan, as part of a larger overall investment to complete this multi-phase expansion.", "1020", "This expansion of Lakeridge’s services and hospital campuses will add a total of 300 new hospital beds and enhanced services throughout the region:", "—redeveloping the Bowmanville Hospital to double the hospital’s capacity by adding 32 new beds and building new, state-of-the-art facilities;", "—a brand new regional hospital in Whitby;", "—a new post-acute care centre in Pickering; and", "—creating space for acute care capacity at the Oshawa site by relocating some services to a new post-acute care centre in Pickering.", "We’ll continue to take bold, decisive action to expand capacity and build modern, state-of-the-art facilities across the province, to reduce wait times and ensure people of all ages can access fast, convenient care closer to home. Once again, we are getting it done for the province of Ontario." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Ms. Bhutila Karpoche", "text": [ "MPPs are finally back in the House for the fall session. We were supposed to be back after Labour Day, but the Ford Conservatives did not want to get back to Queen’s Park. The House is sitting after five months. Why? Because the Ford Conservatives want to avoid accountability. Here are some of the actions, blunders by the Premier, when the House wasn’t in session.", "Breaking the Beer Store contract to bring booze to corner stores a year earlier is costing taxpayers over $200 million. Even people who want beer in corner stores say they could have waited a few months to save that money.", "The Conservative government abruptly closed the Ontario Science Centre, citing roof panels as a safety concern. It turns out that not only were there no immediate safety issues, but that one in 12 public schools have the same roof panels.", "The Therme deal was finally released, and it’s one of the worst deals this province has ever made, putting taxpayers on the hook for billions of dollars over 95 years and chopping down 300 mature trees for a luxury spa.", "It doesn’t end there. The Premier is talking about building a tunnel under Highway 401 and destroying already built infrastructure like bike lanes. Meanwhile, there’s no completion date for the Eglinton Crosstown, which is billions over budget and led to the destruction of hundreds of small businesses.", "And who can forget the Premier’s appointment of the largest cabinet this province has ever seen?", "The Premier talks about respecting taxpayers, but his actions disrespect the hard-working people of this province." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Ms. Laura Smith", "text": [ "It’s Breast Cancer Awareness Month in Ontario. One in nine women will be affected in their lifetime.", "In late fall of 2020, I became a statistic when after a routine mammogram, I was diagnosed with DCIS, ductal carcinoma in situ. This is an early form of breast cancer, but my surgeon promised that I would still be here in five years if we acted quickly, and I’m here today because of early detection and regular mammograms.", "That’s why I’m so proud our government is connecting more women to life-saving breast cancer screening by lowering the age of eligibility for self-referral to a mammogram from 50 to 40. As of October 8, women over the age of 40 can now self-refer, giving an additional one million women the option to detect and treat breast cancer sooner and get on with their lives.", "In early 2022, months after my surgeries and my life-saving treatment, I got on with my life. I felt really strong and I ran in the provincial election as a candidate in Thornhill. I want to thank so many of the people in my health care journey, including Dr. Adena Scheer at St. Michael’s Hospital and the health care team with my doctor, Dr. Eric Silver. I’m here today because of early detection, I’m here for my community and, most importantly, I’m here for my kids." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Mrs. Karen McCrimmon", "text": [ "Good morning, colleagues. I was so lucky this summer to get out and have many conversations at community events, at the doorsteps in my riding, and most recently at the Carp Fair, my favourite place in the fall.", "I know people are struggling. Many of us don’t have a family doctor. They’re worried about the state of our health care system. They’re struggling to make ends meet. They’re struggling to find an affordable home. And they are rightly concerned about the state of our education system.", "I also got to visit amazing businesses in Kanata North, Canada’s largest technology park, including the amazing team at TutorOcean. They are using artificial intelligence to design learning tools to assist teachers, students and parents alike, creating incredible homework and tutoring platforms to suit any learning style, which can transform teacher-student relationships and boost engagement in the classroom. This cutting-edge Canadian technology is being presented to Harvard University next week.", "Last thing: Tomorrow, Wednesday, October 23, is Ottawa Student Transportation’s Driver Appreciation Day. Day in and day out, the school bus drivers ensure students travel safely to and from school. Our students and families couldn’t do without them. We thank them for their professionalism and commitment. Thank you, bus drivers." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Mr. Logan Kanapathi", "text": [ "Auto theft is a major issue across the country. Auto theft is not just theft, Mr. Speaker. In some cases, this is a life-or-death situation, with carjackings and armed robberies becoming common. People feel very unsafe in their own homes.", "That’s why, today, I rise to acknowledge the tremendous effort of York Regional Police in combatting the rise in auto thefts through the launch of Operation Auto Guard. This comprehensive initiative is aimed at reducing auto theft. The first Operation Auto Guard led to the recovery of 80 vehicles worth more than $5 million, with 56 people facing almost 300 charges.", "YRP have taken a multi-faceted approach, targeting high-risk neighbourhoods and engaging directly with the community. These proactive messages are making a real difference. Since last year, auto thefts have dropped by 30%. It’s a significant achievement that demonstrates the effectiveness of community-focused crime prevention and law enforcement.", "I also want to recognize our government’s support of these efforts with a $900,000 investment as part of a broader $18-million provincial plan to fight against auto theft.", "I would like to thank Chief Jim MacSween, and the men and women in uniform at the YRP for fighting against this dangerous crime." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Ms. Laurie Scott", "text": [ "I’m honoured to stand in the chamber today to celebrate my predecessor Chris Hodgson’s retirement from the Ontario Mining Association. For 40 years, Chris has played a very important role, not only with Ontario’s mining industry, but right here at Queen’s Park. Chris represented our home riding of Haliburton–Kawartha Lakes–Brock from 1994 to 2003. He served as Minister of Natural Resources, Northern Development and Mines, Minister of Municipal Affairs and Housing and Chair of the Management Board of Cabinet.", "During his time as a cabinet minister, Chris had many notable achievements. To name a few: As Minister of Natural Resources, Chris launched the government’s Living Legacy program, the single-biggest expansion of parks and protected spaces in Ontario’s history. He introduced the first amended Fish and Wildlife Conservation Act in 50 years, replacing the Game and Fish Act to toughen enforcement. He oversaw Smart Growth.", "Chris has had a profound impact on Ontario’s mining sector during his public life and also as president of the Ontario Mining Association since 2004. It is an extra special occasion, as tomorrow, we will celebrate Meet the Miners Day. Because of people like Chris Hodgson and organizations such as the Ontario Mining Association, our province enjoys a strong and robust sector.", "Mr. Speaker, I would like to thank Chris for his 40 years of contribution to the mining industry and service to the province of Ontario and wishing him the very best and well-earned retirement.", "1030", "We are all very proud of Chris and his accomplishments at home in Haliburton–Kawartha Lakes–Brock." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "I understand the Minister of Long-Term Care has a point of order she wishes to raise." ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Natalia Kusendova-Bashta", "text": [ "If you seek it, you will find unanimous consent to allow members to wear forget-me-not pins in support of Alzheimer’s disease awareness." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "The Minister of Long-Term Care is seeking the unanimous consent of the House to allow members to wear forget-me-not pins in support of Alzheimer’s awareness. Agreed? Agreed." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "It’s my pleasure now to ask our pages to assemble for their introductions: from the riding of Scarborough Southwest, James Allgeier; from the riding of Haliburton–Kawartha Lakes–Brock, Ali Buchanan; from Toronto–Danforth, Jaimie Chen; from Bruce–Grey–Owen Sound, Graham Engelhardt; from University–Rosedale, Jakob Finley; from Aurora–Oak Ridges–Richmond Hill, Rishabh Goel; from the riding of Essex, Kellen I’Anson; from the riding of Brampton Centre, Samika Kapoor; from Beaches–East York, Lincoln Knibbs; from Simcoe North, Ziggy Knutson; from Markham–Unionville, Sophie Lee; from the riding of Sarnia–Lambton, June McCarthy; from the riding of Thunder Bay–Superior North, Lily McLean; from Toronto Centre, Isabella Mendoza Ferguson; from Barrie–Springwater–Oro-Medonte, Elliot Nahshony; from Scarborough–Guildwood, Keerthana Punathil Sajikumar; from the great riding of Wellington–Halton Hills, Jasper Roy; from Markham–Stouffville, Blythe Tam; from Thornhill, Alessandro Terrones Davila; from Scarborough–Rouge Park, Dimitrios Tolios; from Northumberland–Peterborough South, Nicole Vanden Bosch; and from Oakville North–Burlington, Aurore Yao.", "Please join me in welcoming this group of legislative pages.", "Applause." ] }, { "speaker": "Mrs. Lisa Gretzky", "text": [ "It is my pleasure to welcome some constituents from Windsor: Sally Bennett Olczak, CEO of the Alzheimer Society of Windsor and Essex County; Karen Hall from the Alzheimer Society of Windsor and Essex County; and Mike and Karen Kessler, who are here for the Alzheimer Society lobby day. Welcome to Queen’s Park." ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Sam Oosterhoff", "text": [ "I have the privilege of welcoming to the Legislature Teena Kindt, who is the CEO of the Alzheimer Society of Niagara Region. I look forward to chatting with you later today." ] }, { "speaker": "Mrs. Jennifer (Jennie) Stevens", "text": [ "I also would like to welcome Teena Kindt, the executive director of the Alzheimer Society of Niagara Region, and Tracy Koskamp-Bergeron, the executive director of the Alzheimer Society in Cochrane and Temiskaming. Welcome to your House." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Stephen Blais", "text": [ "I’d like to welcome staff and students from St. Peter Catholic High School, who are using both galleries this morning. They’ve travelled a long way from where the sun rises on the nation’s capital. Welcome to the Legislature. I hope you have a wonderful time here in Toronto.", "And, Mr. Speaker, this afternoon, the St. Matthew Tigers are taking on the Colonel By team at Millennium Park. Go Tigers!" ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Patrice Barnes", "text": [ "I’d like to welcome Neru, Nicholas and my intern Jayden from my constituency office. They’re here today." ] }, { "speaker": "MmeFrance Gélinas", "text": [ "I would like to welcome all of the members from Breast Cancer Canada that are here today. Most of them are on the front lawn. Please go out and visit and learn more about prevention, treatment and support for people living with breast cancer." ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Laura Smith", "text": [ "It’s my great pleasure to welcome Kimberly Carson, CEO at Breast Cancer Canada, and Shaniah Leduc also, board chair. They’re in front of the Legislature right now." ] }, { "speaker": "MPP Jill Andrew", "text": [ "It’s my pleasure to welcome the Alzheimer Society of Ontario here today, and especially staff and community members from St. Paul’s. I don’t have a full list, so I’m not going to name anyone, but I’m looking forward to seeing you all today at 5 o’clock. Thank you." ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Mike Harris", "text": [ "I just got a message: The team back at the office is very, very, very tuned in to question period today. I want to give a special shout-out to my director of communications, Sehar Malik. Thank you." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Terence Kernaghan", "text": [ "It gives me great pleasure to welcome Carol Walters from the Alzheimer Society Southwest Partners. Great to see you, Carol. I look forward to our meeting." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Adil Shamji", "text": [ "Good morning, everyone. I wish to extend my gratitude and welcome to all the members of Breast Cancer Canada, as well as the Alzheimer Society. You’re here to help us increase access to life-saving care and educate us about the way we can improve our health care system. Thank you so much for being here." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Ms. Marit Stiles", "text": [ "Good morning. This question is for the Premier. Back in 2018, the people of Ontario will remember that this Premier promised the people of Ontario that he would end hallway health care. We are now more than six years in and there are more people being treated in hallways in Ontario than ever before. On average, today, we are seeing about 2,000 patients a day treated in hallways and equipment closets. Under the former Liberal government, we’ll remember that the average was about 1,000 patients per day.", "I would like to know why this government has doubled down on the former Liberal government’s failures." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "To reply, the Deputy Premier and Minister of Health." ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Sylvia Jones", "text": [ "Speaker, let’s do a quick review of what we’ve been able to accomplish in the last six years and the plan that we have ahead: In 2023, in January, we presented our Your Health plan to the people of Ontario and I had very clear measurables on where we saw health care to be expanded.", "1040", "Of course, we all know about the 50 capital builds that are happening in our hospital systems across Ontario. In some cases, those are brand new hospitals and in some cases, of course, they are expansions and renovations—50 capital builds with the equivalent of $50 billion. That’s real, concrete action that we’ve been able to do in support of Infrastructure Ontario.", "What else have we done? Of course, two new medical schools in the province of Ontario, in Brampton, in York region. Why are we doing that? We are doing that to ensure that we have the health human capacity—", "Interjection." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Member for Ottawa South, come to order.", "Supplementary question?" ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Marit Stiles", "text": [ "Let’s go back to my question, Premier, because back in 2018, this government, again, promised to end hallway health care, right? Now, it may be no coincidence that under consecutive Liberal and Conservative governments, Ontario has continued to have the lowest health care funding per capita in the country. This government is failing every day to deliver on the most basic responsibility of a provincial government which is health care for the people of this province, but somehow they’re able to keep all their promises to their insider wealthy friends.", "So I want to know from the Premier, why is this government choosing to spend billions on luxury spas that no one wants and a tunnel that won’t be built for 20 years when they can’t get sick people out of hallways?", "Interjections." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Members will please take their seats.", "Minister of Health." ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Sylvia Jones", "text": [ "I think it’s important that we start to compare and contrast about what we have seen in previous governments. Under the NDP, you actually cut residency spots—and by the way, you were in Bob Rae’s government as a staffer when that happened. The Liberal government, when they were here for 15 years, ignored the fact that Ontario residents were aging, that we had new Ontario residents wanting to live and work in the province of Ontario and they wanted a family physician.", "We are doing those investments. We are making those investments to ensure that people can get access when they need it. I look at some of the comments as we make these investments: “Ontario hospitals appreciate the province’s continued commitment to building a strong health care workforce, which will help ensure patients continue receiving high-quality health care at home.”", "I don’t know what you’ve been doing over the summer. I can tell you, I have been visiting hospitals. I have been talking to health care practitioners. They are seeing the changes and they appreciate them." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Once again, I will remind the members to make their comments through the Chair, not directly across the floor of the House.", "The final supplementary." ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Marit Stiles", "text": [ "I’ll tell you what I wasn’t doing this summer: I wasn’t closing emergency rooms across this province.", "I’m going to tell you, that is not going to cut it—that response from this minister—because people in Ontario, they don’t need that kind of lecture, they are living this health care crisis.", "I want you to imagine for a minute being the person who gets devastating news in a hallway surrounded by strangers. This is happening every day in the province of Ontario. And let me tell you, it’s not just bad for patients. Imagine being the health care worker that has to deliver that news that way.", "Imagine being a parent showing up at an emergency room with your sick child and finding it closed. It is happening every day in this province from Sault Ste. Marie to Bruce-Grey.", "I want to know from this Premier what the Premier has to say, broken promise after broken promise, to those patients.", "Interjections." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Members will please take their seat.", "Minister of Health." ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Sylvia Jones", "text": [ "Imagine, Speaker, where we would be today if the NDP hadn’t cut 50 medical seats every single year while they were in government. Imagine where we would be if the Liberal government, instead of chokeholding hospitals, had actually allowed them to expand when they needed it so desperately. We’ll do that work because we know it is needed.", "When I talk to young mothers who say, because of the investment in our pediatric care system in our six children’s hospitals with $330 million, it means that we have been able to cut all of the access to surgery and shorten those wait times so that people aren’t having to wait.", "I remember talking to a grandmother and she said, “By getting that cataract surgery, because of investments that your government made,” she has the ability to volunteer to read a book to her grandchildren. That’s the changes we’re making—" ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Thank you very much.", "The next question." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Ms. Marit Stiles", "text": [ "This question, again, is for the Premier. Yesterday, I asked the government about these outrageous changes to home care that have left patients and caregivers without basic supplies to manage pain, to clean wounds. I was so deeply disappointed to hear the very detached—and I’m going to just say it—compassionless response from this government. They dismissed the concerns of patients and families. They said things like, “Oh, well, they’ll be reimbursed,” and “They can visit their family doctor.” Well, good luck with that.", "Anyway, the minister was clear that she thinks that the shortage of family doctors was not a major concern. My question to the Premier is, does your minister also think that this crisis in home care is not a major concern for this government?" ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Deputy Premier and Minister of Health." ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Sylvia Jones", "text": [ "I said it yesterday and I will say it again: It is completely unacceptable that people are not getting the needed medical supplies and drugs they need and their health care providers want to provide. We are working directly with Ontario Health atHome to make sure that any distribution issues are being dealt with expeditiously. We are bringing in experts from Supply Ontario. We are bringing in experts from Ontario Health to make sure that this cannot continue because it is absolutely unacceptable. We are doing everything to ensure that this gets resolved very quickly.", "I will say that it is important for people to have access, to get reimbursed if they have had to go out and purchase necessary medical supplies for their loved ones. It’s the right thing to do." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Supplementary?" ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Marit Stiles", "text": [ "Speaker, what’s really concerning here is that the minister only learned about these horrific experiences after it was published in the Hamilton Spectator. Did she miss all the letters from my caucus colleagues here that were sent to her office on behalf of their constituents?", "The home care supply shortage could have been anticipated, and it could have been mitigated by this government. The minister needs to take responsibility.", "Why did the minister fail to confirm that access to supplies would not be interrupted in this ridiculous change so that vulnerable people weren’t left more vulnerable?", "Interjections." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Members will please take their seats." ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Sylvia Jones", "text": [ "Again, I will repeat: We know that this is an unacceptable pathway. We need to ensure that all of our vendors and all of our suppliers, regardless of where in the province they are providing services, do that under the auspices of getting it on time to the patients who need it and ensuring that they have access. We have directed the vendor to prioritize and expedite urgent orders. We know that they must do better because our patients and our families deserve better.", "As I said, we are working full out every day to ensure that those vendors and those distributors are doing, frankly, exactly what they’re supposed to be doing, which is ensuring medical supplies and drugs get to the families and the patients that need them in community." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "And the final supplementary." ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Marit Stiles", "text": [ "What’s unacceptable is that this minister approved the contract. That’s unacceptable.", "These are not minor issues that the government can ignore or dismiss. We’re talking about palliative care patients going without medication to manage their pain; immunocompromised kids going without antibiotics. This is no small thing. We’re talking about the supplies that a husband needed to drain fluid from his wife’s lungs as she battled cancer at home. We are talking about the medical supplies that a mom needed to maintain life support for her son. It is more than unacceptable.", "Why were these glaring shortfalls allowed to go on for weeks before your government, Premier, took notice?", "Interjections." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Members will please take their seats. Again, I’ll ask members to make their comments through the Chair.", "The Minister of Health can reply.", "1050" ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Sylvia Jones", "text": [ "The member opposite is absolutely right: It is unacceptable, which is why we have been working directly with the vendor and Ontario Health atHome to resolve it every step of the way. When we saw that they needed assistance with distribution, we stepped in and helped with Supply Ontario. When we saw that they needed assistance, we were there.", "I do not support or condone or agree that this can continue. We are working full out to make sure that this vendor actually fulfills the contract as it was written and as it was proposed." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Ms. Catherine Fife", "text": [ "My question is for the Premier. This government has been doing everything but delivering what Ontario needs. You just heard a perfect example from our leader. New affordable housing stalled; two and a half million people without a family doctor languishing. Instead of offering real solutions, this Premier keeps trying to change the channel with political culture wars, gimmicks and a $100-billion tunnel fantasy that will go ahead regardless of any evaluation, financial assessment or feasibility study.", "Is this Premier trying to distract people because his government has simply run out of ideas, or because it is under police investigation?" ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "To reply for the government, the Minister of Transportation." ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Prabmeet Singh Sarkaria", "text": [ "The NDP and Liberals are the same ones who said we couldn’t get shovels in the ground on the Ontario Line. They were the same ones who said we couldn’t get shovels in the ground on the Scarborough subway extension. In fact, that’s all they talked about is their opposition. They’re all talk. They couldn’t get shovels in the ground.", "But under this Premier, we are delivering on the largest public transportation investment in the history of this country, this province and North America: $70 billion over the next 10 years. The Ontario Line will move 400,000 people a day, take 28,000 cars off the road.", "Absolutely, we know what gridlock costs this province—$11 billion a year—and we will build that tunnel." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "The supplementary question?" ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Catherine Fife", "text": [ "This province is still paying the price for the 407 sell-off, I will remind that member.", "Last week, we learned a Hamilton woman had to go buy her own medical supplies because this government has neglected the home care system and created yet another crisis. This government has failed to invest in affordable and supportive housing, leaving vulnerable people sleeping in parks. You can’t even define what “attainable” or “affordable” is. Schools are flooding after every rainfall because this government refuses to clear the growing capital repair backlog. This Premier has no money for the real priorities of Ontarians, but somehow—somehow—he found a billion dollars to subsidize a private luxury European spa; he found $4.3 million to fight an unconstitutional piece of legislation with Bill 124.", "How much must the people of this great province pay for this government’s and this Premier’s incompetence?" ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Prabmeet Singh Sarkaria", "text": [ "We’re going to build for the next hundred years in this province. In fact, maybe the NDP should look at why construction workers are leaving their party in droves and joining the PC Party. It’s because we believe in building. We believe in building public transportation, $70 billion over the next 10 years. We believe in building highways. The Highway 413 Bradford Bypass project that the opposition talked about for 20 years, we’ve got shovels in the ground.", "We’re going to get shovels in the ground and we’re going to do everything we can to keep this province moving. It’s about having a vision. Under this Premier, we’re building for the next generation." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Mr. Hardeep Singh Grewal", "text": [ "My question is for the great Minister of Transportation. The previous Liberal government ignored the hard-working people in Peel region and didn’t build the critical infrastructure we need. I constantly hear from my constituents in my riding of Brampton East that they’re tired of spending hours of their day stuck in gridlock. They want to see solutions and they’re looking to our government for action. That’s why it’s essential that we reduce congestion and get drivers moving to where they need to go.", "Can the minister tell the House how our government is building new highways faster?" ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Prabmeet Singh Sarkaria", "text": [ "That member is absolutely right, and I want to thank him for all of his advocacy in pushing Highway 413 and ensuring that we continue to build the infrastructure for this province. Yesterday, we introduced legislation in this House that would help exempt early works from the environmental assessment process to make sure we get shovels in the ground in the coming year, because we know gridlock is at an all-time high. We’re losing $11 billion every single year to gridlock, and this party has a plan, this government has a plan, unlike the opposition, who don’t want to build. They’ve opposed us on every single one of our projects, whether it be highways or public transit. The opposition have no plan and don’t want to build for the future. Under this Premier, we’re building for the next hundred years, and we won’t stop." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "The supplementary?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Hardeep Singh Grewal", "text": [ "Thank you to the minister for that response. Bonnie Crombie and her Liberals are happy to see Ontario drivers stuck in traffic. In her own words, she’s “never supported Highway 413.” The people of Ontario deserve better. Unlike the Liberals, our government is preparing for a massive population growth expected in our province. We’re providing transit relief that will make travel more convenient and increase opportunities, jobs and economic growth for all Ontarians.", "Can the minister tell the House how our government is going to get drivers moving in Ontario?" ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Prabmeet Singh Sarkaria", "text": [ "We’re taking many measures to make sure we speed this up. With the introduction of yesterday’s piece of legislation, we can nominate projects to be a part of the highway priority projects across this province that will allow us to invoke 24/7 construction, and we’ve got a plan that fits across this entire province. Whether you’re from York region, Peel region, Durham region—we’re expanding Highway 7. As the member said, the increasing population growth we have, the thousands of businesses that are investing in Ontario because of the plan that we have put forward in this government, we are going to continue to build. Whether it’s in the north to Highway 11, Highway 17, whether it’s the 413 or the Bradford Bypass, we are going to continue to build and ensure that we reduce gridlock across this province, that we increase productivity.", "We want to make sure we don’t repeat the same mistakes of the previous Liberal government, which was to do absolutely nothing, build absolutely nothing. We are getting shovels in the ground, and we are building." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Ms. Chandra Pasma", "text": [ "A safe school to learn in is the most basic expectation of a publicly funded education system, but under this government, parents can’t even expect that. Our kids are in schools with floods, mold, crumbling walls and ceilings, poor ventilation, malfunctioning fire alarms, and doors and windows that won’t open. That’s not even to mention the same kind of concrete roofs that shut down the science centre.", "My question to the Minister of Education is, what’s stopping her from delivering safe, healthy schools for our kids?" ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Jill Dunlop", "text": [ "Our government consistently allocates $1.4 billion every year to schools, to boards to renew and make improvements on their facilities. That’s over and above the regular maintenance. These investments are used for such things as HVAC upgrades, for roof repairs, for maintenance of plumbing, electrical systems. In fact, as I toured the province this summer, I had the opportunity to visit some of our school boards where they are using those investments in their schools.", "I visited St. Hilary Catholic school in Red Rock, which received funding for a new addition that created 23 new student spaces for their community. I also visited W.H. Ballard Elementary School in Hamilton, which is using our government’s investment to renew and update its HVAC systems. I even visited my own elementary school in Coldwater, where they have used their renewal money to make improvements to their school.", "Unfortunately, Speaker, while we’re making the necessary improvements in schools, we have some school boards that are sitting on millions of dollars in surplus." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "The supplementary question?" ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Chandra Pasma", "text": [ "If the minister really thinks her government is doing an amazing job, she will make good on her commitment to release the total school repair backlog so parents can judge for themselves what kind of progress this government is making.", "Last week, the Leader of the Opposition joined me at Merivale High School in Ottawa, a school which has failed to meet federal safety standards for lead in drinking water on 60% of tests in the last five years. Merivale is far from alone. Nearly half of our schools in Ontario have not met federal safety standards for lead at least once in the past five years. This government is failing on the basics so badly that they can’t even ensure our kids are drinking water without lead in it. Why can’t you at least make sure our kids are drinking water without lead?", "1100", "Interjections." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Members will please take their seats.", "Minister of Education." ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Jill Dunlop", "text": [ "As I mentioned, boards like the Toronto District School Board, who are sitting on a $300-million surplus, I would hope that the MPPs across in opposition would reach out to those boards and ensure that that money is being spent on those schools to do those upgrades.", "But we actually have boards out there right now that think it’s okay for them to spend their surplus on things like fancy trips to Italy—$145,000 of taxpayers’ money. I have another school board that thinks that it’s fine to spend money to go to a ball game: $45,000. That’s taxpayers’ money. This money is to be spent on our schools, on our teachers and our students.", "We are making the largest investment in education and the expectation is that that money is to be spent on student supports and teacher resources. We will ensure that we are continuing—we will be providing the largest investment in education in history." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Mr. Sheref Sabawy", "text": [ "My question is for the Minister of Natural Resources. The Trudeau-Crombie carbon tax adversely affects every industry in our province. Our natural resource sector delivers the essential raw materials needed to build Ontario, from timber to sand, stone and gravel. But the carbon tax not only drives up the costs for materials, it also impacts the entire supply chain, resulting in higher costs for everything and affecting everyone.", "Speaker, while our government continues to support businesses in this vital sector by cutting red tape and lowering regulatory burdens for job creators, we know that more needs to be done. That’s why we won’t stop until the federal government finally gets rid of this disastrous tax.", "Can the minister share with the House what workers are saying about the Liberal carbon tax?" ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Graydon Smith", "text": [ "Thank you to the member for the question.", "Speaker, last week, I was up in Sault Ste. Marie, where I visited businesses using our great natural resources here in Ontario to build Ontario. That includes Algoma Steel. The member is right that these businesses are hurting from the Liberal carbon tax.", "But it’s not just the businesses that are hurting, it’s the great men and women who work at Algoma Steel every day. Before they go to work, they get up, they drive their kids to school and then they head off to work. After work, they pick those kids up and take them to hockey. It’s a driving community in Sault Ste. Marie. That’s what you need to do to get around.", "These workers have to get to work. They have to help build this province, as I said. So they’re forced to pay that carbon tax every day. It’s unfair to businesses; it’s unfair to them.", "If the Liberals really wanted to care about the environment, they would support our government’s efforts, support the EV sector, support carbon storage and support the largest transit expansion in this province’s history. Cut the gas tax. Support that and let’s get rid of—" ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Thank you.", "The supplementary question?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Sheref Sabawy", "text": [ "Thank you, Minister.", "Speaker, the carbon tax is making life more expensive for everyone across the province. It is not surprising that the Liberal members in the House, under the leadership of the carbon tax queen, are content to see costs increase. Our government recognizes that the hard-working people and business owners that power our economy have had enough. We are taking steps to reduce the burden on businesses and deliver relief to Ontarians.", "Back to the minister: How does the Trudeau-Crombie carbon tax hurt industries in the natural resources sector and consumers across Ontario?" ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Graydon Smith", "text": [ "Not only is the carbon tax hurting consumers across Ontario, but again, when I was in Sault Ste. Marie, I met with our wildland firefighters and water bomber crews. Their quick response is essential during every fire season, and that’s why our government added four new helicopters and a new aircraft to that fleet, not only this year but for years to come.", "But all those aircraft use fuel, and the Liberal carbon tax is dramatically increasing the cost of fighting fires in Ontario. It’s increasing the cost of communities protecting themselves in Ontario.", "From the workers helping to build this great province to the water bombers protecting our communities from fires, that carbon tax has done nothing to reduce emissions and everything to reduce the cost of living and even the cost of safety. The case couldn’t be more clear: We need to scrap that Liberal carbon tax." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Mr. Jeff Burch", "text": [ "Speaker, through you to the Premier: Local nurses, front-line staff and patients have been calling my office in a panic for weeks because medical supply shortages in Niagara are so severe that patients are at serious risk. We have reports of towels being used to bind wounds for days because there are no bandages or gauze available. Front-line health care workers are scrambling to buy medical supplies on Amazon.", "If the government can’t get the basics right—if we can’t even make sure people have access to basic medical supplies like gauze—how can anyone trust this health minister to get anything right?" ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Minister of Health." ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Sylvia Jones", "text": [ "Speaker, I want to be clear: There is no world where it is acceptable for patients who are in-home—not ensuring that they get those medical supplies and drugs. We are working directly with Ontario Health atHome, with the vendor, to make sure that this situation is resolved as quickly as possible. We are telling them, we have directed them, that they must focus and prioritize individuals who are palliative or have drugs that need to be supplied. I cannot be more clear.", "I agree with the member opposite, it is unacceptable, which is why we have been working, as soon as we realized there was a distribution issue, to make sure that this was resolved with this vendor." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Supplementary question? The member for Oshawa." ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Jennifer K. French", "text": [ "Home care is supposed to mean that people get nursing care that they need at home. That used to include medical supplies. This Premier’s home care system has become BYOB: buy your own bandages.", "Sandra is an elderly home care patient in Oshawa who was made to spend $700 on her own catheters and ostomy bags. So my question is, should home care patients expect to pay out of pocket for medical supplies or are you going to pay Sandra back for her catheters?" ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Again, I’ll ask members to make their comments through the Chair.", "The Minister of Health may reply." ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Sylvia Jones", "text": [ "I very clearly have shared and directed that any individual family, patient or caregiver who purchased medical supplies will be reimbursed because we know that it is not acceptable. We know that people are going to proactively make sure that their family members get the necessary supplies, but we also know that that must be covered. We have set up a process to ensure that they can do that.", "I think at the core, we have to get back to the patients and understand that we want to ensure that those patients get the services and the supplies. And when we make investments in home care, when we make investments in ensuring that PSWs get appropriately compensated, we are ensuring that individuals have access to home care and community care, just as they do in hospitals and with our primary care providers." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "MPP Andrea Hazell", "text": [ "My question is for the Premier. Across Ontario, including my riding of Scarborough–Guildwood, we are facing a critical shortage of doctors, especially in underserved areas. This forces more people to the ER as their conditions get worse. I visited an ER and I saw the devastation.", "Under this Premier, there are over 2,000 patients per day who are being treated in hallways, entrances and stairwells. This shortage is placing an unsustainable strain on our health care system, leading to longer wait times, crowded ERs and leaving Ontarians without critical care.", "Premier, how can you say you’re fixing health care while, under this government, the number of people unable to even get a room in a hospital has doubled and 2.5 million Ontarians don’t have a family doctor?" ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Again, I’ll ask the members to make their comments through the Chair.", "Minister of Health." ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Sylvia Jones", "text": [ "I understand the member opposite was not a member of the Liberal Party at the time, but in 2015, your government—under a Liberal government—eliminated 50 medical residency positions. What does that actually mean? It means that 450 physicians were not trained in the province of Ontario because the Liberal government made a choice—", "Interjections." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Order." ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Sylvia Jones", "text": [ "We have made a choice to expand medical schools in the province of Ontario—", "Interjections." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Independent members, come to order.", "1110" ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Sylvia Jones", "text": [ "We have made a choice to expand the Scarborough Health Network to make sure that they have access.", "We’re getting the job done because, frankly, for too many years, we saw people and we saw governments ignore what we all saw coming, which was an aging population and a population that continued to increase. You didn’t make the investments. We’re getting it done with medical—" ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Thank you.", "The supplementary question?" ] }, { "speaker": "MPP Andrea Hazell", "text": [ "Mr. Speaker, while long-term strategies are necessary, the 2.5 million Ontarians cannot wait without a family doctor. By 2026, that will rise to 4.4 million, or one in three Ontarians will be left without care.", "Patients are experiencing a scary reality, and health care workers are burning out. You have an opportunity to take ownership of a failing health care system that you neglected. We need publicly funded, physician-led, team-based care to improve the retention of health care workers and to ensure sustainable quality care for Ontarians.", "Again, how can the Premier say they are addressing the shortage of doctors, but under their Conservative government the number of Ontarians without a family doctor is higher than ever and doesn’t show any signs of slowing down?", "Interjections." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Order. The House will come to order.", "Interjections." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Order. The clock’s ticking.", "Premier." ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Doug Ford", "text": [ "I just want to ask the member from Scarborough—where was their government for 15 years when people were in desperate need of building a Scarborough hospital? They didn’t fund it. And then, when we put it forward, they voted against it. Where were they when we created 3,500 more acute care beds that they have voted against, Mr. Speaker?", "We have registered over 80,000 nurses that they were against. Remember, back in the Liberal days, they fired nurses. Along help with the NDP and the Liberals, you fired nurses. We’ve registered 80,000.", "We’ve registered over 12,500 doctors—", "Interjections." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Order.", "Interjection." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "The member for Scarborough–Guildwood, come to order." ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Doug Ford", "text": [ "We’ve increased the seats at the medical school in Scarborough.", "We’re building a subway in Scarborough. They had 15 years to build it, but your party kept ignoring the people of Scarborough.", "Interjections." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "The member for Ottawa South, come to order. The member for Ottawa Centre, come to order." ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Doug Ford", "text": [ "Scarborough is no longer being ignored. They have a voice for the first time down at the province. We’re making sure that we have more long-term-care beds in Scarborough—" ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Thank you.", "The next question." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Mr. Steve Pinsonneault", "text": [ "Speaker, my question is to the Minister of Indigenous Affairs and First Nations Economic Reconciliation. The economic potential of Indigenous communities in Ontario is vast and diverse, from resource development, clean energy, tourism and innovation. Despite this potential, many Indigenous communities still face significant barriers, such as lack of infrastructure, limited access to capital and challenges in navigating complex regulatory environments.", "While our government has made critical investments in skilled trades training facilities through the Skills Development Fund, many communities still need additional support. Economic reconciliation is a crucial principle as governments continue building better relationships with Indigenous communities to ensure a respectful, collaborative future.", "Speaker, can the minister please share how our government enhances Indigenous economic development across the province?" ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "The parliamentary assistant and member for Brantford–Brant." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Will Bouma", "text": [ "Thank you for the question. As parliamentary assistant to the Minister of Indigenous Affairs and First Nations Economic Reconciliation, as well as the Minister of Northern Development, this is top of mind for us.", "Speaker, just last week I had the pleasure of speaking at this year’s Indigenomics conference, an annual conference that serves as an invitation for change-makers, innovators and leadership across corporate Canada, the financial sector, governments and Indigenous businesses to bring focus, meaning and visibility to the strength of the Indigenous economy and build bridges for impactful outcomes and economic reconciliation.", "Did you know, Speaker, Indigenous economies across Canada are projected to reach a $100-billion valuation sooner than expected? Ontario is doing its part to help them get there. We are doing this through the Indigenous Economic Development Fund, the resource revenue-sharing agreements and the Indigenous Community Capital Grants fund, and through our work identifying economic opportunities at various relationship-building tables. I look—" ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Thank you.", "The supplementary question?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Steve Pinsonneault", "text": [ "Thank you to the parliamentary assistant for his answer. Economic reconciliation is more than financial investment, it is about building true partnerships based on mutual respect and understanding.", "Access to education, training and capacity-building initiatives is essential for Indigenous communities to engage fully in economic development opportunities. Yet many Indigenous communities in Ontario still lack adequate access to these vital resources. Without proper skills development and training, it becomes difficult for these communities to participate in and benefit from vital economic sectors. When everyone has the ability to participate in our economy in a full and meaningful way, our province and economy are more robust and better for everyone.", "Speaker, can the parliamentary assistant elaborate further on what government programs provide much-needed investments for Indigenous workers?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Will Bouma", "text": [ "Thank you again for the question. Our government is on the right track when it comes to First Nations economic development. We recently announced $9.2 million in grants and funding to support economic development in Indigenous communities. These 48 projects are receiving support through three initiatives: the Indigenous Community Capital Grant Program and the Indigenous Economic Development Fund’s Economic Diversification and Regional Partnership Grants.", "In my riding, this funding will support Six Nations of the Grand River in developing the detailed design of a learning and development centre. In Kashechewan First Nation, it means an investment into a feasibility study for a community training centre in the riding of Mushkegowuk–James Bay.", "The member opposite has an opportunity to support First Nations workers in his riding, and my question to him is, will he?" ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Ms. Jessica Bell", "text": [ "My question is to the Premier. A Global News report revealed the Conservatives were about to permit fourplexes as of right to spur the construction of housing in towns and cities to make it quicker and easier to build more housing for people to rent and buy, but the Conservatives at the last minute couldn’t find the courage to make this zoning change.", "It’s a low bar to meet, and you couldn’t meet it.", "My question to the Premier is, what is stopping the Conservatives from permitting fourplexes as of right to help people find a home they can afford to rent or buy?" ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Once again I will remind the members to make their comments through the Chair.", "Minister of Municipal Affairs and Housing." ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Paul Calandra", "text": [ "I think I’ve answered this on a number of occasions. As the member knows, the vast majority of the province—80% of the province—has as-of-right four already. We have not seen the results that have come with both additional residential units or as-of-right four.", "What we are hearing from the development in the home building community and from those who want to buy their first home is that the rapid increase in interest rates priced people out of the market and priced home builders out of the ability to actually get shovels in the ground. We are also hearing from a lot of the home builders that the challenges that they are facing with different rules in different municipalities is making it even more difficult for them to get shovels in the ground.", "It is something that we are working very closely with municipalities on. We’ve told them that we will work co-operatively but we will act unilaterally, if we have to, in order to end the obstacles and the red tape to get shovels in the ground.", "I am encouraged that interest rates are coming down but more work needs to be done so that people can afford to buy—" ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Thank you.", "Supplementary?" ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Jessica Bell", "text": [ "Back to the minister: The fact is, whatever you are doing is not good enough because Ontario is not building enough homes to meet the need and housing has never been more expensive to rent or buy.", "The Global News report also showed the government was finally looking at increasing density and permitting more apartments and condos near transit stations, but at the last minute the Conservatives backed down.", "Again I ask, what is stopping this government from moving ahead with allowing more condos and apartments near transit stations so more people can find a home?", "1120" ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Paul Calandra", "text": [ "Absolutely nothing. As a matter of fact, the Minister of Infrastructure has a number of transit-oriented communities that she has been negotiating with home builders.", "Speaker, as you will know, the new provincial planning statement encourages that development as well. In fact, that is the document that will guide the construction of new homes along our major transit station areas in co-operation with the work that the Minister of Infrastructure is doing.", "But let’s look at what the member opposite is saying. We have said all along that when you increase costs, when you increase taxes, when you make it more expensive for people, things become more difficult. It becomes more difficult to build homes. It becomes more difficult for people to buy their first home. The policies of the NDP and the Liberals are just that. It’s about more fees. It’s about higher costs. When you run massive deficits, that leads to higher interest rates, and we saw the greatest increase in interest rates because of the failure of policies of the federal Liberal government, supported by this crew over here.", "Finally, led by the Premier, interest rates are starting to come down, and we’re going to start to see more people in the market." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Mr. Michael Mantha", "text": [ "My question is to the Premier. Residents in my riding are concerned about a proposal to deposit radioactive material and mine tailings from the former Beaucage mine to the Agnew Lake tailings management area. Neither the townships of Nairn and Hyman or Baldwin were consulted before this plan was announced by the government, nor were First Nations whose traditional territories are on.", "In a response my office received, the Minister of Mines said that Indigenous communities have been consulted. However, Ogimaa Corbiere of Aundeck Omni Kaning and Ogimaa Nahwegahbow from Whitefish River First Nation have both made it clear that their communities were blindsided by this project.", "Speaker, this project has been under consideration for over a decade, but somehow there was no time to consult with communities and all First Nations who will be directly impacted by the work.", "My question to the Premier: Why did this government fail so miserably to consult and inform the public about this project?" ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "To reply, the Minister of Mines." ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. George Pirie", "text": [ "Thank you very much for the question. The Ministry of Transportation is partnering with Nipissing First Nation and Indigenous Services Canada on a mutually beneficial project to move niobium waste from the former Beaucage mining company tailings site to the Agnew Lake tailings management area, operated by the Ministry of Mines in Hyman township. The niobium relocation was assessed under the MTO’s class environmental assessment, which found the addition of the niobium waste material to the Agnew Lake tailings management area would not create any environmental or public health and safety risk and would in fact improve the site.", "That’s how we run our business—with full consultation with all the Indigenous communities." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Supplementary question?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Michael Mantha", "text": [ "Minister, your ministry openly admitted to community members at a public session that they failed to publicly consult with the people that are there. Not only are these communities saying there was no consultation, but they have serious concerns about bringing mine waste to this area. According to the information from the Ministry of Mines, MTO and the Canadian Nuclear Safety Commission, the tailings will include radioactive niobium and uranium, as well as other hazardous heavy metals.", "Agnew Lake is a critical source of drinking water for surrounding and downstream communities. Communities, such as Nairn Centre, McKerrow, Baldwin, Espanola, Webbwood, Massey and several neighbouring First Nations communities, as well as many people who have seasonal properties or use the waterways for recreation.", "Baldwin, as well as Nairn and Hyman, have passed a joint resolution calling on the government to halt this project and remediate the tailings area with clean materials that do not pose a threat to the environment or health.", "Premier, will your government honour their resolution and confirm that this project will not move forward?" ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Again, I’ll remind members to make their comments through the Chair.", "Minister of Mines." ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. George Pirie", "text": [ "In June 2024, mines provide the township of Nairn and Hyman with the project information on details, including ministry contact information. Recently, MTO reached out to both townships’ mayors and offered to provide additional information that could be shared with the public. The township of Nairn and Hyman accepted this offer; the township of Baldwin declined to meet with the staff of the MTO and mines—" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Michael Mantha", "text": [ "Not a word for 10 years." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "The member for Algoma–Manitoulin, come to order." ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. George Pirie", "text": [ "MTO staff also attended the recent council meeting to help address questions related to the projects. On September 11, representatives from the MTO and mines attended a town hall to share information and answer questions about the project. Consultation has been done.", "Niobium, by the way, is a benign mineral that contains low levels of naturally occurring radiation. Niobium is not harmful to the human body. It is used in medical applications, providing support for bone implants and plates and screws for broken bones, and for security tools. Niobium is also used in things like cell phones, computers and hard drives. This is not an issue." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Mr. Billy Pang", "text": [ "My question is to the Solicitor General. Ontario has seen a troubling rise in crime. This is particularly true in our major cities, including in Markham–Unionville, the riding that I have the honour to serve. This increasing crime is having a profoundly negative impact on the safety, well-being and sense of security for our communities. The increase in violent crime, drug-related offences, and property and car thefts is not only causing fear among residents but also straining our law enforcement resources. Small businesses are struggling to cope with the financial losses due to theft and many Ontarians feel unsafe in their neighbourhoods.", "Can the Solicitor General please outline the immediate actions our government is taking to support our constituents in addressing these growing concerns, and what long-term strategies are being considered to reduce crime and enhance public safety across Ontario?" ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Michael S. Kerzner", "text": [ "I want to thank my friend for the question. Our government, under the leadership of Premier Ford, will not stop in prioritizing our public safety, will not stop in fighting auto theft, will not stop in getting the illegal guns off our streets and will not stop in locking up violent and repeat offenders and putting them where they belong: in jail. That’s why our government made an announcement just a few weeks ago to further expand our class sizes at the Ontario Police College, with an additional 80 spots that will help First Nations and medium- and small-sized police services have the extra recruits that they need to keep their communities safe.", "Priority for public safety will be there morning, noon and night for our government." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Supplementary question?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Billy Pang", "text": [ "Thank you to the Solicitor General for his strong leadership. Ontario is grappling with rising crime rates which are placing significant pressure on communities, local businesses and law enforcement. The surge in violent incidents, organized crime and property related offences is creating a climate of fear and insecurity in many neighbourhoods. Families are concerned for their safety while small businesses are struggling to recover from repeated theft and vandalism.", "Could the Solicitor General please outline what specific initiatives our government is implementing to curb crime in Ontario, and what support is being provided to local authorities to address this growing public safety crisis?" ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Michael S. Kerzner", "text": [ "To my colleague: Thank you for the question. The fundamental rights that we all have as Ontarians to live safely in our own homes and communities will never be compromised under the leadership of Premier Doug Ford.", "I want to say this: The other thing that our government has shown is respect. Respect to the people who put on a uniform every day that, no matter the odds, no matter the threats, no matter the situation they’re bringing to their work each and every day their courage, their determination and everything they are in their DNA to keep Ontario safe. That’s why our government will be positive. Our government will make investments, like at the Ontario Police College, like in grants to fight those who think it’s okay to steal our cars, like an additional bail and warrant apprehension grant.", "We’re not stopping. Public safety is our inherent right, and people can count on the leadership of Premier Ford to keep our communities safe.", "1130" ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Miss Monique Taylor", "text": [ "My question is for the Premier. Children in care across this province are still sleeping in hotel rooms, in Airbnbs. Workers are pushed to the brink, and children’s aid societies have been in crisis for years.", "The minister recently announced an audit in the province’s children aid societies, as if that would be the golden solution to the crisis. The child welfare sector has been under review for over four years now with nothing to show for it. Hundreds of children have lost their lives in this broken system. The resources just are not there, even as the need grows.", "Premier, when will your government take responsibility for these children and youth in care and stop your failure of even delivering the basics?" ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "To reply, the Minister of Children, Community and Social Services." ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Michael Parsa", "text": [ "I thank my colleague for the question. We’ve been very clear, but let me repeat it again: We want every child, every youth in this province to have a safe and loving home, regardless of their circumstances, and we have made investments to make sure that happens.", "We invested $76.3 million in child welfare last year. We invested $14 million in child protection services this year. We increased that support by $36.5 million again this year at base funding, which is ongoing, all to make sure that every single child and youth in the province is protected and supported. We will never waver from that commitment.", "If we see that things are falling through the cracks, yes, we will take action. This is the future of our province. We will never ever waver from that commitment." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Supplementary question?" ] }, { "speaker": "Miss Monique Taylor", "text": [ "I’ll repeat this for the minister, just in case he didn’t hear me: Kids are sleeping in hotel rooms. They’re sleeping in Airbnbs. They’re sleeping in children’s aid offices. They’re sleeping in a trailer, in the back. Kids are dying—354 have died in the last three years. That is one every three days. So can the minister guarantee us that this is not going to happen under his watch tonight?", "Interjections." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Members will please take their seats.", "Minister of Children, Community and Social Services." ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Michael Parsa", "text": [ "Myself, the Premier and this government have made it very clear that we will never ever stop fighting for children and youth in the province. I mentioned the investment that we have made this year and last year in the programs to make sure that every child and every youth in the province continues to thrive.", "But do you know what happens, Mr. Speaker? The opposition will never talk about that. I will talk about the investment in the programs to protect every child, every youth in the province and the fact we will never give up on them.", "At the same time, the number of children and youth in care has reduced by 30% over the last 10 years while we increased investment by nearly $130 million. So, yes, we want to make sure where the funds are going; yes, we want to make sure that every child—", "Interjections." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Order.", "Interjection." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "The member for Hamilton Mountain will come to order." ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Michael Parsa", "text": [ "—every youth in this province is protected and supported so that they continue to thrive and to see in every single community—we will never ever waver from that commitment.", "Interjections." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Stop the clock. Members will please take their seats.", "We can restart the clock. The next question." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Mr. Ernie Hardeman", "text": [ "My question is for the Associate Minister of Forestry and Forest Products. Ontario’s forestry sector plays a crucial role in supporting thousands of jobs in rural and northern Ontario communities, providing sustainable economic opportunities for families and contributing to Canada’s environmental stewardship. However, the Trudeau-Crombie carbon tax is placing an undue burden on this industry. This unfair tax is increasing operational costs and undermining the sector’s competitiveness in both domestic and international markets.", "Given the essential role that Ontario’s forestry sector plays in our economy, can the minister please explain how our government plans to address the rising cost imposed by the carbon tax, which threatens jobs and economic growth in this crucial industry?" ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Kevin Holland", "text": [ "Thank you to the great member from Oxford for that question.", "The former Liberal government abandoned the forestry sector and strapped it with tax and unnecessary red tape. As a result, the sector struggled. But with targeted investments made through our forest sector strategy, it has mounted a massive return. And now, despite the Liberal carbon tax systemically impacting the industry, it is our government that has extended the gas tax cuts to save the industry over $2.8 million per year.", "Today, Ontario’s forestry sector generates more than $18 billion from manufactured goods and services and supports more than 148,000 direct and indirect jobs. By cutting red tape, by reducing the gas tax and with targeted investments, Ontario is continuing to support our forestry sector and our northern Ontario workers." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "The supplementary?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Ernie Hardeman", "text": [ "The Trudeau-Crombie carbon tax has not only impacted the competitiveness of Ontario’s forestry sector, but also, it’s threatening the long-term sustainability of rural and Indigenous communities that rely on these jobs. With higher transportation and fuel costs, mills are struggling, and we risk losing a sector that has been a cornerstone of our economy for generations.", "An added financial burden of the Trudeau-Crombie carbon tax is making it increasingly difficult for these businesses to stay competitive, leading to potential job losses and economic decline in these regions.", "How can the Trudeau-Crombie Liberals justify a one-size-fits-all carbon tax policy that disproportionately harms the forestry industry? Can the associate minister please tell us what concrete steps our government is taking to provide immediate relief for this vital sector?" ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Kevin Holland", "text": [ "Thank you again to the member from Oxford for that excellent question. I couldn’t agree more. The opposition has no plan for the forestry sector, and we know the Liberals consider northern Ontario a no man’s land.", "Meanwhile, our government recognizes that building sustainable housing requires an advanced forest sector strategy and innovation. My ministry is well on its way to making Ontario, once again, a world leader in forestry and forest products. For example, the Ontario government has provided close to $8 million for advanced wood construction projects, and we’re investing an additional $60 million over the next three years in forest biomass facilities to turn products like the saw dust from a saw mill into alternative products like fuel, bioplastics and furniture.", "Speaker, it’s clear it’s our government that is standing behind our forestry sector promoting innovation and sustainability." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "M. Guy Bourgouin", "text": [ "Ma question est pour le ministre des Transports.", "Pendant des années, les députés de ce côté de la Chambre vous ont averti des conditions qui se passent sur nos routes et le danger qui se passe sur nos routes. On a eu l’enquête Marketplace qui a démontré comment c’était dangereux, comment la fraude se passe, comment le problème est systémique. C’est un cancer dans l’industrie.", "Ma collègue, hier, a posé la même question au ministre. Le ministre a répondu, la même réponse qu’il a donné à un journaliste. Pourtant, vous l’avez su, pendant des années, ce qui se passait dans l’industrie.", "Quelles choses concrètes dont vous allez rassurer la province puis les personnes du Nord sur nos routes vont répondre à la sécurité? Il y a du monde qui meurt sur nos routes, ce qui ne devrait pas arriver. Il y a du monde qui sont morts à Thunder Bay. J’ai un de mes commettants—je vous ai proposé un projet de loi qui répondrait à la sécurité; vous avez voté contre. Comme je répète encore, il y a du monde qui sont morts sur nos routes.", "Alors, ma demande pour le ministre : je vous demande encore, monsieur le Ministre, qu’est-ce que vous faites pour régler cette situation et assurer la sécurité des Ontariens sur nos routes?" ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Prabmeet Singh Sarkaria", "text": [ "We have zero tolerance for any sort of fraud that is happening within the system, and we will come down very hard on them. That member knows, and as I have said in the past—circumstances of any potential fraud that has been communicated to the OPP, and we are actively working with them on any of that.", "We have also terminated six members that we came upon through an investigation that was conducted as well, and we’ll continue to ensure that we move forward in a way that protects the integrity of the system. We have some of the safest roads in North America and we will continue to put forward bills in this Legislature that improve upon that safety, like we did in the past year, cracking down on impaired driving, cracking down on careless driving across this province.", "I hope the members opposite support this government when we improve investments in highway safety—which they haven’t in the past; in fact, voting against, most recently, a $30-million investment in Thunder Bay to improve truck vehicle safety inspection centres. So I hope the members opposite start supporting this government in our investments in increasing enforcement officers and the infrastructure needed to protect people on our roads. It’s a shame that they don’t support that." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "That concludes our question period for this morning.", "This House stands in recess until 3 p.m.", "The House recessed from 1141 to 1500." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Ms. Jennifer K. French", "text": [ "I beg leave to present a report from the Standing Committee on Procedure and House Affairs pursuant to standing order 109.1(a)." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Ms. French presents the committee’s report. Does the member wish to make a brief statement?" ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Jennifer K. French", "text": [ "No." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "That’s okay too.", "Pursuant to standing order 109.1(a), the report is deemed to be adopted by the House.", "Report deemed adopted." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Is it the pleasure of the House that the motion carry? Carried.", "First reading agreed to." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Is it the pleasure of the House that the motion carry? Carried.", "First reading agreed to." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Is it the pleasure of the House that the motion carry? Carried.", "First reading agreed to." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Is it the pleasure of the House that the motion carry? Carried.", "First reading agreed to." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Is it the pleasure of the House that the motion carry? Carried.", "First reading agreed to." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Would the member for St. Catharines like to give the House a brief explanation of her bill?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mrs. Jennifer (Jennie) Stevens", "text": [ "Yes, thank you, Speaker. The bill enacts the Affordable Home Heating Act, 2024. The act requires the Minister of Energy to develop an alternative home heating fuel strategy and to publish that strategy on a website of the government of Ontario.", "Amendments are also made to the Ontario Energy Board Act, 1998. Section 36.3 is added to the Ontario Energy Board Act, 1998, requiring the board to develop and submit a gas rate assistance action plan. Section 36.3 provides for the purpose and contents of the action plan as well as rules respecting publication of the plan and consultations. Subsection 36.3(5) requires the minister to ensure that the action plan is implemented by January 1, 2025." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Mr. Anthony Leardi", "text": [ "I move that the following change be made to the membership of the following committee:", "On the Standing Committee on Procedure and House Affairs, Mr. Burch replaces Miss Taylor." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Mr. Leardi has moved that the following change be made to the membership of the following committee:", "On the Standing Committee on Procedure and House Affairs, Mr. Burch replaces Miss Taylor.", "Is it the pleasure of the House that the motion carry? Carried.", "Motion agreed to." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "MmeFrance Gélinas", "text": [ "I would like to thank Madame Juliette Bellemare from Hanmer in my riding for these petitions. The petitions are called “Make PSW a Career.”", "As you know, Speaker, PSWs are needed in so many parts of our health care system. Whether you look at hospitals, at home care, at long-term care, PSWs make the up the majority of the workers in home care and long-term care. Both of those areas of the health care system have a hard time recruiting and retaining PSWs. Why? Because PSW is not a good job in Ontario.", "The petition asks to make PSW a career where PSWs would be offered permanent, full-time employment, well-paid, with benefits, with a pension plan, sick days, paid holidays and a workload that a human being can handle—problem solved.", "In my area, when a good job for a PSW comes up, there will be up to 500 people who will apply, but in most other areas, where you are offered part-time jobs, where you don’t know if you’re going to be able to make ends meet, it becomes really hard, and people’s health suffers. If we don’t have enough PSWs, we can’t meet the needs of the people who need home care and we can’t meet the needs of the people in long-term care.", "1510", "I agree with the people who have signed this petition. Let’s make PSW a career. I will sign the petition and ask Marie-David to bring it to the Clerk." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Mr. Mike Schreiner", "text": [ "I’d like to thank Borys Kowalsky and Erik Schomann for bringing these petitions signed by 7,675 residents of Tiny township.", "The signatories of this petition are concerned about the cost and environmental impact of the new municipal administrative building. They’re worried about the debt that will result from it, the tax increases and the diversion of funds from other priorities. They are petitioning the Legislative Assembly of Ontario to require Tiny township to hold a referendum on whether the residents support this administrative building or not.", "I will sign this petition and ask page Lily to bring it to the table." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Mr. Michael Mantha", "text": [ "I have a petition here, presented to me on behalf of the good people in the Nairn and Hyman area, and sent to me by the CAO and clerk, Belinda Ketchabaw, from Nairn Centre. Their petition is in regard to a concern that they have and the request to halt the transportation and deposition of naturally occurring radioactive material to the Agnew Lake tailings management area. The community is deeply worried about the potential environmental health and safety risks associated with the project.", "They are calling on the Ministry of Mines and the Ministry of Transportation to halt the proposed project until an inclusive consultation process has been conducted, full disclosure of all pertinent details has been released, and an environmental and health impact assessment with input from independent experts can be conducted—including opportunities for public hearings. They are also requesting that the province enact legislation—that consultation with municipalities is a requirement of any project that includes the transportation or deposit of NORM.", "As of this morning, while the minister and I were having our exchange during question period, my office just received this update—and I have to give credit to the municipality for having continued on with their advocacy. The response from the ministry says, “We have recently communicated to municipalities and Indigenous communities that the Ministry of Mines and MTO have decided to hold on transporting any materials from the Nipissing site to allow time to share the health and safety reports that were requested from the community.”", "Having said that, I’m happy to report that the project has been put on hold. It’s not halted.", "I look forward to receiving further petitions from the community members so that their concerns can be raised here, to the floor of the Legislature." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "I’m not going to point fingers at any individual member, but I’ll remind the House that the standing order asks that members briefly summarize the petition, and I would ask that members not get into any political debate about the merits of the petition or explanation about that.", "Petitions?" ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "MmeFrance Gélinas", "text": [ "I would like to thank François and Carole Laliberté from Hanmer in my riding for this petition. The petition is called “Let’s Fix the Northern Health Travel Grant.”", "As you know, Speaker, there are many health services that are not available in the north. We don’t do lung transplants, we don’t do some of the tertiary care that is available down south, and many other specialist forms of care are not available in northern Ontario, so people have to travel. In order to compensate people who have to travel, we have the Northern Health Travel Grant that will pay for part of your travel and part of your accommodation. The problem is that the part that is being paid is so little that a lot of people in northern Ontario will choose not to have care, not to go on with the plan of care—with the surgery, with the treatment—simply because they cannot afford to travel to Toronto. The cost per kilometre has not changed in a very long time. The cost per night is supposed to increase—it has been announced that it was supposed to increase, but it has not increased. It’s $100 per night. Speaker, tell me where in Toronto you can find a hotel for $100 a night. It is impossible. A lot of low-income northerners end up going without care because they can’t afford ir.", "I agree with the people. There are thousands and thousands of northerners who have signed this petition. They want to fix the Northern Health Travel Grant, and I agree with each and every one of them. I will sign this petition and ask my good page Samika to bring it to the Clerk." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "MmeFrance Gélinas", "text": [ "I would like to thank Morgan Sheppard from Hanmer in my riding for this petition. The petition is called “A Future for Child Care in Ontario.”", "As you know, Speaker, it is really hard to find a spot for your child or your baby in a daycare. The main reason for that is that child care operators cannot recruit and retain early childhood educators and other child care providers.", "The people who have signed the petition say that they are 100% in support of child care for $10 a day, that right now Ontario needs 65,000 new child care workers to meet the demand. If you take the wait-list in every community of people who have put their name on the wait-list for a child care spot, and you match this with the number of workers—it’s 65,000 workers more that we would need.", "The people who have signed the petitions want to have an advisory committee put together to look at the staffing shortages for early childhood educators and child care workers, to make sure that our child care is able to meet the needs. Without child care, Ontario can’t work. If you want workers to be available, they have to have access to child care.", "I support the petition. I will sign my name to it and ask page Samika to bring it to the Clerk." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "MmeFrance Gélinas", "text": [ "I would like to thank Tylor Gauthier from my riding of Nickel Belt for these petitions. The petition is called “Enact Anti-Scab Labour Law.”", "As you know, Speaker, strikes and lockouts are pretty rare; 97% of all collective agreements in Ontario are negotiated without work disruptions.", "Anti-scab legislation has existed in Quebec since 1978; it has existed in British Columbia since 1993. We had it here in Ontario while there was an NDP government; it was quickly taken away. Anti-scab legislation basically reduces the length and the divisiveness of labour disputes.", "It is really tough to be on strike. It is even tougher when you’re on strike and you see people crossing the picket line to work. It divides community. We had a year-long strike in Sudbury by the miner Vale, and it was just awful. The division of family members who fought amongst themselves, the community that fought among themselves—he used to teach hockey, and now everybody hates him because he was one of the scabs who went across—and the same thing with restaurants. It just makes so much damage to a community to allow scabs to cross the picket line. It is not worth it.", "Ontario should have anti-scab legislation. Let’s make sure that strikes and lockouts are settled at the negotiation table, not at the family table, where community members fight amongst one another. That’s why I have on the table right now an anti-scab bill that has been deposited, and I wish the government would act upon this.", "I fully support everybody who has signed this petition. I will affix my name to it and ask Samika, who has been very patient, to bring it to the Clerk.", "1520" ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Once more, I’ll ask the members to keep the presentation of the summary of their petitions as brief as possible, without getting into additional commentary outlining their perception of the merits of the text of the petition.", "The next petition." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "MmeFrance Gélinas", "text": [ "This petition comes from Wahnapitae First Nation in my riding. Wahnapitae is an incredible, incredible First Nations community. They are on the side of Lake Wanapitei, the great big lake that you can see on the maps in Ontario, and they are worried about the spraying. All of the members of the community have signed the petition to the Legislative Assembly to stop the non-essential use of chemical herbicide. Basically, everywhere there’s a transmission line, Ontario Hydro comes in the summer and sprays pesticide all along the line so that none of the trees and stuff grow to damage the lines—same thing with many forestry workers and forestry companies that will come and spray herbicide.", "We know those herbicides cause cancer. We know that those herbicides are hurtful to the health of the community. Quebec has just as many transmission lines, even more than we do here in Ontario, and they have banned the use of herbicides. They did that back in 2001. Their hydro system still goes.", "There are other ways to maintain hydro lines. There are other ways to maintain the growth that don’t include aerial spraying of herbicide, and they would like our government to consider this, very much like it’s being done in other provinces. It is good for people’s health. It is good for the environment. It creates all sorts of new jobs—to go into the bush to do the maintenance.", "I fully support the good people of Wahnapitae First Nation who want to stop the spray. I will affix my name to it and ask my good page Samika to bring it to the Clerk." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "MmeFrance Gélinas", "text": [ "I would like to thank Sandra and Bryan Smith for this petition. Basically, they and many, many other people are worried about the privatization of our health care system.", "As you know, Speaker, the request for proposals has gone out for MRI and CT scans. The government is about to announce a whole bunch of private, for-profit clinics that would offer MRI and CT. The request for proposals has gone out for surgical suites for hip and knee surgery. Again, the government will announce private hip and knee surgical suites here in Ontario when we have public hospitals with surgical suites sitting empty because our hospitals cannot get the money they need to operate them.", "The people who have signed this petition come from all over Ontario, and they want our health care system to be delivered by not-for-profit—not-for-profit hospitals, not-for-profit community base. They don’t want people to profit off the backs of sick people.", "I fully support this petition. I will affix my name to it and ask Samika to bring it to the Clerk." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Further debate?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Brian Riddell", "text": [ "I appreciate the opportunity today to go into great detail about Strengthening Cyber Security and Building Trust in the Public Sector Act, 2024, during this, its second House reading.", "As the parliamentary assistant to the Minister of Public and Business Service Delivery and Procurement, it is my great privilege today to participate in this reading and in the discussion and debate that I hope it generates. The issues it addresses are timely and important, affecting our people and businesses on a daily basis, as well as our government and the many public sector institutions in Ontario.", "I would like to recognize my colleagues who have partnered with our ministry to work on this important proposed legislation to bolster Ontarians’ trust in the government’s stewardship of their personal data so they can participate fully and confidentially in the digital world.", "Speaker and honourable members, in the first reading during the previous session, our minister and his cabinet colleagues from the Ministry of Education, Ministry of Children, Community and Social Services, and Ministry of Health outlined for us all the wide-ranging and deep-reaching benefits that the people of Ontario would reap with the passage and enactment of this bill. It is abundantly clear that Ontario needs new policies to reduce the risk of exposure to cyber attacks on critical infrastructure and operations, to privacy breaches that threaten individual trust in public services and pose dangers to children and youth, and to harm from irresponsible uses of artificial intelligence, or AI.", "That’s why we are seeking passage of our proposed approach to strengthening cyber security and protecting sensitive data, especially for our children. The proposed changes reflect a series of consultations and updates to our policy landscape to reflect the emerging digital, data and privacy issues that deeply impact people of all ages.", "As technologies continue to advance across the OPS and public sector, there are concerns about how people’s data will be safe and secure at all times. To address these concerns, we are doubling down on our commitment to protecting the personal data of people in Ontario so they can continue to interact with government and the public sector in a manner that instills confidence and security.", "The latest findings from Cisco’s 2024 Cybersecurity Readiness Index revealed that a mere 1% of organizations in Canada have achieved the level of cyber security readiness required to effectively defend against modern risks. The cyber attack on BC’s government systems announced earlier this spring stand as just one case in point. And closer to home, from public hospitals and the LCBO to the Toronto Public Library—2023 alone saw government organizations across Ontario hit by a growing wave of separate cyber security incidents that fully interrupted or impacted some of their services. Even based on this information alone, it is clear that the time to act is now.", "With cyber threats on the rise and continuously evolving with the advancement of technologies such as AI, I would now like to outline what our government, under the leadership of the Ministry of Public and Business Service Delivery and Procurement, has designed this new legislation to address.", "The proposed legislation would establish regulation-making authority and empower the Minister of Public and Business Service Delivery and Procurement to issue directives respecting cyber security for public sector entities, with a focus on vital sectors such as hospitals, schools and children’s aid societies. These regulations would be developed through ongoing consultations with key government and public sector stakeholders to help these organizations better prepare for, respond to, and recover from cyber threats and attacks.", "We are also formalizing centralized reporting within government to better respond to, deploy and get involved in emergency management of cyber incidents in a timely fashion. Not only will this strengthen Ontario’s cyber security regime, but it will also lead to the long-term avoidance of costs by mitigating the severity of cyber attacks.", "Cyber attacks on public institutions are not just attacks on the data of people in Ontario, but also on their tax dollars that fund and maintain these institutions. With that in mind, it is clear that we owe the people of our province our best efforts to combat cyber threats by any means within our power. I have every confidence that this new piece of legislation can deliver just that. Under the leadership of the ministry and the Premier, we remain committed as ever to supporting the entire public sector every step of the way.", "1530", "At this point, Mr. Speaker and colleagues, I would like to provide you with an overview of how our government is continuing the vital work to improve digital privacy safeguards and to keep our children’s data safe. Every parent and educator knows that when it comes to technology, our children’s level of exposure to the online world is at an all-time high and is showing no signs of slowing down.", "The Internet offers many benefits for growing minds and can be a great source for learning, connecting and having fun, but unfortunately, children are not naturally prepared to deal with the possible threats to their privacy that come from interacting with the online world. As a result, we must put the guardrails in place to better protect the youngest people in our province and the most vulnerable, and we must recognize the unique challenges our children face—challenges that, frankly, many of us never faced growing up. We are truly charting a new territory in a digital world, and we must do what we can to protect them together. We must all work hand in hand, sparing no efforts to ensure their safety.", "That is why, if Bill 194 passes, our ministry will work in lockstep with all other partner ministries—such as the Ministry of Education, the Ministry of Children, Community and Social Services, and the Ministry of Health, just to name a few—to develop consultation plans within the priority sectors and the public, and use targeted experts to help us.", "We are eager also to work with school boards, parents’ groups overseeing children in provincial settings, social media and tech industry experts, and law enforcement. These extensive consultations would inform the development of regulations and directives to ensure the right protections are in place, matching the unique needs of various public sector institutions and children they serve.", "We are proposing to introduce clear rules to strengthen the protection of children’s information, to combat the misuse of data created by children and youth engaged with schools and children’s aid societies.", "Based on the consultations, future regulations could include age-appropriate standards for software programs on devices such as laptops used by students in schools, and they may also include strengthening standards for software procurement by schools, to avoid the use or sale of student data by predatory marketing by third parties. This approach will build on work already under way in many sectors, including in Ontario’s school boards, and would explore how Ontario can leverage a variety of tools, among them education and awareness campaigns, parental controls, supervision, age-appropriate-content filters, and enforcement of laws and regulations designed to protect children online.", "Speaker and House members, we must safeguard our children, some of the most vulnerable citizens, from having their information stolen or used inappropriately. In addition to protecting children from harm, we must also support and empower them to become responsible digital citizens. That means teaching them about online safety, privacy and security from a young age, as well as fostering critical thinking skills that will enable them to navigate the digital world safely and responsibly.", "That is where the Cyber Security Centre of Excellence’s K-12 Zone comes in. The K-12 Zone is an educational website for K-12 students, parents and teachers that will feature games, interactive articles and videos to educate children on cyber security risks like cyberbullying, online privacy and password protection.", "As October is Cyber Security Awareness Month, I encourage all Ontarians to take full advantage of our ministry’s online resources. It’s never too early to teach our children how to be cyber-safe, for when our kids have the knowledge and the tools to protect themselves from harm, we all win.", "Ontario is proposing modernizing privacy protections to reduce the risks associated with breaches and unauthorized data access, including identity theft, through amendments to the Freedom of Information and Protection of Privacy Act, commonly known as FIPPA. The proposed amendments would establish requirements for privacy breach notifications and mandatory privacy breach statistical reporting to the Ontario Information and Privacy Commissioner, or IPC, for institutions subject to FIPPA, including the Ontario government and other public sector organizations. Lessons learned from the breach reporting would help identify better and more consistent ways to ensure personal information is kept safer and more secure. The proposed amendments would also formalize a requirement for FIPPA institutions to conduct privacy impact assessments, or as they call them, PIAs. A PIA identifies and evaluates the effects that a program, system or service may have on the privacy of an individual.", "The proposed amendments would also increase the IPC’s oversight of the public sector by allowing the IPC to proactively hold privacy reviews and administer compliance orders, strengthening the oversight role this independent body has in safeguarding personal data.", "We are also proposing protections for whistle-blowers within the public sector, to protect the identities of employees reporting privacy wrongdoings to the IPC. This would further help the IPC investigate inappropriate uses of personal data.", "I would be remiss if I did not mention a topic that the Minister of Public and Business Service Delivery and Procurement spoke about during the first reading debate, and that is a component of what our proposed legislation is designed to address: artificial intelligence, or AI. Speaker and House members, as the parliamentary assistant to the lead minister for all AI work, I can confidently say that the act would lay a strong foundation for AI governance.", "Without a doubt, AI has tremendous benefits, but we must safeguard against the risks that the new technology poses. What happens yesterday with AI changes the next day and on and on, and that’s why we need to embrace it but guard ourselves against it and the progress it gives us. Leadership in this space is about adopting AI applications responsibly, mitigating risks while maximizing the benefits. We are leading the way in strengthening guidance for using AI responsibly across the government and the public sector to protect privacy and personal information.", "We know AI holds immense promise, offering solutions to some of humanity’s most pressing challenges and unlocking the potential for unprecedented innovation across a myriad of fields.", "We know AI use also comes with key risks. To mitigate these risks and prevent potential harm, the province is working on creating guidelines for the government’s use of AI by developing Ontario’s Trustworthy AI Framework, rooted in three strategic priorities, the first being AI that people can trust, ensuring that all risks are clearly defined and mitigations are in place to minimize harm and protect the people of Ontario; the second one is AI that serves all the people of Ontario, ensuring that the use of AI is transparent and explainable; and third, no AI in secret—providing a clear understanding of how and when AI is used.", "Our AI expert working group provides the Ontario government with advice and recommendations on the development of Ontario’s Trustworthy AI Framework and responsible for AI within the public service. This should lead to legislation, if passed, within the regulatory framework to guide the use of AI in the public sector, like in our schools and hospitals. Their expertise will also ensure that the Ontario government’s use of AI is responsible, transparent and accountable—core principles that we must keep in mind to provide the safety, the security, the privacy that people in Ontario expect and deserve.", "One final enhancement that would be delivered if Bill 194 is passed into legislation is it focuses on the critical, ever-evolving topic of modernizing digital service delivery. In many consultations, over a number of years, we heard from the people of Ontario that they need us to provide them with simpler, faster, better and more convenient access to government services. They spoke; we listened, and we continue to listen. As a result, we are leveraging new digital technologies to streamline processes, reduce bureaucracy and provide the accessibility and responsiveness of government services. Through proposed changes delivered in this new act, we aim to do just that.", "1540", "Ontario is constantly improving service delivery to provide a consistent, secure, seamless experience while accessing government programs and services. The proposed amendments to FIPPA include expanding the definition of customer information, such as date of birth and language preferences, and services provided by organizations like ServiceOntario, which can, with consent, collect, use and retain for the purposes of digital service delivery. Updating Ontario’s legislative framework to modernize digital service delivery would offer the people of Ontario a more personalized, transparent and convenient experience when interacting with their government.", "With these proposed changes, users who opt to create an account would be able to receive personalized service delivery and benefit from “tell us once” features with pre-populated fields and communication preferences, so they don’t need to restate their information every time they interact with the government. It’s just this kind of approach that will help us build a more responsible, efficient, equitable government that truly serves the people of Ontario.", "To wrap things up, the Ministry of Public and Business Service Delivery and Procurement, along with its partner ministries and the government as a whole, are enthusiastic about the promise that the Strengthening Cyber Security and Building Trust in the Public Sector Act, 2024, holds this for the future.", "Once again, Speaker and House members, I have been so pleased to join you to present more details about Bill 194, which, if passed, brings real and meaningful changes to the lives of people and businesses in Ontario. As a representative of the Ministry of Public and Business Service Delivery and Procurement, the lead ministry for this bill, I am immensely proud of the work we have all been doing to further the protection of people in Ontario in areas of cyber security, data privacy, protecting children, service delivery and AI. Collectively, we owe it to the people of Ontario to build our province into the best and most digitally safe place in the world to call home.", "People expect and deserve peace of mind in knowing their government is protecting them while they interact with us online. By standing up for hard-working taxpayers whose trust we have earned to represent them, we can make their lives easier and strengthen protections when they conduct online transactions, so they can focus on the things that matter most to them.", "I encourage you to support the Strengthening Cyber Security and Building Trust in the Public Sector Act, 2024. We know it will continue not only to shore up, but to accelerate Ontario’s best-in-class protections for the people and businesses who interact with a digital landscape. Together, my colleagues and I have confidence that our suite of proposed legislative changes will give people of all ages the support they need and the peace of mind that their data is protected as they participate fully in the digital landscape. Change for the better is on the horizon. We cannot wait to roll out the legislation, if passed, and to begin further consultation to support the development of regulations under the act.", "I know you will all have thoughtful and valuable feedback on what we have shared with you today. The minister and I look forward to questions and further debate on it. Thank you for your time today." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (MmeLucille Collard)", "text": [ "Since you’re looking forward to questions, we’re going to move to that question period." ] }, { "speaker": "MmeFrance Gélinas", "text": [ "I would say that we share a lot of the concerns and the ideas that have been put forward in that bill for strengthening cyber security and building trust in our public sector. The one question that needs to be answered is, who pays for those changes? I can tell you that, in health care, they are very worried about cyber security. In the health care system, you need trust. You tell your health care provider information that you won’t tell anybody else, and that goes into your chart. But if that becomes open to just about anybody, it will impact the quality of our care. It will impact how much you’re willing to share.", "Our hospitals, our 142 corporations, are facing deficits. How are they going to pay for this?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Brian Riddell", "text": [ "I respect the question that you’re asking, but at this ministry, we have the intention and the power, if this bill passes, to protect the information of those people in those hospital locations. Yes, it will cost, but that protection will be provided. It will be safe." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (MmeLucille Collard)", "text": [ "Next question." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Andrew Dowie", "text": [ "I’d actually like to build a bit on the question from the member from Nickel Belt because, certainly, my community has been subject to a very significant cyber security incident involving the TransForm Shared Service Organization in southwestern Ontario—and not just that incident, but Ontarians have noticed other incidents throughout the province that speak to cyber security breaches.", "As our information systems advance, cyber criminals are becoming more sophisticated. You have to make those terrible decisions as to, what do you do? You don’t want to co-operate, but how do you safeguard your network? Because now we’re still recovering from our hospital cyber system breakdown in our area.", "Governments must be equipped to combat cyber crime in its various forms. It’s our job as a government to focus on ways to safeguard the integrity and security for digital infrastructure while preserving citizens’ privacy and rights. But this objective transcends the Ontario government. Our partners need that support. They don’t always have that expertise in-house, so collaboration across the broader public sector is essential to upholding safety for all. So can the member please explain how this proposed legislation will increase cyber resiliency and foster collaboration with the Ontario government’s partners?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Brian Riddell", "text": [ "Cyber security is one of the biggest problems today we have in the world. Protecting the people of Ontario is, like I said earlier, a key part of what we’re trying to do in this ministry. We want to be state of the art for the world as an example of where you can go.", "I think you were talking about the Windsor hospital and the issue they had. This is the total reason why we want to put this bill into place and, if passed, be able to do it that they will have the protections they need, just like children in the classroom will have, just like hospitals like we’re talking about and children’s aid societies. That’s where we’re starting. And we’ve assembled a team of experts from the different ministries and from outside work facilities to make this decision go through." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (MmeLucille Collard)", "text": [ "Next question." ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Chandra Pasma", "text": [ "Thank you to the member for Cambridge for his remarks on this bill. I listened very carefully. The member for Cambridge certainly promised this bill will deliver a lot, but what I didn’t hear anything about was who is going to pay for it.", "Our school boards are already incredibly strapped for resources. They cannot pay for student transportation to get our kids to school safely every morning. We have larger class sizes. We’re cutting classes and resources for kids with special education. We can’t protect our kids against violence in schools.", "School boards were already saying before this bill that they need more help financially with cyber security, and now this bill is imposing new requirements on them with no additional funding for them to actually implement these changes. So who is going to pay to make sure that these digital protections are in place?