eliwill/krishnamurti_discussions · Datasets at Hugging Face

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Now, here the problem is immense. When I say I am the world and the world is me, it is not a verbal statement, it is not an abstraction but a reality. Now, what is my action when I'm confronted with this thing, when I realize I am the world and the world is me?
I realize it, not verbally accept the statement, not accept a conclusion, but a fact that I am that. When I am ambitious I create a society that supports my ambition. When I am corrupt I create a society that supports.
So, I am the world and the world is me. I am faced with that fact, and therefore no moving away from that fact. What action takes place?
There must be action when you are faced with a fact. I can do nothing about this. You can do nothing about it?
Is that what you are all saying? Be honest, sir. We don't know what to do.
We are not facing the fact at all, sir. Like a physical danger, the psychological danger we are not facing it at all. Why this lack of seriousness in us?
Right, sir, just a minute. You are educated from childhood to face the cobra - right? - that is a danger, and there, through tradition, through experience, through memory, through what people have 'Be careful of that snake', therefore you are conditioned to act instantly.
Right? Here, you are not conditioned to act instantly. On the contrary, you are conditioned to withdraw from the fact into an abstraction.
Right? See what is going on, sir. With the snake you are conditioned to act instantly, here you are conditioned to go away from the fact.
Right? So your difficulty is how to unconditional the mind to face the fact. You understand?
You can look at the fact. You logically, intellectually, every way, say, 'Yes, it is so'. But you cannot act about it because you are living in an abstraction.
Therefore you have no answer. You understand? If I don't live in abstractions - I don't.
Personally I don't live in abstractions at all, about anything. I have no belief. I have no ideals, no concepts, no conclusion, no opinions.
I observe the fact and the fact tells me what to do. Right? But if I live in abstractions then I don't know what to do.
So, our question then why are you living in abstractions? When you call yourself a Hindu, that's an abstraction, isn't it - or a Muslim or whatever it is. Why do you do that?
Go on, sir, answer, sir. Fear. Division.
No, sir, answer it from... not just intellectual word. Why do live in a world of abstractions? (Inaudible) You are not answering my question.
It's an easy way to live. It is the easiest way, to live in abstractions? Look, sir, you have an abstraction called reincarnation, haven't you?
All of you believe in that - god knows why, but you believe in it. That's an abstraction. So, what is your life?
You are going to live next life. Right? Therefore this life matters enormously what you do - doesn't it?
If you believe in reincarnation, because then you will be born next life and a better life - more money, more houses, more, more - you follow? - and if you believe that strongly, then what is important is how you live now, isn't it. Therefore, the belief is an abstraction, the reality is what you are doing now.
And you won't face that. So why does the mind, your mind, live in abstractions? There must be brotherhood - right?
- we are all brotherly, and we form societies, groups and god knows what else - why? Either you are brotherly or not brotherly. Right?
So, why aren't you brotherly? Because you are - very simple fact - you are concerned about yourself. You say to the other fellow, 'Go to hell, I'm only concerned about myself.
I'll be brotherly when it pays me'. You never face facts. Right?
Now, I say to you, why do you live in abstractions? You haven't answered me. Do you go and read the Bhagavad-Gita which will tell you why you live in abstractions?
Will you go to your guru, and tell you why you live in abstractions? Will he tell you? The Upanishads?
Will anybody tell you why you live in abstractions? Come on, sir, tell me. Isn't it because...
I have this feeling that it's because I find it easy to conform myself to the society that I live in. That's what happens. So you are confirming to a pattern which society has established, and the religious teachers have established it as an abstraction.
Yes. Now wait. Then what do you do?
Just carry on, living in abstractions? That's a fact. All right, I'll take you up on that.
You live in abstractions, that's a fact. Right? Now what is your action when you face that fact?
You know what abstraction means? Words, a conclusion, a formula, a dictum, an ideology - all those are abstractions and you are living in that. That's a fact.
And when you face that, what is your action? You understand, sir? What is your action when you face that you are living with ideas, which have - ideas - you follow?
- words. What is your action? Do you drop them?
The dropping of them is action. Right? As it is an action when you see a cobra.
A man who is hungry, by reading a menu is not satisfied is he? You read the menu - you understand? - and you think you are satisfied.
