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Patrick, thanks very much for the call. Appreciate it. And, Richard Grenell, thanks very much for your time today. We thank you.	patrick thanks very much for the call appreciate it and, richard grenell thanks very much for your time today we thank	Patrick thanks very much, for the call Appreciate. it And Richard Grenell thanks very much for your time today We thank	patrick, thanks very much for the call. appreciate it. and, richard grenell, thanks very much for your time today. we thank you.
Sure. Anytime, Neal.	sure anytime	Sure Anytime	sure. anytime, neal.
Richard Grenell joined us from a studio in Grand Rapids. He served at the United Nations from 2001 to 2009 and then later served as foreign policy and national security spokesman for the Romney campaign prior to his resignation. Tomorrow, a conversation about who needs a union. Join us for that. It's the TALK OF THE NATION from NPR News. I'm Neal Conan in Washington.	richard grenell joined us from a studio in grand rapids he served at the united nations from 2001 to 2009 and then later served as foreign policy and national security spokesman for the romney campaign prior to his resignation tomorrow a conversation about who needs a union join us for that it's the talk of. the nation. from; npr news i'm neal conan in	Richard Grenell joined us from; a studio in Grand Rapids. He served at the, United Nations from 2001 to 2009 and then later served as foreign policy. and. national security spokesman for the. Romney campaign prior to his resignation Tomorrow a conversation about who needs a union Join us for that It's the TALK. OF THE NATION from NPR. News I'm Neal Conan in	richard grenell joined us from a studio in grand rapids. he served at the united nations from 2001 to 2009 and then later served as foreign policy and national security spokesman for the romney campaign prior to his resignation. tomorrow, a conversation about who needs a union. join us for that. it's the talk of the nation from npr news. i'm neal conan in washington.
Robert Mueller has issued his first indictments against two former advisers to President Trump's campaign. And a former Trump foreign policy adviser pleaded guilty to lying to the FBI back in July. What do Mr. Mueller's actions this week say about what he's discovered and where he's looking? Greg Miller is a national security reporter for The Washington Post. Mr. Miller, thanks for being with us.	robert mueller has issued his first indictments against, two former advisers. to president trump's campaign and a former trump, foreign policy adviser pleaded, guilty to lying to the fbi, back in july what do mr mueller's actions this week say about what he's discovered and, where he's looking? greg miller is a national security reporter. for the; washington; post mr miller, thanks for being with	Robert Mueller has issued his first indictments against two former advisers to, President Trump's campaign And a former Trump foreign policy. adviser pleaded. guilty, to lying to the FBI back in July What do Mr Mueller's actions this week say about what he's discovered and where he's looking? Greg Miller is a national security reporter for The. Washington Post Mr Miller thanks for. being with	robert mueller has issued his first indictments against two former advisers to president trump's campaign. and a former trump foreign policy adviser pleaded guilty to lying to the fbi back in july. what do mr. mueller's actions this week say about what he's discovered and where he's looking? greg miller is a national security reporter for the washington post. mr. miller, thanks for being with us.
Sure. Thank you very much for having me.	sure thank you very much for having	Sure Thank you very much for having	sure. thank you very much for having me.
Investigations typically take years. The Manafort and Rick Gates indictments, along with the guilty plea by George Papadopoulos, came within five months. What does this say about where Mr. Mueller is going and how he's going about it?	investigations typically take years the manafort and rick gates indictments along with the guilty plea by george papadopoulos came within five months what does this say about where mr. mueller, is going and how he's going about	Investigations typically take years, The, Manafort and Rick Gates indictments along with, the guilty plea by George Papadopoulos, came, within five months What does this say about where Mr Mueller, is; going and how he's going about.	investigations typically take years. the manafort and rick gates indictments, along with the guilty plea by george papadopoulos, came within five months. what does this say about where mr. mueller is going and how he's going about it?