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Brian Riddell", "text": [ "I’ll put it a different way: What if something happens to a hospital? How much does that cost? What happens if something happens at a school? What does that cost? You hear about children committing suicide because of cyberbullying. Can we stop that? Yes, we can, and this is a chance to do that.", "It’s like one hand and another hand, which one do you want to go with? I want to go with the one where we’re protecting the children.", "1550" ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (MmeLucille Collard)", "text": [ "Next question?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Tyler Allsopp", "text": [ "My constituents in Bay of Quinte have expressed growing concerns about transparency and accountability as the government increasingly transitions towards digital platforms. With the increasing digitization of government services, people feel apprehensive about the accessibility and growing exposure of personal information. Parents and caregivers seek reassurance that transparency will be maintained and that their voices will continue to be heard in this evolving digital landscape.", "I understand that this proposed legislation would strengthen the Information and Privacy Commissioner’s investigative power. Speaker, through you, can the member from Cambridge please explain how strengthening the Information and Privacy Commissioner’s investigative powers would increase government transparency and accountability?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Brian Riddell", "text": [ "Our plan provides transparency that people can look at and see how our ministry is operating and open fairly to the public. That’s what we want to do and that’s the game plan." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (MmeLucille Collard)", "text": [ "Next question?" ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Teresa J. Armstrong", "text": [ "I think we all in our municipalities or ridings have stories about how things were, like the cyber attacks in London on December 13, 2003. The London Public Library was hacked and there were shutdowns with regard to phone lines, websites, computers, including access to the Internet, so what we did as an office was we actually offered printing services to our constituents to kind of help a little bit.", "I understand the government’s bill is trying to get ahead of those cyber attacks, but a lot of the organizations that you mentioned that are going to start up on this legislation—it’s the Child, Youth and Family Services Act—are school boards and the children’s aid societies. These organizations are smaller organizations, perhaps, in some cases, where they don’t always have the resources to implement the legislation. I think part of the concern is when we create legislation and we ask boards or municipalities to implement this legislation, the resources, the training and the funds aren’t there.", "Is this government prepared to put in money and help this implementation of this bill, so it’s successful in its mandate?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Brian Riddell", "text": [ "Like I said earlier, cyber security is an international affair that’s happening, whether it’s Russia, whether it’s North Korea, whether it’s Nigeria or anywhere in the world. The point that I’m trying to make: How expensive is it if we don’t do it? To me, that answers it. It’s not if we should do it; it’s that we have to do it." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (MmeLucille Collard)", "text": [ "Next question." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Lorne Coe", "text": [ "There are many parents in Whitby—in fact, grandparents—who are concerned about how well their children’s data is protected when they’re at school. Can the great member from Cambridge please explain how this proposed legislation will keep children safe in the classroom? You’ve got a minute and nine seconds." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (MmeLucille Collard)", "text": [ "A minute for the member for Cambridge." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Brian Riddell", "text": [ "I’d like to thank the member from Whitby for that question. It will be safe because we’ll put safeguards in that will protect children from going to certain websites. School computers will have software that’s only approved by the school board or by the government on their computers, and it will be safe.", "This is a worldwide problem, like I said earlier. This is changing every single day; they’re getting better and better. If I think five years ago to today, look at the difference in AI and what it can do. ChatGPT, five years ago—last year, I didn’t even know about it until last year when it came out. This is a good bill and I hope I have support from across the way." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (MmeLucille Collard)", "text": [ "Thank you.", "This is all for questions. We’re going to move to further debate." ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Chandra Pasma", "text": [ "It is a pleasure and an honour to rise once again in this House on behalf of the residents of Ottawa West–Nepean. While the Legislature has been shut for this very long 19 weeks, I have taken the opportunity to speak with residents across Ottawa West–Nepean, door-knocking and attending community events and hearing their concerns. They were deeply distressed that the Legislature was not open, that the government was not here presenting solutions to the challenges that they face on issues like health care and housing unaffordability. They really wanted their voices and concerns to be reflected here and to see solutions put forward. So I’m glad that we are back here now, and I’m looking forward to our debates and looking forward to seeing solutions on behalf of the things that matter to Ottawa West–Nepean.", "Today, I am rising to speak on behalf of my constituents on Bill 194, the Strengthening Cyber Security and Building Trust in the Public Sector Act. This bill gives the government regulatory authority for matters of cyber security, AI and digital technology, including regulations that are specific for minors under the age of 18, and it would apply, among other organizations, to universities, colleges, hospitals and local school boards.", "The bill is extremely vague, because much of it is about regulatory capacity, and the language used in the bill is “may” rather than “shall,” and it doesn’t tell us exactly what the government is going to do. It does say that it could include the requirement to develop and implement cyber security programs, and it would create the ability for the minister to make regulations regarding the use, collection, retention and disclosure of digital information. It does allow the Information and Privacy Commissioner to conduct a review if somebody makes a complaint about informational practices, and it expands reporting requirements for the head of an institution—if there is the theft, loss or unauthorized disclosure of personal information, that has to be reported to the Information and Privacy Commissioner.", "I do recognize that this bill is coming because we are in a new digital world, and it certainly has an impact on how we parent and how we educate our children. It’s certainly something that I feel, as a parent. When I was a teenager, my parents were concerned about me reading, under the covers, a book with a flashlight; when I walk up the stairs now, I am concerned about my 14-year-old being on TikTok in her bedroom, which, honestly, is sometimes a little harder to discover. Every night, when I say good night, I tell her, “Don’t sit up on TikTok.” My parents were also concerned about what kinds of books I might be taking out of the public library. Well, I’m concerned about what YouTube videos my kids might be watching and whether it’s taking them down a rabbit hole that might include Andrew Tate.", "So it’s definitely an area where we need to be talking about measures that are going to protect our children—and I do have to say, that’s not just protection from cyber security attacks and data breaches. We also need to be protecting them from things that are happening online, conversations that are taking place, the things that they are exposed to, and the addictive nature of social media.", "There’s a reason why I’m worried about my 14-year-old being on TikTok late at night, and in my opinion, it’s not because the content is so great; it’s the addictive nature of the algorithm. There is enough evidence about the addictiveness of these algorithms being used by social media companies that in the United States, even though Republicans and Democrats agree on practically nothing, there is still enough bipartisan consensus for 42 Attorneys General to have levied a lawsuit against these tech giants—against Meta and the owners of Snapchat and TikTok. I think that speaks for itself in terms of the evidence that exists about how these tech companies have created platforms that are deliberately addictive.", "We’ve also seen school boards in the United States launch their own lawsuits against these companies, and school boards here in Ontario. But rather than joining that lawsuit by the school boards here, the Ford government actually denounced the school boards; they said that wasn’t a good use of resources to protect our children. They said, instead, they were going to talk to the social media companies, and yet they’ve been able to produce no evidence at all that they’ve actually had a conversation with one of these social media companies, let alone achieved any changes or any protections for our children at all.", "I think it’s important that we don’t just talk about ransomware attacks, but that we also talk about what our children are being exposed to, how this is shaping their developing brains, and what we could do to protect our children, to make sure that they’re not exposed to harmful or criminal content, to make sure that they’re not being exposed to cyberbullying, to material that is worsening their mental health. There are concrete steps that we could take as a province, and we are not taking them so far.", "Obviously, cyber security matters too. We are seeing an increase in cyber security attacks. We’re seeing data being accessed without authorization. We’re seeing data being held for ransom. We know that incidents of cybercrime in Canada are increasing; according to Statistics Canada, they’ve almost doubled since 2014, and, in 2018, the Auditor General of Ontario did flag that cyber attacks were a growing threat to the security of Ontario’s school boards’ IT infrastructure and that changes needed to be made. The follow-up report in 2020 did find that there was progress made by the school boards, but still there was more that needed to be done.", "1600", "We have seen school boards in Ontario subject to data breaches. The Toronto District School Board had a ransomware attack in June where the hackers were able to gain access to students’ information, including their names, grades, email addresses, student numbers and dates of birth. In November 2023, student information at the York Region District School Board was accessed. Also in 2023, the Huron Superior District Catholic School Board was hit by ransomware and information on employees was stolen, including social insurance numbers, dates of birth, compensation and banking information. Two years ago, the Waterloo Region District School Board had the data of 70,000 current and former students accessed in cyber attacks, including names, dates of birth and Ontario education numbers; and payroll information for employees was taken, including names, birthdates, social insurance numbers and banking information. That’s just the last couple of years. There have also been attacks in previous years on the Catholic District School Board of Eastern Ontario and the Conseil des écoles publiques de l’Est de l’Ontario as well.", "We definitely do need to take measures to protect the data and information of our students and the employees who work in our school boards and in our schools. This bill, which aims to address cyber security and AI—I think we can support it to get it to committee, but there is definitely so much more that needs to be done and we have some concerns that need to be addressed in committee.", "The biggest issue, really, is funding. It is the question of who is going to pay for these changes. The member for Cambridge said earlier that we couldn’t afford not to do it because of the costs, but the fact of the matter is that there are many things right now that we can’t afford not to be doing, and yet we are not doing them. We cannot afford to leave children with special education and disability needs who have safety plans to have those safety plans exist on paper only, and students who are eloping because nobody is with them during the school day even though they are supposed to have one-on-one or two-on-one support throughout the day, but the school just doesn’t have the resources to protect them.", "We have kids who are walking on rural gravel roads to get to school because of the government’s student transportation funding cuts, which means that school boards have had to increase the walking distances whether or not the infrastructure is there for kids to walk. The driver shortage for our student transportation system, because the government is not covering the full cost of wages, means that we have new drivers, we have managers, we have maintenance technicians filling in on bus routes. So we have bus drivers who do not know the routes, who do not know what corner not to take too fast, where the big potholes are—but they also sometimes just don’t even know the route; they’re going the wrong way entirely. Sometimes that’s funny; I know the kids in my neighbourhood have laughed about that when that’s happened, but, as a parent, my heart is in my throat when I hear that.", "I’ve also heard stories from families across the province of kids getting on the wrong bus, but the bus driver doesn’t know they’re not supposed to be there because the bus driver is not the regular bus driver. If that’s not a safety and security issue for our children, I don’t know what is.", "Our school boards are so under-resourced that we are not even able to provide the basics of safety and security in Ontario. Our kids are drinking water that has high levels of lead in it. We can’t even guarantee clean water for our kids. We can’t guarantee air quality. We can’t guarantee schools that are free of mould and flooding. These are incredibly basic important issues of safety and security.", "So, yes, we need to protect the data and the personal information of our students, but we need to provide the funding for school boards to do that, just like we need to provide the funding for school boards to provide safe, secure student transportation; for them to provide safe, healthy school buildings; for them to provide the resources, the personnel, for all students who have a safety plan to have that safety plan actually implemented every single day at school.", "What we see too often from this government is new requirements being imposed on our school boards when they already can’t afford the existing requirements. We just had the requirement for a tech credit imposed on our schools, which I don’t think anybody is complaining about, but there was no funding for new tech classrooms, for updated tech equipment. There was no attention given to the fact that we do not have enough qualified tech teachers in the province to make sure that there is a qualified teacher teaching every tech credit, and because of that shortage, the government decided to do a consultation on allowing tradespeople without education certification to come in to teach that tech class. Now, if you are a tradesperson, you are very qualified in your trade, but what you do not have is training on how to manage a class of teenagers who may or may not be paying attention and who may or may not actually be interested in the subject matter or in following your instructions. When you have kids operating machinery that requires very careful adherence to safety rules, that is a recipe for disaster.", "But instead of talking to school boards, instead of investing in those resources, the government imposed this requirement on school boards and left them to figure it out. There’s been way too much telling school boards and schools to figure it out without making sure that the necessary resources are there.", "School boards have been asking for support on cyber security. In fact, they were asking for it before this bill was even tabled. These are all from education stakeholders’ budget submissions or their submissions on the Grants for Student Needs.", "From l’ACÉPO: “Technology plays a key role in teaching and learning. Data security has become an area that requires careful attention to ensure the safety of our school system. Maintaining adequate funding to enable improvements to our IT networks is essential.”", "From CUPE: “Increase IT capacity at all school boards, including additional IT staff.”", "From COSBO, the Council of Senior Business Officials: “Cyber security is a key requirement for keeping our school systems safe. Effective access to technology and cyber security infrastructure is a core requirement for students and staff in order to achieve the learning goals and priorities of the Ministry of Education and school board trustees. Maintaining and enhancing the technological infrastructure that is in place will require ongoing investments.”", "From OCSTA, the Ontario Catholic School Trustees’ Association: “School boards host enormous amounts of personal and sensitive information about students and board staff that can make them vulnerable to cyber attacks. This information could be used for identity theft or other forms of criminal activity that pose a significant risk for student and staff safety. It is paramount then that school boards have the necessary resources, training and support required to develop cyber security systems to prevent cyber attacks. While Catholic school boards support the general recommendations of the Auditor General in refining existing cyber security and risk management frameworks to reduce the school board’s risks, including cyber security awareness training to teachers and staff who have access to information technology, additional funding and support resources are necessary.”", "From OPSBA, the Ontario Public School Boards’ Association: “The GSN must address the critical need and increasing costs of cyber security.”", "In fact, once this bill was tabled, the Ontario Public School Boards’ Association sent a letter to the Minister of Public and Business Service Delivery that said, “We are extremely supportive of increasing the protective measures for children and youth and the personal privacy of our students, their families and our staff. We appreciate the seriousness around cyber security risks and have had board members deal with this issue this past school year. We have asked for funding to support this critical need and the increasing cost of cyber security and risk in our boards. This was noted in our most recent education funding proposal. We would also suggest that any new requirements for school boards that are a result of this legislation need to be fully funded and supported by the province.”", "If there is not additional funding that accompanies this legislation, then you are putting school boards in an impossible position, where you’re asking them to deliver something that they simply cannot deliver because they do not have the resources to do it.", "There were also some concerns raised by the Information and Privacy Commissioner about this bill. The Information and Privacy Commissioner laid out her concerns that we need to see an explicit explanation, details, about what kind of cyber security measures this bill will be expected to implement, transparency on the ministerial directives and regulations that will come under this bill, and greater coordination between existing privacy legislation and cyber security legislation for minors.", "1610", "I’m just going to read a couple of these excerpts. The Information and Privacy Commissioner asked for the bill to be more like the federal bill, C-26, the Critical Cyber Systems Protection Act, which “outlines a series of core elements that covered entities must include as part of the cyber security programs mandated by the bill, recognizing that these may be further amplified by way of regulation. These elements constitute best practices which were developed by a range of federal agencies, including Public Safety Canada.", "“Similar to the approach taken in federal Bill C-26, we recommend that schedule 1 of Bill 194 be amended to explicitly require regulations to cover certain core elements that must be included in a cyber security program and that these compulsory core elements align with those to be required federally.”", "The commissioner is also asking for greater transparency about what the minister is ordering under the bill, because right now, “as drafted, the Enhancing Digital Security and Trust Act exempts ministerial directives from part III of the Legislation Act, including the requirement to publish the directives on the e-Laws website and in the Ontario Gazette. Schedule 1 does not otherwise require the government to publicly communicate ministerial directives to which public sector entities must conform.” The commissioner notes, “Greater transparency can also have the positive downstream effect of increasing general public awareness and engagement. This could help Ontarians better understand the nature of the risks involved, ask more informed questions of public institutions they interact with, and become more knowledgeable participants in their own efforts to become digitally aware and protect their personal information online.”", "The last thing I want to raise today, Speaker, is that if we want to talk about privacy and kids’ information and who is accessing it in schools, then I think we also have to talk about vape detectors and security cameras in schools. This government’s only answer so far to the growing and urgent problem of violence in our schools has been to put $30 million towards vape detectors and security cameras, but they provided no guidelines at all for these vape detectors. We know that some vape detectors do not only detect smoke, but they can detect noise as well, and could potentially be recording noise. So we’re going to install these vape detectors in bathrooms with no rules at all about whether or not the vape detectors are allowed to detect noise and whether or not they’re recorded. I think that’s a pretty big problem for privacy expectations of students in school.", "The privacy commissioner has also said before that school security policies around cameras in schools must use security cameras only as a last resort, when every other measure of deterrence has failed, but what we are seeing here is that the government hasn’t tried any other methods of deterrence. They have not done a single other thing to prevent and eliminate school violence, and that’s despite the fact my colleague the MPP for Sudbury and NDP critic for labour and I met with education stakeholders, and we developed a nine-point plan based on that consultation with stakeholders about things that could be done today, if the government cared to implement them, that would prevent and eliminate violence in schools; that would not require cameras to be there constantly recording our children, with no idea about who is accessing that data and how long it is being stored. But the government has not cared to take those actions.", "So much like with the lawsuits against these social media giants, we’re kind of left asking why the government does not care about protecting our children in all situations. Why do they only care about issuing directives to school boards, but not taking tangible measures that are in their capacity to protect our children? And so, I’m hoping that in addition to this bill, we will see some of those tangible actions come from the government." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (MmeLucille Collard)", "text": [ "We’re going to move to questions, and I recognize the member for Bruce–Grey–Owen Sound." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Rick Byers", "text": [ "Thank you, Speaker, and I thank the member for the comments on this important legislation and the discussion on schools.", "Our government has many times made the commitment to keep students in the classroom. This also means keeping students safe from harms that may arise in school. No parent in the province should worry about their child’s safety when they are at school, and that includes digital and online safety.", "This proposed legislation would, if passed, consult with partners to consider the implementation of data and privacy protections for software used by students and the establishment of a right to opt out of educational services that collect or retain personal information.", "Just given these elements, are these elements enough to allow the member to support this bill?" ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Chandra Pasma", "text": [ "Thank you to the member for Bruce–Grey–Owen Sound for the question.", "There are many situations in which this government is failing to keep our students safe at school and in which parents in the province of Ontario are sending their kids off to school in the morning, not even worried about whether they’re going to learn anything for the day but whether they will come home safely at the end of the day. And that’s particularly the case for our students who have disabilities or special needs, whose safety plans aren’t being implemented, who do not have people around them to support them and keep them safe, but it’s also the case for student violence. Their learning is being interrupted every single day through classroom evacuations, through seeing their teachers being hit, kicked or punched by kids not having the supports, which is leading to this frustration, which is then erupting in violence.", "There are so many things that we need to do to keep our children safe, and a few measures around cyber security that do not have funding is just not going to cut it to alleviate parents’ concerns." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (MmeLucille Collard)", "text": [ "Next question." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Tom Rakocevic", "text": [ "I want to thank the member for her excellent submission to this debate.", "I think we’ve seen governments potentially over-promise and under-deliver on a lot of things, and if I took the crux of what was said by the last government member to speak, I got the sense that all public institutions, should this pass, will never have to deal with a cyber attack. I mean, that was the kind of confidence we heard. Do you feel that confidence, if this bill were to pass, that it’s done? Cyber attacks—over. What do you think?" ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Chandra Pasma", "text": [ "Thank you very much to my colleague for that question.", "I do not have that confidence at all. One of the reasons why I do not have that confidence is because we do not know what the government’s plan is to address cyber security, because they’ve put forward a bill that gives themselves the power to make regulations. There’s a list of areas in which the government may make regulations—they don’t have to—and we have no idea what those regulations are going to be, who they may be consulting about those regulations and what kind of funding or support they may be putting forward for those regulations to actually be implemented.", "And school boards are not actually the only institution that is struggling financially under this government and that does not have the resources to implement these unknown cyber security measures without additional financial support. We have not heard a single thing from the government side this afternoon about what resources will be made available from the government to make their regulations a reality for these institutions." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (MmeLucille Collard)", "text": [ "The next question." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Andrew Dowie", "text": [ "I want to thank the member for Ottawa West–Nepean for some very insightful remarks.", "One thing I was hoping to find, though, is really—I want to know what the alternatives out there might be. I know the news has many stories. Certainly, I mentioned the case of TransForm back home and different municipal governments who have had cyber attacks. They have data that they hold in trust for the people of Ontario, and they’ve been held ransom for millions of dollars. It’s truly unacceptable, in the province of Ontario, that this is happening, and it’s why our government is providing our vulnerable, broader public sector entities with the tools that they need to prevent cyber incidents.", "So I’m hoping, Speaker, through you—if the member opposite can explain what support they intend to give our partners and the tools they intend to give our partners to prevent cyber incidents." ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Chandra Pasma", "text": [ "Thank you to the member from Windsor–Tecumseh for that question.", "I think the Information and Privacy Commissioner has already laid out part of the answer in their submission to the government, which is that there are already measures of a strong and robust cyber security program laid out in the federal government’s Bill C-26, which was far more explicit about what public sector organizations needed to be doing. I don’t understand why the federal government could have that degree of explicitness and actually include the details in their bill, but the provincial government was unable to provide those details. I also don’t understand why we can’t have greater transparency around what is being asked and what is being expected, because that is what builds public trust.", "Finally, once again, I’m just not hearing where the resources are going to come from for these public sector institutions, like our school boards, our hospitals, our post-secondary institutions, which are all strapped for resources under this government, which can barely deliver their existing mandate and are now supposed to do this on top of it with no additional funds.", "1620" ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (MmeLucille Collard)", "text": [ "We’re going to go to the next question." ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Teresa J. Armstrong", "text": [ "In my previous career, I was an insurance broker. Way back before cyber security and all this Internet explosion, insurance companies started offering identity theft, for homeowners, under their policy. Now you can buy extra coverage. That’s something that I feel like the insurance company was ahead of the game with.", "Now this government is catching up with a framework around the privacy issues on cyber and AI attacks and releasing private information that’s subject to FIPPA and MFIPPA—one of them being the school boards.", "You highlighted how addictive social media is. Can the member explain to parents—because they need to know. Parents need to trust that their personal information and children are safe and private and protected in our public institutions. How important is it that the government provide support in order to make this legislation be taken seriously, with action?" ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Chandra Pasma", "text": [ "Thanks to the member for London–Fanshawe for that great question.", "We know the unauthorized access of personal data can be devastating. It can have real-world harms. It can result in identity theft and fraud and the loss of wages or income.", "That’s why it’s so important that the government take real and concrete action instead of putting forward a plan to make a plan. When our hospitals are already left treating patients on stretchers, when our schools have to choose between getting kids to school and providing a quality education, when our post-secondary institutions are making deep cuts, they do not have the resources to implement whatever the government’s plan ends up being. If the government truly wants to exercise its responsibility to protect the private information of Ontarians, then they need to step up with the funding to make that a reality." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (MmeLucille Collard)", "text": [ "Next question?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Lorne Coe", "text": [ "Speaker, through you to the member from Ottawa West–Nepean: As you moved towards the conclusion of your remarks, I thought you were going to talk a little bit about the importance of foundational protections related to the use of artificial intelligence—I thought you were leading up to that, but you didn’t.", "So I’m going to put this question to you: Will you commit and your colleagues commit to supporting foundational protections related to the use of artificial intelligence?" ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Chandra Pasma", "text": [ "Thank you to the member for Whitby for that question.", "The artificial intelligence parts of this bill are just like the cyber security parts, in that there’s a plan to create a plan. We don’t even know what the plan to create a plan is, because it’s not clear who’s going to be consulted. It’s not clear what resources are going to go into implementing the plan.", "The Ontario Public School Boards’ Association also flagged this to the government in its June letter, saying that artificial intelligence “is an issue of great interest and concern to school boards, and we would like to ensure that there is consideration of the specific impacts for our sector. Experts who understand the benefits and challenges in education (i.e. how AI is being used by students and staff) should be included in any consultation.”", "I have heard no commitment from the government’s side that there will be consideration of the specific impacts of AI for students and staff and for school boards, that the education stakeholders will be included in the conversation about what the plan actually ends up being, and that there will be resources at the end of the day for schools, for teachers, educators and administrators to actually—" ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (MmeLucille Collard)", "text": [ "Thank you. There’s no more time for another question.", "We’re going to have to move to further debate." ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Aislinn Clancy", "text": [ "I do want to thank the government. They are taking a step in the right direction when it comes to finding a way to protect our institutions, when it comes to cyber security and artificial intelligence.", "As a member of the social policy committee, I just spent the last month hearing about our budget and raising big concerns about the deficits that our institutions are facing. We have hospitals facing big deficits that they’ve never had to face before and relying on credit. We’ve had school boards facing deficits—universities and colleges and child welfare systems.", "We know that the kind of expertise needed in order to do this properly costs money. Just looking at some data—a medium-sized medical institution recently invested $8 million and hired three staff in order to address this. If we think of the scale that we’re going to be addressing when it comes to all of these organizations—school boards, health care facilities, not-for-profits etc.