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s6disn | askacademia_train | 0.88 | How do I cite a transgender author's name Hi, everyone! I am trying to cite an old article by an author who has since come out as transgender and changed their name. Do I cite the text using the name which appears on it (essentially deadnaming them), or do I use their new name? I feel like this is kind of a tricky situation because, on the one hand, I want to respect the author's new name, but I also want my citations to be "correct" for plagiarism's sake. | ht466er | ht4o8yp | 1,642,468,479 | 1,642,476,017 | 11 | 14 | You should do whatever the journal's style guide says to do. Your heart's in the right place and I applaud you for that. But it's not your position to fight the journal editors over this. They're not gonna budge, and publishing's hard enough. Also, situations like this are easy to recognize for famous authors who are public about their transition. But seems like it'd lead you down a rabbit hole of checking the current names/pronouns of every single person in every single work you cite. For scientific papers in particular which can have dozens of authors multiplied, by dozens of papers, and checking all that is just not feasible. | There should be uniformity in how we cite people who have changed their names since the publication, regardless of whether they transitioned, got married, or just wanted to change their name for another reason. Since it is impractical to keep track of who changed their names, the simplest way to do this is to stick with the name in the original publication. We are citing a paper of the past (a paper that has been published), often with many authors that are literally dead. Some of these authors might have even changed their names while they were alive. This is different than referring to a living, breathing person with the name they currently have. The whole point is to refer to something written in the past. | 0 | 7,538 | 1.272727 |
s6disn | askacademia_train | 0.88 | How do I cite a transgender author's name Hi, everyone! I am trying to cite an old article by an author who has since come out as transgender and changed their name. Do I cite the text using the name which appears on it (essentially deadnaming them), or do I use their new name? I feel like this is kind of a tricky situation because, on the one hand, I want to respect the author's new name, but I also want my citations to be "correct" for plagiarism's sake. | ht3hmpx | ht4o8yp | 1,642,458,129 | 1,642,476,017 | 8 | 14 | did the last name change too? | There should be uniformity in how we cite people who have changed their names since the publication, regardless of whether they transitioned, got married, or just wanted to change their name for another reason. Since it is impractical to keep track of who changed their names, the simplest way to do this is to stick with the name in the original publication. We are citing a paper of the past (a paper that has been published), often with many authors that are literally dead. Some of these authors might have even changed their names while they were alive. This is different than referring to a living, breathing person with the name they currently have. The whole point is to refer to something written in the past. | 0 | 17,888 | 1.75 |
s6disn | askacademia_train | 0.88 | How do I cite a transgender author's name Hi, everyone! I am trying to cite an old article by an author who has since come out as transgender and changed their name. Do I cite the text using the name which appears on it (essentially deadnaming them), or do I use their new name? I feel like this is kind of a tricky situation because, on the one hand, I want to respect the author's new name, but I also want my citations to be "correct" for plagiarism's sake. | ht4o8yp | ht3klp5 | 1,642,476,017 | 1,642,459,332 | 14 | 6 | There should be uniformity in how we cite people who have changed their names since the publication, regardless of whether they transitioned, got married, or just wanted to change their name for another reason. Since it is impractical to keep track of who changed their names, the simplest way to do this is to stick with the name in the original publication. We are citing a paper of the past (a paper that has been published), often with many authors that are literally dead. Some of these authors might have even changed their names while they were alive. This is different than referring to a living, breathing person with the name they currently have. The whole point is to refer to something written in the past. | Speaking as a trans researcher, you should ALWAYS cite trans people by the name they CURRENTLY use, regardless of what name the paper was originally published or cited under. It is often very difficult to change your name on all copies of a prior paper, especially if it is widely cited. The process for updating your name on old publications varies widely from journal to journal, and some won't even permit you to do it at all. It's logistically difficult and emotionally taxing. Also, tools like Google Scholar are extremely slow to update names even if the author has already gotten a paper updated with the original publication venue. Not citing someone under their chosen name is as you correctly said an act of deadnaming; it outs the person, reassociates them with an identity they're uncomfortable with, exposes them to potential harassment and future deadnaming, and makes it harder for them to get credit for their work by splitting up their citation counts. Citing people by the name they currently go by allows them to exist in academia as themselves with dignity and respect, and there's nothing "incorrect" about doing it since they're still the same person who authored that original paper. | 1 | 16,685 | 2.333333 |
s6disn | askacademia_train | 0.88 | How do I cite a transgender author's name Hi, everyone! I am trying to cite an old article by an author who has since come out as transgender and changed their name. Do I cite the text using the name which appears on it (essentially deadnaming them), or do I use their new name? I feel like this is kind of a tricky situation because, on the one hand, I want to respect the author's new name, but I also want my citations to be "correct" for plagiarism's sake. | ht4o8yp | ht3v400 | 1,642,476,017 | 1,642,463,720 | 14 | 5 | There should be uniformity in how we cite people who have changed their names since the publication, regardless of whether they transitioned, got married, or just wanted to change their name for another reason. Since it is impractical to keep track of who changed their names, the simplest way to do this is to stick with the name in the original publication. We are citing a paper of the past (a paper that has been published), often with many authors that are literally dead. Some of these authors might have even changed their names while they were alive. This is different than referring to a living, breathing person with the name they currently have. The whole point is to refer to something written in the past. | I use the name the author uses and when in doubt, they in the singular. I'm old and hope that's OK. | 1 | 12,297 | 2.8 |
s6disn | askacademia_train | 0.88 | How do I cite a transgender author's name Hi, everyone! I am trying to cite an old article by an author who has since come out as transgender and changed their name. Do I cite the text using the name which appears on it (essentially deadnaming them), or do I use their new name? I feel like this is kind of a tricky situation because, on the one hand, I want to respect the author's new name, but I also want my citations to be "correct" for plagiarism's sake. | ht45v6l | ht4o8yp | 1,642,468,342 | 1,642,476,017 | 6 | 14 | The point of the citation is for people to be able to lookup what information you’re referencing/relying on/etc. So provide whatever information is required for someone else to find that information. If the cited work doesn’t contain the new name, then it’s not relevant to the citation. This isn’t a problem to be fixed in the work of individuals while citing things. This is work that must be done by the repositories containing that which is being cited. It is necessary for them to update this information for each relevant published piece so that the new name can be reliably used to find the cited piece written under the old name. Example: someone gets married. They have published work under the old name. What do? | There should be uniformity in how we cite people who have changed their names since the publication, regardless of whether they transitioned, got married, or just wanted to change their name for another reason. Since it is impractical to keep track of who changed their names, the simplest way to do this is to stick with the name in the original publication. We are citing a paper of the past (a paper that has been published), often with many authors that are literally dead. Some of these authors might have even changed their names while they were alive. This is different than referring to a living, breathing person with the name they currently have. The whole point is to refer to something written in the past. | 0 | 7,675 | 2.333333 |
s6disn | askacademia_train | 0.88 | How do I cite a transgender author's name Hi, everyone! I am trying to cite an old article by an author who has since come out as transgender and changed their name. Do I cite the text using the name which appears on it (essentially deadnaming them), or do I use their new name? I feel like this is kind of a tricky situation because, on the one hand, I want to respect the author's new name, but I also want my citations to be "correct" for plagiarism's sake. | ht3hmpx | ht466er | 1,642,458,129 | 1,642,468,479 | 8 | 11 | did the last name change too? | You should do whatever the journal's style guide says to do. Your heart's in the right place and I applaud you for that. But it's not your position to fight the journal editors over this. They're not gonna budge, and publishing's hard enough. Also, situations like this are easy to recognize for famous authors who are public about their transition. But seems like it'd lead you down a rabbit hole of checking the current names/pronouns of every single person in every single work you cite. For scientific papers in particular which can have dozens of authors multiplied, by dozens of papers, and checking all that is just not feasible. | 0 | 10,350 | 1.375 |
s6disn | askacademia_train | 0.88 | How do I cite a transgender author's name Hi, everyone! I am trying to cite an old article by an author who has since come out as transgender and changed their name. Do I cite the text using the name which appears on it (essentially deadnaming them), or do I use their new name? I feel like this is kind of a tricky situation because, on the one hand, I want to respect the author's new name, but I also want my citations to be "correct" for plagiarism's sake. | ht466er | ht3klp5 | 1,642,468,479 | 1,642,459,332 | 11 | 6 | You should do whatever the journal's style guide says to do. Your heart's in the right place and I applaud you for that. But it's not your position to fight the journal editors over this. They're not gonna budge, and publishing's hard enough. Also, situations like this are easy to recognize for famous authors who are public about their transition. But seems like it'd lead you down a rabbit hole of checking the current names/pronouns of every single person in every single work you cite. For scientific papers in particular which can have dozens of authors multiplied, by dozens of papers, and checking all that is just not feasible. | Speaking as a trans researcher, you should ALWAYS cite trans people by the name they CURRENTLY use, regardless of what name the paper was originally published or cited under. It is often very difficult to change your name on all copies of a prior paper, especially if it is widely cited. The process for updating your name on old publications varies widely from journal to journal, and some won't even permit you to do it at all. It's logistically difficult and emotionally taxing. Also, tools like Google Scholar are extremely slow to update names even if the author has already gotten a paper updated with the original publication venue. Not citing someone under their chosen name is as you correctly said an act of deadnaming; it outs the person, reassociates them with an identity they're uncomfortable with, exposes them to potential harassment and future deadnaming, and makes it harder for them to get credit for their work by splitting up their citation counts. Citing people by the name they currently go by allows them to exist in academia as themselves with dignity and respect, and there's nothing "incorrect" about doing it since they're still the same person who authored that original paper. | 1 | 9,147 | 1.833333 |
s6disn | askacademia_train | 0.88 | How do I cite a transgender author's name Hi, everyone! I am trying to cite an old article by an author who has since come out as transgender and changed their name. Do I cite the text using the name which appears on it (essentially deadnaming them), or do I use their new name? I feel like this is kind of a tricky situation because, on the one hand, I want to respect the author's new name, but I also want my citations to be "correct" for plagiarism's sake. | ht3v400 | ht466er | 1,642,463,720 | 1,642,468,479 | 5 | 11 | I use the name the author uses and when in doubt, they in the singular. I'm old and hope that's OK. | You should do whatever the journal's style guide says to do. Your heart's in the right place and I applaud you for that. But it's not your position to fight the journal editors over this. They're not gonna budge, and publishing's hard enough. Also, situations like this are easy to recognize for famous authors who are public about their transition. But seems like it'd lead you down a rabbit hole of checking the current names/pronouns of every single person in every single work you cite. For scientific papers in particular which can have dozens of authors multiplied, by dozens of papers, and checking all that is just not feasible. | 0 | 4,759 | 2.2 |
s6disn | askacademia_train | 0.88 | How do I cite a transgender author's name Hi, everyone! I am trying to cite an old article by an author who has since come out as transgender and changed their name. Do I cite the text using the name which appears on it (essentially deadnaming them), or do I use their new name? I feel like this is kind of a tricky situation because, on the one hand, I want to respect the author's new name, but I also want my citations to be "correct" for plagiarism's sake. | ht45v6l | ht466er | 1,642,468,342 | 1,642,468,479 | 6 | 11 | The point of the citation is for people to be able to lookup what information you’re referencing/relying on/etc. So provide whatever information is required for someone else to find that information. If the cited work doesn’t contain the new name, then it’s not relevant to the citation. This isn’t a problem to be fixed in the work of individuals while citing things. This is work that must be done by the repositories containing that which is being cited. It is necessary for them to update this information for each relevant published piece so that the new name can be reliably used to find the cited piece written under the old name. Example: someone gets married. They have published work under the old name. What do? | You should do whatever the journal's style guide says to do. Your heart's in the right place and I applaud you for that. But it's not your position to fight the journal editors over this. They're not gonna budge, and publishing's hard enough. Also, situations like this are easy to recognize for famous authors who are public about their transition. But seems like it'd lead you down a rabbit hole of checking the current names/pronouns of every single person in every single work you cite. For scientific papers in particular which can have dozens of authors multiplied, by dozens of papers, and checking all that is just not feasible. | 0 | 137 | 1.833333 |
s6disn | askacademia_train | 0.88 | How do I cite a transgender author's name Hi, everyone! I am trying to cite an old article by an author who has since come out as transgender and changed their name. Do I cite the text using the name which appears on it (essentially deadnaming them), or do I use their new name? I feel like this is kind of a tricky situation because, on the one hand, I want to respect the author's new name, but I also want my citations to be "correct" for plagiarism's sake. | ht3v400 | ht45v6l | 1,642,463,720 | 1,642,468,342 | 5 | 6 | I use the name the author uses and when in doubt, they in the singular. I'm old and hope that's OK. | The point of the citation is for people to be able to lookup what information you’re referencing/relying on/etc. So provide whatever information is required for someone else to find that information. If the cited work doesn’t contain the new name, then it’s not relevant to the citation. This isn’t a problem to be fixed in the work of individuals while citing things. This is work that must be done by the repositories containing that which is being cited. It is necessary for them to update this information for each relevant published piece so that the new name can be reliably used to find the cited piece written under the old name. Example: someone gets married. They have published work under the old name. What do? | 0 | 4,622 | 1.2 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw24r90 | gw23ec8 | 1,619,536,575 | 1,619,535,992 | 67 | 28 | Realize there are more career options than being an academic. Even in industry, you are not locked into R&D positions. Of friends I have with STEM PhDs: one is in sales of high-end research equipment. One does a kind of technical support, company buys his company's product and he goes on-site until everything is working, he gets to travel all of the time and loves it. Another is basically a high level recruiter and talent scout for PhDs for R&D. Another has a job where she just reads articles and attends conferences, her job is stay on top of the literature and the latest/greatest and send reports to the R&D staff so they don't have to waste time doing that stuff. Another works for a large academic group writing policy related to STEM. If you are in biomedical, look into being a Medical Science Lesion (it is what I would probably be doing if I was not in academics). Another got a fellowship (with congress I think) to work on governmental policy (lost track of her). Another works doing grants congruency at a university (there is the whole world of research oversight, IRB, IACUC, Bio/Radiation Safety, post-award, etc.). I interviewed for a job with the government to be a grants officer (giving out grants rather than writing them). I also interviewed with the military to do evaluations on trainees (the military seemed to take a very broad view of what a PhD qualified you to do). And another friend busted is butt working as hard as possible for about 10 years in industry, getting lots of stocks, etc., retired early and is now a documentary film maker. This is on top of getting jobs that are teaching oriented, such as small liberal arts colleges and community colleges. The first job I was offered at a liberal arts college didn't even have a publication requirement for tenure, just giving research presentations at regional conferences would have been enough. My point is, you do not have to become your advisor. Being an academic at a research university is only one option. Good luck! | I felt similar when I got my PhD. When I started, it seemed like this fantastic thing, to put dr. in front of my name. But after a while, you realize that the title is just that: A title. I always figured that was part of the process, and that's why getting a PhD takes such a long time: You become so intimately familiar with what is known overall about some small part of human knowledge, that it becomes almost mundane. So, what to do? First, take a step back: You've done a great thing! Be proud of your accomplishment. And secondly: Start living the rest of your life, whether that's inside or outside of academia. Industry isn't all that bad: You can make more money, enjoy shorter deadlines, and more free time. | 1 | 583 | 2.392857 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw24r90 | gw201eq | 1,619,536,575 | 1,619,534,539 | 67 | 6 | Realize there are more career options than being an academic. Even in industry, you are not locked into R&D positions. Of friends I have with STEM PhDs: one is in sales of high-end research equipment. One does a kind of technical support, company buys his company's product and he goes on-site until everything is working, he gets to travel all of the time and loves it. Another is basically a high level recruiter and talent scout for PhDs for R&D. Another has a job where she just reads articles and attends conferences, her job is stay on top of the literature and the latest/greatest and send reports to the R&D staff so they don't have to waste time doing that stuff. Another works for a large academic group writing policy related to STEM. If you are in biomedical, look into being a Medical Science Lesion (it is what I would probably be doing if I was not in academics). Another got a fellowship (with congress I think) to work on governmental policy (lost track of her). Another works doing grants congruency at a university (there is the whole world of research oversight, IRB, IACUC, Bio/Radiation Safety, post-award, etc.). I interviewed for a job with the government to be a grants officer (giving out grants rather than writing them). I also interviewed with the military to do evaluations on trainees (the military seemed to take a very broad view of what a PhD qualified you to do). And another friend busted is butt working as hard as possible for about 10 years in industry, getting lots of stocks, etc., retired early and is now a documentary film maker. This is on top of getting jobs that are teaching oriented, such as small liberal arts colleges and community colleges. The first job I was offered at a liberal arts college didn't even have a publication requirement for tenure, just giving research presentations at regional conferences would have been enough. My point is, you do not have to become your advisor. Being an academic at a research university is only one option. Good luck! | Congratulations. I finished my Materials Science PhD in November 2019 and felt the exact same. It's a terrible time looking for a job right now and I'm doing some living-wage work in politics for a bit while I try to have a rethink about what I want to do next. | 1 | 2,036 | 11.166667 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw24r90 | gw1x4ov | 1,619,536,575 | 1,619,533,269 | 67 | 5 | Realize there are more career options than