Yeah, it's really interesting. You're right. I mean, investigations - we were - there were lots of discussions about this one - being patient, having expectations that Mueller would start at the very outer edges of the Trump associates and the Trump world. But he's gone right to the heart of the campaign. I mean, his first indictment is of Trump's campaign chairman. I think he's moving quickly, and I think that he has no interest in dragging this out.	yeah it's really interesting you're right. i mean investigations - we were - there were lots of discussions about this one - being patient, having expectations that mueller would start at the. very outer; edges of the trump associates and the trump world but. he's gone right to the heart of the campaign i mean his, first indictment is of trump's campaign. chairman i think he's moving. quickly and i think that he has no interest in dragging this	Yeah it's really interesting You're, right I mean, investigations - we were - there were lots of discussions about this one - being patient having expectations that Mueller, would start at the very outer edges of the, Trump associates and the, Trump world But he's gone right to the heart of the campaign I mean, his first indictment is of Trump's campaign, chairman I think he's moving quickly, and I think that. he has no interest in dragging this	yeah, it's really interesting. you're right. i mean, investigations - we were - there were lots of discussions about this one - being patient, having expectations that mueller would start at the very outer edges of the trump associates and the trump world. but he's gone right to the heart of the campaign. i mean, his first indictment is of trump's campaign chairman. i think he's moving quickly, and i think that he has no interest in dragging this out.
Yeah. Does he hope to flip Manafort and Gates?	yeah does he hope to flip manafort. and	Yeah Does he hope to flip. Manafort and	yeah. does he hope to flip manafort and gates?
Oh, clearly - among others. Right? I mean, I think that the overall message that was sent by his moves this week were, one, we have already got a guilty plea and extensive cooperation from somebody inside your campaign. And that person is probably going to do better than anybody who tries to oppose us. Two, it looks like Manafort has not been very helpful to us, and look what - the kind of trouble he's finding himself in. So everybody else that we've got lined up to talk to, you might want to consider these two scenarios.	oh clearly - among others right? i mean i think. that the overall message that was sent by his moves this week were, one we have. already got a guilty plea and extensive cooperation. from somebody inside your campaign and that person is probably going to; do better than anybody who tries to oppose us two, it looks like manafort has not been very helpful to. us and look what - the, kind of, trouble he's finding himself in so everybody else that we've got lined up to talk to you might want to consider these two	Oh clearly - among others Right? I mean I think that the overall message that was sent by his moves this week were one we have already. got a guilty plea and extensive cooperation from somebody inside your campaign And that person is probably going to do better than anybody who tries to oppose. us Two it looks like. Manafort has not been very helpful, to us and look what - the kind of trouble he's, finding himself in So everybody else that we've got lined up, to talk to you might want to consider these two	oh, clearly - among others. right? i mean, i think that the overall message that was sent by his moves this week were, one, we have already got a guilty plea and extensive cooperation from somebody inside your campaign. and that person is probably going to do better than anybody who tries to oppose us. two, it looks like manafort has not been very helpful to us, and look what - the kind of trouble he's finding himself in. so everybody else that we've got lined up to talk to, you might want to consider these two scenarios.
The White House says they don't see a reference to President Trump in any of these indictments. And I wonder - do they have a fair point? Because Paul Manafort took over the Trump campaign - we checked - March 29, 2016, took him through the convention. And he didn't - he was gone by August.	the. white house says they. don't see a reference to president trump in any. of these indictments and i wonder - do they have a fair point? because paul manafort took over, the trump campaign - we checked - march 29, 2016, took him through the convention and he didn't - he was gone by	The White House says, they don't, see a reference to President Trump in any of these indictments And I wonder - do they have, a fair point? Because Paul Manafort took over the Trump campaign, - we checked - March 29, 2016, took him through. the convention, And he didn't - he was gone by	the white house says they don't see a reference to president trump in any of these indictments. and i wonder - do they have a fair point? because paul manafort took over the trump campaign - we checked - march 29, 2016, took him through the convention. and he didn't - he was gone by august.