You understand, sir, what I am saying? That has been your religion, your education, your way of life. So, what is a man to do when he is confronted with the fact that he is the world and the world is he, himself.
You know what it means, sir, to realize that fact? Not verbally, intellectually, but to really realize it in your - realize it. Do you know what it means?
That you are totally responsible for every action of yours, and not somebody else - not the government, not society, not your culture. You are the product of that and therefore you are facing the fact and therefore you are absolutely responsible for that. Sir, don't you feel responsible for your family and children?
Do you? Do you, sirs? What do you do?
Just go up in abstractions, and let them starve, let them get disease and so on? You work, don't you? That's the root of the problem.
Wait! That's what I'm saying, sir. You work; you have to act.
You don't say, 'Well, I will have abstractions that I must act'. You go. You go every morning from nine o'clock till five thirty or five to a beastly factory, office, sweat, be insulted, goaded, and that's your life.
Right? By golly. And because that's your life and so boring you trot off to your guru.
Don't you? You go off to a temple, take a bath, shave your head or fast, or play tricks with yourself. So, sir, now what takes place?
What takes place to a mind that has realized that it is the world and the world is itself, and doesn't move from that fact? What takes place? It ceases to live.
It ceases to live. How do you know? That's a conclusion, isn't it.
What takes place when I realize that when you kill a Pakistani for the love of your country, and the Pakistani kills you for the love of his country, the wife, the husband, the children are crying, what takes place in you? Just, what happens to you? I'm not being sentimental, emotional.
What takes place? Right, I'll show you if you want. You see, unfortunately that will become an abstraction to you, not a reality.
To me it is a reality because I am not a Hindu, I don't belong to any country. Right? I have no religion as you... the religion of yours, which is non-religion.
I have no authority. You understand, sir? I don't follow anybody.
And I live a life in which I don't compare myself with anybody. Therefore I'm not envious of your cars, of your women, of your money, of your enlightenment, gurus. Right?
Can you do that? That is action - you understand, sir? - a positive direct action.
And when all of you do that, do you know what will happen to India, to this country? You'll bring out a new generation of people. (Inaudible) Can you do that, sir?
That's your next question. Because you are facing a fact. The fact is that your house is on fire - your house not my house.
And when you realize actually your house is on fire, you don't theorize, you work. Don't you? Now will you, faced with this fact, act?
That is a mind that has no tradition, therefore it is a fresh mind. You understand, sir? But how does it help to change the world?
(Inaudible) How does it stop butchery taking place in the world? How does it stop the wickedness that is going on in the world. Are you asking me?
Yes, sir. Why? How do you stop it, sir?
Not how do I stop it. I can't stop it, sir... What do you mean? The world is you and you are the world.
If you stop being wicked, you have stopped wickedness. Has it stopped? Oh for - do listen to this, sir!
If you love - I mustn't use that word, you don't know anything about it. Sir, the moment I realize I am the world and the world is me, and see the immense significance of it - not my little world, my little family, my little money, my ambition, my petty little opinions - I am the world, of this extraordinary world, of the world of beauty, nature, the flowers, the skies, the marvellous earth, and also the human beings that are suffering, aching, lonely, miserable, shedding tears - I'm all that. And I realize the wickedness exists there because I am wicked.
If all of you realize that now, do you know what, you would be marvellous human beings. You'd change the world tomorrow. But you are not interested in changing the world, nor changing yourself either.
You know, sirs, this is becoming a great problem, whether human beings - Arabs or Jews, or Hindus and Muslims - whether they can live peacefully. Whether knowledge has any place to bring about peace. You understand my question, sir?
Whether knowledge has any place in bringing about peace between human beings. Knowledge being experience. We've had probably over , wars since history began, written history.
People have cried, they have been mutilated, without arms, without legs, without eyes. Women have cried the world over. They have had thousand experiences of tears, and we are still going on.
So has knowledge any place in bringing about peace between human beings? You understand my question, sir? Please, even understand the question, not how to answer it.
You understood my question, sirs? Has tradition helped to bring about peace in the world? - your tradition, my tradition, the Muslim tradition, the Christian tradition - you follow?