being an academic. Even in industry, you are not locked into R&D positions. Of friends I have with STEM PhDs: one is in sales of high-end research equipment. One does a kind of technical support, company buys his company's product and he goes on-site until everything is working, he gets to travel all of the time and loves it. Another is basically a high level recruiter and talent scout for PhDs for R&D. Another has a job where she just reads articles and attends conferences, her job is stay on top of the literature and the latest/greatest and send reports to the R&D staff so they don't have to waste time doing that stuff. Another works for a large academic group writing policy related to STEM. If you are in biomedical, look into being a Medical Science Lesion (it is what I would probably be doing if I was not in academics). Another got a fellowship (with congress I think) to work on governmental policy (lost track of her). Another works doing grants congruency at a university (there is the whole world of research oversight, IRB, IACUC, Bio/Radiation Safety, post-award, etc.). I interviewed for a job with the government to be a grants officer (giving out grants rather than writing them). I also interviewed with the military to do evaluations on trainees (the military seemed to take a very broad view of what a PhD qualified you to do). And another friend busted is butt working as hard as possible for about 10 years in industry, getting lots of stocks, etc., retired early and is now a documentary film maker. This is on top of getting jobs that are teaching oriented, such as small liberal arts colleges and community colleges. The first job I was offered at a liberal arts college didn't even have a publication requirement for tenure, just giving research presentations at regional conferences would have been enough. My point is, you do not have to become your advisor. Being an academic at a research university is only one option. Good luck! | What field are you in if I may ask? | 1 | 3,306 | 13.4 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw23ec8 | gw201eq | 1,619,535,992 | 1,619,534,539 | 28 | 6 | I felt similar when I got my PhD. When I started, it seemed like this fantastic thing, to put dr. in front of my name. But after a while, you realize that the title is just that: A title. I always figured that was part of the process, and that's why getting a PhD takes such a long time: You become so intimately familiar with what is known overall about some small part of human knowledge, that it becomes almost mundane. So, what to do? First, take a step back: You've done a great thing! Be proud of your accomplishment. And secondly: Start living the rest of your life, whether that's inside or outside of academia. Industry isn't all that bad: You can make more money, enjoy shorter deadlines, and more free time. | Congratulations. I finished my Materials Science PhD in November 2019 and felt the exact same. It's a terrible time looking for a job right now and I'm doing some living-wage work in politics for a bit while I try to have a rethink about what I want to do next. | 1 | 1,453 | 4.666667 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw1x4ov | gw23ec8 | 1,619,533,269 | 1,619,535,992 | 5 | 28 | What field are you in if I may ask? | I felt similar when I got my PhD. When I started, it seemed like this fantastic thing, to put dr. in front of my name. But after a while, you realize that the title is just that: A title. I always figured that was part of the process, and that's why getting a PhD takes such a long time: You become so intimately familiar with what is known overall about some small part of human knowledge, that it becomes almost mundane. So, what to do? First, take a step back: You've done a great thing! Be proud of your accomplishment. And secondly: Start living the rest of your life, whether that's inside or outside of academia. Industry isn't all that bad: You can make more money, enjoy shorter deadlines, and more free time. | 0 | 2,723 | 5.6 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw2i8ce | gw2gfjq | 1,619,542,249 | 1,619,541,489 | 20 | 11 | Sleep and play videogames for a week, then job hunting or post doc? At least this is my plan.. | >I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? Yep, that's pretty normal. I knew before I finished my PhD that I hated my research and wanted to do something different, so I got a few internships to expand my skill sets and experience beyond my PhD projects. Because of that now I have a full time job in a field unrelated to my PhD. >How do you find meaning in your work? It's gonna sound very shallow to many people but I just went for the best offer that I thought would hate the least. So far it's working out pretty well. To me it's just a job, if a better offer came up next month I wouldn't hesitate to jump ship. | 1 | 760 | 1.818182 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw2c2ta | gw2i8ce | 1,619,539,664 | 1,619,542,249 | 8 | 20 | I'm with you. Haven't applied for a single academic job since receiving my doctorate. Honestly feel like a sucker for the amount of time spent and BS I put up with to get it. The experience was frankly deeply abusive (and I don't say that lightly) and passion crushing. Still employed in higher ed on a multi-year non-tenure track position but honestly not sure what to do next. The well is dry. Someone once told me graduate study was different from military training in that while they both broke you down, only the military attempted to build you back up. Not sure if that's true or not but do suspect there is a bit of truth to the saying. | Sleep and play videogames for a week, then job hunting or post doc? At least this is my plan.. | 0 | 2,585 | 2.5 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw2i8ce | gw201eq | 1,619,542,249 | 1,619,534,539 | 20 | 6 | Sleep and play videogames for a week, then job hunting or post doc? At least this is my plan.. | Congratulations. I finished my Materials Science PhD in November 2019 and felt the exact same. It's a terrible time looking for a job right now and I'm doing some living-wage work in politics for a bit while I try to have a rethink about what I want to do next. | 1 | 7,710 | 3.333333 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw27fa0 | gw2i8ce | 1,619,537,708 | 1,619,542,249 | 7 | 20 | You should go job hunting. First, just go to one of the big job sites and Google your degree or overall field (so anything from e.g. Neuroscience over Biology to STEM), then some specific skills you always liked to applying. Those can be specific like "microscopy" or broader soft skills. See what types of jobs come up. You could also try to check out alumni from your institution on LinkedIn to see where they went, although it can be hard to find those from the same department. After getting a first idea what you could even imagine to do, try to apply to jobs, get done interviews, "orientation days" done companies offer or if possible informal interviews with either alumni or any other contacts you can find. At that stage you don't necessarily expect to find a job but just dig deeper to see whether you might like a job. After finishing my PhD I thought I might like consulting for a company that covers a broad field of problems but attending their orientation day made it crystal clear to me that I would actually dislike that job. Otherwise r/LeavingAcademia is dedicated to that topic, although not huge has some nice insights every now and then. | Sleep and play videogames for a week, then job hunting or post doc? At least this is my plan.. | 0 | 4,541 | 2.857143 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw2i8ce | gw1x4ov | 1,619,542,249 | 1,619,533,269 | 20 | 5 | Sleep and play videogames for a week, then job hunting or post doc? At least this is my plan.. | What field are you in if I may ask? | 1 | 8,980 | 4 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw2i8ce | gw2b23k | 1,619,542,249 | 1,619,539,233 | 20 | 6 | Sleep and play videogames for a week, then job hunting or post doc? At least this is my plan.. | I think it's pretty common to be burnt out after writing and defending your dissertation. It's an exhausting process that's an odd and terrible synthesis of rite of passage, proof of academic excellence, and hazing. I've been sitting in my office reflecting on whether I feel any passion about my subject. I don't think I do. And honestly, I don't really care if i find meaning in my work. There are things I am working towards, publications in top tier journals, grants, and so on, like other academics. However, I am not doing it because I feel some deep sense of purpose or passion for my field. I'm doing it because I love the freedom of academia. That we get to choose how we spend our time as long as we make progress toward institutional goals. And those milestones only open up more avenues of freedom and choice for my time. And for me, my passion, love, and motivation all come from my family. And from my love of freedom to pursue an endeavor that I find interesting or noteworthy. | 1 | 3,016 | 3.333333 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw2cqoe | gw2i8ce | 1,619,539,945 | 1,619,542,249 | 4 | 20 | I found meaning in life, and work is work . Jobs come and go , they can end from things not outside your control . Hobbies and what bring me joy is totally in my control which is why I seek it outside of my work. Sure I still want to do well at work and I’d like not hate or or find it boring, sometimes it’s interesting sometimes it’s paint dry boring but I specifically chose a post PhD career path that frowned upon to work overtime and has lots of vacation because I want to explore life outside of work. | Sleep and play videogames for a week, then job hunting or post doc? At least this is my plan.. | 0 | 2,304 | 5 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw25w5c | gw2i8ce | 1,619,537,063 | 1,619,542,249 | 2 | 20 | I’m sorry you’ve ended up feeling this way. I feel like it happens very often though. For me I did 4 years of a PhD in “geology” and left before finishing. This was after 2 years for a masters in it. It’s a long story, but I am so happy I went back to my biology degree bachelors roots and am now finishing up a one year post bachelors program to become a clinical laboratory scientist in a hospital lab setting. The job and pay will be more stable than anything I could have had before (especially with covid now as I would have been finishing my degree when all universities seemed to have a hiring hold). I also get to directly contribute to my society with meaningful work. The program I’m currently in has been one of the hardest things I’ve ever done, not just because they take the last two years of their traditional bachelors degree and shove it into 1, but my biology mindset needed a lot of refreshing at the beginning of the program with a ten year gap. I don’t regret it at all! I did not get along well with some of the graduate students I used to work with. I’m a bit of a passive person that wants good work flow and apparently telling someone to work with another student because the advisor said so means others will literally just give you the cold shoulder until you leave and yell at you when they find you alone in a room lol. I found people hated you when you did better than them too. The only people congratulating me on grants I received or big projects I got to work on were professors, then students would be jealous kids and hide your special weigh boats and things. But I also was finding things like a huge lack of lab understanding from every level in the academic world. My advisor never went into her own lab for years at a time, the other students from my university and others across the world typically didn’t know what running standards with your samples meant or why it was important, and it was a challenge to publish anything that didn’t follow a preset story. It was only getting worse, so I left. My field was one I don’t tell many about today because of the atmosphere on it all (pun intended) but it was stable isotopes with the purpose of using the produced records for climate models. All I can say is, do something you won’t go crazy in, or at least that you can find a good pay with so you can use your non work hours as fun. Get into a career line that values a good work life balance. Don’t stay and become more bitter. Hope this helps :) | Sleep and play videogames for a week, then job hunting or post doc? At least this is my plan.. | 0 | 5,186 | 10 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw2c2ta | gw2gfjq | 1,619,539,664 | 1,619,541,489 | 8 | 11 | I'm with you. Haven't applied for a single academic job since receiving my doctorate. Honestly feel like a sucker for the amount of time spent and BS I put up with to get it. The experience was frankly deeply abusive (and I don't say that lightly) and passion crushing. Still employed in higher ed on a multi-year non-tenure track position but honestly not sure what to do next. The well is dry. Someone once told me graduate study was different from military training in that while they both broke you down, only the military attempted to build you back up. Not sure if that's true or not but do suspect there is a bit of truth to the saying. | >I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? Yep, that's pretty normal. I knew before I finished my PhD that I hated my research and wanted to do something different, so I got a few internships to expand my skill sets and experience beyond my PhD projects. Because of that now I have a full time job in a field unrelated to my PhD. >How do you find meaning in your work? It's gonna sound very shallow to many people but I just went for the best offer that I thought would hate the least. So far it's working out pretty well. To me it's just a job, if a better offer came up next month I wouldn't hesitate to jump ship. | 0 | 1,825 | 1.375 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw201eq | gw2gfjq | 1,619,534,539 | 1,619,541,489 | 6 | 11 | Congratulations. I finished my Materials Science PhD in November 2019 and felt the exact same. It's a terrible time looking for a job right now and I'm doing some living-wage work in politics for a bit while I try to have a rethink about what I want to do next. | >I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? Yep, that's pretty normal. I knew before I finished my PhD that I hated my research and wanted to do something different, so I got a few internships to expand my skill sets and experience beyond my PhD projects. Because of that now I have a full time job in a field unrelated to my PhD. >How do you find meaning in your work? It's gonna sound very shallow to many people but I just went for the best offer that I thought would hate the least. So far it's working out pretty well. To me it's just a job, if a better offer came up next month I wouldn't hesitate to jump ship. | 0 | 6,950 | 1.833333 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw27fa0 | gw2gfjq | 1,619,537,708 | 1,619,541,489 | 7 | 11 | You should go job hunting. First, just go to one of the big job sites and Google your degree or overall field (so anything from e.g. Neuroscience over Biology to STEM), then some specific skills you always liked to applying. Those can be specific like "microscopy" or broader soft skills. See what types of jobs come up. You could also try to check out alumni from your institution on LinkedIn to see where they went, although it can be hard to find those from the same department. After getting a first idea what you could even imagine to do, try to apply to jobs, get done interviews, "orientation days" done companies offer or if possible informal interviews with either alumni or any other contacts you can find. At that stage you don't necessarily expect to find a job but just dig deeper to see whether you might like a job. After finishing my PhD I thought I might like consulting for a company that covers a broad field of problems but attending their orientation day made it crystal clear to me that I would actually dislike that job. Otherwise r/LeavingAcademia is dedicated to that topic, although not huge has some nice insights every now and then. | >I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? Yep, that's pretty normal. I knew before I finished my PhD that I hated my research and wanted to do something different, so I got a few internships to expand my skill sets and experience beyond my PhD projects. Because of that now I have a full time job in a field unrelated to my PhD. >How do you find meaning in your work? It's gonna sound very shallow to many people but I just went for the best offer that I thought would hate the least. So far it's working out pretty well. To me it's just a job, if a better offer came up next month I wouldn't hesitate to jump ship. | 0 | 3,781 | 1.571429 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw2gfjq | gw1x4ov | 1,619,541,489 | 1,619,533,269 | 11 | 5 | >I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? Yep, that's pretty normal. I knew before I finished my PhD that I hated my research and wanted to do something different, so I got a few internships to expand my skill sets and experience beyond my PhD projects. Because of that now I have a full time job in a field unrelated to my PhD. >How do you find meaning in your work? It's gonna sound very shallow to many people but I just went for the best offer that I thought would hate the least. So far it's working out pretty well. To me it's just a job, if a better offer came up next month I wouldn't hesitate to jump ship. | What field are you in if I may ask? | 1 | 8,220 | 2.2 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw2gfjq | gw2b23k | 1,619,541,489 | 1,619,539,233 | 11 | 6 | >I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? Yep, that's pretty normal. I knew before I finished my PhD that I hated my research and wanted to do something different, so I got a few internships to expand my skill sets and experience beyond my PhD projects. Because of that now I have a full time job in a field unrelated to my PhD. >How do you find meaning in your work? It's gonna sound very shallow to many people but I just went for the best offer that I thought would hate the least. So far it's working out pretty well. To me it's just a job, if a better offer came up next month I wouldn't hesitate to jump ship. | I think it's pretty common to be burnt out after writing and defending your dissertation. It's an exhausting process that's an odd and terrible synthesis of rite of passage, proof of academic excellence, and hazing. I've been sitting in my office reflecting on whether I feel any passion about my subject. I don't think I do. And honestly, I don't really care if i find meaning in my work. There are things I am working towards, publications in top tier journals, grants, and so on, like other academics. However, I am not doing it because I feel some deep sense of purpose or passion for my field. I'm doing it because I love the freedom of academia. That we get to choose how we spend our time as long as we make progress toward institutional goals. And those milestones only open up more avenues of freedom and choice for my time. And for me, my passion, love, and motivation all come from my family. And from my love of freedom to pursue an endeavor that I find interesting or noteworthy. | 1 | 2,256 | 1.833333 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw2gfjq | gw2cqoe | 1,619,541,489 | 1,619,539,945 | 11 | 4 | >I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? Yep, that's pretty normal. I knew before I finished my PhD that I hated my research and wanted to do something different, so I got a few internships to expand my skill sets and experience beyond my PhD projects. Because of that now I have a full time job in a field unrelated to my PhD. >How do you find meaning in your work? It's gonna sound very shallow to many people but I just went for the best offer that I thought would hate the least. So far it's working out pretty well. To me it's just a job, if a better offer came up next month I wouldn't hesitate to jump ship. | I found meaning in life, and work is work . Jobs come and go , they can end from things not outside your control . Hobbies and what bring me joy is totally in my control which is why I seek it outside of my work. Sure I still want to do well at work and I’d like not hate or or find it boring, sometimes it’s interesting sometimes it’s paint dry boring but I specifically chose a post PhD career path that frowned upon to work overtime and has lots of vacation because I want to explore life outside of work. | 1 | 1,544 | 2.75 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw2gfjq | gw25w5c | 1,619,541,489 | 1,619,537,063 | 11 | 2 | >I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? Yep, that's pretty normal. I knew before I finished my PhD that I hated my research and wanted to do something different, so I got a few internships to expand my skill sets and experience beyond my PhD projects. Because of that now I have a full time job in a field unrelated to my PhD. >How do you find meaning in your work? It's gonna sound very shallow to many people but I just went for the best offer that I thought would hate the least. So far it's working out pretty well. To me it's just a job, if a better offer came up next month I wouldn't hesitate to jump ship. | I’m sorry you’ve ended up feeling this way. I feel like it happens very often though. For me I did 4 years of a PhD in “geology” and left before finishing. This was after 2 years for a masters in it. It’s a long story, but I am so happy I went back to my biology degree bachelors roots and am now finishing up a one year post bachelors program to become a clinical laboratory scientist in a hospital lab setting. The job and pay will be more stable than anything I could have had before (especially with covid now as I would have been finishing my degree when all universities seemed to have a hiring hold). I also get to directly contribute to my society with meaningful work. The program I’m currently in has been one of the hardest things I’ve ever done, not just because they take the last two years of their traditional bachelors degree and shove it into 1, but my biology mindset needed a lot of refreshing at the beginning of the program with a ten year gap. I don’t regret it at all! I did not get along well with some of the graduate students I used to work with. I’m a bit of a passive person that wants good work flow and apparently telling someone to work with another student because the advisor said so means others will literally just give you the cold shoulder until you leave and yell at you when they find you alone in a room lol. I found people hated you when you did better than them too. The only people congratulating me on grants I received or big projects I got to work on were professors, then