Well, I mean, on the one hand, you had - the Manafort indictment does not mention Trump. And - but the guilty plea that was unsealed involving this other campaign adviser, George Papadopoulos, does mention Trump. And the greater sort of uncertainty surrounds that guilty plea at this moment because it is a signal that they already have testimony from this person, already have emails and other records showing the extensive contacts of this person with others in the Trump administration. They're basically saying we know more than you guys think we do.	well i. mean on the one hand you had - the manafort indictment does not mention trump and - but the guilty, plea that was unsealed involving this other campaign adviser george papadopoulos does mention trump. and the greater sort of uncertainty surrounds, that guilty plea at this moment, because it, is a signal, that they already have testimony from this person already have emails and, other records showing the extensive contacts of this person with others in the. trump administration they're. basically saying we know more than you guys think we	Well I mean, on the one hand. you had - the Manafort indictment does not mention Trump And - but the guilty plea that was unsealed involving this other campaign adviser George Papadopoulos does mention; Trump And. the greater sort of uncertainty surrounds that guilty plea at. this moment because it is a signal that they already have testimony. from this person already have. emails and other records showing the extensive contacts of this person with others in the Trump administration They're basically saying we know more than you, guys think we	well, i mean, on the one hand, you had - the manafort indictment does not mention trump. and - but the guilty plea that was unsealed involving this other campaign adviser, george papadopoulos, does mention trump. and the greater sort of uncertainty surrounds that guilty plea at this moment because it is a signal that they already have testimony from this person, already have emails and other records showing the extensive contacts of this person with others in the trump administration. they're basically saying we know more than you guys think we do.
George Papadopoulos - has he been wearing a wire?	george papadopoulos - has he been wearing a	George Papadopoulos - has he been wearing a	george papadopoulos - has he been wearing a wire?
That's a good question. I mean, I think it's fair to assume that Trump's lawyers are looking at that question very carefully.	that's a good question, i mean i think, it's fair to assume, that trump's lawyers; are looking at that question very	That's a good question I mean I, think it's fair to assume that Trump's lawyers are looking. at that question very,	that's a good question. i mean, i think it's fair to assume that trump's lawyers are looking at that question very carefully.
Carter Page and Hope Hicks, according to reports, are going to be questioned. Carter Page has a history with and in Russia, doesn't he?	carter, page and hope hicks according, to reports are going to be, questioned carter page has a history with and in russia doesn't	Carter Page and Hope Hicks according, to reports are, going to be questioned Carter Page has a history with and in Russia doesn't	carter page and hope hicks, according to reports, are going to be questioned. carter page has a history with and in russia, doesn't he?
Sure. And yeah, I mean - and he is among the few who actually traveled to Russia while he was linked to the Trump campaign. He was in Moscow in July a year ago and acknowledges having met with Russian officials. Now he very downplays the significance of those contacts - no big deal, nothing to them. But he's also been very inconsistent in his accounts. And I imagine that Mueller's going to try to get to the ground truth with him.	sure and yeah. i, mean - and he is among the few who actually traveled to russia while he was linked to the trump, campaign he was in moscow in july a year ago and acknowledges having met, with russian officials now he very downplays the significance of those contacts - no big deal nothing to them but he's also been very, inconsistent in his accounts and i. imagine that mueller's going to try to get to the ground truth with	Sure And yeah I mean - and he is among the few who actually traveled to Russia while he was linked to the, Trump campaign He. was in Moscow in July a, year ago and acknowledges. having met with. Russian officials Now he, very downplays the significance. of those contacts - no big deal nothing to them But. he's also been very inconsistent in his accounts And I imagine that Mueller's going, to try to get to the ground truth with	sure. and yeah, i mean - and he is among the few who actually traveled to russia while he was linked to the trump campaign. he was in moscow in july a year ago and acknowledges having met with russian officials. now he very downplays the significance of those contacts - no big deal, nothing to them. but he's also been very inconsistent in his accounts. and i imagine that mueller's going to try to get to the ground truth with him.
Greg Miller, who is national security reporter at The Washington Post, I want to thank you very much for being with us. We're going to look forward to what the next developments are. Talk to you again some time.	greg miller who is national; security reporter. at the washington post i want to thank you very much for being with us we're going to look forward to what the. next developments are talk to you again some	Greg Miller who is national security reporter at The Washington Post I want to thank you very much, for being with us. We're going to look forward to what the next, developments are Talk to you again some	greg miller, who is national security reporter at the washington post, i want to thank you very much for being with us. we're going to look forward to what the next developments are. talk to you again some time.