You know that word 'tradition' means 'tradare', to transfer, to hand over, and also it has another meaning. Another meaning is 'betrayal'. Betrayal of the a man who lives in tradition is betraying the present.
I wonder if you understand this. Not understand it up here. Therefore a man who lives in tradition is always betraying the present, which means the present agony, the present suffering, the present ache, loneliness, lack of affection - that is the present.
And when you function in tradition you are betraying all that. And that's what you all, gentlemen, ladies, have done. So, what will you do when you realize this fact?
(Inaudible) Sir, sir, what do I say, sir? What do I do, sir? I haven't understood what you said, sir.
What did you say, sir? I generalize... All the human beings are corrupt and all the human beings are violent. All human beings are violent.
Right. I say, yes. It is not a generalization but observed.
Observe yourself; aren't you violent? Don't you get angry? Don't you want position, competition?
Don't you support your India against Pakistan? Isn't that violence? And this is happening the world over.
Therefore I am saying human beings for thousands of years have been violent. Right? It is not as abstract generalization but an actuality.
We are sexually violent, we are violent in our emotions, we are envious, which is a form of violence, and also violence takes place when we live in a crowded city. You know that, do you? They have experimented, putting rats, animals in a very, very close quarters, not giving them enough space.
When that happens, the animals, the rats and the other animals lose their orientation. They kill their own babies, they kill their own mothers. They destroy themselves.
That's what we are doing. You understand all this, sirs? Therefore human beings are violent and therefore you have created a world that is violent.
Face that fact, not how to get over violence. How to get over violence by non-violence is an abstraction. And you have played that, with that game for centuries.
But if you face the fact that you are violent, what takes place? Unless I die to all my accumulated knowledge and experience and live this moment, for this moment itself creating further knowledge and experience, how can you face the fact? Do you really want to know that, an answer to that, sir?
Will you pursue it with your life, not with words? That is the only answer. (Laughs) Will you give your life to find out the truth of it?
Yes, sir. So you are asking the question, how to live in the present totally. Right?
Without creating an experience or a knowledge of this moment. Therefore you have to enquire into the question of what is learning. Right, sir?
Sir, what is the difference between... Look, sir, look, sir. Wait a minute, sir. That gentleman asked a question.
You are asking a question, how am I to live in the present. We don't know what it means, therefore you say, 'I'm going to learn about it'. Right?
Learn. Now, what does learn mean, what does learning mean? I learn a language and therefore collect a lot of words, verbs, and learn how to put the words and the verbs together - I learn.
But learning itself is creating an experience, sir. Wait, sir, please, sir. I said there are two meanings to learning.
One is to accumulate knowledge - linguistic, mathematic, biological, scientific and so on - there you learn and accumulate knowledge, and that knowledge can be added or taken, and so on. There is another kind of learning. Will you listen to this?
You know this kind of learning. Right? You are brought up from childhood to learn, to know what learning means of that kind.
I am bringing something new, something - think about, look at it. Which is, to learn without accumulating. Now, to learn without accumulating means to observe afresh each movement of life.
That means I cannot observe the movement of life, thought, feeling, all that, if I come to it with previous knowledge, with previous memories, with previous experiences. Therefore, can my mind, can my mind learn a language, accumulated, how to ride a bicycle, drive a car and so on, on one hand, and also learn without accumulating. You understand?
Which means I must give tremendous attention to this fact of learning without accumulation. Therefore it means learning all the time, never a moment of not learning. The non-learning is the accumulating factor.
I wonder if you get all this. The learning is a constant movement. Therefore there is never a moment you say, 'I know'.
You understand, sir? The moment you say, 'I know', you have lost all humility. When your gurus, your teachers, your enlightened whatever they are, tell you, 'I know', they have lost everything.
You understand? But a man who is learning, never accumulating, therefore he learns every minute and has humility. Whereas the man who is learning and accumulating, he uses his knowledge for his vanity, both technologically and psychologically.
So can the mind hold both? You understand, sir? Hold both and function.
That requires tremendous inward attention and discipline. You understand? Oh lord!