students would be jealous kids and hide your special weigh boats and things. But I also was finding things like a huge lack of lab understanding from every level in the academic world. My advisor never went into her own lab for years at a time, the other students from my university and others across the world typically didn’t know what running standards with your samples meant or why it was important, and it was a challenge to publish anything that didn’t follow a preset story. It was only getting worse, so I left. My field was one I don’t tell many about today because of the atmosphere on it all (pun intended) but it was stable isotopes with the purpose of using the produced records for climate models. All I can say is, do something you won’t go crazy in, or at least that you can find a good pay with so you can use your non work hours as fun. Get into a career line that values a good work life balance. Don’t stay and become more bitter. Hope this helps :) | 1 | 4,426 | 5.5 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw2c2ta | gw201eq | 1,619,539,664 | 1,619,534,539 | 8 | 6 | I'm with you. Haven't applied for a single academic job since receiving my doctorate. Honestly feel like a sucker for the amount of time spent and BS I put up with to get it. The experience was frankly deeply abusive (and I don't say that lightly) and passion crushing. Still employed in higher ed on a multi-year non-tenure track position but honestly not sure what to do next. The well is dry. Someone once told me graduate study was different from military training in that while they both broke you down, only the military attempted to build you back up. Not sure if that's true or not but do suspect there is a bit of truth to the saying. | Congratulations. I finished my Materials Science PhD in November 2019 and felt the exact same. It's a terrible time looking for a job right now and I'm doing some living-wage work in politics for a bit while I try to have a rethink about what I want to do next. | 1 | 5,125 | 1.333333 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw27fa0 | gw2c2ta | 1,619,537,708 | 1,619,539,664 | 7 | 8 | You should go job hunting. First, just go to one of the big job sites and Google your degree or overall field (so anything from e.g. Neuroscience over Biology to STEM), then some specific skills you always liked to applying. Those can be specific like "microscopy" or broader soft skills. See what types of jobs come up. You could also try to check out alumni from your institution on LinkedIn to see where they went, although it can be hard to find those from the same department. After getting a first idea what you could even imagine to do, try to apply to jobs, get done interviews, "orientation days" done companies offer or if possible informal interviews with either alumni or any other contacts you can find. At that stage you don't necessarily expect to find a job but just dig deeper to see whether you might like a job. After finishing my PhD I thought I might like consulting for a company that covers a broad field of problems but attending their orientation day made it crystal clear to me that I would actually dislike that job. Otherwise r/LeavingAcademia is dedicated to that topic, although not huge has some nice insights every now and then. | I'm with you. Haven't applied for a single academic job since receiving my doctorate. Honestly feel like a sucker for the amount of time spent and BS I put up with to get it. The experience was frankly deeply abusive (and I don't say that lightly) and passion crushing. Still employed in higher ed on a multi-year non-tenure track position but honestly not sure what to do next. The well is dry. Someone once told me graduate study was different from military training in that while they both broke you down, only the military attempted to build you back up. Not sure if that's true or not but do suspect there is a bit of truth to the saying. | 0 | 1,956 | 1.142857 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw2c2ta | gw1x4ov | 1,619,539,664 | 1,619,533,269 | 8 | 5 | I'm with you. Haven't applied for a single academic job since receiving my doctorate. Honestly feel like a sucker for the amount of time spent and BS I put up with to get it. The experience was frankly deeply abusive (and I don't say that lightly) and passion crushing. Still employed in higher ed on a multi-year non-tenure track position but honestly not sure what to do next. The well is dry. Someone once told me graduate study was different from military training in that while they both broke you down, only the military attempted to build you back up. Not sure if that's true or not but do suspect there is a bit of truth to the saying. | What field are you in if I may ask? | 1 | 6,395 | 1.6 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw2c2ta | gw2b23k | 1,619,539,664 | 1,619,539,233 | 8 | 6 | I'm with you. Haven't applied for a single academic job since receiving my doctorate. Honestly feel like a sucker for the amount of time spent and BS I put up with to get it. The experience was frankly deeply abusive (and I don't say that lightly) and passion crushing. Still employed in higher ed on a multi-year non-tenure track position but honestly not sure what to do next. The well is dry. Someone once told me graduate study was different from military training in that while they both broke you down, only the military attempted to build you back up. Not sure if that's true or not but do suspect there is a bit of truth to the saying. | I think it's pretty common to be burnt out after writing and defending your dissertation. It's an exhausting process that's an odd and terrible synthesis of rite of passage, proof of academic excellence, and hazing. I've been sitting in my office reflecting on whether I feel any passion about my subject. I don't think I do. And honestly, I don't really care if i find meaning in my work. There are things I am working towards, publications in top tier journals, grants, and so on, like other academics. However, I am not doing it because I feel some deep sense of purpose or passion for my field. I'm doing it because I love the freedom of academia. That we get to choose how we spend our time as long as we make progress toward institutional goals. And those milestones only open up more avenues of freedom and choice for my time. And for me, my passion, love, and motivation all come from my family. And from my love of freedom to pursue an endeavor that I find interesting or noteworthy. | 1 | 431 | 1.333333 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw2c2ta | gw25w5c | 1,619,539,664 | 1,619,537,063 | 8 | 2 | I'm with you. Haven't applied for a single academic job since receiving my doctorate. Honestly feel like a sucker for the amount of time spent and BS I put up with to get it. The experience was frankly deeply abusive (and I don't say that lightly) and passion crushing. Still employed in higher ed on a multi-year non-tenure track position but honestly not sure what to do next. The well is dry. Someone once told me graduate study was different from military training in that while they both broke you down, only the military attempted to build you back up. Not sure if that's true or not but do suspect there is a bit of truth to the saying. | I’m sorry you’ve ended up feeling this way. I feel like it happens very often though. For me I did 4 years of a PhD in “geology” and left before finishing. This was after 2 years for a masters in it. It’s a long story, but I am so happy I went back to my biology degree bachelors roots and am now finishing up a one year post bachelors program to become a clinical laboratory scientist in a hospital lab setting. The job and pay will be more stable than anything I could have had before (especially with covid now as I would have been finishing my degree when all universities seemed to have a hiring hold). I also get to directly contribute to my society with meaningful work. The program I’m currently in has been one of the hardest things I’ve ever done, not just because they take the last two years of their traditional bachelors degree and shove it into 1, but my biology mindset needed a lot of refreshing at the beginning of the program with a ten year gap. I don’t regret it at all! I did not get along well with some of the graduate students I used to work with. I’m a bit of a passive person that wants good work flow and apparently telling someone to work with another student because the advisor said so means others will literally just give you the cold shoulder until you leave and yell at you when they find you alone in a room lol. I found people hated you when you did better than them too. The only people congratulating me on grants I received or big projects I got to work on were professors, then students would be jealous kids and hide your special weigh boats and things. But I also was finding things like a huge lack of lab understanding from every level in the academic world. My advisor never went into her own lab for years at a time, the other students from my university and others across the world typically didn’t know what running standards with your samples meant or why it was important, and it was a challenge to publish anything that didn’t follow a preset story. It was only getting worse, so I left. My field was one I don’t tell many about today because of the atmosphere on it all (pun intended) but it was stable isotopes with the purpose of using the produced records for climate models. All I can say is, do something you won’t go crazy in, or at least that you can find a good pay with so you can use your non work hours as fun. Get into a career line that values a good work life balance. Don’t stay and become more bitter. Hope this helps :) | 1 | 2,601 | 4 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw2r922 | gw201eq | 1,619,546,014 | 1,619,534,539 | 7 | 6 | Writing my thesis was one of the worst experiences of my life, and sent me into a pretty deep depression (someone on my committee even commented he could tell I hated writing, and it definitely wasn't my strong suit). I thought I was going to be in a lot of trouble for my future career, since anyone will tell you the bulk of your work will be writing. I'm now almost a decade into my career and am now sought after as a proof reader of papers/proposals. I write a lot a lot of my own stuff, but I've found ways to delegate the initial drafts to other people where I'm still...not great. I help with prewriting, blocking out the flow, etc, and then get involved again after the first draft has gone through. Same with writing papers. My team's found it to be a very effective way for us to all excel in our separate ways. | Congratulations. I finished my Materials Science PhD in November 2019 and felt the exact same. It's a terrible time looking for a job right now and I'm doing some living-wage work in politics for a bit while I try to have a rethink about what I want to do next. | 1 | 11,475 | 1.166667 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw1x4ov | gw2r922 | 1,619,533,269 | 1,619,546,014 | 5 | 7 | What field are you in if I may ask? | Writing my thesis was one of the worst experiences of my life, and sent me into a pretty deep depression (someone on my committee even commented he could tell I hated writing, and it definitely wasn't my strong suit). I thought I was going to be in a lot of trouble for my future career, since anyone will tell you the bulk of your work will be writing. I'm now almost a decade into my career and am now sought after as a proof reader of papers/proposals. I write a lot a lot of my own stuff, but I've found ways to delegate the initial drafts to other people where I'm still...not great. I help with prewriting, blocking out the flow, etc, and then get involved again after the first draft has gone through. Same with writing papers. My team's found it to be a very effective way for us to all excel in our separate ways. | 0 | 12,745 | 1.4 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw2b23k | gw2r922 | 1,619,539,233 | 1,619,546,014 | 6 | 7 | I think it's pretty common to be burnt out after writing and defending your dissertation. It's an exhausting process that's an odd and terrible synthesis of rite of passage, proof of academic excellence, and hazing. I've been sitting in my office reflecting on whether I feel any passion about my subject. I don't think I do. And honestly, I don't really care if i find meaning in my work. There are things I am working towards, publications in top tier journals, grants, and so on, like other academics. However, I am not doing it because I feel some deep sense of purpose or passion for my field. I'm doing it because I love the freedom of academia. That we get to choose how we spend our time as long as we make progress toward institutional goals. And those milestones only open up more avenues of freedom and choice for my time. And for me, my passion, love, and motivation all come from my family. And from my love of freedom to pursue an endeavor that I find interesting or noteworthy. | Writing my thesis was one of the worst experiences of my life, and sent me into a pretty deep depression (someone on my committee even commented he could tell I hated writing, and it definitely wasn't my strong suit). I thought I was going to be in a lot of trouble for my future career, since anyone will tell you the bulk of your work will be writing. I'm now almost a decade into my career and am now sought after as a proof reader of papers/proposals. I write a lot a lot of my own stuff, but I've found ways to delegate the initial drafts to other people where I'm still...not great. I help with prewriting, blocking out the flow, etc, and then get involved again after the first draft has gone through. Same with writing papers. My team's found it to be a very effective way for us to all excel in our separate ways. | 0 | 6,781 | 1.166667 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw2r922 | gw2cqoe | 1,619,546,014 | 1,619,539,945 | 7 | 4 | Writing my thesis was one of the worst experiences of my life, and sent me into a pretty deep depression (someone on my committee even commented he could tell I hated writing, and it definitely wasn't my strong suit). I thought I was going to be in a lot of trouble for my future career, since anyone will tell you the bulk of your work will be writing. I'm now almost a decade into my career and am now sought after as a proof reader of papers/proposals. I write a lot a lot of my own stuff, but I've found ways to delegate the initial drafts to other people where I'm still...not great. I help with prewriting, blocking out the flow, etc, and then get involved again after the first draft has gone through. Same with writing papers. My team's found it to be a very effective way for us to all excel in our separate ways. | I found meaning in life, and work is work . Jobs come and go , they can end from things not outside your control . Hobbies and what bring me joy is totally in my control which is why I seek it outside of my work. Sure I still want to do well at work and I’d like not hate or or find it boring, sometimes it’s interesting sometimes it’s paint dry boring but I specifically chose a post PhD career path that frowned upon to work overtime and has lots of vacation because I want to explore life outside of work. | 1 | 6,069 | 1.75 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw25w5c | gw2r922 | 1,619,537,063 | 1,619,546,014 | 2 | 7 | I’m sorry you’ve ended up feeling this way. I feel like it happens very often though. For me I did 4 years of a PhD in “geology” and left before finishing. This was after 2 years for a masters in it. It’s a long story, but I am so happy I went back to my biology degree bachelors roots and am now finishing up a one year post bachelors program to become a clinical laboratory scientist in a hospital lab setting. The job and pay will be more stable than anything I could have had before (especially with covid now as I would have been finishing my degree when all universities seemed to have a hiring hold). I also get to directly contribute to my society with meaningful work. The program I’m currently in has been one of the hardest things I’ve ever done, not just because they take the last two years of their traditional bachelors degree and shove it into 1, but my biology mindset needed a lot of refreshing at the beginning of the program with a ten year gap. I don’t regret it at all! I did not get along well with some of the graduate students I used to work with. I’m a bit of a passive person that wants good work flow and apparently telling someone to work with another student because the advisor said so means others will literally just give you the cold shoulder until you leave and yell at you when they find you alone in a room lol. I found people hated you when you did better than them too. The only people congratulating me on grants I received or big projects I got to work on were professors, then students would be jealous kids and hide your special weigh boats and things. But I also was finding things like a huge lack of lab understanding from every level in the academic world. My advisor never went into her own lab for years at a time, the other students from my university and others across the world typically didn’t know what running standards with your samples meant or why it was important, and it was a challenge to publish anything that didn’t follow a preset story. It was only getting worse, so I left. My field was one I don’t tell many about today because of the atmosphere on it all (pun intended) but it was stable isotopes with the purpose of using the produced records for climate models. All I can say is, do something you won’t go crazy in, or at least that you can find a good pay with so you can use your non work hours as fun. Get into a career line that values a good work life balance. Don’t stay and become more bitter. Hope this helps :) | Writing my thesis was one of the worst experiences of my life, and sent me into a pretty deep depression (someone on my committee even commented he could tell I hated writing, and it definitely wasn't my strong suit). I thought I was going to be in a lot of trouble for my future career, since anyone will tell you the bulk of your work will be writing. I'm now almost a decade into my career and am now sought after as a proof reader of papers/proposals. I write a lot a lot of my own stuff, but I've found ways to delegate the initial drafts to other people where I'm still...not great. I help with prewriting, blocking out the flow, etc, and then get involved again after the first draft has gone through. Same with writing papers. My team's found it to be a very effective way for us to all excel in our separate ways. | 0 | 8,951 | 3.5 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw27fa0 | gw201eq | 1,619,537,708 | 1,619,534,539 | 7 | 6 | You should go job hunting. First, just go to one of the big job sites and Google your degree or overall field (so anything from e.g. Neuroscience over Biology to STEM), then some specific skills you always liked to applying. Those can be specific like "microscopy" or broader soft skills. See what types of jobs come up. You could also try to check out alumni from your institution on LinkedIn to see where they went, although it can be hard to find those from the same department. After getting a first idea what you could even imagine to do, try to apply to jobs, get done interviews, "orientation days" done companies offer or if possible informal interviews with either alumni or any other contacts you can find. At that stage you don't necessarily expect to find a job but just dig deeper to see whether you might like a job. After finishing my PhD I thought I might like consulting for a company that covers a broad field of problems but attending their orientation day made it crystal clear to me that I would actually dislike that job. Otherwise r/LeavingAcademia is dedicated to that topic, although not huge has some nice insights every now and then. | Congratulations. I finished my Materials Science PhD in November 2019 and felt the exact same. It's a terrible time looking for a job right now and I'm doing some living-wage work in politics for a bit while I try to have a rethink about what I want to do next. | 1 | 3,169 | 1.166667 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw201eq | gw1x4ov | 1,619,534,539 | 1,619,533,269 | 6 | 5 | Congratulations. I finished my Materials Science PhD in November 2019 and felt the exact same. It's a terrible time looking for a job right now and I'm doing some living-wage work in politics for a bit while I try to have a rethink about what I want to do next. | What field are you in if I may ask? | 1 | 1,270 | 1.2 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw27fa0 | gw1x4ov | 1,619,537,708 | 1,619,533,269 | 7 | 5 | You should go job hunting. First, just go to one of the big job sites and Google your degree or overall field (so anything from e.g. Neuroscience over Biology to STEM), then some specific skills you always liked to applying. Those can be specific like "microscopy" or broader soft skills. See what types of jobs come up. You could also try to check out alumni from your institution on LinkedIn to see where they went, although it can be hard to find those from the same department. After getting a first idea what you could even imagine to do, try to apply to jobs, get done interviews, "orientation days" done companies offer or if possible informal interviews with either alumni or any other contacts you can find. At that stage you don't necessarily expect to find a job but just dig deeper to see whether you might like a job. After finishing my PhD I thought I might like consulting for a company that covers a broad field of problems but attending their orientation day made it crystal clear to me that I would actually dislike that job. Otherwise r/LeavingAcademia is dedicated to that topic, although not huge has some nice insights every now and then. | What field are you in if I may ask? | 1 | 4,439 | 1.4 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw25w5c | gw27fa0 | 1,619,537,063 | 1,619,537,708 | 2 | 7 | I’m sorry you’ve ended up feeling this way. I feel like it happens very often though. For me I did 4 years of a PhD in “geology” and left before finishing. This was after 2 years for a masters in it. It’s a long story, but I am so happy I went back to my biology degree bachelors roots and am now finishing up a one year post bachelors program to become a clinical laboratory scientist in a hospital lab setting. The job and pay will be more stable than anything I could have had before (especially with covid now as I would have been finishing my degree when all universities seemed to have a hiring hold). I also get to directly contribute to my society with meaningful work. The program I’m currently in has been one of the