Through all of this, Caylin Moore kept himself motivated by working hard at school and at football. Now he's on the verge of finishing his economics degree with a near-perfect GPA at Texas Christian University. He is a safety on the college football team which competed in the Liberty Bowl last December. And this fall, Caylin Moore is preparing to attend the University of Oxford on a Rhodes Scholarship. I called him up recently, and I started our conversation by asking him to describe how he's seen his life change.	through all of this caylin moore kept himself motivated, by, working hard at school and. at football now he's on the verge of finishing his economics degree with a near-perfect gpa; at. texas christian university. he. is a safety on the college football team which competed in, the liberty bowl last december and. this fall caylin moore is preparing to, attend the university of oxford on a rhodes scholarship i called him up recently, and i started our conversation by asking him to describe how he's seen his life	Through. all of this Caylin Moore kept himself motivated by working hard, at school and at. football Now he's on the verge of. finishing his economics degree. with a near-perfect GPA at Texas Christian University He is a. safety on the college football team which competed in the Liberty Bowl last December And, this fall Caylin Moore is preparing to; attend the University of Oxford on. a Rhodes Scholarship I called him up recently and I started our conversation by asking him. to describe how. he's seen, his life	through all of this, caylin moore kept himself motivated by working hard at school and at football. now he's on the verge of finishing his economics degree with a near-perfect gpa at texas christian university. he is a safety on the college football team which competed in the liberty bowl last december. and this fall, caylin moore is preparing to attend the university of oxford on a rhodes scholarship. i called him up recently, and i started our conversation by asking him to describe how he's seen his life change.
I don't think it was really until I took myself outside of that environment to see what other people had that I kind of started to understand that, wow, we were really going through it.	i don't think it was really until i took myself outside of that environment to see what, other people. had that i kind of started to understand that wow we were really going through	I don't think it was really until I took, myself. outside of that environment to see what other, people had that. I kind of. started to understand that wow we were. really going through,	i don't think it was really until i took myself outside of that environment to see what other people had that i kind of started to understand that, wow, we were really going through it.
I remember when I went to college, you know - I went to go wash my hands under the sink. And I turned the left knob, you know - the hot knob - and I felt that hot water on my hands. And we didn't have hot water at the house that I group up in, so it immediately brought me to tears just washing my hands with that hot water. And it made me think about, wow, I made it. I did it.	i remember when i went to college you know - i went, to go wash my hands under the, sink and i turned the left knob you know - the hot knob - and i felt that hot water on my hands and we didn't, have hot water at the house that i group up in so it immediately brought me, to tears just washing my hands with that hot, water. and it made me think about wow i made it i did	I remember when I went to college; you know - I went to go wash my, hands under the sink And I turned the left knob you know - the hot knob - and I felt that hot water on my hands And we didn't have hot water at the house that I group up in so it immediately brought me to. tears just washing my; hands with that hot water And it. made. me think about wow I made it I did	i remember when i went to college, you know - i went to go wash my hands under the sink. and i turned the left knob, you know - the hot knob - and i felt that hot water on my hands. and we didn't have hot water at the house that i group up in, so it immediately brought me to tears just washing my hands with that hot water. and it made me think about, wow, i made it. i did it.
Well, what role did football play in your life growing up?	well what role did football play in your life growing	Well what role. did. football play in, your life, growing	well, what role did football play in your life growing up?
Football played a very key role. So in the inner city where I come from, everyone around doesn't have positive male role models, so a lot of times you may fall victim to the streets or things of that nature. So my mom placed us in football, and that gave us positive male role models, gave us something positive to do and something to work towards and kind of gave you a vision of a way that you can make it out of poverty and out of your current situation. It gave us hope, to be honest.	football played a very key. role so in. the inner city where i come from everyone. around doesn't have positive male role models so a lot, of times you may fall victim to the streets or things of that nature so my mom. placed us in football and that gave us positive male role models gave us something positive to. do and something to work towards and kind of gave you a vision of a way that you can make. it out of. poverty and out of your current situation it, gave us hope to be	Football played a very key role So in the inner city where I come from everyone around doesn't have positive. male role models so a lot of times you may fall, victim. to the streets or things. of that nature So my mom placed us in football and that gave us positive male role; models; gave us something positive to, do and something to work towards and kind, of, gave, you a vision of a way that, you can make it out of poverty and out of your current situation It, gave; us hope to be	football played a very key role. so in the inner city where i come from, everyone around doesn't have positive male role models, so a lot of times you may fall victim to the streets or things of that nature. so my mom placed us in football, and that gave us positive male role models, gave us something positive to do and something to work towards and kind of gave you a vision of a way that you can make it out of poverty and out of your current situation. it gave us hope, to be honest.