Now, here the problem is immense. When I say I am the world and the world is me, it is not a verbal statement, it is not an abstraction but a reality. Now, what is my action when I'm confronted with this thing, when I realize I am the world and the world is me?

I realize it, not verbally accept the statement, not accept a conclusion, but a fact that I am that. When I am ambitious I create a society that supports my ambition. When I am corrupt I create a society that supports.

So, I am the world and the world is me. I am faced with that fact, and therefore no moving away from that fact. What action takes place?

There must be action when you are faced with a fact. I can do nothing about this. You can do nothing about it?

Is that what you are all saying? Be honest, sir. We don't know what to do.

We are not facing the fact at all, sir. Like a physical danger, the psychological danger we are not facing it at all. Why this lack of seriousness in us?

Right, sir, just a minute. You are educated from childhood to face the cobra - right? - that is a danger, and there, through tradition, through experience, through memory, through what people have 'Be careful of that snake', therefore you are conditioned to act instantly.

Right? Here, you are not conditioned to act instantly. On the contrary, you are conditioned to withdraw from the fact into an abstraction.

Right? See what is going on, sir. With the snake you are conditioned to act instantly, here you are conditioned to go away from the fact.

Right? So your difficulty is how to unconditional the mind to face the fact. You understand?

You can look at the fact. You logically, intellectually, every way, say, 'Yes, it is so'. But you cannot act about it because you are living in an abstraction.

Therefore you have no answer. You understand? If I don't live in abstractions - I don't.

Personally I don't live in abstractions at all, about anything. I have no belief. I have no ideals, no concepts, no conclusion, no opinions.

I observe the fact and the fact tells me what to do. Right? But if I live in abstractions then I don't know what to do.

So, our question then why are you living in abstractions? When you call yourself a Hindu, that's an abstraction, isn't it - or a Muslim or whatever it is. Why do you do that?

Go on, sir, answer, sir. Fear. Division.

No, sir, answer it from... not just intellectual word. Why do live in a world of abstractions? (Inaudible) You are not answering my question.

It's an easy way to live. It is the easiest way, to live in abstractions? Look, sir, you have an abstraction called reincarnation, haven't you?

All of you believe in that - god knows why, but you believe in it. That's an abstraction. So, what is your life?

You are going to live next life. Right? Therefore this life matters enormously what you do - doesn't it?

If you believe in reincarnation, because then you will be born next life and a better life - more money, more houses, more, more - you follow? - and if you believe that strongly, then what is important is how you live now, isn't it. Therefore, the belief is an abstraction, the reality is what you are doing now.

And you won't face that. So why does the mind, your mind, live in abstractions? There must be brotherhood - right?

- we are all brotherly, and we form societies, groups and god knows what else - why? Either you are brotherly or not brotherly. Right?

So, why aren't you brotherly? Because you are - very simple fact - you are concerned about yourself. You say to the other fellow, 'Go to hell, I'm only concerned about myself.

I'll be brotherly when it pays me'. You never face facts. Right?

Now, I say to you, why do you live in abstractions? You haven't answered me. Do you go and read the Bhagavad-Gita which will tell you why you live in abstractions?

Will you go to your guru, and tell you why you live in abstractions? Will he tell you? The Upanishads?

Will anybody tell you why you live in abstractions? Come on, sir, tell me. Isn't it because...

I have this feeling that it's because I find it easy to conform myself to the society that I live in. That's what happens. So you are confirming to a pattern which society has established, and the religious teachers have established it as an abstraction.

Yes. Now wait. Then what do you do?

Just carry on, living in abstractions? That's a fact. All right, I'll take you up on that.

You live in abstractions, that's a fact. Right? Now what is your action when you face that fact?

You know what abstraction means? Words, a conclusion, a formula, a dictum, an ideology - all those are abstractions and you are living in that. That's a fact.

And when you face that, what is your action? You understand, sir? What is your action when you face that you are living with ideas, which have - ideas - you follow?

- words. What is your action? Do you drop them?

The dropping of them is action. Right? As it is an action when you see a cobra.