—this is going to be an enormous chunk of change.", "Unfortunately, too often, we see that we come with red tape but we don’t come with the scissors. I’m hopeful and I’m optimistic that those scissors will be provided. While we need red tape to safeguard against the misuse of information, the losses when our health data is held ransom, we have to ensure that our organizations have the scissors that they need to cut the red tape and move forward, to ensure that we protect our organizations from harm and from massive lawsuits and liabilities.", "I don’t feel that there’s enough detail in this. I know we want to leave things open to interpretation because we need to make sure that we don’t mandate one organization that’s different from another, but I do think we need some major guiding principles, and I think that’s what’s missing here.", "Especially when it comes to AI, we know there’s a great deal of racism. Data shows that racism is a problem when using AI tools. I’ll do some quotes here. AI in health care—“Some tools for creating health risk scores have been shown to have race-based correction factors.” Also, we’ve seen that AI, when applied to educational tools, can include a racial bias.", "We need to ensure we are having the proper diet—I think of AI as having a diet. I talked to my friend who is involved in AI and start-ups. I brought this forward to him this morning, when we were going for a jog, and he told me, “You have to feed AI a balanced diet.”", "I want to be sure that whatever we do, going forward, respects people’s human rights. I think we lead ourselves to cause more harm than good if we create tools and we rely on tools that are not guided by values, that are not guided by these principles. We need to enshrine human rights protections in the legislation itself. I know that we don’t want to make it too narrow so that we cause harm and it’s not possible for some to use and we’re not being sensitive to the culture of the organization. But we need to make sure that these values are enshrined in the legislation itself.", "I also share the concerns with the Ottawa West–Nepean member—to be sure that there’s proper collaboration. I think we’ve taken a first step to make sure that we talk to experts in the field, but I think we’re hearing today that some partners have been left out and they want their considerations made. I know we can bring that forward in committee, but recently, in a committee, I noticed that voices were missing. So I urge the government that when we take this legislation forward and we’re bringing it to committee, we have a fulsome conversation. If we’re really going to do this well, if we’re going to have equity in mind and we’re going to make sure that it fits with all the different institutions, those voices need to be at the table. We’re hearing from OPSBA that they want to be included in the conversation.", "My experience on committee is that we are far too limited in including more amendments. As someone who proposes suggestions that are from industry experts—if we’re going to do honest collaboration in committee, we need to make sure that we have an openness to include that feedback in the legislation so we don’t have to wait another year to bring back 2.0, 3.0 or 4.0 that may or may never happen. I urge you to ensure that there’s openness going forward and, when we do committee, that there’s openness to amendments from the various stakeholders, so we can include these voices in the final draft of the legislation so that it’s really good and we don’t have to go back and fix it.", "Thank you for your time. As you know, I’m a school social worker. I care very deeply about how kids move around online and how their data is used. So I ask you to come forward and ask me any questions." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (MmeLucille Collard)", "text": [ "We are going to questions. I’ll start with the member for Windsor–Tecumseh." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Andrew Dowie", "text": [ "I want to thank the member from Kitchener Centre for her remarks.", "Just building on, really, my comments from earlier involving hospitals and health care—I know that there’s a code grey that gets activated if there’s a loss of a critical system that renders hospital facilities unable to function. We’ve experienced that at Windsor Regional Hospital pretty significantly, especially in the early days of the pandemic, when surgeries and other procedures had to be cancelled. While code grey may be unfamiliar for most Ontarians, for hospital staff, they know it could be a matter of life or death.", "1630", "Speaker, this government, under the leadership of Premier Ford, is committed to upgrading our hospitals, just like the Windsor-Essex regional acute-care hospital, reducing wait times and making record investments to train more doctors. Part of this commitment to improving our hospitals is upgrading cyber security standards.", "Through you, Speaker: Can the member opposite please tell us what concrete actions they foresee providing our hospitals to ensure they have the support that they need?" ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Aislinn Clancy", "text": [ "I don’t mean to be critical, but I have to remind us that we are the least-funded, per capita, in the country.", "Unfortunately, we’re not out of the hole when it comes to the funding that we need to properly staff health care. I think we’ve seen a lot of health care challenges. A lot of our health care CEOs have come forward and described the difficulties to recruit and retain staff. I think we need to properly fund this project for it to do well. Like I said, we need to have guardrails and we need some red tape to make sure there are protections in place, but if we don’t provide the scissors, we don’t provide the funding, it’s going to be smoke and mirrors. I don’t want that to happen. I don’t think anybody here wants this to be done halfway. We need to look at our funding formula. I think there have been lots of criticisms that hospitals should not be running a deficit." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (MmeLucille Collard)", "text": [ "Next question?" ] }, { "speaker": "MmeFrance Gélinas", "text": [ "I will start with, no, hospitals should not be running a deficit. They should have a budget that allows them to cover their costs. But that’s not my question to the member.", "You started to talk about feeding AI a healthy diet, and I didn’t quite see the link between what you were trying to say with the—I know what a healthy diet does to a human being. I don’t see the link to the AI. I must have missed something, and I was hoping that you could clarify what you had in mind when you shared those comments." ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Aislinn Clancy", "text": [ "We know that the biggest investors in AI right now are Meta, Facebook—all the social media giants. They’ve been doing this for a decade. I know that YouTube is one of the most racist and misogynist spaces in our media today. If we are using the media and the Internet that’s out there, how do we ensure that these AI tools are vetted so they don’t perpetuate misogyny, they don’t perpetuate racism? We’ve heard from policing use of AI that there have been a lot of gaps, especially related to people who identify as Black. I’m worried that the experts right now, who have invested the most in AI, have the most racist, misogynist content.", "We need to be sure that these tools are not being used in our public institutions, that we have a way of vetting them to make sure that they respect human rights and that they’re promoting a healthy balance." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (MmeLucille Collard)", "text": [ "We have time for another quick question." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Rick Byers", "text": [ "Thank you to the member for her comments. I noticed her comments about taking the input of others, particularly in committee, but I want to offer, elsewhere, that this legislation introduces updates to Ontario’s privacy safeguards in alignment with recommendations made by the Information and Privacy Commissioner. Our government values the important input given by outside partners and stakeholders because we know the government doesn’t always know best—even though that may surprise.", "Speaker, through you: Does the member consider that the recommendations made by the Information and Privacy Commissioner, as an independent watchdog, merit supporting this legislation?" ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Aislinn Clancy", "text": [ "I will consistently remind us that it’s not about us without us. If we expect this policy to govern school boards, if we expect this policy to govern our hospitals and our health care sector, we need to ensure that we invite those voices in. When we do end up in committee and those voices come forward, we need to include their expertise, as well.", "I appreciate that you’re deferring to the privacy commissioner’s recommendations. I want you to look around and see which voices are missing, proactively, so we do not cause harm." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (MmeLucille Collard)", "text": [ "We’re going to move to further debate." ] }, { "speaker": "MmeDawn Gallagher Murphy", "text": [ "Today, I have the great privilege to rise in this House to discuss a critical piece of legislation—a piece of legislation that focuses on building a better Ontario by helping the security and the privacy of Ontarians, as our society quickly continues to progress into this digital world that is transforming our lives every minute of the day.", "Bill 194, the Strengthening Cyber Security and Building Trust in the Public Sector Act, 2024, will facilitate our defence mechanisms against cyber attacks, while making certain that the use of artificial intelligence, AI, in the public operations is used responsibly.", "I would like to thank the Minister of Public and Business Service Delivery, the member for Durham, as well as his parliamentary assistant, the member for Cambridge, for all of the work that they have done on this bill, for their forward-thinking approach to addressing a reality that is all around us: AI opportunities to help improve the services the government provides, but also the prevention of cyber attacks that can cripple an organization, a business or a person—thus, the urgency in moving this bill forward so as to protect Ontarians.", "Last May, I presented my private member’s motion to this Legislature, and it read, “that, in the opinion of this House, the government of Ontario should adopt methods to assess potential risks and judge the successful adoption and ethical use of artificial intelligence use in government while developing measures to counter emerging cyber security threats.” That day, I was honoured to have the support of many information technology security experts here in the chamber, to hear the motion debated. There were representatives from IBM, from my local Southlake Regional Health Centre, as well as representatives from the Association of Consulting Engineering Companies. I do thank all of my legislative colleagues on both sides of the aisle, as we had a robust discussion on the threats that exist in this digital age, and we discussed how AI is seen as this unknown, potentially scary, machine, but at the same time, we discussed the right set of circumstances in which AI can benefit Ontarians. At the end of that private member’s motion, all parties agreed unanimously to pass that motion. Thank you to all the members who spoke to my motion, including Minister McCarthy, the member for Cambridge, the member for Burlington, the member for Ottawa South, and the member for Spadina–Fort York.", "I am confident that Bill 194 will meet with unanimous agreement, as well.", "Yes, I would agree with the member for Ottawa South, who noted during his speech that evening of May 8 that governments do not move quickly.", "Well, I would like to thank the Minister of Public and Business Service Delivery for moving forward with this bill, as it is timely and it addresses the urgency required by this Legislature to take action and pass this bill.", "What are the threats, and why do we need to move so earnestly? No one is immune to the disruptions that cyber attacks create. The number of incidents has nearly tripled in just four years. In 2024 alone, Windsor Regional Hospital, Erie Shores HealthCare, Hôtel-Dieu Grace Healthcare, Bluewater Health and Chatham-Kent Health Alliance all suffered cyber attacks which forced hospitals to postpone or reschedule surgeries and appointments.", "We could go back to 2019 when a similar computer system attack hit Health Sciences North, which then shut down computer systems across northern Ontario. HSN was quick to react, and it minimized the potential impact. However, since 2019, these cyber attacks have ramped up. In 2024, the city of Hamilton was a victim of a ransomware attack. Cyber attacks on municipal networks can lead to dangerous situations if there was any tampering with emergency, water and waste water systems. The town of Huntsville was hit by a cyber security attack, causing the town hall and the public library to close.", "1640", "It is important to reiterate the sense of urgency associated with the passing of this bill as we need to ensure we bolster our own cyber resilience. Bill 194 will mandate critical protections and establish a centralized approach for reporting and responding to cyber attacks.", "The new statute proposed, the Enhancing Digital Security and Trust Act, 2024, establishes regulation-making authorities and amendments to the Freedom of Information and Protection of Privacy Act, known as FIPPA. This act would set a foundation to ensure that people, businesses and children have the right protections to safely participate and thrive in digital life. The early sectors include hospitals, school boards, colleges and universities and children’s aid societies.", "The focus for 2024-25 is to establish requirements for cyber security incident reporting, program leads and maturity progress reporting schedules, directives and standards to be established as needed, all informed by industry and emerging issues.", "Safeguarding data and privacy in this digital world are our government’s top priorities. At the same time, we want to support the growth of a safe and prosperous digital economy. We can do that by committing to provide the right tools to quickly respond to cyber attacks and emerging threats, keeping people safe from data and potentially AI-related harms.", "To improve online digital services, with the goal of personalizing service delivery, and to realize the benefit from the “tell-us-once” features like prepopulating fields and communications preferences—this can all be done by creating an online account and choosing to opt in to share personal information. It will be a consent-based service that offers personalized services tailored to individual needs; notify users about new or altered programs; proactively remind them when Ontario IDs are nearing expiration; and send alerts to deter fraudulent activities, all the while ensuring that personal information remains protected. This is truly a focus on safe, reliable and efficient digital government services.", "Switching gears now over to artificial intelligence: AI, it is all around us. It is rapidly advancing and changing the way people interact with businesses and government. It has become a truly transformative force across sectors from health care to education. Today, there is no legislation governing the safe and responsible use of AI in Canada—not in any jurisdiction. Bill 194 offers the framework needed to set the standard for transparent, accountable and safe use of these technologies.", "As a government, we have a duty to ensure that services rendered to the taxpayers in this great province are provided in the most secure, efficient, transparent, trustworthy and ethical manner. By ensuring a secure digital future, the province can deliver on these core principles to Ontarians.", "The Strengthening Cyber Security and Building Trust in the Public Sector Act, 2024, proposes a clear definition of an AI system to create consistency across the public sector and regulation-making authorities to establish protections around the responsible use of AI systems. Once again, the early sectors this will apply to include hospitals, school boards, colleges and universities, and children’s aid societies. The focus for 2024-25 is to establish requirements about key guardrails covering transparency, accountability and risk management.", "Establishing foundational rights for individuals regarding AI use with details set in regulation includes:", "—the right to disclosure/explanation of use of AI that impacts a decision;", "—rights to opt out of automated AI and access government services through another option;", "—the right to challenge decisions made by AI; and", "—the right to appropriate oversight mechanisms.", "Bill 194 would create new regulation-granting authority for operational policies and guidance for BPS institutions for responsible/risk-based use of AI. This could supplement and build foundational rights to respond quickly and proactively to future developments in AI as a rapidly growing sector.", "I believe that AI is transforming people’s lives in a similar manner. However, trust is one of the most critical factors in gaining public buy-in for the use of this technology. By creating this new regulation-making authority’s granting authority, I believe this will establish trust.", "In a couple of great conversations with Sharon Polsky, president of the Privacy and Access Council of Canada, I intensively listened to her comments: “Citizens want to be safe (not just feel safe), human intervention is needed, common sense on where and when AI can be used is critical. People expect governments to earn their trust—trust is sustainable by ensuring verifiable evidence.”", "By establishing strong governance and human oversight in AI decision-making, Bill 194 ensures that AI systems used by public sector organizations are aligned with Ontario’s trustworthy AI framework. This will safeguard against unintended harms and bolster public trust.", "Strengthening the Ontario government’s partnerships with leading AI organizations to inform future AI directions and responsible use is part of this bill. We understand that we must invest in the skills needed for the next generation and ensure that Ontario remains the global leader for decades to come.", "To this end, we are committed to developing collaborative partnerships with organizations as AI evolves to help inform the development of Ontario’s trustworthy AI framework. As such, we are recognizing the Vector Institute for its dedication to cutting-edge research and rewarding it with up to $27 million to continue its great work supporting engineers, researchers and AI professionals to help accelerate the safe and responsible adoption of AI.", "When I was researching for my private member’s motion, I met with the executive of the Vector Institute. Feedback I received from Ben Davies, chief information officer, Vector Institute for Artificial Intelligence: “Vector believes that the AI trust and safety principles we have developed can provide valuable guidance for other organizations as they work to establish their own codes of conduct and AI policies … these principles will cause organizations to consider how they will conduct business in an AI-enabled world. We believe it is important for Ontario to consider the global context to ensure interoperability across jurisdictions in alignment with best practices as it continues to develop and promote its AI ecosystem.”", "1650", "Strengthening partnerships with leading AI organizations like the Vector Institute will make it easier for Ontario companies to develop AI applications and encourage collaboration and create new partnerships.", "In speaking with IBM Canada, we discussed the two disruptors in AI adoption: investing in people and R&D. There are more jobs coming to this province to specifically do exactly that: invest in people in higher-paying jobs. This will lead to greater research focus on micro enhancements to existing technology platforms.", "An example discussed was the opportunity related to a busy call centre. We have all been there, waiting and waiting to speak with a live person who can assist us, and by the time that human gets to the phone, we literally want to scream at that person. Well, how AI can assist to eliminate that venting is by providing service to the point that a human can then take over for the heavy lifting, who now will be in a great state of mind because they’re not being attacked by the person who was waiting online for so long, and this will eliminate unnecessary burnout and mental fatigue. Again, back to how we as a government can ensure people are productive, these tools will help in ways that will continually evolve.", "The Fraser Institute recently issued an article concerning Canada’s productivity crisis: “In the early 1980s, Canada was roughly 88% as productive as the United States, measured by the value of output per hour of work across the economy. By 2022, that figure had dropped to 71%, and it’s continued to decline since then.”", "The Fraser Institute provided some thoughts on what can be done: “A smarter approach is to boost investment in the things that make businesses and workers more productive—machinery, equipment, digital tools and technologies, intellectual property, up-to-date transportation and communications infrastructure, and research and development focused on bringing innovative products and ideas to market, rather than keeping them in the lab or in academic institutions.”", "Speaker, one of the most critical components of this bill is the protection it affords to children, one of our greatest assets. In this digital transformative world, our youth engage with online education tools and social platforms—even more reason to ensure that we protect their privacy and data.", "In my own community, I have heard from parents and grandparents regarding their young loved ones, specifically the cyberbullying that is happening. This is tragic for our children who are impacted by this form of bullying. What could be worse is the potential of a hacker attacking our children. Whether it’s through school laptops or social media use, it is our responsibility to ensure that their digital footprints are secure and protected from malicious use.", "Bill 194 has specific provisions for children, specifically with the goal of establishing protections for children and minors engaging with public sector organizations and creates new regulation-making authorities to grant the Minister of Public and Business Service Delivery the authority to establish and modify requirements aimed at safeguarding the data of children within educational environments and related areas regulated by the province.", "Madam Speaker, I see I’m running out of time, so I’m going to quickly kind of go to the end here. I truly appreciate the opportunity to contribute to this important debate on Bill 194. It followed my private member’s motion and I am confident that we will have productive discussions on this bill, followed by all esteemed colleagues agreeing that, unanimously, we can shape the future of Ontario’s digital landscape by passing Bill 194." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (MmeLucille Collard)", "text": [ "We’re going to move to questions. I’ll start with the member for Nickel Belt." ] }, { "speaker": "MmeFrance Gélinas", "text": [ "J’aimerais poser une question à ma collègue.", "Je dirais que j’aime votre enthousiasme envers ce projet, et oui, c’est quelque chose qui doit être fait. Par contre, comme vous avez entendu, le projet de loi en lui-même parle d’intention et ne parle pas toujours d’actions concrètes. Dans la présentation que vous avez faite, vous parlez d’actions concrètes et on appuie ça. Le projet de loi, par contre, parle—ce sont des ambitions. Ce sont des espoirs qu’on va faire ça à un moment donné, mais on ne peut pas le voire en noir sur blanc.", "Donc ma question, c’est : comment est-ce que vous pouvez vous assurer qu’on va passer des mots à l’action?" ] }, { "speaker": "MmeDawn Gallagher Murphy", "text": [ "Bonjour et merci beaucoup, notre députée de Nickel Belt.", "Alors, dans cette loi dont on parle, franchement, on doit commencer avec des lois, avec des écoles et des hôpitaux. Comment peut-on faire des rapports concernant toutes les choses des attaques de cybersécurité? Donc, on parle de ça.", "J’entends beaucoup de commentaires de nos collègues ici. Ils ont parlé de tous les détails concernant les dépenses et comment on va payer pour tout cela.", "Tout d’abord, on doit commencer avec les lois qui disent: « OK, qu’est-ce que tous les départements peuvent faire avec des rapports? » Parce que maintenant, on n’a rien. On n’a rien du tout. Donc, on doit commencer avec quelque chose. Comme j’ai remarqué—" ] }, { "speaker": "La Présidente suppléante (MmeLucille Collard)", "text": [ "Merci. C’est tout le temps pour la réponse.", "Nous allons passer à la prochaine question. Next question." ] }, { "speaker": "M. Andrew Dowie", "text": [ "J’apprécie bien l’enthousiasme du membre de Newmarket–Aurora—tellement.", "Madam Speaker, this government was elected on a promise to get it done—it’s one of the reasons I’m here, and I’m so proud to be, really. We’re growing faster than ever. We’re prioritizing vital infrastructure like Highway 3 and regional roads, public transit and really the first electric vehicle battery plant in Canada was right in my backyard, right in my riding. It is tremendous. And the largest transit expansion in North America—we’re going to see the fruits of that labour very, very shortly.", "The aim is to equip the next generation of Ontarians with the skills and tools they need to be leaders in artificial intelligence—that did not sound terribly intelligent the way I described it. But Speaker, can the member from Newmarket–Aurora please explain how this proposed legislation will ensure that Ontario does not fall behind other jurisdictions in the development of AI?" ] }, { "speaker": "MmeDawn Gallagher Murphy", "text": [ "Thank you to the member from Windsor–Tecumseh for that great question because in fact our government has been very much focused on building Ontario, building the critical infrastructure that we need, building for a greener economy. Now, what’s important is that we also build our systems and our protections of our systems, and this is why my comment in the last question and through my speech is, there’s no jurisdiction in Canada that has any regulations, any law, regarding the safe, transparent, ethical use of AI in government. This is what this bill is doing.", "You talk about global leader—Ontario has been a global leader when it comes to AI. This is why we are committing to work with the Vector Institute, as I had noted in my speech, committing up to $27 million because we know the Vector Institute has the best people going there—Ontarians going through the Vector Institute with research etc. We are working with them. That’s how Ontario is going to succeed in the digital age." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (MmeLucille Collard)", "text": [ "The next question.", "1700" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Tom Rakocevic", "text": [ "I want to congratulate the member for her compelling and obviously well-researched speech. Today, we’re debating regulatory framework, but the bill seems to be lacking a lot of regulations. We’ve heard multiple government members stand and speak about transparency and whatnot, but in a sense, there’s not much to go on here. There’s a lot of secrecy, because we don’t know what exactly they plan on doing.", "Furthermore, they’re leaving out the entire private sector. As you can imagine, we all have to pay our phone bills through a private company. A lot of our data is being handled by the private sector, and since they’re delegating these authorities down to municipalities without any funding, they’re all going to have to go to private companies to manage their own security.", "So the question is, why won’t you define the regulations and why no word on the private sector?" ] }, { "speaker": "MmeDawn Gallagher Murphy", "text": [ "Thank you to the member opposite for that question. I’d like to reiterate what this bill is about, and it’s improving, on one hand, cyber incident reporting—because right now, I’ll reiterate, there are no regulations when it comes to cyber security and how we report this. We need the mechanisms in place to be able to track this, and this is what this bill is going to do within the public service domain.", "Now, specifically, when we look at our ever-evolving digital landscape, we need to ensure that we can react and that we can anticipate things. You can do that when you have evidence base and you’re tracking. This way, with the broader public service, we will be working collectively with them. What’s important is that if this legislation is passed, it will give the Minister of Public and Business Service Delivery the authority to create comprehensive rules on cyber security and establish these new requirements for the Ontario public service and the broader public sector. That’s what we need to start this off and get it going, and we will be the first jurisdiction in Canada to do it." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (MmeLucille Collard)", "text": [ "Next question?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Will Bouma", "text": [ "I thoroughly enjoyed the member’s speech. I’m very interested. My colleague from Peterborough–Kawartha mentioned this morning, because he spent a lifetime in IT, that in the regulations in AI, government needs to be able to move at the speed of the next virus threat. If we leave everything in the legislation—and that’s to the member from Humber River–Black Creek’s point—it seems to be that it would take weeks, if not months or even years to make any changes to the legislation in the face of a serious electronic threat.", "I was wondering if the member had anything to add on that, that we as government need to leave so much of this legislation in regulation so that a minister can act quickly to counter threats against our hospital electronic infrastructure, our university electronic infrastructure, our municipal electronic infrastructure, so that we can get these threats dealt with quickly, make changes necessary in regulation so that we can do what’s right for the people of Ontario. I’m just wondering if the member would agree with that." ] }, { "speaker": "MmeDawn Gallagher Murphy", "text": [ "That was a great question from the member for Brantford–Brant. Thank you very much for that. It’s interesting, as I was doing my research for my private member’s motion and then also reviewing Bill 194—again, there’s no central party or ministry actually coming up with reporting mechanisms. So what’s critical, if we’re going to do something and we’re going to do it well, we have to be able to centralize our reporting.", "Currently, as I said, there’s no formal communication process to Emergency Management Ontario for any significant cyber incidents. I’m sorry, that blows my mind that we don’t have that. That’s where we need to be starting, and this is what Bill 194 is doing because a cyber attack is like a critical attack, just like anything else; I’d have to say like COVID-19. We need the Emergency Management Ontario to be able to track this—" ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (MmeLucille Collard)", "text": [ "Thank you. That’s time for the questions and answers.", "Report continues in volume B.", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "", "" ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Bhutila Karpoche)", "text": [ "Further debate?" ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Aislinn Clancy", "text": [ "I do thank the government; I am supportive of this bill. We do need to draw attention to harm that is caused by drunk driving.", "I’m going to focus on prevention. I’m a big believer in Vision Zero. As a member of city council in the past—and I want to thank the city council. The city of Kitchener has paid a lot of attention and dedicated a lot into having protected use for vulnerable road users.", "What Vision Zero is: The traditional approach is what we’re talking about today—that traffic deaths are inevitable; imperfect human behaviour; prevent collisions; individual responsibility; saving lives is expensive.", "The Vision Zero model says that traffic deaths are preventable; integrate human failing into the approach and predict that; prevent fatal and severe crashes; look at the whole system; and that saving lives is not expensive.", "What I’ve learned over the years is that by designing the roads appropriately with vulnerable users in mind, we can prevent serious injury and death.", "My daughter bikes to school. She is a vulnerable user. Sometimes, because she’s a teenager and she has opinions about her hairdo, I see her leave without a helmet, and I chase after her, but she’s gone. So this is very personal to me, that when we’re talking about harm on our streets, we’re thinking of everybody and we are thinking about prevention.", "My worry about this legislation is that it talks in a reactive way—“after the first,” “after the second,” “after the third”—whereas I do believe that protected bike lanes, protected sidewalks and street design, looking at a Vision Zero approach, will prevent the loss of life, that this is possible and that we don’t have to worry about our loved ones going out walking, biking and scooting and worry that they won’t come home.", "I do drive an e-bike, so I do urge all of you that when you’re talking about e-bikes, when you’re talking about scooters, and when you’re talking about cyclists and our kids, you talk to folks who are in it. I live this every day. I take my bike to work in my riding all over, because I do have an urban riding, and I’m grateful for those separated lanes. If you’ve ever had to get spat out into a major road—one time I was going across the Wellington bridge and this gentleman pulled over and he said, “You’re going to kill—you shouldn’t be here. You should get off the road.” Sometimes our rhetoric impacts us directly. I was impacted that way; scared out of my wits, worried that he was going to kill me because he believed I was wasn’t meant to be there.", "We know that vulnerable users were fatally involved in 37% of accidents in Ontario in 2020. We know the cancer society also wants us to get out of our cars if we can. Raise your hand if you were a parent and you had to drop your kid off at school. If you were a city councillor, how many of you had your inbox full of parents who were complaining about the area around schools? I know we’re talking about drunk driving today, but we really need to talk and look at traffic from a holistic point of view. The cancer society is spending so much money trying to get kids to walk to school and bike to school. Why? It’s affordable. It prevents cancer. It’s a health care investment. We need to spend more money on looking at how can lead healthier lives, and that’s what the cancer society recommends.", "As a school social worker, I was the person, after cannabis was legal, providing those education sessions to grade 8 students. We need to do more of this. This access to alcohol, which is a carcinogen—a class 4 carcinogen as identified by the United Nations—we haven’t met the increased access with the commensurate increase in education. Yes, there’s a bit in the curriculum, but it doesn’t go far enough, and we haven’t done enough to talk to all generations about alcohol use.", "As a social worker, I’m really worried about the increased use of alcohol. Just the other day I was at a gas station, and guess what was beside me while I was pumping gas? Somebody had left their beer right beside the pump. I can’t make this stuff up. Yes, I know when people are addicted—when you think of your phones that you’re all looking at right now, they’re addictive. They’re pinging at you. There are more visual reminders all the time. If you have an addiction, spend tonight trying not to look at your cell phone and imagine what it’s like to try and pump your car with gas as an alcoholic not trying to buy that can of beer that might be sitting beside you at the pumps.", "I urge you to please talk to the people who use our streets and please think of investing in prevention." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Bhutila Karpoche)", "text": [ "Questions?" ] }, { "speaker": "MPP Jamie West", "text": [ "Thank you to the member for Kitchener Centre. One of the things that confused me in this bill, and you talked a little bit about this in your debate, where you covered a lot of topics, is that when I was growing up, there were no bike lanes at all. Part of my path to school was on a four-lane road, and we rode our bikes along the four-lane road, along with transports and fire trucks and dump trucks. Now we have an infrastructure where they’re bringing in more and more bike lanes where you’re separated from those, where it’s safer for you, especially for young children.", "I don’t understand—do you believe the Conservative government believes that if you remove bike lanes, bikes will no longer be on the roads? If they’re concerned about safety on the road, I feel like the safer way of having our children, especially—I know adults ride their bikes; I have a bike as well. I feel like more people would be safe if there was a designated path for them to be on the road and to not pretend that if you remove the bike lane, bicycles would not be on that road in the first place. What are your thoughts?" ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Aislinn Clancy", "text": [ "I think if you talk to any caregiver right now, they are stressed out. I think the American Surgeon General just said we have an epidemic of mentally unhealthy parents. We have an epidemic of poor mental health among caregivers. Why? They have to drive their kids everywhere. They spend all their day, night and day, taking them to school, picking them up, dropping them off at baseball and hockey and this and that. They’re taxi driver number one. It’s not good for the planet, it’s not good for the pocketbooks and it’s not good for parent mental health. What would help caregivers send their kids off into the world on a bike, on a sidewalk, on a scooter—that’s how my kids get to school—is having some safety in mind. I think a lot of caregivers don’t feel safe sending their kids to school walking and biking. I know as a parent I feel much better knowing that my child can take a protected bike lane to school.", "1650" ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Bhutila Karpoche)", "text": [ "Next question?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Ric Bresee", "text": [ "I appreciate the presentation today. There’s been a lot of conversation about the idea of prevention. I bring to this House’s attention the piece in this legislation about zero tolerance: that, post-conviction, the requirement would be that there would be zero alcohol, zero drug involvement in those drivers. When we’ve already got someone who has demonstrated that they’ve made a bad decision, don’t you think that imposing zero tolerance on that individual is a method of preventing future failure?" ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Aislinn Clancy", "text": [ "I think you named it: You’ve already done the crime, so it’s not prevention, right? We want to prevent people from getting harmed in the first place. If you kill someone drunk-driving, that’s done. That harm has happened to that individual, right?", "So we should be looking at the data on how to reduce alcohol dependence. We should be looking at harm reduction and education in our school system. And we should be looking at how to design our streets to prevent that from happening in the first place.", "When I ride around in our trail system, for example, when I have to cross a major road, some of those roads have flashing lights. They have a pad that goes up. There are different indicators for a driver that say, “We have a vulnerable user crossing the road.” That means that they stop and they see what’s happening. So we need to look at design and we need to look at mental health and addictions in a way that prevents that from a young age. We’re not there." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Bhutila Karpoche)", "text": [ "Next quick question." ] }, { "speaker": "Mrs. Lisa Gretzky", "text": [ "I’m shocked, but not surprised, when you tell a story of someone leaving their can of beer right on the gas pump. I’m wondering if you can tell me what in this legislation or what evidence you have seen, with the government expanding alcohol into stores—and I want to be clear: There are variety stores where you can literally drink alcohol in the store before getting back in your vehicle.", "What evidence is there that their expansion of alcohol sales to corner stores is actually going to prevent people from driving intoxicated? What measures do you think the government actually could have taken to address the issue? I also want to point out that people who have an addiction to alcohol will drive without a licence even if you suspend them, because they have an addiction. So what measures do you see in this bill that would stop that from happening?" ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Aislinn Clancy", "text": [ "That’s missing, and I think that’s our protest against the increase in access to alcohol. Alcohol is a drug, just like opioids are a drug, fentanyl is a drug and marijuana—cannabis—is a drug. Last time access was expanded in the province, emergency visits attributable to alcohol grew more than 24,000 in two years.", "So we know that alcohol is a drug. It’s a problem to quit. If anyone has had an addiction, they should know that. So it was not a good health care choice or road safety choice to expand its access, and it’s not good for intimate partner violence." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Bhutila Karpoche)", "text": [ "Further debate?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Matthew Rae", "text": [ "Don’t worry; I’ll be a little quieter this afternoon, not like I was in question period this morning.", "It’s wonderful to rise this afternoon after a very productive break across the summer. I know we call it a break; I don’t know about my colleagues on the opposition side, but I was working day and night for my good constituents in Perth–Wellington. I had many meetings and many community events to attend to across Perth–Wellington, and I look forward to being back at Queen’s Park to continue to advocate on their behalf.", "I’m very honoured to speak this afternoon on this important piece of legislation improving safety in our communities, in downtown Toronto, but also especially to rural Ontario, which I have the pleasure of representing.", "As has been said in many instances this afternoon and throughout this debate, Ontario has some of the safest roads in North America. In fact, for decades, our province has ranked among the top jurisdictions with the lowest fertility rates—not “fertility”; fatality rates on the roads. First day back at school, everyone.", "We certainly are proud of that track record, but it’s not to say that our work is done. There is always more that we can do, and that’s exactly why our government has tabled this legislation that would introduce the toughest penalties in Canada for impaired driving, and we are not going to stop there.", "We’ve all seen the epidemic that is the car thieves and auto theft in Ontario and its impact on our communities, and it needs to end. I want to be clear: It needs to end. The Safer Roads and Communities Act would crack down on these criminals. It includes measures, if passed, that would strengthen commercial vehicle safety and enforcement, would provide e-bike safety and, most importantly, show that our government is taking decisive action to make Ontario roads safer. We’re taking that action that the previous governments have failed to do, that the federal government has failed to do as well, and that our opposition has been silent on for too long.", "On average, one in three roadway fatalities involves impaired driving by alcohol or drugs. In 2022, more than 20,000 Ontarians had their licences suspended for impaired driving. This year, 10,000 impaired driving charges have been laid by the OPP. Currently, compared to 2022—and the year is not over as well—this is an increase of 16%. That’s one driver every 26 minutes. It’s completely unacceptable.", "In 2022, the Ministry of Transportation conducted a roadside survey of Ontario drivers. That survey found that one in five drivers tested positive for drugs, alcohol or both. The same survey found that, since 2014, the number of drivers who are testing positive for drugs has increased by 55%. If that isn’t enough to see the immediate need for change, the Office of the Chief Coroner determined the percentage of drivers who were killed and tested positive for cannabis more than doubled between 2012 and 2020. That’s why we are saying enough is enough as a government. Our government is determined to get tough on impaired drivers and to get them off the roads, and we will if the Safer Roads and Communities Act is passed.", "This act would introduce a lifetime suspension for drivers for anyone convicted of impaired driving causing death under the Criminal Code. If you are convicted of killing someone while impaired behind the wheel, you will forfeit your privilege to drive for life. We are ready to do everything we can to make sure those dangerous drivers cannot get back on our roadways. There’s absolutely no excuse for alcohol- or drug-impaired driving under any circumstance. Our message to Ontarians is simple: Our government will not tolerate putting other people’s lives at risk, and a lifetime suspension for impaired driving causing death makes that clear.", "These measures would make anyone in this province think twice before driving while they are impaired, and that’s not the only measure in this bill aimed at cracking down on impaired driving. Our government plans to introduce supporting legislation that would require anyone convicted of impaired driving to install an ignition interlock drive device when a licence comes back.", "Currently, those convicted of impaired driving can voluntarily install an ignition interlock device to reduce their licence suspension. Alternatively, they can sit out the ignition interlock requirement by refraining from driving for their full licence suspension and ignition interlock term. Combined with the measures in this bill, our government plans to introduce further regulations that would eliminate the sit-out period, requiring anyone convicted of impaired driving to install an ignition interlock for a prescribed period of time.", "If you get behind the wheel impaired and put someone else’s life at risk, you should have no choice but to install an ignition interlock. It’s a vital tool to make sure impaired drivers are closely monitored and rehabilitated before being permitted the privilege to drive on their own.", "We know that making the interlock devices mandatory doesn’t go far enough, so we’re taking further steps to send a clear message. The Safer Roads and Communities Act would introduce a time-limited, zero-tolerance condition for alcohol and drugs for anyone convicted of impaired driving. If this bill passes, the zero-tolerance period would begin after a driver satisfies the ignition interlock and the Centre for Addiction and Mental Health’s Back on Track requirements, which is a very extensive program that they administer.", "Impaired driving is never okay. Even if our opposition chooses to stay silent, we’re going to make sure that people who choose to drive impaired and put other individuals’ lives at risk are held accountable. Our government will never take any chances when it comes to ensuring our roads are safe, and that’s why these drivers will have to work hard to get their licences back.", "1700", "To drive that point home, the Safer Roads and Communities Act would introduce longer roadside licence suspensions for first-time and second-time drug- and alcohol-related offences. These suspensions would apply to young and novice drivers who violate the zero-tolerance condition, as well as drivers who perform poorly on a field sobriety test or have a blood alcohol concentration of 0.05 or higher.", "Currently, drivers receive a three-day roadside suspension for their first occurrence and a seven-day suspension for their second occurrence, and this just isn’t long enough. We need to teach people who drive under the influence that their recklessness is endangering Ontario lives, which will not be tolerated. If the Safer Roads and Communities Act is passed, drivers would receive a seven-day roadside licence suspension for their first drug- and alcohol-related occurrence, and if they were found to be under the influence a second time, that would result in a 14-day suspension.", "In addition to these measures, the Safer Roads and Communities Act would align the look-back periods for all drug- and alcohol-related offences or occurrences. A look-back period determines the escalation of sanctions for repeat offenders. Currently, administrative monetary penalties and licence suspensions have a five-year look-back period. Ignition interlock and remedial education requirements have a 10-year look-back period. If this act passes, all look-back periods would be harmonized to the 10-year window.", "Our government has a long memory when it comes to drivers who put others at risk. We want to align all look-back periods to 10 years to take a stand against impaired driving and those who choose to do it repeatedly.", "Policing is an essential component to keeping our roads safe. Safe roads are not possible without making sure that police have every possible tool they need to combat impaired driving, so that is exactly what we are doing. The Safer Roads and Communities Act includes several measures that will support our front-line police officers.", "The Safer Roads and Communities Act, if passed, would amend the Highway Traffic Act to clarify that police can stop drivers for sobriety tests whenever they are driving, whether that’s on or off a highway. If you’re driving impaired, pulling off the highway to evade the police isn’t going to work. Our government is making it crystal clear: If you get behind the wheel impaired, there will be nowhere for you to hide.", "In recent years, we’ve also seen auto theft become a growing problem across the province. Actually, calling auto theft a problem doesn’t seem to convey the gravity of the situation—it’s an epidemic. In Ontario, a vehicle is stolen every 14 minutes. From 2021 to 2024, auto theft increased by 72% across the province. In Toronto, auto theft increased by 81% over that same period, and violent carjacking rose by 78% from 2021 to 2022.", "Brazen thieves are using weapons to carjack hard-working Ontarians, compromising the safety of our communities and roads. Nobody should have to give over their car with someone putting a gun to their head—a chilling reality that could happen to anyone in any community across Ontario.", "This government is standing up and saying, “We have had enough.” If the Safer Roads and Communities Act passes, anyone convicted of auto theft would face a driver suspension for 10 years, a 15-year suspension for their second offence and a lifetime suspension for their third.", "The fact of the matter is that motor vehicle theft has become a plague in this province, and our government is looking to step in in every possible way so that this does not become the standard for Ontario’s bright future. The Solicitor General has done a great job. Our new Associate Minister of Auto Theft and Bail Reform is doing a great job. And I know the Minister of Transportation as well is working with both those ministries to ensure we are combatting this problem", "Of course, car thieves aren’t the only cowardly criminals putting innocent Ontarians in danger on our roadways. Stunt drivers are constantly putting innocent lives at risk with their blatant disregard for the safety of others on the road. Those who threaten safety have no place on our roads, and we want to make sure that they face the consequences for their reckless actions.", "In 2021, we passed the MOMS Act—I didn’t pass it; our government passed it—and we increased the licence suspension and vehicle impoundment periods for anyone engaging in stunt driving, street racing or aggressive driving. The Safer Roads and Communities Act is taking this one step further. If the Safer Roads and Communities Act passes, it would amend the Highway Traffic Act to ensure that anyone convicted of stunt driving faces a mandatory minimum life suspension. Currently, the courts have the discretion to suspend a driver’s licence following a stunt driving conviction, which means minimum suspension lengths aren’t applied in all cases. We want to change that and apply a minimum licence suspension.", "By willingly engaging in these dangerous driving practices, these drivers must have a minimum suspension, full stop. The proposed legislation would ensure that anyone convicted of stunt driving receives a mandatory minimum licence suspension. That means one year for a first conviction, three years for a second, and a lifetime suspension, reducible to 10 years under certain circumstances, for a third. Any subsequent convictions would be met with a lifetime suspension that cannot be reduced.", "Stunt driving is not a harmless act; it can lead to dangerous and even fatal consequences. Anyone who disregards the safety of others should face a stiff penalty, and if you’re convicted of stunt driving, you don’t get the privilege of getting behind the wheel again with a light slap on the wrist. If the Safer Roads and Communities Act passes, stunt drivers will learn that lesson the hard way, and the legislation shows that we are taking concrete action to protect families and people on our roads. If you put others at risk, you will pay the price.", "We have also urged the federal government to toughen their penalties against auto thieves for far too long, as the province has done. We have used every tool at our disposal to ensure that car thieves are held accountable, whether it be taking away their licence or improving and increasing funding to our law enforcement officers across this province. It’s time for the federal government to take these criminals, keep them in jail and not let them out to terrorize our streets. It’s about time they step up and put these criminals behind bars.", "The Safer Roads and Communities Act also includes measures to improve e-bike safety. If passed, this bill would create regulation-making authority under the Highway Traffic Act that would allow e-bikes to be categorized into distinct classes. Each class would have its own prescribed vehicle safety requirements, such as speed and weight limits, as well as operator requirements such as the minimum age for drivers and passengers. This proposal is a key step toward addressing safety concerns raised by stakeholders and community members, and the risks associated with heavier throttle-assisted e-bikes.", "Today, these e-bikes often exceed the permitted weight or power-assisted speeds. I know many of us see that in downtown Toronto and many of our larger urban centres as well with the growing popularity of these bikes, which are important for mobility—as one of my colleagues mentioned earlier, he uses an e-bike—and ensuring that we have some parameters around those now 21st-century modes of transportation.", "Our government has been at the forefront of e-bike safety, continuing to embrace innovation to improve outcomes for road users. The Cargo E-Bikes Pilot Program, for example, allows municipalities to choose where and how cargo e-bikes can be used. If the Safer Roads and Communities Act passes, we’ll take another step toward improving e-bike safety.", "It doesn’t end there: We’re also taking bold action to strengthen MTO transportation enforcement officers’ ability to carry out the ministry’s commercial vehicle program. We need all hands on deck to keep our roads safe. If the Safer Roads and Communities Act passes, enforcement officers would be permitted to exceed posted speed limits for enforcement purposes. Traffic would be required to move over for MTO enforcement vehicles when their lights and signals are flashing, and MTO transport enforcement officers would have the authority to seize fraudulent or suspended driver’s licences.", "These legislative measures would build upon our tremendous success at improving commercial vehicle enforcement. Last year, the Ministry of Transportation increased enforcement activities in our northern Ontario highway corridors, and, additionally, we’ve mandated the use of electronic logging devices for all commercial vehicles.", "The results speak for themselves: MTO officers have laid more 3,600 charges and took more than 1,200 unsafe vehicles off the road. The government opened a new vehicle inspection station near Thunder Bay recently; this is a $30-million, state-of-the-art investment and ensures commercial vehicles are in good working order and takes those that aren’t off the road, helping make Ontario northern highways that much safer.", "1710", "We’re also making upgrades and building new rest areas across our highway network so drivers can take a break when they need to. At the end of the day, everybody deserves to get home safely, and our government is doing everything in our power to make sure that is a reality. By enhancing MTO’s transportation enforcement officers’ ability to carry out commercial vehicle enforcement, our roads will be that much safer.", "Despite Ontario’s track record of 20-plus years as one of the safest jurisdictions in North America, we will never sideline our efforts to make our roads even safer. That is the least we can do, and we owe it to the hard-working people who call this province home. Even if the previous government sat idly by when change was waiting to happen, we’ll pick up the pieces one by one because that is what Ontarians deserve.", "Our province proudly welcomes hundreds of thousands of newcomers each year, and they come here for a better life, to contribute to our growing economy and to raise families. By 2031, the greater Golden Horseshoe will have a population of almost 15 million people just living within that area. As our roadways become busier and busier with the growth, we need to make sure that everyone on Ontario’s roadways are protected.", "By introducing the Safer Roads and Communities Act, our government is drawing a line in the sand when it comes to drivers who put others’ lives at risk by getting behind the wheel impaired. We’re getting tough on violent criminals terrorizing our roadways to steal cars for profit, we’re cracking down on stunt drivers who threaten the safety of our roadways and we’re taking bold strides to improve e-bike safety and commercial vehicle enforcement across the province.", "Our government is not one to back down from a challenge, and we’re not one to stop working towards even more goals to ensure more safety across Ontario roads. When the government tabled the Moving Ontarians More Safely Act in 2021, the government ushered in a new era of road safety that improved the lives of families across the province, but our work is far from over and the Safer Roads and Communities Act shows that we are constantly looking for new ways to protect people, families and communities. The passage of this bill would help have a positive impact on this province that would reverberate for generations to come. Road safety is not a political issue, as our government has made it clear, and we’ll work with all members of this House to ensure that our communities remain safe.", "Our government is proud to have tabled this legislation. It builds upon many of our initiatives over the past few years, especially when it comes to our investments in our front-line police offices that go above and beyond every single day for our communities. I think of the over $160 million in combatting auto theft alone, $134 million to buy helicopters to help our biggest urban centres combat auto theft in the most recent provincial budget, ensuring we are there for our police officers to ensure that those criminals are doing the time. I’m a big believer that if you do the crime, you should do the time. I know I look forward to all members of this House supporting this important piece of legislation." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Bhutila Karpoche)", "text": [ "Questions? The member from Niagara Falls." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Wayne Gates", "text": [ "I appreciate that. I thought I was second.", "I listened to my colleague really carefully. You said that the government is going to have the toughest fines ever, but it says here, “Many impaired drivers can avoid criminal conviction thanks to a Ford government policy that allows drivers to plead guilty to a lesser non-criminal charge. While this policy was in place during the pandemic in an effort to move the backlog around, today more serious criminal cases are being tossed out due to this unconstitutional delay, including sexual assault.” Are you in favour of—even though you’re impaired, you’re caught—pleading down for a lesser sentence? Because that’s not what you said in your speech." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Matthew Rae", "text": [ "Thank you for the question. I know our government stands with the people of Ontario to ensuring we have safe communities and safe roadways. That’s why we’re bringing in, as I mentioned, the most penalties in North America, if passed, for impaired driving, especially if impaired driving leads to death—a lifetime suspension for that. As I mentioned, if you’re doing the crime, it is a crime, you should do the time. I know our government will be using every tool we have available provincially to do that. We don’t amend the Criminal Code; that is a federal jurisdiction. But we will suspend drivers’ licences for those who are convicted of impaired driving that results in death, and I hope the members opposite will support that." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Bhutila Karpoche)", "text": [ "Next question?" ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Trevor Jones", "text": [ "Good afternoon, everybody. Thank you to the member for Perth–Wellington for articulating something that reassures me that driving in Ontario is a privilege and not a right.", "I live in a jurisdiction, and the member from Essex lives in a jurisdiction, where we have lots of traffic that crosses the border every day into Michigan, into New York state; the member for Niagara Falls will know this is the case as well. So if someone is convicted, found guilty, punished and sentenced and they receive a lifetime driving ban, what’s to prevent that convicted person from going to New York state or Michigan and just apply for and get a driver’s licence in that jurisdiction?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Matthew Rae", "text": [ "Thank you to the great member from Chatham-Kent–Leamington for that question—a very important question. I know I have the Stratford Festival in my riding. I have the distinct honour of representing that important cultural institution and tourism institution. Many Michigan plates and New York plates and Pennsylvania plates were in Stratford, which was great to see this summer. I do know that a driver with a suspended licence in Ontario is generally prohibited from obtaining a licence in another Canadian province and in some US states. I know, with Michigan and New York, Ontario has a reciprocal agreement that if you share a conviction or a suspension in those jurisdictions, you would not be able to then cross the border either way to get a licence.", "I know we’ll continue to work with our great colleagues in the US to ensure that we’re keeping all of our roadways safe in North America." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Bhutila Karpoche)", "text": [ "Next question?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Joel Harden", "text": [ "I’m just wondering if the member can help me understand something. I think he knows that on this side of the House we would support measures to take further action against impaired driving. I think he knows that on this side of the House we care about road safety all over Ontario, not just downtown but way up north, as my friend from Mushkegowuk–James Bay was saying with respect to the dangers on their highways.", "Can the member enlighten us: How is it that one can have an indefinite suspension for killing somebody while driving under the influence, but you can still drive the week after if you kill someone and you’re distracted? Why do we have that double standard?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Matthew Rae", "text": [ "Thank you to the member for the question. I agree that we’re all passionate about road safety across Ontario. I don’t represent a Toronto riding or a GTA riding; I represent a rural riding. Obviously, it’s very important we have road safety in those areas of the world, especially this time of the year, with harvest going on and lots of farm equipment on the highways, ensuring that—" ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Bhutila Karpoche)", "text": [ "I apologize for interrupting the member.", "Pursuant to standing order 50(c), I am now required to interrupt the proceedings and announce that there have been six and a half hours of debate on the motion for second reading of this bill. This bill will therefore be deemed adjourned unless the government House leader directs the debate to continue.", "Government House leader?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Steve Clark", "text": [ "Speaker, please adjourn the debate.", "Second reading debate deemed adjourned." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Bhutila Karpoche)", "text": [ "Orders of the day?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Steve Clark", "text": [ "No further business, Speaker." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Bhutila Karpoche)", "text": [ "With no further business, this House stands adjourned until tomorrow morning at 9 a.m.", "The House adjourned at 1718.", "", "", "", "", "" ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Ms. Natalia Kusendova-Bashta", "text": [ "Good morning. I move that, in the opinion of this House, the government of Ontario should assess the Ontario lung cancer screening program to determine whether expansion is warranted and more sites are necessary to better serve Ontario patients and to look at broadening the eligibility criteria for access to the lung screening program." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Ms. Kusendova-Bashta has moved private member’s notice of motion number 77.", "I’ll recognize the member to lead off the debate." ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Natalia Kusendova-Bashta", "text": [ "Good morning. It is an honour and privilege to rise in this chamber to speak to my private member’s motion. Motion 77 calls on the Ontario government to expand the Ontario Lung Screening Program by including a site in Peel region to serve its 1.5 million residents in Mississauga, Brampton and Caledon, and if more sites are necessary to better serve Ontario patients, and to look at broadening the eligibility criteria for access to the lung screening program.", "This is a cause close to my heart because, as a nurse who still works at Etobicoke General Hospital, I see the devastating impact that lung cancer has on individuals and their families. A diagnosis is devastating. I know that our government is committed to increasing access to health care, but there’s always more work to be done.", "Lung cancer impacts your ability to breath. As much as we can manage symptoms, there’s nothing worse that a patient can be going through than when their ability to breath is restricted. Speaker, 11,000 people across Ontario are diagnosed with lung cancer each and every year, with the average age being 44 years old to 50 years old. I wonder how many members fit in that range. That’s a pretty scary number, 44 years old to 50 years old. That’s the average age of diagnosis. And it is the most common cancer diagnosis in the country. It claims the lives of close to 7,000 Ontarian residents each year.", "Most lung cancers are caused by tobacco smoking, with the more years you smoke, the greater the risk. This also includes exposure to second-hand smoke. The most recent data from 2020 shows that the smoking prevalence in Ontario is 9.9%, which is lower than the national average of 11.6%. That has been on a decline over the last several years, which is a good trend that we would like to see and support.", "But let’s not forget that lung cancer is not always linked to smoking. Close to 15% of lung cancer patients never smoked, and 35% stopped smoking long before their diagnosis. Other causes include family history, previous radiation therapy, exposure to carcinogens such as asbestos or exposure to radon gas. This fact about radon gas is not one that is widely known by the Ontario public.", "Speaker, Ontarians should know about radon gas and its dangers. It is an invisible and odourless radioactive gas that is naturally released by the breakdown of uranium in soil, rocks and water. It can get into homes and buildings through cracks and holes, and eventually build up to unsafe levels. There are many things Ontarians can do to protect themselves and their loved ones from radon gas. The first is to buy a testing kit at their local hardware store, and if levels are detected, they can seal cracks in their home’s foundation, use a heat recovery ventilator or allow for natural ventilation.", "Speaker, I would also like to touch on the growing problem of vaping among our young people. As you know, my colleague the member for Kitchener South–Hespeler has done incredible work advocating for keeping vapes, tobacco and cannabis out of schools. In a way, both of our motions intersect on this vital issue. While vaping hasn’t been around long enough for scientists to conclusively know if vaping causes lung cancer, we do know that vapes contain dangerous chemicals that no child should ingest. These include, of course, nicotine, a highly addictive substance that negatively affects developing brains, and harmful carcinogens like formaldehyde. Another chemical found is diacetyl, which is linked to a lung disease known as “popcorn lung,” which is damage to the lung’s small airways. Speaker, while we don’t know if vaping causes lung cancer, there is a chance that it might, and keeping these devices out of kid’s hands could prevent a potential health crisis that we may not even see coming.", "I also want to bring attention to asbestos, a carcinogen with a strong link to lung cancer and diseases such as mesothelioma and chronic pulmonary disease. It is a fibrous mineral that is known for its durability and heat resistance, and exposure is most commonly experienced by those who work in the manufacturing sector. Before 1990, it was commonly used to insulate apartment buildings and homes from cold weather and was used for fireproofing. Inhaling its tiny fibres is painless but can cause severe problems in the future. It takes decades after exposure, ranging from 10 to 40 years, to develop cancer, depending greatly on how long your exposure was.", "In 2018, Canada banned the manufacturing, import, sale and use of asbestos; however, it is still our country’s leading cause of workplace death. Across Canada, nearly 2,000 cases of lung cancer are linked to asbestos exposure. Speaker, it is a myth that asbestos is a settled issue. There are still people in our communities who have been exposed prior to the ban, and it can be found in older buildings.", "Avoir un cancer du poumon peut être une expérience très douloureuse et inconfortable. Il peut entraîner de nombreuses complications, telles qu’un essoufflement, des crachats de sang, des douleurs dans la région de la poitrine et la présence de liquide dans la poitrine, appelée épanchement pleural.", "There are many things that Ontarians can do to reduce their risk of lung cancer, which includes, of course, avoiding tobacco, avoiding second-hand smoke, testing your home for radon gas and wearing a mask to avoid breathing in carcinogens in the workplace and keeping a healthy diet and active lifestyle.", "This past November was Lung Cancer Awareness Month, and we had receptions from a number of incredible groups that advocate for this cause, such as the Canadian Cancer Survivor Network, the lung cancer foundation and Lung Cancer Canada, all united under one campaign entitled Right2Survive. I had the chance to meet cancer survivors whose stories of hardship and resilience inspired me to take action. And today, we also have a guest from the Canadian Cancer Society, Hillary, who has been a staunch advocate for putting this motion forward. These organizations work hard to advocate for both prevention and for Canadians living with lung cancer, and for that, I strongly commend their efforts and support.", "Speaker, lung cancer is the leading cause of cancer death for people in Ontario. It kills more people than colon, breast and prostate cancers combined, because lung cancer is usually detected late, when symptoms can already be noticed. In Ontario, 70% of lung cancers are diagnosed at advanced stages, and as a result, survival rates are reduced. In fact, in Canada, five-year survival rates depend greatly on what stage the cancer was diagnosed. Those diagnosed at stage 1 have a five-year survival rate of 60%, but those diagnosed at stage 4 have only a 5% rate of survival. This is why early screening and increasing eligibility criteria are essential. And let’s not forget that lung cancer can spread to other body parts, including the brain and bones.", "0910", "Speaker, let’s look at the facts. When you have earlier cancer detection, you have better treatment outcomes. This can only be done by expanding the eligibility criteria and the number of sites across Ontario.", "Selon les critères d’admissibilité actuels de notre gouvernement, seules les personnes âgées de 55 à 74 ans qui sont des fumeurs quotidiens peuvent faire l’objet d’un dépistage. Or, il y a en Ontario des personnes qui n’ont jamais fumé de leur vie et qui finissent par contracter ce cancer du poumon, ce qui consiste d’une minorité.", "Furthermore, while the Ontario Lung Screening Program currently operates in Oshawa, Sudbury, Ottawa and Toronto, there is no location in Peel region, a high-growth region home to 1.5 million residents. That is why I am calling on our Ministry of Health to assess this program and to determine if expansion is warranted and if eligibility should be broadened. Through screenings, we can change the lives of individuals and families across Ontario.", "Speaker, we have done significant strides to broaden screening access for women at risk of breast cancer. We recently lowered the eligibility criteria for self-referral into the Ontario Breast Screening Program to 40 years old. I think we should also assess the lung cancer screening program eligibility because right now it is limited to persons aged 55 to 74, and if the average age of diagnosis is from 40 to 55, that means we really need to look at broadening this eligibility criteria.", "Recently, a fellow member shared with me that his sister-in-law passed away from breast cancer at age 40. She was diagnosed with stage 3 cancer and passed away within weeks. That is devastating news. It made me think about all of us here in this House. It is a huge privilege to come in here and serve, but this job also comes with a huge level of stress, and stress can contribute to all chronic diseases, including that it can cause cancer.", "So I want to just take this time to encourage all of my fellow members, as we head into the summer break—and we call it a break, but we all know we’ll be working very hard, attending many events, barbecues, meeting with our constituents—please take the time to take care of yourself. Please go get your annual health checkup. Go get your blood work done. Go get your screenings done. Because you can’t take care of your constituents and your family and all the people that rely on you if you don’t take care of yourself. So please, I implore every single one of you to do that over the summer break.", "I just want to conclude with a quote from the Canadian Cancer Survivor Network: “Evidence shows that lung cancer caught at an earlier stage has better treatment outcomes. With lung cancer continuing to have the highest mortality rate among all types of cancer, it is more important than ever to ensure that everyone who may be at risk of developing lung cancer has access to the screening programs that could be the difference between life and death.”" ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Patrice Barnes)", "text": [ "I recognize the member from Nickel Belt." ] }, { "speaker": "MmeFrance Gélinas", "text": [ "I really enjoyed the speech from my colleague this morning.", "The motion in itself is very timid. It basically asks that the government assess the lung cancer screening program that she described, determine whether expansion is warranted, if more sites are necessary and if the criteria need to be changed. I would say yes to all of this. Don’t ask the government to assess. You are part of the government. You have the power to do those things right here, right now.", "The Ontario lung cancer screening program, I can tell you, has been a godsend. We have one in Sudbury. There are only five sites in Ontario that have such a program: Ottawa, Sudbury, Oshawa, Hamilton and Toronto. Are there people at risk of lung cancer throughout Ontario? Yes, absolutely. I look at northwestern Ontario, where the rate of smoking is way higher, in the 20s, when the average Ontario rate is about 12%. In my riding, we’re at 28% smokers. That continues in northern Ontario. These programs should be available to us in northern Ontario—and to everybody else. There are smokers throughout the province.", "This program saves lives. We know that lung cancer is the leading cause of cancer death in Ontario. The reason so many people die of lung cancer is that by the time you are diagnosed, the cancer has grown too large, has spread to other parts of the body. There are very few indications that you have lung cancer until it has reached stage 3 or stage 4, at which point there are very few treatments available, and your five-year survival rate is about 5%—not very good.", "But all of this changes if your cancer is detected early and there are treatments available. The five-year survival rate is over 60%. Things change for the better. But the way we have it now in only five hospitals, with very rigid criteria: you must be between the ages of 55 and 74; you must be a smoker or a former smoker; you have to have smoked daily for 20 years. And the person, the screening investigator—that’s how we call the person who does the screening. They’re quite rigid as to who gets to do that screening and who doesn’t. It should be changed for all of the reasons that the MPP has listed. It has to be done. If we agree to this, let’s not just assess; let’s actually go.", "The program is more than just screening. Sure, they establish if you are eligible for the screening, but they also do a lot of very important teaching as to why they should be participating. They provide a lot of very good smoking cessation support for people who are addicted to nicotine and have a hard time stopping smoking, and if you have any nodules on your lungs, they will do the follow-up. They do a lot of navigation with the participants to help them, to make sure that they do not develop lung cancer and, if they do, that they know the treatment options and act upon them as quickly as possible.", "Basically, what the detection is, is a low-dose CT scan. That’s it; that’s all. It takes minutes and you’re done. You will be informed of the results of your scan. There will be people explaining to you what has been seen—if you have stage 1 cancer, or 2 or 3, sometimes 4, depending on what they find—and they will support you.", "This is a program that has been piloted in the five sites for years now. It has saved lives. It has diagnosed a lot of people. I can speak for the people of the northeast who have been diagnosed with early stages of lung cancer through this program. It needs to be expanded.", "As I said, I agree with everything that is in the motion—just get it done. Don’t assess if it needs to be done. Get working on it. Get it done.", "The member talked about the changes that have been done for self-referral screening for breast cancer, something we support 100%. I would say the same thing needs to be done for colorectal cancer. Right now, the age is at 50, yet not a day goes by that we don’t have dozens of people diagnosed with colorectal cancer at age 30, at age 40. Bishop Brigante, if you don’t know, who’s a very well-known artist in Ontario, somebody we can all be proud of, is in his thirties. He’s fighting advanced colorectal cancer. He had to work and fight really hard, and thank God his wife is a nurse and pushed for him to have a colonoscopy. This is how they diagnosed his colorectal cancer. It shouldn’t have to be that difficult. It should be available.", "0920", "I would add to this: The stats that we keep have to be raced-based data. There are diseases that manifest themselves in populations—in Black, Indigenous, people of colour—differently from white. We have to start to collect race-based data so that the decisions that we make are not made for the entire population of Ontario but are made specifically as to what makes Ontario strong, and this is our diversity. But when our health care system does not collect race-based data—very few of them do this. There are some community health centres who do a good job. There’s one hospital that has started to do it and does a good job, but there are other provinces where it’s done automatically.", "I had the misfortune of breaking my arm in British Columbia, had to go to the hospital. They collected race-based data right away, and they do it in a way that is not threatening at all. Why don’t we do that in Ontario when it is done in other provinces and could really change the way that we provide access to care in this province?", "Having lung cancer usually will mean a hospital stay. This week, we debated my bill for nurse-to-patient ratios. I can tell you that if you are undergoing cancer treatment, stage 4, you are sick enough to be admitted into the hospital, and there are only three nurses for 36 patients, it makes no sense.", "The NDP government in British Columbia brought a patient-to-nurse ratio so that, first, it’s better for the patients; there’s better care. It decreases mortality. It makes sure that the length of stay of the patient is shorter, the readmission rate is shorter. It’s a big win for the patient. It’s a big win for the nurses. So many of them are facing burnout right now. To have a caseload that a human being can handle makes all the difference for many of them who are not working in health care right now, who would come back to the bedside if we promised them nursing ratios, and it’s—", "Interjections." ] }, { "speaker": "MmeFrance Gélinas", "text": [ "Yes—and it’s a cost-saving for the hospital as well.", "All of this Ontario is ready to work upon. We will support the motion. It’s going in the right direction. It is something that needs to be looked at. But the member is a member of the government who could go from looking at it to actually getting it done. The sooner that we do that, the better.", "I also want to comment on the vaping. We are spending $30 million to put vape detectors in our schools when we have a bill on the docket right now called Vaping is not for Kids. Let’s look at what other jurisdictions are doing so that we prevent our kids from vaping. One of the major reasons kids vape is because it tastes really good. There is no reason to have bubble-gum-flavoured vapes. No smoker who wants to quit smoking wants a bubble gum vape; they want something that tastes like tobacco. They only reason the vape industry is doing this is because they want kids to start vaping. Some of the vapes: You do it once, you’re hooked. There’s such a high concentration of nicotine that the kids will be addicted instantly.", "And then, because we put the buying age at 18—there’s always an 18-year-old in a high school that will go and buy a list of vapes for all of his friends at the high school. Put it at age 21. Put it at age 25, like other provinces have done. There are no 25-year-olds in high schools. Nobody will be able to go and buy the vapes, and you won’t need to spend $30 million on vape detectors in bathrooms because kids won’t be vaping. But no. When was the last time we saw any health promotion, disease prevention initiative coming from the government? Zip, nothing.", "The member did talk about the determinants of cancer, stress being one of them. But really, if you stop smoking, drink in moderation, eat healthy food, have a healthy weight and exercise regularly, 60% of all cancers go away. Should I repeat that? If you stop smoking, drink in moderation, eat healthy food, have a healthy weight and exercise regularly, 60% of all cancers disappear.", "Have you heard anything from this government to help 60% of all cancers disappear? No, absolutely not. There is so much more that this government could do, but so far, we haven’t seen any.", "Her comments on asbestos—agree 100%.", "She also had comments on use percentage. I forgot if it’s 16% or 15% of all lung cancer comes from gases. I live in the middle of the Canadian Shield. Many, many houses in Nickel Belt, including my own, are on a big rock where you have rocks in your basement, and argon gas easily gets into your house. Those detectors should be made available to all and should be free. People should be encouraged to do those things, not having to go to Home Hardware and look at 16 different detectors, not knowing if any of them are accurate or not, if you’ll ever get the result or anything like this.", "I see the time is running, Speaker. This is a step in the right direction. This is what needs to be done. We have a program.", "Le Programme ontarien de dépistage du cancer du poumon est un programme qui a fait ses preuves—un programme qui existe dans cinq hôpitaux seulement en Ontario, mais qui doit être disponible ailleurs. Moi qui viens du Nord, je vous dirai que pour ceux à Timmins, à Sault Ste. Marie, à Thunder Bay, ils ont besoin d’avoir accès à ce programme-là—et bien des communautés du Sud, comme la députée a mentionné. C’est un programme qui a fait ses preuves, qui sauve des vies et qui devrait être—je vous dirai de passer aux actes le plus tôt possible." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Patrice Barnes)", "text": [ "I recognize the member from Don Valley East." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Adil Shamji", "text": [ "Good morning, Madam Speaker. Thank you very much for giving me the opportunity to speak in the House on this topic of paramount importance and which has had profound consequences for so many people here in Ontario and across our country. Of course, I am speaking to the private member’s motion calling for an assessment to expand the Ontario lung cancer screening program.", "This is an easy one to support. I’m proud to support it. In fact, the Ontario lung cancer screening program began in 2017 under the Ontario Liberal government, so of course I would want to see this not just continue but succeed.", "However, I’m going to begin by echoing the comments from the member from Nickel Belt that this motion could go so much further. For example, why is it calling for an assessment of the expansion of the Ontario lung cancer screening program as opposed to demanding an expansion of that? Why is it even a private member’s motion, which is strictly symbolic, instead of a private member’s bill, which we could all vote on and compel the government to expand the Ontario lung cancer screening program? Why is it that the government member won’t walk across to the Minister of Health and just ask her to expand the Ontario lung cancer screening program?", "These are all things that could allow us to devote our time in the chamber to things that require a debate. There’s no question in anyone’s mind in this chamber that all of us agree to the expansion of the Ontario lung cancer screening program. After all, lung cancer is the leading cause of death from cancer in Canada.", "And so, I don’t think a lot needs to be said about the merits of expanding the program. Every person in this chamber agrees to it, and I certainly do. The medical community would like to see this happen as well.", "Instead, I would like to focus on the things that need to happen in order for us to be able to successfully and effectively fight cancer—lung cancer and all other kinds of malignancies here in this province. I also want to address a little bit some of the challenges that we may face in expanding the Ontario lung cancer screening program, because I am hoping that all of us will vote in favour of this.", "0930", "The first challenge with the Ontario lung cancer screening program, if it were to be expanded, is that the majority of people in the province don’t know about it. Physicians may know about it. Nurse practitioners may know about it. But the majority of patients and people who are actually at risk don’t know that the program exists. But under this government, we have successive cuts to public health and health promotion activities which could allow people to know that.", "Under this government, we have seen the worst health care system performance in our province’s history. We have more people in our province’s history than ever been who don’t have access to primary care: 2.3 million people don’t have it right now; 4.4 million won’t have it by 2026. If you don’t know about the program and can’t self-refer, and you’re one of a growing number of millions of people in our province that don’t have access to a nurse practitioner or a family doctor, how are you supposed to get referred to the Ontario lung cancer screening program?", "But let’s say, against all odds, you’re able to surmount all of those challenges. The next thing is you’ve got to be able to find somewhere to get screened. I agree: We do not have enough screening sites. I believe we have five right now. Regrettably, the direction that this government has chosen to go with Bill 60 is to create integrated community diagnostic and surgical service centres. The idea is to be able to increase access to diagnostic and surgical services, but one of the challenges with it that has been brought forward time and time again is that many of the providers for that will be private, for-profit entities that will seek to create these centres in urban centres where the economies of scale and large enough numbers of patients can be generated.", "Consequently, people in rural and northern areas will have greater difficulty in being able to access these services. These diagnostic and surgical service centres will draw diagnostic and technological resources away from suburban and rural hospitals and therefore make it more difficult for people to access lung cancer screening in their communities, instead forcing them to make the difficult choice between taking days off from work and travelling—mind you, without adequate funding to the Northern Health Travel Grant, which this government also voted against—and moving to one of these lung cancer referral centres, or not going altogether. So this is something that needs to be addressed if we actually want to expand the Ontario lung cancer screening program and make it a success, and I’m wholeheartedly committed to making it a success along with the member who introduced this motion.", "But again, I want to emphasize: If this government was serious about fighting cancer, if this government was serious about detecting malignancies before they become a problem, when they are in a treatable phase, when they haven’t even become cancer yet, then they would have also taken a number of other steps. I understand the Canadian Cancer Society is here, so I know that they’ll agree with me that we need to bring PSA testing under public funding. This government has repeatedly voted against that. How can this government say they are serious about fighting cancer, about screening for cancer, when they repeatedly, time and time again, in the face of the Canadian Cancer Society, which is sitting right here—how can they vote down funding testing for PSA?", "This is a government that, again, has chosen not to fund take-home cancer drugs.", "This is a government that has not committed to delivering a family doctor for every single person in this province.", "And the final thing: I salute the member who introduced this motion for enumerating many of the risk factors for lung cancer and for cancer generally. I agree we don’t talk enough and people don’t know enough about things like asbestos and radon. We could do more work to help people quit smoking and raise awareness around issues such as vaping and children.", "However, one risk factor that she did not mention, a leading risk factor for cancer in our province and in our country, is alcohol. So you can imagine how perplexed I am that this government—with, admittedly, a limited budget in health care and, just provincially, a government that has a record debt and deficit unprecedented in our province’s history—rather than investing a billion dollars in health care, in cancer screening, in fighting malignancies, instead chose to commit to invest that $1 billion in a risk factor for cancer by trying to bring beer to convenience stores a mere one year early. This government is twisted in knots and cannot get its priorities straight.", "So I’m going to keep my remarks brief. I think I have made it clear that I entirely and wholeheartedly support expansion of the lung cancer screening program. However, I think and hope that I’ve also illustrated the folly in the way this motion has been presented. I hope that people will take away from this that this should have been a bill, or even better, it should have been a conversation with the Minister of Health. It should have been not a request for an assessment to expand the lung cancer screening program; it should have been a demand to expand the lung cancer screening program. It should have called for including funding for PSA testing. It should have called for take-home cancer screening.", "I don’t know which minister brought it in, but it should have called for the government to instead invest their billion dollars not on bringing beer to convenience stores one year early, but to invest it in health care, in getting a family doctor for everyone, in supporting this program. It doesn’t.", "It’s a flawed motion that we’ll support nonetheless because I and the people in the House will stands with patients in Ontario. We do want to fight cancer, and we’re committed to showing this government the right way to do it." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Patrice Barnes)", "text": [ "I recognize the member from Mississauga–Lakeshore." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Rudy Cuzzetto", "text": [ "Good morning, Madam Speaker. It’s an honour to join the debate this morning on the last day of the Legislature before the summer break, and especially to speak in support of private member’s motion 77, moved by my friend from Mississauga Centre, on a lung cancer screening program.", "I want to thank her for her advocacy on this issue, which is a very personal issue for me as well. My father worked as a welder at the Texaco refinery in Port Credit. Every day, he was exposed to asbestos in the gaskets and the welding blankets, and he passed away from asbestosis and lung cancer over 40 years ago, on December 12, 1985. Obviously, we did not have screening available at the time, but today, proper screening can catch hundreds or even thousands of cases of lung cancer at early stages every year, giving people across Ontario a better chance to recover and more years together with their loved ones.", "This is the same reason that I introduced Bill 66 to promote stethoscope checks to detect heart valve disease early, when it can be treated efficiently. I want to thank all members for their support for my bill, as well, as we move towards third reading.", "But returning to today’s motion: As the member from Mississauga Centre said, lung cancer is one of the most common cancers in Ontario, with over 11,000 cases diagnosed each year. It is also the leading cause of cancer death in Ontario, with over 7,000 deaths every year.", "In a majority of cases, lung cancer is only diagnosed at stage 4, after the cancer has already spread outside the lungs. Unfortunately, at that point, the chances of recovery are very low. On the other hand, according to Stats Canada, the five-year survival rate for patients diagnosed early at stage 1 is over 60%. Lung cancer screening with a low-dose CT scan is the best way to detect lung cancer early, when it can be treated most effectively.", "Ontario is the leading supplier of medical isotopes that help detect and fight cancer right across the world. As the parliamentary assistant to the Minister of Energy, I was proud to join the member and our former colleague Bill Walker in Bowmanville two weeks ago for the launch of the Central and Eastern Ontario Isotope Alliance, which will help to expand medical isotope production from our nuclear sector, with a huge win for cancer patients here in Ontario and around the world.", "Screening for lung cancer has been available since 2017 in Ontario for patients at high-risk, including patients from 55 to 74 years who have smoked for 20 years. This is in line with the guidelines of the American Cancer Society. But last November, the society released an update to recommend scanning for smokers from 50 to 80 years old. I agree with my friend that the Ministry of Health should look at these new guidelines to determine if Ontario’s lung cancer screening program should be expanded as well for younger and older patients, and beyond the four current locations in Oshawa, Ottawa, Sudbury and the University Health Network here in Toronto.", "Speaker, it is also critical that young patients and non-smokers who do not qualify continue to have the clear pathway for lung cancer screening when they develop symptoms that are associated with lung cancer.", "0940", "Speaker, I also want to take a moment to thank the Minister of Labour and former minister Monte McNaughton for their work on Bill 149 and Bill 190, our latest Working for Workers bills.", "Firefighters are often exposed to toxic chemicals—like my father—and they are at least four times more likely to be diagnosed with cancer. This bill will help to ensure they have fast and easy access to the compensation they deserve for work-related diseases.", "And as I said here last month, the Minister of Labour is working to include asbestos in the Occupational Exposure Registry, beginning next year, which will also help identify workers who are most at risk for lung cancer and asbestosis.", "It is great to share our time today with the member from Milton. I just want to take the opportunity to congratulate him again on his win last month. I know he’s going to be an effective MPP and a great representative for the people of Milton.", "I also want to thank my OLIP intern for the spring term, Milena Basciano, for all her great work in my office, and I want to wish her the very best in everything she does next.", "And last, as the House rises for the summer, I want to wish all members and staff a happy, safe and healthy summer." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Patrice Barnes)", "text": [ "Further debate?" ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Mike Schreiner", "text": [ "It’s an honour to rise today to speak to motion 77, to look at the possibility of expanding the lung cancer screening program. It’s a motion I’ll be voting for, and I appreciate the member from Mississauga Centre for bringing it forward.", "Speaker, I believe the lung association has already brought forward compelling arguments of why we need to expand the number of screening sites in Ontario—we only have five, far less than other provinces with smaller populations—and why we need to expand the scope beyond smokers. We know smoking is a cause of lung cancer, but increasingly people are being diagnosed with lung cancer who have never smoked. That is where we’re seeing the rising number of lung cancer cases. So expanding the scope of the screening is critically important as well.", "My hope is that this motion passes today, but I’m hoping the member takes this motion directly to the Minister of Health and says, “We have to put this motion into action.” While the member is having that conversation with the minister, I’m hoping the member will say, “Why not expand screening for all cancers?”", "Just as I was walking in here, I got a phone call from my doctor with the results of my latest PSA test. It would be great if all men could get a PSA test covered under OHIP. I’m lucky I have insurance coverage on it, but a lot of people don’t. But it should be all cancers, because we know that the earlier we detect—and I know the member knows this, as a nurse—the more likely we are to cure. As the member opposite just stated, 11,000 cases of lung cancer, 7,000 deaths—and most of the time, they’re detected at stage four. The earlier we can detect, the more likely we know people can survive.", "So what is it going to take for early detection? Well, I’m one of those lucky people. I have a family doctor. I’m not one of those 2.3 million Ontarians who don’t have access to a family doctor. My access to screening and the information that I need around screening for all types of cancer comes from my family doctor.", "I just had my annual physical a couple of weeks ago, and my doctor said, “You might be at risk for colon, you might be at risk for prostate, you might”—he just listed it off and said, “Here is where you go. I am going to give you the requisition form for the blood work and other screening that you need.” Not everyone has that. So, if we’re going to look at early screening of lung cancer and all forms of cancer, then we need to make sure everyone has access to a family doctor, who is a gateway to that screening.", "Then of course, when it comes to lung cancer, we have so few sites around the province that even if your doctor says, “Hey, you’re eligible for screening. We’ll sign the requisition forms for you to do that,” it becomes very challenging for people to access screening because they don’t live near a place where they can access screening. So, I wanted to put that on the record.", "I want to close—and I’m not going to use all of my time—on a few important notes that came out of my last meeting with the lung association, because one thing that hasn’t been talked about enough, I believe, is how do we prevent lung cancer in the first place and what are some of the growing threats to lung cancer that could possibly help explain why we’re seeing such growth in lung cancer from people who don’t smoke. Some of those have been mentioned today, and I appreciate the member opposite talking about it.", "One is radon testing, ensuring that we have radon testing for homes, easily accessible and available, for people and in workplaces.", "Second is looking at air pollution. When I met with the lung association, they had three key recommendations around reducing air pollution. One was better testing, especially of traffic-related air pollution, which historically affects more vulnerable and low-income neighbourhoods. We know from some testing that the University of Toronto did in the city of Toronto that neighbourhoods that are located closer to Highway 427, the Gardiner Expressway, the Don Valley Parkway and larger boulevards like Steeles Avenue, for example, have higher levels of air pollution, which contribute to lung cancer.", "The other one is people who live in close proximity to gas plants. So the Portlands gas plant, for example, in the Beaches in Toronto, is the largest single source of air pollution in the city of Toronto. And you’re seeing that in other places. In Halton, for example, people who live around the Halton gas plant—for those of you like myself, I travel between Guelph and Toronto all the time, and I drive right by it on the 401—one, minimizing the use of those gas plants in the first place to minimize the toxic air pollution, but two, making sure we have air screening in place to make sure the pollution levels are not at elevated levels, affecting human health and potentially affecting people with lung cancer.", "The second area they talked about with me was the importance of indoor air quality and ensuring that we have proper filtration and filters like HEPA filters in buildings, in homes and especially in schools, where children are incredibly vulnerable, as a way to help mitigate lung cancers.", "Then the next one was, interestingly enough, school buses. Most of our school buses are diesel engines. We know the particulate matter from diesel engines negatively affects people’s lungs. The sooner we can electrify school buses to reduce that particulate matter, the more protections we provide for children. Because we know that the airborne pollution from diesel engines is particularly dangerous for young people and their lungs.", "The final one in this category is forest fires. Last year, a million acres burned in Ontario. During four days in the first week of June, that cost our health care system $1.28 billion, primarily due to admissions to emergency departments for people with respiratory problems, oftentimes asthma related. But that toxic air affects people’s lungs. We don’t know yet what the implications are for lung cancer, but the lung association is deeply concerned about the long-term effects of persistent exposure to forest fires. Obviously, our wildland firefighters are the most at risk; they’re the ones on the front lines, and we need to make sure they have the proper PPE and masks and things to protect them, but just average folk walking around our communities are affected, as well.", "0950", "Making sure that we do everything we can to reduce fire risk and we have firefighting in place—and I think we’re going to have to start looking for folks who have had persistent exposure to toxic air from firefighting being part of the screening process, because they are going to be at risk.", "And then finally, on the prevention side, I want to just talk a little bit—I know the member from Nickel Belt talked about vaping. I think we’re going to need stronger rules to ramp up smoking prevention. Even though we’ve done a good job, we still aren’t there yet. But where we’re really having a challenge now is with vaping and with young people. We know the lung association is deeply concerned about the cancer implications of rising rates of vaping, especially among young people—so to make sure we have the rules and regulations in place to prevent that, to reduce vaping and to prevent the long-term implications of that.", "I want to close by saying that the lung association said to me, one in five people suffer from lung disease; five in five people breathe. The best way to prevent lung disease, lung cancer is to make sure the air we breathe is clean and healthy. That is something I’m hoping that, if all of us are going to vote for this motion, we can draw inspiration and work across party lines to do everything we can to ensure the air we breathe is clean and healthy." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Patrice Barnes)", "text": [ "Further debate?" ] }, { "speaker": "MPP Zee Hamid", "text": [ "I’m pleased to rise in support of this motion. This issue is near and dear to my heart. I lost my grandmother, both my aunts on my father’s side and my aunt on my mother’s side to cancer. To this day, I believe that if they had access to early screening, their lives could have been prolonged or perhaps saved.", "As part of looking into this motion, I was shocked to learn that lung cancer kills more people in Ontario than brain cancer, bladder cancer, leukemia, prostate cancer, breast cancer and stomach cancer combined. In fact, the probability of dying from cancer is highest in the case of lung cancer for both males and females.", "The reason for this high probability of dying from lung cancer has to do with the fact that lung cancer survival rates vary significantly depending on the stage of diagnosis. If someone is diagnosed at stage 1, their chance of survival is 60%, and it drops to below 5% if they’re diagnosed at stage 4, when many people unfortunately are diagnosed. This underscores the importance of diagnosing lung cancer as early as possible.", "One statistic that jumped out was that 70% of lung cancers in Canada are diagnosed at an advanced stage, unfortunately. That makes a difference between life and death. That means that someone’s parent or their brother or their sister or their friend might have survived and gone on to live many years of productive life, many productive years.", "Lung Cancer Canada agrees that comprehensive lung cancer screening programs are essential to improving early detection rates and saving lives. While lung cancer continues to have the highest mortality rate among all types of cancer, it is more important than ever to ensure that everyone who may be at risk of developing lung cancer has access to early screening programs.", "Speaker, I’m proud to be part of the government that takes health care seriously and is investing $85 billion in health care, nearly $25 billion more than the previous government. This is the government that ended hallway health care that plagued the province under the previous government. In the past five years, we’ve added over 3,500 hospital beds. We’re building 50 new hospital projects through our $50-billion investment to add 3,000 more. Since 2018, 80,000 new nurses and 10,400 new doctors have registered to work in Ontario. We were the first province in Canada to introduce as-of-right rules to allow health care workers to move to Ontario from other provinces to start working immediately.", "Our government provides an organized screening program, the Ontario Lung Screening Program, that helps screen people at high risk of getting lung cancer. This program is open to people between the ages of 55 and 74 years old who have smoked cigarettes every day for 20 years and not necessarily 20 years in a row. As the House is aware, currently this program operates at four main sites: Oshawa, Toronto, Sudbury and Ottawa.", "Looking into broadening the eligibility criteria for access to the lung screening program might catch cancer at earlier stages for a lot of people who today don’t have access to the screening programs. Adding another site in or around the Peel region may also provide access to people who currently don’t have access to one of the four sites.", "This private member’s motion will hep us determine whether an expansion to the screening program is warranted and whether we should broaden the eligibility criteria for access to the lung screening program.", "While my riding is not in the Peel region, it is adjacent to Peel, and residents of my riding and other residents of Halton travel routinely to Peel for their health care needs.", "In fact, my father is in Trillium hospital right now in the Peel region, as I speak, for his angiography. My uncle was recently admitted to Credit Valley Hospital, also in the Peel region, for his cardiovascular disease.", "Should Peel be selected as one of the sites for the expansion of the lung screening program, it would not only help the 1.5 million residents of Peel region but also over 600,000 people in the Halton region.", "As the House is aware, both Peel and Halton are among the fastest-growing regions in Ontario. Under the provincial growth plan, the Halton region is projected to grow to 1.1 million people by 2051, and the Peel region is projected to grow to 2.28 million people.", "While it is common for people in my riding and the rest of Halton region to travel to Peel for complex health care needs, the same cannot be said about travelling to Ottawa, Sudbury, Oshawa or Toronto, where lung cancer screening centres are currently. I fear that many might forgo screening that might have caught the cancer for them at an earlier stage and could have saved their lives.", "Speaker, I thank the member from Mississauga Centre for her motion as well as her advocacy on this very important issue. I support this motion and urge my colleagues to do the same because better access to lung cancer screening can help find lung cancer early, which is when the treatment has the best chance of working. I’m looking forward to seeing my colleagues support this motion." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Patrice Barnes)", "text": [ "Further debate?", "Ms. Kusendova-Bashta has moved private members’ notice of motion number 77. Is it the pleasure of the House that the motion carry? Carried.", "Motion agreed to." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Patrice Barnes)", "text": [ "Orders of the day." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Mr. Trevor Jones", "text": [ "On a point of order: Pursuant to standing order 7(e), I wish to inform the House that tonight’s evening meeting has been cancelled." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Patrice Barnes)", "text": [ "Orders of the day." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Trevor Jones", "text": [ "Madam Speaker, no further business at this time." ] }, { "speaker": "The Acting Speaker (Ms. Patrice Barnes)", "text": [ "There being no further business, this House stands recessed until 10:15.", "The House recessed from 0958 to 1015." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Mr. Andrew Dowie", "text": [ "It’s truly a privilege to rise in celebration of the Registered Nurses’ Association of Ontario Windsor-Essex chapter’s Lois Fairley Nursing Award. It holds a special significance in Windsor and Essex county, honouring nurses who embody the values of compassion, professionalism and dedication to patient care.", "And so, I celebrate this year’s recipient of the 2024 RNAO Lois Fairley Nursing Award, Anna Dudok. Her remarkable legacy of service to our community is truly deserving of this award. Anna’s dedication and impact as a nurse at Huron Lodge in Windsor since 1991 has not only earned her this prestigious honour, but it has also left an indelible mark on the lives of countless patients and their families.", "Her unwavering commitment to resident-centred care, her vast knowledge honed over years of service and her compassionate approach to every interaction exemplifies the epitome of nursing excellence. Anna’s willingness to go above and beyond, from advocating for her residents’ needs to providing comfort and support during challenging times, embodies the true spirit of nursing.", "Anna’s influence extends far beyond her immediate surroundings. Her dedication to mentoring and guiding new hires ensures that her legacy of compassionate care will continue to thrive at Huron Lodge for years to come.", "To Anna, thank you for your tireless dedication and for exemplifying the very best of nursing. The lives that you impacted and all those that you care about has been immeasurable and your legacy will continue to inspire us all." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Ms. Bhutila Karpoche", "text": [ "I hold an annual member’s statement writing competition for high school students in my riding. Students are welcome to submit a statement on any issue they feel passionate about. It’s designed to empower young people and foster youth participation in politics by bringing their voice directly to Queen’s Park and speaking to issues in their own words.", "The winner for 2024, as selected by an independent committee, is Shivani Saravanan from Humberside Collegiate. Here is Shivani’s statement:", "“Food prices are rapidly increasing in Toronto, and many residents are unable to afford healthy nutritious foods and have become dependent on food banks.", "“In the past year, three additional food banks have opened in Toronto to meet the city’s rapidly growing demand, which has increased by approximately one million visits.", "“Food banks are playing an essential role by assisting those who are unable to afford essentials due to price inflation.", "“While food banks provide the necessities, they do not solve the fact that many residents will not be able to afford food if prices continue to rise. They are only a temporary solution that disguises the true issue causing this situation.", "“Many families struggle to make ends meet as housing prices and interest rates have inflated at a higher rate than salaries.", "“With rising food prices, residents are having to sacrifice nutritious groceries for processed foods, as they are more affordable.", "“At the forefront of this crisis comes human health.”", "Thank you, Shivani. Congratulations." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Mr. Matthew Rae", "text": [ "It is a pleasure to rise today to share with this House some important investments our government has made in my riding of Perth–Wellington.", "Last week, I was joined by the Minister of Education to announce a brand new Catholic elementary school in Drayton, Ontario. This represents $17.3 million in investment by our government in our rural education system and will create 222 new student spaces and 64 new child care spaces.", "This is a huge investment for Drayton and area because, for too long, local families did not have any affordable child care options locally. But our government is delivering for rural Ontario after years of inaction from the previous Liberal government.", "Speaker, the good news doesn’t stop there. I also had the pleasure of announcing that our government is funding a major expansion of St. Mary’s Catholic School in Listowel. This investment of $5.8 million will help build an additional 150 student spaces and 98 child care spaces. These two projects are part of our larger $1.3-billion plan that more than doubles the funding to build new schools and expands child care spaces across Ontario.", "1020", "Since 2018, our provincial government has invested over $34 million in communities across Perth–Wellington to build 250 new child care spaces and 470 new student spaces. While the previous Liberal government closed 600 rural schools, our government will continue to invest in rural Ontario." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Ms. Catherine Fife", "text": [ "When it comes to accessing housing financing, some Muslim Canadians are facing significant barriers because traditional financing restricts some from entering the housing market. Under Islamic law, paying and receiving interest is prohibited.", "Halal financing offers an alternative to interest-based mortgages. There is an overwhelming demand for these products, with over 12,000 families on a wait-list. Financially, this amounts to $6 billion of financing, growing by $100 million per month.", "It is worth noting that Canada is the only G7 country that does not accommodate halal mortgages. We have fallen behind, forgoing billions of dollars in the process. However, the 2024 federal budget indicated that the government would be exploring halal mortgages.", "Speaker, it is important that Ontario is prepared to respond to this change. The Muslim population is being excluded from the housing market simply because they cannot access services that align with their religious beliefs. This is a missed financial opportunity for Ontario and another barrier to housing. Halal financing opens up mortgage options for thousands of Ontarians and millions of Canadians. By extent, it also offers a solution to the housing crisis, and everyone benefits from this.", "The question remains: When will Ontario provide access to home ownership for the underserviced Islamic community? We are prepared to work with the community to ensure that housing is a possibility for every Ontarian." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Mr. John Jordan", "text": [ "Before the House rises for the summer, I’d like to acknowledge all my fellow MPPs for your continued dedication to your constituents and connecting with them over the summer months.", "I’d also like to invite you to my riding of Lanark–Frontenac–Kingston. Experience one of our festivals, like the world-renowned Stewart Park Festival in Perth, or the Blue Skies Music Festival in Clarendon. Both received funding through the Experience Ontario grant. My thanks to Minister Lumsden and the Ministry of Tourism, Culture and Sport.", "We have beautiful museums, including the Heritage House Museum in Smiths Falls, which I had the pleasure of attending on Saturday. It received funding from this government to set up an exhibit to celebrate the 60th anniversary of the pressing of Beatles records in the RCA building in Smiths Falls, where my constituency office is located today. Smiths Falls was the birthplace of Beatles records in North America, with the RCA building employing hundreds of people, 75% of which were women. Some of you may remember the Ed Sullivan Show back in 1964—well, some of you may remember.", "These investments from the province will encourage Ontarians to explore all that our communities have to offer, staying in local accommodations, eating in restaurants and supporting small businesses. Tourism makes significant contributions to Ontario’s economy, supporting approximately 360,000 jobs and generating over $33 billion of economic activity.", "Mr. Speaker, I wish everyone a safe, happy and healthy summer. If you’re thinking about a day trip or a multiday adventure, I encourage you to visit Lanark–Frontenac–Kingston." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Ms. Jennifer K. French", "text": [ "June is Pride Month. Today, we are joined at Queen’s Park by Paul and Cherie Weaver, who live in Oshawa, and whose proud daughter Erin wrote to tell me tell they have a beautiful flagpole in their beautiful garden where they proudly fly both the Canadian flag and the Pride flag.", "Erin wrote that they have had strangers reach out to them about how important it has been for them to see the Pride flag flying in their neighbourhood. One instance in particular was that a teenaged boy knocked on their door and shared that seeing their Pride flag flying as he walked by each day made him feel safe and seen, and that it was just so important to him.", "Last year, Paul and Cherie’s Pride flag was stolen: ripped and cut from the flagpole and taken. Paul replaced the flag. Unfortunately, on the long weekend, the entire flagpole was stolen, flags and all.", "Speaker, across communities, there are ugly and hate-motivated harms happening to our friends, families and neighbours in the 2SLGBTQIA+ community. But there are more moments of magic and acts of kindness, and I am glad to share the rest of the story today.", "A man who lives not too far from Paul and Cherie saw a flagpole lying hidden near his fence, and the flagpole was returned with the flags. Paul has been able to get it back up and flying proudly.", "As their daughter shared with me, “My parents will never let the misguided energy of others prevent them from contributing to the creation of safe spaces and communities.”", "Oshawa is a community made up of great neighbours, but there is still work to be done to ensure that everyone feels welcome. Thank you, Paul and Cherie, for joining us here today at Queen’s Park and for choosing to be wonderful neighbours—flying the Pride flag is a message to your neighbourhood that everyone belongs. And to everyone in Oshawa, happy Pride." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Ms. Natalie Pierre", "text": [ "Last weekend, I had the pleasure of attending a community event at Desi Mandi, a South Asian supermarket located in my riding, to celebrate their third anniversary of doing business in Burlington.", "I met with the owners, Raj and Sara, a lovely couple who opened their store during the pandemic. With the support of the community, they’ve grown their grocery store into a thriving business that sells thousands of different Asian offerings. Whether you’re looking for fresh fruits, vegetables, dairy products, as well as favourites like rice, flour, spices, pickles or frozen food, Desi Mandi has what you need. They also have a butcher shop, along with a hot food table offering delicious South Asian meals. And if you don’t find what you’re looking for, Raj and Sara will bring it in to serve you better.", "Desi Mandi also supports local initiatives in the Burlington community, donating food to organizations across our community, including charities such as the Compassion Society, Food for Life, and religious organizations that provide hot meals for people who are going without. Proceeds raised at their event were donated to the local Joseph Brant Hospital.", "Congratulations once again to Raj and Sara on the third anniversary of Desi Mandi, and I look forward to visiting again soon." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Ms. Mary-Margaret McMahon", "text": [ "Today, I am so proud to speak about a dynamic resident of beautiful Beaches–East York named marvellous Mary Ann Neary. It is very fitting to speak about this wonderful woman on Bike to Work Day because of her strong advocacy to keep people safe in this city and beyond. Mary Ann believed streets were for everyone—for pedestrians, for transit riders, for cars and for cyclists.", "I first met Mary Ann at one of our monthly Ward 32 Spokes cycling meetings in the famous Feathers pub on Kingston Road. We are a motley crew, with half-baked ideas and endless energy, and I’m actually not sure why this meticulously organized and detailed individual did not turn on her heels the moment she spied us. But from then on, she was our true leader, whipping us into shape with strategic plans, community outreach and educational events. We never looked back.", "Whether it was door-knocking, speaking at city hall or organizing bike tune-ups at East Lynn Park, Mary Ann was there, helping people understand the benefits of cycling, especially the health advantages. After all, she was a legend in the health care sector, wowing everyone at the University Health Network with her tremendous skills in speech pathology and, later, as senior clinical director of surgical services.", "Mary Ann loved helping people and never stopping giving back to society. Mary Ann passed away unexpectedly, but peacefully, in her sleep on May 12, 2024—a big loss for Ontario. Rest in peace, lovely Mary Ann." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Mrs. Daisy Wai", "text": [ "Today, I rise to commemorate the 80th anniversary of D-Day, a pivotal moment in our history that took place on June 6, today, but in 1944. On this day, brave soldiers from Canada and their Allies stormed the beaches of Normandy, marking the beginning of the end of World War II.", "We remember the immense courage and sacrifice of those who participated in Operation Overlord. Among them were thousands of Canadians who played a critical role in securing the freedoms we enjoy today.", "1030", "In Richmond Hill, we honour members of the local Legion: Bill Renwick, who served with the 1st Canadian Parachute Battalion, and Angus MacDonald of the Royal Canadian Ordnance Corps, who both landed on June 6, 1944. We also remember Bill Aird of the 48th Royal Marine Commandos, who was attached to the 3rd Canadian Division at Juno Beach.", "I also remember my father-in-law, Mr. K.C. Wai, for his contribution in the Second World War.", "Mr. Speaker, on this solemn anniversary, let us commit to never forgetting the valour of the D-Day soldiers. Let us ensure that their stories are told, their sacrifices are remembered, and their legacy is preserved for future generations." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Mr. Steve Pinsonneault", "text": [ "Ladies and gentlemen, as we eagerly approach the vibrant summer season, I am thrilled to highlight the array of exciting events taking place in our beloved riding. From cultural festivals to community gatherings, there is something for everyone to enjoy.", "Picture the roar of the engines at the Pain Court tractor pull, the savoury aroma of barbecue at Strathroy Ribfest, and the vintage cars at the Bothwell car show and the Wallaceburg WAMBO. There are plenty of Ontario-style events for every community across Lambton–Kent–Middlesex. From the Lucan Summerfest and the Thamesville Threshing Festival to the historic significance of Emancipation Day in Dresden, as well as the bustling night market, these events are not just about entertainment; they’re a celebration of our communities and traditions. Furthermore, these events serve as a testament to the resilience and vitality of our community.", "By supporting local initiatives, we bolster our economy and foster a sense of pride in our shared identity. Let’s not just attend; let’s actively participate, volunteer and support these events.", "As your representative, I am committed to promoting and enhancing the quality of life in our riding. Together, let’s make this summer one to remember, filled with joy, laughter and a deep appreciation for all that our community has to offer.", "Thank you for your continued support. I look forward to seeing you at these upcoming events." ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Bhutila Karpoche", "text": [ "I’d like to give a very warm welcome to Shivani Saravanan. She is the winner of my 2024 member’s statement writing competition. She’s joined by her dad, Saravanan Rathinavel. Welcome.", "I would also like to welcome my staff Spencer Higdon-McGreal. He’s joined by his mom, Allysone McGreal; his dad, Patrick Higdon; and friend Clare Doyle.", "Speaker, I want to take this opportunity to recognize and thank Spencer. We’ve been a team from the time I decided to seek the NDP nomination for Parkdale–High Park. He has been such a big and important part of my work as an MPP for the last six years. He’s moving to France soon.", "Spencer, thank you from the bottom of my heart. I’m going to miss you. Au revoir, my friend." ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Jill Dunlop", "text": [ "I would like to welcome my executive assistant from the constituency office, Jacqueline Bayley, who has brought her sister Suzanne Board to Queen’s Park today. Welcome to Queen’s Park, ladies." ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Jennifer K. French", "text": [ "I am very pleased to welcome Paul and Cherie Weaver, neighbours in Oshawa who have a wonderful flagpole. Welcome to Queen’s Park, and happy Pride." ] }, { "speaker": "MmeLucille Collard", "text": [ "Mr. Speaker, I would like to welcome to Queen’s Park Dr. Charlene Doak-Gebauer—she’s the producer of the documentary Vulnerable Innocence, which inspired my PMB to be debated this afternoon—as well as her husband, Michael Gebauer; also, Mark Kaluski, from my office in Ottawa; David Nightingale, my EA here at Queen’s Park; and Razan Akiba, my OLIP intern. I look forward to welcoming you in Ottawa–Vanier." ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Peter Bethlenfalvy", "text": [ "It’s my great honour to introduce two great people from my riding, the constituency of Pickering–Uxbridge: first off, page Emily Naassan and her father, Anthony, who’s up here. Welcome to our House." ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Catherine Fife", "text": [ "I just want to say a special thank you to the OLIP intern who served in my office this year. Steffi Burgi did an amazing job. I’m so excited to see where she’s going to end up. It’s an amazing program, and I’m all ready for my next OLIP intern next year. Let the games begin." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Andrew Dowie", "text": [ "I’d like to wish a warm welcome to Chris Johnson, senior pastor at the Kitchener-Waterloo Seventh-Day Adventist Church, as well as my great friend Joseph Richards, also from the Seventh-day Adventist church. Welcome to Queen’s Park." ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Jess Dixon", "text": [ "It gives me great pleasure to welcome the family of our page captain, Jasnoor Kaur from Oak Creek Public School, today. Joining us are her family members Hardeep Kaur, Randhir Singh and Prabhjyot Singh. Thank you so much for coming and supporting your wonderful, wonderful daughter." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Logan Kanapathi", "text": [ "I would like to extend to several members of the community—Mitusaan Kugathasan, student trustee for York region; Hishane Kugathasan, who’s a great volunteer from Markham–Thornhill and Markham–Stouffville; and also Sivarathy Subramaniam. Thank you for coming and for all the hard work you do for our community. Welcome to Queen’s Park." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Stephen Crawford", "text": [ "Good morning. I have in the members’ gallery an Oakville resident I’d like to introduce: Andrei Adam." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Mike Harris", "text": [ "I just got a note from a good friend of ours who is watching the last proceedings of this session, Barbara Stevens. Hello. It’s good to see you in TV land today." ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Bobbi Ann Brady", "text": [ "I’d like to welcome to the House a friend, Holy Trinity high school student Adam Chambers. Enjoy your day today, Adam. Welcome to Queen’s Park." ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. David Piccini", "text": [ "I’d like to welcome to Queen’s Park today two constituents of mine, Jake Deacon and Albert Schultz, from Northumberland–Peterborough South and specifically Port Hope. Welcome to Queen’s Park." ] }, { "speaker": "Mrs. Jennifer (Jennie) Stevens", "text": [ "She’s a little late coming in, but I would like to welcome Regional Councillor Haley Bateman from the city of St. Catharines. Welcome to your House." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "With the indulgence of the House, I’d like to continue with introduction of visitors." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Robert Bailey", "text": [ "Out in TV land there—the member from Kitchener–Conestoga reminded me—there’s a Mrs. Given who watches question period every day from out in Brampton. Hello, Mrs. Given. I’m here today." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Thank you.", "I think the member for Peterborough–Kawartha has a point of order." ] }, { "speaker": "Mr. Dave Smith", "text": [ "I know my parents are watching today. It is the last sessional day. I just want to wish my mother a happy 80th birthday on Saturday." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "I beg to inform the House that I’ve laid upon the table the individual members’ expenditures for the fiscal year 2023-24." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "I’m going to recognize next the member for Milton on a point of order." ] }, { "speaker": "MPP Zee Hamid", "text": [ "Speaker, if you seek it, you will find unanimous consent of the House to observe a moment of silence in remembrance of London’s Afzaal family, the four members—Salman, Madiha, Talat, and Yumnah—who three years ago today lost their lives to a tragic and senseless act of Islamophobia-inspired terrorism." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "MPP Hamid is seeking the unanimous consent of the House to observe a moment of silence in remembrance of the four members of London’s Afzaal family—Salman, Talat, Madiha and Yumnah—who lost their lives three years ago today to a tragic and senseless act of Islamophobia-inspired terrorism. Agreed? Agreed.", "Members will please rise.", "1040", "The House observed a moment’s silence." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Thank you. Members may take their seats." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Ms. Marit Stiles", "text": [ "Good morning, Speaker. Looking back on the past few months, I am struck by the fact that, on so many issues, whether it’s health care or housing or making life more affordable, the government has let people down. They’ve shown that in their priorities. People are struggling to find a family doctor and rural emergency rooms are closing while this government subsidizes a private luxury spa in downtown Toronto. While the price of housing ballooned and housing starts dropped, this government spent the season reversing their own legislation and blocking new housing.", "My question to the Premier is, will the Premier admit that he has lost touch with the people of Ontario?" ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "The government House leader." ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Paul Calandra", "text": [ "Mr. Speaker, look, when we came to office in 2018, we inherited a province of Ontario that was in deep trouble, a province that had out-of-control taxes, a province that had out-of-control red tape, a province that had lost 300,000 jobs. Our manufacturers were being hollowed out. We had communities fighting each other with respect to energy in the province of Ontario. People were having to make the choice between heating or eating.", "What we have now is a province that has created over 700,000 jobs. Some $40 billion worth of economic activity is coming back. Our manufacturers are creating jobs like never before. Eight billion dollars of costs to those job creators has been removed. We have removed red tape from them, Mr. Speaker. We’ve lowered taxes for the people of the province of Ontario. We’re building hospitals and long-term-care homes. We’re rebuilding our education system.", "The job isn’t done, Mr. Speaker, but we are going to continue on the path of rebuilding the province of Ontario." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "The supplementary question." ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Marit Stiles", "text": [ "Speaker, no wonder they can’t get out of here fast enough, right? They should be rolling up their sleeves right now to address the priorities of Ontarians. Serving the people as government is a privilege and it can be gone sooner than you think.", "People expect their Premier to be working hard every day to make their lives better. But what they’ve got instead is somebody who puts his interests and his friends first every single time. Instead of hiring more doctors or building more housing or strengthening our local schools, we’ve got backroom deals, RCMP criminal investigations and hundreds of millions of dollars wasted breaking contracts.", "What does the Premier have to say to hard-working Ontarians who feel like they have taken a back seat to his pet projects?", "Interjections." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Members will please take their seats.", "Government House leader." ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Paul Calandra", "text": [ "Mr. Speaker, I would agree with the member opposite: Ontarians know all too well how quickly the gains of the last number of years can be lost. We’re seeing that play out in Ottawa.", "The people of the province of Ontario understand that in 2018, when we came to office, we had a province that was bleeding jobs to other provinces and to the United States. Some 300,000 jobs were lost. The manufacturing sector in this province was hollowed out, Mr. Speaker. Our students were not achieving the results that they should be. Our hospitals were not at the height of what they could be for the people of the province of Ontario. The health care advantage that we’d had, we had lost.", "Fast-forward to today, and I will admit that the job is not done. We have created the conditions for over 700,000 jobs; $40 billion worth of economic activity is coming back to the province of Ontario, and we’re doing that while removing costs for the people of the province of Ontario, lowering taxes, cutting red tape, building a bigger, better, stronger, safer Ontario." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "The final supplementary?" ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Marit Stiles", "text": [ "Speaker, the session might be ending, but people’s problems aren’t. And six years in, I would challenge you to find a person out there who is not a personal friend of the Premier whose life has gotten better under this government. We have emergency rooms closing. We have construction stopped. You could have kick-started the construction of real affordable housing options so that young people can build a home, but the government said no. We could have connected 2.4 million people with a family doctor, but the government said no. We could have reduced congestion on the 401 by lifting the tolls on the 407 for truckers so that people could get home to their families faster, and this government said no.", "When will this government start saying yes to real solutions for real people?", "Interjections." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Members will please take their seats.", "Government House leader." ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Paul Calandra", "text": [ "What we have said no to are the exact same policies that brought the province of Ontario to its knees in 2018. We inherited a province that was overly regulated—one of the most heavily regulated provinces, jurisdictions in the world. We inherited a province where its people were overtaxed, where people had to decide between heating their home or putting food on the table. We inherited a province where communities were fighting each other. We inherited a province that was not building long-term care. We inherited a province whose hospitals needed to be rebuilt. We inherited a province where our roads, infrastructure were so sorely undervalued by the previous NDP-Liberal government.", "What we have done since then is reinvest in the people of the province of Ontario. We’ve lowered taxes. We’ve brought back investments.", "She talks about the friends of the government. The people I consider friends are the 700,000 Ontarians who have the dignity of a job, who have hope and opportunity and a bigger, better, stronger—", "Interjections." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "The next question." ] } ]

[ { "speaker": "Ms. Marit Stiles", "text": [ "I’d remind the minister that today in Ontario people are dying in the streets. Parents are going to turn up at emergency rooms which are closed with their sick child. That is the Ontario we are living in today.", "Yesterday, the Financial Accountability Office released its report into the Ministry of Children, Community and Social Services. For millions of Ontarians, it should be pretty clear today that they are not this government’s priority. Leaping from the page is the FAO’s projection that there’s going to be an overall shortfall of $3.7 billion. That’s the difference between what the government has allocated and what’s needed to maintain program funding levels.", "Speaker, can the Premier explain this discrepancy?" ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "The Minister of Children, Community and Social Services." ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Michael Parsa", "text": [ "As I said yesterday, the FAO’s opinions don’t reflect actual government spending and investments.", "And I’ll make it very clear, Mr. Speaker. Again, the opposition sometimes struggles with facts, so I’ll say it as slowly as I can: Investments in the Ministry of Children, Community and Social Services increased by more than $630 million this year. Every single program under our ministry has seen an increase of investment.", "The year before, the Ministry of Children, Community and Social Services received an investment of more than $900 million, $1.2 billion the year before.", "Now, what has the opposition done? Voted against every single measure to make life more affordable, make the services more accessible for Ontarians. So of course Ontarians are seeing it. That’s why they returned two members from two by-elections and the NDP were shut out once again in this province—", "Interjections." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "The member will take his seat. The minister will take his seat.", "Supplementary question?" ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Marit Stiles", "text": [ "The minister can try to brush off the FAO numbers, but guess who provides the numbers to the FAO? The ministry themselves. It’s their own numbers. Even if they—" ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Lisa MacLeod", "text": [ "The member’s all over the map.", "1050" ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "The member for Nepean will come to order." ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Marit Stiles", "text": [ "Speaker, families of kids with autism have been on a roller-coaster ride of changing programs and reversals and overhauls. They deserve a program that works. The FAO’s report shows very clearly that, again, social services are going to be underfunded by about $3.7 billion.", "Those families deserve a program that works—one that can deliver for them not only the funding that they desperately need, but also the services to help their kids while they can still make a difference. So I want the Premier to explain to people and families in need why he is underfunding social services by $3.7 billion." ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Michael Parsa", "text": [ "Once again, I will gladly share some facts with the leader of the official opposition, because they always seem to miss them. You’ll see them every quarter, Mr. Speaker—they’ll get up and talk about the numbers. When public accounts and actual numbers come out—silence over there, because they have absolutely nothing to say to facts. The cameras are off at that point. You’ll never hear the NDP go in front of cameras at that point. The facts speak for themselves.", "When it comes to the Ontario Autism Program, I’ll say that the FAO assigned an average number to the children and youth in the program. There is no such thing as an average child with autism. The OAP does not treat children and youth as statistics. Support is based on individual needs.", "Mr. Speaker, as I’ve said many times, we doubled the Ontario Autism Program. It was the community that built this program. This year, we increased the investment by over $120 million. This isn’t even the same—" ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Thank you very much.", "The final supplementary." ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Marit Stiles", "text": [ "Only this government could say they doubled the funding and everything gets worse. It’s outrageous.", "Here’s another number for the government: 70,000—70,000 children on the wait-list for autism services.", "Interjection." ] }, { "speaker": "Ms. Marit Stiles", "text": [ "The wait-list.", "Spending on child and youth services, which includes the autism program, is only expected to grow by 0.2% over the next five years.", "Can you imagine, Speaker, that this year, only one in seven of those kids on that wait-list are going to get the services they need—10,000 out of 70,000 kids in need.", "I want to ask the Premier, on what planet does he think that that is acceptable to the people of the province of Ontario?", "Interjections." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Members will please take their seats.", "Minister of Children, Community and Social Services." ] }, { "speaker": "Hon. Michael Parsa", "text": [ "Of course, the leader of the official opposition had no problems when 75% of families were languishing on the wait-list under the previous government, when they held the balance of power for three years and could have gone to the Liberals at that time and said, “Bring in more funding or we will bring you down.” Of course, it was not a big deal for the NDP at that time.", "Mr. Speaker, the program that we have now is nowhere near the program before. The Ontario Autism Program is a world-class, needs-based program that is delivering.", "Let’s do a compare and contrast, because I know the opposition likes it. Before, families received one service. Today, just the core clinical service—ABA, speech-language pathology, mental health support. On top of that, families have access to free services as soon as they register with AccessOAP: entry to school, family foundational services, urgent response.", "We will not leave any child—", "Interjections." ] }, { "speaker": "The Speaker (Hon. Ted Arnott)", "text": [ "Stop the clock.", "Do I need to remind the members that the Speaker’s responsibility is to maintain order and decorum, and in order to do that, the Speaker has the ability to send people home a little early? Thank you.", "Start the clock. The next question." ] } ]