hardest things I’ve ever done, not just because they take the last two years of their traditional bachelors degree and shove it into 1, but my biology mindset needed a lot of refreshing at the beginning of the program with a ten year gap. I don’t regret it at all! I did not get along well with some of the graduate students I used to work with. I’m a bit of a passive person that wants good work flow and apparently telling someone to work with another student because the advisor said so means others will literally just give you the cold shoulder until you leave and yell at you when they find you alone in a room lol. I found people hated you when you did better than them too. The only people congratulating me on grants I received or big projects I got to work on were professors, then students would be jealous kids and hide your special weigh boats and things. But I also was finding things like a huge lack of lab understanding from every level in the academic world. My advisor never went into her own lab for years at a time, the other students from my university and others across the world typically didn’t know what running standards with your samples meant or why it was important, and it was a challenge to publish anything that didn’t follow a preset story. It was only getting worse, so I left. My field was one I don’t tell many about today because of the atmosphere on it all (pun intended) but it was stable isotopes with the purpose of using the produced records for climate models. All I can say is, do something you won’t go crazy in, or at least that you can find a good pay with so you can use your non work hours as fun. Get into a career line that values a good work life balance. Don’t stay and become more bitter. Hope this helps :) | You should go job hunting. First, just go to one of the big job sites and Google your degree or overall field (so anything from e.g. Neuroscience over Biology to STEM), then some specific skills you always liked to applying. Those can be specific like "microscopy" or broader soft skills. See what types of jobs come up. You could also try to check out alumni from your institution on LinkedIn to see where they went, although it can be hard to find those from the same department. After getting a first idea what you could even imagine to do, try to apply to jobs, get done interviews, "orientation days" done companies offer or if possible informal interviews with either alumni or any other contacts you can find. At that stage you don't necessarily expect to find a job but just dig deeper to see whether you might like a job. After finishing my PhD I thought I might like consulting for a company that covers a broad field of problems but attending their orientation day made it crystal clear to me that I would actually dislike that job. Otherwise r/LeavingAcademia is dedicated to that topic, although not huge has some nice insights every now and then. | 0 | 645 | 3.5 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw1x4ov | gw2vi0i | 1,619,533,269 | 1,619,547,796 | 5 | 6 | What field are you in if I may ask? | Congratulations. I moved to UX research after my PhD and I get paid so much more than I could ever imagine in academia. And the job pretty easy and much lower stress. There are loads of potential corporate careers and in corporate you will find highly organised processes, competent managers and friendly workplaces. It's really so much better. | 0 | 14,527 | 1.2 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw2cqoe | gw2vi0i | 1,619,539,945 | 1,619,547,796 | 4 | 6 | I found meaning in life, and work is work . Jobs come and go , they can end from things not outside your control . Hobbies and what bring me joy is totally in my control which is why I seek it outside of my work. Sure I still want to do well at work and I’d like not hate or or find it boring, sometimes it’s interesting sometimes it’s paint dry boring but I specifically chose a post PhD career path that frowned upon to work overtime and has lots of vacation because I want to explore life outside of work. | Congratulations. I moved to UX research after my PhD and I get paid so much more than I could ever imagine in academia. And the job pretty easy and much lower stress. There are loads of potential corporate careers and in corporate you will find highly organised processes, competent managers and friendly workplaces. It's really so much better. | 0 | 7,851 | 1.5 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw2vi0i | gw2suic | 1,619,547,796 | 1,619,546,685 | 6 | 4 | Congratulations. I moved to UX research after my PhD and I get paid so much more than I could ever imagine in academia. And the job pretty easy and much lower stress. There are loads of potential corporate careers and in corporate you will find highly organised processes, competent managers and friendly workplaces. It's really so much better. | I have a STEM PhD and was also disillusioned by academia. Look into Applications Scientist roles. Most of the biotech reagent and equipment providers have jobs with this title. You become an expert in a few instruments and/or workflows and you help researchers learn how their work could be improved with your stuff. After they buy it, you'll often go on site to help set it up and make sure it works in their experiments. And then you're a technical resource as customers continue to use your tools. Field Apps roles tend to travel 25-75%. I travel on the 25% in non-COVID times and I love it. I have had exposure to more high end research labs than I ever would have by focusing in one research area. I've been an invited SME at the CDC. I've been in labs at all the top pharma and research universities in the US and it's just so cool to see the exciting work people do, but not have to toil over the same project for years. I've learned the business side a bunch as well, so in the future I'd potentially like to move into future product marketing and new product development. | 1 | 1,111 | 1.5 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw2vi0i | gw25w5c | 1,619,547,796 | 1,619,537,063 | 6 | 2 | Congratulations. I moved to UX research after my PhD and I get paid so much more than I could ever imagine in academia. And the job pretty easy and much lower stress. There are loads of potential corporate careers and in corporate you will find highly organised processes, competent managers and friendly workplaces. It's really so much better. | I’m sorry you’ve ended up feeling this way. I feel like it happens very often though. For me I did 4 years of a PhD in “geology” and left before finishing. This was after 2 years for a masters in it. It’s a long story, but I am so happy I went back to my biology degree bachelors roots and am now finishing up a one year post bachelors program to become a clinical laboratory scientist in a hospital lab setting. The job and pay will be more stable than anything I could have had before (especially with covid now as I would have been finishing my degree when all universities seemed to have a hiring hold). I also get to directly contribute to my society with meaningful work. The program I’m currently in has been one of the hardest things I’ve ever done, not just because they take the last two years of their traditional bachelors degree and shove it into 1, but my biology mindset needed a lot of refreshing at the beginning of the program with a ten year gap. I don’t regret it at all! I did not get along well with some of the graduate students I used to work with. I’m a bit of a passive person that wants good work flow and apparently telling someone to work with another student because the advisor said so means others will literally just give you the cold shoulder until you leave and yell at you when they find you alone in a room lol. I found people hated you when you did better than them too. The only people congratulating me on grants I received or big projects I got to work on were professors, then students would be jealous kids and hide your special weigh boats and things. But I also was finding things like a huge lack of lab understanding from every level in the academic world. My advisor never went into her own lab for years at a time, the other students from my university and others across the world typically didn’t know what running standards with your samples meant or why it was important, and it was a challenge to publish anything that didn’t follow a preset story. It was only getting worse, so I left. My field was one I don’t tell many about today because of the atmosphere on it all (pun intended) but it was stable isotopes with the purpose of using the produced records for climate models. All I can say is, do something you won’t go crazy in, or at least that you can find a good pay with so you can use your non work hours as fun. Get into a career line that values a good work life balance. Don’t stay and become more bitter. Hope this helps :) | 1 | 10,733 | 3 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw2b23k | gw1x4ov | 1,619,539,233 | 1,619,533,269 | 6 | 5 | I think it's pretty common to be burnt out after writing and defending your dissertation. It's an exhausting process that's an odd and terrible synthesis of rite of passage, proof of academic excellence, and hazing. I've been sitting in my office reflecting on whether I feel any passion about my subject. I don't think I do. And honestly, I don't really care if i find meaning in my work. There are things I am working towards, publications in top tier journals, grants, and so on, like other academics. However, I am not doing it because I feel some deep sense of purpose or passion for my field. I'm doing it because I love the freedom of academia. That we get to choose how we spend our time as long as we make progress toward institutional goals. And those milestones only open up more avenues of freedom and choice for my time. And for me, my passion, love, and motivation all come from my family. And from my love of freedom to pursue an endeavor that I find interesting or noteworthy. | What field are you in if I may ask? | 1 | 5,964 | 1.2 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw25w5c | gw2b23k | 1,619,537,063 | 1,619,539,233 | 2 | 6 | I’m sorry you’ve ended up feeling this way. I feel like it happens very often though. For me I did 4 years of a PhD in “geology” and left before finishing. This was after 2 years for a masters in it. It’s a long story, but I am so happy I went back to my biology degree bachelors roots and am now finishing up a one year post bachelors program to become a clinical laboratory scientist in a hospital lab setting. The job and pay will be more stable than anything I could have had before (especially with covid now as I would have been finishing my degree when all universities seemed to have a hiring hold). I also get to directly contribute to my society with meaningful work. The program I’m currently in has been one of the hardest things I’ve ever done, not just because they take the last two years of their traditional bachelors degree and shove it into 1, but my biology mindset needed a lot of refreshing at the beginning of the program with a ten year gap. I don’t regret it at all! I did not get along well with some of the graduate students I used to work with. I’m a bit of a passive person that wants good work flow and apparently telling someone to work with another student because the advisor said so means others will literally just give you the cold shoulder until you leave and yell at you when they find you alone in a room lol. I found people hated you when you did better than them too. The only people congratulating me on grants I received or big projects I got to work on were professors, then students would be jealous kids and hide your special weigh boats and things. But I also was finding things like a huge lack of lab understanding from every level in the academic world. My advisor never went into her own lab for years at a time, the other students from my university and others across the world typically didn’t know what running standards with your samples meant or why it was important, and it was a challenge to publish anything that didn’t follow a preset story. It was only getting worse, so I left. My field was one I don’t tell many about today because of the atmosphere on it all (pun intended) but it was stable isotopes with the purpose of using the produced records for climate models. All I can say is, do something you won’t go crazy in, or at least that you can find a good pay with so you can use your non work hours as fun. Get into a career line that values a good work life balance. Don’t stay and become more bitter. Hope this helps :) | I think it's pretty common to be burnt out after writing and defending your dissertation. It's an exhausting process that's an odd and terrible synthesis of rite of passage, proof of academic excellence, and hazing. I've been sitting in my office reflecting on whether I feel any passion about my subject. I don't think I do. And honestly, I don't really care if i find meaning in my work. There are things I am working towards, publications in top tier journals, grants, and so on, like other academics. However, I am not doing it because I feel some deep sense of purpose or passion for my field. I'm doing it because I love the freedom of academia. That we get to choose how we spend our time as long as we make progress toward institutional goals. And those milestones only open up more avenues of freedom and choice for my time. And for me, my passion, love, and motivation all come from my family. And from my love of freedom to pursue an endeavor that I find interesting or noteworthy. | 0 | 2,170 | 3 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw2cqoe | gw38t8k | 1,619,539,945 | 1,619,553,377 | 4 | 5 | I found meaning in life, and work is work . Jobs come and go , they can end from things not outside your control . Hobbies and what bring me joy is totally in my control which is why I seek it outside of my work. Sure I still want to do well at work and I’d like not hate or or find it boring, sometimes it’s interesting sometimes it’s paint dry boring but I specifically chose a post PhD career path that frowned upon to work overtime and has lots of vacation because I want to explore life outside of work. | Heal the mental scar | 0 | 13,432 | 1.25 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw2suic | gw38t8k | 1,619,546,685 | 1,619,553,377 | 4 | 5 | I have a STEM PhD and was also disillusioned by academia. Look into Applications Scientist roles. Most of the biotech reagent and equipment providers have jobs with this title. You become an expert in a few instruments and/or workflows and you help researchers learn how their work could be improved with your stuff. After they buy it, you'll often go on site to help set it up and make sure it works in their experiments. And then you're a technical resource as customers continue to use your tools. Field Apps roles tend to travel 25-75%. I travel on the 25% in non-COVID times and I love it. I have had exposure to more high end research labs than I ever would have by focusing in one research area. I've been an invited SME at the CDC. I've been in labs at all the top pharma and research universities in the US and it's just so cool to see the exciting work people do, but not have to toil over the same project for years. I've learned the business side a bunch as well, so in the future I'd potentially like to move into future product marketing and new product development. | Heal the mental scar | 0 | 6,692 | 1.25 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw38t8k | gw25w5c | 1,619,553,377 | 1,619,537,063 | 5 | 2 | Heal the mental scar | I’m sorry you’ve ended up feeling this way. I feel like it happens very often though. For me I did 4 years of a PhD in “geology” and left before finishing. This was after 2 years for a masters in it. It’s a long story, but I am so happy I went back to my biology degree bachelors roots and am now finishing up a one year post bachelors program to become a clinical laboratory scientist in a hospital lab setting. The job and pay will be more stable than anything I could have had before (especially with covid now as I would have been finishing my degree when all universities seemed to have a hiring hold). I also get to directly contribute to my society with meaningful work. The program I’m currently in has been one of the hardest things I’ve ever done, not just because they take the last two years of their traditional bachelors degree and shove it into 1, but my biology mindset needed a lot of refreshing at the beginning of the program with a ten year gap. I don’t regret it at all! I did not get along well with some of the graduate students I used to work with. I’m a bit of a passive person that wants good work flow and apparently telling someone to work with another student because the advisor said so means others will literally just give you the cold shoulder until you leave and yell at you when they find you alone in a room lol. I found people hated you when you did better than them too. The only people congratulating me on grants I received or big projects I got to work on were professors, then students would be jealous kids and hide your special weigh boats and things. But I also was finding things like a huge lack of lab understanding from every level in the academic world. My advisor never went into her own lab for years at a time, the other students from my university and others across the world typically didn’t know what running standards with your samples meant or why it was important, and it was a challenge to publish anything that didn’t follow a preset story. It was only getting worse, so I left. My field was one I don’t tell many about today because of the atmosphere on it all (pun intended) but it was stable isotopes with the purpose of using the produced records for climate models. All I can say is, do something you won’t go crazy in, or at least that you can find a good pay with so you can use your non work hours as fun. Get into a career line that values a good work life balance. Don’t stay and become more bitter. Hope this helps :) | 1 | 16,314 | 2.5 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw38t8k | gw388cl | 1,619,553,377 | 1,619,553,137 | 5 | 2 | Heal the mental scar | Ph.D. in what? I need to know this before giving my opinion. | 1 | 240 | 2.5 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw25w5c | gw2cqoe | 1,619,537,063 | 1,619,539,945 | 2 | 4 | I’m sorry you’ve ended up feeling this way. I feel like it happens very often though. For me I did 4 years of a PhD in “geology” and left before finishing. This was after 2 years for a masters in it. It’s a long story, but I am so happy I went back to my biology degree bachelors roots and am now finishing up a one year post bachelors program to become a clinical laboratory scientist in a hospital lab setting. The job and pay will be more stable than anything I could have had before (especially with covid now as I would have been finishing my degree when all universities seemed to have a hiring hold). I also get to directly contribute to my society with meaningful work. The program I’m currently in has been one of the hardest things I’ve ever done, not just because they take the last two years of their traditional bachelors degree and shove it into 1, but my biology mindset needed a lot of refreshing at the beginning of the program with a ten year gap. I don’t regret it at all! I did not get along well with some of the graduate students I used to work with. I’m a bit of a passive person that wants good work flow and apparently telling someone to work with another student because the advisor said so means others will literally just give you the cold shoulder until you leave and yell at you when they find you alone in a room lol. I found people hated you when you did better than them too. The only people congratulating me on grants I received or big projects I got to work on were professors, then students would be jealous kids and hide your special weigh boats and things. But I also was finding things like a huge lack of lab understanding from every level in the academic world. My advisor never went into her own lab for years at a time, the other students from my university and others across the world typically didn’t know what running standards with your samples meant or why it was important, and it was a challenge to publish anything that didn’t follow a preset story. It was only getting worse, so I left. My field was one I don’t tell many about today because of the atmosphere on it all (pun intended) but it was stable isotopes with the purpose of using the produced records for climate models. All I can say is, do something you won’t go crazy in, or at least that you can find a good pay with so you can use your non work hours as fun. Get into a career line that values a good work life balance. Don’t stay and become more bitter. Hope this helps :) | I found meaning in life, and work is work . Jobs come and go , they can end from things not outside your control . Hobbies and what bring me joy is totally in my control which is why I seek it outside of my work. Sure I still want to do well at work and I’d like not hate or or find it boring, sometimes it’s interesting sometimes it’s paint dry boring but I specifically chose a post PhD career path that frowned upon to work overtime and has lots of vacation because I want to explore life outside of work. | 0 | 2,882 | 2 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw2suic | gw25w5c | 1,619,546,685 | 1,619,537,063 | 4 | 2 | I have a STEM PhD and was also disillusioned by academia. Look into Applications Scientist roles. Most of the biotech reagent and equipment providers have jobs with this title. You become an expert in a few instruments and/or workflows and you help researchers learn how their work could be improved with your stuff. After they buy it, you'll often go on site to help set it up and make sure it works in their experiments. And then you're a technical resource as customers continue to use your tools. Field Apps roles tend to travel 25-75%. I travel on the 25% in non-COVID times and I love it. I have had exposure to more high end research labs than I ever would have by focusing in one research area. I've been an invited SME at the CDC. I've been in labs at all the top pharma and research universities in the US and it's just so cool to see the exciting work people do, but not have to toil over the same project for years. I've learned the business side a bunch as well, so in the future I'd potentially like to move into future product marketing and new product development. | I’m sorry you’ve ended up feeling this way. I feel like it happens very often though. For me I did 4 years of a PhD in “geology” and left before finishing. This was after 2 years for a masters in it. It’s a long story, but I am so happy I went