A man who is hungry, by reading a menu is not satisfied is he? You read the menu - you understand? - and you think you are satisfied.

You understand, sir, what I am saying? That has been your religion, your education, your way of life. So, what is a man to do when he is confronted with the fact that he is the world and the world is he, himself.

You know what it means, sir, to realize that fact? Not verbally, intellectually, but to really realize it in your - realize it. Do you know what it means?

That you are totally responsible for every action of yours, and not somebody else - not the government, not society, not your culture. You are the product of that and therefore you are facing the fact and therefore you are absolutely responsible for that. Sir, don't you feel responsible for your family and children?

Do you? Do you, sirs? What do you do?

Just go up in abstractions, and let them starve, let them get disease and so on? You work, don't you? That's the root of the problem.

Wait! That's what I'm saying, sir. You work; you have to act.

You don't say, 'Well, I will have abstractions that I must act'. You go. You go every morning from nine o'clock till five thirty or five to a beastly factory, office, sweat, be insulted, goaded, and that's your life.

Right? By golly. And because that's your life and so boring you trot off to your guru.

Don't you? You go off to a temple, take a bath, shave your head or fast, or play tricks with yourself. So, sir, now what takes place?

What takes place to a mind that has realized that it is the world and the world is itself, and doesn't move from that fact? What takes place? It ceases to live.

It ceases to live. How do you know? That's a conclusion, isn't it.

What takes place when I realize that when you kill a Pakistani for the love of your country, and the Pakistani kills you for the love of his country, the wife, the husband, the children are crying, what takes place in you? Just, what happens to you? I'm not being sentimental, emotional.

What takes place? Right, I'll show you if you want. You see, unfortunately that will become an abstraction to you, not a reality.

To me it is a reality because I am not a Hindu, I don't belong to any country. Right? I have no religion as you... the religion of yours, which is non-religion.

I have no authority. You understand, sir? I don't follow anybody.

And I live a life in which I don't compare myself with anybody. Therefore I'm not envious of your cars, of your women, of your money, of your enlightenment, gurus. Right?

Can you do that? That is action - you understand, sir? - a positive direct action.

And when all of you do that, do you know what will happen to India, to this country? You'll bring out a new generation of people. (Inaudible) Can you do that, sir?

That's your next question. Because you are facing a fact. The fact is that your house is on fire - your house not my house.

And when you realize actually your house is on fire, you don't theorize, you work. Don't you? Now will you, faced with this fact, act?

That is a mind that has no tradition, therefore it is a fresh mind. You understand, sir? But how does it help to change the world?

(Inaudible) How does it stop butchery taking place in the world? How does it stop the wickedness that is going on in the world. Are you asking me?

Yes, sir. Why? How do you stop it, sir?

Not how do I stop it. I can't stop it, sir... What do you mean? The world is you and you are the world.

If you stop being wicked, you have stopped wickedness. Has it stopped? Oh for - do listen to this, sir!

If you love - I mustn't use that word, you don't know anything about it. Sir, the moment I realize I am the world and the world is me, and see the immense significance of it - not my little world, my little family, my little money, my ambition, my petty little opinions - I am the world, of this extraordinary world, of the world of beauty, nature, the flowers, the skies, the marvellous earth, and also the human beings that are suffering, aching, lonely, miserable, shedding tears - I'm all that. And I realize the wickedness exists there because I am wicked.

If all of you realize that now, do you know what, you would be marvellous human beings. You'd change the world tomorrow. But you are not interested in changing the world, nor changing yourself either.

You know, sirs, this is becoming a great problem, whether human beings - Arabs or Jews, or Hindus and Muslims - whether they can live peacefully. Whether knowledge has any place to bring about peace. You understand my question, sir?

Whether knowledge has any place in bringing about peace between human beings. Knowledge being experience. We've had probably over , wars since history began, written history.

People have cried, they have been mutilated, without arms, without legs, without eyes. Women have cried the world over. They have had thousand experiences of tears, and we are still going on.

So has knowledge any place in bringing about peace between human beings? You understand my question, sir? Please, even understand the question, not how to answer it.

You understood my question, sirs? Has tradition helped to bring about peace in the world? - your tradition, my tradition, the Muslim tradition, the Christian tradition - you follow?