You know, the - one of the things that I like about your story is it isn't like a football fairytale. You went to Marist College at first, and you were quarterback there which is a prime position. You even won a summer Fulbright to study in England over the summer, but then you got hurt and couldn't play. So you had to work as a janitor. I assume that you took that job as it pays pretty well. You know, it pays better than a lot of other campus jobs that you can take.	you know the - one of the. things that i like, about your story is it, isn't. like a; football fairytale you; went to marist college at first and you, were quarterback there which is a prime position you even won a. summer fulbright to study. in england over the summer but, then you got hurt and couldn't play so you had to work as a janitor i, assume that you took that job as it pays pretty well you know it pays better, than, a lot of other campus jobs that you can	You know the - one of the, things that, I like about your story is it isn't like. a football. fairytale You went to Marist, College at first and you were quarterback there which is a prime position, You even won a summer Fulbright to study. in England, over the summer but then you, got hurt and couldn't play So you had to work as a. janitor I assume that you took that job, as it pays pretty well You know it pays better than a lot of other campus, jobs that you can	you know, the - one of the things that i like about your story is it isn't like a football fairytale. you went to marist college at first, and you were quarterback there which is a prime position. you even won a summer fulbright to study in england over the summer, but then you got hurt and couldn't play. so you had to work as a janitor. i assume that you took that job as it pays pretty well. you know, it pays better than a lot of other campus jobs that you can take.
Right.			right.
So if you need the money, that's what you do, but it had to have been - I'm just assuming - it had to have been a little bit hard to go from being kind of star quarterback to then being a janitor.	so if you need the money that's what you do but it had to have been - i'm just assuming - it had to have been a little. bit hard to go from being kind of star quarterback to then being a	So if you need the money that's what you do. but it, had to have. been - I'm just assuming - it. had to have been a little bit hard. to, go from. being. kind of star quarterback to then being a	so if you need the money, that's what you do, but it had to have been - i'm just assuming - it had to have been a little bit hard to go from being kind of star quarterback to then being a janitor.
Yeah. It was extremely humbling. I remember - you know, I used to mop and sweep with my head down. And then one day I just kind of changed my mindset, and I said, you know, I started listening - the Wale album had just came out - so the same songs on repeat, "The Bloom" and a couple different songs on the album. And I would just mop and sweep to those songs, and I would dance while I did it because I started to have hope and encouragement in my heart that, one, I could play football again, and that, two, I would chase some academic pursuits that had never been done before.	yeah it was extremely humbling i remember - you know i used to mop and sweep. with my head down and then one day i just kind of changed. my mindset and i said you know i started, listening - the wale album had just, came out - so the same. songs on, repeat "the bloom" and a couple different songs on the album and i would just mop and sweep to those songs, and i would dance while i; did it because i started to have hope and encouragement in my heart that one i could play football again and that two i, would chase; some academic pursuits that had never been done	Yeah It was extremely humbling I remember - you know I used to mop and sweep with my head down And then one, day I just kind, of changed my mindset and I said you know I started listening. - the Wale album had, just came out. - so the same songs on repeat, "The, Bloom" and a couple different songs. on the album And. I would just mop and sweep to those songs, and I would dance, while I did it because I started to have. hope and. encouragement in my heart that one I could play football again. and that, two I would chase some academic pursuits that had never. been done	yeah. it was extremely humbling. i remember - you know, i used to mop and sweep with my head down. and then one day i just kind of changed my mindset, and i said, you know, i started listening - the wale album had just came out - so the same songs on repeat, "the bloom" and a couple different songs on the album. and i would just mop and sweep to those songs, and i would dance while i did it because i started to have hope and encouragement in my heart that, one, i could play football again, and that, two, i would chase some academic pursuits that had never been done before.