back to my biology degree bachelors roots and am now finishing up a one year post bachelors program to become a clinical laboratory scientist in a hospital lab setting. The job and pay will be more stable than anything I could have had before (especially with covid now as I would have been finishing my degree when all universities seemed to have a hiring hold). I also get to directly contribute to my society with meaningful work. The program I’m currently in has been one of the hardest things I’ve ever done, not just because they take the last two years of their traditional bachelors degree and shove it into 1, but my biology mindset needed a lot of refreshing at the beginning of the program with a ten year gap. I don’t regret it at all! I did not get along well with some of the graduate students I used to work with. I’m a bit of a passive person that wants good work flow and apparently telling someone to work with another student because the advisor said so means others will literally just give you the cold shoulder until you leave and yell at you when they find you alone in a room lol. I found people hated you when you did better than them too. The only people congratulating me on grants I received or big projects I got to work on were professors, then students would be jealous kids and hide your special weigh boats and things. But I also was finding things like a huge lack of lab understanding from every level in the academic world. My advisor never went into her own lab for years at a time, the other students from my university and others across the world typically didn’t know what running standards with your samples meant or why it was important, and it was a challenge to publish anything that didn’t follow a preset story. It was only getting worse, so I left. My field was one I don’t tell many about today because of the atmosphere on it all (pun intended) but it was stable isotopes with the purpose of using the produced records for climate models. All I can say is, do something you won’t go crazy in, or at least that you can find a good pay with so you can use your non work hours as fun. Get into a career line that values a good work life balance. Don’t stay and become more bitter. Hope this helps :) | 1 | 9,622 | 2 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw3v9di | gw25w5c | 1,619,563,455 | 1,619,537,063 | 3 | 2 | There are academic roles that don’t require publishing. Look for teaching faculty options | I’m sorry you’ve ended up feeling this way. I feel like it happens very often though. For me I did 4 years of a PhD in “geology” and left before finishing. This was after 2 years for a masters in it. It’s a long story, but I am so happy I went back to my biology degree bachelors roots and am now finishing up a one year post bachelors program to become a clinical laboratory scientist in a hospital lab setting. The job and pay will be more stable than anything I could have had before (especially with covid now as I would have been finishing my degree when all universities seemed to have a hiring hold). I also get to directly contribute to my society with meaningful work. The program I’m currently in has been one of the hardest things I’ve ever done, not just because they take the last two years of their traditional bachelors degree and shove it into 1, but my biology mindset needed a lot of refreshing at the beginning of the program with a ten year gap. I don’t regret it at all! I did not get along well with some of the graduate students I used to work with. I’m a bit of a passive person that wants good work flow and apparently telling someone to work with another student because the advisor said so means others will literally just give you the cold shoulder until you leave and yell at you when they find you alone in a room lol. I found people hated you when you did better than them too. The only people congratulating me on grants I received or big projects I got to work on were professors, then students would be jealous kids and hide your special weigh boats and things. But I also was finding things like a huge lack of lab understanding from every level in the academic world. My advisor never went into her own lab for years at a time, the other students from my university and others across the world typically didn’t know what running standards with your samples meant or why it was important, and it was a challenge to publish anything that didn’t follow a preset story. It was only getting worse, so I left. My field was one I don’t tell many about today because of the atmosphere on it all (pun intended) but it was stable isotopes with the purpose of using the produced records for climate models. All I can say is, do something you won’t go crazy in, or at least that you can find a good pay with so you can use your non work hours as fun. Get into a career line that values a good work life balance. Don’t stay and become more bitter. Hope this helps :) | 1 | 26,392 | 1.5 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw3v9di | gw388cl | 1,619,563,455 | 1,619,553,137 | 3 | 2 | There are academic roles that don’t require publishing. Look for teaching faculty options | Ph.D. in what? I need to know this before giving my opinion. | 1 | 10,318 | 1.5 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw3yddk | gw25w5c | 1,619,564,991 | 1,619,537,063 | 3 | 2 | I just wanted to say well done for finishing, sounds like it needed a lot of courage and grit and those are amazing traits. | I’m sorry you’ve ended up feeling this way. I feel like it happens very often though. For me I did 4 years of a PhD in “geology” and left before finishing. This was after 2 years for a masters in it. It’s a long story, but I am so happy I went back to my biology degree bachelors roots and am now finishing up a one year post bachelors program to become a clinical laboratory scientist in a hospital lab setting. The job and pay will be more stable than anything I could have had before (especially with covid now as I would have been finishing my degree when all universities seemed to have a hiring hold). I also get to directly contribute to my society with meaningful work. The program I’m currently in has been one of the hardest things I’ve ever done, not just because they take the last two years of their traditional bachelors degree and shove it into 1, but my biology mindset needed a lot of refreshing at the beginning of the program with a ten year gap. I don’t regret it at all! I did not get along well with some of the graduate students I used to work with. I’m a bit of a passive person that wants good work flow and apparently telling someone to work with another student because the advisor said so means others will literally just give you the cold shoulder until you leave and yell at you when they find you alone in a room lol. I found people hated you when you did better than them too. The only people congratulating me on grants I received or big projects I got to work on were professors, then students would be jealous kids and hide your special weigh boats and things. But I also was finding things like a huge lack of lab understanding from every level in the academic world. My advisor never went into her own lab for years at a time, the other students from my university and others across the world typically didn’t know what running standards with your samples meant or why it was important, and it was a challenge to publish anything that didn’t follow a preset story. It was only getting worse, so I left. My field was one I don’t tell many about today because of the atmosphere on it all (pun intended) but it was stable isotopes with the purpose of using the produced records for climate models. All I can say is, do something you won’t go crazy in, or at least that you can find a good pay with so you can use your non work hours as fun. Get into a career line that values a good work life balance. Don’t stay and become more bitter. Hope this helps :) | 1 | 27,928 | 1.5 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw388cl | gw3yddk | 1,619,553,137 | 1,619,564,991 | 2 | 3 | Ph.D. in what? I need to know this before giving my opinion. | I just wanted to say well done for finishing, sounds like it needed a lot of courage and grit and those are amazing traits. | 0 | 11,854 | 1.5 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw25w5c | gw4ow5l | 1,619,537,063 | 1,619,578,449 | 2 | 3 | I’m sorry you’ve ended up feeling this way. I feel like it happens very often though. For me I did 4 years of a PhD in “geology” and left before finishing. This was after 2 years for a masters in it. It’s a long story, but I am so happy I went back to my biology degree bachelors roots and am now finishing up a one year post bachelors program to become a clinical laboratory scientist in a hospital lab setting. The job and pay will be more stable than anything I could have had before (especially with covid now as I would have been finishing my degree when all universities seemed to have a hiring hold). I also get to directly contribute to my society with meaningful work. The program I’m currently in has been one of the hardest things I’ve ever done, not just because they take the last two years of their traditional bachelors degree and shove it into 1, but my biology mindset needed a lot of refreshing at the beginning of the program with a ten year gap. I don’t regret it at all! I did not get along well with some of the graduate students I used to work with. I’m a bit of a passive person that wants good work flow and apparently telling someone to work with another student because the advisor said so means others will literally just give you the cold shoulder until you leave and yell at you when they find you alone in a room lol. I found people hated you when you did better than them too. The only people congratulating me on grants I received or big projects I got to work on were professors, then students would be jealous kids and hide your special weigh boats and things. But I also was finding things like a huge lack of lab understanding from every level in the academic world. My advisor never went into her own lab for years at a time, the other students from my university and others across the world typically didn’t know what running standards with your samples meant or why it was important, and it was a challenge to publish anything that didn’t follow a preset story. It was only getting worse, so I left. My field was one I don’t tell many about today because of the atmosphere on it all (pun intended) but it was stable isotopes with the purpose of using the produced records for climate models. All I can say is, do something you won’t go crazy in, or at least that you can find a good pay with so you can use your non work hours as fun. Get into a career line that values a good work life balance. Don’t stay and become more bitter. Hope this helps :) | This webinar helped me a lot with writing: https://www.digitalhealthcrc.com/writing/ | 0 | 41,386 | 1.5 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw4ow5l | gw388cl | 1,619,578,449 | 1,619,553,137 | 3 | 2 | This webinar helped me a lot with writing: https://www.digitalhealthcrc.com/writing/ | Ph.D. in what? I need to know this before giving my opinion. | 1 | 25,312 | 1.5 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw4e73b | gw4ow5l | 1,619,572,925 | 1,619,578,449 | 2 | 3 | I have this fear even though I’m still in undergrad. I keep trying to see ahead and all I can see is ^ this. It’s so scary and it makes really hard to stay motivated. | This webinar helped me a lot with writing: https://www.digitalhealthcrc.com/writing/ | 0 | 5,524 | 1.5 |
mzo1du | askacademia_train | 0.97 | Just got my PhD. Now what? It all feels less spectacular than it should. I loved my field when I decided to pursue a PhD. And then I started getting worn out. I dropped out because I was having too much trouble working with other graduate students. I found a job in the field, and seeing how my profession works in practice killed any last passion I had remaining for the subject. I ended up losing my job during the pandemic and decided to finish my degree. It was the easiest option, and an option that meant I could stay at home. The passion never came back, but I was able to finish writing and defend my dissertation. So, now what? I'm working for my advisor and will do so for the next couple of months. I hate every minute of it. Doing anything feels like a hassle. The thing I hate doing most is *writing*, which is not a good omen for a future academic career. I can't imagine doing this for the rest of my life. I feel trapped. I know I can't be the only person who's gone through this. How did you pivot to something else? How do you find meaning in your work? | gw4lpum | gw4ow5l | 1,619,576,732 | 1,619,578,449 | 2 | 3 | I felt the same way when I finished. Totally confused, disappointed in how anticlimactic the ending of my PhD was. It took me a year of being miserable in a postdoc to get out and pursue another path - although it was terrifying at the time. I never thought I'd be able to get the position I did, but perseverance prevailed, and I couldn't be happier. And as some others have said - I love my job, but I love it mostly because it allows me a work-life balance I never had in academia. I can't give you a suggestion on what to look into, as I went into medical writing which is exactly what you said you hated, but know that opportunities are out there and you don't have to settle with being miserable. Best of luck :) | This webinar helped me a lot with writing: https://www.digitalhealthcrc.com/writing/ | 0 | 1,717 | 1.5 |
jeubny | askacademia_train | 0.98 | I just saw an advertisement embedded as the first page of a journal article PDF 😡 This made me grumpy. The journal is not an open access so my institution gets to pay for the pleasure of me seeing ads. Thanks Wiley! | g9hyj86 | g9iqn9t | 1,603,244,102 | 1,603,265,076 | 7 | 9 | One of my journal articles (also not open access) had one but at the end. Journals, eh? *glowers* | I've never seen this inside the PDFs of a single paper. But in journals or in websites often. Especially if they're relevant and inoffensive like the one you mention (for a scientific conference!!) I don't see any issue. | 0 | 20,974 | 1.285714 |
jeubny | askacademia_train | 0.98 | I just saw an advertisement embedded as the first page of a journal article PDF 😡 This made me grumpy. The journal is not an open access so my institution gets to pay for the pleasure of me seeing ads. Thanks Wiley! | g9iqn9t | g9hne99 | 1,603,265,076 | 1,603,237,772 | 9 | 5 | I've never seen this inside the PDFs of a single paper. But in journals or in websites often. Especially if they're relevant and inoffensive like the one you mention (for a scientific conference!!) I don't see any issue. | Wow they’re getting creative | 1 | 27,304 | 1.8 |
jeubny | askacademia_train | 0.98 | I just saw an advertisement embedded as the first page of a journal article PDF 😡 This made me grumpy. The journal is not an open access so my institution gets to pay for the pleasure of me seeing ads. Thanks Wiley! | g9iqn9t | g9ia495 | 1,603,265,076 | 1,603,251,205 | 9 | 3 | I've never seen this inside the PDFs of a single paper. But in journals or in websites often. Especially if they're relevant and inoffensive like the one you mention (for a scientific conference!!) I don't see any issue. | AIP journals do it all the time - the first page of *Applied Physics Letters* is an ad too. | 1 | 13,871 | 3 |
jeubny | askacademia_train | 0.98 | I just saw an advertisement embedded as the first page of a journal article PDF 😡 This made me grumpy. The journal is not an open access so my institution gets to pay for the pleasure of me seeing ads. Thanks Wiley! | g9hne99 | g9hyj86 | 1,603,237,772 | 1,603,244,102 | 5 | 7 | Wow they’re getting creative | One of my journal articles (also not open access) had one but at the end. Journals, eh? *glowers* | 0 | 6,330 | 1.4 |
qw9xrs | askacademia_train | 0.98 | TA dealing with a condescending student Hi all, Have any of you had to deal with a condescending student? How did you deal with it (or did you?)? I (30F) have a student (19M) this semester who emails me frequently with questions that have always seemed to insinuate that I didn't know what I was talking about. But I assumed I was being oversensitive or paranoid, so I have always answered him promptly and cheerfully. However, today, the student got in a long back and forth with me (over email) about a basic statistical analysis in which he is FULLY incorrect, but has continued doubling down no matter what I say (or how many resources I send him). Finally he wrote back something along the lines of "fine I still think it means xyz but I guess I just won't include how we got our results." To be clear, he literally added a new statistical test that is not part of the assignment, and makes no sense with the data. The last email especially was honestly very rude, and I'm not sure how to proceed. I'm leaning towards just leaving it alone, since he apparently cares so much about having the last word, but I'm worried about grading his final paper if he continues to double down on this. Has anyone else encountered something like this, and what did you do? | hl1liyu | hl1vofm | 1,637,187,204 | 1,637,191,569 | 117 | 184 | This is not terribly unusual and, sadly, seems to happen much more often to women. The solution is not to argue with them. Tell them that they are wrong in as helpful a way as possible, but once you have stated it clearly and it is obvious that they are not listening to you, let them go off and do whatever they are going to do. In particular, there is zero need for you to argue with them. You don't need to win an argument with them and you don't need to prove anything to them. You are right, you explained it to them, and their mind is closed. Your duty is complete at that point. Now just wait for them to submit garbage and give it the grade it deserves. When they complain, explain to them (and whoever else they complain to) that you tried your best to explain the problem to them, but they were too busy mansplaining to listen to you (don't use that word, though--just explain what happened). | I've encountered students like this in the past, and I honestly email my supervisor with a heads up and then forward the email chain or BCC them so they'll have it for documentation. I'd recommend this as a CYA move regardless. I had a student a about 3 years ago that I caught plagiarizing. I emailed my direct supervisor about it the night before I returned papers. When the student questioned me on it, he became so hostile that he tried to corner me so I couldn't leave, then demanded to follow me to my next class. When I refused, he went immediately the department chair and told him that I'd failed him on "common knowledge." (It was a straight copy and paste from the internet.) By the time I came out of my next class, I already had an email and a missed call telling me I needed to see the department chair. If I hadn't already given my direct supervisor a heads up, there would have been an issue. If there's a potential problem, ALWAYS CYA and let your supervisor know. | 0 | 4,365 | 1.57265 |
qw9xrs | askacademia_train | 0.98 | TA dealing with a condescending student Hi all, Have any of you had to deal with a condescending student? How did you deal with it (or did you?)? I (30F) have a student (19M) this semester who emails me frequently with questions that have always seemed to insinuate that I didn't know what I was talking about. But I assumed I was being oversensitive or paranoid, so I have always answered him promptly and cheerfully. However, today, the student got in a long back and forth with me (over email) about a basic statistical analysis in which he is FULLY incorrect, but has continued doubling down no matter what I say (or how many resources I send him). Finally he wrote back something along the lines of "fine I still think it means xyz but I guess I just won't include how we got our results." To be clear, he literally added a new statistical test that is not part of the assignment, and makes no sense with the data. The last email especially was honestly very rude, and I'm not sure how to proceed. I'm leaning towards just leaving it alone, since he apparently cares so much about having the last word, but I'm worried about grading his final paper if he continues to double down on this. Has anyone else encountered something like this, and what did you do? | hl1vofm | hl1mgvc | 1,637,191,569 | 1,637,187,602 | 184 | 112 | I've encountered students like this in the past, and I honestly email my supervisor with a heads up and then forward the email chain or BCC them so they'll have it for documentation. I'd recommend this as a CYA move regardless. I had a student a about 3 years ago that I caught plagiarizing. I emailed my direct supervisor about it the night before I returned papers. When the student questioned me on it, he became so hostile that he tried to corner me so I couldn't leave, then demanded to follow me to my next class. When I refused, he went immediately the department chair and told him that I'd failed him on "common knowledge." (It was a straight copy and paste from the internet.) By the time I came out of my next class, I already had an email and a missed call telling me I needed to see the department chair. If I hadn't already given my direct supervisor a heads up, there would have been an issue. If there's a potential problem, ALWAYS CYA and let your supervisor know. | State your point and do your job, but you do not need to engage in long debates with arrogant and incorrect students. If they continue this respond to their question politely and succinctly. If they continue to be rude, you can speak to your professor. And you can grade his homework taking off for his mistakes. | 1 | 3,967 | 1.642857 |