You know that word 'tradition' means 'tradare', to transfer, to hand over, and also it has another meaning. Another meaning is 'betrayal'. Betrayal of the a man who lives in tradition is betraying the present.

I wonder if you understand this. Not understand it up here. Therefore a man who lives in tradition is always betraying the present, which means the present agony, the present suffering, the present ache, loneliness, lack of affection - that is the present.

And when you function in tradition you are betraying all that. And that's what you all, gentlemen, ladies, have done. So, what will you do when you realize this fact?

(Inaudible) Sir, sir, what do I say, sir? What do I do, sir? I haven't understood what you said, sir.

What did you say, sir? I generalize... All the human beings are corrupt and all the human beings are violent. All human beings are violent.

Right. I say, yes. It is not a generalization but observed.

Observe yourself; aren't you violent? Don't you get angry? Don't you want position, competition?

Don't you support your India against Pakistan? Isn't that violence? And this is happening the world over.

Therefore I am saying human beings for thousands of years have been violent. Right? It is not as abstract generalization but an actuality.

We are sexually violent, we are violent in our emotions, we are envious, which is a form of violence, and also violence takes place when we live in a crowded city. You know that, do you? They have experimented, putting rats, animals in a very, very close quarters, not giving them enough space.

When that happens, the animals, the rats and the other animals lose their orientation. They kill their own babies, they kill their own mothers. They destroy themselves.

That's what we are doing. You understand all this, sirs? Therefore human beings are violent and therefore you have created a world that is violent.

Face that fact, not how to get over violence. How to get over violence by non-violence is an abstraction. And you have played that, with that game for centuries.

But if you face the fact that you are violent, what takes place? Unless I die to all my accumulated knowledge and experience and live this moment, for this moment itself creating further knowledge and experience, how can you face the fact? Do you really want to know that, an answer to that, sir?

Will you pursue it with your life, not with words? That is the only answer. (Laughs) Will you give your life to find out the truth of it?

Yes, sir. So you are asking the question, how to live in the present totally. Right?

Without creating an experience or a knowledge of this moment. Therefore you have to enquire into the question of what is learning. Right, sir?

Sir, what is the difference between... Look, sir, look, sir. Wait a minute, sir. That gentleman asked a question.

You are asking a question, how am I to live in the present. We don't know what it means, therefore you say, 'I'm going to learn about it'. Right?

Learn. Now, what does learn mean, what does learning mean? I learn a language and therefore collect a lot of words, verbs, and learn how to put the words and the verbs together - I learn.

But learning itself is creating an experience, sir. Wait, sir, please, sir. I said there are two meanings to learning.

One is to accumulate knowledge - linguistic, mathematic, biological, scientific and so on - there you learn and accumulate knowledge, and that knowledge can be added or taken, and so on. There is another kind of learning. Will you listen to this?

You know this kind of learning. Right? You are brought up from childhood to learn, to know what learning means of that kind.

I am bringing something new, something - think about, look at it. Which is, to learn without accumulating. Now, to learn without accumulating means to observe afresh each movement of life.

That means I cannot observe the movement of life, thought, feeling, all that, if I come to it with previous knowledge, with previous memories, with previous experiences. Therefore, can my mind, can my mind learn a language, accumulated, how to ride a bicycle, drive a car and so on, on one hand, and also learn without accumulating. You understand?

Which means I must give tremendous attention to this fact of learning without accumulation. Therefore it means learning all the time, never a moment of not learning. The non-learning is the accumulating factor.

I wonder if you get all this. The learning is a constant movement. Therefore there is never a moment you say, 'I know'.

You understand, sir? The moment you say, 'I know', you have lost all humility. When your gurus, your teachers, your enlightened whatever they are, tell you, 'I know', they have lost everything.

You understand? But a man who is learning, never accumulating, therefore he learns every minute and has humility. Whereas the man who is learning and accumulating, he uses his knowledge for his vanity, both technologically and psychologically.

So can the mind hold both? You understand, sir? Hold both and function.

That requires tremendous inward attention and discipline. You understand? Oh lord!