Did anybody ever say anything to you, though, anybody who kind of knew you as a football player and then saw that you were cleaning up? Did anybody ever say anything to you?	did anybody ever say anything to you, though anybody who kind of, knew you as a football player, and then saw that. you were cleaning up? did anybody ever say anything to	Did anybody ever say anything to you, though anybody who, kind of knew you as a football player and. then saw that you were cleaning up? Did anybody, ever say anything to	did anybody ever say anything to you, though, anybody who kind of knew you as a football player and then saw that you were cleaning up? did anybody ever say anything to you?
I had times where people kind of looked down on me or, hey, you missed a spot or, you know, little slick remarks here and there. But I made a concerted effort never to let it get me or never let it discourage me.	i had times, where. people kind of looked down on me or hey you missed a spot or you know little slick remarks here and there but i made a concerted effort. never to, let it get me or never let it. discourage	I had times where people kind of looked down on me or hey you missed, a spot or. you know little slick remarks here and there But I made a concerted effort never to let it get me or never let it discourage	i had times where people kind of looked down on me or, hey, you missed a spot or, you know, little slick remarks here and there. but i made a concerted effort never to let it get me or never let it discourage me.
Why was it so important to you to get to a D1 school - or a division-one school? For people who are not aware, that's the most competitive level of college athletics. Why was that so important to you?	why was it so important to you to get to a d1 school, - or a division-one school? for people who are not aware that's the most competitive level of college athletics why, was that so, important to	Why was it so important to you to get to a D1 school - or a division-one school? For people who are not. aware that's the most; competitive level of college athletics Why was that so important to	why was it so important to you to get to a d1 school - or a division-one school? for people who are not aware, that's the most competitive level of college athletics. why was that so important to you?
I actually had personal reasons. But my father is in life in prison for murder, and I told myself I would never stop playing football. And so he could see me on TV. So, you know, I did that through eventually transferring to Texas Christian University.	i actually had, personal reasons but my father is in life in prison for murder and i told myself i would never stop playing football and so he could see me on tv so you, know i did that through eventually transferring to texas christian	I actually had personal reasons But my, father is, in life in, prison for murder and I told myself I would never stop playing football. And so he could see me on TV So you know, I did that through eventually transferring to Texas Christian,	i actually had personal reasons. but my father is in life in prison for murder, and i told myself i would never stop playing football. and so he could see me on tv. so, you know, i did that through eventually transferring to texas christian university.
Has he been able to see on TV?	has. he been able; to see on	Has he been able to see on	has he been able to see on tv?
Yes, ma'am. He has.	yes ma'am he	Yes ma'am He	yes, ma'am. he has.
And what does that mean to you?	and what, does that mean to	And what does that mean to	and what does that mean to you?
It's indescribable.	it's	It's	it's indescribable.
Why did you want to be a Rhodes Scholar?	why. did you, want to be a rhodes	Why did you want to, be a Rhodes	why did you want to be a rhodes scholar?
Ultimately so I can make a positive change in my word in my community. But I will say one of the short-term reasons is that I had heard about it long ago when I was in eighth grade from Myron Rolle. He was a role model for me, and I said, you know, I want to be able to succeed in football like this man and also use my mind to take me to different places that I never even thought of before.	ultimately so i can make a positive change in my word in my community, but i will say one of the, short-term reasons is that i had, heard about it. long ago when i was in eighth grade from myron rolle he was, a role model for me and i said you know i want to be able to succeed in football like this man and also use my mind to take me to different places, that i never even thought of	Ultimately so I, can make a positive change in my word; in my community But I will say one of the short-term reasons is, that I had heard about; it long ago when I was in eighth grade from Myron Rolle. He was a role model for me, and I said you know, I want to be able to succeed in, football like this man and; also use my mind to take. me to different places that I never even thought of,	ultimately so i can make a positive change in my word in my community. but i will say one of the short-term reasons is that i had heard about it long ago when i was in eighth grade from myron rolle. he was a role model for me, and i said, you know, i want to be able to succeed in football like this man and also use my mind to take me to different places that i never even thought of before.