qw9xrs | askacademia_train | 0.98 | TA dealing with a condescending student Hi all, Have any of you had to deal with a condescending student? How did you deal with it (or did you?)? I (30F) have a student (19M) this semester who emails me frequently with questions that have always seemed to insinuate that I didn't know what I was talking about. But I assumed I was being oversensitive or paranoid, so I have always answered him promptly and cheerfully. However, today, the student got in a long back and forth with me (over email) about a basic statistical analysis in which he is FULLY incorrect, but has continued doubling down no matter what I say (or how many resources I send him). Finally he wrote back something along the lines of "fine I still think it means xyz but I guess I just won't include how we got our results." To be clear, he literally added a new statistical test that is not part of the assignment, and makes no sense with the data. The last email especially was honestly very rude, and I'm not sure how to proceed. I'm leaning towards just leaving it alone, since he apparently cares so much about having the last word, but I'm worried about grading his final paper if he continues to double down on this. Has anyone else encountered something like this, and what did you do? | hl1vofm | hl1kwzx | 1,637,191,569 | 1,637,186,945 | 184 | 82 | I've encountered students like this in the past, and I honestly email my supervisor with a heads up and then forward the email chain or BCC them so they'll have it for documentation. I'd recommend this as a CYA move regardless. I had a student a about 3 years ago that I caught plagiarizing. I emailed my direct supervisor about it the night before I returned papers. When the student questioned me on it, he became so hostile that he tried to corner me so I couldn't leave, then demanded to follow me to my next class. When I refused, he went immediately the department chair and told him that I'd failed him on "common knowledge." (It was a straight copy and paste from the internet.) By the time I came out of my next class, I already had an email and a missed call telling me I needed to see the department chair. If I hadn't already given my direct supervisor a heads up, there would have been an issue. If there's a potential problem, ALWAYS CYA and let your supervisor know. | I generally see back and forth engagement over email is a waste of time. That said, leave it alone, grade his paper, and if he complains tell him that you have no intention of changing it because it was graded correctly and fairly. If he persists just end the conversation by telling him that he’s welcome to appeal his grade. Let the professor know that this particular student is stubborn and ignorant so he/she won’t be surprised when the student emails them to complain about you. Sadly you should also expect a poor evaluation, but that’s better than wasting time on someone who refuses to learn from you. | 1 | 4,624 | 2.243902 |
qw9xrs | askacademia_train | 0.98 | TA dealing with a condescending student Hi all, Have any of you had to deal with a condescending student? How did you deal with it (or did you?)? I (30F) have a student (19M) this semester who emails me frequently with questions that have always seemed to insinuate that I didn't know what I was talking about. But I assumed I was being oversensitive or paranoid, so I have always answered him promptly and cheerfully. However, today, the student got in a long back and forth with me (over email) about a basic statistical analysis in which he is FULLY incorrect, but has continued doubling down no matter what I say (or how many resources I send him). Finally he wrote back something along the lines of "fine I still think it means xyz but I guess I just won't include how we got our results." To be clear, he literally added a new statistical test that is not part of the assignment, and makes no sense with the data. The last email especially was honestly very rude, and I'm not sure how to proceed. I'm leaning towards just leaving it alone, since he apparently cares so much about having the last word, but I'm worried about grading his final paper if he continues to double down on this. Has anyone else encountered something like this, and what did you do? | hl1u67u | hl1vofm | 1,637,190,903 | 1,637,191,569 | 40 | 184 | If I am working with someone passive aggressive I parse their sentences into explicit and implicit comments, things that they wish to be noted, tasks for me and questions. I just break it al down and say what I agree with or disagree with. Like robotically candid. Including, “I sense you are implying that x; I believe not x. Unless this is an urgent or very serious question I do not wish to discuss it further.” Just get all the bullshit in the open and refute it. You mark him. | I've encountered students like this in the past, and I honestly email my supervisor with a heads up and then forward the email chain or BCC them so they'll have it for documentation. I'd recommend this as a CYA move regardless. I had a student a about 3 years ago that I caught plagiarizing. I emailed my direct supervisor about it the night before I returned papers. When the student questioned me on it, he became so hostile that he tried to corner me so I couldn't leave, then demanded to follow me to my next class. When I refused, he went immediately the department chair and told him that I'd failed him on "common knowledge." (It was a straight copy and paste from the internet.) By the time I came out of my next class, I already had an email and a missed call telling me I needed to see the department chair. If I hadn't already given my direct supervisor a heads up, there would have been an issue. If there's a potential problem, ALWAYS CYA and let your supervisor know. | 0 | 666 | 4.6 |
qw9xrs | askacademia_train | 0.98 | TA dealing with a condescending student Hi all, Have any of you had to deal with a condescending student? How did you deal with it (or did you?)? I (30F) have a student (19M) this semester who emails me frequently with questions that have always seemed to insinuate that I didn't know what I was talking about. But I assumed I was being oversensitive or paranoid, so I have always answered him promptly and cheerfully. However, today, the student got in a long back and forth with me (over email) about a basic statistical analysis in which he is FULLY incorrect, but has continued doubling down no matter what I say (or how many resources I send him). Finally he wrote back something along the lines of "fine I still think it means xyz but I guess I just won't include how we got our results." To be clear, he literally added a new statistical test that is not part of the assignment, and makes no sense with the data. The last email especially was honestly very rude, and I'm not sure how to proceed. I'm leaning towards just leaving it alone, since he apparently cares so much about having the last word, but I'm worried about grading his final paper if he continues to double down on this. Has anyone else encountered something like this, and what did you do? | hl1vofm | hl1t917 | 1,637,191,569 | 1,637,190,496 | 184 | 27 | I've encountered students like this in the past, and I honestly email my supervisor with a heads up and then forward the email chain or BCC them so they'll have it for documentation. I'd recommend this as a CYA move regardless. I had a student a about 3 years ago that I caught plagiarizing. I emailed my direct supervisor about it the night before I returned papers. When the student questioned me on it, he became so hostile that he tried to corner me so I couldn't leave, then demanded to follow me to my next class. When I refused, he went immediately the department chair and told him that I'd failed him on "common knowledge." (It was a straight copy and paste from the internet.) By the time I came out of my next class, I already had an email and a missed call telling me I needed to see the department chair. If I hadn't already given my direct supervisor a heads up, there would have been an issue. If there's a potential problem, ALWAYS CYA and let your supervisor know. | I deal with it by treating them like they're insecure and need a lot of reassurance (which is generally the case), and also by refusing to engage if they decide they want to argue. Don't get sucked into long back-and-forths with a student who just wants to argue - it's fine to ignore emails that don't contain a question. It's also fine to ignore every part of an email but the questions. If he doubles down on it, pass him along to the professor of record for the class, and let them deal with him. It's probably wise to forward the whole exchange to the professor in advance, to let them know this is going on and that they might have to deal with it. | 1 | 1,073 | 6.814815 |
qw9xrs | askacademia_train | 0.98 | TA dealing with a condescending student Hi all, Have any of you had to deal with a condescending student? How did you deal with it (or did you?)? I (30F) have a student (19M) this semester who emails me frequently with questions that have always seemed to insinuate that I didn't know what I was talking about. But I assumed I was being oversensitive or paranoid, so I have always answered him promptly and cheerfully. However, today, the student got in a long back and forth with me (over email) about a basic statistical analysis in which he is FULLY incorrect, but has continued doubling down no matter what I say (or how many resources I send him). Finally he wrote back something along the lines of "fine I still think it means xyz but I guess I just won't include how we got our results." To be clear, he literally added a new statistical test that is not part of the assignment, and makes no sense with the data. The last email especially was honestly very rude, and I'm not sure how to proceed. I'm leaning towards just leaving it alone, since he apparently cares so much about having the last word, but I'm worried about grading his final paper if he continues to double down on this. Has anyone else encountered something like this, and what did you do? | hl1vofm | hl1uq43 | 1,637,191,569 | 1,637,191,146 | 184 | 17 | I've encountered students like this in the past, and I honestly email my supervisor with a heads up and then forward the email chain or BCC them so they'll have it for documentation. I'd recommend this as a CYA move regardless. I had a student a about 3 years ago that I caught plagiarizing. I emailed my direct supervisor about it the night before I returned papers. When the student questioned me on it, he became so hostile that he tried to corner me so I couldn't leave, then demanded to follow me to my next class. When I refused, he went immediately the department chair and told him that I'd failed him on "common knowledge." (It was a straight copy and paste from the internet.) By the time I came out of my next class, I already had an email and a missed call telling me I needed to see the department chair. If I hadn't already given my direct supervisor a heads up, there would have been an issue. If there's a potential problem, ALWAYS CYA and let your supervisor know. | Kill him with kindness, but at a certain point you just give him the tools and enough rope to hang from and leave it at that. He can choose what to do with the rope. You could, this time, dedicate a portion of class to reminding the students why we use the analyses we use for different situations. You could also ask if his major is stats. If it is. Good luck, I have met a few who dont understand that in many applied fields we have very noisy data and must do things to deal with that. The only thing I have to add is that, if you want to bring up him being rude to you via email as a learning opportunity you can phrase it to come from a place of concern. I.e.: "Hey is everything ok? The tone of your email came off like you were pretty stressed. You cant get any body language across, so it might help you to choose your words more carefully in that format. Otherwise people may think things are not OK." | 1 | 423 | 10.823529 |
qw9xrs | askacademia_train | 0.98 | TA dealing with a condescending student Hi all, Have any of you had to deal with a condescending student? How did you deal with it (or did you?)? I (30F) have a student (19M) this semester who emails me frequently with questions that have always seemed to insinuate that I didn't know what I was talking about. But I assumed I was being oversensitive or paranoid, so I have always answered him promptly and cheerfully. However, today, the student got in a long back and forth with me (over email) about a basic statistical analysis in which he is FULLY incorrect, but has continued doubling down no matter what I say (or how many resources I send him). Finally he wrote back something along the lines of "fine I still think it means xyz but I guess I just won't include how we got our results." To be clear, he literally added a new statistical test that is not part of the assignment, and makes no sense with the data. The last email especially was honestly very rude, and I'm not sure how to proceed. I'm leaning towards just leaving it alone, since he apparently cares so much about having the last word, but I'm worried about grading his final paper if he continues to double down on this. Has anyone else encountered something like this, and what did you do? | hl1vofm | hl1lttv | 1,637,191,569 | 1,637,187,332 | 184 | 9 | I've encountered students like this in the past, and I honestly email my supervisor with a heads up and then forward the email chain or BCC them so they'll have it for documentation. I'd recommend this as a CYA move regardless. I had a student a about 3 years ago that I caught plagiarizing. I emailed my direct supervisor about it the night before I returned papers. When the student questioned me on it, he became so hostile that he tried to corner me so I couldn't leave, then demanded to follow me to my next class. When I refused, he went immediately the department chair and told him that I'd failed him on "common knowledge." (It was a straight copy and paste from the internet.) By the time I came out of my next class, I already had an email and a missed call telling me I needed to see the department chair. If I hadn't already given my direct supervisor a heads up, there would have been an issue. If there's a potential problem, ALWAYS CYA and let your supervisor know. | I think the biggest mistake here is pressing the 'reply' button. I've had a student looking for a MSc project supervisor. He wad quite open about being very picky about it. I told him straight about his attitude and the reason he's in the uni. Never seen him again. | 1 | 4,237 | 20.444444 |
qw9xrs | askacademia_train | 0.98 | TA dealing with a condescending student Hi all, Have any of you had to deal with a condescending student? How did you deal with it (or did you?)? I (30F) have a student (19M) this semester who emails me frequently with questions that have always seemed to insinuate that I didn't know what I was talking about. But I assumed I was being oversensitive or paranoid, so I have always answered him promptly and cheerfully. However, today, the student got in a long back and forth with me (over email) about a basic statistical analysis in which he is FULLY incorrect, but has continued doubling down no matter what I say (or how many resources I send him). Finally he wrote back something along the lines of "fine I still think it means xyz but I guess I just won't include how we got our results." To be clear, he literally added a new statistical test that is not part of the assignment, and makes no sense with the data. The last email especially was honestly very rude, and I'm not sure how to proceed. I'm leaning towards just leaving it alone, since he apparently cares so much about having the last word, but I'm worried about grading his final paper if he continues to double down on this. Has anyone else encountered something like this, and what did you do? | hl1vofm | hl1nfyp | 1,637,191,569 | 1,637,188,012 | 184 | 9 | I've encountered students like this in the past, and I honestly email my supervisor with a heads up and then forward the email chain or BCC them so they'll have it for documentation. I'd recommend this as a CYA move regardless. I had a student a about 3 years ago that I caught plagiarizing. I emailed my direct supervisor about it the night before I returned papers. When the student questioned me on it, he became so hostile that he tried to corner me so I couldn't leave, then demanded to follow me to my next class. When I refused, he went immediately the department chair and told him that I'd failed him on "common knowledge." (It was a straight copy and paste from the internet.) By the time I came out of my next class, I already had an email and a missed call telling me I needed to see the department chair. If I hadn't already given my direct supervisor a heads up, there would have been an issue. If there's a potential problem, ALWAYS CYA and let your supervisor know. | Do you need to reply emails? I worked as a TA, I didn't contact any students out of office hours. If he had questions he should have asked during the class period. I wouldn't put so much effort onto that and I agree I would just grade their quizzes, assignments etc. Don't be too helpful, I get where you are coming from but that's so draining and they would take you as granted, some wouldnt even respect you because you're very available and friendly (sad but true) | 1 | 3,557 | 20.444444 |
qw9xrs | askacademia_train | 0.98 | TA dealing with a condescending student Hi all, Have any of you had to deal with a condescending student? How did you deal with it (or did you?)? I (30F) have a student (19M) this semester who emails me frequently with questions that have always seemed to insinuate that I didn't know what I was talking about. But I assumed I was being oversensitive or paranoid, so I have always answered him promptly and cheerfully. However, today, the student got in a long back and forth with me (over email) about a basic statistical analysis in which he is FULLY incorrect, but has continued doubling down no matter what I say (or how many resources I send him). Finally he wrote back something along the lines of "fine I still think it means xyz but I guess I just won't include how we got our results." To be clear, he literally added a new statistical test that is not part of the assignment, and makes no sense with the data. The last email especially was honestly very rude, and I'm not sure how to proceed. I'm leaning towards just leaving it alone, since he apparently cares so much about having the last word, but I'm worried about grading his final paper if he continues to double down on this. Has anyone else encountered something like this, and what did you do? | hl1vofm | hl1rph4 | 1,637,191,569 | 1,637,189,834 | 184 | 9 | I've encountered students like this in the past, and I honestly email my supervisor with a heads up and then forward the email chain or BCC them so they'll have it for documentation. I'd recommend this as a CYA move regardless. I had a student a about 3 years ago that I caught plagiarizing. I emailed my direct supervisor about it the night before I returned papers. When the student questioned me on it, he became so hostile that he tried to corner me so I couldn't leave, then demanded to follow me to my next class. When I refused, he went immediately the department chair and told him that I'd failed him on "common knowledge." (It was a straight copy and paste from the internet.) By the time I came out of my next class, I already had an email and a missed call telling me I needed to see the department chair. If I hadn't already given my direct supervisor a heads up, there would have been an issue. If there's a potential problem, ALWAYS CYA and let your supervisor know. | What a dummy that kid is. Ignore him, and mark him down (fairly and) accordingly. Sorry that you’re dealing with this, by the way. | 1 | 1,735 | 20.444444 |
qw9xrs | askacademia_train | 0.98 | TA dealing with a condescending student Hi all, Have any of you had to deal with a condescending student? How did you deal with it (or did you?)? I (30F) have a student (19M) this semester who emails me frequently with questions that have always seemed to insinuate that I didn't know what I was talking about. But I assumed I was being oversensitive or paranoid, so I have always answered him promptly and cheerfully. However, today, the student got in a long back and forth with me (over email) about a basic statistical analysis in which he is FULLY incorrect, but has continued doubling down no matter what I say (or how many resources I send him). Finally he wrote back something along the lines of "fine I still think it means xyz but I guess I just won't include how we got our results." To be clear, he literally added a new statistical test that is not part of the assignment, and makes no sense with the data. The last email especially was honestly very rude, and I'm not sure how to proceed. I'm leaning towards just leaving it alone, since he apparently cares so much about having the last word, but I'm worried about grading his final paper if he continues to double down on this. Has anyone else encountered something like this, and what did you do? | hl1liyu | hl1kwzx | 1,637,187,204 | 1,637,186,945 | 117 | 82 | This is not terribly unusual and, sadly, seems to happen much more often to women. The solution is not to argue with them. Tell them that they are wrong in as helpful a way as possible, but once you have stated it clearly and it is obvious that they are not listening to you, let them go off and do whatever they are going to do. In particular, there is zero need for you to argue with them. You don't need to win an argument with them and you don't need to prove anything to them. You are right, you explained it to them, and their mind is closed. Your duty is complete at that point. Now just wait for them to submit garbage and give it the grade it deserves. When they complain, explain to them (and whoever else they complain to) that you tried your best to explain the problem to them, but they were too busy mansplaining to listen to you (don't use that word, though--just explain what happened). | I generally see back and forth engagement over email is a waste of time. That said, leave it alone, grade his paper, and if he complains tell him that you have no intention of changing it because it was graded correctly and fairly. If he persists just end the conversation by telling him that he’s welcome to appeal his grade. Let the professor know that this particular student is stubborn and ignorant so he/she won’t be surprised when the student emails them to complain about you. Sadly you should also expect a poor evaluation, but that’s better than wasting time on someone who refuses to learn from you. | 1 | 259 | 1.426829 |
qw9xrs | askacademia_train | 0.98 | TA dealing with a condescending student Hi all, Have any of you had to deal with a condescending student? How did you deal with it (or did you?)? I (30F) have a student (19M) this semester who emails me frequently with questions that have always seemed to insinuate that I didn't know what I was talking about. But I assumed I was being oversensitive or paranoid, so I have always answered him promptly and cheerfully. However, today, the student got in a long back and forth with me (over email) about a basic statistical analysis in which he is FULLY incorrect, but has continued doubling down no matter what I say (or how many resources I send him). Finally he wrote back something along the lines of "fine I still think it means xyz but I guess I just won't include how we got our results." To be clear, he literally added a new statistical test that is not part of the assignment, and makes no sense with the data. The last email especially was honestly very rude, and I'm not sure how to proceed. I'm leaning towards just leaving it alone, since he apparently cares so much about having the last word, but I'm worried about grading his final paper if he continues to double down on this. Has anyone else encountered something like this, and what did you do? | hl1kwzx | hl1mgvc | 1,637,186,945 | 1,637,187,602 | 82 | 112 | I generally see back and forth engagement over email is a waste of time. That said, leave it alone, grade his paper, and if he complains tell him that you have no intention of changing it because it was graded correctly and fairly. If he persists just end the conversation by telling him that he’s welcome to appeal his grade. Let the professor know that this particular student is stubborn and ignorant so he/she won’t be surprised when the student emails them to complain about you. Sadly you should also expect a poor evaluation, but that’s better than wasting time on someone who refuses to learn from you. | State your point and do your job, but you do not need to engage in long debates with arrogant and incorrect students. If they continue this respond to their question politely and succinctly. If they continue to be rude, you can speak to your professor. And you can grade his homework taking off for his mistakes. | 0 | 657 | 1.365854 |
qw9xrs | askacademia_train | 0.98 | TA dealing with a condescending student Hi all, Have any of you had to deal with a condescending student? How did you deal with it (or did you?)? I (30F) have a student (19M) this semester who emails me frequently with questions that have always seemed to insinuate that I didn't know what I was talking about. But I assumed I was being oversensitive or paranoid, so I have always answered him promptly and cheerfully. However, today, the student got in a long back and forth with me (over email) about a basic statistical analysis in which he is FULLY incorrect, but has continued doubling down no matter what I say (or how many resources I send him). Finally he wrote back something along the lines of "fine I still think it means xyz but I guess I just won't include how we got our results." To be clear, he literally added a new statistical test that is not part of the assignment, and makes no sense with the data. The last email especially was honestly very rude, and I'm not sure how to proceed. I'm leaning towards just leaving it alone, since he apparently cares so much about having the last word, but I'm worried about grading his final paper if he continues to double down on this. Has anyone else encountered something like this, and what did you do? | hl1lttv | hl1mgvc | 1,637,187,332 | 1,637,187,602 | 9 | 112 | I think the biggest mistake here is pressing the 'reply' button. I've had a student looking for a MSc project supervisor. He wad quite open about being very picky about it. I told him straight about his attitude and the reason he's in the uni. Never seen him again. | State your point and do your job, but you do not need to engage in long debates with arrogant and incorrect students. If they continue this respond to their question politely and succinctly. If they continue to be rude, you can speak to your professor. And you can grade his homework taking off for his mistakes. | 0 | 270 | 12.444444 |
qw9xrs | askacademia_train | 0.98 | TA dealing with a condescending student Hi all, Have any of you had to deal with a condescending student? How did you deal with it (or did you?)? I (30F) have a student (19M) this semester who emails me frequently with questions that have always seemed to insinuate that I didn't know what I was talking about. But I assumed I was being oversensitive or paranoid, so I have always answered him promptly and cheerfully. However, today, the student got in a long back and forth with me (over email) about a basic statistical analysis in which he is FULLY incorrect, but has continued doubling down no matter what I say (or how many resources I send him). Finally he wrote back something along the lines of "fine I still think it means xyz but I guess I just won't include how we got our results." To be clear, he literally added a new statistical test that is not part of the assignment, and makes no sense with the data. The last email especially was honestly very rude, and I'm not sure how to proceed. I'm leaning towards just leaving it alone, since he apparently cares so much about having the last word, but I'm worried about grading his final paper if he continues to double down on this. Has anyone else encountered something like this, and what did you do? | hl1t917 | hl1u67u | 1,637,190,496 | 1,637,190,903 | 27 | 40 | I deal with it by treating them like they're insecure and need a lot of reassurance (which is generally the case), and also by refusing to engage if they decide they want to argue. Don't get sucked into long back-and-forths with a student who just wants to argue - it's fine to ignore emails that don't contain a question. It's also fine to ignore every part of an email but the questions. If he doubles down on it, pass him along to the professor of record for the class, and let them deal with him. It's probably wise to forward the whole exchange to the professor in advance, to let them know this is going on and that they might have to deal with it. | If I am working with someone passive aggressive I parse their sentences into explicit and implicit comments, things that they wish to be noted, tasks for me and questions. I just break it al down and say what I agree with or disagree with. Like robotically candid. Including, “I sense you are implying that x; I believe not x. Unless this is an urgent or very serious question I do not wish to discuss it further.” Just get all the bullshit in the open and refute it. You mark him. | 0 | 407 | 1.481481 |
qw9xrs | askacademia_train | 0.98 | TA dealing with a condescending student Hi all, Have any of you had to deal with a condescending student? How did you deal with it (or did you?)? I (30F) have a student (19M) this semester who emails me frequently with questions that have always seemed to insinuate that I didn't know what I was talking about. But I assumed I was being oversensitive or paranoid, so I have always answered him promptly and cheerfully. However, today, the student got in a long back and forth with me (over email) about a basic statistical analysis in which he is FULLY incorrect, but has continued doubling down no matter what I say (or how many resources I send him). Finally he wrote back something along the lines of "fine I still think it means xyz but I guess I just won't include how we got our results." To be clear, he literally added a new statistical test that is not part of the assignment, and makes no sense with the data. The last email especially was honestly very rude, and I'm not sure how to proceed. I'm leaning towards just leaving it alone, since he apparently cares so much about having the last word, but I'm worried about grading his final paper if he continues to double down on this. Has anyone else encountered something like this, and what did you do? | hl1u67u | hl1lttv | 1,637,190,903 | 1,637,187,332 | 40 | 9 | If I am working with someone passive aggressive I parse their sentences into explicit and implicit comments, things that they wish to be noted, tasks for me and questions. I just break it al down and say what I agree with or disagree with. Like robotically candid. Including, “I sense you are implying that x; I believe not x. Unless this is an urgent or very serious question I do not wish to discuss it further.” Just get all the bullshit in the open and refute it. You mark him. | I think the biggest mistake here is pressing the 'reply' button. I've had a student looking for a MSc project supervisor. He wad quite open about being very picky about it. I told him straight about his attitude and the reason he's in the uni. Never seen him again. | 1 | 3,571 | 4.444444 |
qw9xrs | askacademia_train | 0.98 | TA dealing with a condescending student Hi all, Have any of you had to deal with a condescending student? How did you deal with it (or did you?)? I (30F) have a student (19M) this semester who emails me frequently with questions that have always seemed to insinuate that I didn't know what I was talking about. But I assumed I was being oversensitive or paranoid, so I have always answered him promptly and cheerfully. However, today, the student got in a long back and forth with me (over email) about a basic statistical analysis in which he is FULLY incorrect, but has continued doubling down no matter what I say (or how many resources I send him). Finally he wrote back something along the lines of "fine I still think it means xyz but I guess I just won't include how we got our results." To be clear, he literally added a new statistical test that is not part of the assignment, and makes no sense with the data. The last email especially was honestly very rude, and I'm not sure how to proceed. I'm leaning towards just leaving it alone, since he apparently cares so much about having the last word, but I'm worried about grading his final paper if he continues to double down on this. Has anyone else encountered something like this, and what did you do? | hl1u67u | hl1nfyp | 1,637,190,903 | 1,637,188,012 | 40 | 9 | If I am working with someone passive aggressive I parse their sentences into explicit and implicit comments, things that they wish to be noted, tasks for me and questions. I just break it al down and say what I agree with or disagree with. Like robotically candid. Including, “I sense you are implying that x; I believe not x. Unless this is an urgent or very serious question I do not wish to discuss it further.” Just get all the bullshit in the open and refute it. You mark him. | Do you need to reply emails? I worked as a TA, I didn't contact any students out of office hours. If he had questions he should have asked during the class period. I wouldn't put so much effort onto that and I agree I would just grade their quizzes, assignments etc. Don't be too helpful, I get where you are coming from but that's so draining and they would take you as granted, some wouldnt even respect you because you're very available and friendly (sad but true) | 1 | 2,891 | 4.444444 |
qw9xrs | askacademia_train | 0.98 | TA dealing with a condescending student Hi all, Have any of you had to deal with a condescending student? How did you deal with it (or did you?)? I (30F) have a student (19M) this semester who emails me frequently with questions that have always seemed to insinuate that I didn't know what I was talking about. But I assumed I was being oversensitive or paranoid, so I have always answered him promptly and cheerfully. However, today, the student got in a long back and forth with me (over email) about a basic statistical analysis in which he is FULLY incorrect, but has continued doubling down no matter what I say (or how many resources I send him). Finally he wrote back something along the lines of "fine I still think it means xyz but I guess I just won't include how we got our results." To be clear, he literally added a new statistical test that is not part of the assignment, and makes no sense with the data. The last email especially was honestly very rude, and I'm not sure how to proceed. I'm leaning towards just leaving it alone, since he apparently cares so much about having the last word, but I'm worried about grading his final paper if he continues to double down on this. Has anyone else encountered something like this, and what did you do? | hl1u67u | hl1rph4 | 1,637,190,903 | 1,637,189,834 | 40 | 9 | If I am working with someone passive aggressive I parse their sentences into explicit and implicit comments, things that they wish to be noted, tasks for me and questions. I just break it al down and say what I agree with or disagree with. Like robotically candid. Including, “I sense you are implying that x; I believe not x. Unless this is an urgent or very serious question I do not wish to discuss it further.” Just get all the bullshit in the open and refute it. You mark him. | What a dummy that kid is. Ignore him, and mark him down (fairly and) accordingly. Sorry that you’re dealing with this, by the way. | 1 | 1,069 | 4.444444 |
qw9xrs | askacademia_train | 0.98 | TA dealing with a condescending student Hi all, Have any of you had to deal with a condescending student? How did you deal with it (or did you?)? I (30F) have a student (19M) this semester who emails me frequently with questions that have always seemed to insinuate that I didn't know what I was talking about. But I assumed I was being oversensitive or paranoid, so I have always answered him promptly and cheerfully. However, today, the student got in a long back and forth with me (over email) about a basic statistical analysis in which he is FULLY incorrect, but has continued doubling down no matter what I say (or how many resources I send him). Finally he wrote back something along the lines of "fine I still think it means xyz but I guess I just won't include how we got our results." To be clear, he literally added a new statistical test that is not part of the assignment, and makes no sense with the data. The last email especially was honestly very rude, and I'm not sure how to proceed. I'm leaning towards just leaving it alone, since he apparently cares so much about having the last word, but I'm worried about grading his final paper if he continues to double down on this. Has anyone else encountered something like this, and what did you do? | hl2gguo | hl1t917 | 1,637,201,025 | 1,637,190,496 | 28 | 27 | In my experience, my professors always told me that if a student escalates beyond the 2nd or 3rd email that you just forward it to the professor. From my PI's own words, they usually don't pull this stuff with professors, only with TAs. | I deal with it by treating them like they're insecure and need a lot of reassurance (which is generally the case), and also by refusing to engage if they decide they want to argue. Don't get sucked into long back-and-forths with a student who just wants to argue - it's fine to ignore emails that don't contain a question. It's also fine to ignore every part of an email but the questions. If he doubles down on it, pass him along to the professor of record for the class, and let them deal with him. It's probably wise to forward the whole exchange to the professor in advance, to let them know this is going on and that they might have to deal with it. | 1 | 10,529 | 1.037037 |
qw9xrs | askacademia_train | 0.98 | TA dealing with a condescending student Hi all, Have any of you had to deal with a condescending student? How did you deal with it (or did you?)? I (30F) have a student (19M) this semester who emails me frequently with questions that have always seemed to insinuate that I didn't know what I was talking about. But I assumed I was being oversensitive or paranoid, so I have always answered him promptly and cheerfully. However, today, the student got in a long back and forth with me (over email) about a basic statistical analysis in which he is FULLY incorrect, but has continued doubling down no matter what I say (or how many resources I send him). Finally he wrote back something along the lines of "fine I still think it means xyz but I guess I just won't include how we got our results." To be clear, he literally added a new statistical test that is not part of the assignment, and makes no sense with the data. The last email especially was honestly very rude, and I'm not sure how to proceed. I'm leaning towards just leaving it alone, since he apparently cares so much about having the last word, but I'm worried about grading his final paper if he continues to double down on this. Has anyone else encountered something like this, and what did you do? | hl1t917 | hl1lttv | 1,637,190,496 | 1,637,187,332 | 27 | 9 | I deal with it by treating them like they're insecure and need a lot of reassurance (which is generally the case), and also by refusing to engage if they decide they want to argue. Don't get sucked into long back-and-forths with a student who just wants to argue - it's fine to ignore emails that don't contain a question. It's also fine to ignore every part of an email but the questions. If he doubles down on it, pass him along to the professor of record for the class, and let them deal with him. It's probably wise to forward the whole exchange to the professor in advance, to let them know this is going on and that they might have to deal with it. | I think the biggest mistake here is pressing the 'reply' button. I've had a student looking for a MSc project supervisor. He wad quite open about being very picky about it. I told him straight about his attitude and the reason he's in the uni. Never seen him again. | 1 | 3,164 | 3 |
qw9xrs | askacademia_train | 0.98 | TA dealing with a condescending student Hi all, Have any of you had to deal with a condescending student? How did you deal with it (or did you?)? I (30F) have a student (19M) this semester who emails me frequently with questions that have always seemed to insinuate that I didn't know what I was talking about. But I assumed I was being oversensitive or paranoid, so I have always answered him promptly and cheerfully. However, today, the student got in a long back and forth with me (over email) about a basic statistical analysis in which he is FULLY incorrect, but has continued doubling down no matter what I say (or how many resources I send him). Finally he wrote back something along the lines of "fine I still think it means xyz but I guess I just won't include how we got our results." To be clear, he literally added a new statistical test that is not part of the assignment, and makes no sense with the data. The last email especially was honestly very rude, and I'm not sure how to proceed. I'm leaning towards just leaving it alone, since he apparently cares so much about having the last word, but I'm worried about grading his final paper if he continues to double down on this. Has anyone else encountered something like this, and what did you do? | hl1nfyp | hl1t917 | 1,637,188,012 | 1,637,190,496 | 9 | 27 | Do you need to reply emails? I worked as a TA, I didn't contact any students out of office hours. If he had questions he should have asked during the class period. I wouldn't put so much effort onto that and I agree I would just grade their quizzes, assignments etc. Don't be too helpful, I get where you are coming from but that's so draining and they would take you as granted, some wouldnt even respect you because you're very available and friendly (sad but true) | I deal with it by treating them like they're insecure and need a lot of reassurance (which is generally the case), and also by refusing to engage if they decide they want to argue. Don't get sucked into long back-and-forths with a student who just wants to argue - it's fine to ignore emails that don't contain a question. It's also fine to ignore every part of an email but the questions. If he doubles down on it, pass him along to the professor of record for the class, and let them deal with him. It's probably wise to forward the whole exchange to the professor in advance, to let them know this is going on and that they might have to deal with it. | 0 | 2,484 | 3 |
qw9xrs | askacademia_train | 0.98 | TA dealing with a condescending student Hi all, Have any of you had to deal with a condescending student? How did you deal with it (or did you?)? I (30F) have a student (19M) this semester who emails me frequently with questions that have always seemed to insinuate that I didn't know what I was talking about. But I assumed I was being oversensitive or paranoid, so I have always answered him promptly and cheerfully. However, today, the student got in a long back and forth with me (over email) about a basic statistical analysis in which he is FULLY incorrect, but has continued doubling down no matter what I say (or how many resources I send him). Finally he wrote back something along the lines of "fine I still think it means xyz but I guess I just won't include how we got our results." To be clear, he literally added a new statistical test that is not part of the assignment, and makes no sense with the data. The last email especially was honestly very rude, and I'm not sure how to proceed. I'm leaning towards just leaving it alone, since he apparently cares so much about having the last word, but I'm worried about grading his final paper if he continues to double down on this. Has anyone else encountered something like this, and what did you do? | hl1rph4 | hl1t917 | 1,637,189,834 | 1,637,190,496 | 9 | 27 | What a dummy that kid is. Ignore him, and mark him down (fairly and) accordingly. Sorry that you’re dealing with this, by the way. | I deal with it by treating them like they're insecure and need a lot of reassurance (which is generally the case), and also by refusing to engage if they decide they want to argue. Don't get sucked into long back-and-forths with a student who just wants to argue - it's fine to ignore emails that don't contain a question. It's also fine to ignore every part of an email but the questions. If he doubles down on it, pass him along to the professor of record for the class, and let them deal with him. It's probably wise to forward the whole exchange to the professor in advance, to let them know this is going on and that they might have to deal with it. | 0 | 662 | 3 |
qw9xrs | askacademia_train | 0.98 | TA dealing with a condescending student Hi all, Have any of you had to deal with a condescending student? How did you deal with it (or did you?)? I (30F) have a student (19M) this semester who emails me frequently with questions that have always seemed to insinuate that I didn't know what I was talking about. But I assumed I was being oversensitive or paranoid, so I have always answered him promptly and cheerfully. However, today, the student got in a long back and forth with me (over email) about a basic statistical analysis in which he is FULLY incorrect, but has continued doubling down no matter what I say (or how many resources I send him). Finally he wrote back something along the lines of "fine I still think it means xyz but I guess I just won't include how we got our results." To be clear, he literally added a new statistical test that is not part of the assignment, and makes no sense with the data. The last email especially was honestly very rude, and I'm not sure how to proceed. I'm leaning towards just leaving it alone, since he apparently cares so much about having the last word, but I'm worried about grading his final paper if he continues to double down on this. Has anyone else encountered something like this, and what did you do? | hl2gguo | hl1xf5w | 1,637,201,025 | 1,637,192,340 | 28 | 22 | In my experience, my professors always told me that if a student escalates beyond the 2nd or 3rd email that you just forward it to the professor. From my PI's own words, they usually don't pull this stuff with professors, only with TAs. | Oh, I just ignore them. They may think they will win the battle, but I will inevitably win the war. (Especially in statistics, because they never know what they are talking about.) Honestly, I find that being cheerfully nonchalant strikes the tone I want to convey and also irritates these types of students so deliciously. One thing I don't do, though, is get drawn into long back-and-forths with students. I am more than willing to admit when I've made a mistake and give students points, but when they're wrong and I know they're wrong...why am I going to argue with you? You're in this class because you *don't* know what you're doing. I will send them the resources; if they continue to try to argue, I will ignore them unless they are asking an actual question. | 1 | 8,685 | 1.272727 |