So I kind of always, you know, had in the back of my mind, but I didn't really think I could become a Rhodes Scholar. And then my mom sent me a text in July to say, hey, make sure you apply for this. I had totally forgot about it, to be honest with you. And then I started kind of looking into it, and I thought about how the opportunity will open doors for me. So I had to jump on that opportunity.	so i kind of always you know had in the back of my mind but i didn't really think i could become a rhodes scholar and then my mom sent me a text in july to say hey make sure you apply for this i had totally forgot about it to be honest with you and then i started kind of looking into it and i thought about how the opportunity will open doors for me so i had to jump on that	So I kind of always, you know had in the, back of my mind but I didn't really think I could become a Rhodes Scholar And then my mom sent me a text in July to say hey make sure, you apply for this, I. had totally forgot about, it to, be honest with you And then I started kind of looking into it and I, thought about how the opportunity will open doors for me So I had to, jump on that	so i kind of always, you know, had in the back of my mind, but i didn't really think i could become a rhodes scholar. and then my mom sent me a text in july to say, hey, make sure you apply for this. i had totally forgot about it, to be honest with you. and then i started kind of looking into it, and i thought about how the opportunity will open doors for me. so i had to jump on that opportunity.
Can you tell me about the moment that you found out you'd won?	can you tell me about the moment that you found out you'd	Can you, tell me about the moment that you found out you'd	can you tell me about the moment that you found out you'd won?
I had been in the waiting room after my interview just kind of like watching little dance videos and stuff like that to take my mind off of it. Everyone else was kind of like talking and, perhaps, comparing each other's accomplishments to each other because they wanted to see who would win.	i had been in the waiting. room after my interview just kind of like watching little dance videos, and stuff like that to take my mind off of it everyone else was kind of like. talking and perhaps comparing each other's accomplishments to each other because they wanted to, see who would	I had been in the waiting room. after my. interview just kind of like watching little dance videos and stuff like that to take my mind off of it Everyone else. was kind of like talking. and perhaps comparing each other's accomplishments, to each other because they wanted to see who would	i had been in the waiting room after my interview just kind of like watching little dance videos and stuff like that to take my mind off of it. everyone else was kind of like talking and, perhaps, comparing each other's accomplishments to each other because they wanted to see who would win.
But I was just super, super quiet. And when they called us in, they announced me. And when they announced me, I just stared at the floor for like an awkwardly long time, like about 37 seconds. And that - mind you, 37 seconds is a super long time for such a tense environment. And I just stared at the floor because I felt like if I move my body and move towards the lady to shake her hands that would be me acknowledging that anything is possible. And for those 37 seconds, I wasn't ready to deal with that yet.	but i was just super super quiet and when they called us. in they announced me and when they announced me i, just stared at the floor. for like an awkwardly long time like about 37 seconds and that - mind you 37 seconds is a super long time for such a tense environment and i just stared at the floor because i felt like if i move my body and move towards, the lady, to shake. her hands that would be me acknowledging that anything is possible and for those 37 seconds i wasn't ready to deal with that	But I was just super super quiet And when they called us in they announced me And when they announced me I just stared at the floor for like an awkwardly long time like about 37 seconds And, that - mind you 37 seconds is a super, long time for such a, tense environment And I. just stared at the floor because I felt like, if I move my body and move towards the lady to shake her hands that would be me acknowledging that anything is possible And for those 37 seconds I wasn't ready to, deal with that	but i was just super, super quiet. and when they called us in, they announced me. and when they announced me, i just stared at the floor for like an awkwardly long time, like about 37 seconds. and that - mind you, 37 seconds is a super long time for such a tense environment. and i just stared at the floor because i felt like if i move my body and move towards the lady to shake her hands that would be me acknowledging that anything is possible. and for those 37 seconds, i wasn't ready to deal with that yet.
Well, eventually you - hopefully you did move (laughter) and shake her hand, I hope.	well eventually you - hopefully you did move, (laughter) and shake her, hand i	Well eventually you - hopefully you did move. (laughter) and shake her hand I	well, eventually you - hopefully you did move (laughter) and shake her hand, i hope.