qw9xrs | askacademia_train | 0.98 | TA dealing with a condescending student Hi all, Have any of you had to deal with a condescending student? How did you deal with it (or did you?)? I (30F) have a student (19M) this semester who emails me frequently with questions that have always seemed to insinuate that I didn't know what I was talking about. But I assumed I was being oversensitive or paranoid, so I have always answered him promptly and cheerfully. However, today, the student got in a long back and forth with me (over email) about a basic statistical analysis in which he is FULLY incorrect, but has continued doubling down no matter what I say (or how many resources I send him). Finally he wrote back something along the lines of "fine I still think it means xyz but I guess I just won't include how we got our results." To be clear, he literally added a new statistical test that is not part of the assignment, and makes no sense with the data. The last email especially was honestly very rude, and I'm not sure how to proceed. I'm leaning towards just leaving it alone, since he apparently cares so much about having the last word, but I'm worried about grading his final paper if he continues to double down on this. Has anyone else encountered something like this, and what did you do? | hl1wnzu | hl2gguo | 1,637,192,005 | 1,637,201,025 | 19 | 28 | Everyone is cautioning you to not reply. I think that's probably the wrong move here. It's not "unprofessional" to issue a rebuke (even a sharp rebuke), as long as it's not ad hominem or abusive. Something like "Also, I'm not sure if you're aware, but the tone of this email was pretty rude, particularly given that the XYZ test you're adding doesn't make sense in the context of this data set. Please be more polite in future communications." If the student responds negatively to that, well, that's when you stop replying. | In my experience, my professors always told me that if a student escalates beyond the 2nd or 3rd email that you just forward it to the professor. From my PI's own words, they usually don't pull this stuff with professors, only with TAs. | 0 | 9,020 | 1.473684 |
qw9xrs | askacademia_train | 0.98 | TA dealing with a condescending student Hi all, Have any of you had to deal with a condescending student? How did you deal with it (or did you?)? I (30F) have a student (19M) this semester who emails me frequently with questions that have always seemed to insinuate that I didn't know what I was talking about. But I assumed I was being oversensitive or paranoid, so I have always answered him promptly and cheerfully. However, today, the student got in a long back and forth with me (over email) about a basic statistical analysis in which he is FULLY incorrect, but has continued doubling down no matter what I say (or how many resources I send him). Finally he wrote back something along the lines of "fine I still think it means xyz but I guess I just won't include how we got our results." To be clear, he literally added a new statistical test that is not part of the assignment, and makes no sense with the data. The last email especially was honestly very rude, and I'm not sure how to proceed. I'm leaning towards just leaving it alone, since he apparently cares so much about having the last word, but I'm worried about grading his final paper if he continues to double down on this. Has anyone else encountered something like this, and what did you do? | hl2gguo | hl1uq43 | 1,637,201,025 | 1,637,191,146 | 28 | 17 | In my experience, my professors always told me that if a student escalates beyond the 2nd or 3rd email that you just forward it to the professor. From my PI's own words, they usually don't pull this stuff with professors, only with TAs. | Kill him with kindness, but at a certain point you just give him the tools and enough rope to hang from and leave it at that. He can choose what to do with the rope. You could, this time, dedicate a portion of class to reminding the students why we use the analyses we use for different situations. You could also ask if his major is stats. If it is. Good luck, I have met a few who dont understand that in many applied fields we have very noisy data and must do things to deal with that. The only thing I have to add is that, if you want to bring up him being rude to you via email as a learning opportunity you can phrase it to come from a place of concern. I.e.: "Hey is everything ok? The tone of your email came off like you were pretty stressed. You cant get any body language across, so it might help you to choose your words more carefully in that format. Otherwise people may think things are not OK." | 1 | 9,879 | 1.647059 |
qw9xrs | askacademia_train | 0.98 | TA dealing with a condescending student Hi all, Have any of you had to deal with a condescending student? How did you deal with it (or did you?)? I (30F) have a student (19M) this semester who emails me frequently with questions that have always seemed to insinuate that I didn't know what I was talking about. But I assumed I was being oversensitive or paranoid, so I have always answered him promptly and cheerfully. However, today, the student got in a long back and forth with me (over email) about a basic statistical analysis in which he is FULLY incorrect, but has continued doubling down no matter what I say (or how many resources I send him). Finally he wrote back something along the lines of "fine I still think it means xyz but I guess I just won't include how we got our results." To be clear, he literally added a new statistical test that is not part of the assignment, and makes no sense with the data. The last email especially was honestly very rude, and I'm not sure how to proceed. I'm leaning towards just leaving it alone, since he apparently cares so much about having the last word, but I'm worried about grading his final paper if he continues to double down on this. Has anyone else encountered something like this, and what did you do? | hl1lttv | hl2gguo | 1,637,187,332 | 1,637,201,025 | 9 | 28 | I think the biggest mistake here is pressing the 'reply' button. I've had a student looking for a MSc project supervisor. He wad quite open about being very picky about it. I told him straight about his attitude and the reason he's in the uni. Never seen him again. | In my experience, my professors always told me that if a student escalates beyond the 2nd or 3rd email that you just forward it to the professor. From my PI's own words, they usually don't pull this stuff with professors, only with TAs. | 0 | 13,693 | 3.111111 |
qw9xrs | askacademia_train | 0.98 | TA dealing with a condescending student Hi all, Have any of you had to deal with a condescending student? How did you deal with it (or did you?)? I (30F) have a student (19M) this semester who emails me frequently with questions that have always seemed to insinuate that I didn't know what I was talking about. But I assumed I was being oversensitive or paranoid, so I have always answered him promptly and cheerfully. However, today, the student got in a long back and forth with me (over email) about a basic statistical analysis in which he is FULLY incorrect, but has continued doubling down no matter what I say (or how many resources I send him). Finally he wrote back something along the lines of "fine I still think it means xyz but I guess I just won't include how we got our results." To be clear, he literally added a new statistical test that is not part of the assignment, and makes no sense with the data. The last email especially was honestly very rude, and I'm not sure how to proceed. I'm leaning towards just leaving it alone, since he apparently cares so much about having the last word, but I'm worried about grading his final paper if he continues to double down on this. Has anyone else encountered something like this, and what did you do? | hl2gguo | hl1nfyp | 1,637,201,025 | 1,637,188,012 | 28 | 9 | In my experience, my professors always told me that if a student escalates beyond the 2nd or 3rd email that you just forward it to the professor. From my PI's own words, they usually don't pull this stuff with professors, only with TAs. | Do you need to reply emails? I worked as a TA, I didn't contact any students out of office hours. If he had questions he should have asked during the class period. I wouldn't put so much effort onto that and I agree I would just grade their quizzes, assignments etc. Don't be too helpful, I get where you are coming from but that's so draining and they would take you as granted, some wouldnt even respect you because you're very available and friendly (sad but true) | 1 | 13,013 | 3.111111 |
qw9xrs | askacademia_train | 0.98 | TA dealing with a condescending student Hi all, Have any of you had to deal with a condescending student? How did you deal with it (or did you?)? I (30F) have a student (19M) this semester who emails me frequently with questions that have always seemed to insinuate that I didn't know what I was talking about. But I assumed I was being oversensitive or paranoid, so I have always answered him promptly and cheerfully. However, today, the student got in a long back and forth with me (over email) about a basic statistical analysis in which he is FULLY incorrect, but has continued doubling down no matter what I say (or how many resources I send him). Finally he wrote back something along the lines of "fine I still think it means xyz but I guess I just won't include how we got our results." To be clear, he literally added a new statistical test that is not part of the assignment, and makes no sense with the data. The last email especially was honestly very rude, and I'm not sure how to proceed. I'm leaning towards just leaving it alone, since he apparently cares so much about having the last word, but I'm worried about grading his final paper if he continues to double down on this. Has anyone else encountered something like this, and what did you do? | hl1rph4 | hl2gguo | 1,637,189,834 | 1,637,201,025 | 9 | 28 | What a dummy that kid is. Ignore him, and mark him down (fairly and) accordingly. Sorry that you’re dealing with this, by the way. | In my experience, my professors always told me that if a student escalates beyond the 2nd or 3rd email that you just forward it to the professor. From my PI's own words, they usually don't pull this stuff with professors, only with TAs. | 0 | 11,191 | 3.111111 |
qw9xrs | askacademia_train | 0.98 | TA dealing with a condescending student Hi all, Have any of you had to deal with a condescending student? How did you deal with it (or did you?)? I (30F) have a student (19M) this semester who emails me frequently with questions that have always seemed to insinuate that I didn't know what I was talking about. But I assumed I was being oversensitive or paranoid, so I have always answered him promptly and cheerfully. However, today, the student got in a long back and forth with me (over email) about a basic statistical analysis in which he is FULLY incorrect, but has continued doubling down no matter what I say (or how many resources I send him). Finally he wrote back something along the lines of "fine I still think it means xyz but I guess I just won't include how we got our results." To be clear, he literally added a new statistical test that is not part of the assignment, and makes no sense with the data. The last email especially was honestly very rude, and I'm not sure how to proceed. I'm leaning towards just leaving it alone, since he apparently cares so much about having the last word, but I'm worried about grading his final paper if he continues to double down on this. Has anyone else encountered something like this, and what did you do? | hl2gguo | hl1vq1m | 1,637,201,025 | 1,637,191,588 | 28 | 7 | In my experience, my professors always told me that if a student escalates beyond the 2nd or 3rd email that you just forward it to the professor. From my PI's own words, they usually don't pull this stuff with professors, only with TAs. | Oof. I’ve had to deal with so many students like that (& the numbers seem to be increasing over the years). My situation is slightly different cause I’m hired externally as a part time lecturer but I’d say the same steps can apply. Normally, I wouldn’t engage in email ping pong but keep my answers brief, firm, & to the point (making it clear they are wrong & backing up where I’m right) then stop responding when they start being rude/ condescending. I’d also let my higher up (in your case, the professor in charge of the class) know of the details (students behaviour, my response, etc) so in case the student appeals when they (predictably) score poorly, then they can back me up. Oh, and during marking I make it VERY VERY clear why they’re wrong & use almost the exact same words I use in the email. | 1 | 9,437 | 4 |
qw9xrs | askacademia_train | 0.98 | TA dealing with a condescending student Hi all, Have any of you had to deal with a condescending student? How did you deal with it (or did you?)? I (30F) have a student (19M) this semester who emails me frequently with questions that have always seemed to insinuate that I didn't know what I was talking about. But I assumed I was being oversensitive or paranoid, so I have always answered him promptly and cheerfully. However, today, the student got in a long back and forth with me (over email) about a basic statistical analysis in which he is FULLY incorrect, but has continued doubling down no matter what I say (or how many resources I send him). Finally he wrote back something along the lines of "fine I still think it means xyz but I guess I just won't include how we got our results." To be clear, he literally added a new statistical test that is not part of the assignment, and makes no sense with the data. The last email especially was honestly very rude, and I'm not sure how to proceed. I'm leaning towards just leaving it alone, since he apparently cares so much about having the last word, but I'm worried about grading his final paper if he continues to double down on this. Has anyone else encountered something like this, and what did you do? | hl2gguo | hl1wyt4 | 1,637,201,025 | 1,637,192,137 | 28 | 6 | In my experience, my professors always told me that if a student escalates beyond the 2nd or 3rd email that you just forward it to the professor. From my PI's own words, they usually don't pull this stuff with professors, only with TAs. | I've always believed that back and forth through email does come across rude. Its always to "clear the air" in person. I've found that people are less rude while talking in-person. | 1 | 8,888 | 4.666667 |
qw9xrs | askacademia_train | 0.98 | TA dealing with a condescending student Hi all, Have any of you had to deal with a condescending student? How did you deal with it (or did you?)? I (30F) have a student (19M) this semester who emails me frequently with questions that have always seemed to insinuate that I didn't know what I was talking about. But I assumed I was being oversensitive or paranoid, so I have always answered him promptly and cheerfully. However, today, the student got in a long back and forth with me (over email) about a basic statistical analysis in which he is FULLY incorrect, but has continued doubling down no matter what I say (or how many resources I send him). Finally he wrote back something along the lines of "fine I still think it means xyz but I guess I just won't include how we got our results." To be clear, he literally added a new statistical test that is not part of the assignment, and makes no sense with the data. The last email especially was honestly very rude, and I'm not sure how to proceed. I'm leaning towards just leaving it alone, since he apparently cares so much about having the last word, but I'm worried about grading his final paper if he continues to double down on this. Has anyone else encountered something like this, and what did you do? | hl2gguo | hl24x4c | 1,637,201,025 | 1,637,195,775 | 28 | 6 | In my experience, my professors always told me that if a student escalates beyond the 2nd or 3rd email that you just forward it to the professor. From my PI's own words, they usually don't pull this stuff with professors, only with TAs. | Just grade him appropriately if he gets the wrong answer he fails and that's it. Bak in my undergrad I remember a student trying to correct the proffessor constantly despite the guy being fully and utterly wrong. The proffessor one day walked out for 5 minutes, walked back in and kept the lecture pretty much ignoring the guy for the rest of it. I thought that was a fairly decent way to prevent ripping the idiot in front of the class. | 1 | 5,250 | 4.666667 |
qw9xrs | askacademia_train | 0.98 | TA dealing with a condescending student Hi all, Have any of you had to deal with a condescending student? How did you deal with it (or did you?)? I (30F) have a student (19M) this semester who emails me frequently with questions that have always seemed to insinuate that I didn't know what I was talking about. But I assumed I was being oversensitive or paranoid, so I have always answered him promptly and cheerfully. However, today, the student got in a long back and forth with me (over email) about a basic statistical analysis in which he is FULLY incorrect, but has continued doubling down no matter what I say (or how many resources I send him). Finally he wrote back something along the lines of "fine I still think it means xyz but I guess I just won't include how we got our results." To be clear, he literally added a new statistical test that is not part of the assignment, and makes no sense with the data. The last email especially was honestly very rude, and I'm not sure how to proceed. I'm leaning towards just leaving it alone, since he apparently cares so much about having the last word, but I'm worried about grading his final paper if he continues to double down on this. Has anyone else encountered something like this, and what did you do? | hl2gguo | hl1xxdg | 1,637,201,025 | 1,637,192,565 | 28 | 5 | In my experience, my professors always told me that if a student escalates beyond the 2nd or 3rd email that you just forward it to the professor. From my PI's own words, they usually don't pull this stuff with professors, only with TAs. | Don't do anything special to or for the student. Talk to your supervisor/the instructor/your mentor/whomever is supposed to be in charge of you as a TA. | 1 | 8,460 | 5.6 |
qw9xrs | askacademia_train | 0.98 | TA dealing with a condescending student Hi all, Have any of you had to deal with a condescending student? How did you deal with it (or did you?)? I (30F) have a student (19M) this semester who emails me frequently with questions that have always seemed to insinuate that I didn't know what I was talking about. But I assumed I was being oversensitive or paranoid, so I have always answered him promptly and cheerfully. However, today, the student got in a long back and forth with me (over email) about a basic statistical analysis in which he is FULLY incorrect, but has continued doubling down no matter what I say (or how many resources I send him). Finally he wrote back something along the lines of "fine I still think it means xyz but I guess I just won't include how we got our results." To be clear, he literally added a new statistical test that is not part of the assignment, and makes no sense with the data. The last email especially was honestly very rude, and I'm not sure how to proceed. I'm leaning towards just leaving it alone, since he apparently cares so much about having the last word, but I'm worried about grading his final paper if he continues to double down on this. Has anyone else encountered something like this, and what did you do? | hl2gguo | hl21q6z | 1,637,201,025 | 1,637,194,298 | 28 | 3 | In my experience, my professors always told me that if a student escalates beyond the 2nd or 3rd email that you just forward it to the professor. From my PI's own words, they usually don't pull this stuff with professors, only with TAs. | I think the work as teacher is guide your students to the knoweldge, you can help them with someproblems, but if your students don't try to learn something and don't listen you, you must not keeping help them. I think you should give up whit him and use his emaik as evidence. | 1 | 6,727 | 9.333333 |
qw9xrs | askacademia_train | 0.98 | TA dealing with a condescending student Hi all, Have any of you had to deal with a condescending student? How did you deal with it (or did you?)? I (30F) have a student (19M) this semester who emails me frequently with questions that have always seemed to insinuate that I didn't know what I was talking about. But I assumed I was being oversensitive or paranoid, so I have always answered him promptly and cheerfully. However, today, the student got in a long back and forth with me (over email) about a basic statistical analysis in which he is FULLY incorrect, but has continued doubling down no matter what I say (or how many resources I send him). Finally he wrote back something along the lines of "fine I still think it means xyz but I guess I just won't include how we got our results." To be clear, he literally added a new statistical test that is not part of the assignment, and makes no sense with the data. The last email especially was honestly very rude, and I'm not sure how to proceed. I'm leaning towards just leaving it alone, since he apparently cares so much about having the last word, but I'm worried about grading his final paper if he continues to double down on this. Has anyone else encountered something like this, and what did you do? | hl24poo | hl2gguo | 1,637,195,681 | 1,637,201,025 | 3 | 28 | Hello ! This post just appeared in my feed for whatever mysterious reason. I am curious to know what is a TA. Anybody could explain ? Thanks in advance ! | In my experience, my professors always told me that if a student escalates beyond the 2nd or 3rd email that you just forward it to the professor. From my PI's own words, they usually don't pull this stuff with professors, only with TAs. | 0 | 5,344 | 9.333333 |
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